The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 and Out - Tua + Pickett Problems, Mahomes/Reid Clinic, Rodgers Pass

Episode Date: October 24, 2022

John reacts to the Dolphins SNF win over the Steelers, why it was a mistake for the Steelers to take Kenny Pickett, why he’s worried about Tua over the long term. He also discusses Andy Reid’s play calling clinic against the Niners, Pete Carroll’s post-Russ redemption, and why he’s not crushing Aaron Rodgers for the Packers terrible start. Subscribe NOW and follow Middlekauff and The Volume on Twitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest content. It's always FanDuel for the best wagering action! #Volume #herdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Just watch a little Sunday night football. Let's dive in. We have a lot of stuff to discuss, some quarterback thoughts, some thoughts on Andy Reed and Patrick Mahomes. Pete Carroll might not be the village idiot. The Denver Broncos might have some issues as well as the Green Bay Packers. And then there's a lot of other football stuff that I will get into on Tuesday. Tuesday's podcast. But if you listen on Collins feed, make sure you subscribe to the three and

out feed. Greatly appreciate everyone that does. Also, Middilkoff mailbag, we throw on Tuesday, and we also put on on Sundays at John Middlecopf as the Instagram. Fire into those DMs. Fire into those DMs. Get your questions answered on the show. Really easy to do. A lot of football talk. Yeah, a lot of contemplating the league and some big picture stuff with, any, you can ask me anything. I don't care. but God, what a day. You know, in theory, not a great day on paper, but I do think that we learned a lot about football.

Okay, let's start with the Sunday night game. And, you know, you obviously had two first-round quarterbacks going against each other. And funny, I was, I actually had a long phone call with an NFL offensive coordinator over the last couple days. And we spent a long time talking about football. I mean, that's what football guys like to talk about football. and the draft came up. And he had an opinion that he said he's told different teams he's worked for, and he talked about draft picks.

And whenever he talks with general managers, he always says that draft picks are pretty overrated. And he's not talking about first round picks, high first round picks, or even good second round picks. His point was whenever you can package a third, a fourth, a fifth round, some group of that for starting NFL players, it's a no-brainer. Because when you look at the percentage of third,

four, fifth, six-rounders that start on a yearly basis individually for teams, it's pretty hit or miss. And I was like, you know, and I tend to lean like, I'm pro draft picks, right? I was a scout and loved the draft

and I love the economic value of picks. And I was like, you know, I do understand that. When the Niners traded a third round pick to get Trent Williams, when the Eagles traded a third round pick to get Darius, slay. I mean, there are some no-brainers, like for a little bit extra money on your cap.

Who gives a shit? Totally in agreement. And it ultimately led us to talking about the third overall pick a couple years ago for Mac Jones. And I said, under no circumstances, could you take Mac Jones at number three? And he immediately pushes back. He says, well, if you think Mac Jones is a really good player and going to be your starter, why not? And I, I said, well, because when you draft quarterbacks high, it's about attributes. I can get average attribute quarterbacks. Dak Prescott is a good example. Kirk Cousins is a good example.

Hill, Jimmy Garoppolo is a good example. Pass the first round. We have a long history. And drafting a guy high does not guarantee he's going to be a good player. You have no clue. There is no guarantee on any draft pick, whether the guy's name is Trevor. Lawrence or whether he's Mr. Irrelevant. Nobody knows, ever, or else we would never have any misses in the draft. Guys like Richard Sherman would, George Kittle, and these guys would never go,

Jason Kelsey go late in the draft. It would never happen. All the sweet players would go high, all the crappier players would go late. As we know, that doesn't happen. And ultimately, my take about the quarterback position was, it's about traits. And you are, when you're drafting high, you are swinging for the fences because there is no guaranteed floor. If there was a guaranteed floor, the high floor guys would always hit. And we all know that is not the case.

Right? And there's no guarantee that the high ceiling guys are going to hit. But when I draft high a quarterback, I like them to have physical attributes. Because if they do hit, they become a star. Look, several years ago, when the Buffalo Bills traded up to get Josh Allen at number seven, they took a, obviously the person, one thing we've known about quarterbacks, the person means a lot.

