The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 04/30/2021 - HOUR 1 - 49ers, Bears, Rodgers, NFL Draft

Episode Date: April 30, 2021

The 49ers did the right thing drafting Trey Lance and keeping Jimmy GaroppoloThe Bears finally have a QB and hopeAaron Rodgers showed how petty he really isColin discusses which draft picks he didn't likeGuest: Joe Thomas Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild. I mean, it was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people.

Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days I'd put on 10 pounds, I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Thanks for listening to The Heard Podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1. Find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Herd. You're listening to Fox SportsFord. Sports Radio. Ah, it is a Friday post-round-1 NFL draft, one of my favorite shows of the year, live in Los Angeles. This is The Herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening, Fox Sports Radio, IHeart Radio, and FS1, it was everything.

It was billed to be one of the great first round. first two and a half hours of the NFL draft ever. Aggressive teams, patient teams. I thought outside of one or two picks, I thought most teams got what they wanted. Joy Taylor is joining me. That was fun. It was a great night. And it just felt good.

It was so nice to see the fans back at the draft. I forgot in a little bit how cool the draft is. I love it, though. I love seeing the guys go out and hug the commissioner and, you know, they're crying with their families in the back and seeing the guys at home. It was, I think it was a great night for the NFL and great night for fans. Yeah, it's very relatable. The commissioner makes it relatable.

You walk up to fans, you show a fan. I like that they had his chair there. I loved it. I thought it was great. So I'm very happy this morning. I'm very happy because I don't really root for teams. I've told you this. I root for people.

I root for people especially. I know. And San Francisco got, Tray Lance, and I thought it was the right move. I just felt, honestly, it made me really happy. I felt sick yesterday going into the draft. I loved John Lynch. I covered John Lynch. He used to be a co-worker at Fox, and I love the Shanahan's.

Don't know him well, but love him. And I was just sick to my stomach. That Kyle Shanahan, super smart. He's the star of the franchise right now. He'd fallen in love with Mack Jones. and it just got horrible press when that story leaked. I mean, awful. Nobody liked it.

And even if Mack Jones would have had some success, and I think he would have had some success, nobody was going to ever buy into it. And then they were going to trade Jimmy Garoppolo because that would at least validate playing Mac Jones. And instead they didn't. And they'd have low-ceiling Mac Jones, who I think is a nice fit in New England,

but against Russell Wilson twice a year, And Kyler Murray twice a year and Matt Stafford twice a year. He would be the least athletic, smallest in terms of arm, dynamic playmaking ability. I just felt sick to my stomach. And instead, they did the right thing. They drafted the bigger, stronger, more athletic, significantly higher upside. And Trey Lance, they're going to keep Garoppolo, according to stories this morning, until the wheels fall off.

They should. There's no reason to trade Jimmy. until trade's ready to go. You gave up a second round pick for him. That's nothing. You already won that trade. You don't need to win that trade twice. All the rumors, all the conjecture, and two smart people,

John Lynch and Kyle Shanahan did it right. Look around the NFL, folks. I mean, it's nice that Philip Rivers got to the playoffs, but you've got to have a quarterback who can move a little. The rules are different now. Offensive lines generally aren't as good. You need some athletic ability. And Mack Jones will be nice.

in New England. But as we all slobbered over Mack Jones and how great and how brilliant and how smart he was, I got to give the SBN credit. Booker McFarland came out yesterday during the draft and he did something that I really liked. He went and showed the five times last year that Mac Jones

didn't have perfect protection. He couldn't outrun defensive tackles. Booker did a good job. He's like, yeah, this is what happens when the Alabama pass protection breaks down, you know, four times a year. and he couldn't move. And oh, by the way, do you understand that the Rams, the Seahawks in Arizona

have three of the top five pass rushes in the NFL, and they got better because now J.J. Watts in town. Like whoever took, whoever the Niners took was going to succeed. That's not really the question. But the pressure on Mack Jones in San Francisco would have been relentless because you gave up so much for him and because this is a Super Bowl roster. Okay, and I kept hearing this. Well, he's a good fit for Kyle's system.

Okay, I get that. I do get that, and I can defend that. But Kyle Shanahan's 2-0-2 in Super Bowls, and he hired guys that were perfect fits, pocket guys. Maybe if he had a quarterback that was a little more dynamic, he'd be 2-0 in Super Bowls and not 0-1-2. To move up to number three and give up all those picks is not just about getting a guy who fits.

