The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 & Out - Commanders bring in top QB's, QB scouting reports, Fugazi Friday

Episode Date: April 12, 2024

John dives into why the Commanders bringing in the top QB's in the upcoming draft for one more round of interviews should be considered them just doing their due diligence and not something out of the ordinary. John also dives into the scouting reports that The Athletic published on all of the top QB's coming out in the draft and who has the biggest upside and who may not have what it takes.  Lastly, John reads your comments for this episode's Fugazi Friday segment. 5:46 - Washington interviews top QB's 13:34 - Scouting reports 33:30 - Josh Allen gets extended 39:37 - Fugazi Friday Follow John on Twitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest. Check out Gametime - the fastest growing ticketing app in the US, and the official ticketing app of 3 & Out and GoLow -  for tickets to all of your favorite NFL, NBA, NHL, NCAA teams. Concert and comedy show tickets, too. Go to Gametime now to create an account, download the app and use code JOHN for $20 off your first purchase. #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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let's fire up the old three-and-out podcast and talk a little football. The commanders are having all the quarterbacks, that being Jaden Daniels, Drake May, J.J. McCarthy, in for kind of final interviews next week, maybe making their final decision. A lot of people in the internet that cover football thought that was weird. I will dive into why that's not weird. all. Scouting reports on these quarterbacks. I saw an article on the athletic that had some

things that jumped out to me from unnamed scouts and unnamed executives. Josh Allen, not the quarterback, the pass rusher, signed a big deal and why I think he's a pretty good example of, you know, not everyone pops year one or your two. Some guys take a little time. And then, of course, Fugazi Friday. We'll hit on a couple Fugazi Fridays, the OJ trial, the Otani interpreter. I think at the top of the list and then some of your guys uh DMs i'm not going to do a mailbag today we'll do a big big mailbag early next week so make sure you at john middle cough firing those DMs and uh i'm probably going to do a master's reaction on sunday night so if you if you want to get involved in that show at go lo pod is the golf instagram firing those DMs and maybe i'll maybe i'll interact

with some of those come sunday night so at golo pod is the golf, Instagram. But other than that, subscribe to three and out. We got a YouTube page, all of our contents up there, and yeah, rocking and roll on the drafts

week and a half away. Master's full swing. As of right now, Tiger looks pretty good. No sex, Tiger, balling. But first, I need you to grab your iPhone, grab your smartphone, grab your iPad,

and download a little app. They happen to be my friends, my partners, and the official ticketing app of this podcast. Game Time. Download the GameTime app and you can go to any event.

Concerns, comedy shows, games. You want to go to a baseball game. You want NBA playoffs starting next week. You live in a city, you're a big fan. You want to go to an NBA playoff game? I'll say this. Went to a couple NBA playoff games last year. Been to a ton over my time around the Warriors in their heyday.

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Really easy to do, save $20, your first pair of tickets. So download that app, promo code John. I was thinking about it today. I'm 39 years old, and I've had one interview in my entire life. Not that I've interviewed somebody. I'm saying interviewed for a job. It happened to me one time. Fresno State didn't even have to interview.

Anything in radio or obviously podcast, zero interviews. I interviewed for the Eagles. And I flew back there and your boy got the job that day. But that's the only interview I ever had. So when it comes to what these players are going through, a lot of people listening, I've had a lot of friends and know a lot of people that work in more corporate structures.

And when you interview for bigger jobs, it's usually not a one-time thing. When I interviewed for the Eagles, now granted, you know, big ego boost, I got it that day. It was a $25,000 job. Now, there were several other people there interviewing for the same position,

but there were also other people interviewing for higher-level jobs, and it was a multiple-step process. Me, got a couple recommendations, interviewed well, met a couple people, smiled, they liked my personality. That's not usual. That's not typical.

For big jobs, entry-level jobs, much easier to pivot if the guy fails. But how many of you listening right now that have interviewed for a big upgrade position with a company to leave a company if you are the person interviewing for high-priced jobs, whatever that may be, whether that's going from 80 grand to 150 grand,

whether that's a $300,000 job, whatever it may be. Usually it's not just a one-off scenario. They usually interview you multiple times. There's initial meetings, there may be a secondary meeting, and maybe there's a final, like, out to dinner, meet with the board of directors

or whatever you may be doing. That's part of business when you are investing a lot of money. And for most companies, even multi-million dollar companies, hiring someone making hundreds of thousands of dollars, is a big hire. Well, in the NFL,

the biggest hire you can make obviously is a high draft pick, right? Because not only are you investing, a ton of what we consider draft capital at first, second or third round pick, you're making that pick in hopes to one day pay that guy hundreds of millions of dollars. Because of what they did after the last CBA,

whoever gets drafted second will make $35 to $40 million guaranteed. But when I make that pick as Adam Peters, just like the Bears when they inevitably take Caleb Williams, in my mind I'm already thinking about the second contract. You're not drafting them thinking worst case scenario. Let's face it, you're thinking best case scenario. It's why Caleb Williams gets compared to Patrick Mahomes and not random quarterbacks throughout the league. We'll get into some of the scouting reports.

The Michael Vicks and the Justin Herbarks are getting thrown around. Not Daniel Jones. Well, maybe, and we'll get into that. But my point is that the commanders are bringing these three guys in. and I saw a lot of people that cover the NFL as like, if you haven't figured it out by now, what the hell are you doing? Of course, when you bring a guy in or multiple people in for final interviews, you are leaning some way. We're all human beings.

You're going to like one guy maybe more than the other. No different when you see these coaching searches. Usually starts out, let's just pick a number, 10 people. You interview 10 guys, and then you cut it down to your final three. Well, guess what? when they go to the final three interviews, they probably are leaning a certain way going into it. Now, that can change.

