The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 and Out - Ravens Red Flag, Rams Rock Bottom, Pac-Done

Episode Date: August 7, 2023

John explains why he’s red flagging the Ravens for switching to a passing attack with Lamar Jackson, why the Rams could be in for a brutal season, and what killed the ]Pac-12. Follow John onTwitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest. Check out Gametime - the fastest growing ticketing app in the US, and the official ticketing app of 3 & Out and GoLow -  for tickets to all of your favorite NFL, NBA, NHL, NCAA teams. Concert and comedy show tickets, too. Go to Gametime now to create an account, download the app and use code JOHN for $20 off your first purchase. Subscribe NOW and follow Middlekauff and The Volume on Twitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest content. It's always FanDuel for the best wagering action! #volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year.

Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The volume. What is going on, everybody? John Middilcock to re-en-out podcast. How are we doing, everybody? Hope or well. Had a good weekend.

Follow a little football online. And I watched a little bit of the Hall of Fame ceremony. Not much, actually. But I saw DeMarcus Ware talk. It was good. Here's the plan. We will do some football talk today, of course. Some stuff on the Ravens and Lamar.

They threw nine interceptions at practice on Saturday. McVeigh, playing everybody now in the preseason. Some stuff on the Netflix quarterback series, struggling to land guys for season two. And then just some of my thoughts on a conference that was near and dear to me growing up, the Pack 12, it's now dead. So some thoughts on conference re-alignment.

I think the schedule this week, we'll just do a podcast. For Monday, Tuesday, I'll probably do one Wednesday and Thursday as well. Nothing on Friday because I'm going to Tahoe this weekend and just, I don't know. It probably the game plan will just be four straight podcasts, a lot of football talk, a lot of need to get a way out of the heat.

And I'm just not sure on the internet connection. So it's probably easier instead of doing Friday's podcast, I'll just do it for Thursday. And we will do a mailbag, I'm sure, multiple days this week at John Middlecom. at John Middilkoff is the Instagram. Fire in those DMs. Need your guys' content.

We'll definitely probably do a big mailbag for Thursday's podcast. And then this weekend we got a bunch of preseason games, which I think I saw Sean Payton said Russell Wilson will play. So I would imagine preseason is always, you know, can be hit or miss. Just depends on who plays. Other than that, I think that's it. If you listen on Collins feed, make sure you subscribe to three and out. Appreciate everyone that listens through the three and out feed.

as well as if you want some three and out merch, go to thevolume.com, the volume.com. Get yourself a flex-fit hat. They look good as well as the trucker hat. So go get yourself one of those. And like I said, we'll just bang out podcasts all week and just keep the content flowing. But first, go grab your smartphone and download the GameTime app. Download the GameTime app. They are the official ticketing app of this podcast.

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official ticketing app of this podcast, game time. Love these guys. I want to start with the Ravens. And I've had them red flagged since the offseason and they fired Greg Roman. Because anytime that an offense, just like a business, makes a dramatic change or has a change in the philosophy of what made them successful and tries to go a different route, it's always not only risky, it can be devastating. And what made the Ravens and Lamar Jackson, when he's been on the field, a consistent power is the running game

and a run-based offense. The problem is in 2023, and really the last over half decade, anytime that's kind of your thing and you have a quote-unquote star quarterback, the media, the fans, the owner, the player always want to do more with their honor. They want to throw.

even though your legs and the running game are what is making you successful. I saw it years ago, ironically, with the same quarterback with Colin Kaepernick. What made the 49ers awesome under Harbaugh and Greg Roman was on offense at least, because defensively, a lot like the Ravens, they've been very good. They were very good. But it was the threat of the quarterback running and a run game that was very, very difficult to stop. And then by 2014, after back-to-back conference championships and a Super Bowl berth, they wanted more.

