The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 & Out - Eagles star Lane Johnson RETIRES, Lamar Jackson’s Injury, Chiefs are BACK + NFL Pre-Week 5 Mailbag

Episode Date: October 7, 2026

John Middlekauff is back with another episode of 3 & Out, breaking down the biggest news and storylines from around the NFL and sports world. John reacts to Lane Johnson retiring and what his departure means for the Philadelphia Eagles and one of the NFL's most accomplished offensive linemen. He also dives into the latest on the Baltimore Ravens, their season outlook, and where the team goes from here. John continues the conversation around NFL referees being suspended, examining the league's officiating issues and the growing frustration surrounding penalties and controversial calls. Plus, he explains why the Kansas City Chiefs are back and whether Patrick Mahomes and Andy Reid are once again emerging as a major force in the AFC. John also discusses LeBron James going from Philadelphia to New York, his decision to attend practice, and the attention surrounding LeBron's connection to New York. The episode wraps up with the Middlekauff Mailbag, where John answers listener questions about the NFL, quarterbacks, coaches, officiating, and the biggest stories across football. Subscribe to 3 & Out with John Middlekauff for NFL news, game reactions, quarterback analysis, coaching takes, breaking stories, and the biggest conversations in football. Follow John on Twitter, and Instagram for the latest.  18+ Only. Restrictions and eligibility requirements apply. Not available in all jurisdictions. Trading is risky. 100% loss can occur. See polymarket.com/tos for more information. The Polymarket US App serves as an independent software provider and affiliate of Polymarket US and Polymarket Clearing, the CFTC-regulated exchange and clearing organization. #VolumeSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Ontario only. Please play responsibly. Concerned about your gambling or that of someone close to you? visit connectsonterio.ca. The volume. What is going on, my people? How are we doing? John Middilcoff,

Three and Out Podcast. That'd be me. Hopefully you're doing better than the Eagles who just, story of the day again. We will dive into that off the top.

Lamar Jackson, some statistics on the officiating this year. I knew it was bad, but I saw this Warren Sharp tweet that went viral. I was like, Oh my God.

LeBron James taking a helicopter back and refusing to live in Philadelphia. I love the city of Philadelphia. Great food. But, you know, I can imagine this pad in New York probably doesn't suck. We'll do some mailbag questions. At John Middlecoff. At John Middlecoff is the Instagram fire in those DMs. Get your question answered here on the show.

You guys know the drill. If you listen on Collins feed, make sure you subscribe with three and out. We also have a Netflix. You can just hit the alert button. never miss a show. I put today my top five teams in the NFL, we put that up on YouTube.

Didn't quite make the podcast cutting room floor. So you can check out the YouTube channel. We got a lot of separate content up there as well. And let's just let's dive into the Eagles. Lane Johnson will no longer play for the Philadelphia Eagles.

He's done. And clearly things, like this is a guy who's battled mental health issues over the years. Miss some time in training camp. You know, there are stories about his parents going through some stuff right now, old age, health issues.

I don't even want to speculate. I've heard a couple different things. You know, clearly there is going to be time in the off season to celebrate one of the great careers. I mean, he's, to me, a first ballot hall of famer. One of the great players in the history of the Eagles. But in the immediate,

this is a five-alarm fire for Philadelphia. This is a disaster. Now, how he's a great GM. Did they invested in a right tackle during the draft? Bell from Miami. They drafted in the third round. But that was not the plan to play him this year. Right?

Maybe in spot duty if Lane battled an injury. But to lose essentially, I mean, they played three games, right? He didn't play against the Rams. And now it's done. This is a major, major problem for a team. that is leaking serious oil. And there are some humans, like my brother-in-law Matt,

my brother Jeff, these guys go on hunting trips out in the wilderness and can just thrive like they're bare grills. If you throw me and some of the people that I hang out with in that environment, we would be screwed. Couldn't survive, couldn't make fire,

wouldn't be able to find food. If we did bring food, we would probably, you know, lose it. I mean, it would be a problem. And sometimes in these hectic situations, which is the NFL. It's like getting lost in the wilderness. Figure it out.

Hey, Ben Johnson, Caleb Williams is going to pull his hammy and be out for who knows how long. He's like, okay, I'll win my third train quarterback. I'll win with my backup quarterback. Hey, Kyle Shanahan, we're going to put a substation right next to your organization. And every single year you're going to lead the league in injuries. Okay, we'll go 12 and 5.

We'll win a playoff game with a bunch of practice squatters and older veteran guys. You know, that is part of being. a head coach. Andy Reed's resume is a lot of, you know, Patrick Mahomes now, all you think about when you think about Andy. He won a lot of games with a lot of random quarterbacks. Donovan McNabb got injured a decent amount of time while he was in Philadelphia. There were some Jay Feeleys and some Jeff Garcia. You know, Michael Vic came out of prison, was a third stringer within a couple of years playing for the MVP. Figure it out. And it doesn't feel like

Siriani is a figure it out guy. If you give him absolutely everything, a couple years ago, Best O-Line, Best Running Game, A.J. Brown and Devante, a quarterback who would still run then, and obviously threw a great deep ball. And I think they had four guys with double-digit sacks. Yeah. I would say most coaches in the NFL would have some success.

Doesn't guarantee you're going to win the Super Bowl, which he gets credit for. But like, I would say all 32 coaches are winning games with that roster. And that setup. Vic Fangio, a defensive coordinator? Like, it was pretty good. This is the NFL. Your right tackle, who is going to have his number retired one day, is done.

Week 4, I'm out. Camp Jurgis I saw today got concussion-like symptoms 48 hours after the game. Who knows if he'll play? Your wide receiver room right now, Devante Smith, I saw a clip where he's at McDonald's on like a paid appearance. You know, in Philly, you got to, we'll get into LeBron a little later. But this thing feels like it is, there are, when I was in high school, I was working, my brother actually works for him now. I worked with a guy named John. His dad was the boss.

