The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 08/05/2021 - Best of The Herd

Episode Date: August 5, 2021

Colin's excited for the football season but everyone needs to slow down on hyping up Patrick Mahomes as a Hall of Famer. The simple fix in Green Bay would be allowing Aaron Rodgers to feel more involved with personnel. LeBron James claps back on social media to all the doubters & haters about the Lakers being one of the oldest teams. Plus, Colin decides which NFL stars are already Hall of Famers!Guest: Joe Theismann Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again,

I was harmed. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis keep coming to him. He's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Therapy is fantastic. But once again, it does not have a monopoly on healing. That's why I create the resources and that's why I create the community because I really just want you to have more access. On the podcast, Cultivating Her Space, Dr. Dom and Terry Lomax create a space where black women can show up fully and be heard.

It's tough because we're suppressing our emotions and so many of us are like high achieving individuals. listen to cultivating her space on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Your husband is not who you think he is. Your body is not what you thought it was. Your identity is formed by a secret history. I'm Danny Shapiro. And these are just a few of the stunning stories I'll be exploring on the 14th season of Family Secrets. He kind of shoved me out of the way and said, move.

And he went out the front door and he jumped in a car and drove off. and that was the last time I saw him. Listen to season 14 of Family Secrets on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening to The Best of Hurd Podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday. From 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1,

find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Herd. This is the Best of the Herd with Colin Cowher on Fox Sports Radio. Here we go on a Thursday. Steelers Cowboys. Tonight football season is back live in Los Angeles. It's the herd wherever you may be and however you may be listening.

We're on IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS1. I don't know if we can top yesterday's show with Jimmy Johnson and Nick Wright. We will give it a valiant effort. I promise you, it is great to be here today. Alex Curry again joining us, Joy Taylor. Coming back from Italy, I imagine Saturday night, full of wine and fun and, you know, whatever Italy provides. How are you? I'm doing fabulous. How are you doing today, Colin? I feel great because football is officially back. It does feel that way. Yes. Yep. Fox, Steelers, Cowboys. So we start with this. The NFL

season officially starts tonight. Kansas City, the Chiefs are the Super Bowl favorite. I do believe they're one of seven or eight teams, maybe one or two more that should be discussed. Are they the best team in football? No, Tampa is, but it is hard to repeat. I think Buffalo and Baltimore will give Kansas City everything they can handle. I think the Chargers in their own division will give Kansas City everything they can handle. I think Seattle and Green Bay, Rams, San Francisco. There's a lot of good football teams. The bottom of the NFL stinks, but it's very small, and the top is fantastic. Kansas City's got a lot to get through. There will be discussions this year.

Oh, there will be discussions. Patrick Mahom should already be a Hall of Famer. Oh, boy. He's 161st in passing yards, 121st in passing touchdowns, 113 in wins. He's not a Hall of Famer yet. He's just really talented.

The most remarkable thing I've ever seen in the last decade in the NFL is Andrew Luck walking into this league with no support. Bad GM, wrong head coach. horrible roster, no defense, no running game, worst O-line in the league. He won 11 games, three straight years. I don't think Patrick Mahomes could do that. Patrick Mahomes could not win in the Big 12th because he didn't have the support group. And that's my story today.

We do not give support groups enough credit. Magic Johnson's been in 30% more NBA finals than Michael Jordan. And Michael's the best, right? But Michael had to fight through coaches, his GM, weird teammates. Magic got the best owner in the NBA his entire career, and he got Kareem for a decade. Anytime Magic faced a little crisis, like year two, had to fire a coach, little injury, the tragic Johnson finals, he could always rely on Kareem, the best owner, then there's worthy Byron Scott. Quarterbacks are a lot like movie stars.

They get all the attention and most of the money. But it's really about the writing. Marlon Brando's considered the greatest actor ever. He's been in six or seven legendary films, but had twice as many that didn't do anything. Why? Because the script wasn't as good. If it was all about the actor,

then Marlon Brando would have been in 30 films, and they all would have been wonderful. He was in about six thinkers. Tom Hanks, there's a reason he always loves to work with Spielberg. Because sometimes he hasn't and the movies aren't as good. You watch the Terminal or Larry Crown? If it was just about Tom Hanks, he would never be in a movie that was a stinker. We do this all the time.