It's about elevating the position. It's not about safe. He fits. He's safe. Well, then go to the third round, fourth round, and get a Kirk Cousins. When you give up that many picks and you go to three, brother, you got to swing. You got to take a big swing on a quarterback talent, not play it safe. And again, Mackle work in New England to the level he can work.

The ceiling's low. but I entered yesterday thinking, oh, it's going to be awful. Because say what you want. The fans matter and the media matters. And when they're all against you on a pick, I've been watching the media. I've been in it for 30 years. There's two ways to write the same story. If they hate your pick, not only you can win and they won't give you credit.

You have to win big for years until the media acknowledges, all right, maybe you were right. It was just going to be an avalanche of ugly. And every time Mac played against Russell Wilson, you're going to be like, Russell's running around making plays. And then Kyler Murray's running around making plays. And Matt Stafford's got the golden arm from above. And you got Mac Jones.

Now you took a big swing. Now you validate moving up. It made me very, very happy. All right. Now a general manager, Ryan Pace in Chicago, I usually clobber. I've got to be honest. There's more than one way to get what you want in the draft. The Chargers got what they wanted, and they were patient.

I think New England got what they wanted a quarterback, and they were patient. The Jets were aggressive. The Bears were aggressive. So was Philadelphia, and they got what they wanted. First of all, to the media, stop creating drama before we have it. Justin Fields, this is outrageous. is how can let's just let the draft develop. He's just too talented to drop too far.

And Chicago said, we got Andy Dalton, running a division with Aaron Rogers, at least for the time being. We got to get dynamic. And they did. This is a great spot for Justin Fields. Super clever head coach, made the playoffs two of the last three years, way above average defense, Alan Robinson star receiver, and Tariq Cohen comes back. By the way, for the first time in the history of the NFL, the Chicago Bears feel better about their quarterback than the Packers do.

Because nobody knows how Aaron and Green Bay is going to end. In Chicago today, hope, optimism, we did it. And I have banged on Ryan Pace for a couple of years. This took guts. It took some luck. But Matt Nagy went 25 and 13, Trubisky. Andy Dalton, for the record, very much like Alex Smith, a great mentor for a year, Andy watches the draft, he knows his role. Play until the kid is ready. But I'll say this

morning for all those who feared Justin Fields would drop, if I'm Justin Fields, I would not trade places with Zach Wilson of the Jets. I don't feel this is a fingers crossing situation. Clever head coach, star receiver, Tariq Cohen comes back, good enough defense. And by the way, Zach Wilson's in the division with Belichick twice a year and Brian Flores twice a year and Sean McDermott twice a year. And Justin Fields is like, I get the Lions twice a year? Green Bay may not have Aaron Rogers in three hours. Minnesota's got Kirk Cousins, so what? Took courage, took guts.

it was a step-up move by the Chicago Bears. But can I fire a shot at the media? Let's all take a deep breath. The quarterbacks kind of went where they were supposed to go. The prodigy went number one. And then Trey Lance, Zach Wilson and Justin Fields, they're dynamic. They went next. The order's not that relevant.

Those were the three guys who are like, whoa, whoa. And then Mac Jones went fifth. And that's where Mac Jones should go. It doesn't mean he can't succeed more than Zach because he gets Belichick and Zach gets Robert Salah. But it's a good move by Chicago. It's a really good move and it's a great, great place. And there is no guarantee in this NFL. You get the wrong coach.

Ask Jared Goff's first year and then his following years. The coach matters. Matt Nagy's good. And if you question it, he got Mitch Trubesky to the playoffs twice in a division. with Aaron Rogers and the Packers. Speaking of Aaron Rogers and the Packers, oh my Lord. A few years ago, in fact, it was a lot of years ago,

baseball was in the playoffs, and a story leaked about Alex Rodriguez being traded or moving in Major League Baseball did not like it at all. A-Rod was taking away from October baseball. I don't think the NFL loved Aaron Rogers planting a story on the night of the draft and stealing thunder from other young players. But with Aaron, a lot of the times you sort of tolerate it because of his talent. We're going to address that coming up next.

Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year.

Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep.

That's me, Clifford Taylor the fourth. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs?

Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jek. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it.

Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because, of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now.

Thank you finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your Podcasts.

Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade

of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit

of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough.

Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth, or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust.

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black rifle coffee.com slash herd. Code Hurd H-E-R-D at checkout for 20% off your first coffee club order. So Aaron Rogers is petty. Aaron Rogers is passive aggressive. Aaron Rogers is a grudge holder. Yesterday he was vindictive. Yesterday, Aaron Rogers was calculated. not a coincidence on the one-year anniversary.

He was humiliated by the Jordan Love Pick. He comes back and humiliates the Green Bay Packers. But I get it. He's frustrated. So give me a minute to tell a story here. I have a friend. He grew up with my only friend that grew up with money. His dad died.

He has an estate. He doesn't take big swings financially. He hits doubles because he feels he owes the family and the grandkids. what the father built. I didn't grow up with that. I didn't grow up with money. I take major risks, leave jobs all the time. We're good friends, but we see the world differently, and we should.

Green Bay is unique. They don't have an owner. It's a top three to five sports brand in the country. Brian Kudakins, the GM, feels like more of an executor of a will than he does GM for a football team. both Aaron Rogers and Brett Farrv won Super Bowls early when they were cheap. And in neither instance, with this GM or that GM, did they mortgage the future, push money down the road, go big in free agency, and try to win four and five by mortgaging the future.

It's not who they are. This is a massive legendary sports brand in America. Yankees, Lakers, Cowboys, Packers. It is in that class. Notre Dame football, Duke basketball. And with no owner, the general manager and the presidents that run it have a sense of history and responsibility to not forego the future for today. Did it with Favre who didn't ever play with that many great players. Look at what Brady's playing with now.

Look at what Mahomes is playing with now. So it's frustrating to Aaron. In fact, I don't think it's a coincidence that Tom Brady wins a Super Bowl. Russell Wilson and Aaron both freak out. They're contemporaries. But the difference is Seattle rolls the dice. Seattle goes for it. Seattle's aggressive, even if they're salary cap situations, not ideal.

Green Bay doesn't. They don't have an owner. This has never been a great fit. The nature of the Packers is frugal, based on tradition and history. A little conservative. They're protecting the brand. The nature of Aaron is California cool, progressive, aggressive, and go for it. It's not a good fit.

Listen, I'm watching all the draft rooms last night. And I mean, the jets are high-fiving and coming out of their chairs and the lions are going crazy in their draft room. And look at the lions guys are high-fiving and hugging and Chargers, Dean Spanos, I'm fiving. The jets and there's the bears. They're like, yeah, everybody's walking into the room and out of the room and the jets are like, woo, awesome. And the Packers, kind of bleak, a little bit like a morgue.

Aaron is sucking the life out of this franchise. And I get it. There was a study done years ago at the University of Washington. They took 100 couples and tried to decipher, distill down to the very instance why couples got divorced. It wasn't money and it wasn't kids. It wasn't family issues. 99% of the time people got divorced when they had lost respect for each other, when they would roll their eyes in public at a party at their wife's comment, or poke their friends in the ribs.

point to their husband. Green Bay humiliated Aaron in public. Yesterday, Aaron humiliated Green Bay in public. It's over. It's over. It may not be over now. It may not be over this year. But when you lose respect and start humiliating the other, hire a lawyer.

For the record, Aaron's agent is David Dunn. he was Carson Palmer's agent. He got Carson Palmer out of Cincinnati. Stay tuned. Joy with the news. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Well, that Tray Lance move sure threw me off.

I was very convinced that Mack Jones was going to the 49ers. Yes. Well, he is not going to the 49ers. He's going to the New England Patriots. He fell. in the first round after the 49ers went with Trey Lance, but it's a great situation for him. New England was patient throughout the first rounds and was able to get Jones with their original pick at 15. And Jones admitted afterwards at the Patriots where the team he secretly

wanted to go to, so he is very happy with the result. I don't think he's being dishonest there. It's a pretty good space to go. I don't know. I don't, I mean, I would assume that every quarterback would want to go to the Patriots. Yes. Well, I mean, why not? I'm not sure Tom Brady, obviously, but I think Tom Brady squeezed all the juice out of that fruit, if you will. And, you know, they started to get very comfortable to your point about relationships. The respect

was gone and they no longer felt the need to try and make the team better around Tom Brady, at least on the offensive side, and that's why you went to Tampa. But I think this is a good situation for Mack Jones. Who wouldn't want to go and learn from Belichick? The other thing is in San Francisco, they

gave away so much to move up for the pick. There was immense pressure that, boy, we have given up some of the future. New England just waited and got him. And if it doesn't work, you didn't give up anything for him. No, I think there's no, I don't think there's pressure on anyone in this situation. Either do I. No pressure on New England.

