The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 & Out - Jared Goff & Detroit Lions knockout San Francisco 49ers in Monday Night Football battle

Episode Date: December 31, 2024

John returns to break down another exciting Monday Night Football matchup where the Detroit Lions and their potent offense, led by Jared Goff, Jahmyr Gibbs and Amon Ra St. Brown, defeated a struggling San Francisco 49ers squad despite a valiant effort from quarterback Brock Purdy. Next, Middlekauff dives into the discourse surrounding Purdy’s upcoming contract extension and his performance throughout a disappointing Niners season. After, John breaks down the Detroit Lions historic season and looks ahead to a marquee matchup in the final week of the NFL’s regular season as the Detroit Lions and Minnesota Vikings square off in an important seeding battle ahead of the postseason. Later John answers your questions in this episode's mailbag segment. Follow John on Twitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest. Check out Gametime - the fastest growing ticketing app in the US, and the official ticketing app of 3 & Out and GoLow -  for tickets to all of your favorite NFL, NBA, NHL, NCAA teams. Concert and comedy show tickets, too. Go to Gametime now to create an account, download the app and use code JOHN for $20 off your first purchase. #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you.

you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the ice. Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

The story I've told myself can then shape my behavior, and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility of connection. This Mental Health Awareness Month, tune into the podcast Deeply Well with Debbie Brown. If you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole, this podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to Deeply Well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, it's Edwin Castro, also known as Castro 1021.

And I'm Kunky, his best friend and business manager. And we've got a new show called The 1021 Podcast. I'm taking you behind the scenes on how I became one of Twitch's most popular streamers. We also love sports. And with the World Cup right around the corner, we'll be breaking down the biggest storylines ahead of the big tournament here in the U. Listen to the 1021 podcast on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're watching the latest season of the Real Housewives of Atlanta, you already know there's a lot to break down.

Gorsha accusing Kelly of sleeping with a merry man. They holding Kay Michelle back from fighting Drew. Pinky has financial issues. On the podcast, Reality with the King, I, Carlos King, recap the biggest moments from your favorite reality show. including the Real House Wise franchise, the drama, the alliances, and the T, everybody's talking about. To hear this and more, listen to Reality with the King on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The volume. What is going on, everybody? How are we doing?

Just watch the Niners lose again. The Lions head into this enormous game against the, um, against the Vikings. So we will dive into Purdy. We will dive into the Lions' chances, not just against the Vikings, but in the playoffs with their defensive situation. We will not talk about Jake Moody,

one of the worst kickers we've ever seen. Happen to be a third-round draft pick. That's a disaster. But that will be a time maybe for the off-season. No more drafting kickers high, especially because the Lions kicker is a former soccer player. There's an undrafted free agent

that played like the USFL. Looks way better, but sorry to go on the tangent there. I've been dealing with a cold flu. I don't know. I was basically in bed all day and I'm sweating as I'm speaking, but thought about canceling, but I was like, you know, football season, this is the last regular season Monday night game. It's Lions Niners.

If I can't have a Michael Jordan flu game, flu pod, then I don't deserve the podcast. So I'm digging deep. We'll talk about the game. We'll do a little mailbag as well. At John Middlecoff. At John Middlecough is my Instagram. Fire in those DMs.

And there will be no show on New Year's Day. So I'm not recording anything on New Year's Eve. I'll probably just sleep all day. I think there is a football game tomorrow. Boise State, Penn State. I have to look at the schedule. I know we got three games on Wednesday. Pretty fired up for that.

I think I'm going to go on with Colin after the Ohio State Oregon game and then me and Jackson will do something at night after Georgia Notre Dame. So football just never stops. This is a great time of year unless you're sick and then

you just got to mentally battle through. So hopefully everyone's having a good week and happy New Year's and let's have a big 2025. Subscribe to the pod, subscribe to the YouTube channel. But first, you know I've got to tell you about my friends, my partners and the official ticketing app of this podcast game time. You want to

go to an athletic event, pro college. You want to go to a concert. You want to go to a comedy show. They got you covered. So take the guesswork out of buying tickets with GameTime. Download the GameTime app. Create an account. Use the code John for $20 off your first purchase terms of play.

Again, create an account, redeem the code, J-O-H-N for $20 off. Download the GameTime app today. Last minute tickets, lowest prices guaranteed. First and foremost, I really admire those two teams. No one has anything to play for. for. The Lions could have rested guys to be ready for next week, given that they're playing Monday night, three time zones over, and they have one of the biggest games in franchise history coming up at home. And not only to Dan Campbell not rest anybody, he approached that

no different than he will next week. The 49ers have guys making huge money, well-established stars, and they played their ass off. It feels like one of the better Nick Bosa games, and maybe he was up because he's playing two really good tackles. George Kittle is just leaving it all. George Kittles had a fantastic season. Like I said, Pearsall got shot. Megan had the game of his life tonight. Joanne Jennings, Fred Warner.

I mean, these guys are all flying around. And this is why football dominates. Because no matter what, game matters, game doesn't matter. You get everyone's best effort. And that's definitely a defining attribute of Monday night football. We say it all the time. even as the season goes on, you can get matchups where you have a playoff team and a non-playoff team and anything can happen. Obviously, the Detroit Lions have a lot of injuries and they're going to struggle to stop people.

But let's start with the 49ers. And let's start with Brock Purdy because his conversation with his contract and they talked about it tonight. And Troy Aikman has said, as he said for a couple years now, he likes him. I like Brock Purdy too. but before we even discuss money, let's just discuss his play. He has been a turnover machine in the second half of these games.

