The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 and Out - Gruden Gate Reaction, Real Deal Cowboys, Baker Limitations, Defending Dan Campbell, Mailbag

Episode Date: October 12, 2021

John reacts to the end of the Jon Gruden era in Las Vegas following the release of more inappropriate emails and his theory about who was coming for his head. He also explains why these Cowboys are legit, why Chargers/Browns showed Baker's limitations, why he likes Dan Campbell's start in Detroit, why he's out on Oklahoma's Spencer Rattler, and answers listener questions in the Middlekauff Mailbag.Make sure you follow John and The Volume on Twitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest content and updates and check out FanDuel for the best wagering and daily fantasy action! Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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That's me. That's the show. Welcome. Subscribe. You guys know the drill. A lot going on. one of the biggest NFL stories, I would say, in recent memory. John Gruden resigned.

His tenure with the Raiders comes to an end before half time of the Monday Night Football Game. Full disclosure, I wasn't that locked in on the Monday Night Football game. I was on so many phone calls, so many text threads. Every time I look up, crazy things were happening, Lamar Jackson is incredible. But the story of the night is John Gruden. So we'll start with that, some thoughts on the Chargers. Some thoughts on Dan Campbell, some thoughts on the Cowboys, Spencer Rattler in the Oklahoma situation.

You guys know the drill at John Middlecoff is my Instagram. If you want to get in the Middilcoff mailbag, what you do at the end of the show, slide up into those DMs. Leave a review, Apple iTunes, subscribe to the podcast. If you listen on Collins feed, I do an exclusive podcast on the three-in-out feed, so I need to subscribe to that. And leave a review, if you could, Apple or iTunes. Well, we got to start with John Gruden.

And I go back to Playmakers. The show that came out at ESPN in 2003. It might have been 04. But it was my freshman year of college. I love the show. I thought it was awesome. And the NFL hated it. And they basically, because they were partners with ESPN,

said it was two over the top and they made them take it down. And one thing we've learned from 04 till today, October 11th, I'm recording this. is you can't write Hollywood scripts, you can't write any potential thing to happen in the NFL that would ever shock anyone. Always be ready for the unexpected. It is the greatest reality television show

in American history. There is not a close second. Nothing holds a candle to the craziness of the national football league. Not in a million years, what I have thought a week ago that John Gruden wouldn't be the head coach. Hell, even when the emails came out, against Demoria Smith. He said he regretted it. He was sorry. I thought it was just over.

It clearly wasn't. And Florio at Pro Football Top kept tweeting out that someone in the NFL was coming for him. I texted someone with the Raiders. They thought someone was gun for him too. And if you look at it, these were not, my theory is this. And in that article today, and I had, you know, I was watching the Monday night football game and I get several texts, probably four or five, from all sorts of different people. Someone I work with, a couple friends, another acquaintances, and they all forwarded me the article. And every single one of them, and some of these people are Democrats, some of them Republicans, they all think differently. So it's not like they all think the same. Every single one of them commented he's done. Every single one of them. And then of course, I read it and I go,

wow. But one of the first things in there was he calls Roger Goodell a pussy. So my theory is that Roger Goodell hated him. This could be wrong. And Roger Goodell was coming after Gruden and had access to all these emails because they're doing the irony of John Grudy getting fired for an investigation in Dan Snyder and the football team is kind of comical, but that's a reality. And John Gruden is done because of this email scandal. But he didn't get fired in my, like calling Roger Goodella Pussy. He also, they threw in Obama and Biden. Don't think they didn't put that in there on purpose. Like, they know how to get the media riled up. They know how to create the storm. To me, it's the Michael Sam comment. Like the Michael Sam comment was,

was like, yeah, that's, I thought immediately once I read that, like, he's done. He's in major, major trouble. And then he factored in as, you know, the first openly gay player on his team. But here's the thing. Gruden had a huge kind of cloud of question mark around him. Beside, before these emails. If he was on a normal contract, a five-year contract, we would have been talking about John Gruden being on the hot seat right now.

His team hasn't sniffed the playoffs in several years. He traded away all of his good players. And even now, like he starts 3 and O and then he loses two straight games. So it's like, are they going to make the playoffs again? Probably not. But now Mark Davis was somewhat just given a lifeline. He has the ability to now get away from John Gruden, which I don't know. I mean, Mark Davis loved John Gruden, or at least did.

I'm not even talking before the emails. I'm talking when he made the hire. He had begged him to come back to the Raiders for years. in like 11 and then again in 14 and then again in 17 when he finally got him. But it's not like John came back for the love of the game. It cost him $100 million.

So he was stuck with this contract if it didn't go well and it didn't, I would have bet against the Raiders making the playoffs this year, especially how they looked recently and the offensive line wasn't that good, that Mark Davis was stuck. And now he kind of gets a reprieve.

He's in Vegas. He has a sweet new stadium. He has some decent players on his team. it's a interesting town for people that are going to want to come there. It's cheap to live. It's got no state income tax. I think his job, when he hired John Gruden, place was toxic. Then John Gruden, you know, kind of screwed it up and wasn't doing that well.

Now he kind of gets to start over from scratch. They have all their picks. They have a quarterback. And they're going to have, you know, from October 11th now until early January to kind of separate themselves from Gruden. But the reality is like this does, like a lot of weird shit happens with the Raiders. right before training camp started, they fired their president. Right, that happened. That was like, whoa, what's going on there?

A couple years ago, Reggie McKenzie just fired out of nowhere. They hired Mike Mayock. They consistently just do some weird things. Now, I always thought highly a Mike Mayock. I thought, watched them on an NFL network, like everyone else. I'm like, this guy would be a really good general manager. And then he goes to work for Gruden, and their picks are terrible. All their high draft picks, Cleland Farrell, Royal Bus, can't even play.

Damon Arnett, terrible. Alex Leatherwood. I know it's only five games, but they already had to move his position. And it's constantly something football-wise. So then when this drama came, but it wasn't just drama, it was being led by the NFL.

This was leaked to the Wall Street Journal and the New York Times. This did not go through Glazer. This did not go through Schefter. This had not go through rap sheet. To me, this was someone in the NFL. This is just my theory. Wanted to get John Gruden.

And they got him. Now, we can discuss cancel culture and is it right, is it wrong? The reality is this is the way the world works now. In 2021, when you have emails, especially in a league that is trying to really improve their image with a guy, what's his equity with the league? It's not like he's one of their best coaches. It's not like he's some guy that's beloved by everyone.

Like, I was going to use an example of another coach that's really like, but that's not even fair because they wouldn't do that. But John Gruden, like to me, I even had this thought. And I'm sure, listen, I say all the time, I don't get on my moral high horse because I would be, I would be lying if I said in my lifetime, I haven't used these words, right? I grew up in the 90s. The vernacular has changed dramatically. And I'm sure I've been part of email chains 15, 20 years ago, you know, in the mid-2000s that would look really bad now. But I would imagine in the last 10 years, I'm actually pretty confident that I wouldn't type those things in an email to another colleague. Now, he was working at ESPN. Bruce Allen was working at Washington,

but he was pretty, he acted like an email was a text message. Now, you could argue, is it fair that they can go back? 10 plus years, different job. It doesn't matter. He's gone. It's over.