The defining thing for all these guys, obviously, is their ability to play the game. And that has been defined over several years playing football. Drake May, multiple year starter, Jaden Daniels, several year starter, and J.J. McCarthy, multiple year starter. Tape speaks for itself. And we all know as quarterbacks,

the intangible aspect of it all, is very, very important. Not many fucking losers, excel at the quarterback position. Right? It's usually smart, hardworking, driven human beings. And if you are going to be a little immature and maybe not have the best work ethic,

you've got to have elite physical skills, i.e. Ben Rathesburg. But typically, the guys that grind, the guys that work the hardest, the guys who are the best leaders, are the best players at that position consistently. There are some outliers. Brett Farv's work ethic wasn't as great as some.

He also had the greatest arm of all time. The other quarterbacks in his generation, Steve Young, Troy Aikman, checked all the boxes off the field, right? Aaron Rogers probably could get away with some stuff. Tom Brady and Peyton Manning couldn't because of his physical gifts. But I would imagine, even if Aaron Rogers' work ethic didn't equal Peyton and Tom's, it was still pretty damn good. So everyone going, I can't believe they're bringing these guys in for like one final round.

You can't? I would take an educated guess that they are leaning, certain way with this pick and the player that they're going to pick. But wouldn't you want to get one final sit down with them all to go, are we really sure? Because let's face it, when you make this selection, just like anyone that makes a selection, no matter how excited you are, and these videos in a couple weeks are going to go viral. People hugging, people chest bumping, people saying F yeah, and hell yeah, and huge high fives. It's awesome. It's one of the coolest parts about draft night. Remember last year, Dan Campbell and his GM, Brad Holmes, when they traded

back and they still got Gibbs the running back. They went nuts because they were as confident as humanly possible, but you still don't know. You're only as confident as you can be when the pick, but we've seen all the time people be confident and the guy not turned out to be really good. So you better be as confident in making a pick at quarterback is way more complicated, right? because even if I miss on a wide receiver, well, maybe he's not our number one. Can the guy be a number two? Even when I miss on defensive lineman,

yeah, he may not be a star, but he still gets to rotate in. If my quarterback sucks, and this guy isn't the one, let's face it, we're screwed. It's just that simple. It's a major problem, and in a couple years,

he will not be on the team and we'll be looking for another guy. Colin and I talk about it all the time. The timeline of getting three or four years at that position is done. You get like two and a half max. Some guys get one and a half. Trey Lance got four starts.

They're like, get out of here. You're not good enough. Zach Wilson, they knew after year two, but because they brought Aaron Rogers, he got like an extra year that they clearly regretted. Mac Jones got three, Fields got three. And really they didn't.

Mac Jones, we knew early on in the season was not going to be back. And Justin Fields is the moment they were getting the number one overall pick around, I would say November was done in the Chicago Bear. That's how fast it happens. So I have no problem, just like any human being, hiring, if you're a small business and

you're going to hire someone that's going to play an important role in your company, a CFO, a CEO, a marketing manager, whatever, doing several interviews with multiple people. And that's what the commanders are doing. I would bring all these guys in. Now, I don't know, we don't have all the details. Are they all coming together? Is one coming Monday, one coming Tuesday, one coming Wednesday? which I would imagine is probably what ends up happening

because it be a little awkward if they're all like the steakhouse on a Tuesday night together but I think this is the right move and I don't think this is weird at all. I wanted to dive into some scouting reports in this article that I found in the athletic basically shit I didn't write down the guy's name my bad

I'm not trying to just aggregate your stuff without giving you credit but it's on the athletic it basically breaks down the top quarterbacks and it gets a bunch of unnamed scouts, assistant coaches, GMs, scouting directors. I love this type of stuff. The media's like, put your name on it.

It's like, guys, they're not allowed to put their name on it. That's not how it works. But we yearn for this content. And let's start with Jaden Daniels, who in this article was universally considered the number two quarterback. As in Fantasyland, you guys, QB2, right? Caleb's QB1.

It's pointless to even talk about any of his quotes. He's going number one. We don't even need to waste any time. Like, he's going to be on the bearer. will evaluate him as a player whenever the game start. But I think all these other players, what's fascinating is like, which one are you going to choose? Part of last year with Bryce and CJ was like,

listen, the Panthers had a choice, right? And they chose the wrong guy. The Dolphins, once upon a time, had the choice. Herbert or Tua, they took Tua. Even though, in fairness to them, at the time, it wasn't as crazy as its age. Dolphins fans were like, Middokov, what the fuck are you talking about Tua playoffs?

not a soul in the league who would take to over Herbert. But this is not about those guys. This is about Jaden Daniels. And one thing stood out to me in this little blurb from a scout. Jaden probably made more progress than any quarterback coming out in the last five or six years. He can anticipate make all the throws and is an explosive athlete. As a scrambler, he's not Lamar or Vic, but his ability to process pre-snap has improved as a passer,

which is hard to do in one year. Here's what I found interesting. We know he started working with virtual reality this season. He got those VR reps, and that's when he took off. Honestly, maybe I've missed it. I didn't see this story. I remember years ago when Stanford started doing it with their quarterbacks, how you could take these mental reps, right?

Historically have always been in a classroom, watching film with your position coach, your coordinator, your head coach. going over what you should do. But I don't know about you. When I was in school and they would do PowerPoints, it was harder to focus. I never learned like that.

Cal Poly, we learned by doing. Some of you can, you know, take that information and then take it back to the field. I do think this middle ground of you're not actually on the field, but this VR is just going to be, and I would imagine a lot of teams now, you know, participate with virtual reality in their operation. It's kind of genius.