And he had owned this barge from actually, I think it was from either the Korean War or World War II. It was really, really old. And it was on the Delta, right, kind of close to Sacramento. And one day, I don't even. know why they had it. I don't even think we used it. I don't even think it worked. But he had bought it and he just parked it on the Delta right next to all this farmland and just sat there. Well, one day, things started sinking. And there was oil all over the Delta. And it was a major, major issue. Like, how do we stop this from happening? How do we make sure to get this thing back

above water? It is taking on water at rapid speed. We have these little pumps and it was a nightmare. John actually got burned by one of the pumps trying to, I mean, it was so stupid. We had these tiny little pumps. It wasn't going to work. And it was a nightmare. And I think sometimes, like, sometimes things just sink. And when you're looking at the Eagles, you go, where are they going to be able to pump this water from sinking their boat? And I don't think there are many answers.

Like, Jalen's not good enough to take random guys and elevate them. Their offensive line hasn't been good for a couple of years with Lane Johnson. Their record with Lane Johnson at right tackle and Lane Johnson not playing, I think it's like 68% when Lane Johnson is in the lineup, and it is well under 500 when he's out. So there's a tangible impact when the guy plays and when he doesn't play. And then we talked about this yesterday. When you have an inexperienced guy calling plays,

there's no one to throw you a life raft. Like you've got to figure it out on your own. Nick Siriana doesn't have the capability to call place. The Eagles won't allow it, obviously. And Nick's no dummy. He doesn't want to do it because that puts him under the firing line. So the defense, I mean, they pay those two defensive tackles. They're not making place.

The big problem, though, is this week they are playing an international game against you could make an argument for the best team in the NFL. I know they're not undefeated like some of the other teams, but just in terms of their complete body of work, I wouldn't put them number one, but they have an argument for being the best AFC team and right in the competition with the Seattle Seahawks, the 49ers, the Chiefs as the best team in the league.

The Jacksonville Jaguars could destroy the Philadelphia Eagles this weekend. And this gets back to hiring these guys. It's like, okay, I can have a CEO head coach. Well, I would say typically when Jim Harbaugh, John Harbaugh, Dan Campbell have had success, it's when they've nailed their coordinators and their roster is full of pro bowlers. Like most of the time,

those guys weren't making playoff runs, especially the Harbaugh brothers, when the roster was in Shambles. Look at last year, when the Ravens had a bunch of injuries. They went 8 and 9. Look at Jim this year. Roster's kind of in Chambles,

getting his ass kicked every week. You know, it's like, well, John, they just lost by 7. Yeah, they were down 20 to 6th of half time and getting worked. So I don't know what they do. If I was a betting man right now, the way this feels and the way it's trending.

I mean, this is not just out of the blue. This is a carryover from last season. This has got like five wins written all over it. And I just don't think they have the guy. Like, they have someone if you give him a Ferrari, can steer it, no problem. But he ain't winning the race with a Prius, with a Ford Taurus.

I mean, he's going to get smoked. Hell, I could put Lewis Hamilton in one of those, you're still going to lose, but at least he'd give you a valiant effort. That ain't the case with Siri. And I think this weekend has a chance to get very, very ugly. Speaking of another situation that is very problematic, young coaches, first time head coach,

very young offensive coordinator. If you watch the Ravens this year, beside the end of the game against the Saints, Lamar Jackson has looked elite. He has looked awesome. If Lamar hadn't got hurt, in that game. And who knows, they probably would have called off the dogs.

You know, defensive coaches aren't big on running it up. They could have beat the Titans 55 to 10. They would have massacred him. But he hurt his ankle. And I kept thinking, like, you know what? They knew this game's in hand. Lamar was on the sideline. It wasn't that big a deal.

But it turns out Rapsheet reported today that like, this is a multiple game injury. And let's be real. like rap sheet's an agent guy rap sheet where he gets a lot of his information from like if you're getting it from the player side they're going to try to be more optimistic hell if you get it from the team

they're going to try to be more optimistic so I think it's fair to take this thing with a grain of salt left the game in a boot their next game this weekend is at Atlanta who looks like one of the if not the hottest team in the league if you just based on the last two games they look fantastic. You're going to win that game with Snoop Huntley?

Like, I'm picking a land in that game. And then, let's say Lamar's multiple week injury. They got to go to Cleveland. This is where we get back to Sean Mannion. You have limited experience as an assistant coach. You get in these predicaments. You only have so many things to draw from. I don't even blame them.

When I was 28, I only had so much professional in life experience. Hell, if I was just talking to my neighbor Jerry, he's 85, fought in Vietnam. That guy can pull from a lot more than I can. And it's no different with coaching. When Andy Reid's dealing with stuff, obviously he just had an issue with the offensive lineman.

Ben there, done that, not phased by it. Thornton on the ground with his ankle pointing to Reno. This isn't the first injury I've experienced to a guy thriving. We'll pivot. figure it out, it's not easy to do, but when you've been in those situations over and over and over again, it becomes, if you are a talented individual, much smoother to navigate it. I would say this, having a nine-month-old is way easier for me than having the three-month-old. You know, it definitely has gotten a little easier, but at first it's like, I might run away. I don't know if this is

me. This is, we got a lot, this is a lot. You know, and then as, okay, I can see by the second child, you'd be pretty unfaced, lose way less sleep. Well, not literally, but like, mentally, right? You just know how to handle things. And I think a lot of these young coaches now are in problematic situations. Why, it's the NFL. Lamar Jackson's been hurt before, probably get hurt again. But this is a team, like this, the expectations were sky high. Every single year, they're like the Super Bowl favorite for a reason. And I mean, a huge reason is him. And here's the other thing about, you know,

Jesse Mentor and Declan Doyle. The Ravens historically and a lot of their have had incredible rosters top to bottom. It's a good one. I wouldn't say it's blowing your socks off. I think the gap between like them and Buffalo, remember they played the bills a couple years ago in that playoff game? It's like the Ravens are just way better than the bills. And they ended up losing the game.

I think that was the Andrews drop. And we're like, if you just remove the quarterbacks, like the two, the rosters from two to 40, it ain't even closest to Ravens. I don't see any difference now. The Ravens are a lot more like the bills in terms of their operation, pretty dependent on the quarterback. So if he's, if this is semi-significant,

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visit connectsonterio.ca. I'm Hamza. And I'm Martin. And we're the hosts of Out of Character. It's a podcast. I know. There's a lot of them to listen to these days. How are you going to get to us?