It's done. And I do think the birds were already circling before this even happened. We were asking questions constantly for those of us that like, obviously I live in the East Bay where the Raiders used to play. I know a lot of seasons.

They didn't like John Gruden. They didn't. Now, did the owner? I don't know. Has Mark Davis has changed? Maybe he has. Because John hasn't been getting it done and he's paying him a lot of money. But he was really important to have a rock star head coach to go to Vegas. But it wasn't like, it looked a little weird from a football standpoint. And now you just wonder, like, is the job good? Because forever, they could never get a decent coach.

And they finally got John Gruden, but it cost him $100 million. Can they just get a Joe Brady, a Brian, day ball for $40 million, because in the past they never could. They could never get a guy with options. And I think maybe this time around, they can get a guy with options. But like, you know, this is just, I'm almost at a loss. And I'm someone that has takes and I always have opinions. It was just one of those things. I was shell shocked. And it's been a couple hours since the story broke that I'm recording this. I still don't really know what to say. It is one of the craziest fucking things I've ever seen.

It really is. And I think it's going to go down as just one of those moments that you never forget. Like if you're a sports fan, you do what we do. If you're listening to this, it's just, it was an all-time wow moment. It was so crazy that I honestly couldn't focus on the Monday night football game. And every time I look up and then I look at the Carson Wentz had his best game, it looks like he's had in years. Lamar Jackson is absolutely incredible.

He threw for over 440 yards. Game winning touchdowns run around. I saw John Harbaugh just called it one of the best games he's ever seen. Just a remarkable performance. And I don't even feel like I get to take it in because I was just consumed with texting people and reading about John Gruden. John Gruden, and this speaks to the Raiders. John Gruden was so much more famous like Urban Meyer than he was good at coaching.

He wasn't good at coaching. He was probably average. But his fame levels were like, he was like a rock star. or a movie star. He was just bigger than life. But as a coach, he wasn't bigger than life. So they were in this position where they had this guy

who actually didn't deliver like when you said his name, like John Gruden. Everyone knew who I was talking about. Everyone knew exactly who John Gruden is. Yet when you watch him coach, you're like, there's something to be desired. It's not like he's Andy Reid or Sean McVay or Belichick or, you know,

it's just like, he's just average. And I think that's the lesson that it's an all-time hype train. No one in my lifetime has ever had a better decade-long hype train and they got to control it themselves because he was the lead voice

on Monday night football and he became this all-time coach. You know what it turns out? He was kind of shitty. He wasn't that good. And he got a ton of money and he profited off it. He made so much money

since leaving Tampa Bay. And he made a lot of Tampa Bay. But the amount ESPN paid him and then even the little amount you know, 35 or whatever million dollars he made for his three years and five games that he coached the Raiders, there are going to be a million conspiracy theories. And I love a conspiracy theory. I'll hear every single one of them. And I'll believe them. There is nothing about this story that I won't believe or won't think is possible. And maybe with time, we'll get the truth who was really had the vendetta against Gruden. I'm fascinated to learn that.

Like we need a detective on the scene here. But yeah, John Gruden's no longer the coach of the Raiders. Okay, let me start with the Cowboys. And I've been pleasantly surprised. You know, I actually blown away by how good they've been. They've been fantastic. And one thing, multiple things jumped out to me. But I'll start here. Trayvon Diggs, who is kind of taking the league by storm as a DB.

It feels like he has 25 interceptions. They're calling him Dion Sanders Jr. And a little inside scouting. and I've talked about this before, when you're in draft meetings, and this actually happened in high school recruiting as well, if a guy's parent has played, if you're recruiting a kid in high school and his parent was a division one player, and if you're in draft meetings and a guy's dad was in the NFL,

that was looked as a positive. Now, that doesn't mean the guy's going to be a great player, but it's just as simple as this. If I worked at Wells Fargo and I wanted to hire someone, and I said, hey, hey, Bill, I got a guy. He's a 23-year-old from UCLA. His brother works at Goldman Sachs. Wouldn't that be a positive?

Now, that doesn't actually tell you if the guy's going to be great at his job or not good at his job, but it's a pretty easy conversation starter. And Trevon Diggs, whose brother is Stefan Diggs, who is one of the better wide receivers in the league when that was being talked about

in the draft room, that was a positive. And obviously he's coming from Alabama, but I think he kind of represents the Cowboys separating a little bit from the pack. I threw on that game on Monday morning, and I'm watching them against the Giants. And it's really stood out the last several weeks. Their guys who are dominating are all blue chippers. Offensively. Probably the worst school of all their star players on offense would be Mississippi State.

But when you really break it down, Dan Mullen, who is now at Florida, had that program at one point in time. Remember, they were like a top five program for a small period of time, but they were consistently in the top 25, in the SEC, in the tougher part of the SEC on the West, right? You play Alabama, you play LSU, then A&M came in, you play Ole Miss as a good team. So they're quarterback, but then you factor in their offensive skill guys,

Zeke, Ohio State, Blue Chipper, C.D. Lamb, Oklahoma, Blue Chipper. Amari Cooper, who was drafted for overall, who they traded a first round pick for and then paid, it feels like every game I watch, Amari Cooper scores a touchdown. And the crazy part about Amarri, you're like, God, I wish he was a little better, but he's still damn good.

So they got Amari Cooper, Citi Lamb, Zique Elliott, Ohio State. Those are like their core three skill guys. Think how incredible that is. With Dak Prescott, who listened, I was critical when they gave a ton of money to, not because I didn't think he was worthy of being paid. I just thought at that price point like I would like to give a little bit less

but he is playing at an extremely high level. You cannot take away the Dak Prescott is probably I don't know a top seven quarterback in the NFL right now does he benefit from having sweet weapons of course he does but if you watch the hard knocks

I only did the first episode you went well clearly and they've always preached this his character his leadership he's clearly a high level guy and he's just a big time player and their offense is elite right now, especially with Zeke, who is running the ball much better than he did last year.

Tony Pollard, who comes, I remember talking to a scout probably within the last month, and we were talking about the dude on the Eagles. I think his name's Gainwell. Might be screwing up his name, but they drafted him this year, I think, in the fourth or fifth round. And he opted out last season.

He's from Memphis. And Memphis has been producing these NFL running backs. Also, Paulard comes from there, when Norville was there, who's now at Florida State, like, Paulers legit. And then you look at defense. Well, Penn State, under James Franklin, recruits like Alabama, LSU, Clemson, Ohio State, right?

