The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 05/18/2021 - Best of The Herd

Episode Date: May 18, 2021

Colin reacts to legendary Packers general manager Ron Wolf criticizing today’s superstar quarterbacks in the NFL and why he’s completely wrong. He argues in favor of LeBron James’ greatness and why his latest accomplishment is further proof of that. He also shares his top 5 players under the most pressure entering the NBA playoffs. Plus, former Cowboys LB Sean Lee joins the show to tell Colin when he knew QB Dak Prescott was special.   Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque.

Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The story I've told myself can then shape my behavior, and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility of connection. This Mental Health Awareness Month, tune into the podcast Deeply Well with Debbie Brown.

If you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole, this podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to deeply well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. If you're watching the latest season of the Real Housewives of Atlanta, you already know there's a lot to break down. Gorsha accusing Kelly of sleeping with a merry man. They holding Kay Michelle back from fighting Drew. Pinky has financial issues. On the podcast, Reality with the King, I, Carlos King, recap the biggest moments. from your favorite reality shows, including the Real House Wise franchise, the drama,

the alliances, and the T, everybody's talking about. To hear this and more, listen to Reality with the King on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for listening to The Best of Heard Podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1. Find your local station for the herd at Fox SportsRadio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeart radio app by searching herd this is the

best of the herd with Colin Cowher on Fox Sports Radio NBA playoff start tonight live in Los Angeles it's the herd wherever you may be and however you may be listening i heart radio

Fox Sports Radio FS1 loaded today a lot of energy big night leap. Joy Taylor is joining me a lot of big energy today. There's a lot going on. There's a lot going on. The playoffs, the playing games. Those are playoffs. I'm excited for the playing games. Oh, I'm excited for all course. I'm in the, we're in the sports get interesting business. It gets interesting tonight.

Exactly. I mean, we've been very lucky. The draft, the schedule, the playoffs. I got to start with this, though. I'm sure Aaron Rogers love this. The most famous GM, the Packers have ever had, very, very good. Ron Wolfe was on a local radio show. And before I play the bite, there are some things in life I'm just not going to waste my time with. I'm not going to ever try to make a liberal, a conservative, or a conservative a liberal. They got their camps. I'm not going to be on Twitter all day trying to convince them to come over to my side. I just laugh at people doing that. Secondly, life was better in the good old days guy. I'm not one of those guys.

I'm not going to try to convince him that life is actually way better now. Like people have their camps. They get embedded. They're a mile deep in it. And I'm not going to try to argue out of it. I found life was better in the good old days. Ron Wolf, former Packer GM, talking about, let's see, maybe he's talking about Deshaun Watson and Russell Wilson and Aaron Rogers wanting an opinion.

Here's Ron Wolf on a local radio show in Milwaukee. I think we've got a lot of divas playing in the league right now. It's an interesting phenomenon as far as I'm concerned. All these guys that are doing this have long-term deals. I just can't believe that the game has changed that remark, but there's a huge change. Today's quarterbacks want to be more than quarterback. These guys, they want to pick the coach, pick the players.

It's an interesting dilemma. It's a dilemma? Aaron Rogers back-to-back NFC championships. Who's that a dilemma for? Seattle wins 10, 11 games a year. That's a dilemma? Yeah, Tom Brady, I know Bruce Ariens wakes up every morning. Whoa, I have got a dilemma on my hands here.

I'm going to have to build a Super Bowl trophy room, not a case. These are dilemmas. Divas. So let's address the life was better in the good old days. These guys are divas. So let's start with Russell Wilson. Seattle, Pete Carroll, who I like a lot, he's come on the show. He'd been fired twice in the NFL, first two years in Seattle losing seasons.

He had to win or he was going to get canned a third time, never get another NFL job. Drafts Russell Wilson third round. Within two years, he's the toast of the league. Commercial $7 million a year. Pete then makes several clunkers. hiring on his offensive line staff, like the offensive line coaches, a couple clunkers. Russell Wilson gets hit so many times. It sets an NFL record.

He runs an offense that is so outdated. Seattle has to change coordinators because people are mocking the Seahawks in the analytic world. Russell Wilson, the diva, voices some frustration. That's a diva? Let's go to Deshawn Watson. His head coach attempts to be a general manager in Houston. It's a disaster.

His owner lies to him. They trade a superstar wide receiver for a second round pick. That's it. For a brief time, the organization is run by a former team chaplain in New England. Deshawn Watson, the life preserver in a sinking ship. says, I'm out of here, man, I'm over this.