Well, there's a specific reason why you should listen to us. We are the best podcast in the entire world. I swear. I know, bold. But why don't we list some of the things we might talk about on a regular episode? So sometimes we'll talk about, I don't know, the Uber driver we just had. And how nice they were, or if we tipped them or not, come and find out.

Sometimes we'll talk about that weird news story from last week. It's the one you're thinking about, trust me. Or maybe we'll talk about music and what's happening in the underground or drama in music or TV shows or the Met Gala and what the actors wore. What we're saying is we're not afraid to talk about everything under the sun. And if you want to see what that's like, come join us. It's a place where everyone can hang out, anyone. Wherever you're from, whatever you're like, you're welcome.

Listen out of character from Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Pods, or wherever you get your podcasts. The ref situation. I talked about it yesterday, but I didn't see this tweet till after the fact that Warren Sharp put out on the referee situation so far this year, which is pretty ugly and honestly pretty embarrassing. because I said yesterday when these guys got suspended that it's like yeah do you want to get a guy on camera screaming F you to your player?

No, but I saw so many former players on social media saying you're screaming back and forth with the referees all the time. Coaches scream F bombs at them nonstop. I'm less phased by that. The other situation with the shoving, he got one less game, but it's like, I don't know. I don't get his caught up. My main issue is can we fix the actual officiating?

You know, I don't care like operating with morality about these human beings. Can we just get the calls right? Warren Sharp put this out. I'm sure many of you've seen it, you know, kind of going viral. That it's been off.

Like something has been weird this year. Well, I'll tell you why. Because through four weeks, most flags in over a decade. They're number one most red zone penalties per game by offense in history. Number one, most penalties on third and four. in the second half of games, it feels like that.

In these games, in the second half, it's the NFL, most games are relatively close. Yellow flags are all over the ground. But here is the thing that jumps out to me the most. 17 touchdowns nullified by penalty. And it does feel like I have friends in California in the construction industry. And you'll talk to them about dealing with projects. It'll be like, bro, you have to get 100 permits, 50 different inspectors, on top of paying premiums to get things done,

it is a pain in the ass. Why? Because that state is overregulated when it comes to many industries. And it is very difficult to get things done. And I think it's no different than what's going on in the NFL. Like obviously sometimes you have to have regulation.

You have to have like, it's a, that's a penalty. Throw the flag. But I do think we have crossed the line. and this happened. Born and raised in California, it was not like that in the 80s and 90s when I was growing up. It is dramatically different from a business perspective,

especially a building perspective. The NFL, like, you used to have to do something really bad to get a pass interference penalty. They throw them, they give them out like their candy now. And you already can't touch them, right, in terms of hitting them across the middle. Because the guy's defenseless. No, he's not defenseless.

He knows he's running around with seven guys in coverage. I do think that the pressure on these guys, knowing all the angles, I've said forever, like, I'm okay with a little human element. I would rather bring back the human element of everything and cut these flags in half than over-regulate, slow motion, all these different angles. And why when the World Cup went on, even for those of us that aren't soccer people, we kind of embraced it because you're like, you know what? This is badass.

What was our number one gripe? the flopping, the cards, it's like, come on, guys. This is kind of, I understand it's somewhat part of your sport, but it felt like they took it, you know, to a different level, right? Because they know they will get the yellow cards, the red cards. And it's like, do you have to flop on every play? It's why people have been so critical of some of these guys in the NBA over the course of the last 10 years.

It's like, we don't need to flop this much. It doesn't need to happen. No different than this. We don't need these. excessive flags. The number one most important people that the NFL can never forget about are all these people watching the games. The Kansas Chiefs and the Raiders just had 25 million people watching. And I'm not, there's nowhere else to go. There's nothing else to watch. But you can't convince me that the flow of a game, when there is a flag, every other play needs to happen.

And I don't know if it's because the referees are so scared of getting, dragged on social media that if they don't get over aggressive there's going to be an angle that actually showed this is football it's a violent contact sport let them play a little bit

basketball what do they usually do once they get in the post season it'll cause many flags like watching a game on Sunday and there is a stoppage there already is a natural stoppage in football there's only what like a little over 11 minutes of action over 60 minute game

when so you you actually don't get that much play. The majority of it is talking about the play that just happened, talking about what the coach would do, should do, didn't do. Like, if you think about it, the majority of a football game, this is not basketball, which is constantly going back and forth. Majority of the football game, people are just standing there. You know, how long does the play last?

Some three, four, five seconds, long ones, eight, nine, ten seconds, right? So when the referees who have become way too big, of a part and play way too big of a role in, one, the viewing experience and obviously the outcome of these games. 17 touchdowns nullified? For example, five last year, the year before four, what are we doing? And honestly, there might be some connection to the training camp, the lack of physicality. It's all interconnected. But I know this, Rod, you're the boss, that they're paying you $50, $60 million a year. You got to nip this in the bud, and you got to do it fast.

Because I love this sport. Most people listening. Most people in America do. I just talked to three different people at the gym today about the Chicago fucking bears. My main guy, Rob, talked to him all the time. Randomly met a guy named Sam came up. He's like, hey, older guy, love you every Sunday. So I knew he was talking about me and Colin.

And I said, where are you from? And my guess is always when in Arizona, somewhere in the Midwest, from Minnesota, from Minnesota, to Green Bay, Chicago, Kansas City, that stretch. A lot of the Midwesterners here. And those football brands where I live are massive. There are more Bears fans here than Cardinal fans. There are more 49er fans here than Cardinal fans. Like, it's a unique place to live.

You know, I'm from Northern California. It's like 90% Niners fans. Lived in Philadelphia, it's 100% Eagles fans. So it's kind of cool. It means you because you'll randomly just have a conversation about Kevin O'Connell. You know, you'll randomly have a conversation about like Andy Reed and specs.

But I do think we just want to watch a game where there is not a yellow you know flag on the ground every play. And now the stats, like your gut feeling,

your eye test, the vibes of what you've been watching felt like that. And then when you actually see these numbers blowing all these previous years out of the water, you go, we got a problem. And I'll give you the NFL credit historically. When they got a problem, they usually pivot and fix.