And they tried to spread it out and throw it a lot. And it was a disaster. And I see a similar thing happening here with the Ravens, is that they pay the quarterback a lot of money. A lot of people wonder if that's a sustainable offense, which is a fair question. Not necessarily in the regular season, but in the playoffs, it has stalled for them. You have to be able to complete passes on third and eight. a tie game in January. It's the only way you can win a Super Bowl. But to get to a Super Bowl, you have to win games in the regular season. And typically, you got to put up a lot of points.

And the reason the Ravens consistently did that when Lamar was on the field was their run-based offense. And a lot had to do with him, who is arguably the greatest running quarterback we've ever seen. I know statistically guys have more total yards or whatever, but you could make the argument that with the ball in his hands, he's the best running quarterback of all time. I would hear other guys. I'm not saying for a fact, that's the case. But if you made that argument, I would listen long and hard to you. But like it's happened many times before, they went, well, you got to pass the ball.

We got to spread it out. On Saturday, the Ravens threw nine interceptions in practice. Let me repeat that. Nine interceptions in practice. I've been going to training camps in the National Football League for well over a decade. Picks happen, right? Just like the game. Interceptions are going to happen.

a couple. Nine, that's fucking outrageous. And the tweet I saw from the reporter all capped the word nine. Because if you've been going to practices in college and definitely the pro, that is a lot of interceptions. And Lamar counted for four. And here's the problem. I think any time a business who is successful gets away or tries to do something different from what made them special, it's not only always a big risk, it can have devastating. consequences. And I understand in theory, like, let's spread it out. Let's throw it all the time. Is that the best use of your most important asset in Lamar Jackson? I'm all for throwing it a little bit more. But to me, getting away from the offense, which started to separate you, because never forget, after that Super Bowl, whatever, in 2013, they went through a very, very rough stretch for Joe Flacco. And then when they inserted Lamar Jackson after they drafted him,

and really for a couple years stretch, the reason they had a lot of success is because their run offense became dominant. Now, the year he won the MVP, I think he threw 35, 36 touchdowns. He's obviously proven much better passer than most of us that I was not the biggest fan coming out of college.

He blew by my expectations. But what truly separates him is his legs. And when you try to spread it out and throw it all the time, you're asking for potential something not to go well. And listen, I'm not acting like the Ravens are going to just stink. But I've had this red flag since the moment they hired them and the moment they have been talking over and over and over about spreading it out and passing it more. There's a reason in and out doesn't sell tacos. They know what they do well.

They got about three items on the menu. Now, you could make the argument to win the Super Bowl. You have to be able to throw it. Of course you do. You're going to have to complete some third in longs. and an offense that's predicated purely on the run game, which I think the argument was it was way too dependent on that. And he didn't get the reps throughout the season of, you know,

the passing situations. It became harder for them in the playoffs. It's kind of why they stalled out multiple times. But you got to get there. And in a situation where the conference is really loaded and full of a lot of really good deep teams, obviously really good quarterbacks. if you take away his best assets, asset, which is his legs and an offense which dominated on the ground, and you start going closer to the middle of the pack instead of the front of the pack,

and your passing game is just average, you're asking for not being a playoff team. So when I see that they threw nine interceptions and your starter at four, I go, God, I worried about this coming into camp. Now, ultimately practice, as Alan Iverson would say, practice, practice. a time to screw up. It's a time to learn. It's a time to figure things out. It's actually the time to throw interceptions, right? It's not winning or losing you a game, especially in early August. But it is a little reflective. Like, they got a long, long way to go. Now, if you wanted to make the argument, this was for two, three years down the road, I'd hear you. But we know the NFL

lives, you know, season by season. And this is a situation now where there's a ton of pressure, they're paying this guy all this money, and we just know the way the league turns on you. We saw it last year with Russell Wilson. It's like, what made Russell so special as a player? His athleticism, him making plays with his legs to throw, not even to run quite like Lamar, but just keep plays a lot.