It happened for years and years and years. That's a diva. Aaron Rogers, his team doesn't even compete in the free agent market. They can his quarterback coach, don't tell him. They draft his replacement off an NFC championship year. And Green Bay over the years has let go of receivers he really likes and has been public about it, like Jared Cook, the tight ender, Jordy Nelson.

Aaron's like, I'm over this. I'm 37 now, and that's supposed to be a diva. Listen, Randy Moss, Antonio Brown, T.O. I've heard, you know, the line, they're divas. You can make an argument with those guys. I get it. A lot of

wide receivers in the NFL have had their moments. But a quarterback who's a superstar, Russell Wilson, Deshawn Watson, and Aaron Rogers, simply seeking competency from the person who runs their franchise. I don't

know. That doesn't feel like a diva to me. I mean, Aaron Rogers can be prickly. He won't appear on this show. I struggle with that. I'd love to have him on. Russell Wilson, sometimes he runs into his own sacks. And Deshawn Watson is not a great natural

thrower. He's not a perfect quarterback. But all three of these guys, they're just seeking competency. I mean, LeBron James, great example. How embarrassing is it that people in Cleveland once burned jerseys because he's left? Think about this. LeBron James three times before he got to Cleveland, they were the worst team in the league.

He left Cleveland to Miami. They became the worst team in the league. He left Cleveland for the Lakers. Once again, first or second worst team in the league. They are utterly incompetent ownership down. at least the second time Cleveland fans didn't burn jerseys. LeBron would have stayed in Cleveland if you could have gotten him a top GM, stayed with a GM, given him consistently good players.

Diva, and listen, I'm from Seattle. It was a losing franchise. We were known for the kingdom and really loud fans. We were a losing franchise. We had been fun. interesting. You know, our fans were crazy. We played in a weird kingdom. And then Russell Wilson showed up. And the Seahawks are a perennial Super Bowl contender. Last year, Seattle's disappointed the way the season went. They were 12 and 4. And Seattle is like, now, Russell Wilson's like, hey, we need to get better.

That's called standards. Russell Wilson has standards. Aaron Rogers has standards. The Ron Watson has standards. I mean, Ron Wolf, I know he's a legend, but he needs to join the Just Stop Talking Club. He left the NFL 20 years ago. It was different. 20 years ago, look it up. It's called Google.

You could literally have an average quarterback, your best player be a running back, have a good defense and make Super Bowls. 25 years ago, that happened a lot. Like you really didn't throw the ball much. and then everything changed. Safety rules changed. You couldn't hit the quarterback. You can't hit wide receivers.

You used to be able to grab a wide receiver when the ball was hiked. Shake him, throw him, toss him, right him down the field. And then if he caught it, go high, knock him out. You can't do any of it. You can't hit the quarterback. Good God, if you accidentally are pushed into a quarterback's knees as a defensive lineman, penalty. You can't hit anybody.

You can be thrown out of games. At college, you are. You can't grab wide receivers now. I mean, the league, all the rules are for offense. All of them. What's that mean? It means when the greatest coach in the history of the game Bill Belichick loses Brady, he can't even have a winning record in the AFC East.

Forget the AFC West, the NFC West. Patriots had a losing record in the AFC East. it means that Patrick Mahomes now is worth $45 million a season. And we're calling that a team friendly deal. The Mahomes deal is like, whew, the Chief's got off easy on that one. How much are they paying him more than LeBron? The world's changed. Because the NFL's never been safer.

Honest to God, it's amazing how often you get to a Super Bowl. In the last six or seven teams, only one will have like injuries. I mean, if you take out the Chiefs left tackle last year in the playoffs, I mean, Tampa Bay was completely healthy. That's why they're adding games. You don't hit practice anymore. You can't hit receivers. You can't go high on tight ends.

You can't hit quarterbacks. I mean, they're going to eliminate eventually either the punt return or the kick return. So the bottom line is the league is all offense. The quarterbacks are everything. I mean, last year I picked all seven AFC playoff teams. I went seven for seven. Why? Let's look at the quarterbacks. I mean, you start looking around, you're like, oh, okay.

I mean, don't have one. Totally limited. That's why teams now will draft a quarterback and the very next year will draft another. Josh Rosen, well, we gave you four starts. Boom, we're off. Trevisky. Third year, yeah, we're done with you. But I made the playoffs twice.

