The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 and Out - Bills Identity, Upcoming Burrow/Herbert Deals, More Gambling Probs, Mailbag

Episode Date: June 6, 2023

John discusses the Bills attempt to establish a more physical identity, how Joe Burrow and Justin Herbert’s teams should approach upcoming contract negotiations, why there’s no excuse for NFL players to gamble, and answers listener questions in the Middlekauff Mailbag. Follow John onTwitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest. Check out Gametime - the fastest growing ticketing app in the US, and the official ticketing app of 3 & Out and GoLow -  for tickets to all of your favorite NFL, NBA, NHL, NCAA teams. Concert and comedy show tickets, too. Go to Gametime now to create an account, download the app and use code JOHN for $20 off your first purchase. Subscribe NOW and follow Middlekauff and The Volume on Twitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest content. It's always FanDuel for the best wagering action! #volume #herdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying.

Yep, that's me, Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok's podcast network on TikTok. The volume. Just a reminder, you can catch me recording this podcast live on Amp. Amp is a new live radio app that lets you call in and chat with me in person while recording. Get the app on Apple's App Store and make sure you follow me at John Middilcoff to get notified when I go live. What is going on, everybody, John Middletalcalf, three and out podcast. Recording this on a Monday afternoon. If you are hearing this and you missed yesterday's show,

it was a mailbag-heavy podcast. And the way you get into the mailbag, and we'll do a couple of mail-back questions at the end of this show as well. It's just my Instagram at John Middlethoth, fire in those DMs, get your question answered on the show. some football stuff going on. The bills. Keep making moves the defensive line. We will talk about some quarterback potential contracts,

as well as another guy involved in gambling in the NFL. I just do not understand it. I don't get it. We will dive into all that as well as, like I said, the mailbag. And the plan is, so football podcast today, football podcast yesterday. We will have a go-low podcast coming up on Wednesday with Jason Sobel who picked Victor Hovlin, who you could have got, I think, you know, 25 to 1, 28 to 1, I think before the Memorial.

Kids hot. Hovlin and Sobel. And then I think we'll end the week with a podcast, football podcast. So we got a lot of content flowing. This is no rest here. You know, we got to keep the lights on. So podcast flown. Appreciate everyone listening.

Also on YouTube. Check out the volumes YouTube channel. We will have a U.S. Open deal in a week during the third major of the year with some Golo merch. We will get into that on the Golo podcast. So let's dive in. But before we do, do you want to go to an NFL game this fall? Do you want to go to a college game?

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Keep hammering that, downloading that app. I want to start with the bills because they made some headlines today. They extended a player. They signed another player. And it goes back to last year when they gave a lot of money. to Vaughn Miller, which I thought was pretty extreme. But in fairness to them, before he got injured, he was having a fantastic season. And I think the lasting memory that we all have in 2000, I guess it was technically in 2020, but of the 2022 Buffalo Bills, who have now established

themselves as, you know, one of the powerhouse teams in the league, was them getting worked by the Bengals, physically kind of tossed around. Now, I follow the bills very closely. love Sean McDermott, known him for a long time. Don't know Josh Allen, but California, Central Valley guy, I root for him. They're a fun team to watch. He's a very explosive, fascinating player, right? Like most people, I thought it was crazy to draft him that high, and they haven't been proven just right.

I mean, they found themselves a superstar player. But in a playoff game, they got shoved around by the Cincinnati Bengals. There's no really way around it. And I think they deserve credit because sometimes teams, when they get worked in the playoffs, I think we can look back and look what they've done moving forward and go, you know, they're just not building this thing the right way. They really are, right? They continually double down on the defensive line.

And it's one area in, you know, still left in the game of football where you can be really physical. And you can kind of set the tone for your team. And I saw it with the 49ers the last couple years. I saw the Cowboys give the 49ers everything they could handle. Obviously, the Philadelphia Eagles built the thing at the line of scrimmage, right? You look at the K&C Chiefs, offensive and defensive line. When you invest in the line of scrimmage and not at some auxiliary, quote, unquote, positions, it's an area you can separate yourself and really determine the team's toughness.

And the bills have attempted to do that. You know, did they give von Miller a tad bit too much money? Yeah, probably. you know, Ed Oliver extending him, signing Leonard Floyd. Obviously, they've invested in a lot of draft picks at the top, you know, two years ago with, I think their first and second round pick with the defensive line. They are attempting to do everything humanly possible to be a physical team and not get shoved around again like they did last season.

Now it's just on their personnel moves like, did they draft, sign, and extend the right players? because I can never fault you for the mindset of going, you know, heavy in terms of your salary cap space and your resources with the offensive and defensive line. It just comes down to did you do it with the right players, right? The Denver Broncos. I understand why they invested in an offensive guard and offensive tackle. The question is, is McGlenty worth that much money? At least with Vaughn Miller, when the Buffalo Bills, you know, gave him a large contract last.

