The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 01/29/2021 - HOUR 2 - Dallas Cowboys, John Middlekauf

Episode Date: January 29, 2021

In hour two, Doug advises the Dallas Cowboys should learn from others mistakes, and do not sign Dak to a long term contract and end up like the LA Rams. John Middlekauff also feels that the Houston Texans shouldn't trade Watson. And Green Bay doesn't want to be like Pittsburgh, stuck with an aging QB who may be on the down side. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeard radio app,

Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Thanks for listening to The Heard podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1. Find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Heard.

We're listening to Fox Sports Radio. What up? Welcome in. This is The HARD. Wherever you may be, and however you may be making this part of your day. I'm Doug Gottliebilling in for Colin. Thank you so much for joining us. We truly appreciate it.

Got John Middokoff upcoming. He'll join us, Ray and Out podcast. By the way, check out my podcast on Collins Network, The HARD Podcast Network. It's called All Balls. I encourage you, you know, Colin, big in the Pacific Northwest. My, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, head coach at Longby State, but he was the coach of Gonzaga when, uh, they went to the lead

eight was his second year's head coach. He left and took the Minnesota job. Uh, he's the one who brought in Mark few. It was, it's an, it's, it's, it's two parts. It's two hours. and, you know, a lot of times you interview these guys, they're still coaches, they're so politically correct. They don't want to say anything.

And he was great. I mean, I learned so much about him, about Gonzaga, about Minnesota, about why he left, about how it feels. It's called the All Ball podcast. So download it on the Heard Podcast Network. How are you guys on Proverbs? Proverbs. Have you ever used a,

proverb, right? Right? The old, it's a wise man learns, you know, what is it? Otto Van Bismarck famously said, only a fool learns from his own mistakes. A wise man learns from the mistakes of others. You're like, oh, that's good. That's good. That's good.

Bruce Lee kind of, you know, kind of took that one and used it. Bruce Lee's quoted, a wise man can learn. from a foolish question than a fool can learn from a wiser question. Like, Bruce didn't know. Let's go with the auto van. What was the guy's name? Auto van Bismarck one. Only a fool learns from his mistakes.

A wise man learns from mistakes of others. Have you noticed what's going on in L.A.? Well, apparently they don't like Jared Gough anymore, right? His general manager, Les Need, who drafted him, signed him to a gargantuan extension. a year before he had to, said in a press conference, he's the quarterback with the Rams. He's on the Rams for now.

And there'll be an open quarterback competition if he's on the roster in the summer and in the fall. Like, wait, wait, what? Excuse me? This is a dude with a huge cap hit quarterback led you to a Super Bowl a couple years ago. Led you to the playoffs this year. Granted, they're all into the job. John Wolford. But what? Look at Philadelphia. I mean, the whole thing is about Carson Wentz.

It's what led to a breakup of the front office with the head coach who got fired. It's the reason they went and hired Nick Casario, right? They go out and hire like a Frank Reich disciple, Frank Reich's right-hand guy because Frank Reich is the guy. the only coach that seemed to have a handle on how to coach Carson Wens. And why don't they get rid of Carson Wins? And why don't the Rams just get rid of Jared Gough? What do you think? I mean, the same reason the Atlanta Falcons are not going to get rid of Matt Ryan.

And the Pittsburgh Steelers are going to start. They're going to have to take Big Ben back. Matt Stafford can say, like, I'll do anything to come play for the Pittsburgh Steelers. You guys need a strong arm quarterback. I'm that guy. I just dream of playing for a functional organization. Let me just get out. They're like, sorry, we had Big Ben's got a $41 million cap number, dead cap number.

We can't get rid of them. Retires, that money doesn't go away. So they have to rework his deal and push that, you know, kick that kind of can down the street a little bit. I bring it up because, you know, the Cowboys and Dak Prescott, that Prescott's a free agent. Now, they could franchise tag him. I could talk from a long-term extension, which they previously did.

But if you're a wise man, don't you learn from the mistakes of others? Maybe they know, they know that DAC is way better than we think. But I should point out, you go back two years ago, not this season, the previous year. They didn't beat any of the good teams. And then they had a chance against Philadelphia on the road. And Philadelphia has got dudes off the street playing wide. receiver and they can't score points. And it's not about surrounding them with supporting cast.