Boom, out. That's the league. So Russell Wilson, Aaron Rogers, and Deshaun Watson are not divas. they're all-time great talents who are simply seeking competency. This is the downside to being great. LeBron James has never asked other players to be as good as him. LeBron James left Miami when DeWade got old. They're still friends.

He left Cleveland because they were incompetent. He got rid of first year and second year players in Los Angeles because he wanted them to be good. I went to Laker games when they had Lanzo ball and all the, Brandon Ingram. And you'd go to a Laker game in the first quarter, LeBron James would ease himself into the games and he would pass, pass, pass, pass, passing his fingers that he didn't have to every night lead the team. But invariably, none of those guys were ready to play, couldn't hit shots, would miss dunks, would miss, and LeBron would have to take over and carry the team. He didn't want to get rid of those players. LeBron didn't want to get rid of Lonson ball.

He gave Lonzo Ball every opportunity. Kyle Kuzma. He was begging for them to be better than they were. Brandon Ingram. In the end, the downside of stardom, Aaron, Russell, Deshawn. These guys aren't demanding. Everybody be as good as them. I don't know.

Aaron's just asking, could you give me a heads up on my quarterback coach? Could you give me a heads up if you're going to draft my replacement? It's called respect, not diva. All right. By the way, there's one other line here by Ron Wolfe that made me laugh. He was on a local radio. And he was asked about the Packers on how split the fan base was when Brett Farrve left. His quote was, well, Lambeau Field was still full.

Okay, great. But you have to realize Seattle doesn't have a contingency plan. Houston doesn't have a contingency plan. And my leanings this morning is either does Green Bay, because Jordan Love ain't it. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the IHeart Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged.

It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's super. Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined.

And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space. For honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok.

Hey, I'm Jared Adano. You might know me as that loud guy who yells out, help on the internet. Help! Somebody! Please! But there's so much more to me than me. I'm an actor. I'm a comedian, and recently I've become quite the helper myself.

And on my new podcast, Hope I'm a Hippocrat, I'll be changing lives, helping people in need with my sage advice and thoughtful solutions. Sike, I'm a comedian. I'm not qualified to give good advice. Join me and my comedian friends as we riff rant and recommend some of the most legally dubious advice known to man. If I'm calling you, even if you're unqualified, On your phone, let it ring twice.

One ring is too scary. Oh, cream of chicken suit. Hey, cream. Cream a chicken suit. This is Help from a Hypocrat, the worst advice from the dumbest people you know. Listen to Help from Hypocrite as part of the Mike Cultura Podcast Network available on the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, it's Edwin Castro, also known as Castro 1021. And I'm Conkey, his best friend and business, manager. And we've got a new show called The 1021 podcast. I'm taking you behind the scenes on how I became one of Twitch's most popular streamers. We also love sports. And with the World Cup right around the corner, we'll be breaking down the biggest storylines ahead of the big tournament here in the USA. Listen to the 1021 podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So yesterday on social media, LeBron is sort of prone to

do this. But, you know, listen, generationally, I talk about this on the air once and not very often. But, you know, I mean, the phone and how much you use it in social media, anybody under, you know, like 35, 36, that's what you grew up with. I like to watch games and not be on my phone. I like to just watch games, open a cold beer, sit with my dog, have the channel flipper. I don't want my phone. But if you're young, you grow up and you're on your phone as you watch games. It's just I didn't grow up with phones. I get them. But I didn't grow up with them. And so outside of NFL Sunday, I mostly don't have my phone with me when I watch games. I just want to watch games.

So LeBron often goes to social media because that's the generation he grew up with. He's got his phone all the time. That's how people communicate. So yesterday a stat came out where LeBron has the most 25 point per game seasons in NBA history, you know, mostly by a long shot over everybody else. Jordan's got 12. LeBron's got 17. And then LeBron went to, you know, his Twitter account and said, yeah,

since I was 19 years old and I'm a past first guy, always been. That's why I'm never mentioned with the greats of scoring, huh? That's perfect because I'd rather keep it that way. You know, people are like, come on, LeBron's a little petty. That's just, you know, he's on the social media every day. That's how he communicates. But Lebron is right now, I think, what, third all-time leading score, and we don't mention him as a pastor.

In fact, I've said this before. My favorite LeBron James stat in the history of his game is not an NBA stat. And we know he didn't play in college. It's a high school stat. It's my favorite stat by far. LeBron averaged 28 points a game as a junior in high school. And just one bucket more as a senior 30. He could have scored 50 a game in high school.