Well, what did Russell really want to do? He wanted to throw it like Peyton Manning and Tom Brady, just sit in the pocket. Russell, that's not who you are like Lamar. And I know this is not, Maybe this is Lamar's view too, but the Ravens, you do not have Patrick Mahomes. This is not Joe Burrow or Justin Herbert. That is not this player.

Do what he does well. And then build the passing game off that. If you're going to get into a position where you're throwing 45 times a game, I'm going to bet against you. I don't think you're going to maximize your potential. And it feels like they're force feeding this. It feels like this is what they wanted from the ownership down. And I think they're playing with fire. I really do.

I saw Jim Harbaugh and forced Greg Roman to spread it out because of their organization philosophy and crashed and burn. And this is making me nervous. This is an organization that I tend to just give the benefit of the doubt to, just feel like a playoff team. But I don't know, man. I got my spidey senses up and I've had it since their comments in the springtime. But when I see stuff like this, I got a red flagged. I really do. Sean McVey He was a guy that really changed everything in the preseason I know Coward credits him with kind of ruining the preseason

because he had this veteran-laden team he had star players and this happened even before Stafford got there right Todd Gurley Cooper Cup Robert Woods Andrew Whitworth Aaron Donald they just had a ton of big names

that never played a snap in the preseason and you know what I agreed I was like would have done the same thing, totally understand where he's coming from. Like, makes complete sense. I wouldn't play those guys either. And I told Coward the other day because I believe this to my core, I think they got a chance to be fucking terrible. I think they could really stink because their margin for error with like three players.

It used to be like eight players. Well, now Jalen's gone. Whitworth, long gone. I mean, it's three guys. Cup, Donald, and Stafford. Well, Cooper Cup's already hurt. McVeigh's downplaying that. Matt Stafford, we know at any minute,

can have elbow, shoulder problems. And Aaron Donald, I don't care if you're LT in his prime, Reggie White in his prime, if I put you on a team that's not very good, you can't win me games. You can't, you could have an incredible season, 17 sacks, a sack a game. We could still lose 16 games.

I mean, I don't think they're going to go one in 16. But I said this before, and I'll say it again, the year the Warriors lost Kevin Durant. Curry got hurt, Clay was hurt, they won 15 games. And they almost had the number one overall pick. I think this team is circling the drain. I think Sean McVeigh kind of knows it. He was asked about his ideas, you know, based on the past, what he plans on doing in the preseason. Here was his quote.

We're still kind of working through that, but it will be very different than the kind of what you guys have been accustomed to. The guys that have been big contributors that have played a lot of snaps will still lean toward being smart with them. But for the most part, there's going to be a lot of guys who are playing and very few guys who won't be. You know why? They don't have that many star players anymore. There's only a couple of them. The entire team, we don't know, we'll see. That's usually what a bad team is.

They have no clue. And we know last year, their team was a little better. Jaylin was on this team last year. Now he had a bad season, but Robert Woods, these guys are gone. I mean, Alan Robinson,

they traded away. They don't even have that. And I know he had a bad season, but they don't even have the veteran players. They are a Matt Stafford missing six, seven games away from winning three football games. Now, big picture might be the best thing to happen to the franchise, right?

They got their picks. They could draft a quarterback. That means they would have other picks and other rounds. They could replenish and kind of reset. But this is a guy that burns, hot. And a lot like Gruden, it's hard to go through, even early on if you realize this team's not going to be that good. This guy gets to the office like four in the morning. This dude grinds. It's all worth it when you're competing for Super Bowls and you're competing to win divisions

and competing to win playoff games, which he did basically every season before last year, right? It makes you feel like you're working toward a goal. I always struggled. I couldn't relate to the coaches. It's like you're putting in like 20 hours a day. You got a three win team. Like what a waste of time? You know, you guys all could be fired. Now, McVease, obviously, they could not win a game. He's not going to get fired. But he doesn't know how to do it any other way. It's why the article that came out about him a couple years ago, retirement came up. It's like, you know, we're thinking about starting a family. It's like, yeah, Sean, most coaches in the NFL have kids. You're not going to be the first guy coaching a football team with children.