The Rams, awful turnover, lose the game. The Miami Dolphins, awful turnover, lose the game. Tonight, I don't want to hear, well, what about the defense? He doesn't play defense. He's not stopping them. The 49ers aren't stopping them. It's irrelevant to him.

Tonight was all about you cannot turn the ball over. And this was a night, if you don't turn the ball over, you're going to score on every drive. I don't even think the 49ers punted. And the only way the lions were going to beat you, the only way, well, twofold. The Nider somehow drafted a kicker

in the third round, and he's one of the worst kickers we've ever seen. But that's a separate issue. Was if Brock Purdy, or offensive players fumbled the ball. No turnovers. And for whatever reason right now, Brock Purdy, over the middle of the field,

is just not a reliable passer. And I don't know if it's because he can't see things. Even some of the balls he completes, oftentimes are erratic. And tonight was tough because that lion's defense beside a couple of players is a practice squad unit. It's not very good. They are not stopping anybody. And the only way the 49ers were going to lose that game once they got the lead was Purdy, handing them the ball.

And not only did he do it once, he did it twice. And the first one, airmailed, wasn't even close. I mean, Ricky Pearsall would have had to jump 30 more feet to even touch the ball. And the other one, he just stares down the guy over the middle of the field. And Kirby Joseph picks him off and does the Burton Hanks, which is an awesome dance, by the way. But like, when we talk about Brock Purdy's skill set, he clearly has talent. He clearly is a solid player. In the first half, he was slicing and dice in them, had an awesome touchdown run.

But like part of his game, he's never going to play like Josh Allen or Patrick Mahomes or Lamar Jackson. decision making is going to have to be a huge part of his game and be like an elite decision maker when i think drew breeze i go well he never had the talent of aaron rogers right or the arm of tom brady but decision making was just on point no one was better was a master upstairs and one of the knocks on purdy coming out part of the reason he fell to the seventh round wasn't just his physical limitations is because his last year in college he was throwing picks non-stop stop. And you watch him down the stretch. Like the Niners, they were six and nine coming into this game. But like just a couple weeks ago, they were in it with the Rams. And he's just become a turnover machine.

And it's just, it's a problem. And when we talk about this huge amount of money, like I just think, how could you not be concerned? Honestly, how could you not be concerned? How could you be comfortable giving him this type money when this is what's going on? last year like that's how we got in the Trevor Lawrence situation Trevor wasn't playing well everyone was making excuses then they give him money and it was a disaster Jordan Love at least he had played well to when they cut him the check like part of if you look at it like a stock

if a stock's up or a stock down shouldn't a stock be down I don't give a shit what you did in 2022 or 2023 it's 2025 what happened the last couple months what the hell was that? It's just, listen, I'm not trying to be some hater because I've never been on that side of the ledger. But when I watched tonight,

and I watched those two passes that lost them the game, two interceptions led to 14 points ballgame. It's over. Like I don't, you can be like, well, the defense sucks. Well, yeah, they've sucked for a long time. They're not very good this year. Neither's the Lions.

You know who didn't throw the ball to the other team? Jared Goff. You know why? Because if Jared Goff throws picks right now, guess what will happen? The Lions will lose. He can't afford to turn it over. He's got to be perfect.

So what was Jared Goff tonight? 25 and 34, 300 yards, three touchdowns, no picks. Honestly, his only stupid play was like a bad sack that ended up, they got three points out of it anyway. But like, you have to hang your hat on something if you're purdy. Same thing with Jared Goff.

A huge part of Jared Goff. game because he's not super mobile, right? And he's actually, it feels like he's throwing the ball with a little more zip now than ever, but it's decision making, really good decision making, especially over the last couple months as their defense has been depleted. I have to rely on you. Obviously, there are going to be some plays, Kyle Shanahan, Ben Johnson, elite coordinators. There are going to be plays where guys are just wide open, hit them in stride, and they both do it with their eyes closed. That's why they're good players. But where Jared Goff, to me, is really separated like he just, I'm looking at his game log.

Niners, no picks, obviously. The Bears last week, no picks. The Buffalo Bills, no picks. The Packers, one pick. The Bears, no picks. Like, he just hasn't been throwing picks because he can't afford to. Because if he does, and honestly, if he does next week, they'll lose. And sometimes, like, this is why, if I'm going to pay a quarterback $40, $50 million a year and give $150, $200 million guaranteed, there's going to be a stretch for my defense is in Chambles. And we can't stop anybody. especially good offenses. I'm going to need to

fucking ride you like, you know, secretariat. And whether you play like Josh Allen or whether you play like Jared Godfer Purdy, you got to play

within yourself, but dominate. And you can't be hitting guys in stride like Brock Purdy did today. Like that, I don't know. Anyone making an excuse

for him the night should be ashamed and embarrassed. Like that was, that's an enlightening moment. And then he gets, you know, I'm recording this right after the game,

he gets injured. I don't know what that was. Keep your fingers crossed. It's not that elbow. again, kind of a weird deal. He couldn't grip the ball. Hopefully he's just his hand. But man, like, I just can't get over the interceptions.

I don't do the, especially second half interceptions. And that's what all these down the stretch of Miami, the Rams, tonight, second half interceptions, doesn't get any worse than that. It really doesn't. So I'm not acting like they're going to kick him to the curb. Tim Calacami reported tonight that Jed York, who was on the field before the game, told Tim that obviously these guys are coming back. I've never even entertained that story. And Kyle likes Brock, but these have to be moments.

Like there was one moment tonight where he threw a pick and Kyle immediately covered his mouth. He's no dummy. Monday night football. He knows he gets caught on camera talking a bunch of shit. It would go viral. Like Kyle, I want to see what you're saying. I'm interested. I want to hear your thoughts because I know I'm going to get your fake thoughts in front of the podium here whenever you talk after the game. But listen, I admire the 49ers being completely out of it and throw in the kitchen sink with all they got, given their injuries and their situation. I mean, they played a game tonight. Their offensive line was the equivalent to the Detroit Lions defensive line.