You got a highly paid running back who was the highest paid running back in the league. They just paid Amari Cooper $100 million. They just drafted CD Lamb. And that offensive line is, I mean, they've spared no expense. Do I think the offensive line is as good as it used to be? Of course not. But it's not for lack of spending or lack of investment in terms of draft picks historically from the Dallas Cowboys. They have done everything in their power.

to make this guy have everything he could possibly need, including keeping his offensive coordinator, even though they change coaches. And they still weren't beating the good teams this year. So here's my question. Shouldn't you learn from the mistakes of others? Forever people have been scared of that second year of the franchise tag, working spike.

And like, oh, I don't want to pay $37, $38 million, $40 million for one year. Would you prefer to have a guy stuck on your team that you don't want anymore? Is that what you're saying? Right? I mean, like, look, even from the other side to it, all these guys have, all these football players have polluted your minds to think, well, football players don't have guaranteed contracts.

Yes, they do. They just might not be as long or as fruitful as NBA or NFL players. Why? Because they get hurt very easily. and then their careers are over or dramatically altered. But like Deshawn Watson got $73 million up front. Like within a couple of weeks of signing a deal, he got $73 million wired to his account or to an escrow account. It's just sitting there.

Cold, hard cash. Now we finally pay a guy. So, all right, that's good. We got cost certainty. We got Deshawn Watson. And he's like, nah, I'm not feeling it. What do you mean you not feeling it? Like we're building the whole thing around you.

We got your left tackle. We went and tried to rework our Our wide receiving core Now David Johnson comes off the books Now we've got more money to spend We're going to work some things around We brought in a GM I'm not feeling it

If you're really wise And you're the Cowboys This is the out you've been looking for Hell you can go get Matt Stafford mid-20s Short-term deal Right trade from Matt Stafford Work his deal A couple years, 20 something

Why do I want to pay 30-something million dollars and have this gigantic dead cap money bill where he has a bad year, I want to get rid of him, like a Jared golf like Carson Wentz, and I can't. They didn't make the playoffs last year, despite having far and away the best roster and healthiest roster in their division. Remember, that was a division where the Giants sucked,

the Redskins sucked, and frankly, the Eagles were so injured that it didn't even matter if they were good or not. They just completely banged up. And they didn't win the division. And they played like Arizona was bad, in Miami was bad. And they just didn't beat any of the good teams or Philadelphia.

So a wise man should learn for the mistakes of others. And the mistakes of others are to sign Dak Prescott to some long-term deal. How many of these things work? Like we say it in baseball all the time, don't we? Now baseball, the length is two or three times as long. Here we go, Bryce Harper, here we go. It's held like Albert Pooleholz. When did that, that thing didn't work out.

I mean, maybe Bryce Harper and Mike Trout because of where they are, but by the time they're mid to late 30s, like no steroids in baseball, I don't know. If I'm the Cowboys, I look at all these quarterback situations and they all, I mean, like, look, that's going to be the thing with Aaron Rogers. He signed a gigantic contract. They don't want to get rid of him. But because it has basically an exit clause next year,

he's going to want a new deal. Ben Rothesberger, he reworked his deal a couple years ago. Remember, I might retire, I might not. Gee, I don't know. Oh, you found some more money. Guess what? I'm coming back. Why can't they get rid of him?

$41 million cap hit. There's a bunch of different ways to work it, but the Dallas Cowboys signing up for another bad deal or another potentially bad deal would not be learning from the mistakes of others. It would be repeating the mistakes of others. It would be, you know, I mean, you would have thought the Germans would have paid attention to Napoleon.

Don't fight a war on two fronts or attack Russia and the dead of winter, but they didn't pay attention. Why do we study history, so we're not doomed or deemed to repeat it? And it's not even ancient history. We're talking present history. The Eagles and the Rams provide you the blueprint for why you should not sign your quarterback to some gargantuan deal if he's not an absolute dude. I mean, even the Chiefs thing, which by all accounts, like, he kind of did him a solid up front. But at some point, that thing becomes live. You get a couple years from now, and the Chiefs are going to have to hope they hit on draft picks

because they'll be paying him so much money that there's not going to be a ton of money to go around for other star players. That's why everybody's trying to get paid now. All right, coming up next. John Middokoff joins his show. Does he think the Texans will end up moving Watson? Plus, what's really a play here with the Rams and the Packers? And oh yeah, by the way, we all love Mahomes, but he's probably not going to have his two tackles for the Super Bowl.