I mean, we all learn differently. Some guys can only learn from the field. Some guys can learn in the classroom and go to the field and need one rep and they're good. And most people are somewhere in the middle, a little bit of everything. I think that's how I am, that's how you are. Like most people aren't one way or the other. It's kind of hearing it over and over, reppping it out in whatever you're doing, practice the 10,000 hours. And he's a guy, a little bit of a late bloomer, got around really good players, a really good coach.

and excelled. Now, here's the thing. Lamar Jackson's the best running quarterback I've ever seen in terms of explosion, in terms of instincts, and in terms of not getting hit, like he can avoid these hits. Michael Vic was probably the most explosive runner we've ever seen, but he could not avoid hits. He actually like yearned to hit people, which is a problem when you're actually kind of small. Michael's not the biggest guy, and he'd get hurt a lot. I think Jaden is just a really good athletic quarterback, but that's where it gets back to the concerns of the weight. But if you don't have concerns on anticipatory throws, layering throws, processing information, like, if the commanders feel good about that,

like this guy's going to go number two overall. Some more stuff. Jaden is quarterback too. He can start immediately, better learn to protect himself or he'll be in the cold tub often. That's the thing. That's the Michael Vick thing. If you can't avoid the hits or seek the hits out, you are done in this league. I don't care if you're Cam Newton.

Cam Newton was out of the league in his early 30s. Sometimes you see these highlights of Cam Newton early on in Carolina or at Auburn. You're like, is this the greatest athlete factoring in the size I've ever seen at the position? But just taking a pounding, taking a pounding, taking a pounding, fucking wears on you. I don't care if like the, you know, Mean Joe Greens and the John Lynch's and those type players are out of the league, it's still a vicious game. and these guys are running faster than ever. So that to me is a huge concern. Even if you feel good about the processing and stuff,

can you teach that? Now, I've always believed that you kind of are who you are as an instinctive player at whatever you do. It's hard to completely change and take that out. You're either fearless or you kind of hesitate. Or you're just naturally avoiding. Frank Gore as a running back was elite and he played for 50 years

because he never, you know, went out of his way for contact. He avoided it. And that helped the longevity of his career. When you're banging, banging, bang and banging, banging, it's just brutal. Listen, I grew up, you know, I didn't grow up on a ranch,

but I was going to the ranch a lot as a kid. Wear and tear ranch miles on trucks is a lot different than me driving my Tahoe around town. So the wear and tear of getting blasted all the time as a quarterback or running back is a reason so many running backs fall off a clear. It's the reason Cam Newton fell off a cliff. So I think you've got to try it.

There's no weight in enough. You just have to get a feel for the guy if you think he can change a little bit, if it was him trying to prove something. Or that's just kind of how he is when he's instinctively playing. To me, that's probably the biggest concern. And that's where the weight comes in. People like him. I mean, that's pretty clear.

And listen, I remember just throwing on the YouTube on Malik Neighbors. I'm like, how good is this guy? And it's hard not to just be wowed with Jayden Daniels. Last but not least, he could end up being the best one. Very good athlete, armed talent. I think he sees it and can process. Big drop off after him and Caleb. Here's where I think it gets interesting with Drake May.

Is everything is a projection. And for what Herbert kind of has become, I don't think he was viewed that coming out. He is way better than anyone thought he would be. Where Josh Allen, there were people. If you were betting on Josh Allen, he thought he would be a star. You were getting at, you know, it was basically like walking into home plate.

You're down a run or two, and you have to hit a home run to extend the game. You're either going to strike out or hit a home run. There was no middle ground with him. Now, Josh Allen is much more talented, in my opinion, than Drake May. But he is in the mold of like, you're either going to hit one off the wall here. Maybe it won't be a home run. But you're either getting a double or triple or this is going to be a disaster. and those are the riskiest picks.

But part of life is risking it. Like if you stay in the slow lane, your entire life, you're going to get fucking lapped. You're like, oh, the mortgage rates are too high. I can't afford this. Well, you sure? Because if you can't, maybe you'll rent your whole life. You know?

Obviously, if you don't have the money, you don't have the money. But how often you hear, oh, I wish, you know, I should have bought then. There's always that guy, I wish I would have done this then. I should have invested in that stock then. I've met a million of those guys. And they're telling the same story. forever and it never changes. Now in the NFL, like sometimes in real life, if you don't invest in

something, whatever, you get more opportunities. You might only get one in the NFL. So if you're Adam Peters and you take this and it backfires, it could be a disaster. It could cost you your one shot as a GM, especially if it's really ugly and if you take Drake May over Jaden Daniels and then Jaden becomes a star, that's a problem. It is. And he knows that. Like it's part of the business. But here's a very interesting quote on Drake May because we only talk about the ceiling I say this all the time with comps it's always like oh this this wide receiver

he reminds me a lot of Keenan Allen I see a keenan Allen you know I see some Mike Evans we're never like you know this dude reminds me of like the fourth wide receiver on the Carolina Panthers remember that rotational guy for the New York Giants two years ago

he was like kind of moved to the slot sometimes he had 30 catches That's who he kind of, if you say that in a draft room, it's like, what? So you're always comparing him, he's got a little Devante with a little Tyreek speed. It's always like, you know, he's got a little Herbert meets a little Josh Allen. You would never be like, you know, he's got like Cleveland Baker mixed in with a little Vegas Derek Carr. You'd be like, oh, don't feel as good. That's why you always hear like with Jaden.

Lamar's, Vicks, you know, I mean, you don't hear all the scrubs that couldn't play. I know a lot of people that look at the ceiling, but you've got to look how low the floor is. A guy like Drake May has a lot of room to grow. He's young. He hasn't played nearly as much football. Only two years are starting. May reminds me a lot of Herbert. May is Herbert Light.