You couldn't point any of these guys out of the lineup. And they're trying, and I appreciate that. But at the end of the day, when you're in a tight game, and we're talking hundreds of millions of dollars being in a contract, like you just can't make those passes. They cannot happen. Right? They can't.

Not when your contract is in the balance and not expect people to, like, be all over the map on opinions on it. And on Detroit, like, my number one takeaway before Purdy started throwing the interceptions was like, there's just no way they can beat the Lions next, or excuse me, beat the Vikings next week, let alone win

playoff games as if this is their defense. And it's not their fault. It's not like they have a bad scheme. They just have a million injuries. Their offense is elite. It's like it is awesome. They got it all. But if you do not have a defense, you cannot win in football. You can't win in big time college football. And you definitely

can't win the NFL. And given the unit they have, it's just, they're kind of screwed. They cannot slow anyone down. I mean, Purdy tonight, who's, to me, had a pretty me season. I don't care what statistics you throw at me, had the game of his life in terms of passing yards. And guys were running wild. And the thing in the NFC, obviously Minnesota, you got Jordan Addison and Justin Jefferson, the Philadelphia Eagles, A.J. Brown, Devante Smith, Sekewan Barkley. I will see on Goddard's health. But even their back. up tight end is good. The Green Bay Packers, if what's his name,

Christian Watson could ever get healthy, they got a million wide receivers in a tight end and Josh Jacobs. So you just look at the NFC, you know, the Rams are probably your easiest bet given that they just got Pooka and a running back. But all these good NFC teams, you know, even Washington, they got a quarterback that can run around,

they got a couple wide receivers, they got Terry. It's hard. You've got to play defense. And I just, it's sad because I think the Lions, like, healthy early in the season, like they're winning the Super Bowl. everyone thought it. Anyone, whether you like the Lions,

whether you don't like the Lions, if you just watch football, you went, that's the best team in the league. And this team no longer resembles them. Offensively it does, but defensively it does not. So if Dan Campbell can win this game, what a disadvantage it is for the Lions

to play multiple time zones on the West Coast have to fly back. I mean, I'm recording this at 8.30 Pacific Standard time. So let's say they get to the plane by 10. 10.30-ish, 10-15. They're in the air by 11 Pacific Standard Time. Four and a half, five-hour flight to Detroit.

I mean, by the time they're getting there, the sun's coming up. And you only got like Tuesday, usually Monday and Tuesday are game plan days. I would imagine Dan Campbell had Ben Johnson, Aaron Glenn and some of his staff really start working on Minnesota today, right, at the hotel. Because they've got to be, one, you're just exhausted after a game. You know, you're only going to have so much energy, even if you pop like 60 milligrams of Adderall and slam some Red Bulls, you only have so much energy and then it'll catch up to you later in the week. And this game, this is the best game of the weekend by far.

I mean, let's face it. The games this weekend kind of suck because there's not really that much on the line. It's not like there's 10 teams in the balance of winning division, not winning division, getting in, not getting in. There's not much going on. And this, I mean, both teams are making the playoffs, but it's the first time I read a headline today. Two teams, or it's like the fourth time in NFL history, the two teams over 10 games over 500, will play. Obviously, it has to take a very unique set of circumstances to even get to that point. But it sucks because what Dan Campbell's done, you see that visual during the Monday night game of when,

is it Sheila Ford? Is that Martha's daughter? Or maybe it's Martha and Sheila was the mom. I get those confused. Sorry Detroit Lions fans. I'm not like, not super locked in on your, the ownership names with your family. But the Ford family, obviously the daughter runs it now. And when he's she stood by them when they were one in five with Dan Campbell. And remember, it was really ugly early on with Jared Gough. What they've become is really awesome. But I think the shitty part, big picture is like, Aaron Glenn, you never know with the defensive coordinator.

Like defensive coordinators aren't locks to get a job. Though, like, I kind of imagine he'll be the next coach of New Orleans. We'll see on that one. Or even the Jets where he played. But it feels like if Ben Johnson is willing to leave this year, which he wasn't last year, like he's gone. So this was your squad, right? It wasn't obviously all your defensive guys are under contract,

but you had your coordinators who Ben Johnson's been the coordinator for three years and he'd been there for, and Aaron Glenn's been the coordinator the entire time. And obviously, Dan, you know, tonight, he goes for it no matter what, but I couldn't fault him the night of going for some of these. Like it didn't even matter. Even sometimes to kick field goals. Who's just trying to win, which I appreciate. Why?

Because winning breeds on winning. You see everything that's coming out of the Indianapolis Colts. I saw a bunch of clips during the Monday night game scrolling my phone you know McAfee put out this thing and on the Colts you know basically Shane Steichen was asked like did you guys have a problem with people being late?

He's like yeah you know sometimes people just show up late it's like people just show up late in the NFL you think people show up late for the Chiefs or the Patriots with Belichick and Brady you think people showing up late with Dan Campbell you think that shit has flown with Kyle Shanahan or John Lynch over the last five years

like no and that's why you see the culture in these two teams but like you get to a law of diminishing returns where you just run out of bodies and that's where Minnesota like I'm starting to think maybe it's just their year because I if Minnesota wins this game

I don't see a scenario where I probably would bet against them in a playoff game I really don't and there's a chance you know it sucks for Detroit but if Detroit loses the game on Sunday and they play the Buccaneers.