I think over $50 million guaranteed. First, about all of favor. When he's healthy, as you saw last year or two years ago with the Rams in their Super Bowl push, and then early on last year, he's still a difference-making player. And Floyd can be an extra piece. Ed Oliver can be a really good, you know, third, fourth guy on your defensive line. The price of admission now for these players, it's not cheap, right? We saw Javon Hargrave, who the 49ers, he's on his third contract.

get four years, $80 million and $40 of a guarantee. So when you extend, pay, sign these guys as free agents, or obviously want to draft really good players, you know, usually have to draft them high. Usually have to pay a lot of money. So I understand what the bills are doing and I commend their mindset. Now it's just going to come down to they have the right players, right? Did they go in on the right guys?

Because they're going to be held the one standard. Can you beat the Chiefs and can you beat the Bengals? the playoffs. And we'll see how this Aaron Rogers thing kind of comes to fruition, but can you, can you hang with him, right? Because you're going to go after, you know, Mack Jones, we've seen what the bills do with the, uh, with the New England Patriots, right? And even last year, like that Miami game, one of the most bizarre wins of the season, right? Remember, they outgained them, the, uh, the time of possession, the, the play disparity. But I, I think the bills clearly are better than the Miami Dolphins. It's just going to be, can they get after Patrick Mahomes, Joe Burrow,

and now Aaron Rogers, and any other really good quarterbacks? We know there are a ton in the AFC, but they're going to be judged in January because last year, right, I had high hopes, and then they got killed in the second round. And it feels like they take, they've taken a step back. And I think sometimes, you know, you don't have to overreact to a loss, but, you know, like the Eagles, there's no reason for them to overreact to a crazy. loss in the Super Bowl. Now, if you're the bill, is like, do you have enough toughness? And they keep signing defensive linemen. They keep extending defensive lineman. So I do think they are going about it the right way. Now it's just going to come down to their head coach. Here's the other thing.

Sean McDermott has gotten back to his roots. He's calling the defense. So they get rid of Leslie Frazier. He was the fall guy last year. So does Sean McDermott make an incremental difference for them from a toughness standpoint, from a defensive scheme standpoint, and they don't get worked when it matters this time around. If you're watching the NBA Finals, it's really a pretty fascinating two-star players going up against each other, right? Jimmy Butler was kind of discounted over the years until he got to Miami, right? It was like, how good is he?

Chicago Bulls kind of sold on him. Then he went to Minnesota, and it was like, ah, he was too tough on, on Andrew Wiggins and Carl Anthony Towns. Then he goes to Philadelphia and they essentially choose Ben Simmons over him. We can relitigate that all we want, but that's just a fact. And Pat Riley went all in and he's been rewarded. Now, I think we can argue how good Jimmy Butler is relative to the league during the regular season, but there is not a regular season that means less in 2023 than the NBA.

And Jimmy Butler, if you just judge him on his playoff performance, he's easily a top 10 player. And Nicole Yokic, the Joker, as he goes by, is clearly a transcendent talent. So in the NBA, it's very clear. It's a star-driven league. It's about getting the right stars and then just going all in around the guy. And Denver's a good example. They've gone all in around the Joker, won multiple MVP's,

and now three wins away from an NBA finals. The Heat have done it a little NFL style. They got a bunch of undrafted free agents. agents, you know, BAM is obviously a really good player, but some other random guys, and they just kind of make their hay on coaching, culture, and just Jimmy leading the charge. Not always the prettiest thing, but it works. I heard Coward kind of compare it to the Patriots because historically New England, with some of those Tom Brady teams, player for player, were not always the best, and honestly, rarely the best team in the league top to bottom talent wise. They won with clearly

Brady, but coaching, discipline, execution, toughness, mental toughness, kind of wearing your ass down, ultimately making you make a mistake that they were not going to make in the biggest moments. And what's cool about it is like, in pro sports, you go as far, especially in basketball and football, in basketball as your star player, in football, as your quarterback. And I saw headline today that they must have had a golf tournament in Los Angeles. Branden And Staley talked about the ongoing contract talks with Justin Herbert. We have talked before about the ongoing contract talks with Joe Burrow. And I think all you want in the NFL when you land a star player,

and ideally it's that quarterback, but it could be Micah Parsons, Nick Bosa, it could be Travis Kelsey, it could be Chris Jones. It could be, we go around the league and pick out star players. Lane Johnson, Jason Kelsey is the total package. Like, that's what you're. looking for, right? A guy that you can pay a premium who can become your leader and then you just basically build around him. And in football, if it's not the quarterback and if it's, you know, an offensive tackle, a defensive pass rusher, a wide receiver, a tight end, you want him to be

the total package. And when you look at the Chargers and the Bengals, like, they should thank their lucky stars because they got two guys. Like, whatever the Denver Nuggets pay Joker, what they've him so far and what they will inevitably pay him over the next seven, eight years, it's a discount, right? Whatever the heat have paid Jimmy Butler, it's clearly not enough, right? What he means to them and winning at the highest levels. Now, Joe Burrow has accomplished more than Justin Herbert, right? A bunch of playoff wins. Herbert still doesn't have one. He's only been in the one playoff game and they lost it in the crazy comeback to the Jags. But I'm a huge believer in Justin Herbert.