I love Magic. But every professional athlete's career, there'll be a crisis. But Magic always had Jerry Buss and Kareem and World. worthy. Patrick Mahomes has yet to face crisis. You folks gave Aaron Rogers nine Super Bowls after he won the first. Big Ben got there his first year. You had him better than Brady and Manning. He never was. Dan Marino, first year, a Super Bowl. You thought he'd get to eight more. I love Mahomes. I think he's amazing. But the reason he's going to be a Hall of Famer and the reason he's going to be amazing is the Hunt family. Brett Veets, the GM, and Andy Reed.

He's got the best tight end, the fastest receiver in a single season. They totally rebuilt the offensive line. Do you think if Patrick Mahomes played under Doug Marone in Jacksonville the last three years, you'd be calling him better than Brady? What if he was in the NFC West and had his college coach, Cliff Kingsbury, and had to go up against Pete Carolyn Russell Wilson twice a year, or Stafford now in McVeigh or Kyle Shanahan? He wouldn't even be the best quarterback in that division, in your opinion.

I love Mahomes, but we do this all the time. Players, movie stars have a couple of good hits. Oh, they're going to be Hanks. They're going to be Denzel. They're going to be Brady. I mean, as much as I love Tom Brady, the greatest thing he ever did was in Tampa, a losing culture, a losing franchise, a GM, nobody knew, an offensive line that needed work. And in six months, they were easily the best.

football team in the world. Any time he had an issue, a crisis in New England. Robert Kraft, Bill Belichick, a great defense, that's not to say he doesn't deserve credit. Go ask Baker Mayfield, the difference between Freddie Kitchens

and Kevin Stafansky. If he still had Freddie Kitchens, he would not get a new contract. With Kevin Stafansky, he will. Go ask Jared Gough. I don't think he's Mahomes. he couldn't play a lick with his first coach.

Jared Goff got a lot of money because of his second head coach. We do this all the time. Here's what we know about Mahomes. He's super talented. He's only a three-year starter. He's yet to beat Brady in the playoffs. He's had a few early injuries. And a lot of his credit is the supporting cast.

I say this all the time. Judge everybody in crisis too. Now, crisis is harder. But the only time I've seen Mahomes in crisis in his career was in the Super Bowl this past year when he lost his left tackle and he was awful. 52 passer rating, 50 attempts completed less than 25, no touchdowns and two picks. It's amazing what just missing a left tackle. He had Travis Kelsey, had Tyree Kill, had his defense, had Andy Reed, had the GM, missing a left tackle. had Andy Reed, had the GM, missing a left tackle.

He was awful. And outplayed by Garoppolo for three quarters of his first Super Bowl. Mahomes would, of course, admit this. He's not arrogant. He would admit it. But you had Marino and Big Ben and Aaron Rogers. You had them all in multiple Super Bowls. How about a new rule on this show?

We give the supporting cast for movie stars and quarter. and NBA stars a lot more credit. And we also are willing to wait a few years to see how athletes perform when things don't go their way. Magic Johnson was in 30% more finals than Michael Jordan. Nine and he won five, but Magic always had the great advantage. Wrong coach, still got the best owner. wrong draft pick still got the best owner

tough road trip still got the best owner tragic Johnson wake up the next morning still got the best owner little injury still got the best trainers support staff Mahomes will be a hall of famer he's not there yet maybe only one year away another MVP another Super Bowl

but just don't forget if you put him in Jacksonville, if you put him in the NFC West with his college coach, would he be favored? No, he wouldn't be favored to win the NFC West. He's yet to have a bad O line, yet to have a lousy coordinator, yet to have a deficient, wide receiver and tight end group. Never had it. The money kicks in.

The O line deteriorates. You can't keep the Pro Bowl. second receiver, he'll still be great, he'll still be talented. Take a deep breath. Before we annoy it, let's watch everybody for a few years in crisis too. All right, a lot of things. And I can just tell how that's going to play. You don't like Patrick Mahal.

I think he's great. I think if he wins the MVP in another Super Bowl this year, then you can have Hall of Fame discussions. But right now he's 161st in passing yards and 113th in wins. Can we slow down a little? Just pump the brakes a little. I'm not saying you have to screech do a stop. Can you just pump the brakes? Get ready to slow down the car, the Hall of Fame car, a little.

Let's bring it down to 55 miles an hour. I'm not saying a dead stop, but you guys are 85 miles an hour, the greatest player of all time. Folks, support systems are everything. You know what Mahomes is right now? If he was in Jacksonville, he would be what we're going to say about Trevor Lawrence in three years. Well, I mean, he's great, but he can't win the big game.

What would Mahomes be with Joe Burroughs' offensive line? I'll tell you, he'd be hurt. That's what he'd be. He'd be hurt. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged.

