The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 & Out - John Canzano and Dari Nowkhah join the podcast

Episode Date: August 29, 2024

John is joined by the longtime Oregon columnist and now owner of his own substack, John Canzano to talk about the hype surrounding Oregon, the PAC-12 school conference realignment, and what the future of college football will look like. Later, SEC Network lead host, Dari Nowkhah stops by to talk about all things SEC. 7:08 - John Canzano 59:41 - Dari Nowkhah Follow John on Twitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest. Check out Gametime - the fastest growing ticketing app in the US, and the official ticketing app of 3 & Out and GoLow -  for tickets to all of your favorite NFL, NBA, NHL, NCAA teams. Concert and comedy show tickets, too. Go to Gametime now to create an account, download the app and use code JOHN for $20 off your first purchase. #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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For additional terms and responsible gaming resources, see dkng.com. Slaughty-Ball. What is going on, everybody? It's your boy, John. Middle Cough, that'd be me, Three-N-Out podcast, is here rocking. And I thought we talked about college football today

because it's here. And it's obviously a much different world than you and I grew up on. The amount of conference realignment is never ending. And I thought, well, let's focus on the Big Ten of the SEC. So John Kazano, who lives up in Portland, has a huge substack, the Bald Truth, Bald Brother, dialed in with Oregon. Knows these guys well, knows college football, especially on the West Coast really well.

We're going to talk to him about the hype surrounding Oregon, this conference realignment with the Pact 12 schools going to the Big Ten, what's going to happen with Oregon State and Washington State, and just the overall vibe of college football moving forward. He talked to a bunch of coaches what they foresee happening in the very near future because it's a different world. I miss the Pact 12. I'm not going to lie, but you can't hold on to the past forever because we're not going back.

It is what it is. Obviously it doesn't even exist anymore. Texas and Oklahoma in the SEC And the hype on the SEC this year is pretty strong So I thought let's have someone from the SEC network Dari Noca ESPN guy Who is the lead anchor for the SEC network He's an Oklahoma guy

So he's fired up Oklahoma's in the SEC We'll talk Texas, Bama Georgia It's a lot going on in college football It's kind of turned into the haves and the have-nots And we just got to embrace it We got a college football playoff which is going to be interesting. The vibe of the season.

Do the games mean as much knowing you have a little room for error? But this is where we're at. So we just got to embrace it, enjoy it. And don't get me wrong, I'm going to watch, I mean, probably more college football this year than I ever have in my life. And I've watched a lot of college football. So I love Saturdays. I would imagine many of people listening love Saturdays as well, especially if you went to a school, a Power 5 school. it's hard not to get just immersed in that culture and that vibe.

So John Kazano, talk a little Oregon, talk a little Washington, talk a little Big Ten. Darinoka will talk some SEC and we'll be off and running. So make sure you subscribe to the podcast, the Renaud podcast, if you listen on Collins' feed. Also, the YouTube channel, we got all this content up on the YouTube channel. And exciting times. Football is back, baby. but first, do you want to go to one of these games, these college football games? Or if you've never been to Hudson Stadium, would highly recommend it. Place rocks.

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Again, create an account and redeem the code J-O-H-N for $20 off. Download the GameTime app today, last minute tickets, lowest prices, guaranteed. Let's dive into Kazano. Very, very excited to have on a fellow bald man and a guy that knows one of the best college football programs in the country better than anyone. Long time, Oregonian. And now just a Big Ten guy. Who would have thought,

John Kazano, who was crushing it on Substack. John, how you doing? I'm doing well, man. Rick Newheisel told me a Big Ten Media Day. He was like, who knew? I'm a Big Ten alum now. You know, and they're claiming everybody. So I think it's going to be fun to see some new cities, though,

and some new matchups. Certainly there's a lot happening in college sports. You've been talking about a lot. Yeah, but before we done, dive into Oregon and just college football coming up. You know, I have a lot of admiration for anyone that started kind of in the old school traditional media and who's transitioned. And your substack, the bald truth, is just big time.

And you have to be one of the bigger sports substacks in America. So I want to say congrats because that's awesome. And just, you know, your journey over the last, how many years now, a couple of your entrepreneurial journey. Yeah. You know, Mike Leach, I talked to Mike Leach when I was making the jump, and he said, you're going to be amazing without the structure of traditional media around you. And to some respects, it has been amazing. And I fashioned the thing like it's a pirate ship in honor of Mike Leach.

But, you know, I had been at six different newspapers, and I had worked in that structure. And everything I learned at those newspapers, I still use. And it was valuable to me. So I get young people going, hey, can I just go right out on my own? and I say, no, don't do that. Go into mainstream media and pick up that sourcing and learn what you need to learn. But I had sort of hit a ceiling. And, you know, I'm hosting a radio show that's an afternoon drive radio show that airs across the state.

And I was writing a column forever at the state's biggest newspaper. And I'd been there 20 years. And, you know, everyone knows what's happening to newspapers. The newsroom was down to like nine reporters. It had 68 when I got there 20 years ago. And I was being asked to do a bunch of things that had nothing to do with my job. And so it was scary, though, to take that actual leap where you leave like a secure situation that you could stay at forever. It was kind of a scary thing.

