The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 04/30/2021 - Best of The Herd

Episode Date: April 30, 2021

Colin goes all in on the NFL draft: explains why he loves the 49ers taking North Dakota State QB Trey Lance and the Bears making a big move to land Ohio State QB Justin Fields. He addresses Aaron Rodgers wanting out of Green Bay and why Colin understands his frustration. Find out which moves he didn’t like from the first round. Plus, former Falcons GM Thomas Dimitroff joins the show to breakdown the best picks from the first round.   Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel,

help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it.

Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. On the Look Back at it podcast. From 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 is big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it.

With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild. I mean, it was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days I'd put on 10 pounds, I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening to the best of herd podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1. Find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Herd.

This is the Best of the Herd with Colin Cowher on Fox Sports Radio. Ah, it is a Friday post-round-1 NFL draft, one of my favorite shows of the year, live in Los Angeles. This is The Herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening, Fox Sports Radio, I-Heart Radio, and FS1, it was everything. was billed to be one of the great first rounds, first two and a half hours of the NFL draft ever. Aggressive teams, patient teams. I thought outside of one or two picks, I thought most teams got what they wanted. Joy Taylor is joining me.

That was fun. It was a great night. And it just felt good. It was so nice to see the fans back at the draft. I forgot, I forgot in a little bit how cool the draft is. I love it, though. I love seeing the guys go out and hug the commissioner and, you know, they're crying with their families in the back and seeing the guys at home.

It was, I think it was a great night for the NFL and a great night for fans. Yeah, it's very relatable. The commissioner makes it relatable. You walk up to fans, you show a fan. I like that they had his chair there. I loved it. I thought it was great. So I'm very happy this morning.

I'm very happy because I don't really root for teams. I've told you this. I root for people. I root for people especially, I know, and San Francisco got Trey Lance, and I thought it was the right move. I just felt, honestly, it made me really happy. I felt sick yesterday going into the draft. I loved John Lynch. I covered John Lynch.

He used to be a co-worker at Fox, and I love the Shanahan's, don't know them well, but love him. And I was just sick to my stomach that Kyle Shanahan super. smart. He's the star of the franchise right now. He'd fallen in love with Mac Jones. And it just got horrible press when that story leaked. I mean awful. Nobody liked it. And even if Mac Jones would have had some success, and I think he would have had some success, nobody was going to ever buy into it. And then they were going to trade Jimmy Garapolo because that would at least validate playing Mac Jones. And instead they didn't. And they'd have low-ceiling Mac Jones, who I think, think's a nice fit in New England, but against Russell Wilson twice a year and Kyler Murray twice a year

and Matt Stafford twice a year, he would be the least athletic, smallest in terms of arm, dynamic playmaking ability. I just felt sick to my stomach, and instead they did the right thing. They drafted the bigger, stronger, more athletic, significantly higher upside. And Trey Lance, they're going to keep Garoppolo, according to stories this. morning until the wheels fall off they should there's no reason to trade jimmy until tray's ready to go you gave up a second round pick for him that's nothing you already won that trade you don't need to win that trade twice all the rumors all the conjecture and two smart people john lynch and kyle shanahan did it right look around the NFL folks i mean it's nice that philip rivers got to

the playoffs but you got to have a quarterback who can move a little the rules are different now Offensive lines generally aren't as good. You need some athletic ability. And Mack Jones will be nice in New England. But as we all slobbered over Mac Jones and how great and how brilliant and how smart he was, I got to give the SPN credit. Bougar McFarland came out yesterday during the draft. And he did something that I really liked.

He went and showed the five times last year that Mack Jones didn't have perfect protection. He couldn't outrun defensive tackles. Bougar did a good job. He's like, yeah, this is what happens when the alibi. pass protection breaks down, you know, four times a year, and he couldn't move. And oh, by the way, do you understand that the Rams, the Seahawks in Arizona have three of the top five pass rushes in the NFL, and they got better because now J.J. Watts in town. Like, whoever took, whoever the Niners took was going to succeed.

