The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 02/09/2021 - HOUR 1 - Tom Brady

Episode Date: February 9, 2021

Nick Wright in for ColinWhat has motivated Tom Brady throughout his career?Ranking the three phases of Tom Brady's careerGuest: Kevin Clark Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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A ton to do today. I tried to be pretty measured and reasoned yesterday. But if I have to hear more about the negative legacy implications for Patrick Mahomes based on that Super Bowl, I'm going to lose my mind. And I will explain why, with evidence later in the show, also on the show, Kevin Clark, Peter King's going to join us, among others. Russell Wilson flirting maybe, possibly, with the, idea of not being a lifelong Seahawks, so we'll get to all of that.

We're going to start with Tom Brady, but before we get there, Joy Taylor, who betrayed me multiple times yesterday, publicly, privately on the internet, I was going to say I need to lean on you today because I'm a little tired donating all that plasma to pay off my gambling debts tires you out, but I know I can't lean on you for anything, Joy. I just can't. So how are you? That's unfair. I can be a good teammate.

The world wanted you to have your, you know, take your medicine on Tom Brady yesterday. I didn't want to come between that, you know. And, you know, I'm a very honest person, as you know. And we all love Danielle. That's just, that's what it is. Okay. That's my, that's a call back to yesterday of Joy telling him, professing to the entire world, that I am the least popular member of my own family.

Before I get to the Brady stuff, just very quickly, your thoughts on the idea that a fair amount of this loss should be hung up, around the neck of Patrick Mahomes? Your quick version of that before we get to that in full. Well, I mean, when it comes to quarterbacks, they get a lot of the credit. So in a lot of ways, they should get a significant amount of the blame when things don't go well. But I also think you have to use your eyeballs and be reasonable. And if you did actually watch the entirety of that game, there were some moments where Mahomes

wasn't spectacular, but I would lay a very small percentage of the outcome at that game at the feet of Patrick Mahomes. And I would argue that there is not a single quarterback in the league that you could have replaced Mahomes with in that football game, and the Chiefs would have fared any better. But we are not going to start the bulk of the show with the losing quarterback. We're going to start the bulk of the show with the winning quarterback, who once again is Tom Brady. But for the first time in his career, it is Tom Brady without Bill Belichick. And Bruce Ariens had some very interesting quotes before the game. but they were just reported yesterday by Sports Illustrated about part of Brady's motivation.

So we can show you these quotes. This is the short version of it. I think personally too, he meaning Tom, is making a statement. You know, it wasn't all coach Belichick. And that's the first time we have heard what I would consider a firsthand witness talk about what we in the media have spent a ton of time talking about over the last nine months, which is how much of Brady's decision to pick the box and to move on was about proving he could do it without Bill. And there are certain things that get discussed and they are

purely media creations. And there are certain things, though, that the media is talking about because even though you can't get any of the actual parties on the record, you know them to be true. either through close sources or, in this case, a few close sources, and just your number one best source on everything, logic and reasoning. And that logic and reasoning is this. Tom Brady has had a chip on his shoulder his entire career. What has changed is what the chip is. And I'll explain in a moment how Bill Belichick may have placed the single biggest one on there yet.

But when he came into the league, what's the chip on his shoulder? 198. That's the number of people drafted before him. He's famously the 199th pick of the draft. We saw in the, I think it was NFL Network documentary like a decade ago, he could name all of the quarterbacks who were taken ahead of them. But that chip can only last so long. And Tom can say that still drives him.

But that's hard to believe, especially because, when within three months of his first NFL start, he's hoisting his first Lombardi trophy, nobody then doubted that the Patriots made a great draft. Nobody thought the Patriots made the wrong decision in sticking with Brady over Belichick, or I'm sorry, Brady over Drew Blasso. So then, what's the next chip? What's the next challenge? The next one was his rivalry with Peyton Manning. That's another one, if you remember. folks said, oh, that's a media narrative. That's a creation.

That's not how the, it's not quarterback versus quarterback. It's quarterback versus defense. Some of those folks who try to be like, let me tell you how football people think of it. Brady's not worried about Peyton Manning. And then what happened? Spite, was it, SpyGate Gate, one of the gates, one of the many Patriots, alleged cheating scandals happened. And Tom Brady's emails get released.