Take everything Herbert does and make it less. They'll be compared because of the size, but there's no comparison. I like May, but when I see the amount of work, work it will take to have him reach his potential, we'll be fired first. I have no problem taking big swings. I really don't with these, you know, when you're high in the draft.

But the risk is astronomical because the pace of the pressure has never been higher. The amount that we all talk about this, the league talks about this, and ultimately how fast the owner will want to pivot. What I'm paying one of these quarterbacks, it doesn't hinder me from moving on.

It doesn't stop me from cutting him, trading them, getting rid of them for nothing. We have seen it over and over now. All these quarterbacks that failed were on other teams very, very fast in recent memory. Very, very fast. Baker Mayfield's on his fourth team. Sam Darnel's on his fourth team.

Think about that. All those guys from the Zach Wilson draft, other teams, they're begging someone to give them a seventh round pick for Zach Wilson right now, begging. no one will do it because no one wants them for $7, $8 million as their backup quarterback. They're going to have to eat some money ultimately to unload them.

And when you talk about potential, which is what you have to do in a draft, it's one thing with a position player. It's another thing with quarterback. And even if you have Marcus Marriota, Jacoby Brissette, or whatever on your roster, if you're not good early on, there is not a fucking soul that watches your team that is going to want to watch that guy play. And they will scream and scream and scream. And you can say all you want,

we don't listen to the outside noise, we're insulated. Your owner does. He listens to Sports Talk Radio podcast and watch the shows every single day. Because if I owned a team, I would too. And so would you. So the coaches may not, even though a lot of them do.

The GMs definitely do a little bit more. But the owner is the only one that matters. And when his fans are scrubs, screaming. I can't watch this ninth year retread backup quarterback anymore, throw the young guy in, which is the right move. But when you get these huge projects, it can derail you immediately. It really can. Listen, the Masters is going on right now. Some of the guys crushing it right now in golf. I was talking to a buddy who played at Oregon, who now works, Robbie, who works for Adidas. and we were talking about how good Max Homa was in college.

When Max Homa left college, he was the national champion. He's currently, as I turned the TV off, he was four under. Actually, he just bogeyed, maybe he was 3 under. Max Homa sucked as a pro, was holding on for Deer Life. He didn't pop until his late 20s, early 30s. He got eaten alive. Now, golf's a little different than football, but we're seeing it happen in football.

guys who aren't quite ready at that position get destroyed. Where when I was a kid in like the 90s, you got several years. You got time to learn, sit. Hell, even Carson Palmer got a year. It's why what happened to Patrick Mahomes, we will not see that anymore. That just is not happening because nobody wants to watch it. And now with the money, the owner, let's just play the kid. Though you get a huge project like Drake May.

and it's clearly like a pretty big project, better be ready to go. Here's what I say about Justin Herbert, who I liked a lot. Now, I never thought he would be this good. He's like a four-year starter in college. At Oregon, who was competing in Rose Bulls. Herbert was a starting quarterback for a team

that literally won the Rose Bowl. I mean, he'd been in a lot of big games at a really, I would say, high-profile school. So comparing him to Drake May, I just putting those guys in the same sentence, I don't love that. Here's the thing with J.J. McCarthy. And the same thing with May. I don't love McCarthy.

He's a winner. He has all the intangibles. But I wouldn't say I like his arm and I think the athlete is a little overrated. He reminds me of Daniel Jones. You know what's funny is when I looked at the numbers for, and I've been saying this for a while now, of J.J. McCarthy, his numbers kind of reminded me of Alex Smith. Now he's a little shorter.

I think he's got a little bit better armed than, but I think he's in a similar mold. Well, there's nothing wrong, the Alex Smith, the chief guy, the last year with the Niners guy, and before he got injured in Washington guy. The guy was a good player. You could make the playoffs with that guy.

But he was the best case version of that guy. The comp for Daniel Jones coming out of school was Alex Smith. That was his comp. and what happened to Daniel Jones he simply wasn't good enough now in defense of him Alex Smith finally got Jim Harbaugh

and Andy Reed which is clearly better than any situation he's been in even with Brian Dable so to maximize a guy like Alex you need everything great around him especially on defense and a great head coach so to me

J.J. McCarthy has had that in college he's been the version what Alex was with the Chiefs and with the 49ers. They had an elite defense, have like 75 guys that are going to get drafted on the defensive side alone, and had six offensive linemen go to the combine,

NFL running back, and just an NFL head coach. So I'm not anti-JJ McCarthy. I think he's a fascinating prospect. But I think when you compare him and you think about drafting him really high, a lot like Drake May, you're just thinking of the best case scenario.

And unlike Drake, who has more physical skills, his floor is just not as high. And when it doesn't go well for Daniel Jones, that type player, Alex Smith, earlier in his career, it doesn't get any uglier. That's as ugly as it gets. So I think this J.J. McCarthy situation is going to be fascinating. Now, it goes to Minnesota, like the situation a lot more.

Offensive weapons, good head coach, floor is a good defensive coach. But if he goes to the Patriots, I'm out. Last but not least on Pennix. Here's an assistant coach. Pennix is better now than Mayor of McCarthy for NFL football. He can read defenses, throw accurately, is quick, and has strong enough arm. He's more of a sure thing to play in the NFL, but I'm not sure where he goes from here

because he doesn't have the same upside. It's a great line. It's not about where you are today. If you were playing NFL football next week and it was a winner get in game for the commanders, they would be better off with Michael Penix than any of the other guys. But like we talked about, you're drafting not even for this rookie contract, you're drafting ultimately to try to give him $250, $300 million in four or five years. And that's the thing that concerns teams with Michael Penix.

