The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 and Out - Defending Aaron, Post-Zeke Jerry, Bad McDaniels Vibez, Jalen Carter Draft Floor

Episode Date: March 17, 2023

John defends Aaron Rodgers for wanting to move on from dealing with the ownerless Packers, and looks at the compensation holding up the deal. He also discusses if Jerry Jones is capable of learning his lesson from the albatross Zeke Elliott contract, why Josh McDaniels’ tenure feels like more of the same old Raiders dysfunction, how far Georgia DE Jalen Carter will drop as red flags continue to mount,  He also answers listener questions in the Middlekauff Mailbag. Subscribe NOW and follow Middlekauff and The Volume on Twitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest content. It's always FanDuel for the best wagering action! #volume #herdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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I thought about walking across the street, grabbing maybe a six-pack, slamming a couple, and then podcasting. But I said, you know what? I'll just grab a Gatorade, get my mentals right, and let's talk Aaron Rogers. Because obviously that's what we're going to do is we're going to talk some Aaron Rogers with Mac, A couple other things around the league. Zeke, Waller, Chiefs, Jalen Carter having a rough go at it. But I'm here.

I'm ready to roll. Hopefully everyone's had a good week. Rogers, man. It just won't end. It's the gift that keeps on giving. So we will talk all things football. What I will do is have a mailbag at John Middlecough is the Instagram.

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firing those DMs if you got golf questions. And yeah, anything else? We got March Madness. I bet on Arizona. They obviously lost immediately, so that was 200. I might as well have just lit on fire. But yeah, we don't need to talk about that. Let's talk about happier times and football.

Before we dive in to all things, Aaron Rogers, as well as some other stories around the National Football League, I want to tell you about my friends at Game Time. Go to your smartphone. I know you have one. We all have one. And download the GameTime app. And when you do, download the GameTime app. Type in the promo code, John, J-O-H-H-N after signing up.

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Hey, let's dive in to Aaron Rogers. I guess I'm not proud, though I'm entertained by McAfee and A.J. Hawk, and I watched the entire hour of Aaron Rogers' life. I couldn't turn it off, even though it kind of ebbed and flowed and it's entertainment. I did enjoy McAfee, which clearly looks pretty stoned, but you kind of got to be if you're going to go an hour with Aaron Rogers. And I wanted to start with this before I'm going to defend Aaron and I'm going to be critical of Aaron. I picked the two angles, which I think are fair on both sides.

But overall, like I think we make somewhat too big of a deal when, obviously, star players drive pro sports. When I was a kid, it was Michael Jordan, Cal Ripkin, Ken Griffey, Jr. through Tom Brady and Peyton Manning and LeBron and Curry and Derek Jeter's. And we all know. You're not building pro sports off the backs of the working class guy, right? You know, the middle infielder or the offensive guard or the seventh man. You are as strong as your stars. And in football, it's the quarterback. And it really always has been the quarterback. They make more money than anyone my entire life. Welcome to the business. Now, I would say this. It's going to be weird when he inevitably, as of recording this, has not been traded yet, plays for the Jets. But like, welcome to the game. Welcome to pro sports.

When I was a kid, like there was always this story that, you know, if you were born anytime after like the 60s, you wouldn't even understand it. But Willie Mays played for. for the Mets. And then once you kind of live through it, you see Tom Brady play for the Bucks, Peyton Manning, play for the Denver Broncos. Hell, when I was really young, Joe Montana ended up playing for the Kansas City Chiefs, it's part of the business. One thing that I actually think is more relatable now in 2023, that it definitely was 30 years ago. Like my mom had the same job for 30 years. I can't tell you how many family friends I had when I was a kid, like through either my parents or my friend's parents that had the same job for decades. I don't have one friend who

hasn't had minimum like three jobs by the time they were 35. Most people in my generation, millennials, bounce around gigs. So society has changed in terms of the way it's actually much more relatable to sports. How many people listening to this right now, if you're around my age, 38, whether you're a little younger, a little older, have held several jobs in your life. And I'm not talking like in high school and college while we're construction one summer, then I interned for Morgan Stanley. I'm talking professionally, earning a salary with benefits, having a real job. Most people I know have bounced around, which is kind of the culture we are in right now. It's also more access with LinkedIn. Times have changed. But forever,

pro sports and athletes, kind of like coaches have always bounced around. And most people couldn't really relate to that. I actually feel it's much more relatable now. Hell, people like me, not in a million years would have left California, the majority of my life. Now, I can't tell you how many people I know that kind of paralleled me left for financial reasons, for opportunities, for whatever, for job, you name it. People just are more inclined to make changes now professionally. It's like I can't tell you how many people I know in California that have sent their kids.