They're consistently a top five recruiting class. Michael Parsons was so damn good, he opted out, did not play a snap in 2020, and still went 11. Think of some of the guys that did that. Jamar Chase, who was freaking sweet, by the way. Pena Sewell, who went seven. So you had the fifth pick, the seventh pick, and the 11th pick. So like, or maybe it was, maybe Parsons was the 12th pick.

But you get my drift here. We're talking about the elite of the elite from the big time programs. And then Diggs coming from Alabama, who gave a pretty, you know, I don't know if he was emotional. I just saw the headlines, but he said in his press conference that he went to Alabama as a wide receiver. You know, his brother, like I said, is Diggs with the bills. And he was crushed when Nick Saban went to him.

And this happens a lot in college. college. You know, I think sometimes being in the recruiting meetings, I remember you have these conversations, but you truly don't know until you get a guy on campus. Maybe it happened way more 20, 30 years ago. You were automatically going to move guys. I think you have some ideas. But when the guy's 18 years old, you just mess around with them during the season because they're redshirting at different positions, different scrimmages, and see what they got. And ultimately, Sabin goes to Diggs and go, hey, we're going to move you to corner. And Diggs was like, I'm crushed. And you think about it, It's like Jerry Judy, Ruggs.

I'm sure Ridley was there at the time. Who else am I missing? Waddle, Devante Smith. So just because you couldn't be a wide receiver at Alabama at the time is no reflection that you were not a good player. And watching him catch the ball, he had a couple of plays in that Giants game that might as well have been interceptions.

He just dragged a foot or was out of bounds. He's high point in the balls. His ball skills look like one of the Bama guys at wide receiver. He is fantastic. So their impact guys are all. all blue chippers from elite programs, and they're all planted. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

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Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the hard way and listen now. A really high level and they're kicking everyone's ass. I don't see how they don't compete for the one seat. I mean, they're probably top to bottom. Obviously, Aaron Rogers is a better player than DAC, but their teams more talented, the Packers. We saw them against Tampa straight up,

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I didn't really get to watch a lot of this game beside on Red Zone on Sunday, so I fired it up today. And it was fantastic. The fourth quarter, the Chargers scored two. 26 points in the fourth quarter. I think the Brown scored 15. It was nuts. And I think sometimes, and listen,

Brandon Staley went viral last week and he said something that I couldn't have agreed with more. Because I do think in 2021, the analytical movement, everyone wants to pass and pass and pass. And listen, I am pro passing. But he basically mentioned that the run game and running the football

establishes a physical culture as a team. it does in practice. I always thought this with the Harbaugh-N-N-Niners, their go-to play was power. Well, you run that in practice, you just improve your defense because you set a physical tone. That's what you practice against.

I think a lot of spread offenses, just the narrative is always they're really soft. And I think a huge reason they're soft is because when you practice against that every day, it's harder to get more physical. Look at Alabama's defenses since they have become more pass-happy. When they were run, run, run, run,

pass a little bit for the majority of Sabin's tenure, they were a dominant defense. And obviously, the game changes you progress. But there is a huge element of a carryover to being a physical team and having a physical run game. But to win in the NFL, especially in January or the Super Bowl, you have to pass the ball. And you have to make passes on third and five plus, right? In big games, you get in third and seven, third and eight, third and 11. And that's how you win. A couple years ago, Patrick Mahomes won the Super Bowl because he could make big passes. You watch all these guys becoming stars, Herbert,

now Josh Allen, Lamar has improved a lot of this. You have to be able to pass in must downs. You also got to be able to run. Well, you don't technically if you have Patrick Mahomes, but most of these other teams, you've got to run a little bit. And I do think it helps the other side of the ball because that's what they practice against, and then they're ready for it when they see it in the game.

So you're watching the Chargers and Browns. We talked a lot about this. quarterbacks do not play each other, right? They're never on the field at the same time. This isn't basketball. You can't guard, like Justin Herbert can't guard Begermayfield, right? Justin Herbert, it's not baseball.

You don't get to pitch against them. You guys, you never see each other. But as a consumer, as a viewer, you were able to really feel the two guys on the field at the same time. It's why I think we gave Josh Allen so much credit on Sunday night because you're watching them on the field,

go back and forth with Patrick Mahomes, you go, this guy's out playing him. And listen, Baker Mayfield is better than I ever thought he would be once he struggled in the NFL. I really liked him coming out of college because I thought he was B Drew Brees. And then it was clear, his personality, he was a little bit different of a mindset than Drew Brees.

But then he got to fancy last year, and you're like, you know, he could be the best version of himself in this offense. The problem is that when you play a guy like Herbert, a guy like Josh Allen, a guy like Patrick Bahomes, you get in positions where Nick Chubb is a star. That guy is an elite player. It is so insane.

And listen, it's easy to play Monday morning quarterbacks with drafts four, five, six, seven, eight years later. We've been doing it, you know, talking about sports for the history of time, and we'll never stop doing it. But in the history of our lives, they've never had a redraft. Because if there was a redraft, Belichick took his teammate. Sony Michelle, who is now on the ramps. I think he'd like a redo on that.

And I'm pretty sure the Seattle Seahawks took Rashad Penny over him as well. That's a problem. Because Chubb might be the best running back in the league, or at least right there. And their backup, Kareem Hunt is fantastic. They have the best one-two running back combination in the league. And in this offense, that's really important. Because you can hammer those guys.

And Chub had 160 plus. Hunt's a touchdown maker. But yesterday, Herbert, who threw for 400 yards and four touchdowns, He made, to me, one of the plays, like, easily the play of the day and just a remarkable play, if you're a lover of football. He rolled to his right late in the game. I think it was under four minutes left.

Hits Keenan Allen way up the sideline. Keenan Allen has to leap for it. Herbert on the run, throws an absolute strike, keeps his feet in bounds. The level of talent between the two guys, because now that we're paying these guys, like ultimately you have to give these guys big money when they become free agents. or they're going to be, their contract is coming to an end, or you have to move on.

There's no like, you know, can we get this guy for a discount? That's not possible. You saw it with Dak Prescott, who is not Herbert, who is not Josh Allen. He's in that next tier in terms of talent. You know, ideally, would I want to give him 43? I'd rather give him 31, but that's not the way it works. I understand that. I'm not naive or ignorant to the fact that that's just the going rate.

That's what you pay. Well, Justin Herbert is going to be one of those guys, right? Which, whatever the number is, the salary cap will rise. I don't know. I'd have to text around to find out in three years what that number would be. I think it's fair to say that number's going to be astronomical. It's going to be fucking massive. That's not arguable. Like the man on the moon can see that.

My mom can see that. You know, Bill Belichick can see that. Well, Baker Mayfield's in contract, like his conversation is, what are you going to do with him? And he is fine. You can be very, very competitive with him. You could win this division with Baker Mayfield playing like he's playing. But this is a business and you do eventually have to pay him because you have to build around your team.