But I think he knows himself. He burns hot. It's not easy to go through this transition. Now, they set themselves up for this. I have no problem with them selling out over the years with all their picks to try to win games because it worked. I'm always foreign baseball selling prospects to get a star player. You want my entire farm system for Otani? You want everything for Juan Soto?

Here you go. Because 99% of these guys aren't going to be shit, right? just like draft picks. It's always, I can't believe he traded three ones for this player. You have no clue who those ones are going to be. For every JJ Watt and Aaron Donald, there are a ton of Taco Charlton's and Cleland Furles.

You are not guaranteed anything just because you have a high pick. But I do think this is going to be a good time for McVeigh. If he can handle this season, take his foot off the gas a little bit, just bottom out. And I think he's already kind of telling you with his words. We don't know. what we got, we're already injured.

This team has been really shitty written all over it. The quarterback Netflix series, obviously people involved with the volume are involved in that series. Colin was a huge part of it. We advertise, they did advertising on this podcast. It was very, very well done. They got the biggest star in the sport who won the MVP and won the Super Bowl, who had, you know, the injury. It was fantastic television.

they had easily one of the most polarizing players of the last 20 years in Cousins. You could argue Marriota wasn't even needed. You could have just gone off Cousins and Mahomes. But one thing is pretty clear is this Netflix series who got picked up. They're having a season two. No different than in golf, full swing or an F1, right? They have success. It's cool insight, right?

In golf, the Netflix series, It's kind of important, right? These guys don't have teams and brands where they don't really have to do anything and just get free marketing, right? Like, if you play for the Cowboys, Dak Prescott doesn't even need to talk and he's getting free marketing. Same with Mahomes. Like, Mahomes didn't need to do that to get the pub and the fame, right?

Just being a really good player. In some of these individual sports, it definitely helps, and it definitely helps in golf. In football, like, and I heard Colin weeks ago go on this rant, like Mahomes are a lot of credit. he did not need to do this. He's already super rich and was super accomplished. He only had stuff to lose. And he still agreed to do it.

So a lot of respect. Cousins, I think probably knew like, let's show like, I'm a pretty good guy. I'm working my ass on. I think a lot of people will like me and kind of get off my case. And honestly, I would agree most people you talk to that have watched that series will go, I kind of like cousins. I think I'm in a root for him. I know that's where I felt.

And when you see this, I saw a headline that Trevor. Lawrence just turned down the Netflix series. And I was thinking like, is it really that crazy for him to turn it down? He's been one of the most hype players ever, played at Clemson that had a million people paying attention to him, gets drafted number one overall, now has his career kind of rolling, and is a good season away from signing a $200 million contract. So from a financial standpoint, doesn't need this at all. I saw a clip, I think it was last week of Peyton Manning.

And you know, in Green Bay, they ride their bikes out to training camp, right? So you ride your bike out to training camp and it's cool. The fans are all lined up there on the fence. And Peyton Manning was walking out to practice and he was signing autographs. And I saw LaFleur say it was awesome enough. Payton there. Talk to the coaches, talk to the team. One thing that, like, if I had to have a theory on that one,

Peyton was there kind of recruiting Jordan Love. And I'd make the argument to Netflix. I don't even know if you need a superstar player. Like, you could just get middle of the road, high brand guys. If you got Jordan Love, Kenny Pickett, and one other NFL starting quarterback, let's even say, Gino Smith, I think the series will be fine. Because the brand of football, the insight that you get, automatically with the way the show is conducted,

like you get the coaches, you get the other players. It's pretty entertaining. Like, I don't think it's going to be clearly very, very difficult for them to get famous. like Russell Wilson ain't doing it, right? Justin Herbert turned it down. A lot of these guys, Jalen Hertz, turned it down. They don't need it financially. And with how popular and how just big the sport is,

the quarterbacks talk like multiple times a game. They don't need it for the publicity. So I would go a little off the beaten path. And to me, Jordan Love would make all the sense in the world. Packers huge brand, story incredible. Right. If he's awesome, it's a fantastic story. if he's shitty, it's fantastic.