Like I know several people whose kids to go to the SEC. When I was a kid coming out like in high school in 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, I knew one person who left the state of California really for college, not counting like Oregon or Arizona. I'm talking like headed east. And it was a guy that went to Virginia Tech because he got an engineering scholarship. it was a no-brainer. But most people went to schools in California, whether it was the elite schools or the state schools. You just stay locally. That's not the case anymore. So Aaron Rodger is going to end up on another team.

Like, yeah, it's been happening since the history of sports. Football, basketball, baseball, like Michael Jordan played for the Wizards. So Aaron Rogers, it was inevitable that he was not going to end his career on the Packers. Hell, Brett Far, now granted, one thing Aaron told McAfee is like, I'm the best player in the history of the franchise. And I said, yeah, he's right. Like, he's a. better player than Brett Farf. Now, is he more important to the franchise than Brett Farf? We could argue that. But like, once you get old, Tom Brady was told by Bill Belichick in not so many words. Like, we don't want you anymore. Peyton Manning was cut. Joe Montana, who had won four fucking Super Bowls, never lost in the Super Bowl, was told, we're going with Steve. Adios, buddy.

So I think, listen, it's an awesome story because he's one of the most. famous players of the last several decades. He is right there with the Brady, Montana, Peyton Manning. You know, he's in that world. You know, I don't know whether he ranks fourth or whether he ranks seventh, but he's in the conversation. I personally would have, obviously, Tom and Joe above him, but I would have Peyton Manning above Aaron Rogers,

but I would probably have Aaron Rogers right behind Peyton Manning. So the Elway, Marino, Peyton Manning, Aaron Rogers, like, they're all in the same world. So anytime you get a player of this level of this fame and hell, he just won recently two back-to-back MVP's and probably at a stretch right there with Mahomes and Brady is the best player in the league in his late 30s. So I understand that the polarization with them, why it's such a big story, but it's always inevitable. Most guys do not finish their career on one team. And whether it's a small market team like the Packers or whether it's, you know, the New York Giants or the San Francisco.

Go 49ers. Most guys play another snap on another team. Sometimes that doesn't happen, but for the most part, he is just following in the line of all the elite players. Okay, I'm going to defend Aaron Rogers. Clearly, if you watch the interview, and I think Packer fans would understand this, if you don't quite know, the Packers, obviously they don't have an owner, but they have a team president, who basically operates and acts like he's the pseudo owner. And I've said this before. on this podcast. I have a hard time, like, if you're the best employee in your business, if you don't take your manager seriously, if he's not the owner of your company. Right. Like, whoever sign, if you're listening to this, whoever signs your check,

whether you work for a smaller mom and pop shop and you directly know the owner, or whether you work for a big corporation, a big conglomerate, and it's paid for like an, like an Oracle, an Apple or whatever. You work for someone. who has nothing to do with your check beside like you have to answer to them but the money you're generating like he is not the grand poo ball in terms of the cash flow it's not his money so i understand like tom brady for example remember a couple years ago i guess it would have been last year when it was clear he was going to come out of retirement where he was spotted with the son overseas i think it's man city or manchester united that is owned

by the Glazer family, which Tom Brady has talked about, like having a lot of respect for. Why? They're richer than him. On the hierarchy of power in society, they're above him. And you saw the same thing with Tom Brady when he was with the Patriots with Robert Kraft. And one thing Aaron Rogers gets mad at is clearly, I don't think he respects Mark Murphy, the president, and he doesn't love the way they handle players, which makes sense, right? I've seen it with the 49ers. They take a lot of pride. when a guy is cut or moved on about keeping the door open. Jed York wants to be friends with them long term. I saw it when I worked in Philly with Jeffrey Lurie. You see it with a lot of

organizations, but Tom Brady specifically with Robert Kraft. He did not want him to leave on bad terms with him. This is between you and Bill, but you and the standing in the organization will never change. That doesn't exist with the Green Bay Packers. Because ultimately Murphy, why does he give a shit? The Packers are not his. When Aaron Rogers makes $40, $50 million a year, it's not his money. He answers to, I don't exactly understand the hierarchy, the board of directors. Now, he's a well-paid middle manager. So when Murphy last week goes on, you know, Packer.com or the local television and basically says, it's over. He's kind of acting like he's fucking Robert Kraft, Jerry Jones, or Amara. And he's just simply not. So I understand Aaron Rogers

looking at him like, we are not equals. You don't not only sign my check. I don't work for you. Yet the way the Packers is set up, Goudicin's answers to that guy. So this is never going to change. And I've said it before, like, the Packers, I think, listen, it hasn't, you know, inhibited their ability to win.