That's not really the question. But the pressure on Mack Jones in San Francisco would have been relentless because you gave up so much for him and because this is a Super Bowl roster. Okay, and I kept hearing this. Well, he's a good fit for Kyle's system. Okay, I get that. I do get that and I can defend that. But Kyle Shanahan's two, oh and two in Super Bowls, and he had guys that were perfect fits, pocket guys. Maybe if he had a quarterback that was a little more dynamic, he'd be two and O in Super Bowls and not O in two.

to move up to number three and give up all those picks is not just about getting a guy who fits. It's about elevating the position. It's not about safe. He fits. He's safe. Well, then go to the third round, fourth round, and get a Kirk Cousins. When you give up that many picks and you go to three, brother, you got to swing. You got to take a big swing on a quarterback talent, not play it safe.

and again, Mackle work in New England to the level he can work. The ceiling's low. But I entered yesterday thinking, oh, this can be awful. Because say what you want. The fans matter and the media matters. And when they're all against you on a pick, I've been watching the media. I've been in it for 30 years. There's two ways to write the same story.

If they hate your pick, not only you can win and they won't give you credit. You have to win big for years until the media acknowledges, all right, maybe you were right. It was just going to be an avalanche of ugly. And every time Mack played against Russell Wilson, you're going to be like, Russell's running around making plays. And then Kyler Marie's running around making plays. And Matt Stafford's got the golden arm from above.

And you got, you got Mac Jones. Now you took a big swing. Now you validate moving up. It made me very, very happy. All right, now a general manager, Ryan Pace in Chicago, I usually clover. Got to be honest. There's more than one way to get what you want in the draft. The Chargers got what they wanted and they were patient.

I think New England got what they wanted a quarterback and they were patient. The Jets were aggressive. The Bears were aggressive. So was Philadelphia and they got what they wanted. First of all to the media. stop creating drama before we have it. Justin Fields, this is outrageous. How can't, let's just let the draft develop.

He's just too talented to drop too far. And Chicago said, we got Andy Dalton, run in a division with Aaron Rogers, at least for the time being, we got to get dynamic. And they did. This is a great spot for Justin Fields. Super clever head coach, made the playoffs two of the last three years, way above average defense, Alan Robinson star receiver, and Tariq Cohen comes back. By the way, for the first time in the history of the NFL, the Chicago Bears feel better about their quarterback than the Packers do.

Because nobody knows how Aaron and Green Bay is going to end. In Chicago today, hope, optimism, we did it. And I have banged on Ryan Pace for a couple of years. This took guts. It took some luck, but Matt Nagy went 25 and 13 with Trubisky. Andy Dalton, for the record, very much like Alex Smith, a great mentor for a year. Andy watches the draft. He knows his role.

Play until the kid is ready. But I'll say this morning for all those who feared Justin Fields would drop, if I'm Justin Fields, I would not trade places with Zach Wilson of the Jets, I don't feel this is a fingers crossing situation. Clever head coach, star receiver, Tariq Cohen comes back, good enough defense. And by the way, Zach Wilson's in a division with Belichick twice a year and Brian Flores twice a year and Sean McDermott twice a year. And Justin Fields is like, I get the Lions twice a year? Green Bay may not have Aaron Rogers in three hours.

Minnesota's got Kirk Cousins, so what? Took courage, took guts. It was a step-up move by the Chicago Bears. But can I fire a shot at the media? Let's all take a deep breath. The quarterbacks kind of went where they were supposed to go. The prodigy went number one. And then Trey Lance, Zach Wilson, and Justin Fields, they're dynamic.

They went next. The order's not that relevant. Those were the three guys that were like, whoa, whoa. whoa and a Mac Jones went fifth and that's where Mac Jones should go. Doesn't mean he can't succeed more than Zach because he gets Belichick and Zach gets Robert Salah. But it's a good move by Chicago. It's a really good move and it's a great, great place. And there is no guarantee in this NFL.

You get the wrong coach. Ask Jared Goff's first year and then his following years. The coach matters. Matt Nagy's good. And if you question it, he got Mitch Trubesky to the playoffs twice in a division with Aaron Rogers and the Packers. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential.

Either way, the podcast, Superhuman, documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th.

You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from Bathurst. basketball to college football or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music.

The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs?

Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do a little kill? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s.

To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed cracks. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Now you're finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people.

Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field

and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough

because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth? Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust.

I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keir Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way. Open your free, our heart radio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Aaron Rogers is petty. Aaron Rogers is passive aggressive. Aaron Rogers is a grudge holder. Yesterday he was vindictive.