I understand, I don't want to say reservations, but it's easy to push back when you haven't proven it. If you watch football on a weekly basis and you also factor in that his head coach is Brandon Staley and defensively, they have been very hit or miss over the last couple years, right when it's mattered the most. Like, I can't put it all on Justin Herbert. Now, to get over the hump, he's going to have to be really good in the playoffs. Joe Burrell has proven that.

But one thing Joe Burrell has had going for him is, His defense, the last couple of years, when it's been nut cutting time, has come to play. But overall, either way, like, I'm going all in on both guys. And I think both franchises should feel very, very good about it. One of the stories right now coming out of the 49ers, now he's not a quarterback, and he's already under contract. I obviously haven't been to a practice so far the last couple weeks, but all the reports, Anthony Lynn, I think, spoke last week.

Christian McCaffrey is like a man amongst boys out there. Now, granted, Nick Bosa is not there. He's allowed to stay in Florida and train. Trent Williams is not there. Debo's, you know, kind of working on the side. But the standard in which Christian McCaffrey, and really the moment they traded for him up until really today, in which he operates on a daily basis,

is he's underpaid. Because his effort, his just mindset on the practice field, the standard he sets for all the young guys looking around. And when you draft star players, right? Or when you draft a player and then they become a star, ideally, and this is why character matters so much. It's why that we question, you know, the Kyler Murray's of the world.

Like, can you afford to put all your chips in the middle of the table on your star quarterback and pay him all this money when he's not the hardest working guy in the building? When he's not the guy that sets the standard for your entire building of just excellence, anything less is unacceptable. Tom Brady did, Peyton Manning did, Drew Breeze did, clearly guys around the league like Patrick Mahomes, Joe Burrow. I think Justin Herbert is going to fall under that umbrella. We've seen what Jalen Hertz means to the Eagles in terms the way he conducts himself, the way he works. It is so important. And I think sometimes it can feel, I don't want to say overblown or overdone, but we talk so much around the draft about character, character, character.

when question marks become available through a trade, right, or available as a free agent, is it worth it? And I think the teams that circumvent the standard get themselves in positions where they regret it. And I think the NFL is very, very lucky right now to have just such high-level guys in the league. When you look at it, and I remember talking to coward about this last year, I forget exactly what we were talking about, but I remember going through the all pro list, the first and second team. And I don't have it up top of my head, but I think there might have been one guy who would be quote unquote considered a questionable character.

The overwhelming majority of them were like super high level guys. And you want to win in this league. And if you look at the teams that are winning right now, like ultimately the cowboys, their success the last couple of years, this isn't like the 1992 White House Cowboys, you know, with drugs and the strippers and the, you know, all the craziness going on off the field. Look at their squad. Pretty high-level group of dudes, right? Obviously, the Eagles, pretty well-together a bunch, the Chiefs, the Bengals, the Bills.

You know, this is for the most part. I'm not saying every guy is some choir boy, but it's just high-level dudes that are clearly really good players. Because it's a talent league. You got to have, you know, the, there's a standard in which to be a really good player, you have to have a prerequisite of physical ability, playmaking ability, production. but most of these guys and this is the one thing,

the Patriots were the closest to the line of like, God, they got a lot of overachievers. But they had enough high-end talent always, whether it was Brady, whether it was Gronk, whether it was Will Fork, whoever, Logan Mankins, that, you know, this league is, you know, I think sometimes

we don't give the proper justice to the importance of high-level dudes. And I've said this forever, you know, when guys get in trouble, that the NFL, those guys are the minority in the NFL. The majority of the guys in the league are just high-level guys, right? And I'd say the majority of really good players are really high-level guys. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque.

Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented at all. embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. And last but not least, talking about not high level, I just do

not understand in 2023 with all the information we have, everything is. digital now. There is a Colts player right now who supposedly is not a star player, but he is a guy that according to reports NFL fans will know who he is. At the time of recording this, I do not have a name. I just have the headline for the story that there is a player being investigated by the league for extensive gambling. And it's going to come out and some of the media will push back. It's hypocritical to not know. The players, just like the only, owners owned the revenue of these gambling companies. And because of the integrity of what is going on with the NFL, you're not allowed to gamble

on football. We can argue and attempt to litigate over social media or text message or whatever, whether it's fair or not. But the reality is, those are the rules. So I don't get how guys, especially now, everything is true. When you put your name in, they know who you are. They can track where you are. So some of these guys, like with the Lions,

I think Jameson Williams, was gambling on college. Well, they can tell where you are. Anyone watch these murder shows? Now with our phone, they know everywhere we're going. So I just, this notion I saw either Floria or someone wrote earlier today that maybe there was some, question in whether the information to the players was set in stone early on, like in meetings or whatever, that you are not allowed to do this. I guess there are people that like,

it's not being articulated or streamlined well enough to really hammer home. Listen, in my experience, well before gambling was legal, sports-wise, throughout the country like it is now, I thought it was pretty clear. It was well laid out. when I was with the Eagles. So to me, there are no excuses. And I don't understand if you're a player, even if you're on a veteran minimum salary, making a million dollars,

how it's worth it for you to gamble when you know the repercussions. You know, and especially now, you've seen Calvin Ridley, that was a year ago now. And I loved to gamble. But if you told me that I would not allow to gamble, and that was the only way I could keep podcast,

and making a living, I would not gamble. It would be pretty easy. I'm not saying I would like it. I enjoy gambling on golf. I really do. And I can't wait to gamble on the U.S. Open here in two weeks. But if that was part of the stipulation of my job and the success financially I was having, I would easily be able to slow it down.

Now, I would understand. And this is why I think you've seen some instances in college baseball. where gambling has become a problem, it's hard. Like, you can't pay off. There is no amount of money you can bet to get like in the pocket of some star NFL or basketball player. They make too much money. It's just impossible.

Right? It's why historically the referees have been bought off. You can't buy off a coach or a player. They're making too much cash. Same with college football. Same with the NFL. We're in college baseball. Okay, you got a coach, you know, making $300,000.

you could, $50,000 to him is a lot, right? $50,000 to some star wide receiver isn't that much money. You're basically just gambling because it's entertainment and I totally understand it. But given what's on the line, it just doesn't make any sense. So I can't fathom having, being that stupid really to gamble on sports when it's well laid out in front of you. You know the consequences. you have seen guys get in trouble. And listen, even if you like gambling, you got some coin,

what do you bet in five grand a game? Like, how is that worth it when you're making at minimum? A minimum salary is $7, $900,000. And that's assuming you're on a rookie contract. If you're on a second contract, that thing's starting at seven figures. So these guys, man, I think everyone around the league now has absolutely zero excuse to not understand what's on the line.

But also understand that when you use your phone, you are being tracked. These companies, there is a lot of red tape surrounding all this. We're still very, very new in this legal sports gambling in a lot of these states. They're going to follow the rules. It is just not worth it for them to cut corners or have something shady happen and then get their license removed in a state or have something, you know, take on and in Kura, big fine, right? There's no point doing that.

That's why they are being extra cautious. And they're even more likely to forward every single questionable name transaction immediately to the leagues that they are in business with, i.e. the same as the players. So these whoever, I'm not going to know free ads here. But when you're in business with these leagues, the players benefit from that too, because there's a revenue sharing. so really just shake my head at these guys' stupidity. Okay, let's dive in to the mailbag.

Let's bang out a couple questions and get you guys out of here on your merry way. Appreciate everyone listening. Start with Thomas. Again, DM's wide open Instagram at John Middlethoff. Hard to watch most of the games with the time change, so it's huge having podcasters like you to listen to during my waking hours.

He started this, I skipped the line. Avid listener from over in France. I have a two-part question for the mailback. First, do you or have you ever played fantasy football? And second, I have noticed that fantasy has had an impact on creating a divide among football fans' opinion on players. Obvious examples. Justin Fields, potentially Anthony Richardson, get massively hyped when in real football, they might just be a mid or low tier starter.

Hell, just this past year, I was in leagues where Marietta was not highly of. I was wondering your thought on the topic of dueling fan perceptions. A lot of different angles here. First and foremost, I've never played a full league as start to finish throughout the season. I started playing daily fantasy over the last three or four years. I don't consistently do it, but I have played daily fantasy. I have never been in a fantasy football league. Now, I'm not acting like I'm against it.

I'm glad that it's a part of football. It's helped separate the sport clearly. And it's created a lot of, I would say, novice fans and people that might not be interested without it to keep very close eyes. And then really, you know, strong fans, even more invested in the entire league. So I'm a big fan of it. just when you, you know, I don't know, I just haven't played, you know. I guess when I was younger, probably in college, you know, it was probably less popular,

like when I was in college in like 03, 04, 05, 06. And then I aspired to work in football and I started working in like 08 and 09 in college football. And by the time I got to the NFL in like 10, 11, 12, fantasy was probably really taken off. And I just got into radio, now podcasting. I just live it in terms of. Read so much about it. Such a big part of it. Some people say, you know, you guys can ask me during the season fantasy football questions.