I mean, Tampa sometimes, when they get rolling on offense, they'll just score at will. I mean, Baker Mayfield is, I think he's like top two or three in touchdowns right now. So I don't think that's a great matchup for them. They got Mike Evans, they got some running backs who can play. Baker Mayfield right now is 39 touchdowns. Obviously, he's going to play this week because they need the game.

I mean, he's going to end the season with 40 plus touchdowns. Now, Baker will throw interceptions. but just looking at that matchup, like I like that matchup more from Minnesota. I think Minnesota, just better on defense, much better chance to go on the road and win that game. If you tell me the bucks are playing, especially if, you know,

Detroit loses this game by seven or ten points coming Sunday. And I'm not tired to talk shit. I love the lines. I love Dan Campbell. But like, we got to be realistic about how you win big time football games. Like, you can't win big time football games when you can't cover anybody.

And Baker Mayfield has 39 touchdown. for a reason. Like, they throw the ball a lot. Like, they're, they're an explosive offense even without Chris Godwin. So, I mean, Mike Evans is a monster. Like, you saw George Kilden. That's like, that's Mike Evans. But he can do even more work because he's outside. So I think the only way Detroit has a chance, not just on Sunday night,

but in the playoffs is like they're going to have to have games or they force fumbles and get picks because they're just not going to have stops. They're just not going to be able to get stops. And it's no one's fault. It's not bad scheme. It's not a bad coordinator. it's just injuries. So to me, you get a freak force fumble,

you get maybe a backwards pass, you get a great play by a defensive back. You start a night, Purdy just airmail someone. You get a bread basket catch by a DB, like Kirby Joseph tonight on his first one. Like, that's got to be your formula. And that's a little random. And it's probably hard to win a couple games like that randomly.

But you definitely can win one, maybe two. And obviously, you know, Sunday is huge for them because that the only one team gets a buy now, which I kind of go back on fourth on. Like I, you know, the football season is so hard. Like two teams get a buy felt right. But listen, it gives us more games on Saturday, Sunday, and Monday night. Now with the new playoff schedule.

And one more thing. And I saw. So congrats to the Lions. 14 wins. You know, if they win Sunday, 15 wins. What a fucking season. Belichick brought up today with McAfee. I saw a clip that, you know, the NFL should go to a draft lottery.

And I'm like, I'm not a post. Why do we just give these shitty teams the number one pick or the number two pick? Why don't we just make it random? It doesn't mean like a team that's drafting 20th is going to get the number one pick. But why don't we just give it a percentage chance?

So if you're in the top, you know, like the NBA does it. If you're in the top four or five, you have whatever, 17%. And actually they've lowered it over the years to make it even harder to tank. And it's not because in the NFL, tanking is an issue. it clearly is not.

I mean, the 49ers are better off losing these last two games, and clearly they're trying to win tonight. But why do we incentivize these shitty, shitty teams? Why do we even, you know, Stephen Ross could offer Brian Flores a hundred grand a loss because if he loses, they would have got Joe Burrough, which would have been the right move. But I'm not opposed to the lottery at all.

And I'm not, you know, Bill would have a better idea of he's been to a million of these league meetings, if they'd even entertain that. Who knows? Doubt they would. I've never heard anyone in the league bring that up. But I think that would be smart. And I'd be all for that because, like, the same crappy teams,

like the Jags are always drafted in the top three or four. Like, every single year they're there all the time. All the bad teams are just consistently drafting high. And every once in a while, they'll be a new team after a disastrous year. But for the most part, this is the same crappy teams drafting high. Why don't we make it random? It's like, yeah, you might get the third pick. or you might get the 12th pick.

And that's on you. Be better at football. Run a better football operation. And I hope that happens one day. It's the most wonderful time of year for getting in on all the hoops, football, and hockey action at the Draft King Sportsbook. It's the season of giving. And we're being gifted college football and basketball,

pro football and basketball, and pro hockey two, almost 24-7. So many games every day, so many opportunities, to place your first bet. Try betting on something simple, like picking a team to win. Go to Drafking Sportsbook app and place your bet. And here's a gift for all new customers. Bet five bucks to get 150 in bonus bets

if your bet wins. Download the Draft King Sportsbook app and use the code, John. That's code J-O-H-N for new customers to get 150 in bonus bets if your first bet wins. When you bet, just five bucks. Happy holidays from the first. draft kings. The crown is yours.

Gambling problem, call 1-800 gambler. In New York, call 8778-8-Hope-N-Y or text Hope-N-Y 4667-369. In Connecticut, help is available for problem gambling. Call 888-78-9-777 or visit ccpg.org. Police play responsibly on behalf of Boot Hill Casino and Resort in Kansas. 21 and over. Agent eligibility varies by jurisdiction. Voiden in Ontario. One bonus bet per customer based on amount of initial touchdown bet and expires 168 hours after issuance.

One single use boost per customer that only applies to winnings. See Sportsbook.draftkings.com slash promos for additional terms and responsible gaming resources. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, new? Huge news. We created our own podcast called Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast?

Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey, Jonas, guys. I honestly don't remember.

I think it was on a call about what we should call it. We were thinking, I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas.

And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel. Help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind.

Highlights are trending. Opinions are flying. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source.

The athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsSlic on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slices Life 12 and the TikTok podcast.

podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing.

And we're still chasing it. and we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth, or are you a good person because you're afraid?

Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way.

Open your free, iHeartRadio app search learn the hard way and listen now. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey.

I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levant this went to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life.

Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Let's bang out some mailbag questions with no show on New Year's, with the football games going over the next couple days. I thought I wanted to bank some out right now. I have a million at John Middlecoff is the Instagram fire in those DMs.