You really can't lose. So that was my theory on why Paid Manning was there, recruiting Jordan Love, and that's who I'd be going after. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential.

Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying.

Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music.

The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast.

I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know.

I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history.

Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, conference realigned it. Last time, I guess I did a podcast on Thursday, it wasn't by any means official. that the PAC 12 had lost Oregon and Washington officially ending the conference, but by Friday, by about lunchtime, Pacific Standard time, Oregon and Washington had decided to join the Big 10, joining USC and UCLA, and Arizona State, Utah, Arizona and Colorado already had, but had officially joined the Big 12, essentially ending the Pac-12. Now, I want to preface it by saying this.

I never went to an NFL game until I worked in the NFL. I grew up in Davis that at the time UC Davis was a Division II program. So the biggest football games I had ever gone into my life until I started working in football post-college were games at the University of Cal Berkeley. My dad, my grandpa had taught there forever. It was about 45-minute drive. My dad was a season ticket holder. And we used to go watch USC. Washington, Oregon, UCLA.

It was fucking awesome. Like it was my big time sport, right? Being able to watch these guys, some of them that would obviously, from Tony Gonzalez, I remember watching Keishon Johnson. I love the Pac-12.

Born and raised on the West Coast. Those were the teams I watched in football and obviously basketball as well. We had a good family friend, John Hofer, who played for UCLA with Jason Capono and some of their really good teams. and I love the conference.

I love everything it stood for. I was definitely not smart enough to get into any Cal, UCLA, Stanford, USC. We wouldn't have the money. I probably wasn't mature enough. I got into schools like Oregon and Arizona, but I didn't quite have the balls or the foresight. If I could do it over again, I probably would have taken a chance to kind of go out of state,

but I did not go to a Pact 12 school, but I love the conference up until the end of it. and this is a pro-business, pro-money show. So I completely understand why all this happens. Football is now a television sport. And football, especially in college athletics, is the sport that pays for everything. I saw this coach in Missouri.

I don't want to screw up his name, Dershowitz or something, go on this rant about like, what about the other student athletes, like the baseball players and the gymnasts and the soccer? nobody cares about any of those sports when these moves happen. Why? Because none of those sports exist without the money that football generates. And a huge reason the PAC 12 started dying and getting lapped years ago, because they hired this guy named Larry Scott, some Ivy League tennis player, who had these grand visions of being the conference that really put gymnastics and baseball and

soccer on an equal playing field of football and men's basketball. And it's not. It never will be. Those sports do not generate the same money. They don't generate any money. They lose money. And the Pact 12 network, which they tried to be very progressive and just be able to be self-sufficient.

They didn't need ESPN. They didn't need Fox. They didn't need anyone else. They could handle it on their own. But they didn't put foot. as priority number one. They put everything on equal footing. And it was a disaster.

It was actually an embarrassment. And I'm not trying to diminish or downgrade those other sports. My child is not going to play D1 Power 5 college football. That would be the upset of the world. If he does play any college athletics, he's much more likely to end up playing tennis or golf, one of those Olympic sports that doesn't generate any money. Right?