It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, it's Edwin Castro, also known as Castro 1021. And I'm Kunky, his best friend, and business manager. And we've got a new show called The 1021 podcast. I'm taking you behind the scenes on how I became one of Twitch's most popular streamers. We also love sports. And with the World Cup right around the corner, we'll be breaking down the biggest storylines ahead of the big tournament here in the USA.

Listen to the 1021 podcast on the IHHard. radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're watching the latest season of the Real Housewives of Atlanta, you already know there's a lot to break down. Georgia accusing Kelly of sleeping with a merry man. They holding Kay Michelle back from fighting Drew. Pinky has financial issues. I like the boozy style of Housewives show. I think it looks like it's going to be interesting. On the podcast, Reality with the King, I, Carlos King, recap the biggest moments from your favorite reality shows, including the Real Housewives franchise,

the drama, the alliances, and the team everybody's talking about. As an executive producer in reality television, I'm not just watching it. I understand the game. As somebody who creates shows, I'll even say this. At the end of the day, when people are at home, they want entertainment. To hear this and more, listen to Reality with the King on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The story I've told myself about love or relationships can then shape my behavior,

and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility of connection. This Mental Health Awareness Month, tune into the podcast deeply well with Debbie Brown and explore the journey of healing, self-discovery, and returning to yourself. We explore higher consciousness, emotional well-being, and the practices that help you find clear. clarity, peace, and self-mastery in a world that can feel overwhelming. The world is becoming lonelier.

We're not becoming more social and connected. We're becoming more individualized, but we actually meet people in connection. If you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole, this podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to deeply well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you. you get your podcast. All right.

So I'm giving you everything I got today because I'm off tomorrow, right? Summer still, I'm taking some Fridays off. I am bringing everything today, Cowboys Steelers tonight. Want to talk about LeBron James. You know, stars always say I don't listen to criticism. I don't deal with it. But stars are on Twitter, too, and stars are on Instagram. And our president probably isn't.

The former one was. But the reality is everybody now can connect with it. You can at any point in time, if somebody's on Twitter, connect with them, and everybody reads their phone all the time. And LeBron James was reading his phone yesterday and seeing what guys like me were saying, most people supported the Laker moves. I did not. I call them the antique store.

They're too old. LeBron came out and said, keep talking about my squad, our personal ages. He stays injured. We're past our prime. Do me a favor, please. And I mean, please, keep the same narrative energy when it begins. That's all I ask, thank you. He's since deleted it.

yes, I said the Miami Heat and the Chicago Bulls are better. Why? Because they got better players. Wasn't like some hyperbolic wacko statement. The Miami Heat got better players. The Chicago Bulls got way better players. And I also said the Lakers got older because they signed older players. Folks, Aaron Rogers, Russell, Wilson, and LeBron are taking Max money.

Therefore, the Packers, the Seahawks, and the Lakers are top heavy. They pay a lot of money to LeBron and a lot of money to Anthony Davis and a lot of money to Russell Westbrook. And those three are their best players. But because of that, the rest of the roster is pretty darn thin. Same in Seattle and same in Green Bay. Tom Brady keeps reworking his contract. So the Buccaneers roster is not top heavy. LeBron did that, took less in Miami.

Kevin Durant took less in Golden State. Therefore, you can spread the money out. The Lakers roster is top heavy with only one star in their prime, who's a great player, Anthony Davis, and he's missed 72 games in three years. And because the roster is top heavy, he'll be asked to play more minutes. People are conflating old and veterans. Everybody knows veterans win in the NBA. We all know that.

That's not a revelation. Don't confuse veterans with old. I love every year at Christmas, I love to go to Utah and there's snow. There's a difference between that and living in Buffalo. I love, love skiing on Christmas with my kids, but I want it to go away by March. I don't want to live in Nova Scot. Scotia. There's a difference between while you go to college, you have some fun and being the campus pot dealer. The Lakers aren't old. They're the oldest franchise in league history. They have

one player in his physical prime. That's a great player, Anthony Davis. And as I argued yesterday, I think his prime, because he's so gifted, was early and he will deteriorate very quickly. I said that about Cam Newton and Russell Westbrook. Sometimes the way a guy plays, they won't age well. Westbrook can't shoot. So if you notice in the last three years, he's gone from MVP to literally 90% of the teams don't want him. Cam Newton may struggle to beat out Cam Jones. He was an MVP eight years ago, but he's not efficient.