Your character, your focus, you know, who you are as a guy. Why Kyler Murray has struggled, why Baker Mayfield has struggled. I get that. So I'm assuming the guy is a high character guy and then I lean on the traits if I'm going to draft high. And still, like I said, that does not guarantee me anything. But I want to avoid the low ceiling guys when I'm drafting high. because if they just don't hit, and even if they become 70% of ideally what you want,

they're not going to be as good. And I think when you watch this game the night, the number one reason I was against taking Kenny Pickett super high, he does not have the physical attributes. And one thing we've seen with time to Atanga by Loa, when you just compare his physical attributes to Justin Herbert, they're not even in the same world. And like I've said before about Justin Fields, there is more to quarterback play than just arm strength, size, speed.

I get that. But ultimately, you have to have some of that. And usually if you're going to be a guy getting drafted relatively, you know, in the top 100 picks, you're going to have some of that going for you as a quarterback. But when I draft low-ceiling quarterbacks, Tua is one, picket is one. I'm going to be limited. I have to have him maximize every ounce of his talent just to compete to be the 11th, 12th, 13th, best quarterback. Think of the group of quarterbacks, right, that are the top 7, 8 guys.

Herbert, I mean, Alan, Mahomes, I think Herbert is kind of on the outside, but physically he's in there. Lamar, obviously, Brady, Rogers. Even Kyler, he drives us nuts. His physical attributes are stupid. his ceiling is really high. And then there's the group of Dak Prescott, Kirk Cousins, Derek Carr.

None of those guys were drafted in the first round. And they have all maximized their ceiling, right? Kirk Cousins cannot get any better than he actually is. Dak Prescott has maximized his ability. And those guys are always competing at their best to be top 10 quarterbacks and most people never put them there. Now, they're good starting quarterbacks

on teams that can make the play. playoffs, but I never want to draft guys that look like Kenny Pickett, that look like Tuotong of I Loa, high. Because their limitations will always, there's always a coin flip when we're drafting. It's so hard to play the position just to begin with. And as you see, most guys do not maximize their talent. And most guys just do not, the NFL's hard. So even if they become the most of what they can be, it still might be slightly above average. And when I watch Kenny Pickett, I never think he's going to be a star quarterback. Just like I said about Mac Jones two years ago, I would never have taken him three. Hell, that makes me want to

throw up in my mouth. And even when Belichick took him at 15th, I mean, I just, where was he actually going to go? Was he going to go in the next 15 picks? I doubt it. But the reality is that those type guys will usually intend to never be, even if they maximize their skills, top 10 guys. Now, if you build a great team and Miami has a very talented team. The Steelers have a very talented team and they still struggle. Now, I know Tua's coming off the head injury and Kenny Pickett's a rookie, but like you don't need to be Bill Parcells or Bill Walsh or Bill Polion to watch these guys play and go, yeah, their arms are pretty average. Their arms, they struggle to make basic throws. They throw a very interceptable ball, you know. And listen, I tend to lean strong arms.

quarterbacks, but when I watch that, I go, yeah, I think both those teams drafted their quarterbacks way too high. And speaking of the Dolphins, as you saw tonight, Tua, luckily athletes, I think like a lot of entrepreneurs the last couple years, their risk tolerance is completely different than the media. I mean, the media, and listen, I even said the moment Tua stumbled on the Sunday game, he shouldn't have played the next Thursday game, but I've never, I I struggle with this, right? Because I don't want anyone to get hurt, but I enjoy football for the violence of the game.

And there are risks that are inherent with playing the sport. There are 11 guys on one side of the ball that are trying to inflict, you know, pain, not injure anyone, but have a violent collision and take them to the ground every single snap on defense. And while the game is less brutal in the sense that the head hitting has been taken out with targeting

and the way the game is coached and obviously the way the game is officiated the guys have never been faster top to bottom. We've never had quicker defensive linemen. We've never had faster linebackers and obviously our corners now, basically every corner runs a 4-4. And there is just an inherent violence in the game

when you're playing quarterback, when you're playing wide receiver, when you're playing running back. And there's nothing you can do to ever officiate or regulate it out of the game. It's called tackle football. And so when Tua got hurt, we all, it was a queasy moment. It was tough to watch, but it's part of the sport.