My issue and hesitation with this one, they're just so pro offense. They clearly think more women watch when there's more points. Like that's a fact. Like they want more women to watch because they feel they've capped out on men. But I don't know. I just don't agree. The other thing is, you know, speaking of the chiefs,

I was on a group text with a bunch of guys from the guys from the volume and three and out yesterday, and we were talking about, you know, the NBA and how they've changed their salary cap and now you can't build super teams. You pay the wrong guy. You just cripples your franchise. And I think one powerful thing that the NFL has

is that star players, regardless of markets, stay. And then if you do it right, you can build the Patriots for 20 years. You can build what Andy, Reed is built with the chiefs. People say they don't want dynasties. I mean, Coward's been on this forever. It is more important to have

them in your sport than not. And like the biggest basketball teams in my life by a mile have been Michael Jordan, Kobe and Jack, Kevin Durant Warriors, and some of LeBron super teams. You know, it hasn't been the thunder and a bunch of guys

that have never tried beer. I'll promise you that. You put them on consistently like you're not going to rate. And I I think you watch, and the Raiders reserve a lot of credit because you can't just throw the chiefs on in a 50 to nothing blowout or a bad game. Like, I don't think it's going to set the record for most people watching this week. Game was fantastic. And I actually think both the games that were on, there was a physicality to them that sometimes, you know, in this new modern NFL you don't feel. But like, everyone can resonate.

I remember when I was a kid and Jordan was kind of fading off and the Yankees were starting. Like, you either kind of like them or hate them. There's rarely when these dynasties get going, many people in the middle, many people that are indifferent. Like, it's pretty rare to go, like, what'd you think of Belichick and Brady? And you just find someone that's emotionless.

There's, like, no opinion. It's impossible. Kobe and Shaq, who I hated as a kid because I rude for Sacramento. And, yeah, we shouldn't have won. Because, obviously, Tim Donagy with the mob screwed us. but like, yeah, they were better. We know, our clutch's player was Mike Bibi.

They had Kobe and fucking Shaq and Phil Jackson. Like, yeah, shocker. But, like, they create so much emotion. And I think the Chiefs being back, who, the Chiefs are the new Cowboys, right? One, because the Cowboys drifted off brand for a long period of time. They were not winning. Like, they shouldn't have resonated and got the views of the Patriots, right? Because the Patriots were rattling off Super Bowls.

The Cowboys are like most years like struggle to make the playoffs and definitely don't do anything in the playoffs. But their brand recognition from previous generations, this is a franchise historically that just hadn't had that much success. Right? I mean, they've had good teams over the years before Patrick Mahomes, but never viewed as like Super Bowl contender, a predominant favorite.

And I think the, you know, Josh Allen, Patrick Mahomes, like those guys, as long as they want to stay for their franchises, they will stay. And that's the thing with football that you see,

it's funny because Steph Curry just took a, take a discount to stay with the Warriors. And when I say a discount, it's like $10 million, still make it $55 million. It's making so much off the court. I mean, it's a discount

to the amount of money that, like, however much you make, could be $80,000, could be $800 grand, could be, you know, $20 an hour. Whatever the number is in your bank account that you just don't notice, could be a dollar, could be $1,000, but if it disappeared tomorrow, like you would not notice. When I see some of these guys took a discount,

like certain people are at the point where they don't notice. So if they don't notice, doesn't change their life and doesn't impact, like what they can do moving forward, like I don't even care. It doesn't matter. You know, and I, I do. think part of Steph, though, you know, I would say him and LeBron are the predominant, and I would say two of the most famous people of my lifetime. And clearly the most famous people in the NBA by a mile.

If the NBA could, they would have the Sixers and the Warriors is the number one seats. See a San Antonio, see Oklahoma City. Come on up, Steph. Because of brand. But Steph's brand is a lot like what I grew up on. The same guy playing the same place for as long as he can stay there. and compete. And LeBron, which I respect.

Like, I see a lot of people with some different opinions on this helicopter. He's living in New York City going back and forth to Philly. I love my time in Philadelphia. I love the city. It was as a young guy who was going out on the weekends. Like, I really enjoyed it. I think there was like, I don't even know how to quite describe it. But some with those people that resonated with me, I thoroughly enjoyed living there.

the weather I didn't love, but in terms of the city, the food, the people, the stuff to do at night, you know, and I didn't have any money. I'm making $40 grand at the time. Like, I just live in as a shitty apartment. LeBron is just a full-on mercenary. And everyone just knows it.

Like, yeah, the only reason he chose Philadelphia because on paper gave him the best chance to win, he does not want to live there. He'd be like, well, Kobe didn't live in L.A. He lived in Newport Beach, which I would too if I was him. But it's like, yeah, it's not like Kobe lived in Scottsdale or Vegas. I mean, he, this guy's living in a different state, which again, I appreciate.

Like, guys, I am here for one thing trying to get that extra ring. I don't give a shit about your city. I don't give a shit about anything going on here. I'm strictly here for basketball. It feels a lot like when, you know, some of these companies, like hire consultants, they kind of fly in, fly out, fly in, fly out. and he's just hopping on, you know, Ruben's helicopter. And I think it makes the media really uncomfortable.

It's like, what are the deal? It's like, guys, they're paying him a lot of money. He can use the helicopter. Like, welcome to the real world. Who gives a shit? The other thing is, and here's why I will defend LeBron, like, when you pay LeBron, he does ads and stuff for you. It's like, Kauai.

No, Kauai literally got money under the table and did nothing. All he had to do was like a couple social media posts. Show up for an hour in a commercial. shoot and wave. Andy Reid puts in more effort in commercial shoots than Kauai Leonard. Now, I would also say that fanatics, having ordered some products from them, feels like the worst company in American history. I remember this probably within the last seven, eight years, ordered a couple hats or, you know, like a cool college shirt or whatever. The product, one to ten scale was like a negative ten. I don't know if he's just selling it to so much

many people that buy it once, maybe people buy it over and over again. I don't get it. Like, I don't get the whole Michael Rubin thing. Again, props to him for building this company and making this money and getting in with the leagues. I just think his product. This product just couldn't be any worse. But made a ton of money. He flies back and forth in New York, signs LeBron to this deal. But I've seen people like, is this Philly, like, just this is a hired gun. A hired gun. I just don't think we, like, this is kind of a dying breed. Like, truly, doesn't care about anything, but like winning and making some cash.