I do not pretend to be Matthew Berry or my guy Field Yates, but I do enjoy the banter. You know, having not consistently played it, it's hard to have like, here's the thing. Historically, running backs have been the number one overall picks, right? like Christian McCaffrey, Derek Henry, Adrian Peterson, and clearly in real football, quarterbacks and even receivers are more important. So I get what you're saying. And part of it is like Fields running ability. He can not throw a touchdown, but if he runs for two, throws for 150 yards and runs

for another hundred, still gets you points. Just part of the game. So in terms of fantasy, I got nothing against it. I'm glad people really enjoy it. It feels like it's, I don't know if it's more popular now than ever, but it's clearly really big, you know. I don't pretend,

you know, I say this always about gambling. I try to be very authentic on this show. I just talk about what I like and what I do. So I have no problem talking about gambling because I like to gamble. I don't talk that much about fantasy because I don't play. Not against it.

But I think a lot of people talk about gambling that would never gamble, right? Colin was one of the first to talk about gambling back in the day with, like, RJ on his ESPN show a decade ago, right? Because he was gambling on games. It was interesting, fascinating. And listen, I've always said, like, I don't care if you're not betting $1,000 a game or $10 a game,

but like, do you actually gamble? And the amount of people in the media that I would have a hard time seeing, we've seen their Twitter accounts, very risk adverse. in terms of the way they live their life. So I think they're not probably a big gamblers when it comes to football, which is obviously the number one bet sport in America. Okay, Trevor, how do NFL contracts work when a player is traded? Did the Jets get a copy of Aaron's contract with the Packers?

If so, is that how other teams find out about different clauses and salary cap structuring to use their future contracts with players? Or is there just a base contract that you can change, amend, add, subtract? Thank you for helping me during football fix. During my football fix and outside of each season, I have completely seen the game that I love watching differently since finding your podcast. I appreciate it, Trevor. There is a database.

I don't have the exact name off the top of my head. It might just be the league database that every team has access to. So the moment I sign Leonard Floyd, Jalen Hertz, you name it, big or small, a contract, it goes into a database that every team in the league has access to.

So for example, when Howie and the Eagles were working on Jalen Hertz's contract, what do you think they did? They brought up the last four or five quarterback contracts and they use that as a guide. Some of the clauses,

some of the structuring of the money, and then they kind of curtail it to their own team, how they fit in the money under their own salary cap situation issues. Now, I think what makes football dramatically different than baseball and basketball, and I feel like I'm repeating myself here, but if you make a four-year, $80 million contract, so $20 million a year,

I think Amari Cooper signed just back in the day, five years, $100 million, $60 guaranteed. in basketball or baseball, it would just be 20 a year. Or one year would be 18, the next year would be 19, the following year would be 22, and you just pay it out as they played out the years on the contract. In football, it's very different. There is a signing bonus, which, like any bonus, if you sign a $100,000 contract to sell insurance, and you get a $10,000 signing bonus, you get that money up front.

So when you see these signing bonuses of $10, $20, $30, $30, $50, whatever, whatever million dollars, that is paid to the player. And that is under the umbrella of the guaranteed money. And I don't pretend to be Howie or Parag here, but you amortize the signing bonus and the guaranteed money over the life of the contract. Now, some of these contracts now have these fake, voidable years that you can use to amortize it over the life of on the books, right?

It's why I think Javon Hargrave is a good example. he signed with the 49ers, $40 million guaranteed. I don't have a signing bonus off top of my head, but let's just pick a number, 25. And he got four years averaging $20 million a year. It's why I think the average per year can be a little overstated. It gets agents a lot of credit and makes players feel good. But I think Hargraves cap space or cap hit this season is like $6 million. Right?

We're in the NBA. His number would be $20 million because he's average $20 a year. Well, that's not the way these contracts work. So when it comes to the clauses, I think there are obviously a lot of injury clauses with players that have previous injuries, i.e. Jimmy Garapolo, that you base guaranteed money on.

Or, you know, there are, you know, in the NFL terms, they use the term paragraph five, because I think paragraph five is your base salary, which changes player to player. There are certain, you know, just, baselines, a veteran minimum, depending on how long you've been in. Clearly, rookie contracts are all slotted. But, you know, the Denver Bronco signed Mike McGlinchie to a whatever, $80 million contract, 50 plus guaranteed. You can fudge that throughout the books,

however you see fit. You can front load it. You can backload it. You can evenly load it throughout the course of the contract. Debo Samuel signed a, I think, 60, million dollars guaranteed was it last year i think a salary cap hit over the first two years aren't as big next year it's like 28 27 million dollars now when you see franchise tags or fifth year options those are a lot like NBA or baseball contracts now they're only one year if i pick up your fifth year option or i give you a franchise tag but if that number is 20 million dollars or 15 million dollars or 75 i guess it wouldn't be 75 quarterback 35 million dollars that's just a one season, that much money, all guaranteed.