I mean, I grew up a big 49er guy. Steve Young, his career ended on a concussion laid out by Aeneas Williams. It's been happening forever and it will continue to happen. But as you saw most of the media, and I think most people like, Tua just leave. Don't play anymore. Well, there's a balance of protecting guys from themselves, which is key, right? because athletes, especially with concussions, will always want to come back into the game.

But like I said, Miami and the league kind of started manipulating it. They started making up the rules. Like, if you pass concussion protocol, which you did a week ago, he just wasn't allowed to play because it was really more of a cover your ass moment, not because there were some protocol.

The protocol was set by medical doctors, the league, and the union, and they just recreated it on the fly because of the public images we all saw. And then when Tua came back, everyone's watching him play tonight because Sunday night football is the number one show in America. And you would think, I would imagine most people watching him like, Tua would be very hesitant to do stuff. Meanwhile, I look up the television today.

Tua is running. He's lowering his shoulder on contact. There was zero hesitate. One thing you could never take away from Tua Tonga Vailoa. Don't love his hype. Don't love his athleticism. And I don't, I definitely do not love his arm. But I really admire his stuff.

And I say it all the time with quarterbacks. Any team worth their salt, any GM, and any head coach, they yearn to have elite toughness in their quarterback. Because to win big consistently in the NFL, your quarterback has to be a tough SOB. Might not have to be the toughest guy in your team, but he cannot be a puss. And Tua is tough. But I'm watching him tonight, multiple plays lower shoulder on contact. And the risk tolerance for professional athletes, but specifically,

football players is just dramatically higher than the majority of guys in society. Now, obviously, they have physical gifts that most of us don't have, but part of the reason that you make it to this level and you separate over a period of time in high school and then definitely in college at the highest levels is because you're kind of crazy. And that's a huge element that comes with being a good NFL player. And most guys and most of the great players and the Hall of Fame is littered of them with them has guys that, you know, they don't operate scared. And that's just part of the deal.

And I think it's part of the reason in a weird way that we all love the sport of football. Why the NFL has kind of separated from the pack. I loved the NBA growing up. I mean, loved it. I grew up on Michael Jordan, Shaquille O'Neal, like I was born in the mid-80s. I remember in the 90s when I was watching the NBA

and going to NBA games, the NBA was full of dudes that were pretty fucking crazy. At any moment, like a fight could break out. It was dudes, even though they still, they made a lot of money at the time, not near what they make now. It always felt like dudes were on tilt. And the NFL still has that. And I think that really resonates with people as an entertainment product. You know, have you ever just like Googled some of the baseball fights in the 80s back when baseball was in the heyday? Like, there's a reason big fights do big numbers on pay-per-view. We like that. There's an element of violence. There's

There's an element of unknown. There's an element of craziness that most of us, quote, unquote, normal people in society, you know, kind of are entertained by. And there's an element of that that the NFL brings that, you know, you can't duplicate anywhere else. And the other thing, I got to give this guy some credit because when the chiefs traded Tyree Kill to the Miami Dolphins, I don't know if I thought he would mail it in, but I thought this was a guy who had been at the highest level for half a decade, right?

putting up ungodi numbers, winning, going to AFC championship games, going to multiple Super Bowls, becoming a Super Bowl champ in my mind. Let me see how to say this. The most talented trio I've ever seen. One of the most dominant trios I've ever seen. Just one of the most fun trios in NFL history. Him, Tyreek, or I mean, Tyreek, Mahomes, and Kelsey. And maybe I thought he was going to mail it in.

Remember those guys that when Dan Snyder bought the team, and for like the first 10 years, he would just sign like Albert Hainsworth, Archelette, he would just sign random guys, and they would always suck. Now, he would sign them for a lot of money or trade for him, and then they would suck for his team. I just thought Tyreek would just kind of be going through the motions. Like he'd already done his work, he was getting his money, going to live in Florida, no state income tax, and just kind of chill. Instead, this fucking guy dominates.