He basically had the same average. Why? Because LeBron's always been about his teammates. LeBron's always made the right basketball decision. What is the team need now? And this is one of the things that's really unique about LeBron. I've always called him the greatest Swiss Army knife in basketball. basketball history. He does everything well. Even the other all-time great athletes, they knew what

they did well and they leaned into it. Michael Jordan and Kobe were aggressive scores. Neither was really an assist guy. Neither led the league in assists. Neither was a rebound guy. They scored. That's what they did. They leaned into it. Tom Brady, Peyton Manning. Pre-snap geniuses. Neither are great athletes, neither are running around, but both. Before the ball snapped, probably as good as we've ever seen. And they just leaned into it. More film. More, more, more, more. Tony Gwyn, best pure baseball hitter I've ever seen. I didn't grow up with Ted Williams. Tony Gwyn, I'm not a home run guy. I'm a base knock guy. So he hit for average. If LeBron was a baseball player, he would be what he is as a basketball player. He could lead baseball and batting

average. He could lead it in on-base percentage. He could lead it in home runs. But he'd do a little of everything. What do you need in the moment? That's LeBron. LeBron and Wilts Chamberlain are the only two basketball players in my life who could lead the NBA in any category, but they've had to make a choice. LeBron last year led the league and assists. LeBron now has the most 25-point average. seasons. For years, he was the best on-ball defender. He literally could guard any position. I still go back to the Chicago playoff series when he was a Caval where he said, I'm going to guard Derek Rose. Derek Rose was MVP. Totally shut him down. Little tiny Derek Rose. A little Vue, view, view, view, view, view. That's like asking an 18-wheeler to stop a Fiat.

He's like, yeah, take him out of the game. He's the best leader. But Will it was the same way. Wilts like, I'm going to lead the league in rebounding. Don't tell me about Bill Russell. I'm going to lead the league in assists. Wilk Chamberlain once led the NBA in minutes, and he averaged more minutes than there were per game. What? Because he played overtime.

Because he heard the, you know, you don't play that hard. Will it's like, I'm going to lead the league in minutes and assists and scoring and rebound. If you count playoffs, if you count playoffs, LeBron all time in basketball is second in points, fourth and assists, eight in steals, 31st in rebounds. And the only reason he's not 10 in rebounds, because he could be, is because you don't want LeBron rebounding because you want him on the fast break because he's a freight train.

So LeBron very early in his career figured out, I can score so quickly and beat all the guys guarding me down the floor. I don't want to be grabbing a rebound and have to weave my way through traffic. I'm just taking off, get me the ball and I'll score. So everybody else, even the stars, know what they're good at, they lean into it. LeBron doesn't. LeBron has to make a choice. What matters this year, this moment, this set, this series, this possession.

What is my team need now? Okay, I'll be the best in the world at that now. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd, weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, what's up, everybody? It's me, three-time Pro Bowl of LaVore Arrington, and I couldn't be more. excited to announce a new podcast called Up On Game. What is Up on Game, you ask? Along with my fellow Pro Bowler, T.J. Hushmanzada and Super Bowl champion.

Yep, that's right. Plexico Burris. You can only name a show with that type of talent on it. Up on Game. We're going to be sharing our real life experiences loaded with teachable moments. Listen to Up on Game with me, LaVar Arrington, T.J. Hushman Zada and Plexico Burris on the IHeart Radio. app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast from.

Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth.

Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show.

This is a place for raw, unfiltered. conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music.

The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Cliverts Show on the Eyeheart

radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, I'm Jared Adano. You might know me as that loud guy who yells out, help on the internet. Help! Somebody! Please! But there's so much more to me than that. I'm an actor. I'm a comedian.

And recently, I've become quite the helper myself. And on my new podcast, Hope from a Hypocrite, I'll be changing lives, helping people in need with my sage advice and thoughtful solutions. Sike, I'm a comedian. I'm not qualified to give good advice. Join me and my comedian friends as we riff, rant, recommend some of the most legally dubious advice known to man. If I'm calling you, even if you're on your phone,

let it ring twice. One ring is too scary. Oh, cream a chicken suit. A cream. Cream a chicken suit. This is help from a hypocrite, the worst advice from the dumbest people you know. Listen to Help from Hippocrat as part of the Mike Coultera podcast network available on the IHartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, it's Edwin Castro, also known as Castro 1021. And I'm Conky, his best friend and business manager. And we've got a new show called The 1021 Podcast. I'm taking you behind the scenes on how I became one of Twitch's most popular streamers. We also love sports. And with the World Cup right around the corner, we'll be breaking down the. biggest storylines ahead of the big tournament here in the USA. Listen to the 1021 podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your