And the game of football to quarterback position has become about efficiency, complete 67, and 68% of your throws. That's not what he does. The game has grown away from him. And this happens all the time. Anthony Davis, the style he plays, he hasn't already committed to his body, it's breaking down more and more and more and more. He will not age particularly well. Some guys, like LeBron, committed to his body, could shoot jumpers. He's gotten more perimeter. He's aged very, very well. But don't conflate. You need veterans and the Lakers roster. to win in the Super Bowl, you've got to have about seven great players in their prime. And to win in the NBA, you need three really high-end players in their prime.

Say what you will about Milwaukee. Janus is a two-time MVP. If you've watched the Olympics or the finals, you know Drew Holiday is really good. Durant and Drew Holiday are carrying Team USA. Not Devin Booker, not Dame. It's Kevin Durant and Drew Holiday. And by the way, Drew Holiday shut down my arguable MVP, Chris Paul in the finals. Janice, Middleton's an all star in the east, Drew Holiday and a really good supporting cast.

All those guys still in Milwaukee in their physical prime, and they will be next year too. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, this is Jason McIntyre. Join me every weekday morning on my podcast, Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre. This isn't your typical sports pod pushing the same tired narratives down your throat every day. Straight fire gives you honest opinions

on all the biggest sports headlines, accurate stats to help you win big at the sports book and all the best guests. Do yourself a favor and listen to Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics

where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced. games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're watching the latest season of the Real Housewives of Atlanta, you already know, lot to break down.

Gorsha accusing Kelly of sleeping with a merry man. They holding Kay Michelle back from fighting Drew. Pinky has financial issues. I like the bougie style of Housewives show. I think it looks like it's going to be interesting. On the podcast, Reality with the King, I, Carlos King, recap the biggest moments from your favorite reality shows, including the Real Housewives franchise, the drama,

the alliances, and the team everybody's talking about. As an executive producer in reality television, I'm not just watching it. I understand the game. As somebody who creates shows, I'll even say this. At the end of the day, when people are at home, they want entertainment. To hear this and more, listen to Reality with the King on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The story I've told myself about love or relationships can then shape my behavior,

and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility. of connection. This mental health awareness month, tune into the podcast deeply well with Debbie Brown and explore the journey of healing, self-discovery, and returning to yourself. We explore higher consciousness, emotional well-being,

and the practices that help you find clarity, peace, and self-mastery in a world that can feel overwhelming. The world is becoming lonelier. We're not becoming more social and connected. We're becoming more individualized, but we're becoming more individualized. but we actually meet people in connection.

If you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole, this podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to deeply well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, it's Edwin Castro, also known as Castro 1021.

And I'm Kunky, his best friend and business manager. And we've got a new show called the 1021 podcast. I'm taking you behind the scenes on how I became one of Twitch's most popular streamers. We also love sports. And with the World Cup right around the corner, we'll be breaking down the biggest storylines ahead of the big tournament here in the USA. Listen to the 1021 podcast on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So we all know the GM, Brian Guden Coon, Cunstuff, the Packers, and the quarterback Aaron Rogers do not see eye to eye. but Aaron did talk about it yesterday.

He's trying to mend the fence. They're trying to grow together. They're going to communicate more. And here's Aaron Rogers yesterday. Relationships aren't formed in a matter of a couple days. You know, there's time where the respect grows and the communication follows. You know, it's all about wanting to have those conversations and wanting to, you know, to be in conversation like that.

And, you know, we've had a couple conversations. and been positive conversations. Now, we all know, you know this. I'm not, this is not a revelation. It's always been a delicate balance, right? Like, you don't give all players a say in personnel, but a defensive coordinator may trust, you know, a veteran guy and say, listen, we're going to draft this kid.

Watch some tape. What do you think? And I do think that's valuable. I do think there's one or two players on both sides of the ball that a coach or a coordinator thinks, These guys not only play the game, they think the game, and that's where Aaron Rogers comes in. But I also think Joe Montana didn't have to worry about personnel because he had so much trust in Bill Walsh and the Niners Front Office. I think Tom Brady, for 15 to 16 of his 20 years in New England, didn't have to worry about personnel.

He inherited a great defense. They got Randy Moss and Welker. It wasn't until the last three years where Belichick whiffed on seven. Several drafts, very few pro bowlers, almost no playmakers that Brady started getting frustrated and I think wanted more of a say and more respect then. But Jimmy Johnson came on our show yesterday and said, this Green Bay situation is not that difficult. Aaron should have a say. I don't think it's tricky at all. In fact, at our seminar, John Zorneski and I got in an argument about this or a discussion.

he said, Jimmy, he said, you would never listen to one of your players about who to draft or who to hire. I said, well, wait a minute now. I said, Aaron Rogers is smarter and been there longer than most of those scouts. Why wouldn't you listen to him? He knows those players. He knows talent. He knows what they need. And I said, in fact, I said, if my memory serves me right, I said, John, come on over with me.