So, and listen, a lot of you listening, if your child is, that's awesome. But just know, the reason that shit exists is because of football. Some schools, men's basketball, but football at any big program is generating 70 to 85% of the revenue for the entire athletic program. And the PAC 12 lost side of that as a conference. And a lot of these schools, academics, means everything to them. And that's their prerogative. That's fine. but academics mean a lot to a lot of these programs in the Big Ten, a lot of these schools in the SEC,

but they never undervalued, not just college athletics, but the importance of the sport of football. Because a rising tide lifts all boats. And to me, the growth and the separation of the SEC is directly correlated with Nick Sabin. Because it was Nick Sabin started dominating and kicking everyone's ass and winning year after year, the amount of money that Alabama started making, and then the amount of money that the other teams and that conference started seeing, and the amount, they already had the passion, the amount of resources they all started pumping into their football programs,

and that conference started separating from the PAC, and they've never looked back. They became universally cool in this country. I used to laugh. Like, I'm going to watch Pac-12 games over the SEC. I watch way more SEC games now than Random Pack-12 games. Why? It's a better product.

They pay their coaches and they get better players. Like it's just the whole thing feels bigger. The Big Ten, who I think sometimes can be overvalued, I've never argued their vision on how important football is. Now, they've been carried mainly by Ohio State that operates like an SEC program and now Harbaugh and Michigan is rolling. And I think some of these other programs realize the importance of trying to get like that. But the moment you add USC with Lincoln Riley and now Oregon, who cares a shitload about football, it's going to help the conference immensely.

Now, big picture, football, where this whole thing is headed, and I believe this to my core, is an NFC AFC. So you get, let's say, 40 to 50 programs are all playing under the same umbrella, and only those programs can go to the 12-team playoff. if you're not part of that, you're not in the club. Maybe it's a little more. Maybe it's 60. Maybe it's 75. You add some of these big 12 teams. You add some of these ACC teams.

But you can see where it's all going. Like, it's not going toward equality. Because equality in sports doesn't work. That's not the way it's ever worked. The top end in college football and college basketball have always separated from the pack. and they always will. And when they're in these positions now, I had someone with a,

I'd say a program that's going to compete for the national championship this year. Reach out to me. And he said, I hear you on your AFC, NFC idea, but one major difference is in the NFL, all 32 teams are under the same umbrella. So at the end of the year,

when they pay out from the television deal, the Jacksonville Jags make the same as the Cowboys and the 49ers. There is no difference than a six-win Raider team and a 14-15 win Eagles team in terms of the television revenue. They're all treated as equal partners. We're in college football. You have some of these teams like in the SEC make a different amount than the Big Ten teams now than the ACC teams. It's going to still take a while for everyone to get on the same footing.

But I think what's inevitable now is for these college football bohemist powerhouse and just revenue cash cash. to all bind together and work as one and get under the same umbrella. Now, that might take a little time, but that's where it's headed. And ultimately, the PAC 12, too many teams, too much poor leadership. It wasn't, they didn't see themselves like that. And when they started to realize that that's where everything was going, it was too late. You got to strike where the iron's hot. It's hard if you're a podcast or just starting a podcast now.

Good luck. It's going to be very, very difficult. But if you saw it 10 years ago, seven years ago, you could get a jump on everybody. And that's what a lot of these conferences did. It's why I've seen a lot of people, you know, kind of crush the new Pac-12 commissioner. The guy was handed a shit sandwich and expected to make filet mignon. It wasn't possible. There was nothing he could have done.

Like when people are like, I can't believe he handed all the presidents a deal that was based on incentives. he didn't have any other options. There were no television partners lined up to give him a lot of money. Now, when I saw the package that he offered him, the Apple package based on subscriptions, I went, of course Oregon and Washington were never going to sign that. Those were type deals I used to sign in the podcast business eight years ago. It was like, hey, we'll pay on how many subscriptions or how many people use the promo codes. In 2023, it's called flat rates.

you want it on this? This is what it costs. That's how the SEC operates. That's how the Big Ten operates. Even though when I saw that they were going to make way less than even the Big 12, but with a certain amount of subscriptions or people signing up, they could have eventually got to like $50 million, though the PAC 12 to me does not have the following the consistent passion to hit those numbers. If the SEC and the Big Ten signed a contract like that with one of the streamers,