Every time I look up, I go, Tyreek is playing every bit as hard as he did for the Chiefs. And I guess you don't get extra credit for playing hard. It's pro sports. It's the NFL. But it's very enjoyable to watch. He is a, he's a freaking awesome player. And ultimately my take on the Steelers, like you know where I stand on Canty Pick and I'm not a huge believer at all. They're just not very good.

I mean, that is just an average football team. And honestly, well below average. I mean, they are headed for the first time in a long time. Obviously, Mike Tomlin has never had a losing season. I think it's basically set in concrete. He's going to have a losing season this year. And part of it is, you know, without TJ, I almost said JJ, without TJ Watt, they're at a huge disadvantage.

But defensively, they're just not quite as good. And offensively, you know, peak Ben hasn't happened for a long time, right? I mean, that guy is three, four, five years away. but I think you're really seeing what you've seen you saw last year with old over the hill bend but even that over the hill bend could manipulate defenses he was so smarty it's seen so much now you're seeing a guy's

that can't do that and they don't have the physical skills you're just seeing an offense that's pretty hard to watch I mean I'll be completely honest if I wasn't making my living off talking about the NFL making my living off just thinking about different takes and angles on these games I probably would have zoned out after the second half.

I'd be watching the Yankee game. Not that the Yankees are that entertaining right now either, but that was watching Tua and Kenny Pickett. That's not exactly Mahomes and Josh Allen. Football season is underway. So now is the perfect time to download FanDuel, America's number one sportsbook, because right now new customers get a no-swet first bet

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For confidential help, Michigan. 1-8-8-Hope-NY, or text, HopeNY, 467-369, New York, Tennessee, 88888-9, Tennessee, 1-800-5-2-4700. Wyoming, visit www.1-800 gambler.net, West Virginia. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential.

Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. I was thinking today I watch the 49ers get their ass kicked by the Chiefs.

And the other night, you know, usually on Saturday nights, the older you get, you know, Sunday for me is like most people's Monday. It's a long day. Now, granted, I'm not digging ditches here. I'm just watching football. But I try to get up at like 6, 6.30, get a workout in, get my day started before even the games come on at 10. Then I just watch football day and do podcasts.

And last night, you know, I wasn't going out or anything. there wasn't any good college football games on, so I turned on the Redeemed team. It's basically this documentary on the late 2000s Olympic basketball team. And a lot of it surrounds Kobe Bryant. And it just makes

you think of the Last Dance. And in The Last Dance, which most incredible documentary I've ever seen, you just realize like the combination of Michael Jordan and Phil Jackson. And sometimes, and over the vid, I also watched the

the Montana documentary. And there are just some like coaching athlete combinations that are just perfect. Like they're just made in basketball heaven or football heaven. And Michael Jordan and Phil Jackson were just made in basketball heaven. Like Pat Riley and Magic Johnson. Joe Montana and Bill Walsh. Bill Parcell's an LT.

Like if you were a football god or a basketball god, that would be your combination. You'd be like, Bill Parcell's LT. made for each other, right? You know, Bill Walsh, who wants an athletic, accurate quarterback, Joe Montana, athletic, super accurate, cool under pressure, boom, put them together, rest is history. And I'm watching Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes today. And I'm thinking, these two fucking guys in football heaven.

You know, John Madden used to talk about, he didn't used to talk about it. He said it when he was introduced as a Hall of Famer in Canton years ago. It might have been like 01 or 02. I don't know the exact year. I think it was maybe 03 or 04. And he basically said that, you know, in a weird way, he's a football junkie. And he thought about before he even got into the Hall of Fame, like in John Madden's world, that when the lights go out, all the bus talk to each other. So you could have Bill Parcells, you know, talking to Tom Landry.

And Tom Landry talking to, you know, Lawrence Taylor. And Ladeney and Tomlinson talking. to Walter Payton, just talking ball. And, you know, even he kind of laughed. You know, it sounds cheesy, but sometimes you, how cool is that? And you watch Patrick Mahomes and Andy Reid, you're like, these guys were meant to be on the sideline, be in the trenches, and work together. Andy Reid is one of the rare offensive linemen.