And I talked to a lot of entrepreneurs and small business owners about kind of the exhilaration of waking up every day, knowing it's on you, knowing you have to create. You know that. You know that pressure. It really, it's been good for me. And it's been a lot of fun. And the readers, I think readers are now conditioned with. Hulu and Netflix and YouTube and everything that they they consume. I think they're conditioned to kind of go and seek out the information and subscribe here and subscribe there and kind of piecemeal together what they're

reading these days. So the readers have been fantastic. It's been really cool to see the reaction from sources like, you know, I would the big 10 credential me for Media Day? And yeah, they they did. You know, they recognized me as a, you know, as a as a nation, so to speak. So I, I, I, I, think it's just been a lot of fun and, you know, it's, I get to go now where the stories are and the readers have been great. You know, I'm from Northern California, born and raised, and I was a Pac-12 diehard. I used to go to games at Cal at Memorial Stadium with my dad in the 90s. But it's safe to say, you know, the way the SEC and now the Big Ten, those programs, is it safe to say you were kind of uniquely suited because the ducks are your bread and bunner, but even

Oregon State, Washington, Washington State, have a pretty rabid fan base. for West Coast College football, which in the Bay, the Niners, Trump everything. I mean, Stanford was a top five program. They couldn't get 10,000 people there. That is just not the case with, obviously, Oregon, but even now that Washington's good, Oregon State and Washington State. Yeah, I mean, just look at it. You know, we talk about the stadium sizes in the SEC of the Big Ten, and they're huge.

But, you know, you start piecing together the fan bases at Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State, you start going through the PAC 12. I grew up in the Bay Area, too. my last job before coming to the state of Oregon was at the Mercury News. I was, you know, I've been immersed in the PAC 12 for, you know, since a kid. Like I wore a cow jacket to school as a kid, you know, and I rooted for Stanford. I was a Bay Area guy. And so I think, you know, watching 108 years get blown up was really sad.

And there's a lot of tradition. And I thought about the eucalyptus trees in the parking lot at Stanford and going to see an East West Shrine game and going to, you know, see a cow football game. and, you know, having those experiences and then, you know, kind of contrasting it with what was going on from the business standpoint and major college athletics was really sad. But, yes, like, I left the newspaper in, like, February. And here came, you know, by summer, UCLA and USC in June said, we're leaving. And so all of a sudden, I was kind of in a fortunate position to be like, okay, I'm sourced with all these schools and all these presidents. there's a lot going on. And so the last 25 months or so, John,

have just been absolutely, you know, nonstop. There's no offseason. All the reported, the Washington State and Oregon State fans are anxious. The Oregon fans are excited, but also kind of lamenting the loss of like some tradition. The Washington fans are in the same boat. And, you know, I think still there's a lot of, you know,

readers and listeners in the Pac-12 footprint who are still kind of following all the teams to see what happens. What happens to Utah? in the Big 12. What happens to Arizona, Arizona, State, and Colorado. But, you know, certainly, yeah, I was in a fortunate position to kind of be sourced and connected to all those schools with all the drama going on. That date between, you know this specific timeline, but between USC and UCLA being announced going, which kind of came, maybe you knew, but for most of us out of nowhere. And then to win Oregon and Washington, what was that, like a year, less than a year?

Yeah, it was June 30th that. of 22 that USC and UCLA announced. And I'll tell you, everyone was surprised. Oregon's athletic director, Rob Mullins, was in a meeting when it happened. And it was like a what? He had no clue. Nobody had any clue. Nobody had Oregon. Nobody anywhere had any clue. And so they tried to downplay that and be like, oh yeah, yeah, okay, we saw science. But no, and everybody got blindsided by that. And then it became, what do we do? They were already kind of reaching out to consultants to be like, hey, where's our value? Where's the future college athletics going to be?

So, you know, Oregon hired their firms, Oregon State and Washington State. Everybody kind of hired their firms, their consulting firms, to figure out what was happening. But for that next year, John, it was largely six or nine months of the schools saying, we have solidarity, we're in this together, we're negotiating. And in the end, you know, Colorado leaving in July, you know, 12, 13 months after USC, UCLA left, Colorado left, and then came that August 4th where, you know, I think everybody went to bed on the night before thinking Oregon and Washington were in, because that's what Oregon and Washington was telling everybody else. They were telling the president of Oregon

told the president of Oregon State, we're staying. The only way we would leave for the Big Ten is if they offer us a full share. And then came the following morning, you know, Oregon State and Washington State signed the grant of rights, but Oregon and Washington didn't show up to the Zoom meeting. And they only got a half share, right? They got a half share for a time, and then they'll eventually be, you know, transitioned into a full share. Clearly, they were negotiating. Yeah. And, you know, publicly and privately, they wanted the PAC 12 as a fallback. But I put a lot of this on PAC 12 presidents. I put it on PAC 12 commissioners. That stuff's all been done. But, you know, it's just a total failure of leadership because the PAC 12 was a good conference.

We saw them in football a year ago. They were good teams. They played. They played. in the national championship. They had Heisman trophy candidates. All those teams are going to go off into their new conferences now and the best teams are going to compete at the top of those news conferences. So this is really just market consolidation. And unfortunately, the PAC 12

got picked. Yeah, I mean, to me, Oregon and Washington had no choice but to try to join the party. And who got screwed were Washington State takes football seriously with Mike Leach. I mean, that was a real program. And obviously Oregon State, Jonathan Smith, I'm sure you agree as a star. Those two programs really, really got screwed.