It was Deflate Gate. And while it was an invasion of his privacy, those emails got released. least, and so I feel badly about that. There was a very telling email to his father that came in the public sphere when he was talking about Brady versus Manning. This was when Manning was now with the Broncos. And Tom said, he's got one or two years left. I've got seven or eight years left.

That'll be the final chapter. Game on. So Brady versus Manning was always propelling him. Once he got rid of that 199th pick chip on his shoulder, it then was a little bit of a lot of a Peyton Manning chip. Doesn't matter you have more rings. He has more MVP's. He makes more money. A lot of football people say he's the better guy. But then Brady kept winning and Manning retired. And so that chip goes away because nobody argues Brady versus Manning anymore. And you know what the next one was? The one opponent no one has ever defeated. Time. It's the old cliche.

Father Time's undefeated. Tom did a whole documentary series called Tom versus. He told everybody. That's my new opponent. I'm going to play till I'm 45 years old. People think quarterbacks can't play till they're 40. I'm going to totally reframe that entirely. And that was his new challenge. That was his new motivation. And then who stepped in front of that? Bill Belichick, which will eventually lead us to where we are today. But it was Bill Belichick that stood on those train tracks of Tom versus Time and said, this train's not going any further. And Brady, understandably, was apoplectic about it.

Because it was the summer of 2019. Everyone says, oh, Tom Brady put his house up for sale. He wanted to leave. that was the final piece of Brady leaving the Patriots, but every other piece was a Belichick decision despite Brady giving him all the reason to make another decision. So think if you're Tom Brady in the summer of 2019, the only goal you've ever stated publicly that's a personal goal,

that's not a team goal, is I want to play until I'm 45. And by the way, I've got this guy, Alex Guerrero, I think he's an amazing trainer. You might think he's a quack. Don't care. He helps me with my body. It's my secret to this incredible longevity. So I'd like to work with him.

I'd like to keep playing. I'd like to be a patriot for life. And Belichick won't let it happen. And Tom, understandably, is like, wait, forget what I've done over the last 20 years. How about what I've done over the last three? So this is a defense of Brady here. Listen to this. To the summer of 2019, think about it, show the timeline.

What I do in 2016? Well, I missed those first four games because of Deflategate. All I did was go 11 and 1, and then lead the single greatest comeback in Super Bowl history to win my unprecedented at the time, fifth ring. What I do the next year? Oh, yeah, I won league MVP at age 40. And in the Super Bowl, threw for 500 yards. And he's probably thinking, and maybe, if you hadn't benched me,

Malcolm Butler, we'd have won that one. What happened in 2018? Yeah, my numbers were down, my stats were down, but I did win a road playoff game against Patrick Mahomes leading an overtime drive down the field, and we won the Super Bowl. And now it's the summer of 2019. The only personal goal I have is to play until I'm 45, and you're telling me no. You won't give me the extension. And look up. The Tom Curran pieces. I did it this morning. July 29th, 2019.

Tom Brady's asked about an extension, says to reporters, ask Mr. Kraft, do you think I've earned one? Six days later, August 5th, 2019. It has reported Tom Brady signs an extension. But then we find out it was a fake extension. There was no actual real years tacked on to the end of it.

He got a raise, and the Patriots couldn't franchise tag him. That's October 5th, 2019, and on October 6th, he put his house on the market. On that day, that moment, he said, okay, fine. I've done all this. I have always performed. I've always been the commensurate teammate,

and you don't believe in me. Bill Belichick agreed with me more than he agreed with Tom. Bill Belichick said, I see the numbers going down. I see the trajectory of every quarterback ever once they get to a certain age. I cannot. best in you into your mid-40s.

It's an insane proposition. And so guess what? That then became Brady's newest chip. 199th pick, beat you. Peyton Manning, long gone. Time? Well, I won league MVP at 40, and I won my sixth Super Bowl at 41. But now my coach, the man who's been on this journey the entire time,

with me, the man who should know to doubt me the least, the man who our success is inextricably tied together, he is telling me, as much as he very well may love me, I don't believe in you. I think you believe in yourself more than is realistic. I think you believe you can do something and for the first time, I don't believe you can't. And so you can come to me and ask me for an extension, an extension that my boss, Robert Kraft, wants me to give, that the fans of the team want me to give, that your teammates want me to give.