Belichick immediately said Cam Newton is still a starter. Mack Jones was going to have to beat Cam Newton out. I think Cam is going to be better than he was last year. He will. And before Cam got COVID, he was not playing bad. I think that the COVID situation really affected him and eventually got back on track by the end of the season. So I don't think that we're going to have to see Mac.

And I don't, I mean, I'm not going to speak for Patriots fans. I haven't talked to any to see what the pulse is on the fan base as far as wanting to see him. But I think most Patriots fans are probably comfortable with Cam Newton. Let Mac wait for a year, develop, learn that very complicated offense. And, you know, Cam was a temporary situation anyway. So I love this pick all around for everyone. I think it's a great situation for Mac. And I think it's actually a very feel-good story because it felt like the Niners pick with Mack Jones'

felt very forced. Exactly. It did not feel like the natural fit. It felt a lot like this is Kyle Shanahan really pushing against the rest of the organization and the fan base. You know what else jumped out?

It kind of pops into my head. A lot of kids opted out. Good players opted out. They all got drafted. I mean, Trey Lance, basically, his season shortened to a game. It didn't affect him at all. Roshan Slater, the offensive lineman

for Northwestern, didn't affect him at all. He now, by the way, the Chargers. God, have they upgraded their offensive line? Holy moly. Well, I think that it's a really good job by the scouts and the organizations to do in-depth interviews and, you know, pay attention to what those guys, their tape before they opted out. I mean, look, we're all dealing with unprecedented circumstances. So, and the draft is, as we know, none of us really know how any of this is going to play out

or how these guys careers are going to go. So you might as well draft talent. And congrats to Nick Sabin. What a recruiting night for him, huh? six Alabama players selected in the first round. SEC had a pretty good night. Yeah, it tied a record set by Miami in 2004 for the most from a single school. So congrats to Alabama.

So the Cowboys traded down after the top two corners that they were said to be targeting, were off the board before the 10th pick. They moved from 10 to 12 and selected linebacker Micah Parsons from Penn State. I love this pick for Dallas. Parsons was very happy to head to Dallas. saying after the pick that he would put out in the world that he wanted to be a cowboy. His dream came true. Yes, this is a great pick for Dallas. Baseball and Adam Silver, just give your players a big hug.

Literally, Micah Parsons' entire life changed. I love when the commissioner is given a bear hug to a flat. Those moments to me are so raw. I mean, look at that. That kid's life just changed. No, Micah is a great player. That's the average person winning the lottery. Yes. That's the average person winning the lottery.

Yes, but so much more than that. Because yes, obviously their life has changed financially, but this is the culmination of a lot of hard work, not just by Micah, his family, his friends, his coaches, mentors. You know, this is a moment. This is why the draft is so special. And he was a really great player and a great fit for Dallas and what they needed. You know what he is?

It's a little like Isaiah Simmons last year for Arizona. him. He's just really gifted. Figure out where to put him. Dan Quinn, figure it out. A lot of people said, well, Dallas didn't need a linebacker. Well, they didn't need a receiver last year. But the Cowboys' feeling was C.D. Lamb was the best athlete available. So they took him.

And by the way, he's really good. Micah Parsons was the best athlete available. The coaches get paid a lot of money. Figure out what to do with that. Also, I would not say that Dallas did not eat a linebacker. They've had injuries at that position a lot. And their defense was what they needed to draft. Like their defense is what was struggling last year.

They have plenty of skill position players. This is what, this was a great pick for Dallas. So Jamar Chase, kind of not surprising, but a lot of people still felt like Cincinnati was going to take Penae Soul. They did not. Jamar Chase is reuniting with his LSU teammate Joe Burrow as the newest member of the Bengals. He was the first wide receiver off the board, which we assumed that he was going to be at

the fifth overall pick. And he is confident that he is going to. going to rewrite the record book in Cincinnati? I'm going to break every record they got at the Bengals. That's my goal right there. I'm telling you right now, I'm going to break every record they have. I don't know how I'm going to do it, but it's going to be done. Well, Chad Ojasenko holds the team records in catches right now,

751, 10,783 receiving yards, and 66 touchdown catches. He also opted out of the 2020 season, but in 2019 with Joe Burrow, he had 84 receptions over 1,700 yards and 20 touchdowns, and the Bengals still have seven picks remaining. What I'm about to say could be totally wrong, and I have no data to back it up, but it just always feels like LSU guys work. I mean, seriously, like Alabama guys, they're good too.