Now, part of that is they've averaged 10 plus wins for 30 years because of Brett Farr and Aaron Rogers. And they've done a good job of hiring coaches and hiring general managers. But clearly there's a disconnect when guys get cut. And Aaron Rogers has fought for this for a couple of years because they're not a normal setup. There isn't an owner in the building who takes a lot of pride in those players wanting to open the doors when they come back.

Most organizations you go to want those guys to be welcome when they come back. It's a big deal. It's like the NFL's version of alumni with college sports. And if you're a good player for a team, you always want the door to be open. That's a huge part of your identity. It's huge part as you get older of continuing to make money. And it's fair to say that the Packers lack that. But I understand.

I only worked in corporate America for a couple years when I worked in radio. And I worked for a middle manager guy, my last year there, that is the most incompetent dumbest guy I've ever been around. If you've ever seen the Howard Stern movie, I think he called him pig vomit. You know, the guy, we used to call him, if you've ever seen the Seinfeld episode, when they're sitting by the guy in the plane, and the dude can barely form sentences,

and Elaine's making fun of him, calls him vegetable lasagna. We used to have these names. names for him. And it was like, this guy was in somewhat control of my employment, yet he was such a peon in the grand scheme of things. And I had no respect for him. And it was very hard to operate. And it was the best thing that ever happened to me when I never really left. But like I can. And I think most people listening to this, like, you could have a disagreement if you work for whoever owns the business. But really at the end of the day, you have to respect like they own the thing. This is their money. And whether they're paying you 50 grand or 50.

$50 million, it's their cash. So there's always a level of respect there. It's no different than you with your parents or a real teacher and a substitute teacher, right? A real parent and maybe a step parent. There is just a level of respect when it's not there that like when you are so good. And that's where Aaron is on the hierarchy of talent. It doesn't get any higher.

So I do understand with him looking at the organization and just struggling with it sometimes. when he knows that a huge part for the last decade plus of ass kicking and taking names has been because of him. Now, we can argue his personality and how bought it in he's been the last several years and all the different variables and we'll get into that in a second. But I do defend him in his disdain for Murphy, who again, acts like an owner and does not own the team. And two, like, have they done the greatest job of over his career handling some pretty

legendary veteran players who have helped them win a lot of games, I think he's on to something there because he has friends on other teams whose owners, whether it's any team that has an owner, they take a lot of pride if you play for my team for seven, eight, nine years and we're consistently good on, you're always a part of this. Now, the business, inevitably we're going to break up, right? But that doesn't mean that we can't come back together. Richard Sherman had a bad breakup with Pete Carroll and John Schneider. He went to the rival team, the 49ers. Yet this year when they played Russell Wilson, who was right there?

Game one. Richard Sherman. So it's a big deal to organizations that clearly the Packers, in Aaron's eyes, are hit or miss. And I do think he's coming from that in a pretty genuine spot. Now, if we wanted to be critical of Aaron Rogers during this whole situation, is one, when you threaten to retire, like, that gets old and that gets old fast. It's one thing when Tom Brady's like, I don't know if I have anything left.

He's like 44, 45 years old. You know, I don't know if I can keep doing this. I don't know if the passion statement. Like, that's understandable. But when you're like the peak of your powers, winning MVP, you're like, yeah, I got to think about this. Like, that gets exhausting. And that gets exhausting fast. And the number one thing, like, I hate exhausting people in my life.

It's why I think me and Colin have such a good relationship. I, professionally, I don't bug them like, we'll bullshit about sports stuff. But when it comes to business wise, any complaints, like, like, well, there's none of that. Like we do we don't do that. I hate that. He hates it. And our professional relationship is awesome because of it. I think we're a match made in heaven. It's like I don't I see it with my girlfriend. I see it with some of my other friends. They can have very like emotional, emotional draining people in their life. You're emotionally draining on me. I'm moving on. I don't have the energy. I'm not good with it. Maybe that's a character flaw. But like Aaron's pretty emotionally needy. Now he's been so good at his job. I do understand it. Now, part of the. of his job and when you're the quarterback, the offseason matters, right? Especially when you transition to players. So this year, when they transition to younger players and got rid of DeVante, like, I understand the Packers like, Aaron, we'd like you here working with these guys. We're trying to get over the hump in the playoffs, and we need your participation. You don't

have a 12-month-a-year job. You get six months off, even if you come here for three or four weeks. the job, I think sometimes players act like, you know, just need some time off. You get a fucking shitload of time off. You know, most people, even people in making big money, whether you work on Wall Street, run banks that aren't going under, whatever, run restaurants. Most people don't just like, yeah, just work six months a year.

Like, hell, the coaches, you know where Andy Reid, Belichick and Sean Payton were today in the office, you know? So it's like most jobs, you don't get this huge period off. And he's always complaining about that. He didn't play that well this year. Like part of it like anytime you're an older player, like part of the reason Joe Montana got traded, he had injuries, his back.