And I am going to say no. Not because I don't like Tom Brady, not because I have some grudge against Tom Brady, not because I have something to prove to Tom Brady, but because in my head, in my heart, in my belief, you're not going to be worth it. And that moment right there, Tom Brady was the 199th pick all over again. The person who knows me more than anyone in football is telling me I can't do it.

He didn't have an heir apparent. Jimmy Garoppolo wasn't there. They didn't have some great draft pick. We saw, by the way, with their quarterback situation. was. They were going to have to go with Stidham. And Stidham couldn't even, he ended up being third on the depth chart when it was all said and done this year. But Belichick was that certain that that, that cliff that I'd been talking about, that this is now Nick talking, that folks on television, myself included have been talking about, that Brady was approaching it. And maybe it was already

falling off it. And you saw it in the play calling in 2019 as last year with the Patriots. You saw it where they put their resources in 2019. And Belichick flatly said, I am not tying my team's fortunes to an old man quarterback who's going down. And so, of course, Tom Brady's motivation is not about proving that he was more important than Bill for those first six Super Bowls. That's what people are missing. It's not about retroactive credit over the 04 Super Bowl against the Eagles. It's about right now, present.

Today, I was in the building, I was here every day, you saw how I did meetings, you saw how I did practice, you saw how dedicated I was to my body, my craft, how this is my life. You saw all of it. We had just won a Super Bowl. We were the defending champs. We had been to three in a row. The one we lost, I threw for 500 yards. I'm two years removed from a league MVP, and you are looking in my eyes saying, I can't trust you. I can't believe in you that this is who you're going to be moving forward.

And so that's the motivation. It's not about who gets credit for what happened in New England. It's about that Tom Brady was forced, he feels, I'm sure, to not continue in New England. Because the guy who should have believed in him more than anybody believed in him as much as Nick Wright did. which was not much. Kevin Clark is going to join us and tell us what went wrong for Patrick Mahomes.

And if he blames the Super Bowl on Patrick Mahomes, I'll never speak to him again. That's coming up next. Nick right and for Colin on The Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year.

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It is Nick Wright in for Colin Cowherd on the herd. Kevin Clark from the ringer joins us in just about 10 minutes. Bottom of the hour, no, not bottom of the hour. 75% of the way through the hour, the quarter of the hour. I don't know. How would you say that? 45 after the hour. How about that? Let's go with that. We're going to get into... Yesterday I talked about Tom Brady's three Hall of Fame careers.

I was trying to figure out which of those three careers was the most impressive. We'll get into that. But first, here's Joy Taylor with the news. No, no, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Tired up cooking at home, change it up without getting up. Just order Jersey mics through their app for no contact delivery.

or no contact at the door pickup, Jersey mics, be a sub above. So Patrick Mahomes has been playing with turf toe through the playoffs, and now that the season is over, he will reportedly undergo surgery Wednesday. That's tomorrow. Super Bowl was Sunday. Wednesday is when he's going to have surgery. To repair it, the rehab will be several months, but Mahomes is expected to make a full recovery and be ready for the start of training camp. Now, I wanted to let a few days go before discussing this.

I don't believe in excuses, but I do think there are reasons. And injuries are not fun to talk about. They're not sexy. It's not something we want to really evaluate in a big way when it comes to big games, because it does feel a little bit like it's in the excuse family. We didn't talk a whole lot about Eric Fisher and Mitchell Sports being out before the game, because that's not, you know, we want to talk about goat status and legacy. Because it's football.

Dynasties, right. But that obviously played a massive role in that game. And this turf toe situation did as well. He's having surgery tomorrow. He played in the biggest game of the year on Sunday. That means it's a very significant injury. If you know what turf toe is, in a way to describe it, imagine this is a foot.

This big part of your toe right here is what's injured. So when you bend your foot to say run or throw, you're going to be in excruciating pain, which I'm sure he played through, which guys played through horrible injuries all the time in big games. Like I said, it's not an excuse, but it just could be a reason. Well, so I think there is a difference between an excuse and an explanation, right? An excuse is trying to explain away, or explain away, is trying to essentially say why something happened, why it wasn't your fault when it probably was.