Let's talk to Troy. I said, Troy, it was your fourth or no, your third year. I said, did I talk to you about hiring Norv Turner? He said, coach, don't you remember? You brought Norv in and let me visit with him before you made a decision whether not to hire him or not. So I trusted my players, especially my quarterback, that's smart, you know, as far as some decision making on not only the roster, but also on hiring coaches.

Now, I think one of the things that's overrated in life is having power and control. I think one of the things that's underrated is having talent and being focused on one thing. I would not want a big say in personnel. I would rather be focused on playing quarterback. If you go look at the NBA and the NFL over the last decade, let me name some of the coaches that have had personnel power and coaching power. Tom Thibodeau in Minnesota, Doc Rivers with the Clippers, Bill O'Brien in Houston.

Stan Van Gundy and Belichick. And Belichick acknowledged this offseason. I've got to give more respect and bring in more voices on the draft. I think it's almost impossible to be great at two things. Michael Jordan tried baseball. Randy Moss tried hoops. So did Roy Jones, Jr. So I think ideally as a quarterback, you should just worry about being a quarterback.

In fact, if you watch the documentary, what you discovered is Brady didn't have much of a relationship or conversations with Belichick. He was on the phone constantly with Josh McDaniels. Brady just worried about that offense and its efficiency. And I think that's the way to do it. I think Brady only got frustrated and wanted more of a voice because Belichick, with all that control, butchered several of the last drafts. And I will say this. I think what the tipping point with Aaron Rogers was.

I mean, he's a smart guy. He'd always like a heads up. But I think when Aaron really started wanting a say, and this is just conjecture on my part, is I thought the 2020 Packers draft was terrible. That's a football team, Packers 13 and 3, get to the NFC championship, and not a single player from that draft has had an impact.

Then this year, again, it feels like more of a developmental draft outside of Amari Rogers, the slot corner from Clemson. He'll come in and play immediately. So I think Aaron would want less of a say if he wasn't so frustrated with the last couple of drafts because he understands, I'm getting older, had a couple surgeries, NFC's loaded at the top. I got to get through Brady.

you got to get me players every April, like four or five dudes that can play and win games. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. So we started talking about Hall of Fame and I said, can't in or can't out? Just like, let's take some current stars and I'll tell you if I think they're Hall of Famers yet or not. I'm not guessing on what they do, on what they've done so far. Canton or can't out? Here we go.

We're starting with Odell Beckham Jr. Cant out. Okay, last four years, he's given me 670 yards. He's missed 23 games. He's a Hall of Fame talent, but he's not on the field enough. In the last four years, he's just not available. He's not a Hall of Famer. Ezekiel Elliott.

It's not a Hall of Famer. Can't out. He's the only running back in NFL history whose yards have done. declined in each of his first five seasons. So he is a declining player whose first two years look like a Hall of Fame lock, but doesn't feel like a Hall of Famer to me now. Julio Jones. Canton.

No question. He has the most receiving yards per game in NFL history, 95. Most seasons, over 100 plus receiving yards per game. Arguably the best receiver in the NFL for most of a 10-year period. Absolute first ballot lock. Travis Kelsey. Chiefs tied-in. Kenton, he's already in. A thousand plus receiving yards in five straight seasons. He is the first

tight end in NFL history who has done that. I still think he's in his prime. I think he has three or four huge years left. I always kind of thought, you know, Kellyn Winslow was the best tight end I've ever seen. I think it's now Travis Kelsey. Calio Mack. Callio Mack can't out. Again, couple of good years is not a Hall of Fame career. He's had fewer than 10 sacks in each of his last two years. He's never had a sack in the playoffs. He's never won a playoff game. He's a remarkable talent, but he needs two or three more great years. Is Patrick Mahomes a Hall of Famer? I said he needs one more year. By the way, Ken Stabler and Joe Thaisman had an MVP in a Super Bowl title. And Stabler finally got in 30 years after retiring and Thysman's not in. So I think he needs