And if you look at their starting depth chart, he's down four offensive linemen. Could this be a Giants Patriots sort of upset? We'll get to that. I'll come in next. But first, one more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day. seven days a week within the iHeart radio app search heard to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like imagine an olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged it's the enhanced games some

call it grotesque others say it's unleashing human potential either way the podcast superhuman documented it all embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year within probably 10 days i'd put on 10 pounds i was having trouble stopping the muscle growth Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined.

And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Cliverts Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream,

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I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jek. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack.

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Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it.

And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust.

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We'll get to the Dak Prescott thing. And, you know, I've heard people say, like, oh, you should trade Deshaun Watson for the number one overall pick. Like, I'm not sure people understand just how valuable those rookie contracts are, the rookie contract. Like, that's the dream scenario. Actually, the dream scenario is not to have a first round pick, but have a second, third, or fourth round pick quarterback, right?

Well, you're not paying nothing for a couple years. then you can load up your roster. That's what the Chiefs have been able to do, a first round pick, a first round pick, a rookie contract, right? That's why these younger quarterbacks

are getting run earlier. John Middukov joins us here in the herd. John, I'm going to read because we don't have the sound yet. It just came across. Nick Casario is the new general manager of the Houston Texans and he,

he said they have no intentions of trading Dachan Watson. He started by saying, before we take any questions, organizationally, we want to reiterate our commitment to Dishan Watson. We have zero interest in trading the player. What's your reaction? You know, I think that's a hell of a quote. He comes from the Patriot School. And by no means, let's face it, every leak you read right now, and it's not even the leak,

just the Deshaun, he's angry, he's ready, demands the trade, is all coming from his agent. And if you know one thing about the Patriots, they are not getting bullied by agents. Now, my theory, especially once they made the hire, was they're going to blow this thing up. And it's an easy one, right? Like the guy wants out to trade them, but you're not just going to let the agent, you know, kind of bend you over the table here and just dictate the terms. That's not how a guy that spent 20 years with the Patriot operates. I do think it's not crazy to trade them. I heard you talking like, obviously the number one pick is really valuable.

But what if you get the second or the third pick? That's really valuable to if you like one of these quarterbacks, reset your franchise. I also think you'll get somewhat of a pass because the guy wanted out to go too. But the NFL is not the NBA. Hey, if we are taking him at his word, and I, you know, Doug, in these press conferences, I mean, you get a lot of lies. But if he doesn't believe he's going to, he'll want to trade him, and that's what he's saying, he does not have to trade it.

What's the show I'm going to do? Not show up? I doubt it. I agree. I mean, first, I think, I have not. Would you trade them if you got to have happened? Well, well, look, I'm a little, okay, there's two different. One, every NFL guy I've talked to, right?

And I've talked to three, two general managers, a director, player personnel, and another guy who's in player personnel. And all of them are like, no, I'm not trading him. For a multitude of reasons. First thing is, he just signed the contract. Like, he just, this is not like the last year of a deal. This is not going to be a free agent. This is not, you know, he after, and he signed the contract after they traded Newk Hopkins.

So he can say, like, things went bad and whatever, but relax, dude. Second thing is, okay. And he's been around Billy O for years at that. For years and everything they've built, they've built around him. Like, make no mistake about it. That you can, Billy O had issues as a front office guy. But his skill set was on offense and his desire was to build a better overall offense. And by the way, he had to pay Deshaun.

So that's some of the reasons that, one of the reasons he had to move nuke. He didn't think nuke is worth his next contract. And, you know, I don't know why I took the David Johnson contract on other than maybe he was going off the books this year. And that's when Deshawn's money, you know, went on the books. Right, right? So it's moving some of the stuff around. But it was all done to build him an offense, which, by the way, he was able to have statistically a good offense.

So, yeah, I mean, like, now would I personally? Yeah, I would move off him in a second, especially if I can get a quarterback at a much more reason, or draft a quarterback deal. And because JJ Watts over the hill, I'd napalm the third. thing. But I don't think. To me, he's getting traded either way.