That's the point he's at. Everyone knows it. Everyone acknowledges it. And it's like, yeah, see how this looks. You know? And that's what you can pull this off. This would have been a bait, way bigger story doing something like this for this guy

if he was way younger. But like, I'm sorry at 41, 42 years old. You can do whatever you want. You know, like even the McCarthy and Roger's screaming at Jeff. Like, Roger's about to be 43 in like two months. Yeah, it's like, we got, less patience when we're a little older. Scream back and forth. Say some words.

Even McCarthy's like, yeah, we've known each other for 20 years. This isn't your normal. This isn't Jim Harbaugh met Justin Herbert two and a half years ago. So I just love that story of him hopping on a helicopter. The moment practice or a game ends like, I'm out. And in fairness, I've always talked shit about New York, having been my first haste of the East Coast, living in Philly, being kind of told to hate them.

and then I went one time to Times Square when we did the draft in 11 I was like this place pretty cool when I went back a couple years ago for the Ryder Cup stayed at a nice hotel ate a couple nice steakhouses I was like this place is awesome

if you're in the right area I didn't even see it was clean no homeless I don't know where I was staying I have no clue don't even remember the hotel's name I just remember every bar stays up

it's like Vegas I don't even think it closed I like Philly But if you could pick anywhere And you have unlimited money Like LeBron ain't parking with the pores You know LeBron ain't hanging out with us

Normal human beings He's living in his own world So wherever he's helicoptering to Ain't where you and I are going So probably pretty sweet Probably pretty sweet This record is on Miley is having a moment

New Closive shows So IHR radio is sending you To experience it all Life at the Hollywood flights, hotel, tickets, and $1,000 cash. Listen to IHart new music for 10 minutes a day on the IHart Radio app. And click enter. Every day you listen is another chance to win. Stream Miley's new album, Bass Persuades, today.

I'm Hamza. And I'm Martin. And we're the hosts of Out of Character. It's a podcast. I know there's a lot of them going around. But why should you listen to ours? Well, we're only the best podcast in the entire world. we talk about pretty much everything under the sun. For example, music we're listening to,

underground music, trending music, drama in music worlds. Yes, sometimes we even talk about just everyday mundane situations in our lives, like the cool Uber driver we just had. Or the food we just say that is surprisingly delicious. Or we'll talk about the Med Gala and the looks that they wore. Are they awesome? Are they trendy? Come find out. Because our opinion matters. And so does yours. and this is a place where all of our minds can come together and connect. So what are you waiting for? Come connect with us. Listen out of character from Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network. On the iHeart Radio app, Apple Pods, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Let's dive into some mailback questions. Ad John Middlecoff. Add John Middilcoff is the Instagram. Fire into those DMs and get your questions answered here on this podcast. Broncos fan here. What on earth are we going to do with Bo Nix and Davis Webb? Having watched every start of Bo's career, He's won a lot of big games.

Clearly, has a clutch gene, and has proven that we can go far in the playoffs with him at quarterback. But game to game, he's just not a very good quarterback. And if anything, he's regressed. I'm terrified that we're going to give him $60 million a year. Don't be. He can't play like this against $60 million a year. We also have the greatest play caller of all time on the sidelines, knock on place, make an unproven coordinator happy.

I don't understand it. What do we do? I had another guy. Take me some screenshots of the All-22 saying that, like, it's easy to blame Davis Webb and give the equal amount of the pie chart to Davis and the quarterback, but the quarterback deserves way more heat. And guys are open, he's missing them. Like, if I was going to give blame, Bo Nix deserves way more than Davis Webb.

Now, if I was going to give blame about Davis Webb, I'd go Sean. Now, Sean's in his early 60s. you know, if you read that Wickersham article, it is a grind to call plays. So it's, yes, like you want me to call plays like Kyle and McVeigh and, you know, Ben Johnson, like, those guys are like 40 to 45 years old. They have more energy.

Like, I can't maintain this level and do it, which I do understand. Like, I totally get it. He's earned his right to do that. But I also think, like, the powerful part of having an elite play caller, it's like, okay, Davis Webb, you want to go be the Eagles OC? you want to go be the Bucks OC, whoever.

I don't even know where he was going to go, but he was going to get an OC job. See you later, buddy. I look forward to one day claiming you as a member of my tree. I love being around you, your stud. But bye. I mean, that's what all these other coaches do. And I just think this is a weird spot.

I think Sean, I give him a lot of credit. And I think this helps with age. I think 10 years ago, Sean Payton, even if he had done this move, he'd already have it back. But again, experience, age, wisdom. I think it's also as you get older, you get more reflective to your younger self. I've noticed that with just me personally.

Like sometimes I have thoughts in my head, like thinking about things from high school or college. It's like, why am I thinking about that? It was like 20 years ago, 25 years ago. But they're just powerful memories. You get a little nostalgic about. It makes you reminisce about things. and I just think Sean Payton has talked adamantly about 25 years ago

when he got play calling ripped away from him before as a young, young coach. And he's not doing that. But their quarterback is just a roller coaster ride. You can't depend on these crazy turnarounds late in the game. That's not a sustainable model. And the way he just played against the 49ers, Like there's some open balls. He's just missing.

He played. And I get the 49ers playing good on defense. But man, he looks bad. I would not be worried. Like the NFL's cutthroat. This isn't like, well, we drafted him. He ain't getting a max contract if he doesn't start playing way better. At this point in time, we might just do we need to acknowledge this.

Kind of is what he is. Like this, his coaching can't be any better. He's got Sean. fucking Peyton as the guy that drafted him. So if anything, the guy's invested in his success. His other right-hand man is Davis Webb, a former quarterback who got into coaching, like obviously quarterback in that position is his baby. And Bo Nix still looks like this.

So the NFL exposed you fast. I just think Bo Nix has probably peaked. Like there's a pretty good chance. Like this is exactly who he is moving forward. It's not going to change. Question for the bag. Let's say Siriani gets canned. Who do the Eagles go after?