Yesterday, Aaron Rogers was calculated. Not a coincidence on the one year anniversary. He was humiliated by the Jordan Love Pick. He comes back and humiliates the Green Bay Packers. But I get it. He's frustrated. So give me a minute to tell a story here. I have a friend he grew up with my only friend that grew up with money.

His dad died. He has an estate. He doesn't take big swings financially. He hits doubles because he feels he owes the family and the grandkids what the father built. I didn't grow up with that. I didn't grow up with money. I take major risks, leave jobs all the time. We're good friends, but we see the world differently and we should.

Green Bay is unique. They don't have an owner. It's a top three to five sports. brand in the country. Brian Kudakins, the GM, feels like more of an executor of a will than he does GM for a football team. Both Aaron Rogers and Brett Fav

won Super Bowls early when they were cheap. And in neither instance, with this GM or that GM, did they mortgage the future, push money down the road, go big in free agency, and try to win four and five by mortgaging the future. it's not who they are. This is a massive legendary sports brand in America.

Yankees, Lakers, Cowboys, Packers. It is in that class. Notre Dame football. Duke basketball. And with no owner, the general manager and the presidents that run it have a sense of history and responsibility to not forego the future for today. Did it with Favre who didn't ever play with them. that many great players. Look at what Brady's playing with now. Look at what Mahomes is playing with

now. So it's frustrating to Aaron. In fact, I don't think it's a coincidence that Tom Brady wins a Super Bowl. Russell Wilson and Aaron both freak out. They're contemporaries. But the difference is Seattle rolls the dice. Seattle goes for it. Seattle's aggressive, even if they're salary cap situations, not ideal. Green Bay doesn't. They don't have an owner. This has never been a great fit. The nature of the Packers is frugal, based on tradition and history, a little conservative.

They're protecting the brand. The nature of Aaron is California cool, progressive, aggressive, and go for it. It's not a good fit. Listen, I'm watching all the draft rooms last night. And I mean, the jets are high-fiving and coming out of their chairs and the lions are going crazy in their draft room. And look at the lions guys are high-fiving and hugging. Chargers, Dean Spano's high-fiving. The jets and there's the bears.

They're like, yeah, everybody's walking into the room and out of the room. And the jets are like, woo, awesome. We. And the Packers kind of bleak. kind of bleak, little bit like a morgue. Aaron is sucking the life out of this franchise. And I get it. There was a study done years ago at the University of Washington.

They took 100 couples and tried to decipher, distill down to the very instance why couples got divorced. It wasn't money and it wasn't kids. It wasn't family issues. 99% of the time people got divorced when they had lost respect for each other, when they would roll their eyes in public at a party at their wife's comment, or poke their friends in the ribs, point to their husband. Green Bay humiliated Aaron in public.

Yesterday, Aaron humiliated Green Bay in public. It's over. It's over. It may not be over now. It may not be over this year. But when you lose respect and start humiliating the other, hire a lawyer. For the record, Aaron's agent is David Dunn. He was Carson Palmer's agent.

He got Carson Palmer out of Cincinnati. Stay tuned. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd, Weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Hey, I'm John Middlecoff, and I host the three and out podcast. Do you like football? Do you like the NFL? Do you like the NFL draft? Quarterbacks, coaches.

Well, I talk about it all on the show. I used to work for Andy Reid as a scout. Now I give you my unfiltered and raw opinions on everything that goes on the NFL. And you know we're talking college football because of how important the draft is year round. Listen to the three and out podcast with me, John Middlecom, on the IHeart radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way,

this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music.

The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Cliverts show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford

and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J.

And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 was big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know.

I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack, so I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now, so... Thank you for finishing that sentence. Yes, I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years.

from black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations

with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch life becomes about wins and losses Steve Burns, Dustin Ross,

because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway.

Open your free iHeartRadio app, search Learn the Hardway, and listen now. Joe Thomas was the third overall pick out of Wisconsin, went on to play for years, never missed a snap, never missed a game, 11 NFL seasons and 10 Pro Bowls in the argument for a top three or four left tackle in the history of the game. NFL network analyst Joe Thomas now joining us live. They proudly brought to you by Mercedes Ben's the best or nothing. They proudly held that last night in Cleveland. First of all, it was a good night for the city.