another great year and then we can start the discussion. But he's like 120th in passing yards, 113th in wins. Yes, he's great. But, you know, can we, can we, can we, you know, let's make sure we all understand how great the Hall of Fame and football is. Great alone. You got to give me some numbers. You got to give me some years, not just great. Okay, Von Miller. Very, very close. I can make the argument canned out. Excluding the Super Bowl year, he's had a sack and a half and four playoff games. And there's a lot of injuries piling up. So I think Vaughn Miller's on the edge. Cam Newton. Not close. Worst completion percentage in the NFL since he entered the league. Now, he was a transformative

player and a unique player, but a lot of injuries, never had back-to-back winning seasons, really inefficient in terms of throwing the football. I think he's a star. You know, commercials, endorsements, he's a star, but he's not a Hall of Famer. Ben Rutherlisberger. First Ballot Hall of Famer, 18th year. He only needs a thousand more passing yards to pass Marino for the most passing yards by a quarterback who spent his entire career

with one team. So I've got my issues with Ben, but I think he's one of the most uniquely gifted quarterbacks I've ever seen, the greatest pump fake quarterback I've ever seen. I mean, you know, it's interesting. We all talk about, you know, his off-season, he doesn't work out hard. Doesn't it tell you how great he is? Uh-huh.

That he doesn't work out hard in the off-season, and he's been that successful. He's a first ballot hall of famer. Matt Ryan. Very close. I'd say can't out. Now, over the last 10 years, no quarterback has accumulated more passing yards in games they lost. So Matt's not winning enough to me to be a

Hall of Famer. That Super Bowl win may have been the difference, but right now I need more wins and more quality seasons. I do think Arthur Smith is really, really good for Matt Ryan. I think he's going to end his career with Arthur Smith and put together, he's going He has a chance for it.

Because I think if Brady retires and he's still playing for two or three years, Matt is still in the running. The next three years will decide it. J.J. Watt. I've had my criticisms, but he's a three-time defensive player of the year. He's going to Canton. There's no doubt about it. He was a unique force.

He's had some injuries. But in his prime, I mean, he was the only defensive line. And I can remember getting interceptions, getting touchdowns. I don't think he's as good as Aaron Donald. but he was so dynamic for about a five-year period, and I think he, to me, he feels like a Hall of Famer. But when I say Moe-Holmes isn't, what I'm saying basically is,

can we give respect to the Hall of Fame? This is the shrine. It can't just be your great with an MVP. I mean, if you go look, there's only one baseball player ever that's in the Hall of Fame that didn't play very long, Sandy Kofax. Now, Kofax is considered unhittable.

You know, there's the old joke about, you know, Frank Robinson's a legendary baseball player. And somebody was talking to Frank Robinson once. And they were asking him about all the pitchers he's faced, all the great pitchers. He was like, ah, it's pretty good, this, this. And they mentioned Sandy Kofax. And Frank Robinson said, oh, yeah, nobody hit Sandy Kofax. Yeah, nobody hit him. So Kofax is the only baseball hall of family.

He didn't play very long, but he was so dominant. So you could make the argument with Mahomes had he won the Super Bowl back to back. then you get into a space where it's like, I mean, he's three-year starter, but I do think here, in year four, if he lights the league up, which I think he'll do, if he stays healthy, I think he will, and if they win the Super Bowl, they're certainly in a small group of teams that could. Then I think we can have the discussions, but we tend to do this. You know, Marino got to a Super Bowl, we thought he was going to win eight. Aaron won a Super Bowl, we thought he was going to win six.

It's hard. This game is hard. Basketball players don't get tackled. Baseball players don't get tackled. Soccer players act like they get tackled. They don't get tackled. We tackle our quarterbacks. They get hurt.

And offensive lines, cap space, do you have the right coordinator? This game is practice is hard in football. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. Joe Thaisman played for 12 years in the NFL. He was a Super Bowl champ of multiple-time pro bowler. He's won 62% of his games, won three times as many playoff games as he lost, was part of that dynasty with the Washington football team and Joe Thaisman. It's joining us now live.

Haven't talked in a while, and there's a bunch of stuff. By the way, people often forget that you and Warren Moon are the two greatest players in league history that had to start in the CFL. You played there and played well for three years because of negotiations with the dolphins. I'm old enough to remember all that stuff, Joe. That's the only time I like being old. Thank you. but there's something to be said about aging.

I don't know how graceful we are at times aging, but there's something to be said about aging. But you're right. I, you know, Warren and I spent a lot of time up there. He spent a lot more time actually in Canada than I did. And of course, another guy who didn't quite get to the championship level, but won a bunch of championships up there is Doug Flutie. Doug spent an awful lot of time up there as well.