Do Howie and Lurie have it in them to go after a defensive guy like Tomlin or Flores? No chance. Think about who the Eagles have hired in Jeffrey Lurie's tenure. Andy Reed, Chip Kelly, Doug Peterson, Nick Siriani. And the other thing that they do, and having lived it, is they're big on these studies. And just like trends. and, you know, they're numbers, guys. Like, they like the flow of the trajectory of what's working and what's not working.

What's working right now in the NFL? Let's just look at the NFC. The Cowboys head coach, their offense is incredible, is the play caller. Let's go west. Mike McDonald is a major outlier. I mean, hell, he literally is. He's the first defensive coordinator who is also the head coach to win a Super Bowl. Because think about it, every defensive coach that wins a Super Bowl is always the CEO.

Who is two rivals? offensive play callers, head coaches. Who's the apple of everyone's eye right now in the Midwest? Ben Johnson, play caller. So I think the eagle, now I don't know who that guy is, but I think 100% they would hire an offensive play caller because that is, it's evident that's what's working. And the most success they have had, like sustained success,

the Syrian-thing I think would really rattle them if this is the undoing of Nick. let's face it. Like, there is a path for them to win four or five games if this thing completely unravels. But I think the one thing they would tell themselves is when you have a head coach and Howie likes Nick a lot. Like, this is not, like this is not going to be some backstack. I mean, it might be eventually if you get fired, you feel like you got backstab. But they, like, I've seen them together.

Like, anyone that's watched their press conferences, like, they're pretty close. Like, I think they're pretty good friends. And obviously Howie's had a lot of success with him being. the head coach. It's been a pretty, and obviously Nick, how he changed his life. But if you go through these scenarios where your offensive head coach cannot call plays, look at last year. Dan Campbell doesn't want to call plays, but he fired Johnny Moore and he started calling plays, they immediately got better on offense. Now, I don't know you just look around the league, like who would they hire? LaFleur, if LaFleur got fired, because you could put him with Fangio,

but Fangio's about to retire. But, you know, you, LeFloor is a better... I mean, LeFloor can call plays. And again, I'm not saying they're going to hire LaFleur. But my point is, like, who... The number one guy that's going to be on the market this year,

and who knows? I mean, maybe he just wants to play Minecraft and work one day a week. I don't blame him. And he's made... I mean, I think Tomlin was making like $25 million last year. You know, the Steelers don't pay their players,

really, unless you're T.J. Watt. They pay Mike Tomlin. He made a lot of cash. And I just think the Eagles will try to get a coach that will just call the place. So who would that be? Is there a guy in college? Who's the best offensive play caller?

It's also head coach. Lane Kiffin? Would Lane leave LSU for the Eagles? Probably not. I mean, Lane's making $13 million a year into the boss, right? Steve Sarkesian. I would say how he, and how he likes him, I would say this.

I want to say like somebody. I just remember being around them. They were buddies. I just think Sark in that market. I don't know. But who are the guy, like the Eagles aren't hiring Davis Webb? Maybe they would. I don't know.

Declan Doyle. They've had success. You know, Andy was young and Siriani was young. Like, I think they would like someone 35 to 40, early 40s. I think that would be the move. Because here's the other thing. They would have to retool this thing big time. And here's the other thing.

And I feel like I'm shitting on the guy. He's a Super Bowl champ. And there's a short number of human beings that have been a head coach and won a Super Bowl. But what would, if Nick's here, like, what's his job next year? He's making a lot of money. He could sit out and hang out. But these coaches aren't really wired to do that. Let's say he gets fired.

where's Nick Sirion in he's 100% not a head coach you can't hire him as your play caller so what does he do like assistant head coach wide receiver coach so he's going to go from the headman to working with the wide receivers I mean quarterbacks

you trust him with the quarterbacks can you do a small segment on how hard is to get better velocity and change your arm strength like Bryce has done isn't it a rare thing it rarely if ever happens I would say two things that stay the same from college. And one I was taught, and one of these is just from watching.

The arm strength thing is just from watching. I would say Tom Brady in my lifetime is the only guy who feels like his arm got dramatically stronger over the course of his career. Right. And the peak of Tom Brady's powers with Edelman and Gronk, he had a high-end arm. I do feel like coming out of Michigan, it wasn't viewed as like a high-end arm. And part of that might have been the pliability, whatever happened. I don't know exactly what he did. But most guys' arm strength in college will never look any different throughout the rest of their career.

And obviously some guys, as you get really older, you know, in your mid to late 30s, can diminish. Right. But like, Aaron Rogers' arm strength was the same thing for 20 years. Mahomes' arm, Josh Allen, Lamar, their passes have looked the same their entire career. So I don't know what Bryce did. maybe it's lower body strength as well because you know he didn't weigh that much coming out i have no clue but it's pretty evident but i would say 100% it's a very very rare thing it just doesn't happen the other thing is strength for an offensive lineman like guys you can hold up defensive

lineman or you can't so when guys go to the combine they do like the bench press it's like well he did 27 reps on 225 And then you watch him as like his functional strength isn't that like great. But his bench press, he can do 30 reps or however many reps is alive for, I don't even know off top of my head. But so yeah, a lot of things don't change. I don't know what he did specifically. But honestly, maybe it's just maybe just look stronger. It's still the same.

But it definitely feels stronger. And I had someone with the Panthers reach out and be like, I agree. Is it me or is the league just off this year? I think it's a combination of. lack of physicality, the kickoff rule, the oversaturation of fantasy and gambling and injuries. I'm 23, so I'm not some get off my lawn, lawn, sour puss, but the overall product definitely feels lower quality. Couldn't agree more. The kickoff rule, it does feel a little like XFL, UFO. I was talking to a couple people about this over the last couple days, and this has been a theme of

just a conversation. The kickoff thing, if you kick it into the end zone, even if there's 10 seconds, historically, if I was winning by a field goal, or one or two points, right? A field goal either beats me or ties me. If I banged it into the end zone and there are 28 seconds left and you got no timeouts,

I'm in pretty good shape. Now if I bang it through the end zone and you have, even if you just got one time out, and there's 10 seconds left, you're at the 35-yard line. All these kickers are kicking at 60 plus. you just have to get like one kind of chunk play. You don't even need to hit like a 40-yard

or you could hit like a 15-yard comeback. So I think it does feel definitely a little, I just think the whole thing's kind of manipulated right now. The officiating we talked about, there's a bunch of injuries. I mean, Sunday night football. Lamar Jackson probably not going to play. Hot tag, Kellyn Moore is losing my trust.