I thought the Browns did a great job in their draft pick. You know, Joe, you were a very high draft pick, and you went to a team that didn't have a lot of winning in recent years. And so Zach Wilson, similarly, some of these kids go to organizations. So you went from winning Wisconsin to the Browns who were struggling. And I want you to tell my audience, take me there psychological. not just adapting to the NFL, but going from winning to losing, was it a struggle for you? Well, I think that's one of the big struggles that any player that goes to the NFL has to face.

It's dealing with the losing. How are you going to handle it? Are you going to be a guy that curls up into a ball and starts feeling sorry for yourself? Or is it going to motivate you to bring out the best in yourself to put in the extra hours in the film room, to do what it takes on the football field to get better? And I think that's something that's difficult because a lot of guys that come from these college programs like Alabama. And when I came out of Wisconsin, we had not lost very much. You're not used to losing much at all. And so you don't know how to handle that. And guys can just as easily go both ways where they start feeling sorry for themselves or it can motivate them. And you can all of a sudden see them elevate to another level.

You know, one of the moves I liked, Joe, is Joe Douglas is the new GM of the Jets. I know him a little bit. I think he's really smart. And so Sam Donald never had a chance in New York. Forget everything else. He was under duress. They never got the O line right. So last year, Joe Douglas goes and gets Beckton, the left tackle.

And then he gets his quarterback. And I love what they did last night. Zach Wilson may fail in New York, but he's not going to fail because he's running for his life. They moved up to get Elijah Vera Tucker, a terrific clean player out of USC. He'll play on the interior. Now, some people think you don't move up for a guard. But take my audience into the chemistry of an offensive line. In all your years in Cleveland, you played with a lot of different guards, Joe.

When teams move up for guards, left tackle we've always understood. You get a left tackle. That's the guy you pay. He's the great one. But the value of the guard to a lot of people is completely overrated. Your thought on what it means. Well, I love what the Jets are doing. They're not making the mistake of putting the rookie quarterback out there

when he doesn't have a supporting cast because rookie quarterbacks need development. They need protection. So you can either protect him with a great pass blocking offensive line or you can put him out front with an offensive line that does a great job with a great running game. So you don't have to put too much pressure on that rookie quarterback to win before he's ready with his arm. And the new offense that they have there, Mike LaFleur, he's actually a coach that worked with me when I was in Cleveland.

He's bringing the Kyle Shanahan wide offensive running zone scheme. And the guard becomes really important. when you're running that offensive run scheme because what you have to do to be able to get that run play started is you've got to keep the guard and the defensive tackle on the line of scrimmage, get him running down the line of scrimmage so that the running back can get three to five steps in the ground before he has to deviate from the angle that he's running at so that he can start creating those running lanes with that stretch zone concept that they have. And so when I was in Cleveland, we had Joel Betonio and we had John Greco as our guards. You need big strong guards that

can keep those defensive tackles on the line of scrimmage. They don't allow penetration. It allows the play to get started, get that running back's shoulders facing down the field so that they can fall forward for a minimum of four yards so you can line up and run it again. And in this scheme, guard is an absolute premium when you're talking about being able to move defensive tackles like guys like Aaron Donald off the line of scrimmage and not allowing penetration because a lot of times in this scheme when you're a guard, you're going one-on-one, you don't have center help because if a guard has a three technique, which is a three-technic,

an outside alignment by a defensive tackle. Usually that noseguard is a backside alignment on the center. So the center is going to be double teaming with the backside guard, and that front side guard is all by himself on an island. That's one of the toughest things in all pro football to do. And that's why you go get a guy like Elijah Verit Tucker from USC, who is my second favorite offensive lineman in this draft. Wow.

And everybody just got smarter, folks. You just got Concepts 101 from Joe Thomas. Now, it's interesting. I'm not going to ask you for a number, but you played with some rookie quarterbacks in Cleveland, I would imagine. I think most of these guys ended up in really nice spots. But I want you to go back to your career and the rookie quarterbacks you had. What advice would you give Mac Jones or Trey Lance or Zach Wilson?

I mean, we know Trevor Lawrence going to play really early. What advice would you give them in their first camp about integrating your personality with the team, gaining respect because you're a kid? Nobody knows if you're any good. And by the way, here's your franchise, run the offense. What would the advice be? I would say, listen first, talk second. You've got so much to learn.