I feel like we could do some research on that, but yeah, there's been a lot of great players in LSU. LSU is one of those places where you're just like, yeah, you went to LSU. Their receivers are just like bigger than everybody's. Well, yeah, I mean, especially receivers, for sure. I love this pick for Cincinnati. I still think that they need to invest in the offensive line.

I know they made some moves this off season, but Joe Burrow is coming off of a pretty catastrophic injury. So you want to make sure that you're built in the trenches, especially in this division in the AFC North. You want to have a good offensive line. But this is a great pick. They're comfortable with each other. So the learning curve is not going to be there as far as the chemistry goes.

And we knew he was the best receiver. It was going to go first off the board. Good stuff. What a night. By the way, round two tonight. Can't wait. Joy Taylor with the news. Well, that's the news.

And thanks for stopping by. The Heard Lye News. So much. I, you know, it is, Joe Thomas is around the corner. I'm trying to be, I mean, I really did like almost all the draft. There were two picks I

did not like. I'll get to those in a second. I'll get to those after Joe Thomas. but only two picks I was like, one of them you can guess. The other one, I'll let you guess. Joe Thomas was the third overall pick out of Wisconsin, went on to play for years, never missed a snap, never missed a game, 11 NFL seasons and 10 Pro Bowls in the argument for a top three or four left tackle

in the history of the game. NFL network analyst Joe Thomas now joining us live as they proudly brought to you by Mercedes Ben's the best or nothing. They proudly held that last night in Cleveland. First of all, it was a good night for the city. I thought the Browns did a great job in their draft pick. You know, Joe, you were a very high draft pick, and you went to a team that didn't have a lot of winning in recent years.

And so Zach Wilson, similarly, some of these kids go to organizations. So you went from winning Wisconsin to the Browns who were struggling. And I want you to tell my audience, take me there psychologically, not just adapting to the NFL, but going from winning to losing, was it a struggle for you? Well, I think that's one of the big struggles that any player that goes to the NFL has to face. It's dealing with the losing. How are you going to handle it? Are you going to be a guy that curls up into a ball and starts feeling sorry for yourself? Or is it going to motivate you to bring out the best in yourself, to put in the extra hours in the film room, to do what it takes on the football

field to get better. And I think that's something that's difficult because a lot of guys that come from these college programs like Alabama and when I came out of Wisconsin, we had not lost very much, you're not used to losing much at all. And so you don't know how to handle that. And guys can just as easily go both ways where they start feeling sorry for themselves or it can motivate them and you can all of a sudden see them elevate to another level. You know, one of the moves I liked, Joe is Joe Douglas is the new GM of the Jets. I know him a little bit. I think he's really, smart. And so Sam Donald never had a chance in New York.

Forget everything else. He was under duress. They never got the O line right. So last year, Joe Douglas goes and gets Becked in the left tackle. And then he gets his quarterback. And I love what they did last night. Zach Wilson may fail in New York, but he's not going to fail because he's running for his life. They moved up to get Elijah Vera Tucker, a terrific clean player out of USC. He'll play on the interior. Now, some people think, you don't move. up for a guard. But take my audience into the chemistry of an offensive line. In all your years in Cleveland, you played with a lot of different guards, Joe. When teams move up for guards, left

tackle we've always understood. You get a left tackle. That's the guy you pay. He's the great one. But the value of the guard to a lot of people is completely overrated. Your thought on what it means. Well, I love what the Jets are doing. They're not making the mistake of putting the rookie quarterback out there when he doesn't have a supporting cast because rookie quarterbacks need development. They need protection. So you can either protect him with a great pass blocking offensive line or you can put him out front with an offensive line that does a great job with a great running game. So you don't have to put too much pressure on that rookie quarterback to win before he's ready with his arm. And the new offense that they have there,