Like they didn't think he could say healthy. Why'd Peyton Manning get cut? They had the opportunity to take Andrew Luck, but they thought his back was fucked. Right? Peyton Man, or I mean, Tom Brady, Belichick basically shorted his age. He's like, I know you're still playing well, kind of, even though he's coming off a rough season.

You're 41, 42 years old. I'm going to short you as a stock. Now he was wrong. But like as you get older or as you get injured, sometimes people move on. Average season, 39 years old. I don't actually think it's that crazy logically to move on from Aaron Rogers. You know, the two most famous coaches of the last 40 years are Bill Walsh and Bill Belichick. And the thing that they get so much credit on, you know, I think people in like normal businesses, you know, I would say admire about them is their ability to be early, not late in terms of getting.

getting rid of players and not being stuck with albatross contracts, famous players who aren't good anymore, players who once, you know, their name carried premium salaries, but then their play no longer and they're always able to pivot. So you could argue that they could have just sold last year instead of giving them this contract.

And I think they probably should have. I think every, all parties regret that. But $150 million. He just won another MVP. I understand it. But I don't think it's that weird to get rid of a 39-year-old player who maybe you're like, okay, now officially the arrow is pointing down.

Now, in 2023, you never know. It's hard to put an age on a quarterback and say he's going to suck, right? Like I would have said when they drafted Jordan Love, which is clearly something that Aaron never forgot, which I understand. I don't care what you do for a job. If I bring in someone specifically to replace you, that would bother you. I understand it's part of the business, but with quarterbacks is a little different. I can be a Star D. Lyman.

I can be Nick Bosa, and the Niners could draft. Every player in the draft could be a defensive lineman. I know I'm fine. But with a quarterback, when you take a quarterback really high, it was pretty clear what they were doing. And let's face it, kind of backfired. Because if they would have traded up and got Justin Jefferson or Brandon Ayuk or drafted T. Higgins, they would have been better off.

And maybe they would have got over the hump one time in those three years when Aaron Rogers was playing pretty well. But ultimately with this situation, like I do understand the Packers. Old player, kind of a pain in the ass, can be a little exhausting when he's awesome, whatever, but if he's not going to be awesome, see you later. And I understand Aaron Rogers going, Murphy, this isn't your money, this isn't your team, and you walk around here acting like you're more important than me. And we all know you're not. And then in terms of the compensation, I think it's somewhat complicated because the Packers, I know. You know you're moving on. You're over it. But you have an asset that you don't just want to give up for nothing, especially when you factor in. He's a quarterback. But I do think you can look at it like this. You once got this guy, whatever, picked 24 back in 2005. He immediately became a first vowed Hall of Famer and in the argument for a top five quarterback of all time. Probably I think most people would probably put him somewhere like six to eight. But that's what you got out of it for 15 years. So you're return on investment. You have got, you didn't get a 10xer. You

got a hundred extra. It doesn't get any better as a draft pick in the 20s than Aaron Rogers. That's as good as it gets. So his contract makes it pretty complicated. He's kind of complicated. If ultimately you capitulate and give him for a second round because you just want to pivot, even though if you were listening to this, you're a dire fan, you know the thing with the bonus. They can give it any time up until September. Separate from that, like if you just want to move on and just start the offseason and just end this conversation, I don't think it's that. big a deal. And if you're the Jets, if you, like, I understand not wanting to give a first round pick, which is for you this year, pick 13. Because you go, this guy, he just told Pat McAfee

two weeks ago that he went in the, the, the, uh, darkness retreat, 90, 10, I'm going to retire. So this is a guy who's not only talked about retirement now for a couple of years, just said he was 90% going to retire this year. Now, we talked to him. We got a face to face. Maybe he told us, but he sure doesn't sound like he didn't even commit to them that when they left his house, he's like, just give me a week, let me see how I feel. So it's not like, hey, guys, you trade for me, minimum you got two years. The commitment is still kind of loosey-goosey. So if I'm going to invest a premium pick and a lot of money into a guy,

I really don't get commitment on the other side. It's great for Aaron Rogers. He gets to go one year, goes well, keep playing. If it doesn't see you later. Well, if I'm the Jets, I got to give up pick 13 for a guy that I'm getting off your hands, who you want to get rid of anyway and pivot to this other quarterback, which is your prerogative. Obviously, he is an all-time great player and immediately gives me a chance to compete in the playoffs. But there's no long-term commitment here.

So when I trade a first-round pick for Tyree Kill or Devante Adams or two first-round picks back in the day for Jalen Ramsey or Kille Mack, they're going to be on my team for a while. Now, obviously, they're a risk. They could get injured. They could not be as good. But still, I know for a long period of time, I'm getting a guy that's going to be able to play. I could get 17 games at Aaron Rogers.