He's older, the injury history. No one can argue when you watch him play. Beside Caleb, he throws the ball and he's more accurate and his deep ball is better than everybody. I mean, it just speaks for itself. But there are other factors in here. And here's a scout. I think Bo Nix is much better than Pennix. I disagree there.

Penix is serviceable and a different player when he's playing on schedule, but he's not a good foot athlete. I worry about him when he gets traffic in his face. The fascinating thing to me with Pennix is if he goes to the right spot, good offensive line, good coach, I think it can be good. But the one thing that you saw in that Michigan game, which people keep going, middle coffee, you once put him number two in the draft, you pivoted.

No one's arguing that he's, He's not a really good player. But his speed at his pro day, he never really did that and played like that, right? Now, can he? We saw CJ Stroud, much better playmaker in the pros than we saw in college. We knew he was great in the pocket.

I know Pennix is great in the pocket. Elite. Michael Pennix is an NFL caliber pocket passer. But you get hit a lot in the NFL. I don't care who you are. And when Michael Pennix played NFL level teams, Oregon, Michigan, Both times I thought he wasn't going to finish the game.

And that concerns me. I like the player a lot. But I think it is fair to be concerned. And it's pretty clear like he's not going ahead of those three guys. But I think he has the chance to have the most fascinating career. I would be stunned if he had a long career. But I could see if he gets in the right situation having a fantastic couple years. Because he's kind of ready made.

Very old school. It doesn't happen as much anymore. He's quarterbacks, man. Fascinating times. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque.

Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care what you'll say. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment. And the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be.

Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast.

I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because, of crack.

I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really?

Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your Really quick, I wanted to touch on Josh Allen, not the quarterback, but the pass rusher. And I think he's a really good example of, and I'm guilty of this, that it's one thing when you draft a guy that doesn't have the traits. We had Mayock on, and they drafted Cleland Farrell, who's going to play in the NFL for a decade. He's a really solid NFL defensive lineman.

The Niners really missed him last year when he got injured. that was a big blow for their defensive line. They didn't have him down the stretch because I think he hurt his knee. Really good run defender. Same thing with Solomon Thomas. Solomon Thomas is going to have both those guys are going to have long, profitable NFL careers.

They just should never have been picked high because they didn't have the traits to justify it. Not that they wouldn't have been really good second or third round pick. But you take a guy in the top 10, traits do matter. Because, let's face it, I'm not trying to hit a stand-up single.

I'm not trying to hit a stand-up double. Those picks do not exist. You're either trying to hit home run or you're willing to strike out. And Josh Allen is a guy who's almost 6'5-5. He's got 33-inch arms. He's really explosive. And early on his career, it just was kind of up and down. And I would say before last year,

it felt like he was kind of coming on. He had seven sacks three years ago, seven sacks two years ago. And last year, he looked like an elite player. 17 and a half sacks and is what you wanted to look like but it did not happen overnight and I think this is just good advice for most people

like I used to be very very impatient when I was younger I mean I still am not a very patient person but my path was no one else's path but my own and we all know people who especially professionally have immediate success right that financially

maybe are doing a lot better than us at a certain point in time in our career and it's hard to not let that impact you. But you've got to stay laser focused on yourself. And I think anyone with talent, I'm a huge believer in the cream always rises. But not all cream rises at the same rate. And not every guy is Tiger Woods, right?

Not every guy is Joe Burrow or Patrick Mahomes. And it's just like, holy shit. Some guys take a little while. Devante Adams was a laughing stock his first year and a half in Green Bay. By the end of his fourth year, it's clear, like, this guy's going to be one of the better players in the NFL. Some guys take time. And when you invest in someone, the quarterback position is different than all these other positions.

Like, as a position player drafted high, you're going to be on the team more than likely for your first four years. And if you're on a bad team, which he's been on, you're going to go through some coaches. You're going to go through some defensive coordinators. And all you can hope for, one, you can only control what you can control. How hard you work. I read some of his quotes. he clearly seems like a pretty high level guy. You know, just how seriously you take everything.

And then you need some things to go well for you that are out of your control, who your coordinator is, what your defense is. And when you get in the right situation, then it's on you to take care of the opportunity. We all get different opportunities at different point in time in our life. Sometimes we're ready for them, sometimes we're not.

And when you're not, there's not much you can do. Right. But try your best. But when you do get posed with an opportunity, and you are prepared, you got to take advantage of it. And Josh Allen clearly did. After his fourth year, he had 17 and a half sacks, and he just signed a $150 million contract with $80-plus million

guaranteed. And if he's good, he'll see most of it. That's the thing with these good players, when you see the quote-unquote fake money guaranteed money, it gives you wiggle room if it doesn't go well, but good players that just play well. Like Aaron Donald, just solve his money all the time.

Right, DeVonte Adams, just go around the league, like Travis Kelsey. Like whatever contract they sign Guaranteed, not guaranteed, the normal number you see, they just consistently see those numbers. So you keep balling, you keep having 14 to 15 to 16 sacks, you will see every penny of this number.

And I think it's cool because we get obsessed and listen, I'm guilty of it as much as anybody. Like, I like guys that immediately come to play. It's easy to go, God, Puka Nakua, shattering records. Well, my mom can see that. Can you see like a guy like, hey man, I wouldn't give up on this player. I think there's something there.

And Josh Allen finally popped. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds.

I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions,

my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand-new podcast. the Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations

with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations,

stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes,

follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jay.

And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 was big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now.

Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, Fugazi Friday. Let's hit on a couple.