That's what position he played in college. He went to BYU back in their heyday. He's not a safety. he's not a DB, he's not a wide receiver, he's not some skill guy, he's an offensive lineman. He loves throwing the ball because in the early 80s, BYU was well ahead of the curve. They had Jim McMahon, they had Steve Young, they threw the football lot and they were very successful. They were one of the best programs in the country. And a lot of times where you either play college football or where you coach early on your career, that kind of develops your philosophical belief

in playing the sport. And then when Andy got into the NFL, he went to the Green Bay Packers that immediately traded for a young Brett Farf. And that's who he coached. And it shaped his football philosophy. And then he gets this guy who has a Farvian quality of the pizzazz and the flare and the big arm, but also like a Brady-manning-like level understanding of football and control of the sport from the position. And then he's also been lucky enough to inherited Tyree Kill and Travis Kelsey who might go down as one of the best tight ends.

I mean, in my opinion, he's one of the best tight ends I've ever seen. And then he gets with a coach who, I mean, in my mind, he's the best offensive coach of definitely the last two decades. I mean, of his head coaching career. And they're kicking ass and taking names. I saw a stat today during the Sunday night game. I think Florio tweeted this out that Patrick Mahomes. has won 55 of his first 70 starts. All these two guys are doing or winning.

But sometimes, Andy, like any good coach, like Phil needed Michael Jordan, like Bill Parcells needed LaDanean or Lawrence Taylor, needs their player to make miraculous plays. Pull things out of their ass. Steve Kerr needs it a lot with Steph Curry. And sometimes the player just needs the coach to tell them exactly what to do,

from a schematical standpoint, and it'll work, and it'll make everyone look like a genius. And that's what took place today against the 49ers and Domeco Ryans. A lot of people, including myself, think Domeco Ryans is going to be a head coach in the NFL. And I think he might be a head coach going into next year. Like, he'll get a job this offseason.

Andy Reid today, and don't get a twisted, you know, the media loves to tell you that other people are calling plays. It was clear today. Now, I don't know, it's not like I ask Andy on an individual game, basis. Andy called every fucking play today. The camera was on him. He's reading the plays. Mahomes is calling the plays today. And honestly, it looks like he's been calling the plays all season, the games I've been watching. And he put on a clinic today. And Patrick Mahomes, who has made plays miraculously for the chiefs over the years and made him look really smart, today that was

a clinic by the head coach. And Mahomes just had to drive the bus. And 430 yards later, three touchdowns and a 21 point victory against a team that myself included thought was going to be a Super Bowl contender. They undressed them on the road. That was an old school NFL ass kicking because they outschemed them. They outcoached them and they ran circles around them. So, you know, we've been lucky enough. I know in my sports watching life to see these great combinations, that's as good as you get right there. And speaking of great coach and course, quarterback combinations. It's funny.

Like, you know, I think a lot of things in society can be argued because it's not black and white, right? It happened a lot during the, during the Rona. A lot of different opinions. Even though now, as time has gone on, we know exactly like what worked and what didn't, most didn't work. But like a lot of things in politics and business can be argued on either side. In sports, it's like, did this trade work two years later?

How'd the guy play? How many games you win, right? did this coaching higher work, how many games the guy win? Right? It's very black and white. I say it all the time is my favorite part about sports. It's just, do you win or do you lose? Do you throw a touchdown or do you not?

Like, it's just, do you score points or do you not? Like, it's just, we have concrete data. Like, there's no manipulating the data. Like, you either go 10 and 7 or you go 7 and 10. You can't go, well, no one cares, right? You either win the first round in the playoffs or you go home. It's not debatable. And I think part of the Pete Carroll Russell Wilson discussion,

and there was a huge media narrative that Pete was this archaic idiot and that Russell was this superstar. But they were winning. So we were basically just arguing over something we couldn't quite prove. Like should they be listening to Russ more or should they be listening to Pete more? Even though when they were together, out of 10 years, they had eight winning seasons. Or excuse me, they had eight playoff seasons. They had nine winning seasons.