Now, inevitably, I'm a little confused. I understand, you know, you go to ESPN.com, they're just by themselves. Inevitably, they're a Mountain West program now, but it does suck for those two programs. There's no way around it, right? I'll stop push back on that a little bit. I met with Oregon State's president on Friday, and what I got out of that meeting was they are not ready to accept relegation. And I think what they're thinking about, you know, a source told me, too, there'll be two bites of the apple for Oregon State and Washington State. And we hear that term in legal, in legal courtrooms where they say you can only take one bite of the apple.

Well, I think for 2025 and 2026, they're going to try to play a better schedule. They're going to try to put together some kind of alliance or partnership with the Big 12 ACC where they play some football games that are higher profile football games that kind of move them away from the narrative of, hey, they belong in the. the Mountain West. So I'm looking for that in 2025. And then they think there's going to be a fracture again in college athletics. And I think, you know, Kyle Whittingham told me, the Utah coach told me that he expects that it's going to be 40 or 50 teams. It'll happen anywhere from 20 months to four years from now. They're going to break off. It'll be a super conference. So what Oregon State and Washington State are both trying to do is they're trying to say, hey, we want to be as well positioned as we can when that happens.

So if you see them in 26, except relegation or reverse merger, I would view that as a complete fallback position for them, that something went wrong as they tried to forge forward with this ACC or Big 12 plan, because they've got the attention of the CW right now, and the CW president, Dennis Miller, told me that he's looking to expand that relationship. They're already broadcasting ACC games, and then the two pack 12 teams this season. I wouldn't be surprised if the CW comes in and says to the ACC,

hey, do what the Mountain West is doing. Have Oregon State and Washington State play your schools in 2025. Work them into the schedule. You don't have to put them into the conference, but work them in as a non-conference opponent and we'll buy those games. It gives the ability of the ACC to sprinkle a little more cash over those members who are all disgruntled. So keep an eye on that as like the bite one.

And then bite two is like, hey, can you do enough? in the next two years, to position yourself much the way Oregon and Washington did over 20 years, you know, to position themselves as, hey, we're on the right side of that line when that division comes. Utah is a great example of this. Look, they came from the Mountain West, came into the Pack 12, had success. Now they're in the Big 12. They're going to win the Big 12 this year. And then when that division comes, I have no doubt that Utah is going to end up on the right side of the line. So Oregon State, Washington State have to win games and stay visible. So when you talk to all these guys and you're as plugged in as anybody, and we, you know,

we guess about this because it feels inevitable, but like almost like the NFL, AFC, NFC, which was essentially be this Big Ten and adds some teams, this SEC add some teams, Clemson, Florida State, Miami already won in, whoever else from the West Coast of Washington State, Oregon State, a Stanford, you know, join, Notre Dame joins. It's pretty clear where this is all headed. the way you've alluded to, right? Yeah, and I think everyone sees it, and you know, it really comes down to TV.

We all know TV's running this, and so what does Fox, what does ESPN want? Will the CW or someone else get in on this? And if there is an upper division, let's say there is Super Conference, and let's say it's not 40 or 50, let's say it's only 32. Is there a possibility

here that there's a relegation model and a promotion model where there's a second division, which would be pretty sweet. Like, it would really incentivize those teams in the middle to continue to fight, you know, because it would be pretty demoralizing, let's say, let's say you are Utah. And they say, hey, you're school 33. You know, we just couldn't get you into the top 32. And, you know, we love you, but you're, you know, if Utah wins that lower division, do they move up and do they play, you know, and then the lower

teams move down? I mean, it could be a really interesting model that could add a little twist. Because I think college football still has to be different than the NFL. And I think what we're really risking here as we're risking going, okay, well, the NFL is the best of the best. Like, why are we tuning in to see Alabama, Georgia, if you didn't go to school there, if it just looks like the NFL. So I think they have to think about some differences between these two things and stay to that. Okay, let's talk about Oregon, who's really thrown their hat in the ring over these last, what would you say, 25 years of being a blue blood. And, you know, growing up in the Sacramento area, Ontario Smith, Grand High School, Blati, my cousin played at Fresno State.

They used to have some battles. Got to know Jeff Schwartz, that Bilotti run was awesome. Then Chip took it to another level, Helfrich in the year with Marcus. But now Dan Lannning, right, just has this thing rolling. You know, Mario had some issues as a head coach but could really recruit. Dan looks like the combination of both can recruit and not. The hype on this individual season as big as any over the last 25 years up there with a Chip season? Yeah, and I think so. I think maybe, you know, the chip season kind of snuck up on people a little bit because, you know, he had taken over. Remember, he lost his first game to Boise State. And, you know, there were the Lugarrett punch, blood punch, and all that happened. And so there was a little bit of, you know, how good can this be? Where is the ceiling? And will Chip leave? This landing thing feels like it's got real legs to it. And the anticipation combined with joining the Big Ten and getting that Ohio's

state game. Ohio State's coming to Otson Stadium. They're going to play, they're already standing room only seats. They're selling for ridiculous amounts of money. Like this will be the largest attended sporting event in the state's history. Like there'll be more people at that game than any other sporting event

ever. So there is unprecedented excitement but you know, you hit on it like I think that ascension from Brooks to Balotti, Rich Brooks to Mike Bellotti to Chip Kelly. That really accelerated. Mark Helfrich was just there long enough. And then there was, you could kind of see a decision that was

made by Phil Knight and the university administration. Like, okay, we've been with our guys for like 30 years. And those assistant coaches that were there, even during the Helferich era, had been there for 30 years, like all of them. And so we've done our thing. Do we need to go outside the family and go get recruiters? Because if we're really going to accelerate, do we need to get recruiters? And so even the higher of Willie Taggart was a diversion from. from, we're promoting our own guy, or we're, you know, promoting from within, and we're keeping our assistance and keeping that momentum. So it was kind of greeted with some anxiety.