Very, very easy to get involved. We'll start with Parker, who brings up a good point. With the Colts losing, in horrific fashion versus the Giants, Will there ever be an accountability with this franchise? Ballard has one playoff win, and it was gifted by luck. No division titles in eight years.

Every other team in the South has won the division twice. Didn't know that. You audibly said, Jesus, last week's mailbag went and form the Colts hadn't won the division since 2014. Colin seems to think the Colts have a good roster, which is obviously a horrible take, considering they've lost many embarrassing games these past couple years. For example, is there a reason that Ballard always gets a pass

but the blame always gets pointed at AR? Seems insane to me. I don't give a flying fuck that he's well liked. I agree. If I was a Colts fan, I'd be done. McAfee went scorched earth on them on Twitter. This year's embarrassing. I mean, that gutless performance against the Giants.

Malik Naber is a really talented player. But, I mean, he looked like Randy Moss and he's Justin Jefferson out there against you guys. obviously the Anthony Richardson tapout situation. Clearly some of the things in McAfee's tweet about guys not working hard, guys not focused, guys not preparing. Like the franchise is broken. There's no way around it.

Relative to what it was with Peyton Manning and even with early Andrew Luck, what it is now is, I don't know the answer. Now, the owner is a kook? You know, is he going to fire Ballard and, you know, you wouldn't think he's going to fire Shane's psyching, but I don't know what to tell you. I mean, yesterday was, you could say yesterday was a low, but the season's been pretty bad.

It really has. I mean, the Anthony Richardson situation is bad. I would say the overall play of the team, you know, now part of that is, I think the expectation, I picked them to make the playoffs, so it shows you what I know. but yeah, I mean, it sucks. You guys are in a weird spot. Huge fan of the show. Saw this, and immediately thought of you.

You might have already seen it, but it's a crazy statistic. In the last 22 years, the 49ers have either made an NFC championship game or missed the playoffs. You know, it actually spans when you say 22 years. They were so terrible in the 2000s. Like when I was in college, they were so god-awful with my. Mike Nolan and Mike Singletary, they were just never sniffing the playoffs. They've really, once Harbaugh got there, made the playoffs three times, and then with Kyle made the playoffs, and obviously every time they made the playoffs,

they'd gone to the NFC championship, but I think three of those seven, they went to the Super Bowl. But, yeah, it's wild. Here are the scenarios that's going to happen with Donald. He signs a three-year deal, making 35 to 45 per season. They give him the non-exclusive franchise tag, projected at 36 million. Another team can offer Donald more, and if he takes it, he gets two first round picks, or you know, Minnesota does. Donald signs the exclusive franchise tag, $41 million.

We run it back with Donald. If he is demanding 55 mil on his next contract, we either add void years to the contract and keep him, or we make a decision to move on with JJ. I believe they would move on if KOC thinks JJ can be 85, 90% as productive as Donald. having JJ actually gives us leverage with Donald. He knows we like JJ and won't overpay. I will bet my entire life savings that Donald is on the team next year. There is no scenario with JJ being hurt

that we don't at least tag Donald for one season. Please look at the message. I watch every single one of your podcast. My dream is to work for the Vikings. I would say that I think we get too caught up in per year. You know, I see this a lot with the Purdy, conversation, 40 million a year, 50 million a year, 60 million a year. Like, tell me what the contract guaranteed number is.

That's what we're dealing with. What is the guaranteed? What's the true guarantee on his contract? Is it 50 million? Is it 200 million? Right? Like, I don't care what Trevor Lawrence makes per year because that's not how NFL contracts are paid.

It's about guaranteed money and signing bonuses. Jordan loves like, whatever, 50 million a year. He got a $75 million dollar signing bonus. So it's not like, the way he's paid, he got $75 million in one year. It's not like he will get 50 next year. It's not the way it works. So I think we get really caught up in the numbers.

It's like, do you want to give him like a five-year contract? Do you want to give him like a Tuatong of I Loa-Jordan love contract? Because if I was Sam Darnold, like, that's what I would be in the mood for. Do you think the Browns would put in a call to the Vikings about J.J. McCarthy? The Vikings are likely to give Darnold a contract based on how well he has performed. and with him still being reasonably young, we could make McCarthy the odd man out. I think, I mean, honestly,

I haven't really thought too much about 25 with J.J. McCarthy, just assuming Sam Donald's still on the team. What I do believe, though, is that if you're the Vikings, you just keep J.J. McCarthy around. Because part, like his value diminished. He tore his knee and then had to have another surgery. So even if you really like J.J. McCarthy, He's been in the league.

One of the years off his rookie contract is gone, and he had knee surgery twice. So, like, I was thinking about this today, actually, in the shower. It's crazy what your thoughts are when you're just daydreaming about football. I don't know if they could get, could they get a second round pick for him? Like, I don't think you would get a first round pick for a guy who has not played and who got injured year one, even if people really liked him.

Because a lot changed since the draft. one, you just miss out on a year of the contract, and two, he's injured. So I would say that I think they're both on the team next year. I'd be stunned if they traded JJ McCarthy. Stunned. Found you on the radio in 2017 because of the Ruben Foster pre-draft hype and have been a diehard listener ever since. Ruben Foster was the Alabama linebacker,

who the 49er drafted in the first round, who I don't think he made it through year one. He got in trouble a couple times and it was a disaster. Very talented player. How would you relate to Vikings in the Darnel situation of having JJ quote unquote learning to the Niners with Jimmy and Lance? Obviously Sam is light years better than Jimmy

but if Darnold were to leave, they'd be in the headlines and likely regress. The Niners got lucky that Brock bailed them out, of that conversation for a year and a half. I think you bring up a decent parallel, right? The Vikings, I mean, they're a game away from being the number one seed. If you're the number one seed, I mean, you're 60 minutes away from being in the NFC championship game.