And I know you're coming from a great program. Like if you're Mack Jones, you're coming from Alabama. You've won national championships. You've been at the top of the game in the college world. But in the NFL, it's a different world. And so the best thing you can do as a rookie is gain the respect of the guys around you by putting in the effort, spending those extra hours after everybody goes home. because those are the things that your teammates, your veteran teammates notice, and that gets you

the respect. The thing that doesn't get you the respect is when you show up and you start acting like you've been there and you know what it takes to win at the NFL level. So putting in your work, keeping your mouth shut, opening those eyes, asking a million questions, working harder than everybody around you, that's how you gain the respect. That's how you move up the ladder and become a great NFL professional. By the way, the Browns drafted Greg Newsom, a corner from Northwestern. I actually had him going to Arizona in my mock draft. A lot of people didn't have him first round. I liked him a lot.

Your thoughts on the Browns, what they got. I mean, listen, they've upgraded their secondary. It was a clear problem last year. They're in a division with Joe Burrell can throw it, and the Steelers have great receivers. And I kind of thought it was a good pick. Your thoughts? Yeah, I thought it was a great pick,

especially with Joe Woods, the defensive coordinator for the Browns. He likes playing a lot of dime, a lot of nickel, where he's going to put a lot of defensive backs on the field. it gives them a lot of flexibility. And when you had a guy like Greg Newsom who's very fundamentally sound, he's very smart, he's very savvy, he's long, he's athletic, he can make a lot of those plays. He is exactly the type of player that the Browns want to add to that secondary to allow them to lock down some of the passing game to give a guy like Miles Garrett,

who's one of the best pass rushers in the NFL, the time he needs to get to that quarterback. So for the Browns, they were in an excellent position. They didn't have to reach to take anybody. They were allowed to be able to just take the highest rated defense. a player on their board. And it just so happened that they got one guy that they really didn't expect. And it was at a cornerback position that they really coveted. Yeah, boy, if you asked me what units in the NFL improved the most this offseason?

The Chargers offensive line and the Brown secondary have made massive improvements. By the way, your thoughts? We were very skeptical of Mack Jones three. Trey Lance instead goes three. Your general thoughts on that? Well, I like Trey Lance to the Niners a lot better. playing for Kyle Shanan, understand how much he likes a big quarterback that can get outside the pocket and that can throw accurately down the field on the move.

And that's exactly who Trey Lance is. I don't think you move up to the number three spot to get something like a Mack Jones, who is basically a guy like Kyle has had a number of times in his career that have kept him from winning Super Bowls. Let's be honest, Jimmy G, Matt Ryan, Matt Schab, Kurt Cousins. Those guys are all kind of in the same mold as a Matt. Mac Jones. He wanted to be able to maximize what this offense can do and to have a guy like Trey Lance with that skill set gives him an ability to finally see what is the ceiling that I have for this offense. And so that made perfect sense for me. And I actually like Mack Jones a lot better

to the Patriots than just about anybody else because he's the most like what they had with Tom Brady. And so Josh McDaniels is going to be able to take that playbook that they had with Brady and say, hey, Mac, memorize everything you got right here. And he's going to be able to do that quickly. and they're going to be able to adapt very quickly to what they want to run from a schematic standpoint and to be able to maximize the talent that they brought in during free agency. All right, Joe Thomas, all-time classy guy, does great job at the NFL network. Their coverage, by the way, rounds two and three starts at four Pacific, seven Eastern. Joe, we love you.

You taught us about football today. I got my notebook out here. I appreciate all the schematic lessons I got. Great seeing you. Thanks for having me on, Colin. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. By and large, I thought most teams, I'll give you a pick that I thought was interesting.

The Buccaneers drafted last, and a lot of people, myself included, thought they'd go get a quarterback. The fact that they got an edge rusher, Joe Tryon from Washington, that's a good player. And the fact that he'll be able to slowly work himself in behind his shack bear, a JPP. That's a really good pick. There's a reason Jason Lide of the Buccaneers has a stocked roster. That's a really good pick at number 32. There's about three edge rushers, three or four in this draft I liked,

and to get one at 32 is pretty good. But by and large, I liked almost what everybody did, and I liked to be optimistic because who knows if they get the right coaching? There was two draft picks I didn't love. Cadarius, Tony, the New York Giants went and got a receiver. He's small. A little bit of durability concerns. I don't think wide receiver.

Now they have Kenny Ghaladay. Sterling Shepard, I think, is a really solid two or three. Darius Slayton's a nice player. They got Evan Ingram, Kyle Rudolph. Sequin Barclay is a good pass catcher. I just didn't think wide receiver is what they need. There's a million in this draft. I just didn't.