And I don't know what you do with him because I could not. You're not just going to be able to get him. Well, John, just give him like a four years, $80 million. You know, yeah, I would give him four years, $80 million. And I guarantee every penny, $20 million a year. That's not going to be possible. you know, and you saw in that game, like, one guy's in a completely different universe than the other guy. You know, if you gave Justin Herbert Nick Chub as well, the charges would never lose a game.

I mean, Baker's just handed it off, handing it off, he's making three guys miss, he's busting tackles, and he dumps it off to Kareem Hunt, but when he has to, he can't make passes. Now it's not all his fault. I don't know what's going on with Odo Beckham. That's a disaster. That trade has just been a train wreck from the jump. Jarvis Landry's hurt, and he's a huge safety blanket. for Baker Mayfield.

Najoku, the tight end, who's really, really talented, had a really good game yesterday. Again, Baker is solid. Like, you could, doing what you're doing with the Browns, you can hang. But I don't know what you do financially. I could not pay him one of these, quote-unquote, max deals. Could not do it.

Would not do it. So the Browns are already in this little bit of a predicament and never forget. You know, I saw a bunch of people on social media as the game was going on Sunday, calling it like the analytical ball. And Brandon Staley is very progressive with that. I think part of like, I actually think the numbers people are taking a little too much credit for guys going on on fourth down. Like, since I was seven years old, I was screaming at the TV to go for it. You could go to every single human that watches football, whether they have a master's degree, a doctorate degree, or whether they are a high school dropout.

They have been screaming at the television on fourth and probably under five, past the 50 yard line for their coach to go for it. This is not some new concept. Every human, think how many times if you played high school football, it'd be like fourth and one like coach, let's go for it. That was a coaching issue, not like the,

that only the numbers and only the academic elites in these buildings thought to go for it. No, every human being that watch football wanted their coach to go for. And now both these two teams are going for. And I think everyone's saying that the Chargers are just following the flow chart. No, I think they realize they have one of the greatest quarterbacks we've ever seen

through like 18 games or how many games. I guess he played 15 last year and he's played five this year. So that's 20 games. I don't know through 20 games. I didn't see Marino Young. I didn't see Elway Young. Brady was not this good young. Manning wasn't this good young. Mahomes got a year to a red shirt so I wouldn't even count him. This could be the great, if you started as a rookie, the greatest first 20 games we've ever seen from a quarterback and Justin Herbert. I don't think that's hyperbole. I think the numbers speak for themselves. And the eye test is mind-blowing.

His eye test, to me, is better than his box scores. And his box scores are freaking awesome. It's really, I said it on Monday's podcast. I think Mahomes, Alan, and Herbert are three of just the easiest guys to root for. They're everything the NFL wants. From a character standpoint, from a likability standpoint, they're always smiling. they're always having fun.

Like you build around guys like this. The NFL's in a good spot with these three guys. And the problem for the Browns is their guy, while they did draft him number one overall, is just not on their level. Another story that kind of went viral on Sunday night was Dan Campbell. And listen, Dan, when he was hired

and he gave his original press conference, it went, you know, it just blew up, right? Because he said some crazy, things about biting kneecaps and he's just this he's him and Vrable biggest guys he just looks big he looks kind of crazy he's got this goate he almost looks like a wwee wrestler or something he played in the NFL but i had said that like i remember when the niners were getting ready to play them week one i had been watching his press conferences for a couple weeks leading up to it and i'm like you know i actually think this guy gets this rap of like this huge meathead and i've watched his press

conferences and I was blown away. I'm like, this guy's intelligent. And then you look like Sean Payton would have just made him as assistant head coach just for shits and giggles. Like he made him as assistant head coach for a reason. And I think when you look at the last whatever, three or four years that Patricia and Bob Quinn, the two Patriot guys that took over that organization, the biggest reason they failed is they felt like they were just trying to copy Belichick. It was like a throwback. It was like a Josh McDaniels, Eric Mangini, from like the late 2000s. And I say it all the time, and I think everyone who's had any success in anything, but definitely in football, is you got to be true to yourself. Whether you're hosting a

podcast, whether you're a sales guy, don't try to act like someone else. Because eventually, you're going to get exposed. Be comfortable in your own skin. And Dan Campbell yesterday is in tears after the game. And the game wasn't on live for me, but I was able to, I was following because I bet on it and I was following it, it came on the Red Zone channel. And there was a fumble and the lions take the lead late and you're like, oh my God, the lions are going to win the game. And then the game disappeared for me. And then I think like the Niners game came on.

I didn't see what happened. And then I checked my phone probably five minutes later and it says the Vikings won the game. I'm like, how is that even humanly possible? And then you see the at like half time of those games. You see the highlights. They have multiple timeouts. They drove 37 seconds and kick a long 55. They've basically been lost two of the last three weeks,

same exact score, I think, 19 to 17, by two field goals that add up to like 115 yards. It's unheard of. And this guy, who I think gets this kind of knock of being this meathead and super tough guy, just wants to get into backyard brawls, is in tears. And I'm like, you know what? I think a lot of people are probably going to make fun of.

them and that's what social media does because that's let's face it where a lot of losers go to congregate and you know rip on people and make fun of people because i don't know why there's probably some psychology to that it'll come out over the years as all these social media companies battle through uh whatever the hell they're going through but i was blown away i'm like that's i like this guy and i've liked them for a while but i've watched his team pretty closely they are in every single game and let's face it usually when you're going to do a complete tear down a complete rebuild the move is to try to trade whatever asset you have, right? Jimmy Johnson did it once upon a time with Herschel Walker.

A lot of coaches do that. When they come to a terrible team, any asset they have, they trade it. Ideally, you have a couple. The Lions were so terrible they had won, and it was their quarterback, and they immediately traded them. They do not have anyone else that you like, could you trade this guy and get like a set? They don't have any of those type guys.

Their team is atrociously bad in terms of talent, right? We all agree. They have to be right up there. They've already had a bunch of injuries, too, as the least talented team in the league. Yet every single week, this team comes out, just throwing blows and right in every game. Even the game they got blown out by the Packers, weren't they up at halftime? I mean, they just, they are really, really impressive. And I think Dan Campbell, unlike Patricia and unlike Quinn, remember Patricia was telling reporters to like not sit up,

to sit up straight in press conferences. Like, bro, you look like a slob. Who are you to tell anyone to sit up straight? But that was kind of Belichickie. And even though I've never seen Belichick do that in a press conference, it just felt like they were complete. Frauds would be the wrong word because to work for Belichick for that long, you know what you're doing,

but we're not comfortable in their own skin and we're just completely over their heads. It does not feel like Dan Campbell's over his head. Now, ultimately, can they make good draft picks? Can they build this thing and get a good enough players? That is yet to be determined. But I don't see how you could watch the, Campbell through these first, whatever, five weeks of the season and what he's doing there and not be impressed. Because they have no talent. They have no controversy or anything. I mean,