So we all got our start somewhere. Let's start with this. Joe Gibbs is one of the great coaches of all time. We've talked a lot in the last couple of months about Aaron Rogers, having a say in personnel to some degree. Did Joe Gibbs ever go to Joe Thaisman and think, Joe, what do you think about this receiver in the fourth round? First of all, the answer is no.

Secondly, if I didn't like a play, it didn't matter. I'd figure out how to run it. It's a different time and a different age. And I said this a long time ago about Aaron's situation. It isn't that he wants to sit down and make the decisions. He would just like to be included in the conversation. I had a conversation with a really, really fine general manager, one of the best in the league. He's retired now.

And I asked him, did you ever talk to your players? He said, absolutely. I'd get four or five up in the room and the season was over. We'd sit down. We'd talk about the football team. Nobody knows the needs as well as a player. I mean, I understand management. They look at it.

But players understand locker rooms. They understand what goes on on the field. They understand the communication aspect of it. And just to have their input about what they see. I think is valuable when it comes to being able to help a football team, add personnel and grow. You know, it's interesting. I heard this week Carson Wentz, I think Nick Foles would work in Indianapolis, but I also know the background with Foles and Wence. And somebody said to me this week, and I thought it was pretty smart, they said,

you can't be physically not capable of playing, and then emotionally not always able to play because somebody's on the roster you don't like. in Carson Wentz, should he be able to just go, hey, I'm not always available physically. Emotionally, I got to get through this thing and deal with Nick Foles. Is that asking too much? Yeah, I think basically in Carson's, don't worry about other people. You take care of yourself. We won a championship in 82, and I think they drafted Tom Flick, a quarterback in the second round.

Yeah. And it's like, I can't worry about what's behind me. I'm not a rear-view mirror guy when it comes to playing ball or anything in life. I like to see what's out in front of me. I hope Carson can stay healthy enough to be able to compete. I think going Indianapolis with Frank is a great thing for him mentally. I don't care. If I'm Carson, I don't care who you bring in.

Right now, I can't play. We're going to need somebody to start the season. And then bring on whatever competition you want. I think that's the attitude. It's healthy for him. It's healthy for the football team. And that's where I hope he gets to. You are in Super Bowls.

I remember him well, 82 and 83 back-to-back. And, you know, Kansas City has now been to back-to-back Super Bowl. I think fans don't realize this. We just think Tom Brady's going to make it. It's like time out. A lot of those Patriot teams did not go to the Super Bowl back to back. Take me to 82, 83. Was 83 much harder than 82 to get there for you, Joe?

I think we were about, it's a tough question to say yes or no to simply because, remember, in 82, we only played 12 games. It was a strike season. We missed, I think, seven games. So it was a shorter year. That's one of the things that we see now is we see that the strain on the players, how many people are available. I mean, you look at that Super Bowl with Kansas City, this last one against Tampa.

Both their tackles were gone. I mean, guys are starters in this league for a reason, Colin. You know, you have ones and twos for a reason. If you're trying to play a team that has a lot of ones and you've got a lot of twos, it's going to be tough. And we saw that in the Kansas City game. The thing is, it's a long season. It wears on you.

Their off season isn't that isn't as long. long as others and there is a recuperation period. I think that what they need to do, and it's a different time and a different era, but they need to sit down and look at where their deficiencies were. I think one of the things that we noticed and nobody really talked about is the last three games that Kansas City played, they weren't stellar performances. They got there, but they struggled. They weren't the juggernaut they were going into the latter part of the season. And they need to get that back. And the other thing is, too, is, you know, there's, Tarek is such a big part of what they do offensively, they need to find alternatives. Besides Kelsey,

you need to find an alternative weapon so that if people want to take away, Tariq, you have to make them pay so that you can take advantage of his great speed and his ability to stretch a field. Okay, so I hear the Niners brass. They're all saying, oh, Garoppolo looks amazing. It's the best I've ever seen Garoppolo, and part of that, I think, is strategic because if they have to move him at some point, let me ask you, if you ran a team, no. Knowing his injury history, Joe, you lose your quarterback week five. He's kind of expensive. Joe, would you roll the dice on Garapolo in week five or six if you look at your roster and you think we can win games with a guy if he can play?

It depends on how long he's gone for. If I lose him early, is he gone for the season? Then you have to make an evaluation. I think this is a key year. More than completing passes, more than throwing touchdown passes, the most important, thing for Jimmy this year is to play 17 football games. To be able to make yourself available. I tell guys all the time, young guys, I said, the most important thing you can be is

on the field because if you're on the field, the coach can count on you. If you're on the field, you're learning. Every day you take a snap. I've had conversations with Tom Brady. I mean, Tom's 44 now. Tom's played 21 years in this league. He goes out to practice in Tampa Bay. He learns something today.