And then Mario Cristobal, yes, you're right. I mean, unprecedented recruiting. And he left the place better than he found it. It was a really tumultuous time. And then landing comes in, it's clear. They're recruiting at a level they've never seen. You look at their offense. You know, they've got six transfers.

They're probably going to start on offense, including three whiteouts that are going to be transfers in the quarterback. right guard, right tackle, transfers. Defense, they're going to start seven transfers. These are players, and this is depth that they've never had before. And size. At the spring game, I'm on the field, John, and I'm watching these guys, and it's a size thing that it's just not Oregon.

Even Oregon in 2011, when they played in the national title game in 2015, in the national title game, they weren't big. They were built like those 49ers teams you grew up watching that had, you know, Randy Cross, you know, playing guard, right? It was these were very athletic offensive line. And the guys they have now make Dylan Gabriel look small. And, you know, and he's not a real tall guy, but he's not like 5, 9, 510. And that's how he looks back there.

And so I initially thought, gosh, how small is Dylan Gabriel? And then I stood next to Gabriel and I was like, that's not it. His offensive line is bigger than ever. Well, when you look at Dan Lannning, I looked at his five losses. One to Kirby Smart and the first. first game of his career, which he was a heavy underdog. Yeah. He's lost to DeBoer three times, and two of them could have gone either way.

And DeBoer's at Alabama, so that one aged pretty well. And two years ago to Jonathan Smith, who I think would be the Washington coach, right? Do you agree with that if everything hadn't happened? Oh, 100%. Jonathan Smith's a stud. So, I mean, those, I would say those five losses are pretty good losses. Yeah. The pressure on him, clearly, Bama sniffed around.

He's making a ton of money. I mean, I looked at the odds. They have the third best odds to win the national championship. Behind Ohio State, they have the second best odds to win the conference. They have, I mean, they have better odds than Michigan, obviously going through a little transition with Harbaugh leaving and Penn State, who's a consistent 9-10 winner. I mean, it's pretty strong going to this conference just viewed as not quite an equal to Ohio State, but pretty darn close. So the pressure on this coach seems pretty high. Yeah, it's set up that way, isn't it?

And it's funny that you mentioned the coaches, and those are good losses, right? But we kind of look at them differently because he got out-coached in that game at Washington, that first game where he went for it and went for it and went for it and didn't get anything. And you know what? I saw him in the hallway after that game. He looked sick. I mean, he looked like he knew. But I also think that's kind of his brand.

And it's kind of what makes him a good recruiter. The kids love that he's a little bit of a gunslinger and a little bit, you know, he's a fun guy to be around. and he'll go for it and he believes in his guys. But, you know, I talked to him this offseason and he said, you know, he's really, he knows now, he knows, like, the decisions he makes have huge impact on what happens to Oregon and football. And you're not at a blackjack table, like deciding to double down here. You got to, you got to be within reason, take the points when it's there. And then the Oregon State game, Jonathan Smith just out-foxed him.

I mean, Oregon State at halftime was down two scores in that game. Third quarter, they're down two scores in that game. and Oregon State figured something out, and they ran the ball like 17 straight times, and Oregon couldn't stop him. And it was just, it was Oregon State's run game and Jonathan Smith knowing, hey, when I've got something, I just go back to it. And so I think Dan Lanning's head, you know, if he were a first year head coach with this kind of expectation in this roster, I would think differently.

But I'm seeing a guy who's more locked in, seems to have the program buttoned up in ways that he didn't before. His offseason, I think, was very busy. he knows that there's a little bit of a team chemistry, team culture question. When you have as many as maybe 13 transfers starting among your 22, you've got to really work hard and fast to get them kind of all on the same page and make them real teammates. And so, you know, the offense went off to the Oregon coast,

and the defense went off on a retreat, and Dylan Gabriel took the receivers down to Southern Oregon, kind of did a retreat. They're trying to do some things to, really kind of get some cohesion. And I don't think they're alone. I think that's a question with the portal in general. If you're taking that many transfers, hell, I've seen it with the trailblazers back in the day. Like, you can't just assemble like all the best players, regardless of character, regardless of personality. You've got to have some cohesion. So I think Oregon's

trying to find that pretty rapidly. And here comes October 12th in Ohio State. Well, he hit a grand slam taking Bow Nix, which at the time was not viewed as some can't miss transfer portal guy. And I'm sure you've seen him play for Denver. He looks pretty darn good. Now Dylan Gabriel, who I knew he played well last year, but looking at the stats, Oklahoma was good. And he was really good.