Like, he's gone. Really? Yeah, and I just think. I think this is an agent deal. I think this is a Mogetta deal. His agent, and he did the Jalen Ramsey thing. And I don't think it, I just, I think it becomes a staredown thing. And I think this is the, because if the Texans give in the acquiesce to him, who won't

they acquiesce to? Yeah, to me, if they just, that's why you're not just given away from one first round pick. And you, you brought up Jalen Ramsey. I think Jamal Adams and Khalil Mack a couple years ago, the elite non-corterbacks that we know are way less valuable, even though those guys are blue-chip, pro bowl level players, go for two ones and a two. So if Deshaal watched it, I don't think it's crazy. I tweeted this the other day, like, why wouldn't you just have for four ones, right?

We know quarterbacks are infinitely more important than other guys. And then you start saying that out loud. He's like, I don't know if anyone would trade you that much. Then you look at it like not all ones are equal, right? the ones that everyone got for Jalen or Jamal or even Khalil when the teams go eight and eight or better in making the playoffs, those picks are in the 20. Well, two picks in the 20s, if I had the second overall pick and you had picked 21 and 28, I would not trade you two for those two picks. So the one thing this year, if the Jets and the dolphins are interested, they have ammo that is just really, really powerful if they're open to trading them. Here's the other thing.

They hired David Kelly. I worked with him in Philly. He's a lifetime position coach. He's 65 years old. My theory is, and I think I saw this out there in the last 24 hours, they kind of wanted to hire Josh McCown. Maybe they either thought he wasn't ready to blowback or whatever. I think from what I've read he's going to be on the staff,

kind of groom him for a couple years, and then make him the head coach maybe in like two or three years when all these picks are starting to come to fruition and maybe you have a team that you feel confident on. They're not sending to Miami. just hired Charlie Frye who's like, do do I'm, I'm, I've never been, I haven't been a Tua guy all year,

but they clearly are pot committed to Tua. That's why they brought in Charlie Frye because you know, he coached me to lead 11. He's a former NFL quarterback himself and they have a relationship, right? So that one. The Jets thing is interesting because like, they could fleece the Jets for three or four first round

draft picks over two years, right? Which would completely change their franchise for the better. But if you're Deshawn, why would you do that? They got nobody to play with. Like, great, I love Robert Sala. Awesome. Who you're going to throw the football to? Who's going to get one awesome young left tackle? That's about it. Like, I think

he's good where he is. But I also think that at some point it becomes a bit of a, lack of a better term, urinating match. And I don't think it ends well for Deshaun. I don't think they trade. I'm going to go what they don't trade. Here's what I know. The 49ers, like, let's look

at the teams that would be viewed if they got Deshawn, they would be good. The Niners, the Colts. I know the way the Niners operate, and it's pretty clear the way Ballard operates. They're not given three first rounders for a player. They're just not going to do it. Like, it's just not the way they do business. Maybe if they get them for like one and like a couple twos, but we know that that makes no sense for the Texas.

So like you said, Deshaun and his agent who just, they are leaking nonstop. And I'm not even blaming Deshaun because his history shows like everyone likes them. To me, the agent has a history of doing this. And the agent thinks he controls this deal. And back to the NBA, buddy. Like, this is not happening. The reason Jalen Ramsey got traded is because they got two ones and a two. The reason Jamal Adams got traded is because they got two ones and a two.

Like that for a position. But he also, but also those guys had a new contract coming. Remember, the Texans paid him $73 million up front, right? They paid him for this coming year and the following year already. That's already in an escrow. People don't understand that about NFL contracts, like the guarantee. guaranteed money in escrow. Like when I give Steph Curry $200 million, I pay them over the five years life of the contract.

In the NFL, like with Rogers and Matt Ryan and all these big quarterback contracts last couple years, people don't get the amount of money those guys get in like a 12, 18 month span of cash, right? Yeah. And that all comes, like the team is on the hook for that no matter what. Yeah. So, and look, and here's the thing about rich people. And Cal McNair, if you don't like them, it doesn't, the owner thing that means nothing to

me because there's plenty of owners those guys. They're just the guy who they write the check and every once in a while they go like, man, we got a great owner. We got a great owner because that's the guy who writes the guy. The coach or the GM or a teammate, that's one thing. But he could go all year without ever talking to the owner. Right. But the thing about rich dudes is you think they want to write a check?