Mike LaFleur, he's actually a coach that worked with me when I was in Cleveland. He's bringing the Kyle Shanahan wide offensive running zone scheme. And the guard, because really important when you're running that offensive run scheme because what you have to do to be able to get that run play started is you've got to keep the guard and the defensive tackle on the line of scrimmage, get him running down the line of scrimmage so that the running back can get three to five steps in the ground before he has to deviate from the angle that he's running at so that he can start creating those running lanes with that stretch zone concept that they have. And so when I was in Cleveland, we had Joel Betonio and we had John Greco as our guards. You need big strings. You need big

strong guards that can keep those defensive tackles on the line of scrimmage. They don't allow penetration. It allows the play to get started, get that running back's shoulders facing down the field so that they can fall forward for a minimum of four yards so you can line up and run it again. And in this scheme, guard is an absolute premium when you're talking about being able to move defensive tackles like guys like Aaron Donald off the line of scrimmage and not allowing penetration because a lot of times in this scheme when you're a guard, you're going one-on-one, you don't have center help because if a guard has a three technique, which is an outside alignment by a defensive tackle, usually that nose guard is a backside alignment on the center. So the center is going to be double teaming with the backside guard,

and that front side guard is all by himself on an island. That's one of the toughest things in all pro football to do. And that's why you go get a guy like Elijah Verit Tucker from USC who is my second favorite offensive lineman in this draft. Wow. And everybody just got smarter, folks. You just got Concepts 101 from Joe Thomas. Now, it's interesting. I'm not going to ask you for a number, but you played with some rookie quarterbacks in Cleveland, I would imagine. I think most of these guys ended up in really nice spots. But I want you to go back to your career and the rookie quarterbacks you had. What advice would you give Mack Jones or Trey Lance or Zach Wilson?

I mean, we know Trevor Lawrence going to play really early. What advice would you give them in their first camp about integrating your personality with the team, gaining respect because you're a kid. Nobody knows if you're any good. And by the way, here's your franchise, run the offense. What would the advice be? I would say, listen first, talk second. You've got so much to learn.

And I know you're coming from a great program. Like if you're Mack Jones, you're coming from Alabama. You've won national championships. You've been at the top of the game in the college world. But in the NFL, it's a different world. And so the best thing you can do as a rookie is gain the respect of the guys around you by putting in the effort, spending those extra hours after everybody goes home, because those are the things that your teammates, your veteran teammates notice,

and that gets you the respect. The thing that doesn't get you the respect is when you show up and you start acting like you've been there and you know what it takes to win at the NFL level. So putting in your work, keeping your mouth shut, opening those eyes, asking a million questions, working harder than everybody around you, that's how you gain the respect. That's how you move up the ladder and become a great NFL professional. By the way, the Browns drafted Greg Newsom, a corner from Northwestern. I actually had him going to Arizona in my mock draft.

A lot of people didn't have him first round. I liked him a lot. Your thoughts on the Browns, what they got. I mean, listen, they've upgraded their secondary. It was a clear problem last year. They're in a division with Joe Burrell can throw it, and the Steelers have great receivers. And I kind of thought it was a good pick. Your thoughts?

Yeah, I thought it was a great pick. Especially with Joe Woods, the defensive coordinator for the Browns. he likes playing a lot of dime, a lot of nickel, where he's going to put a lot of defensive backs on the field. It gives him a lot of flexibility. And when you add a guy like Greg Newsom, who's very fundamentally stown, he's very smart, he's very savvy, he's long, he's athletic,

he can make a lot of those plays. He is exactly the type of player that the Browns want to add to that secondary to allow them to lock down some of the passing game to give a guy like Miles Garrett, who's one of the best pass rushers in the NFL, the time he needs to get to that quarterback. So for the Browns, they were in an excellent position, They didn't have to reach to take anybody.

They were allowed to be able to just take the highest rated defensive player on their board. And it just so happened that they got one guy that they really didn't expect. And it was at a cornerback position that they really coveted. Yeah, boy, if you asked me what units in the NFL improved the most this offseason? The Chargers offensive line and the Brown secondary have made massive improvements. By the way, your thoughts? We were very skeptical of Mack Jones three. Trey Lance instead goes three.

your general thoughts on that. Well, I like Trey Lance to the Niners a lot better. Playing for Kyle Shannon, understand how much he likes a big quarterback that can get outside the pocket and that can throw accurately down the field on the move. And that's exactly who Trey Lance is. I don't think you move up to the number three spot to get something like a Mack Jones,

who is basically a guy like Kyle has had a number of times in his career that have kept him from winning Super Bowls. Let's be honest, Jimmy G. Matt Ryan, Matt Schaub, Kurt Cousins, those guys are all kind of in the same mold as a Mac Jones. He wanted to be able to maximize what this offense can do and to have a guy like Trey Lance with that skill set, gives him an ability to finally see what is the ceiling that I have for this offense. And so that made perfect sense for me.