So he was available not because he can't play. Partly they have this super hype guy, Jack Arnold, at Oklahoma. He comes here. He's been playing a lot like Bo Nicks for a long time. I mean, his college career started in 2018. So the hype on Dylan Gabriel trying to, fill in Bo Nix's shadow. It's kind of a tough spot, though this guy, older player, had a lot, played a ton of games, had a lot of success. Coming from Oklahoma has to make it a much easier

transition for him. Yeah, and he, you know, he got here early, even though he's only got eight months to make this happen. I mean, Bo Nix took two years. And Nix was a better player that second season than he was the first one. Big time. And I think that's a real interesting distinction is Gillen Gable's got to do it, and he's got one year of eligibility. So, but, you know, Nick's set the all-time NCAA record for starts by a college quarterback, you know, and I wrote when he was leaving, hey, nobody will ever do this again. And Dan Lanning told me on Media Day, he goes, bad take, because here comes Dylan Gabriel, who's going to break that record if he stays healthy. So it's no secret what they're doing. They're finding an experienced older quarterback who's got a ton of snaps, and they're putting him in an offense where he's got great receivers, great backs, great offensive line. Will Stein's a real creative offensive coordinator. and I think it was interesting to watch Knicks in Denver in that last preseason game because, you know, by the way, you know, out of the gates after the draft, he was 16 to 1 to be the offensive rookie of the year. Caleb Williams was 2 to 1.

Probably a pretty good bet, Bo Nix at 16 to 1. But it was interesting to me because it didn't look like Nix was unprepared for anything. And it was the same at Oregon. You know, he went from two offensive coordinators. Kenny Dillingham, who's now at Arizona State, was his first coordinator, then Will Stein. both of those guys had him just distributing, distributing, distributing, I expect the same for Gabriel. And it's probably unfair because, you know,

to put Bo Nix's numbers and project them, you know, you talk about Gabriel would be in the Heisman conversation. He might be a finalist. He might win it. But, you know, I think that's kind of the stakes right now. And a lot of pressure on landing, a lot of pressure on Dylan Gabriel to perform. Can we go on Bo Nix really quick? Because I was scouting, actually, when Marriota was playing.

And clearly he's from a character. standpoint, I mean, like a 12 out of 10, just physically doesn't quite have the talent. But he was the number two overall pick. Herbert, who physically is much more gifted but was nitpicked in weird ways, went six. Bo Nix was, I mean, it was a historic quarterback draft, six guys in the top 12, and he was last. And it, like, I'm not trying to overreact to two preseason games, but looks like he's in a pretty good spot and going to work. Do you see similarities in those three guys, obviously super high character guys, hard workers,

football people love them but you know bow nicks a little like herbert little underlooked and just nitpicked in ways like are we sure that we're not overthinking this one yeah and i remember when the questions about herbert were there about you know is he is he's too soft-spoken and i was like gosh he's yeah too nice of a guy and but the thing that i loved about herbert was you know he played for mark hellfitch he played for willie tagger he played for mario Christopal. It was like all of this transition. He's gone to the NFL and what's happened? Transition, transition, transition. And with his head coaches, it's why I'm looking at Jim Harbaugh and Herbert together. And I'm like, this is the first time Justin Herbert has had a guy who he knows is

going to be there. It's going to be kind of cool to see what he can do. But I think the common thread was, you know, you look at the maturity of Herbert. He was at Oregon for all those years and played for all those coaches and dealt with it. You look at Knicks. He goes from Auburn to, you know, where he was booed out of town. He goes to Oregon. He plays for multiple coordinators, very mature. Mariotta had a real maturity about him right when he arrived. Even as a freshman, he was, you know, he was out handing granola bars to homeless people and doing things like, you know, really just had a great heart, you know. And so I think there's a maturity to those guys. And then when you combine that and you know this, Look, I covered the NFL before coming to the state of Oregon.

I was around the Niners and Raiders a lot. And Rich Gannon was the quarterback in Oakland when I was there, and Jeff Garcia was in San Francisco. Neither one of those guys were high draft picks. They had lived a little. They had flown under the radar, and they were the highest rated passers that season for the AFC and the NFC. And I asked Bill Walsh, I said, what is this about?

And he goes, so much of being successful as a quarterback is being mature, and the system you're in and the opportunity and the coach. coaching staff coming together. So when I saw Sean Payton draft Bo Nix, I immediately went to draft Kings and looked at the odds and went, okay, what are the odds here on Bo Nix as the rookie of the year? And I was like 16 to 1. It's not a dumb bet. Like, you know, Caleb Williams has got a lot of weapons around him, but I don't, you don't know what's going to happen. But I just think it was Sean Payton, Bo Nicks together. And then when even when the, in the preseason when he was put on the third team depth chart, I thought, what a small.

smart thing for Sean Payton to do. There's no downside in putting your rookie and saying, I'm taking all the pressure off him until I need to put the pressure on him. And so even at this point, you know, you got Bo Nix who will turn 25 this NFL season. It's not like having a very young, inexperienced quarterback. I'll look at, in comparison I like to make is Brock Purdy, who started like 48 games at Iowa State. By the time Brock Purdy got into the 49ers offense, it wasn't his first thing. Like, he had done. been a starter for like four years. Bo Nix has that experience between

Auburn and Oregon. I think there's something to, I've started, I've played, I've seen some stuff. Well, one thing I think we learned with Bo Nix and Pennix, when they showed up two years ago to Washington, Oregon, not a soul, if I would have said, one guy's going to

go eight and the other guy's going to go 12, and they're both going to be pretty damn good. No one would have believed you. So when you look at Dylan Gabriel, who's on this loaded team, Will Stein, to me, is a name I have circled that if they have a big year, he's going to be interviewing everywhere. A young offensive genius. I mean, could we be looking at a first round pick?