And because the AFC's tough, we missed the playoffs. He just quits. I just gave you pick 13. I could also argue like, listen, man, if you win a couple of playoff games and get to the AFC championship game, the pressure on Aaron to, like, is he really going to retire off that? Would that alone be worth it? Probably.

Is there a point in time where you're just like, I just want to get this guy? Now, I would have some demands. Like, listen, Aaron, we're just going to pull this trigger. You're going to be here during OTAs. We want you working with these players. We don't need three months in the offseason, but can you get us like one month of just, which are really three days a week?

It's like Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. We also act, this is a Monday through Friday job. This is three days a week. And you're in the office for like six, seven hours. You can hang out in New York. You can take your private jet to wherever you want to go, fly across. Do whatever you want. Head to Jupiter, Florida, in the weekend.

But can we just get some of your time? Like, there has to be some give and take here. It's why when Tampa signed Tom, it was so easy. You knew you were getting everything. You knew he didn't want to stop playing football. You knew even during the vid and we had the dumbest fucking rules that have aged so poorly, he said, come over to my house, trained with the guys. They had helicopters chasing him.

The league was trying to find him. That you got everything he had from Tom. When the Broncos signed Peyton Man, they got everything he had. And that would make me nervous if I'm the Jets giving that pick 13. that ultimately feels like they end up capitulating to. But listen, this is a complicated situation, just like Aaron is a complicated individual. And if he plays like an MVP, none of it matters.

Simply, none of it matters. You'll win 12 to 14 games and you'll compete for Super Bowl. But if he plays like he did last year and you're the Jets and things don't go well, and you go 8 and 9 and you just gave pick 13 and then he's like, screw it, I'm out. You're like, God, that wasn't quite worth it. So I don't have a great feel for how this is going to go. Obviously, the Jets have nothing to lose in the sense of like, what are there other options?

This is a no-brainer for me. But I do see the complications on their end about just getting in the Aaron Rogers business. What is going to cost me and how long I get a, you know, feel good about the guy being in my organization. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all,

embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. Yep, that's me.

Clipper Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skis. gets, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even mute. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. The Midway Point of the NBA season is here, and now is the perfect time to download, Fandul, or America's number one sportsbook. Because new customers get a no-swet first bet up to $1,000.

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Call 1-800 gamble. Hope is here. Gambling helpline.m.m.org or call 800-327-50-50 for 24-7 support. M-A. Call 1-8-7-8, Hope N-Y, or text, Hope N-Y, 467-367-369 NY. Fandua is offering online sports wagering in Kansas under an agreement with the Kansas Star Casino LLC. Cull 8-Hunter gambler or visit fanduel.com slash RG, Colorado, Iowa, Michigan, New Jersey, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Illinois, Tennessee, Virginia. 100 next step or text next step to 53342 Arizona 1888 78977 or visit ccpg.org slash chat

Connecticut, 1-8009 with it Indiana. 1-800 522 470470 or visit KSgamblinghelp.com, Kansas, 1877770. Stop Louisiana, visit wwww-WW.Mdgamblinghelp. dot org, Maryland, 1-800, 522, 4700, Wyoming, or visit www. www.1-800 gambler.net, West Virginia. A couple other quick things. Contracts really matter, right? We learn that with Jerry Jones, who, I think, listen,

he is a fantastic personality for the league, for a guy that hasn't been to an NFC championship game in two and a half decades. His mark on the league is, undeniable. And his personality, love them or hate him, everyone's got an opinion on him. And the ultimate reality with football is the way they make money. It's a big television show. It's basically, you know, it's not scripted, but it's reality television. And Jerry is a key character. Now, one downfall he has, because they actually have drafted pretty well over the last seven,

eight years. They have drafted a ton of good players. Is that he gets very emotionally, like, there's a balance of drafting good players and then being unemotional when you have to make decisions on their contract. I loved Ezekiel Elliott. In college, I loved him early on in his career. How could you not? He was a dominant player. He could run inside. He could run outside. He could pass block. He could catch. He was a load. He was great in short yardage. He could bust long runs. He was a beast. But the thing with running backs, you should never be in a rush to pay them. And when you draft a guy fourth overall, that means he got paid a lot of money. He was, highly paid player the moment you draft him. And you have the fifth year option as a reason.

Now, I understand that he kind of created, remember, he went to Cancun or whatever, but they paid him. I was looking at it this year. They paid him after his third year. So he's drafted in 16. He got paid going into 19. And obviously he's never been the same. He got a $50 million guaranteed contract. That's where Jerry kind of has to play hardball. And I read some of the quotes that Jerry had when he paid him. It was about, you know, Emmett Smith, played in the league for 13 years. He was on our team forever. That is what Zeke's going to be.