They want to write a check for $73 million and then you bail after the first year. Like, I don't think that's the way they're going to operate. All right, let's, you mentioned a. couple other people. What is going on with golf? And I bring it up because it's one thing to be down on golf. And McVeigh, of course, is a Gruden guy. Gruden falls in and out of love with the quarterbacks the way the Bachelorette falls in and out of love with the bachelors, right? Right? So that's not, but less need, like he's on the Rams for now. If he's on the roster, he's going to be quarterback like they how what are they do what what is going on with the Rams I heard

Colin had a theory that they tried to get him to take a pay cut and he did it and they blast them so I text a couple people that just like you think that's possible and they responded that the amount of guaranteed money that he has coming that no agent in their right mind like if you're reaching out for him to take a pay cut you're a moron at the GM like you know what the answer is going to be before the call so I don't necessarily think that's the case I've never heard a bad thing about Jared Goss. It's like a teammate. I know Whitworth and him are close.

Work ethic, so I can't speak on that. But my theory is you never, ever. It's one thing, a coach. I mean, McVeigh, I'm a blast him. But then the GM, the double down, you don't do that to a guy, in my opinion, if he's working really hard and just struggling. Like you just, you sugarcoat it, even if you're down on him. To me, it has to be something like they don't think he's putting in the work.

They don't think he's given them all because you would not. I mean, they are destroying them. guy verbally in the press when that never happens. I mean, look at Jimmy Garoppel. He has missed 70% of the game two of the last three years. The Niners are not huge fans right now because they can't depend on them. And you would think they're talking about Tom Brady when they talk about Jimmy Garoppel. And he doesn't even have guaranteed money.

Like they could just cut them. Yet the Rams, they're stuck. Like when I saw the report that they need marriage counseling, like, well, part of marriage counseling is you can kind of get a divorce if the counselor doesn't work. Like, there is no divorce. coming for the ramps. Like, he's stuck. He doesn't have any trade value right now.

So why would they be doing this to motivate him? Honestly, Doug, it makes no, I think it's bad business. The coach can be that. And just so people are aware, just so people are aware. Colin and I both, we call each other, and I think we looped you probably in on it, too. Like last year before they cut Gurley, it was, they were the, he's lazy, you know, he doesn't work hard. He's bad in the locker room.

he's toxic. We got to get, like, it was one thing to just cut him. It was another thing to point out what they felt like was their logic behind cutting him, other than just like, hey, you know, we decided to move on. And they're the ones who signed him to this deal. Okay, so if you and I, John Middlecoff, our guest, I'm Doug Gottlieb filling in for calling this is the herd. He has the three and out podcast.

That's the great football podcast and the herd podcast network. I got the all ball podcast, basketball podcast, same herd podcast network. If we both agree that the golf contract is best, bad and the only reason he's on the team, right? And we'd agree that the only reason Carson Wentz is still with the Eagles and they fired Doug Peterson is that contract. You're the Cowboys. Do you really want to sign up for a long-term deal for a guy that's been a 500 quarterback

on a minimum rookie contract? Like, I get he's better than a fourth round pick where he was drafted. But do you really want to overpay for too long, seeing how bad so many of these other long-term contracts for middle-the-road quarterbacks are? Yeah, to me, it's really risky. I mean, the only guys, let's face it, you feel confident given enormous money are the guys going straight to the Hall of Fame. Rogers, Russell, right? I mean, we've seen it time and time again when you're doing this projecting on a young guy.

Like, say what you want, Mahomes won an MVP in the Super Bowl. Like, we had a lot of information that none of these other guys are getting. And it's been a disaster. And I think, Dak, clearly, they would never, they love the guy. there's never been a terse word about him, like they would never talk about him like Jared Gough or some of the stories about Carson Wentz. But, like, you know, he was awesome and their team sunk. And to me, maybe the tactic is just kind of go to the cousins route, do the franchise tag again this year,

see what happens. Maybe, I mean, maybe you could think big picture franchise and trade him. The problem is who's going to play quarterback for you. But I'm with you. I am not into signing max contracts to like good players. because you just gave a bunch of examples. And I'd say, Dax, more consistent person clearly than Carson, more talented than Goss. But in that same vein, like, he's never just going to be a top five guys.