podcasts. Playoff basketball is great. Playing games tonight. Now, I've said with no confidence whatsoever, I like the Lakers and Milwaukee to reach the finals. And one of the reasons I like Milwaukee is we've dismissed them. And there was this two or three year period where Janus is going to be the face of the league. he's on 60 minutes, and there was a lot of pressure, and I thought it affected him. And they didn't have really a complete roster.

But the league's done trying to make him the face of the league. Last year in the bubble, they put Milwaukee playoff games on at noon. You were not the face of the league if they're putting your playoff games on at noon. That's like the NFL playoff game on Saturday. They're not putting your dynasties on that. Also, he signed an extension, so he's not going anywhere. He had a great year, but wasn't even in the MVP conversation. Brooklyn should be favored because of their star power and stars matter in the playoffs.

So I think Milwaukee, the minute we dismiss NBA teams, you know, like we guarantee the two things about LeBron's teams, they're always better the second year. We think he's going to walk into a place and win titles. It never works that way. It's always the second year. And we also tend to think when you put a bunch of stars together like the Clippers, they'll win first year. Now, that's usually second year.

And I also think when a team gets dismissed is when they feel less pressure. And I think Milwaukee will play well. LeBron, Lakers, I think they're in the finals. Cross your fingers. LeBron gets hurt. I'm out of there. But I do think, I don't think there's a lot of pressure on Janus this year in the playoffs. I don't.

I think there's five players where there's a lot of pressure and I can feel it. I'll give you my top five. These are the five guys I think face real legacy pressure. Number five would be Chris Paul. You know I love Chris Paul. But we've got this thing about Chris Paul where he like has been around forever and everybody wants to say his top five point guard and he's not good in the postseason. Let's be honest, his career postseason winning percentage is 47%.

And yet he's won 65% of his games in the regular season. And now Phoenix has the second best record in the league. You can't do a one in Dunner. Like you've got to win some games here. You've got to win some series here. He's got some good young players. He's got to coach Monty Williams everybody likes. He's been to one conference finals in his career, despite the fact he's had a remarkable

career. It's a little pressure on Chris now. You've got to win a couple of playoffs series. When you've got to win a couple playoffs. series. Number four. James Harden. He forced his way out of Houston because he wanted to play for a winner.

Okay, it's step up time. Also, you know, we all have this feeling on James Hardin. Is his game like Carl Malone is kind of relies on the whistle. Carl Malone needed the whistle. James Hardin needs the whistle. There's no excuses now. You got Kevin Durant. You got Kyrie Irving.

The East has only one or two teams that can match up with you physically. James got to win a couple of playoffs. series or get to the finals here. Number three. Paul George, stinkeroo last year. Last year, first player since the 60s to shoot under 25% in three straight playoff games. He was awful. And I like Paul. He was awful. And it's time now. Like, like, and I will say this, what makes it more confusing is there was a point late in the regular season where Paul may have been the best player for about a month. He was unbelievable this year. And then all of a sudden, when you have that, that was the thing they always said about A-Rod. Jeter,

3.05 in the regular season, Jeter hit 305 in the playoffs. Arod was the best player in the world in the regular season and went down in the playoffs. That's why he got a reputation as he's not a very reliable player, even though Aeron had a lot of good postseason games. Paul George has to at least redeem himself a little because he was atrocious last year in the playoffs. Number two. Kyle Leonard. First of all, I missed 20 games again. So what are you? So I can't depend on you in the regular season to play, and now the data says the clippers are an atrocious late game team. Well, if you're a Magic or a Larry Bird or a Dr. J or a LeBron or the late Kobe, we expect you to be good late.

You can have a bad first quarter. I won't discuss it on my show. You've got to be good late. So now I'm not getting quite missing 20 games a year, and now he's not good at the end of the games. What is he? This is really important because last year, this team physically, physically, you know, physically, Fizzled a favorite and fizzled in the bubble.

Number one. Kevin Durant, 2019 finals missed it mostly hurt. Last year, hurt. This year hurt. The question for Kevin is, dude, you left an organization where you could have played about 50 games in Golden State with Clay and Steph and won a bunch of titles. I didn't like that judgment, but here's a time to redeem yourself. You win a championship. It's like, all right, my bad, I'm wrong.