That's not usually the way it works. And most general managers who are unemotional would have been like, Zeke, you got to do this again. And then we'll pay you after your fourth year. When most first rounders get paid, you should never pay a non-quarterback after their third year. It's a first round pick, obviously with guys drafting the second through seventh round.

But we've seen it. We taught with Todd Gurley. And it had devastating consequences. And same thing with Zeke, because you never know. You can't quantify, you know, when the tread on the tire is going to go. And the guy's going to lack explosion and not be a good player. But it came pretty immediately with Zique.

And it was a pretty devastating contract for the Cowboys, that they are still going to have dead cap space on the books this year. And I think one thing that these players do, at least with Dak, who I'm hard on the contract, you know, whether you're paying him $28 million or $40 million, his value as a a functional top 12-ish starter. He has moments where he's the fifth guy and he has moments where he's the 14th guy and probably averages out somewhere like 9 to 11. It's fine.

And you're still going to win a lot of games because he's the quarterback. When you're running back is like a bottom 15 running back as a starter in the league and you're paying, you paid him $50 million guaranteed. It's a devastating contract. And I just think Jerry, these agents and these players play to his loyalty. Because like I said, what the Packers are missing, that owner, who wants to take pride in the guys. You can argue Jerry takes too much pride in the guys,

whether it's Des, you know, whether it's Zeke, whether it's Dac, it's like he's too close to the sun. And like Amari, it was much easier for him to be unemotional about Amari. Like he signed him because he was good.

And then he traded him. But when he drafts you, you know, you see it with the offensive linemen, you see it with the defensive lineman. He loves you. And he takes a lot of pride in you. And I think some of these players play to that.

And sometimes it works. And sometimes it has devastating, devastating ramifications. Josh McDaniels. What I don't understand about Josh McDaniels is he's got this McVeigh quality, except he doesn't win. And same thing with Gruden, is he turns on players so fast.

Last year, Darren Waller, ultimately he's not the general manager, but the general manager works for Josh McDaniels. He's the boss. And they gave him $22 million guaranteed. They gave him a $3 million or $50 million contract. Now, Darren Waller, when you pull up his stat sheet, was, and listen, I've watched a lot of Darren because I watch a lot of Raiders.

When he was humming, he was awesome. It was like him, Kittle and Kelsey. And he was, you know, Kittles is the total package. Kelsey's the best receiver. And Waller is like, what the hell is Waller? The 6-6 guy that can run like the wind, unreal in the red zone can just, who's covering this guy? But when you look at a statute, he hasn't really done much the last couple years.

But even two years ago, like, it had started trending. down yet they still paid him. And then a year later, they like, yeah, we don't really want this guy. I just think there's not really a method to his madness when it comes to Josh McDaniels. Like, you have to be able to coach and figure out guys that aren't just your guys, right, or someone that you have a connection with. What do they immediately do? Last year, they signed Chandler Jones. This year, they bring in Jimmy Garapolo. They bring in Jacoby Myers. Like, you got to figure out. And listen, I'm not acting like, I will. to give Darren Waller that contract.

It's like, bro, you got to prove you're a really good player again and fit in our system, and then we'll figure it out, right? You haven't done enough. Like, ultimately, Devante, you break him off because he's been the best or the top two or three wide receiver for years. You don't even think twice. When it comes to a guy that you haven't coached and who's coming off a bad year, it's like, what's the rush?

Well, why are you letting him blow you around? And then he does, and then all of a sudden a year later, you trade him. So it's just, it's been very, very rocky. It's been very, very weird. you know, a lot like when John Gruden got to the Raiders. It's just dysfunctional. That's what it feels like. Disfunctional.

And it's hard. Like there's a difference between dysfunctional and just being like, to me, Denver doesn't feel dysfunctional. It just feels like a coach run organization. Paying McGlenty 50 million. Like, Sean, he's not a $30 million player. But I know when it comes to the season, he's going to coach him hard. He's going to have him operating on a high level.