Here's a thing. Two things before we dive into some of your DMs about Fugazi Friday. Ornthall Simpson. also known as the juice or OJ, died today. And before we dive into the Fugazi that was his trial in 95, there were things when I was a kid and anyone older than me, and I think this lasted probably until like 10, 15 years ago. I don't think there's a lot that we share in as a community anymore.

We're in the 90s, like there were moments and events that it felt like everyone shared it. I think a large reason was I didn't have cable probably till like 98-99. I had three channels. I guess four channels. CBS, NBC, Fox, and ABC. And at night, the nightly news would be on.

I remember when, what was the, not the Iraq War, but General Schwarzkopf War, I just remember the TV being on, like the whole country. We're all watching the same stuff. Now the one thing I think that kind of resonates with most people are presidential elections still, but that's so bat-shit crazy that it's not like it felt like it used to be.

But there used to be certain things that like everyone shared in and certain controversies as well. And I think OJ is just an all-timer. Everyone was paying attention. I just don't think that really happens anymore. I would say the most it happens to is now the Super Bowl and a presidential election. and I don't even know if that has lasting power once Donnie's gone So like if it's just two random lifetime politicians I don't think it'll be the same

But the OJ thing I remember listening to it in class The verdict I was in fifth grade I don't think there's anything like that that would happen now And I would imagine I'm not alone Like everyone's classrooms Everyone's parents

Every fucking person was paying attention to what was going on with OJ. Now obviously, superstar running back became famous in Hollywood was a very famous person and his murder, the murder he committed, was really famous.

I do think he represents the Fugazi. I've never been arrested. Got a couple tickets probably close when I was in college. You know, drunk in public. Actually, that was in high school. But that's a long time ago now. But I've never spent any time in a courtroom. But I've followed enough court cases with famous people to know one thing and one thing only.

The biggest Fugazi in the criminal justice system is like justice was served. The only thing that matters in the courtroom, do you have money or do you not have money? Because if you have money and you have the best lawyers, you are going up against a district attorney. State employee. They got no fucking chance. I don't have what the district attorney, whoever he was going up against at the time was making. but what his crew, Cochran, Kardashian, his crew lawyers was making,

it ain't a fair fight. If I show up to your golf course and we're going to play a two-on-two match, I'm like, bring the best player at your club, and I show up with Scotty Sheffler, I don't care how good the player you show up with. I'm going to kick your ass, and clearly OJ gutted those two like a fish,

and got off just because, I mean, now, there were other, probably variables, but his lawyers were elite. And we see this all the time. I'll give you one. Get ready. SBF, I think, was just sentenced to like 20 years in prison for the crypto scandal. He wasn't Ponzi wrong thing.

He's like buying, I don't exactly know how you'd describe it, but he was doing illegal activity. He was robin Peter to pay Paul, but actually he was having a successful business. It wasn't quite Bernie made off, but you finance people know that he cheated the system. He broke the law. Get ready for him to be pardoned this fall. I would expect that actually. If Joe Biden loses, I would expect him to pardon SBF on the way out.

Why you say? Because of money. He donated a shitload of money to politicians. Like all this stuff, it all gets back to money. That's why like, I see all these people getting really emotional online. Like, guys, spend the same way. forever. If I got in trouble right now for something, I probably would be up against the wall in a courtroom. I don't have unlimited funds to hire the best lawyer. Now, maybe I could

publicize it through the podcast, make it big enough where some guy would do it for a cheaper fee to hype himself up, but if you got money, you got a chance. That's why these big corporations, they think it's a pain in the ass to go to court. They're not really worried about it. They got big old budgets to dominate in that world. OJ killed people. He ended up going back to jail because he was fucking off his rocker, but OJ did, 76. The Otani interpreter,

this has got to be, listen, when I talked to Colin about this a couple weeks ago, that super rich people, they get robbed all the time. It's been happening since the history of time. Because money's all relative, right? If you have $100,000 in your bank account and $800,000,

is missing, you might not notice, or there's a weird purchase for $800. If you have $100 million in your bank account and someone takes out a couple million, you might not notice. But what Otani's interpreter was doing, he lost over $180 million. Now, he won $140 million, but there was a $40-plus million, L. He was in the red. I don't believe for a second that Otani wasn't help funding his gambling Do I know if he bet or not? I got no clue

Dude doesn't even speak English So I've never even heard the guy talk Beside into this interpreter And listen I don't care Like I'm not one of those people That like Otani has to pay As a consumer I just want to watch Otani play baseball

I don't give a shit Honestly they're gambling in California It drives me nuts I used to do a lot of business there podcast wise And we got to the point where we couldn't do gambling stuff because the thing, these gambling companies went from the DFS to gambling stuff. We work with one now and they just don't want to waste our time there because there's no end in sight. So you got to go through an illegal bookie, which they went through.

And like, listen, this guy is the all-time fall guy. But Major League Baseball and Otani can push all they want. They knew nothing. It's just at those numbers, even with as rich as Otani is, bullshit. There's not a soul that believes that. There is not a soul with a working brain. Here's the other thing. Back in the day, before I ever knew this gambling was legal state by state.

I guess federally legal, that states are allowed to make it legal, and then states like California and Texas, for whatever reason, just, I don't know, living in the fucking stone ages. But you had to go through a bookie. I've gone through some bookies. A lot like when I was a kid meeting weed dealers in the back of Burger King or McDonald's. Now, I didn't have nearly as much money as I do now, but I had a pretty hard limit.

once I hit four figures, I would have to pay him. He wouldn't let me make it past $1,000. And listen, everyone's different. If you're Phil Mickelson, that number is probably $500,000. But to get to the point when you are $40 million in debt, it would never get to that point. The biggest bookie in the world would only do that if he had this guy's blessing.