look at Urban Meyer. I got a headline on my phone, I think from the athletic. It just updates when like news breaks. And when the Jags lost, this thing fires up on my phone. They've lost 20 straight games, the Jags. I think it's the longest losing streak in the NFL since 1977. And we just laugh at that franchise. It's a complete joke. Now, the Lions, in fairness, have also been a laughing stock. Right now, though, I don't view them as a laughing stock. I view them with a guy as a head coach that has a plan and is also kind of being a human, that that was a very human reaction to, it's what, to lose to a 66-yard field goal several weeks ago, Justin Tucker, I mean, that's going to go down as one of the greatest kicks of all time. It's one of those that

you almost just tip your hat is Justin Tucker. He's probably a Hall of Fame kicker. What are you going to do? But then to be in that situation again, two weeks later, not quite as long. On the road, a divisional rival. Their kicker always miss kicks. I mean, I watched the Vikings game against the Cardinals, whatever, that would have been week two. The only reason the Vikings lost that game is because they missed a field goal, they missed an extra point, they missed chip shots. Like, what I think of the Vikings, I think of kickers that don't always make kicks.

Yet against the Lions, who just feels like the franchise is cursed. And I thought Dan Campbell gave a pretty powerful, like that was just, I thought that was, I felt like it came natural to a guy that I think we view as this tough guy fighter. And then on the flip side, I think sometimes fans can get a little bit of a bad rap. I understand players, you know, not quite understanding where the money comes from, right? You just, you start making huge money. It kind of all gets lost in translation. You know, I've never been a professional athlete.

but if you're making 7, 8, 12, 20, some of these NBA players, I don't think you quite realize where all the money comes from. You just realize you're making a ton and you're worthy of every penny because you base your worth on other players. You go, well, I'm better than that guy, I'm worth this. All the money comes from. Literally every penny in pro sports from the fans. The reason these media deals get paid for is because people watch.

If nobody watched, these would be glory. horrified YMCA games. All these pro sports. They would not exist. All the money. And it really makes me uncomfortable NBA players. Some of them, not all of them, can be, you know, kind of contentious toward the fans. They've had a rough fan player kind of environment for several years.

For the most part, the NFL players, I think are just much more relatable. And part of it is because the overwhelming majority of them get cut every year. Their money's not guaranteed. But I don't think they still quite realize, like every penny comes from the fans. And the most valuable fans now are the ones sitting on the couch. But if you go and pay for a ticket, you're also valuable. And sometimes, like, when fans boo or get really loud, I think often the media likes talking down upon them, right?

Like, what are the fans know? And listen, I've been guilty probably at this before, too. But I also acknowledge, if people didn't listen to this podcast, I would not make a penny. I am dependent on the consumer, and that's you listening. And the reason you listen is because you watch these games and you're probably a sports fan, right? And without you, you wouldn't, you add value when you see these television ratings, why they're such a big deal is because that's what everyone bases the price of the purchases of the media deals. Now, obviously it's a little more complicated than that, but all the money comes because of you. Every sponsorship deal, every media rights deal, all of it.

And a couple weeks ago at Oklahoma, when Spencer Rattler was Planned Territory, and he's been bad. He's one of the more hyped quarterbacks in the country. He goes to Oklahoma, a program that had had multiple number one overall picks and rehabilitated Jalen Hertz to make him a second round pick and now a starter. He just got a nice win against Carolina on the road, a big win for the Eagles. And they were chanting, we want Caleb. And I saw a lot of the media elites shitting on these people.

Like, how can you do that? And I understand the players, some of them were like, you know, Little unfair. You cheer us when we're good. You boo us one or bad. They were strictly saying, we want Caleb. There is probably not a more educated fan base,

especially if you're like Maya. If you're 35, 36, 37, 40, right? You've been an adult for multiple decades, from Bob Stoops now to Lincoln Riley. You know exactly, exactly. But hell, if you've just been watching this team the last five or six years, you know what an NFL quarterback looks like.

You know what a quarterback who has these. ability to take you to the playoffs looks like. You've had a front row seat. You've seen every snap from Baker to Kyler to Jalen. You know exactly what it looks like. So when you see Spencer Rattler, regardless of the Netflix special and what he acted like in high school, I think that's irrelevant. Truly fans don't necessarily care. It's been proven. People are always like, shut down the NFL domestic violence. Well, you don't turn off the TV. Like, I can't believe you hired this guy. He's been arrested on four DUIs. Well, you watch. If you didn't watch, they would get rid of all these people.

But it's been proven over and over the NFL knows, and even college football knows, that they don't get on your moral high horse because ultimately fans do not care. It sounds loud on social media. I can't believe. And obviously, I'm not even comparing Spencer Rattler to that.

He just on the Netflix special was, you know, kind of dushy. But as a player, if he was awesome and been another Baker Mayfield or Kyler Murray, no one would have cared. They would have cheered the living, you know what, out of him. But he's terrible. I mean, he's not very good at football. And Oklahoma fans cheering for We Want Caleb three or four weeks ago,

everyone in the media is like, these guys, these fans are idiots. No, actually, they're probably more educated about it than you. Because they were right. And just because a coach does something doesn't automatically make it right. Coaches, you can be an elite coach, Belichick, Lincoln Riley. I'm seeing it right now with Kyle Shanahan and do dumb things and have a rough stretch. You're not perfect. Jeff Bezos has probably made several deals.

lost. He's also made some great deals that made him a lot of money. But for every Whole Foods deal or NFL Thursday Night Football deal, he's probably made some bad ones. We just talk about the good ones. Well, Lincoln Riley stuck by Spencer Rattler for too long. He's not very good. The fans knew it. And now we know it because Caleb comes in in one of the greatest, most entertaining Red River shootouts we've ever seen and saves their season and was absolutely incredible. Now, does that mean he's going to be the next Baker-May. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media.

Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

One week I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told,

and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, Follow at Clifford and a TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jett. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down,

and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so you know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now.

Then you're finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist,

Keer Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it

and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro.

Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way.

Open your free iHeartRadio app, search Learn the Hardway, and listen now. Field or Kyler Murray, no. It's hard to sustain it, how you react with praise, no different in how you react through adversity. But in that game and his talent, he's on a completely different level.

And I think this happens sometimes in college football, no different than the draft. You're a five star, you're a top two or three quarterback in the class, no different being a top five pick or a first round pick as a quarterback. That does not guarantee that you're actually going to be good.

And sometimes you're just not good enough. And I'm watching enough Spencer Rattler because the guy that hired me at Fresno State is now Lincoln Riley's like right-hand guy as a recruiter. So I watch basically all their games. He's not any good. You know, relative do NFL people. And I know he was projected to be the number one pick.

I don't, I view an undrafted free agent. You know, he's talented enough to be a six-year. I would not draft him. If I had a draft board, Spencer Rattler would not be on it. I mean, he can't even start his own program. and Lincoln Riley probably should have benched him weeks ago. And I've heard other things, but, you know, until he goes pro or whatever, I'm not going to come out and say nothing too bad.