An explanation is, wow, he didn't look like himself, what was going on. Oh, he was dealing with this, dealing with that. Now, what I will say on this front is, I do not think that if his foot was fully healthy, this game goes differently. I don't think the reason the Chiefs got annihilated was because Mahomes wasn't at a total 100%. What I will say is Mahomes hit me with the okey-doke a bit by doing two things. One is he looked brilliant against the bills, but the other one was Joy. The shoes he wore off the plane. He was wearing velvet red loafers, no socks, no support.

I'm like, oh, my man's foot's fine. You wouldn't wear those shoes if your foot was hurting you, but I was wrong. And like everything about this Super Bowl, I was wrong. I was trying to Zeprooter his footwear choice. It did not serve me well, Joy. No, and I don't think that Mahomes didn't play a good enough game to win. To my point, like, I don't think this is an excuse for why they lost. But I do think he was in a lot of pain, obviously, or he wouldn't be having surgery tomorrow.

I think that the bigger, more significant injuries were on the offensive line. Like, that's obviously what actually played a role. And had they been healthy, I do think this game would have gone differently. So Jerry Rice is one of the best players in NFL history. Many would argue the goats before probably the Atlanta Super Bowl and now. But his argument for the greatest of all time obviously has been diminished because of those accomplishments by Tom Brady. He pretty much solidified his space as the goat, at least in the NFL, with his seventh Super Bowl this season. And Jerry Rice concedes that Brady has earned the title, but he does think that he,

Jerry played in a more physical era. I don't have seven Super Bowl rings, but I think I played in an era where football was more of a contact sport. You're not seeing a lot of that now, you know, players are projected. When you got seven rings, you're doing something right. So he said something about playing until he's 45. I think he can do it now in this league because players are so much more protected. So, yeah, he can have that ghost status.

I never wanted that status anyhow. I will say, I believe the. he is right. I won't say it's less of a physical league now, but there are players are obviously more protected, particularly the quarterback position. All the rules are more favorable to the offense.

So he's definitely right about that. They've tried to get rid of the awful hits and player safety is definitely improved. I do agree, I don't think that he is somebody who cares about being the goat. Now all these guys are extremely competitive, but I've talked to him personally about the goat thing and he is completely dismissed it.

Like he doesn't want to have that conversation. And I do think to your point earlier about using logic, Tom Brady obviously cares about going down as the greatest of all time because it's something that matters to him. And that's not a negative thing. I think it's a great thing. But it's just also a reality. It's going to be skewed as a bit of a slight what Jerry said there.

But I don't think he was actually trying to take a shot. I think he was just explaining, like, Tom Brady can play at this level for as long as he is, I'll be in an outlier because the game is a little bit different. Okay, so there's a lot here. One is, like, of course, as time goes on, guys are going to be able to play longer, you know, conditions are going to improve health, fitness, and the game's getting safer, right? And, you know, I'll use the NBA example.

Larry Bird suffered his major back injury that kind of derailed his career because he was retarring his own driveway. Like, they, it just, and that seems like something that should have happened in 1946, not 1988. And so, like, yes, like, LeBron can sleep in a hyperbaric chamber and is probably not retarring his own driveway. So all of that, we have to kind of do the math in our head about how, what we're going to count, what we're not going to count if we're going to discount anything. The question I would have for you, Joy, is do you think football is like basketball, where you can have one player who is at the top of the pyramid, or is it more like baseball,

where, you know, who's the greatest pitcher of all time? and who's the greatest hitter of all time. It's not like you can't cross-pollinate those two. Because I would almost argue there's like best quarterback ever and then best non-quarterback ever because it's such different jobs. And even if you go defensive to the ball, best defensive player ever,

I just don't know if this actual honorific exists in football. No, you're absolutely right. Basketball is a little bit more positionless, although I would think that most centers would disagree with that. the game has changed a lot in that regard as well. But yeah, baseball, obviously very different. How do you compare a catcher to a pitcher? Like football, you have the whole, you have three different.

Satchel page to Babe Ruth. What do you do? Right. Like, you know what I mean? Like, they're just totally different people. I mean, yeah. And then you have, like, you have kickers in football. Like, how do you compare everyone?

I think it's just that Tom Brady has accomplished so much over such a broad spectrum of time that it's becoming kind of a nuanced argument. Like he is obviously the best because of what he has accomplished individually and with the team success. And then we can start talking about other positions because obviously Lawrence Taylor transformed the game. Like where do you put him all time? Obviously Jerry Rice. You still have Joe Montana up there as well. Obviously, you know, Tom Brady playing the same position.