I mean, is a Heisman trophy winner? You talk about odds. I mean, this guy's going to put up stupid numbers. Is he not if he stays on the field? Yeah, you know, I spent a little bit of time with Dylan, you know, in Indianapolis during the Big Ten Media Day. He's very, he's just chill. I mean, and he's from Hawaii, and he kind of has that island vibe to him.

and I just, I left that going, I was far more impressed with him, because you watch him play and you kind of go, okay, but who is he really? And can he handle the transition? Can he handle kind of the glow that Oregon's going to have this season? And particularly, look, you know,

as much as you want to circle October 12th, it's like the way that Oregon's season schedule unfolds, they play a big sky opponent in week one, then they get Boise State, who could be the group of five champion who goes to the playoff. Like, that's going to be a really interesting test that comes in week two for Oregon.

And I like that that game's position there. And then, you know, it becomes the Oregon State game, the Civil War. They should blow Oregon State off the field. They have far more talent, even though the game's at Oregon State. Then you get UCLA as a conference opener. That's a very manageable first Big Ten conference game, weird, big ten game at the Rose Bowl. Then it's Michigan State and Jonathan Smith back at home. It's like Dan Lanny's getting to avenge some of the ghosts of his past.

and then you get the October 12th game with Ohio State. And I kind of think there's going to be such a frenzy around that game. Rick Newheisel told me he thinks Oregon's going to win that game just because the electricity and the enthusiasm around it and they're at home and they're talented. But that will be the biggest game in Oregon's history. Like you look back to the late 1800s. They haven't played a game that is going to be that exciting and that big.

They had, were they both top five? maybe it was David Shaw's first or second year in Oregon. I think David Shaw beat them. They're both pretty highly ranked. But if both these two teams are undefeated coming to that game, I guess if George is undefeated two, it'd be one or two verse three. Which now with the playoff has a little different meaning. It's not like this could knock you out.

But yeah, I mean, it's really exciting. On the quarterback thing, is it safe? to say that Oregon moving forward is just going to play in this free agency thing every year and try to get one of these plug-and-play players? Or is that something you talk to Dan Lannning? Would they like to just have like their redshirt freshman be a three-year starter eventually? I think eventually they would. He doesn't want to close a door on that. He was real careful when I talked to him about that the last time because I look at his quarterback room and I can tell you, it's not just Dylan Gabriel. You've got Dante Moore who was highly recruited out of high school,

went to UCLA, and you got Austin Novasad, and they continue to kind of chase high school quarter, the best high school quarterbacks that they can sign. But I think there is a little bit of a pushback from the high school guys who are looking at Oregon and going, hey, wait a minute, do I want to go there? Or can I get there by going to somewhere else first? I want to play right away. And so it'll be interesting to see, like, you know, I asked Dan Lannning about the room, and I said, okay, how do you keep those guys happy? And he said, you have to really sell the idea that they see the long play. Austin Novosad in the spring game

was the best passer of the three quarterbacks. Mike Riley, the former Oregon State coach, snuck over to the Oregon Spring game. He watched it. I said, what did you think of the QBs? He said, I kind of think Novosad's the best pure thrower. And so, you know, I could see spots. Was he a high school recruit?

Yeah. Like, did they get him out of high school? Yeah. And so, you know, they've got him in there. But I could see spots. Like, if they're trying to keep Dante, Moore or Austin Nova Sad kind of feeling like they're part of it. I could see like they're going to get some playing time in the early part of the season, particularly because look at this. I mean, there's the

potential that you're going to play 16 or 17 games if you get to the national championship. And you need to have depth. And you don't want to have Dylan Gabriel out there, you know, in a game you're leading against, you know, your big sky opponent or Boise State or Oregon State for the whole game. And so I think it'll be really interesting to see how they manage that room in the early part of the season. And then, you know, you're going to be really interesting. games that kind of get away. Do they leave Gabriel in there to kind of pile up numbers the way LSU did with, you know, Jaden Daniels? Or, you know, do they, do they kind of pull the reins back a little? I know, I think Bo Nix came out at halftime last year of their game against Portland State,

and I kind of expect that's what they'll continue to do. You've been around these programs for a long time. Obviously, the change of when you lost out on a huge recruit to USC or to Texas or to whatever, he was gone. I mean, I don't fall high school recruiting that closely. But I remember Dante Moore, I mean, that was a big deal. They wanted him. Goes to UCLA, plays up and down, Chipleys, boom, he's right to Oregon. So you could argue now when you lose out on a big recruit, you keep that relationship because that thing can change and it can change fast. Yeah. And the kids are aware of it. And you can kind of see the way that, you know, when they choose a school now, it's almost like, you know, you don't.

You don't close that door ever. You don't blow the bridge up behind you. Deegan Rose is, you know, a highly recruited quarterback came out of Central California. He's playing at Clovis High School this season. He had offers from Auburn, Oregon, Utah, you know, all these schools wanted him. He's committed to Oregon State. He wants to play. And he knows he can go to Oregon State and he can play right away.