I think those programs could make $100 million to school. Like, to me, that's where I saw might not be this deal, but that's where ESPN's dying. I had a guy that's a big part of a major program tell me, one thing that makes a lot of these programs in the ACC, like the Clemsons, the Florida States, the Dukes, the North Carolina's about jumping to the ACC is people don't think ESPN long term has that much money. Like they've extended themselves so far. They're holding on for dear life right now. right they're leaking oil at a rapid rate where fox and i've seen a lot of people say this and it's true they were a part of the destruction of the pack 12 of course they are they want to develop something in the big 10 add USC ad uccela now get Oregon and Washington they can take on the SEC in terms of

ratings in terms of interest and make more money they're not paying as much and they can get the ratings, right? Because the Big Ten has enormous fan bases. Why? Their schools are huge. Google how many people go to Ohio State? Google how many people go to Wisconsin? Schools are massive. When you have massive schools and you have success in athletics, you get massive fan bases, right? The reason the Yankees and the Cowboys and the Dodgers are such big ratings draws, they have the most fans. So it was sad, inevitable. The Pac-12 only has Larry Scott to blame the presidents to blame. Never forget a couple years ago in the height of COVID.

Pac-12 was like, we're not playing. The Big Ten, same thing. Like, we're quitting. The SEC never flinched. They were like UFC and Dana White. Like, fuck yeah, we're playing. They were operating in a different world. Their fans never thought twice about playing football.

If it wouldn't have been for Justin Fields and Ryan Day and Jim Harbaugh and some of the dudes in the Big Ten, the power brokers, the Big Ten would not have played football in 2020. The only reason the PAC 12 played any football in 2020 is because those people in the Big Ten pushed it to happen. Like it just, it doesn't matter as much out here. And overall, Cal, like, they don't deserve to be a Power 5 program anymore. Not that the coaches and the players don't care. No one in that operation beside those individuals gives a shit. Do you know what they deserve to play? Like UC Davis and Cal Poly. Stanford probably desert belongs in the Ivy League now.

Washington State, Oregon State, ton of respect for those programs. I love watching them on TV. They should probably play Fresno State, Boise State, and San Diego State. Feels right. Oregon and Washington belong with Ohio State and Michigan. Obviously, USC as well.

The irony with USC is they have been really, really shitty and underachieved beside last year post Pete Carroll. It's been a disaster. yet their brand and their importance a lot like Texas is very, very important. It's why Texas and Oklahoma ultimately went to the SEC. Money. You can't operate in this modern day. We're all living in it, the inflation, the cost of everything.

Well, the cost of travel, I heard this like, what about the cost of soccer? They don't care. It doesn't matter. That's a line item to them. It doesn't matter, man. That's just the least of their worries. anyone arguing about any of the other sports besides football and men's basketball

is a waste of your breath. It's just an expense. It already was. It just gets a little bit bigger. But now they make a little bit more money. And from just a nostalgic point and just as a fan of college sports, yeah, it kind of sucks.

It does. The difference this time around of like the moment Oklahoma and Texas and obviously USC and UCLA, we all kind of became numb to it. Like this is, it was clear where everything was headed. Oregon and Washington had to look out for themselves. So when I see some of these, like the president at Washington State, Oregon State get mad,

like, welcome to the way business works. Mergers, acquisitions. You're either growing or dying. And the PAC 12 was dying. And it was dying rapidly. But Oregon as a program or Washington as a program was not dying. They were growing and they outgrew the region, the importance. And the irony with Oregon is, and I read an article in the athletic talking about it,

is they always skirted this line very, very well of like this small town program who actually for a long period of time had the same coaches on the staff forever. Like Mike Bellotti had the same coaches for like 15 years. When he kind of got ousted for Chip Kelly, Chip did not bring in 25 new guys. they kept the entire staff. And when Chip left to the Eagles, Helfrich, who was on that staff, got elevated, got elevated.