He assembled a good roster, no doubt, but the problems from last year persist. Can't start, can't run the ball, and can't shake the penalty. Even more frustrating seeing Ben Johnson, Liam Cohen, becoming head coaches last year and having immediate success. I can see a scenario in one, two years

where Kellyn is the one holding us back. I would say that their teams, I mean, the Jaguars roster is pretty legit. And the Bears, you know, Ben Johnson got there. They had Caleb Williams, Rome, they immediately draft, Loveland, Menungai. You know, it's like, you guys, I talked about this last night.

Your top two picks, Jordan Tyson, if you tell me Jordan Tyson doesn't play a game this year, I believe you. And the second round pick, the big time defensive tackle from Georgia, Christian Miller, he's been inactive three straight weeks. I think he was, I said this, I'm trying to figure out like toe injury after the Lions game, but he's just not playing. And he wasn't designated an injury last night. So you have these two high picks.

Those are two pretty important players. Like your franchise got some flaws. Tyler Shuck doesn't look that bad running for his life. Kelvin Banks gets injured last week. I wouldn't just... I think you guys would be okay. Hot mailbag take, watching the Falcons obliterate the Saints.

How bad is Cooper Rush? The Falcons team looked hopeless the first two weeks. As a Ravens fan, I thought it was indefensible that we chose him as our backup over Huntley last year going into the season, and it took us punning. on two winnable games before bringing Huntley back. Did that end up costing us a playoff game last year?

And with the Panthers, look, could we be sitting here at the end of the season saying the Falcons lost the division because they chose Cooper Rush over backup options? It's hard for me to blame them on that one because they signed Tua. And then Tua got hurt in practice. Like Tua was going to be their starting quarterback.

And I also think they thought Michael Pinnock could come back. and then Michael Pennock said his knee was fine and then he kind of refused to play early on. So I can't speak exactly. I'd have to go back and look and read. Did Cooper Rush legitimately beat out Tyler Huntley in the preseason? I forget exactly how that played out.

But in this scenario, like they signed Tua for a million bucks. I think they thought in the back of their mind like Pennix was going to be ready for week one. And then Pennix couldn't practice, Tua could practice, but then he gets injured. so I don't know if they had many other options but I'll tell you he's really I thought a couple years ago when he was playing

didn't he start games with McCarthy in in Dallas? I thought he looked pretty good. So sometimes as a backup it's like I'm playing golf on Saturday morning I've played twice in the last five months one of those two times I shot 71 I do not know how I did that

so it's like am I a scratch golfer am I a guy that can shoot under par? Well, I could also go out there on Saturday and shoot 90. You don't know what you're going to get. Now, if I play every day for like two months straight, it's pretty clear with the way I'm playing.

That's like a backup quarterback. They're like playing golf, you know, once every three months. You might have a great game. See, he did it. And that tape stays with you forever. And then you put him back out there. He's like, you just shot 95.

It's like, yeah, fuck. Hit seven balls out of bounds. That's kind of being a backer. Like when you're the starter, like every game's around, every day's around, you're getting all the reps. When you're the backup, you don't really do that much. That's like going back to Dylan Riola coming off the bench against USC was so incredible. It's like I get he's played a lot, but there's no chance he's got a lot of reps over the course of August and then early on in the season with Dante Moore. Because the starting quarterback gets them all.

This isn't high school. You don't split them. So I'll defend Defansky and the Falcons that way They had some weird circumstances happen But Cooper Rush is a good example of like He had to play more and he's gotten really exposed And

You know what I kind of want to do? What would our guess be Of our man's career earnings? My guess would be I'm going to guess $22 million. I'm way off. I guess he hasn't been.

been in the league that long. He's still, he's made 13. Yeah, never mind. He's, the biggest contract these times was like two years, $5 million. I got a little aggressive there. I'd say the one thing about his $13 million, though, he spent from

2017 to 24 in Dallas. So, you know, you keep that extra, whatever, depending on where you would be living, you know, 10, 12, 7%. But I don't know how much more Cooper's gonna make so hopefully he saved invested correctly um yeah good luck to him the music you love your favorite radio stations everywhere you go the podcasts everyone's talking about all in one place and it's free i heart radio whatever you want to hear listen anytime anywhere music radio podcasts

Unlimited audio. It's on the free IHurt Radio app. One app, no subscription. Always free. Grab the free app. I heart radio. Everywhere you. Download the free IHR. Radio app today. I'm Hamza. And I'm Martin.

And we're the hosts of Out of Character. It's a podcast. I know. There's a lot of them to listen to these days. How are you going to get to us? Well, there's a specific reason why you should listen to us. We are the best podcast in the entire world. I swear. I know, bold. But why don't we listen to us?

some of the things we might talk about on a regular episode. So sometimes we'll talk about, I don't know, the Uber driver we just had. And how nice they were, or if we tipped them or not, come and find out. Sometimes we'll talk about that weird news story from last week. It's the one you're thinking about, trust me. Or maybe we'll talk about music and what's happening in the underground or drama in music or TV shows or the Met Gala and what the actors wore. What we're saying is we're not afraid to talk about everything under the sun.

And if you want to see what that's like, Join us. It's a place where everyone can hang out, anyone. Wherever you're from, whatever you're like, you're welcome. Listen to out of character from Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network. On the IHeart Radio app, Apple Pods, or wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, a couple more quick ones. As a Dolphins fan, if we end up with the number one overall pick, it needs to be Jeremiah Smith.

Malik Willis shows you can be serviceable for the next couple years. We should build the skill positions over these years and then look to bring a quarterback in the future. Jacob Rodriguez, Texas Tech linebacker, stud. I've watched a lot of college football through the first four weeks. Four boxes in the living room, which wasn't allowed, pre-child, but it's like, hey, you want me not in the office with the family? We've got to get these four boxes up. I've watched all these top quarterbacks play countless games.