So I think that it's complicated. It's why Florio and these guys, they get access or Pelisaro or Schaefter. You know, these guys in the league forward them the contract once it goes in the league database. It's why Florio can always, on pro football talk, break down a contract with the individual clauses. It's how, now somewhat would have seen it last year. year with the Kyler Murray video game clause, but every team in the league is going to notice that. Because any time these groundbreaking deals get set, right, the moment Nick Bose's contract, he gets signed this offseason, or Joe Burrow or Justin Herbert, all the details will leak because

everyone has access and everyone, you know, wants to talk about it because it is fascinating. sets the precedent on how you're going to do business in the league based on high-valued players. Long-time listener from Sweden, having been a season ticket holder at the London games and thus having watched the Jags in London multiple times, I have grown fond of them. See, shit is working.

Don't sleep on Roger branding worldwide. Do you believe this year they will take further strides and cement themselves as the class of the AFC South. Granted, the division is a strong candidate for worst in all football. But the Texans could make some noise, and the Titans are always competitive under Rable. All the best. This is from Christos.

I would say they are, I'm sure they are. I haven't looked at division odds. The heavy favorite to win that division. They have separated themselves at quarterback, right? Tanny Hill feels like he's going the wrong direction. The Texans have a guy who's never taken an NFL snap. And same with the Colts. And a guy that's at least CJA has played a lot of football at a high level.

Anthony Richardson is a major, major work in progress. I think this year, you just want to build on last year, right? Win the division, host another playoff team, a game, win a playoff game. You know, potentially if Trevor can take us, take a step and become in the conversation. Because I think we start talking about him like this. He's not quite there. You know, he's not a top five quarterback yet.

But he's definitely inching into the top 10 stratosphere. Does he become like, yeah, we start talking about him like the way we talked about him coming out. Because let's face it, I would say Trevor Lawrence is one of the biggest prospects in the NFL the last two decades. I'm trying to think, Andrew Locke. It feels like Andrew Luck and Trevor Lawrence were bigger prospects than Matt Stafford. They were bigger prospects than Jared Gough. They were bigger prospects than Bryce Young. They were bigger.

When I say bigger, I mean, better, more critically acclaimed, hell do higher regard around league circles, better prospect than Baker Mayfield. I'm just trying to think off top of my head some of these top quarterbacks of Sam Bradford. So yeah, I mean, I think Trevor Lawrence, the hype on it. him should be competing for Super Bowls. Now, part of that is their team needs to improve. You know, the running game, ETN is probably more of like a hybrid, closer to like a best case scenario,

Kamara type. Now, I'm not saying he's going to be as good as Alvin because Alvin became, you know, a high-end, all-pro level player. But he's going to be more that than some between-the-tackles guy. I don't think they've talked about it. You add Calvin Ridley, you know, defensively, They've drafted a lot of guys the last couple of years.

They had a number one overall pick defensive end. Can Walker take a step? You got Doug Peterson, who's a proven Super Bowl winner, who's a former quarterback, so you feel pretty good about him, the maturation of Trevor Lawrence around him, very stable human, just easy going, easy to be around, the opposite of one of the all-time flameouts in Urban Meyer. Yeah, I'd be very, very bullish on the jazz.

I think I had someone, you know, I probably lost the DM, but had DMed me that after I kind of had a take, that it feels inevitable for the Jags to go across the pond and end up in London, that Shod Khan has invested pretty heavily in Jacksonville in terms of maybe it was his practice facility. I just think if there's an opportunity and it looked like you could do to your franchise, If you could have put a couple hundred million dollars in, but if the league wants you to move and you go, God, I can double the value of my franchise, like what are the Jags worth? They're an NFL team, so they're worth a couple billion.

But you put them in London. Now, we don't know if it's going to go seamlessly or not, but if they're just in London, much bigger fan base in terms of quantity of people, you would have to imagine the franchise would be worth, let's take an educated guess. 50% more, 100% more. If it's worth 2.5 billion,

Is it worth five immediately putting in London? I'm just speaking out loud here, but that doesn't feel crazy. Call me crazy. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all,

embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the must. So, Graves. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying.

Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand-new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes,

follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Mailbag, I forget if you're married or not. But I think I want to propose to my girlfriend of six years. Three in college, three out. Any advice? I'm not married now. But we just bought a half. house, you know, congrats to me. And moving in, I mean, I already live with her, but we will,

I got a little remodel project. My friends at Angie, you know, led me to, uh, still going through that process. That's, you talk about a remodel process, taking people through. It's exhausting, especially when you have no clue what they're talking about in terms of like, they could throw any number at you. You're like, yeah, sounds good. So you see the number, you're like, holy shit, that's a little money. I have a lot of respect for you. You know, I, I, to be that serious with someone at a really young age. It was hard for me, for sure. I was not in the mindset in my 20s.

Only thing that came first was work and trying to get further along in work and relationships. You know, I didn't really get serious, serious with girls. I mean, I had a serious girlfriend in high school and college, but marriage wasn't being in my mindset coming out of colleges, work, work, work. And really, in my 30s, and really the last I had. say four or five years. I think more of that. And we all mature at different ages. So I respect someone that you meet someone that you just, if you know, I'm a big gut feel

guy. I've been like that my whole life, whether it be professionally or personally. You have a gut feel with someone you're working with, someone you're in a relationship. And when you know, you know, you know. Like so if she's the one and you know in your gut and, you know, you've been dating six years, but I would say three years in college, that means let's just pick a number. You start dating at 20 or 19. You know, so now you're what, 25, 26.

You get married early, have kids early. You know, be an empty nester by 50, you know. Be playing golf from 50 to 75 with your kids. So it could be fun. I don't necessarily have any advice of how to do it. I've just seen my friends do it. People do it on Instagram. She's the one, she's the one.

Buy a ring you can afford and just go all in and let the chips follow them. So congratulations. My advice is you have any reservations. One thing I would say is don't do it for other people's reasoning, right? You're 25, 26 years old. Times on your side. And I would imagine you're not dating someone that's like 38.

So her time clock, if she's your age, you're like, you guys got some time. My one advice would be this. If you do get married, enjoy your life for maybe a year or two. Now, maybe you guys are homebodies. You want to have children right away, and I don't fault you for doing that. Listen, I'm 38. I don't have kids yet, so by the time I have a kid, it'll be 39, 40 years old. Which I plan on being young.

I'm planning on being like Pete Carroll. 70 years old. Kids like 25. I'm just running around. You know, 70 by the time I'm 70 might be the new 55. But the one thing I would recommend, and I don't know yet the way you operate in life, I would just enjoy each other's company without children for a year or two. Maybe she's all in, wants to have children right away.

Listen, that's, I get it. But I don't think it's crazy to just have a good time for a year or two. When I say good time, I don't mean like go out all the time. I just mean, just enjoy each other. I think some people have kids and my brother had kids. His son's three, three and a half now probably. Crazyest three and a half year old I've ever met. It's a lot.

You know, it's your life, you become pretty mature or pretty fast, which is, which is important. I want multiple children. And listen, I'm not saying that you should do it my way, but I do think if you have the opportunity to just kind of hang out and just enjoy each other's company just as you two without children at 25, 26, 27 is not the craziest idea. But follow your gut. If your gut says merrier, Marrier, live happily. ever after and good luck to you guys. Okay, last question. Hope you had a great weekend.

If you had to start a franchise today and you had to go all in and you had to go on was play on the field thus far and their injury history, would you take Purdy or Lance? Thank for the great takes. I think I would take Brock Purdy and I wouldn't hesitate. And there's a lot of arguments in 49er land of like, It's not fair to Trey Lance. The NFL's not fair.

You know, one thing I base my take is on Trey Lance, good guy, everything I've heard, high character guy, tries really hard. You don't get to dictate who drafts you and whether you're overdrafted, right? It wasn't Solomon Thomas's or Cleland Furrell fault that they weren't good enough to be, you know, worthy of the third or fourth pick. They were drafted there. And especially Cleland, should have been like a third. second round pick.

Turns out Solomon Thomas, I'm not trying to act like I'm some genius scout here now that I just podcast for a living. But if you watched him, it was clear, tween her body, couldn't bend, not super powerful, plays hard.

Number three overall pick was insane. And both guys are going to have longer careers. They're going to play for seven to ten years. But where they were drafted, like that was the team doing that, not them. And Trey Lance, this COVID year didn't play

not a huge recruit no one in the Power 5 wanted him to play quarterback goes to a program that is like Alabama meets Ohio State meets Clemson of D1AA they beat the shit out of everybody he played well but it didn't translate to the NFL right like one thing that he did in college

if you go back and just watch his North Dakota State highlights his one year as a full-time starter they won the national championship he ran a lot Well, running away from a dude that plays for South Dakota State or Weaver State or Montana State is clearly not the same of running away from NFL players. His running does not translate. Kyler Murray, Justin Fields, Lamar Jackson, Anthony Richardson, like those guys, their athletic ability immediately translated.