Now, Oregon State's job is to try to retain that kid. And everybody else's job is to see what he turned the kid. into in a year or two and see if they can try to get him in the portal. And that's the game, the name of the game. And Jonathan Smith, who's at Michigan State now, he's got Aidan Childs. I asked him, I said, kind of do your earlier point, is this just going to be how it is? And he said, yes. He said, you're going to see the major programs that are going to kind of look around and try to cherry pick lower college football, the mid-majors, the group of five schools. You know, you're going to see a lot of activity in the portal. And then you're going to see other

schools that are going to go out. Like, you know, Washington State did something interesting. interesting, you know, 23 of the 25 signies in December were high school seniors. It was strange because everybody else is going in the portal. And Jake Dickert said, hey, I can get them now. And I can get them and I can try to sell them on the idea that this is where they need to be. You know, and if I recruit out of the portal, I'm never going to see those kids. I'm never going to get them. At least I get a year or two with them to try to convince them.

This is the right place. And he got a kid from your old neighborhood out of the Sacramento area, way Sean Parker is a true freshman running back who is going to be a star. And he was electric in the spring game. He may start for Washington State. But now the job is, can you keep that kid? Yeah, see, to me, what gets tough, and I was a GA at Fresno State. I mean, how do these programs, that guy, what Cal did with their running back,

they got pretty lucky, right? They obviously paid him, but he was pretty loyal to them. I would imagine everyone was calling him. And so this running back that goes to Washington State, let's say he has a huge. huge year. Well, who do things on the phone with them? Washington, Oregon, hell, Texas, who knows, the whole country is fault? It's like you have these scouting departments. I don't know if you saw the story. DeBore's guy that he took his GM is making $825,000. So, because he, and he probably has 15, 20 people working for him. So it becomes very, very challenging, which is, I'm a huge

Jonathan Smith guy. I mean, I just think he's, I was a Pat Hill guy. He reminds me of that old school. slam the ball. He's a throwback for being a younger guy. Clearly he freaked out, which I don't blame him, the move and he goes to Michigan State, who paid him a lot of money, but he had coached at Washington under Peterson. He's a Pasadena

guy. UCLA, Washington's, do you think he said, oh my God? I mean, it was hard to turn down whatever he got $80 million, but do you think he regrets that? 100%. He's not going to say it. But, you know, I talked to him at Big Ten Media Day, and I talked to him

after, you know, before and after he left. And it was interesting, two or three days before he announced that he was going to Michigan State, I asked him, are you in contact with other schools? Is your agent in contact with other schools? He was on my radio show. And he did something that no coach would, has ever done. He said, my agent better be on the phone talking to other schools. That's what I'm paying him for.

And he said, I'm not trying to be like, you know, tried about this. He goes, but that's the guy's job to get out and see what opportunities there are for. for me. But I think he got scared and he took that kind of any port in a storm mentality and he chose the Michigan State job because it was safe and secure. I think if he doesn't go to Michigan State, probably Michigan State goes after Jake Dickard at Washington State. So, you know, I think, you know, those two schools were left in a lurch, so to speak. But if Smith waits, he either gets Washington or UCLA. And he was a Pasadena kid who, you know, grew up going to USC games. Those two jobs were better jobs than the job he took.

because he's in the Big Ten, much like at Oregon State. It's not going to be Ohio State or Michigan. He's got Oregon and USC and Washington to deal with now. You know, what's a good season at Michigan State anymore? Like his best season is it, you know, being third or fourth in that conference. So I do think he probably regrets it. He'll never say it. Do you think it's safe to say that Washington is just a better job in this current landscape than UCLA?

Yes, a better football job for sure. Yeah. You know, even look back. when was UCLA's last success? And like you, look, I worked at the Fresno B many moons ago, okay? So I was covering those Pad Hill teams. Those Fresno State kids wanted to play UCLA. They had a chip on their shoulder because they said, you didn't recruit me. I was good enough. You didn't even drive to my house to see me. And, you know, they play them in a Freedom Bowl or, you know, or a conference game, that Reggie Bush game where Fresno State could throw haymakers.

And so, you know, there was a chip on your shoulder mentality there. But look at UCLA football. historically. When have they ever really, in the last 20 years, had success? They're a basketball school going into the Big Ten conference. They're going to get their teeth kicked in. That could be a three or four win season for Deshaun Foster. But I'm looking at Washington and I'm going, look, even in a rebuild, even with the bore leaving, you know, they're going to have a nice start to their season. I think in about week five or six, it'll turn on them because their schedule gets tough. But, you know, I'm not going to be surprised if Washington wins seven in a transition year. And UCLA also in a transition year, I think, is looking at three or four. I think they needed

a guy like Jonathan Smith to kind of, who knows how to kind of overcome. And, you know, Oregon State hadn't had real success, except for Dennis Erickson one season and Mike Riley had a little run where there was an uptick. Jonathan Smith kind of brought some stability there and was doing things that nobody really before him had consistently done. You know, it's funny is when I was at Fresno State, we played Rick Newheisle's UCLA team, and Pat Hill on the Sunday of that week hit the way he opened the meeting. He said, raise your hand if you had a scholarship offer from the school. Ryan Matthews was the only guy that raises, and then we beat him. And, you know, I think Washington State, Oregon State, Fresno State, Boise State always had that mentality,

and it served them for a lot of success. And they've had a chip on their shoulder. Washington, you know, I'm from Davis. So that Balati, Chris Peterson, that group, my dad always took a lot of pride in. He was a UC Davis guy. I was texting with a scouting buddy who was at Washington within the last week and a half. And he said, Steve Belichick, the practice I was at, Bill was right by his side the entire practice. And Brennan Carroll, Pete was right by aside the entire practice. So major transition year, I think I read, was it three or four guys from the two deep returning?