But I also wonder, what's left in the tank physically? Like, we're not getting, I mean, LeBron's starting to add some injuries to it, but Kevin can't say healthy, period. Long stretches. So I think there is pressure on Kevin Durant. Otherwise, he's going to become known as like an injury guy, kind of flaky guy, not really a leader guy, can't depend on him guy. And although he'll say that doesn't matter. I think it matters to everybody. Everybody at some level wants to be like.

What's up? I'm John Middlethoff. I host the three and out podcast. I need you to subscribe right now. If you like football, you like the NFL, you like the draft, I have you covered. Three and Out Podcast. That's me. Used to scout in the league.

Now I talk about football. Urban Meyer, Travis E.T.N. What's he doing? Naji Harris says he has a lot more free time in the NFL. I dive deep into everything football. Three and out podcast. Go subscribe right now. He is now joining us.

We don't get many in studio guests these days. He's joining us in studio. Sean Lee, who just announced his retirement. So you were high school football. You were great. College football, NFL, and now no more football. When you wake up in the morning, do you just think, I'm a broadcaster? I'm a, is it hard?

I'm still struggling with it. And it depends on the day. You know, you wake up in the morning, and that competitive side of you is saying, what are you doing retiring? But then when I go and I work out and I hard and I try to wake up from that and I barely can walk, there's a reason why I'm retiring. You know, I said this before. You pour gasoline on the fire for 25 years.

It's hard to put it out. So, you know, I love playing for the Cowboys. I love it. But I think it's time to be done and have enjoyed it. When you were a thinking guys player. You were known for having very good instincts. When you were playing, did you think about, were you so all in, you never thought about secondary things? Or when the injury started piling up last three years, did you think as a player, you know, this is coming to an end now?

I've been doing this for 20 years. It's coming to an end. Did you think about that? You know, you never think of it in the moment because you're so locked in and winning, and it takes so much work to be great. But, you know, slowly and surely, you know, certain days the body doesn't feel right. You know, I had surgery last year. I had to have my eye reconnected to my pelvic bone.

I mean, right at the beginning of the season, having to deal with that in a season. And I think you start to think of your family. You think of the long-term aspect of what you've put your body through. And it's just time. I mean, it's so hard because I love. the sport and I put so much time and you know I grew up I started when I was nine and I loved every moment to be able to play in playing linebacker playing for the Cowboys putting all that time in the study you know where does that energy go and

that's something that I think a lot of us you know we worry about you know Dack Prescott's interesting because years ago I used this as an example and people just gave me so much crap there was a and I thought it just spoke volumes of him I don't think he's the most natural thrower Dan Mullen came on our show And it's like, we fell in love with him. And we didn't think he was very good at throwing the football, but we fell in love with him. But there was a moment on the cowboy sideline that he threw a paper cup. He was on the sideline, Gatorade Cup, took a step through it.

And it didn't go in the garbage. And he took a step and he stopped. And he walked by and he went back to the garbage and he got the cup and he put it in the garbage. And I came on the Monday and I said, okay, that's a, that's a conscientious guy. Like, that's what quarterbacks have to do. Everything matters. And I thought, and people just said, this is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. And I said, we know he's not the best thrower, but he's able to.

plus at the podium. And I want you to take me to rookie year, fourth round pick. He has a great game in Los Angeles in the preseason. Preseason, yep. And lit it up. And I mean the world changed. Cowboy fans would not hear it. When was the buy-in for you?

Was it practice where you were like, boy, this dude is a leader. This is our guy. You know, during that training camp, you know, Romo, he would take every couple days off. And Dack was the quarterback back. So normally with a rookie quarterback on defense, we're like, we're getting picks all day to day. We're about to beat the offense up. And so a two-minute drill late in practice,

I'm like, I know the play, I know what's coming. It's a slant to DES. I'm going to go get this. I break on it. I go to get it. He puts it on the back shoulder of DES perfectly thrown, no problem. And he had done that all practice. And it wasn't an issue.

It was his first time really with the ones against NFL defense. And he made it look easy. I mean, that's been him from the start, is how cool he is, how composed he is. And another thing is how he faces adversity. Anytime there's adversity, he says bring it on. And that's why I know with the injury he has, he's coming back better than he was. So last year was a trying year. Listen, Cowboys' offensive personnel is really good.