But you just, I think sometimes, and I think it's a tough spot. And this is where I give Sabin a lot of credit when he had Tua and Jalen, is he was able to pivot? Because you can't get so consumed. Well, is this guy going to transfer? Who cares? You have to go with the better player. And it's tough because that wide receiver,

at running back, a defensive line, you can play a bunch of guys. At quarterback, only one guy gets to play. And once you get a really good one, that guy never comes out of the game. So I understand. Like, you probably don't want him to transfer. But, like, I think it's safe to say that Spencer Rattlers, like the Oklahoma fans nailed it. If the Oklahoma fans, every single person at that game several weeks ago that chanted that, and it felt like the whole building was, was a scout, they nailed it.

They were dead on. I mean, they were ahead of the curve. They knew what Lincoln Riley couldn't see. And let's face it, sometimes you're too close to the fire. You're too emotional to the situation Where if you can take a couple steps back Which the fans kind of can Right they don't know anyone personally

Listen I understand as a coach You get very emotionally connected to people It's a people business So you are tied to individuals You make promises, you know their family You have them over to your house I get it But it's also a bottom line business is about winning

And you have to be able to balance The emotion of really liking the guy Or being tied to the guy we're making these promises to doing what's best for your football team. And whether it was, you know, it's never the wrong time to do the right thing. And ultimately, Lincoln Riley did the right thing by bringing in this young five star who just, who saved their season. Thunderstruck, adjective.

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Okay, from Ben, just listen to your Seattle segment. Got to ask. Should USC call Pete Carroll and see if he wants to bounce? Can you imagine the fan base if he actually came back? Well, this is an interesting question. I think it's kind of twofold. One, it would excite everybody for sure. It would be an enormous moment on social media in Los Angeles, in the college, in football, right?

If Pete were to leave Seattle. on the other side, I'd say this. They tried this several times. Now, granted, it wasn't Pete, but they tried it with Lane. They tried it with Sark. And Pete Carroll's 70 years old, or going to be 70 years old. Like, it was an incredible run. It was freaking awesome.

As someone who was going to college at Cal Poly, my cousin who was playing at Fresno State, played him in one of the most epic games ever. Uh-huh. Fresno State versus USC. I remember going to a practice once I went to work at Fresno State with Tim Skipper, who's good buddies with Lane. And USC was so cool.

I mean, they were an NFL team. It's over. It's 2021. I think they need to find their own coach. They need to find their own identity. They have to find a way to do that. Like, eventually, Alabama found Nick Sabin after going through some coaches. Clemson found Dabo.

Ohio State, Ryan Day. Like, can you just find your own guy? It's USC, you should be able to win there. I also think sometimes you, you know, when you break up with somebody, I've never had this happen. You know, I've seen some people on Wikipedia, like famous people who get a divorce

and then they remarry someone. That feels like it probably is not going to work great. You'll never have that what you, to replicate what you had the first time. you know, once you break up with someone, even if you stay friends, even if you stay hooking up with them, it's not quite the same as when you were in the relationship with them. And things were good, right? But for whatever reason you brought, Pete left you.

And Pete, you know, listen, we can argue it was stupid, the Reggie Bush stuff. It was an overreaction, the NCAA, a bunch of clowns. But it happened. He took off. And the program was in Shambles kind of when he left. So I hear what you're saying. I would recommend just James Franklin, Chris Peter. I'm just throwing out some names.

You know, find your Matt Rule, right? Find your when Oregon found Chip Kelly. Like, do that. You're USC. Once upon time, you found Pete Carroll. Can you find an NFL coach? Who's available? I think you can. Question for the pod. After watching the 49ers play,

it's clear Shanahan does not trust Lance to make the correct decisions. It feels like Lance ran the ball every other down and Kyle did not trust him in big spots. Fourth down play calls were head scratchers. I would agree. Do you think this could be, Kyle, showing the front office and possible outside noises that Lance was not his first choice at quarterback and sort of proving his bias toward Mac Jones as a more start-ready quarterback, even though he is struggling to? P.S. Put some respect on the Nevada Wolfpack. They are rolling. I think they got an

NFL quarterback. They are good. They beat Boise. Don't sleep on Nevada. Trust me. As someone who my second year, Kaepernet killed us both years. I was at Fresno State. My second year we went up there. They beat the shit out of us. They had three guys. That year they had three guys run for 1,000 yards,

and they also beat Boise. So yeah, I mean, I respect the Nevada football program. Well, the latest, before I'm recording this, or as I'm recording this, Trey Lance is injured, sprained his knee. So just a disaster. disastrous situation for the 49ers. Listen, he needs a lot of work.

His loopy release, they need to shorten that up. That's not going to happen until the offseason. Right? Once you're on the golf course, you can't fix your swing. You're just playing. So that's an off-season project. Hopefully he's going to be okay and maybe he can make the start in a couple weeks. But his accuracy is a little hit or miss.

He needs to work on some touch. But they need to not just run him. They treated him like Camper. Newton. And I was a little like, you know, listen, you got a running quarterback, you got to run him a little bit, but they're running them up the gut. He's getting guys falling on him. And now he's got a spray knee. Kyle Shanahan is a really good coach. I've seen it firsthand. I've seen every single play Kyle Shanahan is called as the head coach for the 49ers. I know people in that organization. He's an impressive guy. He's a big time football coach. He is having a very, very

rough 2011 season. I don't know what it is. I can't quantify it. I, you know, I haven't asked anyone there, not that they'd even tell me, but it's just weird. It's just been a bizarre year for Kyle. Now, could there be some lingering he didn't want Trey? Maybe I don't know that, but I never had inside scoop on who he actually wanted. Do I think he like Mac Jones? Yes. Do I think he also like Tray Lance? Yes. I think Trey Lance is a very likable guy. High character. well-spoken, smart, loves football. Like, a lot of people liked them.

Remember, one of the stories that came out about draft time is the, is, what was it called? Oh, the Colts, they had a draft show. And if you are a special, like, character guy, your magnet is a different color. And I think there were two guys

in the draft that had the different color in the first round. It was Trey Lance. And I think it was Devante Smith, was the other guy. Like, Trey Lance, off the, field is like everything you want and Kyle really values that. But he's a big work in progress as a quarterback.

A big work in progress. And listen, Kyle's a great schemer. Is he a great quarterback developer? Who is really good quarterback developer? Well, I've seen Andy do it. He did it with Donovan McNabb. He's done it again with Patrick Mahomes. Brian Dayball's done it with Josh Allen.

Right? Greg Roman's done it with Kaepernick and now Lamar Jackson. It's difficult. Like, not most guys aren't quote-unquote quarterback developers. Russell's ran through a bunch of offensive coordinators. McCarthy, you know, would Aaron give him McCarthy credit for himself? I don't know. I doubt it.