That didn't work for me. But I think he can play. They just kind of, they call it reaching or overdrafting. I thought Quitty Pay was available. I think he's a better prospect. But the Raiders draft. Alex Leatherwood, what the hell are you doing? He's a second, third round player. Like, I've been doing this 30 years. I've got enough contacts. I've asked about Alex

Leatherwood. He's a guard. He's not going to play tackle in the NFL. He's a good guard prospect. Good guards. Not great guards. Quentin Nelson's great guard. Good guard. That's second round. Maybe top of the third. And everybody kept saying last, oh, it's a ceiling. Oh, it's a ceiling. Tell me the last Alabama player that came out. and hadn't realized, if not they're ceiling close to it. Nobody squeezes your talent out like Nick Saban in college. Now, there are coaches in college that can recruit and can't coach, and they win games. If you can just recruit, you can win a lot of games.

You're not beating Bama and you're not beating Dabo Sweeney. You're not beating Brian Kelly. You can win a lot of games. Alex Leatherwood peaked in the middle of last year. There's nothing wrong with him. He's going to start in the NFL. He's going to be a nice interior lineman. But this idea that he has some ceiling,

that's what they said about James Carpenter when the Seahawks took a Nick Saban offensive lineman. James Carpenter's fine. He's played in the league. But he was available next round. Nick Saban squeezes talent out of his players. What you see is what you are getting. This is not some guy from a small school Wyoming

that doesn't have NFL experience. So, I mean, listen, you're in a division with Patrick Mahomes So what do you need when you're a division with a Hall of Fame quarterback? You need a pass rush. That's why the Bears go out and get Khalil Mack because they face Aaron Rogers twice a year. It's why Buffalo years ago spent a lot of money on Mario Williams because you face Tom Brady twice a year. When you're in a division with Peyton Manning in his prime or Russell Wilson or Aaron Rogers or Patrick Mahomes and Justin Herbert, you go get pass rushers.

Make them uncomfortable. Quitty Pay was available. Better prospect than Alex Leatherwood. Jalen Phillips, by the way, not a shock. Quity Pay and Jalen Phillips. Two of my favorite GMs in the NFL are who? Chris Ballard of the Colts and Greer. He's the thing is Scott Greer, the Dolphins, real clever guy.

Chris Greer, excuse me, I apologize. These are really short guys. They really do nice work, very well respect. They went and got edge rushers. It's exactly what the Raiders need. If you're in a division with Mahomes twice a year and Justin Herbert twice a year, and hell, if you read stories this morning, Aaron Rogers, is going to be playing for Denver in 45 minutes.

You've got to get pass rushers, not guards. The Raiders' offensive line is okay. It's not terrible. It's kind of good, actually. It just didn't like this. And by the way, Gruden, you know what it is? The other thing that's funny about the Raiders,

I swear to God, they only draft Bama and Clemson, Ohio State players. I guess when you don't make the playoffs and you're sitting home watching the college football playoff, you know, save some time and money on travel. You can just draft whoever you watch in the playoff. But Cadarius, Tony, for the gym. Giants I didn't like. He missed six games in 2019. He's a small guy, plays really hard. Don't love that pick. Giants wide receiving tight-in running back core is excellent.

Giants have plenty of weapons. Giants, Daniel Jones needs to win games. This is a very good roster right now. O-line's not great, but I didn't love that, but that kid's a playmaker. Come on. And again, I hope Alex Letterwood makes it. I'm not rooting against him. If the Raiders would have taken him second round. I'd be like, okay, that's fine. All right, Thomas Dimitrov is a long time. First of all, he was director of scouting for the Patriots as they built that dynasty up. Then he went to the Falcons, never afraid to make a big, gutsy move to Julio Jones trade, which, by the way, Julio is one of the great draft picks, wide receiver picks in the last 10 years.