So if you're given 35 and really you've got to look at it, you're given 120 guaranteed. So you're stuck with a guy for minimum like three years for a guy that, you know, maybe one of those three years makes a pro bowl. And it's not even guaranteed every year. Who knows, right? I think that's very, very risky. And I also think I give the Cowboys credit. Like, they have not splurge yet on him when it's happened pretty consistently with their other players that they regret basically signing him all.

Okay. I understand Aaron Rogers' frustration, right? Like, he, it feels like, it feels like his coach ran out of plays. And that's why they kicked the field goal. Like, he wasn't, because they couldn't call a time out. And so they had a need a four-down play. They didn't need a two-point conversion play if they got it. He did make a couple weird throws to play.

before. A little, an Aaron like. He did. He did. And I don't know if everybody's like, well, you would have scored on third down. Like, I don't know. I mean, Jason Pierre Paul had an angle. But he would have gotten closer. DBs are so fast. Like, they could redirect. Like, he probably used to do. Those linemen are fast. Those limber crazy

fair. You know, I mean, J.P. He's got some, got a rocket up as you know what. Okay. So, I understand, like, then he's got to shake Tom Brady's hand. Like, are you kidding me? At Lambo. At Lambo. at LAMLAML. Like, I got to go over and shake his hand.

It's the worst. I got to shake Tom Brady's hand. By the way, Tom Brady looks like he's getting younger. And Aaron Rogers, he looked. He's like Deputy Dog with a saggy face. Like, he just looked awful. So he gets in there and he does the whole, like, you know, a lot of guys got questions, myself included.

But he's really smart. He does things for a reason. Was it because he was pissed? Or was it something else? I think he was definitely mad. I mean, I saw him say this week. I mean, it is 15 minutes after the game. It's the most devastating loss of his career. I mean, I know the Super Bowl is the biggest win. That would have been a, that would have been, I mean, beating Tom Brady at Lambo, probably even if they would have

won the Super Bowl would have been equally as big. I mean, that would have been a massive moment in the guy's career. And it's easy. I mean, he just threw the coach under the bus. And I think sometimes when things are going well, it's easy to make it seem like everything's great. Like, Does he really love Matt LaFleaure? I think he likes them, and I think he embraced them this year. But how do you forget, Doug, if they, you know, hired your replacement, basically right in front of you eight months ago in any walk of life, it's hard to forget that. I don't care how much money you're making.

I don't care how successful you've been in the past. Like you do, and you still see that guy every day. And then on top of it, it's one thing if you get the replacement and you go, you know what, this guy, this guy's pretty good, right? the guy can't beat out the backup quarterback. He's terrible. I mean, he's awful. And Aaron's been the league long enough,

probably looking at this guy skipping balls in practice, like, this is a joke. And I just, that animosity, especially with a guy like him, it's clear. He's a grudge holder, and he's someone that doesn't forget. To me, they won so much.

You just, what are you going to do, complain? But that loss kind of brings it all back up to the surface. It's like, you know, it's basically removing everything and bringing up the problems that, came back, you know, in the summer, because clearly when the pick happened, the rumors came out. It weren't even rumors. I mean, it came out immediately. He was mad.

He's admitted that. And I just think now you're thinking, these guys wanted to replace me. And they weren't able to, but, like, screw these guys. Do you think he, I mean, my guess would be, hey, rework my deal. And, oh, yeah, by the way, if you really want to fix this thing, get rid of Jordan Love. Well, Brady, in a little bit different. different way did that with Garoppolo, right? Kind of forced their hand.

Now, the difference, though, is Tom, so Jimmy in 2014 was drafted. And then basically from 2014 to when Jimmy was trading 17, they were going to Super Bowl's and they were winning them, right? I think he was like two and three in that little span with Jimmy on the team. You know, Rogers, like, to me, they'd have no choice if Roger was like Super Bowl MVP, but they're losing in this game. So I think he might want that, but what Jordan loves? trade value right now.

He has no tape because there was no preseason. And all the teams on the outside are like, well, he's not trade for him. Here's what he is, okay? He's a 2020 who's still on the lot. Right? So it may not be... Could you get him for a third rounder, you know?