Tom, you know, John, Charlie Weiss, Belichick, obviously developed Tom to an all-time great. You know, Peyton, I would say, self-developed. Who developed Peyton Manning? Payton Manning. So, yeah, it's just difficult. You know, as someone who is financially tied to the Niners, who wants to see them do well, the better they do, better my business does and my friends like listen i'm not the fan that i once was but i i root for them

to do well it's off it's really really off i think them in seattle like just some weird juju both places where the rams a lot of good juju the cards a lot of good juju with the cards and you know me i'm arizona hater steve kime he's drafted listen i've always defended steve kine and i'm not going to get on my moral high horse about the d y but I do think in Arizona, they have really, really tight DUI deals that it's just you got to be smarter there. So that was probably the one time I was the most critical of him. But he's been a good GM. He's drafted a ton of good players.

He signed a ton of good free agents. I think Steve Kheim knows what he's doing. Now, I question the Cliff Kingsbury higher and who knows? Like it could have also been the owner, had a big influence. And I don't know what his other options were, but it's playing out pretty well. I mean, they're 5 and O. Now, Kyler in that game, and this is the concern. This is my number one concern with the little guy is when you are that small and you are a fantastic runner.

And Kyler, I would say of all the runners I've ever seen in my adult life of watching football. I don't quite, I wasn't watching the same way I watch now like with Steve Young. But Michael Vick, Lamar Jackson, Cam Newton, these guys were reckless runners in terms of their body. They dive head first. They take a ton of collisions. Tray Lance was doing that too. Lamar Jack, or I'm not Lamar Jackson, Kyler Murray is like Ricky Henderson.

He just slides, and it's a smooth slide. He's up and he's down. He is very, very cautious. He does not really endanger when he runs. But in the pocket, Bosa's slammed him down. He looked like he messed up his arm. He's just getting slammed by these enormous human beings, and it's hard when you have that body type.

That would be my number one concern with Kyler. Because in terms of arm strength, playmaking ability, dude's a stud. Mike from Cincinnati. What up, Mike? After the past five games, how do you think Jalen Hurts situation

will play out in Philadelphia? Eagles have potentially three first round picks and the rumors are that Deshawn Watson is not interested in going to Philly, which is weird. I mean, if he was clear, they got Devante Smith, they got Jalen Rager, they got multiple tight ends, they got multiple running backs.

Do you think the Eagles should just continue sticking with Hertz for the long term and build around him. I have not watched that game. I was reading Albert Breers article this morning, and at one point in time in the game, Hertz was like 10 for 12 for 35 yards. I don't know what his final line ended up at. I know he ran for the touchdown.

He did the Cam Newton thing because I think Sam Donald threw a bad pick. I did see that part on the red zone. Yeah, I mean, they're not going to trade for Deshaun Watson until he's cleared. And it doesn't feel like he's going to be cleared anytime soon. So I think they are prepared to play this season out. Now, big picture, like, how he plays, you know, if they get to seven or eight wins, yeah, I think they'll run it back and give him another season because he's cheap.

You can use that money. You're not paying a quarterback to invest other places. You can use those three first round picks to get better players and be equipped maybe to get a guy if they ever become available or I don't know. It's not easy to land a quarterback. You would say most of the top quarterbacks who are under 30, right? Derek Carr, Deshawn Watson, Mahomes, Herbert, Alan, Lamar. I guess you throw Baker in there.

I mean, all these guys were drafted by their teams, and most of them were drafted really high. Now, Trey Lance, Justin Fields, Trevor Lawrence, Zach Wilson. So really, when you go around the NFL, who's the best quarterback who wasn't drafted? Probably Kirk Cousins. And he, you know, and he was a unique situation, right? Franchised a couple times. Russell was drafted, Rogers was drafted. I know Brady left, but he was 43 years old.

Like most quarterbacks do not become available in free agency. So the problem is, how do you acquire a quarterback? You either draft them or you don't get one. So that's, and I don't think it's a great quarterback draft. I think they're kind of a weird spot. I don't know, I know I'm not answering your question. I would just, I think what they're doing is exactly what we're all seeing. They're taking it week by week.

Be competitive and they've been competitive. They have a lot of good players. Is Jalen Hurts going to be on the team as a starting quarterback for four or five years? I would doubt it. I would doubt it. But he's clearly way better than I think that I ever imagined he'd be. He's been impressive that way. You always have strong opinions, but you have to admit you are wrong on the Cardinals.

You have been ripping them ever since I started listening to you. You're right. You were dead wrong about Kingsbury. You didn't think he was an NFL head coach. You predicted the Cardinals would get off to a bad start and then fire Cliff. You also need to eat crow on your Steve Kime takes. I'm pro-Skeyev. You thought it was a bad operation predicted a last place finish.

I've never disputed they had talent. Never have. Did I think Cliff was bad? I did. Am I wrong on that right now? I am. I am. Long way to go.

A lot of season left. Right now, wrong. Steve Kime, good GM, drafted a ton of good players. Never disputed that. He did hire Steve Wilkes, and Kingsbury, we'll see, because I watched the Niners physically kind of punk them. Physicality, how do you handle the air rate? You hit them right in the teeth.

You take away their space. I heard Brandon Staley say this about Mahomes and the Chiefs, because he called Steve Kerr, and he asked Steve Kerr, he said, you play with Michael Jordan, you coach Kevin Durant, Steph Curry, Clay Thompson. What threw you guys off as a player and now as a coach? He said when people weren't intimidated and people were willing to punch the bully. And, you know, the air raid offense, they could throw up a tons of points.

But when you get physical with them, it throws them off. Now, Kyler easily could have hit a couple other passes and the game could have been a different score. But, you know, I'm prepared to be wrong. Like, I have no problem eating crow. I'm not in the right. You know, Coward said this forever and he's dead. I've learned this being in this space full time. I'm not in the right or wrong business. I'm in the entertaining business. I have to entertain you guys. If I don't, you guys won't listen and I'll go out of business. Like whether I'm right or whether I'm wrong, ultimately doesn't matter. Now, do you want to be right more often? So build your credibility, I guess. But I never say anything. I hang my hat on anything I say, I truly believe. I'm not Skip Bayliss, I'm not Stephen A. Smith. I don't just like, LeBron sucks or this. You know that.

I said I didn't believe Cliff Kingsbury was a good NFL coach because I truly believe that. And I fundamentally do not like the offense. I fundamentally don't. Full, candid, honest opinion, I hate the offense. I love a lot of their talent. Ron Dale Moore, Stud. Hopkins, baller. J.J. Watt, still playing well.