They have to address the O line next year. This year they address the defense. But there was a point last year, Sean, where, and I think it's pretty well documented. I mean, Mike McCarthy had to fire the D.C. that tells you, where there were times it looked like, I don't like to use the word quit, but there was just no juice defensively. It just wasn't there. Mike Nolan's scheme wasn't working with the players. As you well know, it's all about the buy-in.

If players don't buy in, we see it in the NBA. The Knicks have bought into Tom Fibodeau. They're limited, but they bought into him. Was there a point last year where you just knew this scheme, this team is just not working? Players aren't buying in. Well, I don't know if we didn't buy in, but we knew early that we weren't playing defensive right way. I mean, you look at some of the games and the rush yards we gave up. Some of the times our offense early was playing great.

DAC was playing unbelievable and we weren't able to support them. I'll say this, though, we did fight as a year went on. And defensively, we slowly got better and better. Now, I think with Dan Quinn, kind of going back to a defense we've played, I think he, Dan, the type of motivate area is, the type of defense he calls. He's won a Super Bowl as a coordinator. He's almost won as a head coach. Just from what I've heard over there, the guys love him.

So I think we'll get back to playing defense the right way. But there's no question. I think scheme-wise, we took a big jump in a different direction. I think we didn't have an offseason. And it showed earlier on. We struggled. But I know a lot of those guys are frustrated with what happened, especially some of our linebackers and they're ready to make plays.

Being a Dallas cowboy, now, again, that's your career, so you don't have a lot. I mean, Penn State was kind of not great when you got there, better when you left. But to be a cowboy, it's your only NFL. life, so there's nothing to compare it to. But you obviously played with guys who came from other organizations. I mean, just give me, could you go to a grocery store? What was it like? Oh, it's incredible. I mean, the tradition, walking in there and seeing the tradition that they have and the guys who've won Super Bowls, I mean, I used to get calls from Leveroy-Jordan when I was

injured trying to motivate me to come back. And so we saw it as an extreme responsibility to try to live up to what they did in the past. You know, I said, I wore that on my sleeve every day. When I came in this facility. I'm like, I get to be a cowboy. Are you kidding me? In this facility, in this state, with the support that we can get. And even through all my injuries, what I loved was I got support from so many fans, no matter what I came back from. And teammates and from Mr. Jones. So to me, I probably would have been on the league a long time ago if I wasn't a cowboy. Yeah. Well, what was your relationship? You probably had an agent. What was negotiating like with Jerry Jones? Oh, everybody at some point negotiates with Jerry.

You know, you have agents, but the way they run it, it's a family business. I mean, they treat you like family. And so, yeah, I know this, after my surgeries, or after, you know, I did a bunch of injuries, but I had three years in a row where I had to have surgery. And after every surgery, when I knew I had to go in there, Mr. Jones called me, picked me up off the floor and said, hey, listen, you're going to come back from this, you're going to come back better. So the way he treated me, the way Stephen, the whole family,

I mean, they really run it like a family business. And to me, we all want to give back to them and try to win because of it. Yeah. When you look at the Cowboys going forward, again, sometimes it's a salary cap league. You have to make choices. I thought this year, and I totally agreed with their perspective this year, they just went defense. They just said, we're going to go defense. I think next year they have to go, they have to address the offensive line.

How concerned are you? There are so many starts and so many years with that offensive line. we've added a game in the NFL. NFC East tends to be a physical division. I just saw Ryan Carrigan now. He's back in Philadelphia. Is it a legitimate concern to go? That old line is old, and by week 12, I went and looked the other day, Sean.

Their last six games are all good pass rushes. Is that a legitimate concern? Well, I think one of the underrated stories from last year, obviously, DAC went down. But we started the season without our two tackles, Ty Smith and Lyle Collins. And then at the end of the year, Zach Martin went down with the calf and was gone. So as much as we missed Dak,

we miss those guys on the O line. I think they're still great football players. I think they're going to come back and be all right. But we know when they go down, it changes the type of team we have. But I think when you get all three of those guys back, you get that back back, that offense is going to roll.

The question really is, what can we do defensively? We have to play better defensively. Yeah. You know, it's quarterbacks are so. I saw a stat the other day where Dak made $107 million, like international soccer star money. We were killing them about it. Texting them, letting them know.

It's like, wow. Those yogurt commercials really pay. They pay well. The quarterback's different in this league. If Russell Wilson complains, it's different than a safety complaining. If Aaron Rogers complains or Deshawn Watson, it's different. I mean, they're $30 million year guys. Did Dak and Jerry have a different relationship than Sean Lee and Jerry?