Jim Brown, Dion. Jim Brown. Dion. Yes. So it is a bit more of an argument. I think that Tom Brady's just accomplished so much that it's like what's the point of trying to compare anyone to what Tom Brady has accomplished. So it starts after him. So the Lakers didn't have AD last night, but they were able to sneak past the Thunder with a 119, 112 overtime win. The bronze stepped up in 80s absence with his third triple double of the season, scoring 28 points, 14 rebounds and 12 assists. This was the

fifth win in a row for the Lakers, tying their longest winning streak of the season and the second straight game that had to go to overtime. Anthony Davis and Alex Crusoe did not play. I haven't heard you talk about this yet. I don't know if you're where you stand on this, but I, I, I was adamant that LeBron should have been the MVP last season. My preseason prediction for MVP was Luca, which is looking not so great now. I think that LeBron is putting together a really nice MVP resume so far heading into All Star. So last year, believe it or not, I didn't think it was LeBron. I thought LeBron could have caught Janus, but the season ended too early for him to catch him. This year, I also picked Luca before the year, but the Mabbs's

are a mess. This is so weird, because statistically, this is honestly like LeBron's 13th best season. Like, I think he's had 12 statistical seasons better than this one. And I think right now he is clearly the MVP. The Warriors are not good enough. They're out of the playoffs right now. The Nuggets are keep losing games as good as Yokic is, and he's a one-way player.

That Durant keeps missing time, and he's with Hardening Kyrie, so that's going to hurt him. To me, LeBron and Embed are the only two legitimate candidates right now. And I think LeBron's going to win it. I think the Lakers, we don't have to talk about it much here because I know we have Kevin coming up. I think the Lakers are demonstrably better than everybody else. I think like they, and I understand overtime win against the Thunder doesn't demonstrate that. They are, they are cruise controlling it for three and a half quarters and then kicking it in at the end of games. I think they are clearly the best team by a decent margin.

There is Joy Taylor with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Heard Lye News. Kevin Clark from The Ringer joins us right now. Brought to you by Mercedes-Benz, The Best or Nothing. Kevin, it's great to see you. Sunday was bottom five day of my life.

Also on that list are both of my slow newsday appearances, but we don't have to get into that right now. What the hell happened? What happened? What happened on Sunday? Well, we spent the last two years thinking that Patrick Mahomes was this unstoppable John Witt character. It doesn't matter what happens. He's got the knockout power.

And then we found out the limits. The limits were Mike Remmers. The limits were not having any of the things that make you, that you normally provide the base of your success. And I think that we saw that for the first, time he's mortal. And I actually think this might end up being good for his career. But to answer your question, 29 pressures happened. And no one can overcome that, not even the best quarterback we've ever seen. When you say it could be good for his career, explain why. So, you know, I think that we get into this trap where we think that every other team can go all in all the time. And Mahomes

just is the only ingredient needed in Kansas City. And the Reed is the only ingredient needed in Kansas the city. And I've talked to Brett Beach about this, the GM. And he basically says that every team now is all in every single year. That's, you know, remember a couple of years ago, less need the Rams GM said, oh, the Rams are, we're going to be like the Warriors, all this stuff. And it was revolutionary at the time. Well, now everybody who competes for a champion to probably eight teams a year, they're all in. They're maximizing the cap. They're trading for a superstar every single year. I mean, Stefan Diggs with the bills last year is a good example of that. And so I think that now we know Mahomes's, you know, 10-year contract. It still has.

has what the 16th and 18th biggest cap hits the next three seasons. So it's not like it goes to some insane number. The chiefs are going to need to build. And they're going to need to, they have the base for success, but they're going to need to take some swings. And I think that we learned that last night. And a lot of that is going to be offensive line. We don't know the future of Mitchell Schwartz.

We don't know the future of Eric Fisher. Obviously went out two weeks ago. We don't know how long term that's going to be. Mahomes needs help like everybody else. I think he's the best quarterback I've ever seen, but he's human. That's what we learned. So let's talk about, I think, the MVP of the game, who obviously didn't get an MVP vote, and that's Todd Bowles.