Chandler Jones, star. Buda Baker, one of my favorite DBs in the league. Their team looks awesome. They're 5'0. Now, it's like, they better not miss the playoffs. Stumbled across your show and love it and love to see

a Fresno State guy doing well. You keep jumping on Urban Myers being a really bad NFL coach, but still an elite college coach, because he doesn't look like he knows what he's doing this year. But Jimmy was pretty stinking bad his first year in the NFL. What separates Jimmy from Meyer in the first year? Cowboys fan, not a Jags fan,

but just curious. Well, I was born in 1984, so when Jimmy got the job in like 1990, I was six years old. So to be completely honest, I don't, I can't really break it down what Jimmy, what made him so special. Now, I've watched the 30 for 30s. I've obviously watched different documentaries about Jimmy. I think Jimmy was kind of a unique person. He was just an all-time, you know, outlier coach, right? I mean, he could do it everywhere. He did it at Oklahoma State.

He did it Miami. He did the Cowboys. He even had some success with the Dolphins. You know, his first move, though, right? Didn't he make a huge trade and get a bunch of picks back and then drafted really, really well? Drafted really, really well. So, you know, I don't know if they're a person. money was a lot different.

The egos, probably similar. I mean, you had to have a big ego back in the 90 as you do in 2021. But, you know, maybe it was a little bit easier to make the transition in 1990 than it would be in 2021. But ultimately, Jimmy hit on a lot of really good players, right? He got drafted Troy Aitman, drafted Emmett Smith, then he drafted Michael Irvin, and then they traded for Charles Haley. Ken Norton, June, like their team was really good. They signed, I guess, when they signed Deion, he was going.

on, but he was a really good coach. The other thing about Jimmy Johnson, thing about this, okay, here's a major difference. Jimmy Johnson's coaching staff in the NFL had Norv Turner was his offensive coordinator, one of the truly great offensive coordinators in NFL history. Now, is he a good head coach? No, but as Norv Turner a fantastic offensive coordinator, we all agree, yes. Dave Wonstead, I think was his special teams coach and assistant head coach.

Dave Wonstead's, I mean, was it? NFL head coach was a college head coach those were his assistants look at some i mean bevel charlie strong the duty went naked through the taco bells his defensive coordinator so you could just one thing i can speak on is the coaching staff for jimmy johnson was in a different world than urban mire if urban mire had a good coaching staff i think he'd be okay if you told the urban Meyer had, you know, like a LaFleur, you know, a good defensive court, a Vic Fangio as a defensive coordinator, John Fossil's kid as his, you know, special teams coach, I'd be like, yeah, you know, he'll figure it out. But I think you just look at his coaching staff, it's pretty

questionable. Can you explain if the paths just have injured or shitty of an O line or if it's Mac Jones being either too scared or confused? If not, anyways, love the content. I think it's pretty simple. And I didn't watch just on the red zone bits and pieces of that game against the Texans. And it was, listen, you're down 22-9 on the road. I don't care if it's the Texans. Come back and win.

That's a good win. Road wins. You don't get credit. No style points. You just want to win. I think I tweeted this out on Sunday when it looked like they were going to lose. That if Mack Jones had played at Iowa State

or Mac Jones had played at Oklahoma State or Mac Jones had played at Michigan State, he would have gone where, guys of his talent have always gone in the third or fourth round. And people would be like, Middle Cuff, you're such a hater. Now, most of you would probably agree, but that is not being a hater. Getting drafted in the third or fourth round as an NFL quarterback is an incredible accomplishment. That is something to be proud of. There are only 32 guys every year drafted in the first round. And most of them have elite attributes. Hell, even the second round, look recently,

the D.K. Metcalfs, the AJ Browns, Debo Samuels, Nick Chubs, ton of start, Bobby Wagner's. I mean, all these guys, good players go in the second round. There is nothing wrong. Shady McCoy, Sean Jackson, star players go in the second round. Like, if you go in the third or fourth round, I think we go, oh, guy went in the fourth round. That's a, you got drafted in the fourth round to the NFL.

That's really, really impressive. He's not very big. He has an average arm at best. Like, his skill set is not conducive. Guys with that skill set don't get drafted in the, first round, let alone 15th overall. So he played out of school. Think about this. His college teammates, he had four wide receivers. And I love this. He played with four first round picks. I actually think that does a disservice to how good his teammates were. They weren't four first round

picks. They were the 10th overall pick, Devante Smith. They were the sixth overall pick, Jalen Waddle. They were the 15th overall pick, Jerry Judy. And they were the 12th overall pick, pick in Henry Ruggs. So of the wide receivers he played with, not one guy in two separate drafts lasted past the 15th pick. Two guys went 10th in the top 10, 10 and 6. When I say top 10, does that include 10? But think about that.

Four wide receivers, the lowest one guy was drafted was 15th. His running back in a passing league where running backs don't really go in the first round anymore went 24th. He had an offensive center, Landon Dickerson, who tore his ACL and got drafted 37th. And he's good.

I mean, if he didn't tear his ACL, he would have gone in the top. 20. Alex Leatherwood, who has already been moved to guard, but, I mean, starter at guard and tackle at Alabama, was the 17th overall pick. So he played with multiple first round,

Dickerson's a first round offensive lineman torn ACL wheels 37. Multiple first round offensive lineman a first round running back for top 15 wide receivers. It's the greatest accumulation of offensive talent

on one team we've ever seen. And Metchy, the dude who's still on the team is, I'm sure, a first round pick. The running back they got, baller. So it's, you know,

he benefited unlike anything we've ever seen. You know, back in the day the Ken Dorsey's of the world, they got dinged because of the team they were playing on. Now he got inflated. And I'm not saying he's bad. He's fine. He's Kirk Cousins. Kirk Cousins went in the fourth round. So, you know, their wide receivers aren't great. You know, it's not, I'm not blaming it all on him, but he's a limited player. His physical capabilities are, you know, there's a ceiling on it.

He can only become so good because he lacks physical attributes, which most humans do. But when we talk about you in terms of the draft, that's how we define where you go. I say it all the time. The draft is a marketplace. And your character, your physical attributes, your times, your production, it all gets factored into the price of what I have to pay to acquire you. And I think, you know, he was a million dollar home that somehow got. out a $4 million valuation. I never understood it.

Why, I'd go, well, I'd pay a million dollars for that home. You'd be like, well, it's $4 million. And my take was simply, well, I don't want the house for $4 million. I would not take it. If I could pay a million dollars for it, I will take the house. But if you're going to pay $4 million, Godspeed. And if Kyle would have taken them, it would have been like buying a $9 million to pay $9 million for a million dollar house.

People think I'm a Mac Jones hater, and I'm honestly not. I root for the kid. but yeah. Okay, Middlecoff Mailback, at John Middlecoff. You guys know the drill. Podcast. Next one will be out on Friday. Tell your friends.

Have a great week. Enjoy however the weather is. Kind of chilly where I'm at today. And talk to everybody soon. Peace. Volume. Get right to the romance and find the way to wow this valentines with 1-800flowers.com.

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Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing huge. potential. Either way, the podcast, Superhuman, documented it all, embedded in the games and

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