I promise you that. That's the type of player that we have. And that's the type of individual that he is. I think in Jimmy's case, you just have to keep yourself available so that you can play football. Boy, you look good, Joe. You're taking care of yourself. You look fantastic. By the way, you're doing something.

You're always been a young thinker. You have a new NFT sports collectible thing you're doing. What are you launching here? Yeah, we do. The NFTs are out. As a matter of fact, they're out today. And what they are is they're live for purchase today. They're actually called Playbooks.

And what I've done is I've taken four plays that I basically have. that I think defined a lot of my career. It was my touchdown pass against the unit, a touchdown pass I caught against USC in college, my record breaking punt, which was one yard, the play that was made against Kim Bocapper in Super Bowl 17,

and then my first punt return. See, I started my career as a punt return. Yeah. Against the Giants. So I've had a chance to do a lot of different things and we've captured them in the NFTs. And we did the voiceovers for it. I think Marcus Allen is doing it,

Earl Campbell, I believe, is one that's doing it, Shannon Sharp is another one that's doing it. And they're available, like I say, today. And it's pretty exciting. I looked at a couple of them. And it's really neat what they can do with the imagery and the digital nature of creating these really collectibles. They're unique. Those four plays are very unique and really define my career in so many different ways. And I think that's what we all want to do is make something special to us available to people that are interested in. Hey, one more question.

When you were playing, these quarterbacks now, Joe, I mean, good God. They got quarterback gurus. They got quarterback camps. They throw 10,000 throws by the time that 11 years old. And so I said with Tua and Daniel Jones, I'm going to make a decision by Thanksgiving. I'm not going to give you four years anymore. That's not the way the world is. We got a minute left, minute and a half left.

How long if you ran the Giants or the Dolphins before Daniel and Tua, before you would just make a decision? decision, maybe not publicly, but privately, we got to get a better quarterback. I would give them the entire year. I wouldn't have made a decision midseason. Too many things factor into it. Colin, I've said this time and time again, the quarterback position is the single most dependent position on the field. If you lose some personnel, again, I go back to Patrick in the Super Bowl. You lose your two tackles. You're going to run around and you're limping a little bit anyway. So I would give them, I would commit to both of them for the entire year. year this year. Let me see what you got. Then we'll go look at it after that and we'll sit down

and evaluate not only your position, but what helped you, either helped you or hurt you to be able to win football games for us. Wait, I got a minute left. Ryan Fitzpatrick, I love your team and your coach. I don't get that decision at quarterback. Explain it to me. You have to. I think the thing about Fitz is he sort of fills the role a little bit of what Alex did here, Alex Smith, when he was here and with Taylor Heineke. He's a guy who has a chance to play. Stephen Montez is another one that's out there. Kyle Allen, there are three other quarterback.

Fitz has such a great presence in the locker room. He has a great presence on the field. I've been at training camp every day except for one since it started. And he's learning an entirely new system. Now you think if he played in nine different teams that he'd be a guy that knows what's going on. This is a little bit of a different system. and it's a learning process. But he brings such calm.

And one of the things, there's no question. What Washington wanted to do this year would be able to put the ball down the field. And it's something that fits does. Yeah. So what he does from a player standpoint, his personality fits this football team very well. Great seeing you, Joe.

You look fantastic. Thank you so much. Thanks, Colin. Great being with you. Take care of yourself. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends,

me and hilarious guests from Bob O'Don, to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprise. of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments.

If we didn't talk ever again, I was funny. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis come until he's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball.

So listen to Point Game on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Therapy is fantastic. But once again, it does not have a monopoly on healing. That's why I create the resources and that's why I create the community because I really just want you to have more access. On the podcast cultivating her space, Dr. Dom and Terry Lomax create a space where black women can show up fully and be heard. It's tough because we're suppressing our emotions and so many of us are like high achieving individuals.

Listen to cultivating her space on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Your husband is not who you think he is. Your body is not what you thought it was. Your identity is formed by a secret history. I'm Danny Shapiro, and these are just a few of the stunning stories I'll be exploring on the 14th season of Family Secrets. He kind of shoved me out of the way and said, move, and he went out the front door and he jumped in a car and drove off, and that was the last time I saw him. Listen to Season 14 of Family Secrets on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.