So I think they're in a situation where when you have a known quantity, anytime you go to this unknown, there is a huge amount of risk. Because now, JJ had played at Michigan. Trey Lance played in North Dakota State. Like, one guy is much more equipped to come into college or coming from college. He played for Jim Harbaugh to have success in the NFL. But there is no guarantee that he's going to have success in the NFL. None.

So to me, you get a guy who was raw, who needed some work, and you have a ready-made competitive team. Like, part of the reason they are so good this year is Sam Darnold's explosive arm. Like, part of the reason they are dominating is he, like, throws two or three touchdowns a game. Because they don't have like the 85 Bears defense. I mean, they're good on defense, but look at their personnel.

So to me, a huge part of their success when you watch them is their explosive passing game. You know, the thing with Jimmy is like, it was easy to justify it. It's like, well, he hands the ball off. You know, he's not even throwing like 25 touchdowns. Sam Donald's going to throw 36, 37 touchdowns.

And it feels like that's a sustainable thing because Addison's in his second year, Justin Jefferson's under contract. you got Hawkinson back. Naylor's good. We know they're going to have good running backs with KOC. So I think it's less about like, you know, Aaron Roger started to diminish.

And he started budding heads with the coach and the GM. So it was like, you know what? Fuck you. We're going to go with Jordan. And it was extremely risky. But it was like it had run its course. When they had decided to essentially move on from Jimmy, it wasn't because

Trey Lance was better than Jimmy. He was not. There is no scenario on this planet where Trey Lance could have beaten out Jimmy Garoplo. So what did they do? They told Jimmy Garoplo,

you're not coming back. Which is ironic because then he ended up coming back because he couldn't trade him because he was injured. And Trey Lance gets hurt in the second game, which the way it was training, Trey Lance was going to get benched.

But Jimmy was still around. It was one of the most bizarre scenarios and situations I've ever seen in my entire life. sports or non-sport it was crazy but they got lucky that it played out that way because if he hadn't been there they would have been screwed I doubt Purdy would have looked as good

if Purdy would have had to come in week two like Jimmy did instead of coming in later in the season so I just think this is pretty easy you got JJ under contract you're on this team you got Sam Darnold who you can franchise or give a long-term contract he's going to be on this team. And if Sam ever wore to get hurt, you got JJ as a backup.

If JJ can pump up his value and Sam can continue to dominate, you can flip JJ like the Patriots once did with Jimmy Garoppel. And that's part of the reason why you invest in high-level coaches because J.J. McCarthy's value should improve. Right? Jimmy Garapolo, he started like a game and a half when Tom Brady got suspended for deflakeate. And he got injured.

I think it was against the dolphins. And he hurt his shoulder. And Jacoby played the next couple games. So the only thing anyone in the NFL had to go off on Jimmy Garapolo was preseason games and a game and a half of NFL football. And the 49ers gave him a high second round pick. So it's like, I know you drafted him 11th, but if you use them as your backup quarterback for a couple years

and then one day trade him for like a second and a third round pick, that's a pretty good value. It's not the end of the world, especially with a quarterback. There's no other position where you could draft and he could really not play and then you could trade him for a second and a third round pick. So he still has a lot of value to the Vikings. God, we get a lot of JJ Sam Donald questions. This is more about trading him.

I just don't think you trade him now. What's the point of trading him? Like you have the asset under contract with you. You've done some work. Like, you need a backup quarterback. You've already paid him because he was a first round pick. Like, my guess is he's not making nothing. So his contract, J.J. McCarthy signed a four-year,

they gave him $21 million. And a signing bonus is $12 million. So the Vikings paid him $12 million. And he basically averages like, like, $5, $6 a year. his cap hits are like three, four, five, six. So his contract's not crazy. You got a backup quarterback. I don't think it's that crazy just to keep him.

I really don't. And that's what I would imagine they end up doing. Big Texas fan here. This team is incredibly confusing. They have great players everywhere on the field and a coaching staff that everyone was very high on before the season. Obviously Stroud's shoulder is hurt. and can semi-excuse the poor accuracy of late.

But what more does the team need to do? Is it as simple as drafting and signing offensive line help? Or bigger changes needed, such as firing Slowick? Would absolutely love them to get dayball if available. I'd be a little surprised if they fired Slowick after one kind of weird year. I mean, just last year he was having like the best rookie season for a quarterback in my life. And now he's just a village idiot.

Now, it has looked rough. And obviously he hasn't been good this year. But I would say the offensive line, the guard and center spots are killing them. CJ's under duress constantly, and he's not playing well. So maybe you just chalk this up. Everyone thinks you're going to lose in the playoffs.

You got nothing to lose. Like, why don't you win that game? It'd be crazy how much we would look at the success of this season if I told you that they won a home playoff game. They're going to be an underdog in that game. I just don't think everyone's going to say they're just a lock to lose. I don't know.

Playoffs are weird. What do you think should be the number one quarterback taken in this draft? Ward or Sanders? As a Giants fan, I would take Cam Ward over Sanders any day of the week. I think one thing that no one is discussing are the intangibles that Cam Ward brings the table.

Shador is a spoiled kid and I'm convinced that when he struggles, he will lash out at the media and be a locker room cancer. On the other hand, Ward is a natural-born leader who has risen to the occasion at every level, and being a zero-star recruit out of high school, he's a great kid and single-handedly carried the Miami team to 10 wins. Not to mention, he has a better arm and higher upside than Shador.