And I actually like Mack Jones a lot better to the Patriots than just about anybody else because he's the most like what they had with Tom Brady. And so Josh McDaniels is going to be able to take that playbook that they had with Brady and say, hey, Mac, memorize everything. everything you got right here. And he's going to be able to do that quickly. And they're going to be able to adapt very quickly to what they want to run from a schematic standpoint and to be able to maximize the talent that they brought in during free agency. All right, Joe Thomas, all-time classy guy.

Does great job at the NFL Network. Their coverage, by the way, rounds two and three starts at four Pacific, seven Eastern. Joe, we love you. You taught us about football today. I got my notebook out here. I appreciate all the schematic lessons I got. Great seeing you. Thanks for having me on, Colin.

I honestly think literally the Cleveland Brown secondary was a weakness. Outside of their offensive line, it may be the team's strength by Thanksgiving. The Chargers' offensive line was worst or second worst in the league. It may be their strength by Thanksgiving. I mean, no teams have literally between the draft and acquisitions gotten better. I mean, Cleveland had a huge issue. They were atrocious on the back end. They got the Rams safety, John Johnson, Troy Hill.

Now they get Greg Newsom, Denzel Ward still there. They get Grant, I think a Dilpit from LSU. They drafted last year, got her. This is a big-time secondary in Cleveland, big time. And you got Miles Garrett. So you got a pass rush. Clowny now, not much of a pass-rusher, but Cleveland's back end is like, that's really good.

Like, you've got a lot of first-round picks back there. Watch out. By the way, I've already bet Browns over nine and a half. Hell, that's stealing money. I'm in 11 win category this morning with Cleveland. I really like what they did. Okay, I know. I'm Mr. Positive.

When you think of me, you think of optimism. I got to be negative. I hated two picks in the first round. I know. I just didn't like them. You can guess one. We'll talk about that coming up. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific.

Hey, I'm John Middlecough, and I host the three-and-out podcast. Do you like football? Do you like the NFL? Do you like the NFL draft? Quarterbacks, coaches. Well, I talk about it all on the show. I used to work for Andy Reid as a scout. Now I give you my unfiltered and raw opinions on everything that goes on the NFL.

And you know we're talking college football because of how important the draft is year-round. Listen at the three-and-out podcast with me, John Middlecock, on the I-Heart radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all,

embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying.

Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show.

This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Cliverts Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream,

this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clivert Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross

double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out

on the Look Back at a podcast. I'm Sam Jett. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill

waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so you all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack, so I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS

on the table right now, so... Then you're finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Keer Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark.

Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch life becomes about wins and losses Steve Burns Dustin Ross because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth or are you a good person because you're afraid because that's two different intentions bro absolutely and that that's two different levels of trust I want you to just really be a good person

Join me, Keir Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app, search Learn the Hardway, and listen now. Mom said always have fresh undies. Mom's right. Get new fresh underwear from Tommy John, a Mother's Day gift, too. Women love the dreamily soft loungeware, 20% off your first order, Tommyjohn.com slash heard, H-E-R-D. By and large, I thought most teams, I'll give you a pick that I thought was interesting. The Buccaneers drafted last, and a lot of people, myself included, thought they'd go get a quarterback. The fact that they got an edge rusher, Joe Tryon from Washington, that's a good player.

And the fact that he'll be able to slowly work himself in behind a Shack Barrett, a JPP. That's a really good pick. There's a reason Jason Lied of the Buccaneers has a stocked roster, that's a really good pick at number 32. There were about three edge rushers, three or four in this draft I liked, and to get one at 32 is pretty good. But by and large, I liked almost what everybody did, and I like to be optimistic because who knows, if they get the right coaching. There was two draft picks I didn't love. Cadarius, Tony, the New York Giants went and got a receiver. He's small.