Now, is that going to result in 10 wins? I don't know. But he will do everything in his power as a head coach to make. them successful. I don't even know if Josh McDaniels knows what he's doing as a head coach. Obviously a good coordinator when he has Tom Brady. But when he gets out on his own and he's in charge of signing guys, on utilizing guys, on working with different personalities, I think a lot of people think he's weird, you know, and players struggle to relate to him. It's one thing when you got Belichick in the building and everyone kind of has to fall in line, right? Like you walk into the

Marine barracks. Like, everyone's at attention when, you know, the head honcho walks in. I don't know, the hierarchy, sergeant, whatever, the lead of the Navy SEALs. Like, everyone gets up, stands straight. It's like that with Belichick. It'll be like that with Sean Payton. I wonder if people start going like, wait, this guy? And it's just, you know, I saw Darius Slay tweet out, like, I tried to tell you guys. And he was talking about Matt Patricia. But Matt Patricia, Josh McDaniels, they struggle with the human dynamics of these guys. You've got to be relate to the players, whether it's your center, whether it's your safety, whether it's your tight end. They all come from different backgrounds too. And it just feels like Josh, something's just off. I can't put my finger

on it. Didn't get a wrong car, didn't get along with Darren Waller. It's like, who do you get along with? Like, Jimmy Garoppel? Why? Because he was just once a Patriot? You sure that's going to work? Like Kyle, he didn't always text Kyle Shanahan back. He's going to text, you back? What if he doesn't? Jimmy Garoppos will already work like $140 million. He's not trying to prove anything anymore. He's rich. He's richer than you. I think this Raider thing, man, is off to a very, very rocky start. One thing I find pretty fascinating is the Chiefs. Like, they're a good example of not getting that emotionally tied. And I think I heard Coward and Breer talking about it today of like, you know, the Chiefs are kind of

the new Patriots where they don't get emotionally tied to guys that they'll, you know, utilize guys coming off average seasons, help them resurrect their career. They'll take chances on guys like they did when they traded for Orlando Brown. But they never gave Orlando Brown some huge contract, right? They played it out two years ago. They franchised them this year. They didn't resign them. They said hit the open market.

And honestly, he didn't get that much money from the Bengals. Now, he's going to play left tackle, right tackle. He can do it both. And they went out and signed Juan Taylor, who was a right tackle really in college and then the pros who they think they can move to left tackle. But if it doesn't work, which is kind of risky. But he's a much better athlete than Orlando Brown. And if it doesn't, you can always bump him to right tackle.

And hell, they could draft a left tackle in this draft. They could trade up. You know, I still think that they'll sniff around Laramie Tunzel. We'll see. But like, part of being good with contracts and in free agency is being unemotional. And being able to say, like, listen, this guy's a solid player. We can win a Super Bowl with them. but we're not going to go to that price point.

And Belichick for 20 years and the Patriots for 20 years were the best at that. You'd be like, God, you guys just won 14 games. You won the Super Bowl and you're going to let this guy walk. It's like, yeah, we think we got the most out of them. Or we know something that you don't. And it kind of feels like the chiefs are doing that now. And that's how you sustain.

Because the only way to not sustain when you're good is to pay for average, right? Is to give guys like Mike McGlinchie $50 million. Like, that's just you can't win with those type of con. It's not going to work. But the chiefs have figured out a way to not really do that and be unemotional with their decisions. Now, is every one of them going to work? Of course not.

Like, can Taylor just bump over to left tackle? Maybe not. They might eventually have to move them back to right tackle, but they wouldn't be stuck. It's not like, well, you screwed up. No, we could always change his position back to the one that he's most comfortable with if he's unable to be comfortable with it. So the chief's got to be looking at like, the Raiders are in shambles.

The Denver Broncos spent so much money on average. And like our dynasty is about to really start humming. We're just getting started. You see how many young random guys we just won the Super Bowl with? Can you name majority of the guys in our secondary? Do you know how young some of our linebackers are? Do you know how young some of our offensive skill guys are that barely just learned how to play in the NFL?

you know how good our quarterback is? How good our coaches? If I'm a Chiefs fan right now, I'm licking my lips. Like, we're about to go on at Golden State Warriors, New York Yankees in the late 90s, like, this is our league. Okay, a couple other quick things around the league. Jalen Carter, that many consider the number one player in this draft from a talent standpoint, and I would agree,

is not having a good off-season. He won't receive jail time. for the reckless driving situation that led to the loss of life for a girl in recruiting and a teammate. But he pleaded no contest. And also at a pro day where he showed up out of shape. Listen, there are two reasons guys quote unquote fall. One, media overhypes them. And in the eyes of the NFL, they're not falling.

They went where they should. and then there are the guys that have off-field question marks and it's impossible to quantify yet you still know they are really good Warren Sapp, Randy Moss are two examples of everyone understood how good those players were but they fell because of off-the-field concerns

I'd say one of the craziest drops was Laramie Tunzel based on a picture that hell I smoked some weed a few times in my day even that one I thought was like, what the hell is this? Never seen anything quite like that. So ended up falling, I think, to 12.

Was that 12 to the dolphins? And people fall for character concerns because I can't trust you or I'm unsure or I just don't know. I feel uneasy. No one in the NFL disputes how talented Jalen Carter is. And there are not many guards and centers in the NFL that can block the guy right now.