So it was like it was working. We were basically just arguing something that we couldn't totally prove. Like, Rush should be cooking. Well, it's like we just won 10 games. Well, you could have won 12? It's like, well, could you? I don't know. But it was always up for debate,

and it was one of the more polarizing discussions in all of football. And I'll be honest, I tended to be on the side of Russell Wilson. Like, you know, Russell at this point in time, Pete's old, he's 70 years old, he wants to run the ball. his defense is a little outdated like I'd lean with Russ. I think they're pretty crazy. They were going to lose the transaction when they traded Russ to Denver. Well, we'll get into that in a second. Well, it's pretty clear.

Pete is a winner. He's been winning since he went to USC when he was winning national championships. Then he gets to Seattle, builds the best defense in the league, and won with Russell Wilson, who at the time was not some star quarterback, who at the time was a game. manager. So when they not only won the division consistently, but went to back-to-back Super Bowls, it was when Russ was nowhere near what he became. So when Pete Carroll played to his philosophical beliefs in college and then the first five or six years in Seattle, they didn't

just win, they won big. Now, you could argue that the play call, whatever, I'm just talking about overall success is not debatable. Pete Carroll is a big. Pete Carroll is a winner. And then Russell gets traded. And I've said this forever about Russell. Every offensive coordinator he's ever had in his entire NFL career

has been relieved of his duties. Every single one has been fired. And obviously the Denver thing is a complete disaster. It's got a chance to go down as one of the worst trades of all time. And here's a reality.

We all thought Seattle, they're like, oh, are they going to draft Bryce Young, Will Levis? Like, what quarterback are they going to take? Because they're going to be drafting so high. And you know what it turns out? They are going to be drafting high. But it's going to be with the Denver Broncos pick. They are now four and three.

Now, I don't know if they're going to be a playoff team. I would still bet against it. They actually play the Giants this week at home. Sneaky enormous game. If I would have told you week eight, Seattle hosting the Giants, you could send Fox's number one crew there, and it would be a bigger game than 40 Niners Rams,

you would have been like, put down the drugs, middle cough. Well, it's true. That is the bigger game. Four and three versus six and one. I mean, the Niners and Rams are averages the day as long right now. And one's three and four, and the other's three and three.

So that's where the winners are, and the Rams game is where the losers are right now. So Pete Carroll and his success now, it's coming to light. Like I think we all, as I said last week, I owe Belichick a little bit of apology. He's really good. And he can win games with Bailey Zappy.

He can win games with Mac Jones. Well, Pete Carroll is now winning games with Gino Smith and running the shit out of the ball. You know why Pete likes running the ball? And you know what under Pete Carroll historically? It works. So in Denver Broncos... Do you know what's going to happen with the Denver Broncos?

Their head coach is going to get fired. So for the fourth guy in Russell Wilson's career, an offensive coordinator, and this time a head coach, is going to be giving the walking papers. Because Denver lost day to the Jets. Obviously, Russell didn't play. He's injured.

And you can say, well, you know, they lost because he was injured. What if Russell's just injury prone now? Finger last week. He's got hamstring now, his shoulder, Wolverine blood. Like, let's ride. I mean, give me a break. This season for the Denver, are they going to win six games?

And to me, the question is with Denver. And I know their GM got a lot of credit for drafting CERT, and not taking Justin Fields. Are we sure that he's a lot to keep his job? Because you get a lot of credit for drafting. But I'm a big believer in this. A GM's job is more than just drafting. And who his quarterback is,

whether he acquires that guy via trade, free agency, or the draft, and definitely who his head coach is makes or breaks his career. This guy hired Nathaniel Hackett. And not only traded for Russell Wilson, which I understand. Like I completely, I probably would have done the same thing then signed off on giving the guy

$250 million, which again, I also kind of understand, but the results are the results. It is a dumpster fire, a train wreck. They are one of the worst teams in the league going nowhere fast. So if you tell me,

Hack, it's done. If the GM loses job, like that's what happens. when people buy a team for $4.5 billion and you start losing. Every single per, you can't fire the players and you can't fire a guy who's owed $170 million guaranteed.