And they were confident it did. Why? Because they had played the best players in college that they were going to see immediately in the NFL. Trey's athleticism doesn't translate as a runner. And his passing, he's just not naturally accurate. Brock Purdy, sneaky, more athletic than you think, is very comfortable avoiding people. Now, he's not a runner,

but his athleticism shows because he's very instinctive playing the position. And then when you play for the 49ers, they're not looking for Patrick Mahomes. They have Debo Samuel, who catches a lot of his balls behind the line of scrimmage or within 10 yards in the line of scrimmage.

Brandon Iyuk, within 15 yards of the line of scrimmage, George Kittle, tight end. Christian McCaffrey and the running backs. their play caller is a run first 43-year-old, you know? So I think Brock's is a much better player. Now, in theory, could tray pass them in years to come. Not right, not currently, but over a five-year span.

Sure, 49ers don't have that leeway anymore. This guy's going into his third year after the season. You've got to pick up his fifth-year option. And they've admitted, like, he's no longer the starter. He's currently competing to be the backup. was a story today, my guy Matt Mayoko. They expect Brock Purdy to be cleared by the middle of training camp. Now, still a lot to be determined, how his elbow reacts.

We got a long way to go till then. But Trey Lance is competing to be the back. Zach Wilson is a backup quarterback. And whether it was Aaron Rogers or whether it was Derek Carr, Zach Wilson was not going to be the starter for the New York Jets. Like that ended. And I've been saying this for a while, because of the amount of money in the NFL,

10, 15, 20 years ago, you made less as a high pick. Well, I guess technically some of those guys made a lot, right? The San Bradford's the Domiconsuze. But when I drafted you high, you were on scholarship for several years. Those days are done. Teams just don't have time.

Coaches will get fired. I got to pivot. There's so much pressure in the league that like 15 years ago, Trey Lance is getting another year to figure it out. They just don't have time now. And last year, the team, team like kind of was clamoring for Jimmy Garoppel to come back.

When Trey got hurt and Jimmy won that game, week two, they basically threw him a party on the field. It was crazy. And the 49ers players, a lot of defensive players, they're not into figuring out on the fly here with Trey Lance. Like those days are over. They tried it. Was it a miss pick?

It sure looks like that. Now, here's the other thing. If you are going to miss on pick, on picks, which is inevitable, you've got to be able to pivot fast. Howie Roseman, missed on Jalen Rager, pivot fast. The 49ers.

If they thought the 49ers told you everything you need to know about when they signed Sam Donald. If they still believe that Trey Lance could be really good,

they would have just basically named him the backup slash he's going to start early on we're going to ease party back in. They're not saying that. Why? Because Kyle doesn't trust

him as a player. And the thing in pro football, and this gets back to sell him Thomas and Trey Lance, you can be a great guy. The coaches, the executives can really like you. Like, we talk a lot about questionable character guys. We don't talk enough about really good character guys that just aren't good enough.

Because the bottom line in this business, like, you got to be able to play. And at certain positions, quarterback, pass rush or offensive tackle, you got to be really good. Or you just get replaced. Whether it's Wally Pipped or you just get benched. And I think what turns out is the 49ers. made an aggressive move that, you know, was, happened because Jimmy Garoppolo had been injured the previous year. They also traded up from, you should never do this.

If you're going to trade up from 12, to me, you've got to get either to one or two. They traded up to three. Like, looking back, I think they'd like a redo on that. They could have just taken, I don't know, Michael Parsons, you know, taking someone else. I think they would definitely like a redo on that one. But you don't get redos in the draft. You get who you pick, and they pick Trey Lance.

They got very, very lucky. No, I'm not acting like Brock Purdy is just going to be some 10-year starter. But he is definitely better in Trey Lance right now, definitely better in Trey Lance heading into the season, assuming he's healthy. And I think that the 49ers are living in the present. And because of the way contracts work, I don't think you have really some long.

Trey Lance needs reps. He needs to play. Well, how does he get to play? This team doesn't have the runway of last year, Justin Fields, whether the Bears won or lost, reps, reps, reps, reps. That's all that matters, right? This year, C.J. Stroud, Anthony Richardson, reps, reps, reps, Bryce. Bryce Young.

49ers are trying to win the Super Bowl. So if you can't complete basic outroutes or comebacks or Kyle feel comfortable about play calling with, you as a passer, you're just not going to play. So that's probably a long-winded way of saying Brock Purdy. Appreciate everyone listening. Thanks to my guy hosts on the audio. My guy James on the video. And appreciate all you guys for making this podcast possible. Talk soon. Volume. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you

funnier. week my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

On the Look Back at it podcast. 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 is big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make a little. make sense of how we survived it with our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s.

84 was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.