Be the only way possible. And when they first came out with the story, Otani said, I paid back his debts, which again, I have no problem with. Human beings help other human beings all the time. With debts, with down payments, with business loans, like, welcome to the world.

It doesn't bother me at all. Even if it's quote unquote illegal because it's illegal bookie. I don't give a shit. I could not care any less. But if the numbers in which I saw tweeted out today, if you don't think Otani's involved, I just think,

naive is the wrong way to put it. You're just, I can't even, we couldn't even have a conversation because it's just not possible. It really isn't. And he's going to take the fall and his family, and his family's family,

and their kids will all be taken care of forever. But this is in all time, as Chris Carter said, Fall Guy moment. A couple other Fugazi Fridays here. This came up a couple times. Some of you guys slid into my DMs about the work-life balance.

And before I read this, I thought about this over last week. Obviously, if your goals and aspirations are to have a lot of money, like if that's something that means a lot to you, there are going to be limitations on work-life balance. And if you're a younger person trying to earn your stripes at a company, working for someone, wherever, you're going to have to go above and beyond.

Your work-life balance in your youth will not be as much. Now, if you own a company, obviously there are certainly, roles, CEO, commissioners, whatever. I mean, high, high level roles, your work life balance is going to be shitty at times. If you don't desire a lot of money or are cool with the job you're in, yeah, do whatever you want. My overall take is work life balance is such an individual thing. Like what you desire out of your life is not what I desire. Just like it's not what Bill desires or James desires or Kelly desires or Megan desire. We all have. different desires, besides basic ones.

Like, want our kids to be healthy, want to be safe, we want to have food. I mean, there's some basic human needs and necessities and things that we're all kind of universally agreed upon, like, want our kids to be educated, want our kids to be down the right path. But other than that, like, what you like doing with your own time, when you like vacationing, how much you like working, do you like working on the weekends, do you like, do you mail it in come Thursday? That's all on an individual basis.

And I have no problem. Lazy people exist, just like crazy workers exist. If you work a 9 to 5 and you're older and you don't really care, I don't blame you. I don't. Gary V., who can be a little cheesy sometimes, has always said something that is so right. When you own a company, you can't expect the people working for you to have the same skin in the game, work ethic, and desire for that entity as yourself. You'd be a moron if you did. So I have no problem anyone doing whatever they want to do. but there are also repercussions.

Like certain jobs, if you don't work hard enough and you're not producing, I have a lot of friends in sales. There's a lot of pressure. It doesn't mean they don't get to screw around. Part of their job is entertaining and playing golf and taking people to events and games and concerts.

But you better close deals. Because if you don't, they will get rid of you. And many people listening to this, no. And it's not about like FaceTime or how many hours. Like, just close the deals. I've always been a big believer in that. Either get it done or you don't. And that's maybe how I was raised, pretty old school dad, like just, just produce.

I don't really care about all your bullshit. So this is a rebuttal. Wife and I work in local government with 9 to 80 schedules, not quite sure what that means, maybe nine months. I don't know. We have every Friday off, we have every other Friday off and do nine hour days Monday through Thursday. We work 56% of the year when you factor in vacations and holidays. I have no clue what any of it's crazy you've already broken that down I guess you get it from the government we also own a 1.5 million dollar house and slow have two kids pensions so work life balance

can't succeed again that succeeds for you might not succeed for me or the person listening it might succeed for them they might want that and they don't have that so I think we're all different but I do think the one consistent and I think high achievers and I equate that I think with money which fair or not, I mean, it's just kind of the way we do it in society. There's not many guys not working that much. Now, maybe you get to a certain point where the business runs itself, but it's usually a lot of time revolving around whatever you're doing. I heard you previously talking about having a serious XM for your vehicle.

I used to have it as well for a free trial run, and after that they wanted $204 a month. Serious XM has been on such a decline with the use, use of smartphones in cars and availability of auditory media. If you want to save money, tell them you want to cancel and they will lower your bill all the way down to $8 a month. Not to mention Sirius just laid off almost 5% of their workforce two months ago. They're hurting big time.

Part of the reason I actually think mine's like $2,99, which is absurd. I'm with you. I have a 2012 Tahoe. I want to get a new car. but what I want is like 200 grand maybe not that much but I mean a new Tahoe now is like 100 grand and it's like do I want a car payment right now my car is I don't have a penny for my car and it runs fine

and the other thing is I would if my job revolved around getting a new car I drive like two places to the gym into the golf course podcast or my desk is at my house I actually don't drive very much but my point is my Tahoe doesn't connect to the internet or Bluetooth so I can't connect to my phone, which my girlfriend thinks I'm fucking nuts. She hates it. Right? Because most people, many people listening to this, probably are Bluetooth with their phone. I feel like I'm living in the Stone Age. But I don't. So I need something besides just like listening to my phone on the center

console. So I just have DXM. Maybe I just need to get a new car. But cars I want are just, I don't know. I guess that's just the price of life now. You want this car, it's $97,000. I remember when, like, a suburban was like 50. But again, I'm not acting like that's the price. It is what it is. Maybe she just get a Tesla. Border Raised in Texas, been a fan for all the DFW teams for 20 plus years.

That being said, when I was a kid, you flipped on Fox Sports Southwest and got all the local sports games. I love streaming, and I'm glad we are here, but going. but Bally has bought the rights to all the Rangers, stars, and Mavericks. Now, in order to watch them, you have to have either Furbo or Direct TV. Why can't I just pay to add teams I want to watch on YouTube TV? I feel like this is a huge Fugazi and fucking me over. Again, I like streaming and would gladly pay monthly to be able to pick and choose whenever I get to watch. Also, Bochie is the man.