But when you don't trust the person, it'd be very, very difficult for me to draft them really high if there are other players available. If there are other players available who I think can be pro bowl level guys and are high character guys, I would take them over Jalen Carter. Now, that never guarantees anything because there's no such thing as a high floor. That's easy for us to say it doesn't actually exist because a lot of high floor players suck. So Jalen Carter is a high-ceiling guy who's already good. But gosh, darn it, he makes me nervous off the field. And I know for a fact, he makes everyone nervous off the field. I think it's fair to say that this guy is a potential drop like a rock.

And to me, when you are legit number one overall talent, to me, if you go in the teens, that would be pretty crazy. But I think it's all on the table. I really do. He could still go 5, 6, 7. You know, I think it's pretty clear he's not going to go in the top three or four because of the quarterbacks. But I think you're looking at a guy who's going to fall because of off the field concerns. Not on the field concerns, off the field.

The Eagles, they've re-signed a lot of their dudes. You know, they're getting the band back together. As of right now, it feels like Daria Sleys going to come back, like you never left. James Bradbury resigned. They re-signed Brandon Graham, and they re-signed. Fletcher Cox. Now, Graham and Fletcher, obviously just one-year deals. I think it's fair to say this would probably be the last year. Definitely for Fletcher, maybe Brandon could go on a year-by-year basis. Travis Kelsey, excuse me, Jason Kelsey announced that he's going to return, took a tequila

shout with Howie, and then tweeted something out earlier this week. So they're getting a lot of their old veteran players back, and they're going to have an influx of new players, right? Jordan Davis, the guy they drafted last year is going to play much more moving forward. You would assume that Jacoby Dean, the third round pick that they drafted, is going to play a lot more at linebacker. They have the 10th overall pick in this draft. I would guess that guy is going to impact the team. They obviously have their own first round pick.

So I think they have a unique ability to blend old and young. Because most teams, I would say it's kind of stupid to resign these older players, but they have a lot of younger players and they're going to have multiple, you know, high picks in this draft to immediately kind of get in the mix. So to me, that makes me understand the move because I would say the Howie, by nature, would be move on, but it's pretty tough with Fletcher and Brandon Graham specifically, right?

Fletcher has been a stalwart on that team, who's clearly arrow is pointing down. And Brandon, you know, just kind of the heartbeat of the defense, his energy had one of the most historic plays and the most historic play in the history of the franchise given it's their only Super Bowl win and yeah I mean the Eagles as long as Jaylen's healthy

until the Niners figure out their quarterback situation I think they gotta be the favorite and last but not least you know Mr. TikTok Juju Smith-Schuster was signed by the Patriots I've seen a lot of people kind of bag on the move like I'll say this for Juju when Juju played at USC they were good

and he dominated. When Juju played in the NFL, he's played for winning teams and he's been productive. It'd be one thing if Juju was a big TikToker and he played for shitty teams. Like, yeah, I don't know. This guy, what is he?

Juju just was a starting receiver caught almost 80 balls for the Kansas Chiefs. So it seemed to work out pretty well right there with Coach Reed and Patrick Mahomes. Before, played five years for the Steelers. Last time I googled them, they don't lose. Now, they don't always win the Super Bowl, but they have winning records.

So this guy adds to winning. Does it feel like Juju and TikTok and Bill are going to work? Could be weird. But listen, I've always kind of like Juju as a role player. And clearly they took Juju over Jacoby. I haven't seen the breakdown of Juju's numbers relative to Jocobes. But, you know, I think we're somewhat splitting hairs. I think sometimes Bill in his mind,

whether you're a late round pick or an undrafted free agent, if he's never going to view you as a guy he feels comfortable paying, he's never going to pay you. And as long as he has the juice, which craft gives him, like, that's going to happen. And, like, it's been really successful, but I think I heard someone say it's like, they're still operating like Tom Brady's there,

and Tom's not. It's kind of true. You know, you can't kind of, but the one year they splurged it didn't work. So maybe he's gun shy now. I don't know. I don't expect the Patriots to be a, Super Bowl team, but like we've talked about before on the podcast, it's going to be hard for

for them ever to suck because he's just too good of a coach. So even if they are, quote, unquote, shitty for them relative to the Brady years, what's that, 7 and 10, 8, 9, which sucks when you're just stuck in no man's land. And when you got Bill Belichick, I don't care what your roster is, you're always going to be stuck in no man's land, worst case, because he's just too good of a coach. And now they got Bill O'Brien, I'd pick him to win eight, nine games, kind of in that range, but that's not really where you want to be, especially in the AFC, which is pretty stacked.

Have a great weekend. Talk to everyone soon. Adios. The volume. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite, unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends, me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an acapella band with

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