Well, I think Dak, what makes him special is that he leads from the front. He doesn't want a different relationship. He wants to be running with you. He wants to be lifting with you. I mean, that's why I think from day one guys loved him so much is because he's going around the locker room talking to everybody. The rookies that are in the back locker room, you'll find him back there talking to them.

So for him, that never was an issue. And really, for our team, that was never an issue. He was always part of the guys, part of us. And so when he did get paid, and when we celebrated, we love it, we reduced because he deserves it and he's worked for it. You know, the history of the Cowboys is, Jerry's not afraid that, you know, as he said once on our show, he never signs up for a bad time.

Jerry loves to talk. He loves to be front and center. That's one of the things we love about him. They took some gambles on draft picks this year. You know, some guys that had, you know, a little bit of luggage. And there's always been this sense, boy, Dallas, a lot of beautiful people. It's easy to get in trouble. That was the, that was the reputation, 80s, 90s. I don't know it because I don't live in that world now. is it, if you're a young player and you come in and you like to have a good time and you're a little loose and is it easy to get in trouble in Dallas or do they keep their eye on you there? Well, I think we know that, you know, the history's there. Everybody's watching it.

And I've always said the young guys, we haven't done anything. Those guys are the ones that built this program. You have a responsibility to act the right way, to work every single day. You can't lean on that. And I think also some of the leaders in the locker room, they know that. They're not going to let certain things slide or things get past. That's when I talk about Dax, Zach Martin, talk about Layton Vanderess, Jalen Smith.

I mean, those guys know what it takes to win, and they're not going to allow any of that to really get going. I asked Ray Lewis this one time, one of the great linebackers of all time. I said, who's the toughest guy you ever faced? And he told me a story about, I think it was Willie Roof, was an old Kansas City offensive lineman. It was like blocking a building. Go back to your career.

You were a guy would mix it up. you like collisions, and there's got to be one or two offensive linemen or full backs you dealt with, and you're not going to miss them at all. They were no fun to play. Who was literally fit? You're a big guy. Who was physically for you as a football player? Like, this is not going to be a great Sunday.

It's going to be, I'm going to wake up Monday sore. I mean, I'm going to go more with the running back. I mean, I'm going to Adrian Peterson. I mean, the first time I played him and I experienced that jump cut he has, I was like, what am I doing here? I mean, I can't tackle this guy. And then later I play him and I tackle him. And I'm running the sideline and I keep fixing my face mask.

My face mask is bent from trying to hit him. So I have to go in the locker room and halftime, change my face mask. And I just knew with him and he's still playing. He still looks unbelievable. But, I mean, he fights for every yard. He's explosive. He had so much speed. I mean, I just got such immense respect for him.

But with what he's doing now and how he played, the speed, the athleticism, the I mean, I loved going against them because it pushed you to your best. But man, he was, a game after him, I was in the ice tub all week. Really? No doubt. I mean, he brought it every single time. Ice tub all week? All week.

So you like those finesse backs who run out of bounds? Oh, no. Not all the time, too, especially when they're, some of those finesse backs, Darren Sporles. Oh, that's the one thing. I'm trying to guard him in space. I mean, that's the one thing I look back in my career is just I admire so many of these guys watching them, how they play, and being able to play against them was a best. It was the best.

So you wake up in the morning, you're out of the NFL. What's the first thing you do now? 30 years of playing football. I loved basketball when I was kid, and I got ran off the court because I wasn't very good, but I'm playing every day. You know, and you think that you go back to where you were when you were 18. But now when I'm on the court, I mean, it is airball, clank, clank, clank. I mean, I'm trying to get something competitive going.

But, you know, that's the thing, the outlet, where is it and where to find it? It's hard. It's hard. It's the gym. I'm the gym. I'm the gym. I'm, you know, I wake up. I say I'm playing basketball and lifting weights, which is fun. But for me, you know, the football, the camaraderie, the meetings, you know, driving up to the facility and you know you got the Giants on Sunday night. I mean, that is the stuff you're going to miss. Good for you. Sean Lee, former Cowboy Pro Bowl linebacker. It's great seeing you. Love to having you in today. Yeah. Thanks for having me. I appreciate you guys. Penn State Nittney Lion and Dallas Cowboy, great. Four times, led the Cowboys in Tackles.

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