This does not feel like there's Caleb Williams, Andrew Luck, hell, even Trevor Lawrence. Like, we've got a long way to go, but let's just throw up the red flag. this is, I get it, people get excited. I do too. I stay shit that I, not, I don't regret it because I talk for living, whatever, I'm going to say stupid shit,

but I stay stupid shit all the time. I did think everyone was so excited. It's going to be the greatest quarterback draft of all time. Like, are we sure? Like, are we positive? Because history would say, I would bet against you. It will not be.

And as we stand going into October, which college football season, still as like two months left, and then obviously the playoffs and the bowl game stuff. Is there one guy right now that you say no doubt about it number one overall pick? Because I do not think you do. At quarterback. I saw this guy do a funny like Instagram meme thing on Jeremy. He pretended to be the Ohio State offensive coordinator.

And it was just like he's pretended to be in the headset to the quarterback like he's in the box. It's like, yeah, let's let's run the ball here. Grab Jeremiah and put him. in the backfield. Let's run the ball again. End around to Jeremiah. Let's, okay, play action. Make sure you look for Jeremy. It's just like every single play. Jeremiah Smith.

I think you could justify taking number one overall. Now personally, and you guys know where I stand on him, I've been blown away. He is a badass. I have so much respect for how hard he's playing after the history of the last like 10 years of these guys that couldn't miss that would come back for their junior year and just kind of mail it in. I don't blame them either. It's kind of a weird spot.

but this guy is playing his balls off. If there is the equivalent, which it doesn't look like there is, of an offensive lineman or a defensive lineman, I would take that, I would take a left tackle or Miles Garrett over Julio Jones. I just would. I fundamental believe in the trenches first over the outside.

But it doesn't like, I don't see who is competition is. Who's like the second best player in college? football this year. This draft eligible. I love Trinidad, but he's, you know, you're talking about a guy 510. Colin Simmons. I think a lot of people thought the South Carolina, Dylan Stewart, is more talented

than Simmons. He just got kicked off the team or suspended. So that's not ideal. I don't even know who the best offensive alignment is. That shows you everything. There's not like, now, we still got a long way to go. Do you ever feel that McVeigh gets too impatient with his offense? It seems like he'd rather swing for the big play than go small ball.

He wasn't always this way, like back when he had Gurley. But since getting the gunslinger like Stafford, he's been extremely pass happy. I've said this forever. Sean McVeigh's comp is Andy Reed. Sean wants to pass, which I respect. Kevin O'Connell is a Sean McVeigh product. What is Kevin O'Connell? He's in a weird spot now.

in a perfect world, what would he want to do? He'd want to pass it 40 times a game. I got no issue with. Your philosophical belief on how to play football is what makes you your own man. Everyone's a little different, right? Every coach has their own kind of core philosophies.

But like he gets, you know, he's from the Shanahan tree. And he's not like Mike and Kyle. Mike and Kyle are like, Ben Johnson feels like he should be from their tree. They want to call runs. They want to run for 300. yards. Sean McVeigh does not want to run for 300 yards. If you don't Sean McVeyer, you can run for 300 yards or throw for 600 yards, he would throw

for the big number every time. Where Ben Johnson, Kyle Shanahan, every day of the week and 50 times on Sunday would sign up for the 300 rushing day, every single game. They would pick that every time. Like, this is what I give Andy a lot of credit. Like, this is not really his nature. But, like, he's not dumb. You write the hot hand.

The guy looks incredible. They just, hey, just keep handed it to K-9. And it's working. Kenneth Walker looks incredible. Like, Sean, one of your best players is Karen Williams. Now, in fairness, they also have Devante Adams, Higbee.

Pooka's back look good. A little concerning about Puka. I didn't even know if it was AI. He's like, you know, it's the beginning of growing. It's like, I don't know. He's going to need a hernia. surgery. It's like one day, maybe, potentially. Like, well, he's on my fantasy team. Like, is he going to keep playing? Is he going to look

like he just looked? Because he looked pretty sweet. Can we get some updates? I don't know. I hate fantasy. Other than that, yeah, I just think, Sean wants to pass. You know, it's why, is Sean McVeigh going to be there with Ty Simpson? I would bet against it. I have a hard time envisioning in two years. Week one against Seattle's Seahawks. Sean McVey and Ty Simpson take the field. I just, I don't know. I could be wrong. I'm not right. If you told me Sean went to Amazon, make my Thursday night way better.

I would sign up for that. But listen, I want Sean to coach for the next 25 years. But clearly, probably won't. Sean's got a little hiatus written all over him. Hiaitas is probably the wrong word. He's got a little, he's got a break. I would say like a 24-month break. You know, they get the one year's wife's like,

how great is this? They go on vacations. They do Amazon. He does one more year. And then he starts missing it. Like I can't see Sean just quitting forever like John Madden did, coward did. But I think I would bet a lot of money that he is a lock to skip a year or two

within the next, you know, over the street. Like once Stafford is gone, and they can't pull some rabbit out of the hat, it's like, well, could they trade for Herbert? Spanos family wouldn't trade Herbert to them in their own bill, no chance. Burrow, I mean, bro needs to not throw interceptions in the red zone.

Listen, I like Joe, and you guys know where I stand on the Bengals. You look at the numbers, like the 400 plus passing yards, Some of the, it fell a little hollow. Like, I was pretty dialed in on that game. Had the Bengals, minus two and a half. We were fighting an uphill battle, and it wasn't the defense's fault.

Now, Chase got C-Oed. Like, Joe, I'm watching Lamar. I'm watching Mahomes. I'm watching Purry. Like, you need a little more, buddy. If this is going to go where you guys hyped it up to go, the defense is not playing bad. Trevor Lawrence did not slice and dice them.

They did not lose that game because Leon Cohen lit them up like Christmas tree. Parker Washington didn't do anything against them. They lost that game because the offense did not come through in big moments. Period, point blank, end the story. Thanks for my TED Talk. I'll see you guys later. Adios. The volume. This is an I-Heart podcast.

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