I think more than that. You couldn't, he was to spend a year on an NFL team. Everyone I talked to said like he's a developmental pick, right? He's like two years away. and he's had one year sitting and watching and learning with Aaron Rogers in the quarterback room. You don't know late first round pick, so it's not bad expensive. So I think you can get a second for him, you know, which is like, which is Josh Rosen was

a better prospect coming out of college. But Josh played. But this is where the car analogy works. If you, if he plays, if he takes one snap, now he's driven off the lot, now he loses value. You know, right now if you go to the dealership and you buy a, you buy a 20, you know, a 2020, you know, a Chevy suburban, right? You know, they redid the Suburans.

Yeah. You get a brand new, but an older design, right? 2020. You get like $10,000 off MSRP or something crazy, right? That's what you get for, that's what you get for Jordan Love. If they were to trade, you know, like a late second pick, you know, like a pick in the 60s or whatever, it would be a pretty devastating. Like that move was a disaster for them, even though it did kind of motivate Aaron, I guess.

But just to get nothing, I mean, that's. that backfired. You know, they basically, they bet against their Rogers. But did it? No, did they really bet against her? They bet on the future. They didn't want to be Pittsburgh, right? They didn't want to be the team that does not have Pittsburgh tried to draft a guy in the third round,

and he looks like a third rounder. And now they're like, I guess we've got to take Ben back next year. They didn't want to be Pittsburgh. Yeah, I mean, but I would put Jordan Love, you know, that was, it'd be one thing to me if they got a guy that everyone was kind of in the same camp, if this guy could be an NFL starter. Like, it was a pretty risky pick. You know, I mean, the guy was a major project.

I mean, like, Pittsburgh was drafted these quarterbacks. They just, I mean, there's a chance Jordan Love is never any good. I would lean he probably is never going to be, right? I mean, there's a decent chance he's never a legitimate NFL starter. Now, I get, like, I understand the mindset. I mean, I've been in these draft meetings. You're thinking about that with everyone. Yeah.

But when you have a guy like Aaron Rogers, basically you just made the NFC championship. Now, he didn't play as well, right? I mean, he was dramatically better this year. So you could argue just getting that play, but they had the same result. I mean, they had lost in the NFC championship last year. They lost again. Yes, but they were, I mean, they were, Aaron Rogers was a different player this year than he was last year.

One hundred percent, him individual, I'm just saying as a team. Right. Like the team, they got, like, Matt will four has been a two NFC championship camps in two straight years, right? The team, their team was better this year. I'm agreeing there. And their offense was awesome. Yep. But, like, they got the same result.

middle cough great stuff dude enjoy the weekend and then next weekend last last football game for a while thanks for joining us i know see you Doug all right john middlecough three and out is in fact the podcast join us here on the herd podcast network let me you can listen that in the herd podcast network let's get to ryan music with the news turn on the news this is the herd line news right dog what do you got oh Doug all right so we have a ton of fresh news coming out of houston their new head coach David Cully has spoken, their new general manager, Nick Casario, has spoken. We'll have all of that for you in about 20 minutes at 2 Eastern, 11 a.m. Pacific.

What I have for you right now is Derek Henry is hoping that Deshaun Watson is no longer in the AFC South. He spoke to the Tennessean about the potential trade. He said, that'd be better for us. Every year we play them. It's always tough and always comes down to the wire. That's the kind of player Deshaun is. I know Deshaun. So I wish the best for whatever happens for him.

But like I said, that's better for us. If he's out of the division, we definitely appreciate it. Yeah, he's not out of division yet. Wait, do you hear the sound? I don't think Houston's flinching on this one. It should be certainly interesting to see how that plays out. And we'll wrap up with this, Doug, staying in the NFL, but going to the AFC North. The Steelers have had a great young player in T.J. Watt, J.J. Watt's brother. He has been about as good as J.J. Watt was at his peak, just an absolute dominant force on the defensive side of the

ball. He's now heading into his fifth and final year of his rookie deal. Wanted to get paid. That's right. But we haven't heard from TJ just yet, but we have heard from Steelers owner, Art Rooney the second in terms of TJ. It's a good problem to have. We're obviously going to do what we need in order to make sure he stays on our team into the future. So this could be a little bit about what Big Ben was talking about and what the team has said and the athletic yesterday where they're really working on restructuring that deal to bring that cap number down because they have some big free agents that they're going to need to pay. And this is sort of a good problem to have if you're the Steelers, right?