Because we can talk about the Chiefs offensive line being banged up, and it was. But it's the same offensive line they had against Buffalo, minus Eric Fisher. I know they moved people around, but Mitchell Schwartz's been out for three months. They've been playing with a lot of these guys throughout the year. And the Chiefs went 386 run on Buffalo, and against the Bucks, it looked, like Patrick Mahomes at Texas Tech, running around trying to make a crazy play totally overmatched. And, you know, I have egg on my face because before the game, I said to Colin, I think, I was like, you're acting like the Bucks front four of the purple people eaters.

They're really good, but they're not the greatest D-line ever. I still feel that way, even though they played like the greatest D-line ever, which to me is about the scheme. How did Todd Bowles so out-maneuver Andy Reid and Eric B. Anima? He made adjustments and he went with a strategy he's never done in his life, which is he blitzed 9% of the time, which is the lowest number on record. And he said, okay, here's what I do. It doesn't matter. Throw it out.

Here's what the chiefs aren't good against. And listen, Todd Bowles did not invent taking away the deep pass. A bunch of teams have done that again, Patrick Mahomes. The difference was, first of all, obviously the pressure within the linebackers. And they had fast linebackers who could hang with the chiefs. And that's what made the difference. Whether that's Levanti David hanging on and being okay against Kelsey for three quarters, whether that's Devin White being all over the place and taking away screens.

I mean, the pressure obviously was the most notable thing. That's where everything flowed through. But the defensive backs played well, the linebackers played well. This team was built for the Chiefs. I don't know if that was intentional. This is sort of, you know, a fast team that could hang with them. And then Todd Bowles knew what to do with him. In the biggest game of his life, Todd Bull has made adjustments.

Andy Reid didn't. That is the coaching story of this game. One more on the Super Bowl, and then I want to move on to some other things. You mentioned Andy Reid didn't make adjustments. Yeah. That was shocking to me. I think you're totally right, but it was watching it happen. I don't know what the counterpunch was, and maybe it would have whiffed, but I would have liked to seen it.

Like, what did you make of why he didn't and what they could have done? Okay, so the biggest shock to me for the entire game wasn't the pressure because I guess if you had told me, They get a bunch of pressure against those tackles. I would understand that. Okay. The biggest shock to me is that nothing changed throughout the game. I mean, how accustomed are you and I to seeing Patrick Mahomes down 10 points, 14 points, 24 to 7 if it's against Bill O'Brien, and then he just turns it on, right? It's like seeing Liam Neeson in an action movie.

Like, you know what's coming. Here come the fireworks, right? And nothing ever happened because the pressure never got better. And so 92% of the plays that Chiefs ran were in five-man protection. Now there's some wiggle room there with the chips and all that stuff. but they didn't ever do a max protect thing or anything like that. And that's not what they like to do. They like to get Travis Kelsey out into routes.

They like throwing to the back out of the backfield. I understand all that. But I don't care. I don't care at some point. Like this wasn't about, some people were criticizing Reed for still taking deep shots or whatever. None of it matters if Patrick Mahomes isn't being protected. I was looking at the passing charts this morning.

He was, Mahomes was three of seven within 10 yards throwing to the left. Behind the line of scrimmage throwing to the right, he was three of six. This wasn't a play. thing, this was a protection thing. So whatever you can do to keep Patrick Mahomes from looking like he's facing a defense that has turned off sides off in Madden, okay, that's what it looked like, or they were doing a jail break screen and it was intentional. I don't know what it was.

I never seen anything like it. So if you can get Mahomes out of that scenario, you do it. And Andy Reed just never did it. I don't care. It's not what you do. Change what you do because Todd Bowles did. All right. So this could be the off season of unprecedented quarterback movement. We already saw Stafford and go off that trade. Wintz might get trade. there are two superstars who I don't think are going anywhere, but they seem to be a little nonplussed with their current situations. And that is one of your favorites, Aaron Rogers, and another one of your favorites, Russell Wilson.

By the way, if you don't know Kevin Clark, he likes really good football players. They're mostly all his favorites. Huge fan. So you said something that I thought was interesting that applies to, I think, Rogers and Wilson. you said that Les Sneed said every year we're all in. Like everyone's all in.

And that Brett Veets, they're all in. And you look around the league and it's like, oh, the Bucks went all in. They got Brady. They got Gronk. They got A.B. They traded up in the draft. They're in the Super Bowl. The Chiefs had Alex Smith.