What are your thoughts? I think Shador is a pretty good player. I mean, I've watched a lot of Colorado this year. I bet on him a decent amount. I think he's pretty good. Cam Ward has a better arm Shador's arm is average for NFL standards Cam Ward has a high end arm

I think the character stuff you know I I just think the the Buffalo situation like they're just such a polarizing I mean I see so many people on Instagram talking about this 20 year old's girlfriend and it's like

come on guys what are we talking about and maybe it'll turn out to be right in a couple years, but I think we're over-analyzing. Shador Sanders and Travis Hunter are treated like NBA players. Like the microscope they're under is pretty crazy. And I can't pretend, like, I haven't talked to buddies that, like, I haven't heard bad things coming out.

So I think we over-emphasize, like, yeah, there were some tweets last year about a guy transferring away. Dion did it too. You know, I mean, you're kind of getting, you're kind of getting to Dion. Now, the difference is Dion was one of the great talents in the history of sports. Chador is not that. I've always kind of sneaky like Shiloh, but I have a soft spot for hard-hitting

safeties, and Shiloh will fuck you up if you come over the middle. Some people call them dirty. I just call them a football player. Again, I like, I've always enjoyed watching Shiloh, but I think that it's a lock. I don't by any means think it's a lock that one of these quarterbacks go number one overall.

But I also don't think it's a good draft, so now I think about it, like, why wouldn't they? It's not like, you know, Miles Garrett, or Trent Williams or some like all-time great pass rusher or left tackles in this draft, Tony Bisselli, you know, Orlando Pace, something like that. There's no like Bosa brother or something. People are always like, why do you say Bosa not T.J. Watt? Well, T.J. Watt went 27th. It's funny. I asked a buddy one time. I was watching a Steeler game earlier this year,

and I remember texting some scouts and I was like, how did this guy go to the 27th? They're like, well, he wasn't remotely this good in college. And then I remember looking at TJ, like he was a tight end, kind of like JJ, changed positions. He really was a one-year wonder. But looking back, it's kind of crazy. Palmer here, big fan of the pod and your takes. On your most recent pod, 12, 27, 24, you mentioned how Mario Cristobal was really good recruiter for Oregon and how big brown bags of cash were being paid under the table for players in college before NIL.

My question is about Nick Sabin. In this phenomenon, I recently saw a couple clips on Instagram from the McAfee Show, the first came from College Game Day before the Notre Dame Indiana game, where Shane Gillis poke fun at Sabin for bringing in talent with these so-called bags of money. To paraphrase, which Nick obviously denied. Later, I saw Nick Sabin go on McAfee Show and double down on his claim. The program never had any involvement on under-the-table transactions to recruit the best players to Alabama, creating value for players with degrees.

Do you think this is true? I think it's fucking laughable. Of course they were paying players. So was every good program. I mean, this is college football. If in college football and college basketball, you try to talk like that pre-2020 and you were a dominant program,

you're just a blatant liar. And listen, like you don't need a lie anymore. No one cares that you were giving guys 30, 40. They weren't giving guys millions of dollars, but they were paying players. All these programs. were forever. Coach K, paying players. There's nothing wrong with it. Why are these guys so obsessed? We don't care anymore. Cam Ward literally got paid to play a bowl game and then quit at halftime.

Why he's like, we don't pay. Now, here's the thing, where they have plausible deniability, they weren't the guys handing them the money. You know, when you went to play for one of these top 10 basketball programs or top 10 football programs, they don't hand you know the head coach isn't handing you the briefcase of cash but you're getting the cash of course they were paying players there's nothing wrong with it but say been acting like that is is a little give me a fucking break it's what i appreciate belichick bellichick's like i would never work in college and then the rules went out the door he's like wait we can just openly pay players i'm in so he was like we just created value yeah you did by helping them get better at football

while you were paying them under the table. I think some of these guys struggle because, I mean, and I don't, maybe he doesn't want to get, I don't even know, who cares? None of it matters.

None of it matters. They're literally just, they're not supposed to pay to play now. It's supposed to be NIL, right? Like I get a marketing deal where I'm literally just paying you cash for nothing. But this notion that they, John Wooden was paying players.

I mean, they have like one of the biggest boosters in the country. in like the 60s and 70s. I think his name was like Sam Walton. He was an LA guy. There's never been a good program who has consistently won in football or basketball

that wasn't funneling money to those players in some form or fashion. I remember R. IP Lud Olson is I worked for a guy Rich Ellerson, who was the coach of Cal Poly. And he coached at Arizona in the 90s, like Teddy Bruskey and,

And, you know, they had some pretty good teams at Arizona. They were called Desert Swarm. Their defense was really good. And Ellerson, I think, I'm pretty sure he was the defensive coordinator at the time. Dick Tommy was the head coach. And this is the heyday of Arizona basketball. And it's like Mike Bibby, Miles Simon, a bunch of dudes. I mean, they were like winning national championships and competing for national championships

and going to the final four every year. And he walked into a staff meeting one time. He's like, where all those awesome cars in the parking lot come from? Turns out, it was the. basketball teams cars. This is like 1998. And someone hit him like, hey, don't talk about that. Saban acting like they were just like giving guys a meal plan.

I mean, fuck out of here. You can't let the days of just lying to our faces. You could pull that off in the 80s, the 90s. Everything was just like you could just lie through your teeth. Like, we've sniffed you all out. We know everything that's going on. And there's nothing wrong with it. The way some of these programs used to operate,

hell, I've been told the way it's working in college football right now, it's like there's above board and there's below board in NIL because it's like, hey, you want $500,000? Well, if I give you $500,000 in NIL, you have to pay taxes on that $500,000, $10.99. So, hey, I can get you $500,000, but I'll get a couple hundred under the table. So guess what?