Agree, go Rangers. Yeah, man, we are in a... transitional time. As someone that defends streaming, someone tweeted at me this morning. Like, it's BS. The Masters is not on TV till 3 o'clock Eastern.

Like, guys, this is never changing. Augusta doesn't need any money and they don't, they will not put it on broadcast TV until, like, they want to do it. But there is the Masters app and ESPN Plus. Is it perfect?

No, but it exists. I do think, and listen, I don't, I don't, living in Arizona, like when I lived in the Bay Area, I watched all the teams I want to watch. The Giants games are on, the Warriors games are on.

And I could also watch the Kings games. Here, I haven't watched one Diamondback game, and I wouldn't watch Kevin Durant and the sons have you paid me. But I understand if you live in your home market and want to watch those teams, and because of the changing media landscape,

everything that happened with Bollies and these local networks is a disaster. That sucks. That would piss me off. to. I think times are better now in terms of our options, but I don't disagree 10 years ago. If you lived in Philly, if you lived in Texas, if you lived in Northern California, if you lived in L.A., if you lived in wherever, Georgia, if you want to watch your baseball team, your basketball team, your hockey team, you knew exactly where to find it. Every game was on.

That's not the case anymore. And I do feel for you. I don't think it's like anyone necessarily trying to screw you, though. I do think it's this transitional period of time that it's going to have to work itself out. Tangit Fugazi Friday Topics. Applying for jobs where you upload your resume and then add in all the resume fields which are on your resume in the window field boxes.

Yeah, man, that's why you go to LinkedIn Jobs slash John or promo code John. I've heard, I actually played golf with a guy a couple weeks ago that runs this company and his son is about to graduate college you're going to come work for him. And I say, what's that like? He's like, to be honest with you,

smartest thing I ever did because he's been working with him over the summers the last couple of years when he came home. He's like, he got me on LinkedIn. And we make so many hires on LinkedIn because you don't have to do any of that. It's already right there.

It's your resume. So I don't use LinkedIn in the sense of like, for job-wise, but I never talk to anybody in any industry that is like with the times that doesn't utilize that. So I don't know what kind of

where you're looking for jobs and what makes you, because that would piss me off too. I upload my two-page resume. I told you everything I do and then I got to re-put it in. Screw you. LinkedIn,

promo code John. Okay, last one. Fugazi Friday idea. Subscriptions, loyalty services. Without them, everywhere has these. My local gas station, my barbershop, the car wash. Without them, you want to purchase anything they charge you X percent more on anything. They lock you into using them only and make you pay per month to utilize the services

or pay an arm and a leg for one-time use, thus upcharging you for the same service. It's taking over everywhere. I just want gas and a can of Zin. Feel you, brother? what the fuck do I need to be a loyalty member to get two specials? Why can't I just walk into a place without having to pay a premium for showing up to your door as a new customer? You know what's funny?

It's a gas station, but it has like a sweet car wash. And I've used it twice since I've lived in Arizona because the car wash is elite. But when you pull up, they hammer you. Become a monthly member. Become a monthly member. Become a monthly member. And the monthly membership is like $100. And a high-level car wash.

I mean, they have your car for like an hour and a half is more than that. You'd save money if you use it. I'm like, hey, buddy, I don't drive that often. I bring in here once every six months to just get a full detail just so it's clean. Mainly for the inside because the outside is going to get dirty, whatever, and then I can just go through a $10 car wash. But I want you to the inside. I don't need a monthly.

I'm not a salesman driving around. But he's relentless. And you're just like, hey, man. I don't need it. I do not need it. Say, hey, man, it'll save you some money. It'll save you some money. No, it won't.

I don't get that many car washes. From a business standpoint, if I was going to defend them, why are insurance companies such great businesses? They get monthly reoccurring revenue. Why is this cable destruction of the bundle and everything that's happening to, you know, the old school cable box,

fucking everybody? They were used to getting all of our money every single month. Now they don't get that anymore. So I think you're just hoping to get a certain percentage. I mean, I get why they do that. And I also understand from the consumer,

it's like, shut up. I don't want it. I'll give you Fugazi. Anytime you walk into Lowe's or back when you were younger and went to malls and shopped to like Macy's or Home Depot's, hey, you want a Home Depot car, it'll save you.

No. I just want this hammer and I want these nails so I can hang a couple of pictures so everyone in my home is happy. That's all I want. I don't need your special credit card. I'm not fucking a carpenter here. I'm just buying this nail gun. Just let me purchase it and I'll leave.

Now the one that is worth it, Costco. I don't do free ads here, but Costco has to be one of the most incredible companies. When I remodeled my house, I ripped out all the blinds. So we have not had any window coverings or blinds. it doesn't matter as much during the winter part of it was like I spent so much money it's like God these blinds are outrageously expensive

I mean talk about it Fugazi like does it really cost you this much to make blinds and shutters really I understand they gotta cost something we all got you know Mous Defeat here you're telling me for a tiny little window

it's $2,500 for one fucking window we sure how much everyone making a lot how many hands are in the cookie jar on this one but it is what it is I mean you go to Costco when you walk out, they obviously have all those, you know, different options for backyard, whatever, right? One of them is the window coverings, called them, got a bid, which was, you know, probably lower than some of the,

or equal with some of the other ones. They send me 17% back in a debit card to go shop at Costco, which I would anyway. And they send me 2% of everything I spent at the end of the year as an executive member. What a business. I wonder Charlie Munger called it the greatest business of all time. Okay. for Gazi Friday. Have a great weekend. Watch the Masters talk soon. The volume.

Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel. Help an Acapella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with. Robert Smygel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds.

I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On The Look Back at it podcast. For 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 was big to me. I'm Sam Jay. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it.

With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild year. It was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.