They trade up. We're not satisfied and they keep push, push, push. Seahawks and the Packers seem to be like, no, we're actually not all in. We're just kind of in, even though our players, our quarterbacks are amazing. do you think that has to do with the frustration of Russell Wilson and Aaron Rogers? And do you think there could be any movement there? Yes. Yeah, absolutely.

It has everything to do with it because the Packers have since Ted Thompson, and before that, Ron Wolf, they've tended to be pretty conservative. They take big swings going back under Ron Wolf to Reggie White. Charles Woodson is a big swing. But year and year out, they're mostly draft and developed and pick their spots. There are a couple, you know, Zadaria Smith and Preston Smith. They'll go out every few years and make those changes. but they're not all in every year like some of these teams.

Okay, they're not in every, there are teams right now who are in every trade discussion. And if someone's available, they'll make a call. I don't think the Packers and the Seahawks necessarily operate like that. They're a little bit more of long game, keep the window open, all that stuff, okay? And I think that Aaron Rogers sees when a team goes out and trades for a superstar receiver. And he says, I'd like that on the other side of Devante Adams. Or I'd like some more defensive help to go all in.

And I just think that we're in a league now where superstars go for two first round picks. And I'm intrigued to see what new teams make those big swings in the next couple of months to help their quarterback to help their window. If you're not all in right now, we saw that with the bucks. Tom Brady happened to join a team that was all in and had Chris Godwin of Levanti, David, and Shaq Barrett in last year their contracts. This was a stacked roster. I don't think there's a lot of team building lessons from that because, you know, it's going to be really hard for a team to find the next goat who's mad at his, The organization you played for for 20 years, it's an extenuating circumstance. But what I would say is that if you don't have a stacked roster, that's the barrier for entry now into the Super Bowl.

Good quarterback, stacked roster. Seahawks and Packers don't have it right now. All right. We got 60 seconds. One last question. Very simple. Who looks worse after Brady wins his seventh Super Bowl? Me for my takes the last four years or Bill Belichick for seemingly agreeing with those takes and telling Tom, we don't need you here anymore.

I think it's Belichick. I know I'd love to roast you here. I'd love to roast you here. But you didn't build a team without weapons. You didn't build a team where the highest-graded receiver was James White last year. You didn't build a team where over a two-year period, Nick, Julian Edelman had 11 deep receptions. That was the most in the team. And in one year, Mike Evans has 15, including the playoffs.

And that Chris Godwin and Robin Kowski have eight. I mean, this was once you saw that Brady still had the arm, you look back on the 29 Patriots, you go, oh, I get this. Oh, I see what was going on here. This was not Brady in decline. This was the Patriot skill guys putting Brady in decline. And that's a huge, huge indictment. Velashek, best team builder of all time, not in 2019. Kevin Clark from the ringer, slow newsday is amazing. The podcasts are amazing. The writing's amazing. Kevin, it's great to talk to you. Thank you so much. Continued success, my friend. Love coming on with you, Nick. Absolutely. There's the great Kevin Clark. Coming up next,

Speaking of Brady, yesterday we talked about how he's the only player ever to have three Hall of Fame careers within one career. Which of those was actually the best mini career? The answer, when I looked into it, the answer shocked to me. I think it'll surprise you. We'll do that next. Nick right in for Colin on The Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific.

Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth.

Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? This Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano and our podcast Point game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game.

His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nasree. He has to guard Julius Rand. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too.

Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He run up the court, licking his fingers why he got the ball. Like, you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. American soccer is about to explode. The World Cup is coming.

Ramos sending on to Ernie Stewart the chip. I'm Tad Ramos. I'm Tom Boe. On our podcast, Inside American Soccer, you'll get the real storylines. I'm not worried about Policic. I'm not worried about Balligan. I'm not worried about McKinney. My only concern is what happens in the back.

The biggest decisions. If you're going to look at stats and numbers, he has no shot at making this World Cup team. and the truth about the U.S. national team. It wouldn't be a huge surprise if our team ends up in the quarterfinals or potentially a great run into the semifinals. The World Cup is almost here. Experience it all with us.

Listen to Inside American Soccer with Tom Bogart and Tab Ramos on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcast. Hey, everyone, it's Ryder Strong and Wilfredel from PodMeets World. And now the PodMeets Twirled podcast. We're two men who were completely clueless to reality TV. who now have covered Dancing with the Stars, traitors, and we're gearing up for the season finale of Survivor. So yeah, now we're experts.