They didn't really start operating like one of these kind of crazy programs. They were making a lot of money and having a ton of success, but they kind of had this loyal thing to them. They were kind of an outlier. Like USC was firing people left and right and even they were hanging on to the peak Carol days,

but they were constantly going through people, new coaches all the time. That was not the way Oregon was operating. They were kind of like, Like, in a weird way, this multi-million dollar powerhouse mom and pop shop when it came to the football program. And they kind of changed the moment they fired Helfridge. And they started hiring the Florida guys in Willie and in Mario. And obviously now Dan Lanning, who feels a little more loyal than those guys, right, feels like he's in it to win it now for the long run, which makes sense.

They just gave him an extension. But all this stuff, it's like, you got to change and you got to adapt if you want to survive. I've, you know, whenever I see these media people complain, it's like, stop living in the fucking past, man. Stop looking in the rear view. Look forward. Stop complaining. Like, no one wants to read as a writer.

Well, then create a YouTube channel. Create a podcast. There are a lot of avenues people are consuming stuff. Maybe they just don't consume it like they did 15, 20, 30 years ago. Things change. Originally sports in like the 50s and 60s were enormous on radio. Then television happened. And now streamings happen.

like things will continue to adapt, right? There are cars that literally drive without a human being. If I would have told you that like 10 years ago, I'd be like, what? Now people are in them left and right in all these big cities. That's how Uber operates. It's only going to continue.

And conference realignment sucks because of what we thought about in our youth. But, you know, once upon a time, Utah was a small whack program. Then they went to the Mountain West, then they went to the Pack 12. Now they're in the Big 12. They'll eventually be in one of the top. two leagues when that because that's that's where we're going but no one can blame anyone

else beside Larry Scott and just the mindset of the conference they killed themselves they really did as a whole right the ACC really cares about sports it means a lot to their programs so same with academics right you don't think Duke's a good academic school you don't think North Carolina is a good academic school their programs care deeply about academics as well Well, as athletic. Same with the Big Ten. I even talk to a buddy about some of these SEC schools. It's not as easy to get into as someone would think. I just don't think a lot of these programs, I know for a fact, with Cal, really care. They really don't. Like, I see Arizona State since living here.

I always thought, like, why isn't this program better? I always thought the same thing about San Diego State. I think the program kind of is what it is. They're going to be easily one of the worst programs in the Big 12 when they get there. Because this is like, it's just kind of average. they just, I think in theory they care about sports, right? But they're just not as good. They're baseball golf school, right? They kind of belong probably in the Big 12th. They wouldn't belong in like the Big Tanner of the SEC, right?

Oklahoma, Texas care deeply. It doesn't mean they're always going to be good. Hell, I think just already too much hype on Sark in Texas, I would bet them to win like eight, nine games max. But no one can argue how much those two schools care. Venables last year was a last year. It was a disaster. One of the worst years in my 38 years of life at that program.

But no one ever argued like, oh, they kind of stopped Karen, wave the white flag. That ain't their problem. I think sometimes out here it's just like they waved their white flag. Like, whatever, we'll just kind of be average. That is not the mindset of these, the big conferences now.

And there's just, I never understood. I'll just end this, I'll end on this by not putting football first. When you put football first, everyone else benefits. The golf teams in the SEC fly private. That's not because the golf teams make a lot of money.

It's because their football programs print money. And they got to spend it somewhere. Their soccer teams are better because of their football programs. And I saw it first and foremost for years under Larry Scott. It was just like, oh, let's care about gymnastics. Let's care about women's softball. No one cares. not a soul.

I saw everyone arguing talking shit about Rapino and the women's soccer team on social media. I'm on so many group text messages talking about sports. No one has even mentioned

women's soccer. Ultimately, that's a story that feels really big on social media that no one actually gives a shit about in reality. Like, no one cares. They just don't.

If you win championships, cool, but if you're bad, no one's paying attention. And I think that's kind of the pack 12 fell off a cliff. The volume. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite.

Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel.

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