Russell ain't getting fired. Even though if you could, you would fire him. That's just not the way it works. I would say that Hackett and Peyton are in major, major trouble. And last but not least, one thing, you know, I guess I got to take an L on this too that I think I missed on

that at quarterback in the NFL, I don't care how good you are, and the Packers have the last two years, the best quarterback in the league. The reigning MVP, a guy who played at an extremely high level, even for his own standards, who you could make the argument historically

as a borderline like top five, all-time quarterback. That's how good Aaron Rogers is. I thought that he could make other players, right? That you could just kind of draft some guys, have some randos, and you would still be, not maybe, I didn't expect to see like the next Devante Adams, but I expected the offense to still be really good.

And once you pay a guy what they paid him, they gave him $150 million, which I don't blame them. I mean, it's a no-brainer like, Aaron, you want to stay? Here's $150 million. We'll pay you $50 million a year. I thought that LaFleur was good enough, and obviously Rogers was definitely good enough, that he could raise the floor of everyone in the unit.

And watching them play this year, their talent isn't good enough to be raced. And I'm not making an excuse for Aaron. But I don't think you could put like Elway in his prime, Rogers in his prime, Mahomes on this team. And it would look that much different. And I think the one thing that really hit me today like watching the Chiefs is like, yeah, they got rid of Tyree Kill and they traded him. And they used that pick and they drafted a defensive player. But do you know what they also did? One, they still had Kelsey,

but they signed Juju Smith-Schuster. They used a second round pick on a wide receiver, who hasn't really done that much. But they also still had Nicole Hardiman. Like, they invest resources in that position. And I think about the bills. They spend all this money on Josh Allen. They obviously trade for Dix, who's on their team.

Well, last year it was pretty clear Gabriel Davis was ascending. They draft Khalil Shakir, kid from Boise State. who looks awesome. They keep doubling down on those positions. And I understood the Packers trying to build up the defense and playing in a running-oriented operation and just try to dominate on defense. And their defense hasn't been that bad.

But I do think in modern day football that you have to put serious resources around your quarterback at the skill positions. Because I don't give a shit if you have Joe Namath, John Elway, Aaron. Rogers in the peak of their powers. If they don't have big time talent around them, there's only so much they can do.

There are only so many points they can score. And I know a lot of people, and I'm sure this guy's getting crushed in Packerland, LaFleur, who, you know, when LaFleur went to the Titans, his one year as an offensive coordinator, their offense wasn't that good. It struggled. It actually got dramatically better with Arthur Smith.

And why I haven't put that much stock into that, because I give him a lot of credit watching the Packers the last couple years kind of resurrecting Aaron's career. Again, things are all relative. Aaron was really good, but I'm just saying getting him back to that MVP level. I thought he balanced the run and the past really well.

But then I started thinking part of the reason they could balance it is because they had Devante Adams. Like they had a superstar wide receiver who was an unstoppable force. And they have nothing resembling that now. You know, I like Alan Lazard. I mean, he's like a three. Their rookie wide receivers, I mean, the kid they drafted in the second round is injured. He's nowhere to be found.

Randall Cobb is just old, and he's banged up. They can only do so much. So when I look at his stats and I'm watching the game, he's averaging like less than six yards of pass. I'm going, they deserve criticism for this. This was, they went in with the mindset of we're going to run the ball and play defense. Well, you can't do that when you're losing in games. And they have been down in a couple of these games, and they can't come back. because their passing game is not explosive enough.

And then when they have leads, they can't put you away. They can't score, you know, 40 plus points because they're not an explosive offense. So they invested all this money into the individual, which was the right move? 100%. But now they're not equipped around him to compete.

And I'm watching them today thinking, not only was I wrong, they're just not very good. Like, are they a lot to get to nine wins? I guess I wouldn't say no. because they still got Aaron Rogers, but the eye test, it looks really, really shitty. Tuesday, I'll dive into my guy Brandon Staley.

They look terrible. The New York teams just keep winning. And Tom Brady, they lost 21 to 3 today to the Panthers. We will definitely dive into that. So subscribe to the podcast. See you later. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy,

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