I know we annoyed a lot of our listeners by our severe lack of survivor knowledge. That is the point of the show. I'm just going to remind you. I have watched some Survivor. I obviously haven't watched enough. Did people not like it? Like what was just because we?

Yeah. We'll be recapping the big conclusion in the 50th season from the final attempts at gameplay to the desperate plea as a finalist to a bunch of ha, who, ha, ho, ha, who. Again, we are experts.

So make sure to tune into Pod Meets Twirled for all our Survivor 50 takes. Listen to PodMeets Twirled on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's Nick Wright in for Colin Coward on the herd, and I got to remind you guys, the supplement Colin swears by every day is MDrive, powerful ingredients, backed by science,

help you get energized, stronger, leaner. Go to MDrive, 4. where men.com today. Get free shipping and a 60-day money-back guarantee. Don't let age beat you. Refined your prime with M-Drive. So Russell Wilson is more than a little frustrated with Seattle. We'll discuss that in 10 minutes.

But I want to revisit something we discussed yesterday here for a moment, which was, and Joy in the News mentioned how Jerry Rice said, Tom Brady's the goat now. Whether you agree that there is such things of full. football goat. What had been true was Rice and Brady were the only NFL guys ever that you could cut their careers in half and say, first half, second half, both first ballot Hall of Fame careers. Pick a half, either one, first ballot hall of fame production accolades all of it. Brady, with this latest Super Bowl victory, elevated to an impossible tier, which is three

separate First Ballot Hall of Fame career. if you just cut it into thirds, and we showed it to you yesterday. There's the Aikman phase, which was the first seven years of his career. And again, the numbers on the right are what that player did in their entire career. And on the left is what Brady did over this seven-year stretch. Matched him in Super Bowls, beating it in Super Bowl MVP. He's neither one of a regular season MVP in that time. Then there's the Dan Marino phase.

And again, that's Marino's entire career on the right-hand side versus what Brady did from 07 to 13. And again, it's more appearances, more Super Bowl appearances, more Super Bowl MVs. If you're listening on the radio and you can't see the graphic. And then these last seven years are the Montana phase.

And this is the one that is really, truly incomprehensible. Because Joe Montana was the gold standard for greatest quarterback ever. And Brady, in the last seven years, has the same number of Super Bowl. titles, the same number of Super Bowl MVP, one fewer

regular season MVP than Montana did in his whole career, but one more Super Bowl appearance. And this is the other thing on the Tom versus Time where everyone must acknowledge he's winning. Of those three phases, the Aikman

phase, the Marino phase, the Montana phase, the most impressive is the most recent one. What he's done the last seven years is better than he did. the middle seven or the first seven. It's not just that he won more Super Bowls. It's not just that he went to five of seven Super Bowls,

but it's also that the one Super Bowl he lost, he threw 500 yards, and he did it now with a new team with a different team. In fact, I would argue, and I know some Pat's fans will disagree with me here, I think each one is more impressive than the last. I think the most impressive is the last seven years, The next most impressive is the middle seven,

even though he won no Super Bowls in those middle seven. He had the undefeated season, he had two league MVPs, those teams were propelled by him, not the defense. And somehow the least impressive is the first seven years when he won three Super Bowls and his first four years as a starter. Could Russell Wilson be on the move? That's next on the hurt. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy,

not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends, me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam, it's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast Point Game. the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was crying. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Mark keep coming to, he's like,

you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everyone. It's Ryder Strong and Will Ferrell from PodMeets World. And now the Pod Meets Twirled podcast. We're two men who were completely clueless to reality TV, and we're gearing up for the season finale of Survivor. I know we annoyed a lot of our listeners by our severe lack of survivor knowledge. That is the point of the show.

I'm just going to remind you. Again, we are experts. Listen to Pod Meets Twirled on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Joey Dardano, and on my new podcast, Hope from a Hypocrite, I'll be changing lives. helping people in need with thoughtful solutions. Psych, I'm a comedian. I'm not qualified to give good advice. Join me and my comedian friends as we riff, rant,

recommend some of the most legally dubious advice known to me. This is Help from a Hypocrite, the worst advice from the dumbest people you know. Listen to Help from a Hypocrite Wednesdays on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.