A little bit of durability concerns. I don't think wide receiver. Now they have Kenny Ghaladay. Sterling Shepard, I think, is a really solid two or three. Darius Slaten's a nice player. They got Evan Ingram, Kyle Rudolph. Sequin Barclay is a good pass catcher. I just didn't think wide receivers is what they need.

There's a million in this draft. I just didn't. That didn't work for me. But I think he can play. They call it reaching or over-drafting. I thought Quitty Pay was available. I think he's a better prospect. But the Raiders drafting Alex Leatherwood,

what the hell are you doing? He's a second, third-round player. Like, I've been doing this 30 years. I've got enough contacts. I've asked about Alex. Leatherwood. He's a guard. He's not going to play tackle in the NFL. He's a good guard prospect. Good guards. Not great guards. Quentin Nelson's great guard. Good guard. That's second round. Maybe top of the third. And everybody kept saying last, oh, it's a ceiling.

Oh, tell me the last Alabama player that came out and hadn't realized, if not their ceiling close to it. nobody squeezes your talent out like Nick Sabin in college. Now, there are coaches in college that can recruit and can't coach. And they win games. If you can just recruit, you can win a lot of games. You're not beating Bama and you're not beating Dabo Sweeney. You're not beating Brian Kelly. You can win a lot of games.

Alex Leatherwood peaked in the middle of last year. There's nothing wrong with him. He's going to start in the NFL. He's going to be a nice interior lineman. But this idea that he has some seal. That's what they said about James Carpenter when the Seahawks took a Nick Saban offensive line. James Carpenter's fine. He's played in the league.

But he was available next round. Nick Saban squeezes talent out of his players. What you see is what you are getting. This is not some guy from a small school Wyoming that doesn't have NFL experience. So, I mean, listen, you're in a division with Patrick Mahomes. So what do you need when you're a division with a Hall of Fame quarterback? You need a pass rush. That's why the Bears go out and get Khalil Mack

because they face Aaron Rogers twice a year. It's why Buffalo years ago spent a lot of money on Mario Williams because you face Tom Brady twice a year when you're in a division with Peyton Manning in his prime or Russell Wilson or Aaron Rogers or Patrick Mahomes and Justin Herbert. You go get pass rushers. Make them uncomfortable.

Quitty pay was available. Better prospect than Alex Leatherwood. Jalen Phillips. By the way, not a shock. Quitty pay and Jalen Phillips. two of my favorite GMs in the NFL are who? Chris Ballard of the Colts and Greer, his thing is Scott Greer, the Dolphins,

real clever guy. They've had a Chris Greer, excuse me, I apologize. These are really short guys. They really do nice work, very well respect. They went and got edge rushers. It's exactly what the Raiders need. If you're in a division with Mahomes twice a year and Justin Herbert twice a year,

and hell, if you read stories this morning, Aaron Rogers is going to be playing for Denver in 45 minutes. You've got to get pass rushers, not guards. The Raiders offensive line is okay. It's not terrible. It's kind of good, actually. It just didn't like this. And by the way, Gruden, you know what it is?

The other thing that's funny about the Raiders, I swear to God, they only draft Bama and Clemson and Ohio State players. I guess when you don't make the playoffs and you're sitting home watching the college football playoff, you know, save some time and money on travel. You can just draft whoever you watch in the playoff. But Cadarius Tony for the Giants, I didn't like. He missed six games in 2019. He's a small guy, plays really hard.

Don't love that pick. Giants wide receiving tight-in running back core is excellent. Giants have plenty of weapons. Giants, Daniel Jones needs to win games. This is a very good roster right now. O-line's not great, but I didn't love that, but that kid's a playmaker. Come on. And again, I hope Alex Letterwood makes it.

I'm not rooting against him. If the Raiders would have taken him second round, I'd be like, okay, that's fine. That's fine. It felt like a huge reach. All right. the latest on Aaron Rogers, and believe me, the latest could be a trade. And also, you people banging on Urban Meyer for taking a running back. Have you watched Urban Myers history before?

You do get that's going to work. You do get he just drafted a rookie quarterback. Hour two, I'm feisty today. I don't need Red Bull. I am Red Bull. That's next. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends.

Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

On the Look Back at it podcast. From 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 was big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s.

84 was a wild year. It was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to Look Back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Cliford Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with

athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Cliford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble

stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.