Untraceable, you don't have to pay. But you're getting the same money. You're actually taking home more because taxes, Uncle Sam, the IRS, never knocking on your door. I'm just so tired of all these people fucking lying through their teeth and just thinking like, oh yeah, he's just making sure you, you came to Alabama because he was going to teach you how to hold the edge. No, you came to Alabama because your program was sweet. You'd funnel them cash, and it was a win-win for everybody.

I mean, give me a break. A bet of fans as I heard you on. Colin, question for the mailbag. With KC locking up the one seed, who do you think Andy and Mahomes would rather see an arrowhead for the conference final. I think they would 100% rather see Lamar Jackson. We witnessed what they did to Lamar Jackson last year. So now, I don't think

if Lamar's going to play like he's been playing, I think the gap's much smaller. Last year, at the same time, they were more fearful of Josh Allen than Lamar Jackson. But at the end of the day, like, you're going to have to beat, you know, more than likely they're going to have to beat Herbert and Lamar, Josh, to go to the Super Bowl. That's what they're going to have to do.

Love the show, avid listener, since there aren't a lot of top-end quarterbacks, who is a sleeper to go higher to a quarterback-needy team? My pick is Kyle McCord. Did Kyle McCord declare for the draft? Can't confirm nor deny. Kyle McCor Mum on NFL draft. So he hasn't officially announced. I'll be honest.

I watch the holiday ball. I was kind of blown away. I'm like, this guy can slant. Like, Kyle McCord is below the dude at Indiana. I would take Kyle McCord over Rourke. Yeah, this draft, it's like Kyle McCord, Dylan Gabriel, who's like 5-11, Jackson Dart, who I'm just not sure is that good.

Rourke, who I just cannot take seriously. Quinn Ewers, who might stay in college. Beck, who has a torn UCL, Jalen Milrow, who might stay in college, Warden Sanders. This quarterback class is fucking horrendous. Like, it is really bad. Especially when you look at

Caleb Williams starter, Jaden Daniels starter, Drake May starter, Bowneck starter, Michael Panic starter. And it took Sam Darnold having like an MVP season for JJ. Now, JJ was hurt, but you know what I mean. This class is horrendous. I like the Kyle McGor pick. Okay, last question.

Saban, asking like they, we give them an extra smoothie. That's how we get them to come to Alabama. Come on, man. This could be a question for the offseason. As a huge fan of both college and the NFL, I was curious to hear your thoughts around why we see so many more fights with fans in the stands

in the NFL versus college. I get not every college football stadium serves alcohol, but I've been to night games at LSU, OU, Bama, and several other stadiums that do serve beer on top of the tailgate scene. I've seen some fights at college games, but not as many as I've seen at NFL games with fully grown men.

You'd think college games with young drunk college kids would have more fights, yet I see way more fights at NFL games in person and on social media with adults. Curious to hear your thoughts. I don't really have a theory on this one besides, obviously, like you said, Alcohol plays a part in both your tailgating, you're drinking, you're amped up.

You know, in the NFL, it's Sunday. I would imagine most people that are brawling, you know, on Sunday are going to work the next day. I do think there's, if you look at most of the fights, they're not happening in like luxury suites or the lower bowl. They're happening at the, you know, the upper bowl. So it's just cheaper to get in. and you know it's a certain demo of a guy I just think that I don't know if he's mad at the world

I don't know what are you fucking fighting about especially when you see people fighting over they're the same like they're on the same team they're both wearing the jerseys but I think there's an economic aspect of this I would say pretty consistently they're the upper bowl

I would say pretty consistently it just looks like they are beyond fucking intoxicated and arguing about nothing. So it's just pretty low-level morons fighting. I can't imagine go into a game and getting into a fight. I mean, honestly, I can't imagine. And I don't know if I've seen that many. And I was going to Raider and 49er games

at the Coliseum and Candlestick. But like you, I mean, I see a lot of them on social media. And I think they all have a pretty consistent theme. booze guys kind of I don't know Maybe they had a fucking rough day Maybe they're just angry at the world

Maybe they're amped up Watching football I don't know But I can't really relate to like Paying money to go to something Then to get into a fight Especially in the quarters Like you're in the upper bowl

There ain't that much room to move So yeah I mean I Some of these brawes too Or guys are like getting their nose shattered It's like you guys are fucking idiots What a loser And I hate calling fans losers

Because they're the heartbeat of everything we do Especially what I do But like if you're going and getting into huge brawls Especially when you're like rolling over seats And when women are there like It's like what are you guys What an awful look How does

I don't quite understand how it happens But it pretty consistently happens Okay adios, have a great day talk to you soon The volume Hey guys it's us The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it.

Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. If you're watching the latest season of the Real Housewives of Atlanta, you already know there's a lot to break down. Portia accusing Kelly of sleeping with a merry man. They holding Kay Michelle back from fighting Drew. Pinky has financial issues. On the podcast, Reality with the King, I, Carlos King, recap the biggest moments from your favorite reality shows, including the Real House Wise franchise, the drama, the alliances, and the T, everybody's talking about. Hear this and more. Listen to Reality with the King on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

I'm Joey Dardano, and on my new podcast, Hope from a Hypocrite, I'll be changing lives, helping people in need with thoughtful solutions. Sike, I'm a comedian. I'm not qualified to give good advice. Join me and my comedian friends as we riff rant and recommend some of the most legally dubious advice known to me. This is Help from a Hypocrite, the worst advice from the dumbest people you know.

Listen to help from Hippocrite Wednesdays on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The story I've told myself can then shape my behavior, and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility of connection. This Mental Health Awareness Month, tune into the podcast deeply well with Debbie Brown. If you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole, this podcast is for you.

hear more. Listen to deeply well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.