And Thomas is now joining us live. So it is, you know, Thomas, I'm going to throw a theory at one of my goofy theories. So here goes. So this will take me a minute. But Green Bay is different. They don't have an owner, and they have a very top five or six national brand. And I'm talking like Notre Dame football, Green Bay Packers, Lakers, Yankees. And I always feel like if you're a GM for the Packers,

once they paid Farr of an Aaron Rogers, after their Super Bowls, they had to pay them. And they did not mortgage the future for either. And I've always felt like the – and this is weird, but the GM of the Packers, Packers is different. You could have gone to Arthur Blanker Robert Kraft and say, I got a question. But I feel like when you're the general manager of the Packers, you're almost like an executor of a will of a family company that you're not going to mortgage the future. This is a proud brand. Well, Tampa, the glazers just want to win. They've been irrelevant. They've been lousy. And so we all bang on Green Bay, myself included, for not going for it with Aaron and pushing

money down the road and mortgaging the future. But is it possible to Packers simply, Thomas, have a different responsibility to that community? I don't think they have a different responsibility, Colin, to the community. They have the responsibility to win, and they have the responsibility and the reputation and the history of being so successful. This is a really important time for that organization, of course. And when you have people like Aaron Rogers, and I will bring it a little bit of closer to home and people like Julio Jones talking about trains.

As an organization, as a GM, that's complicated. You better make sure you have a way to figure that out because both organizations, and in this case, the Packers are riding on this quarterback. Aaron Rogers is one of the best ever to play in this game. And of course, they want and need to get this done. They have to be creative. They have to be in line with this. They have a head coach who was a good head coach, but he's that much better, of course,

with Aaron Rogers. Would you call Aaron today if you ran the Packers? Would you call? I mean, what would you do today? I would, I would call. I'm a communicative person, Colin, that's vital. I'm sure they've been talking. Brian Gutikens has been calling. I'm sure there have been discussions in the very end in today's world. I really feel like these marquee players, as much as they loved where they've been and they've done so well and made a lot of money, they don't like to be hamstrung in the very end. And again, I feel more and more of that with Julio and Aaron in this situation. These are two marquee players that are, you know,

the organizations build a lot around them, of course. Yeah. So I'm a Trey Lance fan, met the kid, just love him. I think he's thoughtful, eye contact, humble, smart. There's a lot to like on tape, film, obviously. I was a little worried that they'd given so much up to move to three. I just couldn't get past this. Mack Jones in a division, Russell Wilson twice a year,

Kyler Murray twice a year, Matt Stafford, and I got low-ceiling unathletic guy, and what optically is going to that look like six times a year to my fans, to my, it bothered me. I thought my divisions got world-class quarterback talent. Am I just talking, have you ever even considered something that? Is that ridiculous? No, like, that's vital. I mean, I looked at that situation there. I was a bit surprised.

I wasn't sure they were going to go in that direction. and everyone was talking about Mac Jones, of course. I mean, the idea of having an athlete like Trey, a guy they think he built with, I know they made a comment that Garapolo is the leader going into the season and such, help him grow and learn. You have to look at what's around you. That was a monumental move by an organization. John Lynch and obviously, you know, where Coach Shanahan is,

they know what they're doing, but they also know after bringing in Garoppolo how important it is to make sure that this quarterback decision works for them into the future. You know, I said this yesterday, Thomas Dimitrov joining us. I said, listen, you only gave up a second for Jimmy Garapolo. That's what the Dolphins gave up for Josh Rose and what the Patriots gave up for Muhammad Sunu and neither really clicked. And I said to myself, you don't need to win the trade twice. Like, why get rid of Garapolo?

Keep them around until Tray's ready to play? I mean, not that anybody has to win the trade, but I don't see the value of getting a five for Garapolo. I'd rather just keep them around until Tray can play. 100% agree. I think there were two organizations that were a really good fit for Tray Lance, and it happened to be at three and four. Honestly, looking at my old organization, I was on the edge of my seat wondering what they were going to do. And if Trey would have dropped, would he truly have been the guy there versus Kyle Pitts? It's something that I'm sure has talked about in Atlanta all day here.

He is fantastic as an athlete and an upside. He needs to be in an organization like you're saying with Garapolo to help him. There's not a massive amount of pressure off get-go to be the guy. And you're exactly right. Keep him there. Let him grow with Garoppolo in the house. Listen, I lobbied. My argument for Atlanta was, listen, there's two locks in this draft.