They do a great job drafting and developing talent. But then at some point, you've got to give them that second contract. Yep. And that's where in the past guys have walked. And that's the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd-Lie News.

We'll get to some of that Houston stuff. Plus, the way one NFL team is handling their business right now regarding the franchise quarterback has me scratching my head. No, it's not Deshawn. I'll get to that upcoming next, but first. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Doug Outlib's show? Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque.

Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement

to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health,

purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be.

Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim?

Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. We pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so you all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack.

So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history.

Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan, Ryan, Kornain. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch.

Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines,

as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Oh, sorry, my bad. Old habits, right? I'm Doug Gowley filling in for Colin.

Cremo Barber Shave Cream gives you a close, comfortable shave while fighting razor, burn. Fight the burn. Cremel barber shave cream is rich concentrated formula packed with slick molecules that blades will glide over your skin available at major retailers to Amazon and at cremocompany.com. Cremocompany.com. I need that. Can I read that. Do I get it? Do I do I can you send that to me? That can you, that would be amazing. Because that's like my whole thing with shaving, right? I'm lazy, you know.

I'm just lazy. Who doesn't like it? But I just, I need the good cream stuff where it feels where the razor just works and cuts through. Doug Gottlie pulling in for Colin. You heard John Middokoff earlier, how the Rams are handling this Jared Goff situation. It makes absolutely no sense. Look, there's a huge dead cap bill if you cut him. And oh yeah, by the way, I don't know how many people would trade for him considering the contract.

but the way in which you've left him out there and handle this, you're killing his trade value. For the time being, you're stuck with him. You know, can you work some magic with the salary cap to move money around? But you're crushing his market value. How does that make any sense? Somewhere in between awesome and terrible sits Jared Gough. And you got him for one more year.

But something is under this, the burr is under the saddle. of less need. And look, we're all in sports, you know, and look in sports radio. We're all, you know, a bunch of us, like I'm trying to think here on our on this, on Fox Sports Radio, so you had Dan was there, Colin was there, I was there, Jason Smith was there, right? So that's four of us, right? And while we all have very different styles, right, I mean, Colin obviously kind of the master, the metaphor, Dan is an unbelievable kind of, of leader of group discussion and interviewer. I'm not really sure what I bring to the table, right?

But the point is, we were all kind of brought up at time. Dan would have a head start on us. But during those years, we were taught on how to interview and how to tease. And so there's a how you're raised in your sport as a player. Like you're going to usually coach like you were coached. when you're a coach and you grew up in the Gruden system, that's what McVeigh did. I mean, this is interesting, right? Sean McVeigh, where was his last stop?

Washington. Remember who they had on a franchise tag and no one had anything great to say about him? I don't know, Kirk Cousins. Like, they did the exact same thing in Washington with Kirk Cousins as they're doing in L.A. With Jared Gough. And oh, yeah, by the way, McVeigh is not only a Jay Gruden guy, who's a John Gruden guy. And the downfall of John Gruden in Tampa was he was a serial dater of quarterbacks.

He would never get married to one. He just wasn't. That's why everybody's thought that he's going to get rid of Derek Carr at some point in the near future. And he never has. But he did bring in Marcus Mariotta, just like, I don't know. So there's a pattern here which is disturbing. But what doesn't make sense is like, you sign the guy. the late Rodney Dangerfield,

late, not right, the master of the one-liner, right? One of his, I listened to one of his cassette tapes. I used to have it when I was a kid. And my wife's a bad cook, a bad cook.

Just the other day, she told me to take out the garbage. I told me you cooked it, you take it out. That's what the Rams are doing. They gave him the contract. Now they're mad about the contract? It makes no sense.

You don't like Jared Goff? You signed him to that deal. He led you to a Super Bowl. You cooked it. You take it out. I don't understand how they're handling it. All right. Coming up next,

I didn't believe the Houston Texans would trade Deshaun Watson. Wait to hear what the Houston Texans said moments ago. That's up coming next. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is The Hurt. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends.

Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes.

Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing huge.

human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the Look Back at it podcast. In 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84's big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a huge. unpack what went down and try to make sense of how we survived it with our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s.

It was a wild year. It was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me.

Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits. my basketball and college football journey or my career in sports media. Well now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. This is an IHeart podcast.

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