Trevor Lawrence and Kyle Pitts are not going to miss. Those guys don't even look like college players, right? And my takeaway was this. Arthur Smith is good with tight ends. Arthur Smith will elevate Matt Ryan to a pretty cool place this year. And you don't want to be the Packers where you draft Jordan Love. And then Aaron Rogers is the MVP. And you're sitting there going, we could really use a receiver,

is that I like the Kyle Pitts move because I do think the new coach, I think you guys actually did a really good job at receiver and offensive line. I think if Kyle pops with Arthur Smith, this is a big time offense. So if you were in that chair again, could you, I know Frank quarterbacks are everything, Thomas, but boy, Kyle Pitts is unique. Kyle Pitts is unique at so many levels. When you think about that offense with Julio Jones, Matt Ryan, who, by the way, I believe, even though it would have been a nice move to have someone in the wings, he can win a Super Bowl.

And I believe that, Colin. You bring in a guy like Kyle Pitts, pair him with the receiver group as well as Hayden Hurst, who I think is a hell of a football player and athlete. Those two athletes had tight end. Look, you look all the way back when Tony Gonzalez was here in those early years from Matt Ryan. There was not a better situation for Matt to be popping it around the field, high security throws. This could be a very special thing for an offense that I think can be prolific. So you made the playoffs six times three NFC South Division titles,

which is saying something against Drew Brees and Sean Payton. Obviously, I'm sitting there thinking, when I saw you were going to be on today, I'm like, listen, you're still younger in shape. You've got to miss the juice. Draft night's crazy fun, right? Crazy fun. First time in 30 years that I wasn't in a draft room last night. I wanted to text Arthur Blank and tell him, look, don't feel sorry for me. I'm doing okay, but obviously we didn't communicate on that level.

But it's big. This was the first time Colin I was ever able to step back. and look at everything from a sort of a general GM view instead of from the Falcons perspective, and it was very enlightening. Now, you know Belichick pretty well. Do you think he was sitting there? Because I kept saying in my mock drafts, he's going to move up. He's got to move up.

You got Josh Allen in your division. You know, I mean, this is what you're going to have to get through. Do you think he was close to moving up or he was just going to let it all play out? I think they had like any time you're talking about Bill Belichick, as intelligent as he is, and thought out as that organization is. They looked at it. They dabbled. They saw.

I mean, what an amazing ending that they ended up getting a guy like Mac Jones at the 15th spot, not having to give away a whole bunch of compensation, still doing what they did in free agency. I think they were another group. They were another team that were winners in that round. Ryan Pace, I've been critical of him. It took guts. Did you like the move to move up and get Justin Fields? Love the move.

Love the move for both him and Matt Nagy, knowing that, you know, look, I've been on the hot seat many, many more times in one year, believe me. We all are when you don't win Super Bowls and things don't work out. You're drafting off the hot seat often. That was a big time move going for a player that I think could be special for them, get them up there in that neck of the woods. I think it's great Matt and Aggie told me yesterday. He said, look, I had similarities when I was in Kansas City with letting a quarterback continue to grow, another situation. like that with what they're doing with their quarterback in Chicago right now. Give him a little bit of time. I think it took Patrick Mahomes, what, 17 games or 16 games in 17? I think they're hoping that

they can do that in Chicago. Good, good move on their part. All right. By the way, I was talking to Chris Ballard last year and he says, you know, you draft guys, all you do is pay attention to the first round. He said the first 15 picks of that second round, there are pro bowlers all over that place. Urban Myers got the first pick. Urban and his guy. Now, I like Liam Eichenberg, the Notre Dame tackle, but everybody's rolling their eyes at me this morning because they got, now they got Trevor. They're not very good at tackle. They've got two, they don't have a bell cow back. They got two backs. They need a lot of help everywhere. What would you do? I mean, I just can't get, they have two picks early second round. Your gut feeling on where Urban goes.

Look, I mean, there's some good football players there. And by the way, for Fundy, you know, you know our guy Chris Ballard, great guy, and I have a great deal of respect, and he was exactly right. So many good players there. I mean, Irvin right now, to do what he did in the first, you know, the first round, he and Trent Balke, man, I just think there are some really good players like Asante Samuel Jr. out there that I think they can continue to add to that defense, and that's a good football player to look at. Thomas, it's great seeing you. If you're in L.A., call us. I'd love to pick your brain. You're a smart dude. You'll get back at this stuff. Next year, you'll be in a war room. That I know, and I appreciate you stopping by. Thanks, my friend. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy,

not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes.

Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On The Look Back at it podcast. For 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 was big to me. I'm Sam Jay. And I'm Alex English.

Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild year. It was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

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