but they do have some star power in name, even if it's the kids, the dads aren't working. And if you ask me, do you think Bill Belichick is advancing every opponent for them? I would say, I would bet he does. So they do have an advantage of those two guys being around. Yeah, I mean, they've got some master chess players in the room. And you can talk all you want about, hey, who has extra assistance and who has extra analysts. But if you give me Pete Carroll and Bill Belichick in the room, you're going to figure

some stuff out and you're going to you're going to do some things that others aren't thinking about and it's just what jed fish needs right i mean he's an offensive guy he's an offensive mind their offense at arizona was dynamic because of jed fish i just love that he's kind of leaning into his weakness and then he's selling like with no shame the idea that we've got NFL experience you know come here and you can be part of an NFL program and by the way these guys are at practice and so i don't blame him for doing that. And I think they're going to have a real nice start to their year. Week three is dicey. They have to play that Apple Cup game against a very ticked off chip on your shoulder, Washington State team that's got a lot of returners. So that one's going to be a little dicey. But beyond that,

I could see them being like five and one to start the year and having maybe be ranked at the bottom of the top 25. But you look at their back into their schedule, it's brutal. And it finishes with Oregon. But the back end of their schedule has them at Penn State. There's Oregon in there. I think it's going to unravel for them down the stretch, but I think Jed will be able to sit, you know, stand tall and go, hey, we won seven or we won eight, and we feel good about year one. And that's a, that's not a bad place to be after your first year. Do you think as this, obviously the Civil War now is going to be moved up, it was clearly a huge rivalry if you went to Oregon or you went to Washington played there, you live in that area, do you think nationally this rivalry is going to

get put on steroids over the next decade, given that it's going to be at the end of the year now, and has a chance to really, really grow and be something cool on a bigger picture scale. Yeah, and I think, you know, the Oregon fans would always say, you know, that Oregon State's their rival in state. But it was the Washington game that had a little extra for them because for a while their Oregon State wasn't competitive. And I think this year's game with Oregon State's not going to be competitive. Everyone's pointing to end of the year. And Fox is going to blow that thing up. I mean, that is going to be, yeah, they're going to do everything that the Pac-12 should have done.

done to make that game bigger than ever. And they'll understand the market. They're invested in it. They'll understand how to market and how to brand that game and how to make it feel and look bigger than ever. But I know, you know, Oregon fans are, I think, interested and excited to try to finally win that game. I mean, Lannning has not won that game.

And I think Washington's going, hey, if we can go and go to Otson Stadium and win that game, will Dan Lannning ever beat us? Like, you know, I think there's just a lot of intrigue at the end of the season. And by the way, with the expanded playoff, that could be a pretty pivotal game from seating standpoint or, you know, does Oregon already have a loss? You know, I think the expanded playoff, because it's lowered the bar for how, you know, how many losses you can have, it is going to create all this interesting kind of down-the-stretch appeal with jockeying for position, jockeying for seating, who are in those top four seats that don't have to play, that first. playoff game on a campus or do you want to play that first playoff game on your campus because you know it's bigger um i just think it's going to be really fun okay let's end on this uh when the news was announced they gave 120 million dollars and they stole lincoln riley away it was like geez

USC is back and then you watch them last year you're like can lincoln build a defense can he build a tough team he inherited a pretty good thing from bob stoop's in oklahoma i'm not sure they're going to be very good. Relative to the expectation. Just your thoughts being around these programs, obviously Oregon's rolling now the way that they're discussed when it comes to the USC because it feels, I don't want to say irrelevant, but nowhere near where they thought they would be three years into Lincoln Riley getting $120 million and getting them back to, I would say national prominence.

That was the mindset giving the guy all that money, right? Yeah, when his AD introduced him, he said, we're going to change the landscape of college football. with this hire. And, you know, the song girls were there and the band was there. And Mario Chris Ball told me at the time, and he said, not so fast. He goes, you know, he hasn't, USC hasn't been able to recruit the big guys. Remember, Oregon was recruiting the biggest, baddest players out of the L.A. market. Oregon was going to the Coliseum and beating USC with, you know, Southern California kids. And so it was, you know, can Lincoln Riley get those guys? And then, oh, by the way, Caleb Williams comes in, dynamic player, probably the MVP.

at college football in the last two seasons. Really, if you look at everything he did, like, you know, how many deficiencies at USC did he cover up by just running around and, you know, playing Tecmo Bowl back there? I mean, it was phenomenal to watch him play. But now he doesn't have him. And so I'm kind of, I'm in an interesting position with this because I talked to Lincoln Riley in Indianapolis Big Ten Media Day.

He seemed a little humbled. And that worried me because I thought, you know, we don't need him humbled. We need, you know, the rest of this conference needed Lincoln Riley walking around thinking like he was the best thing ever. But suddenly, you know, he was getting beat up a little bit by the questioning. People were saying, are you an upper tier team? You know, these were questions USC doesn't get. And so, you know, they didn't pay him $120 million to go in there and win seven or eight games.

So there's a lot of pressure on him. And I'll be really interested to see the new defensive coordinator. Can anybody put a defense together with the way that offense plays? It's a little Mike Leach-like, can you, you know, or Chip Kelly like even, too, because they put a lot of pressure into your. defensive coordinator when you play the way they play on offense. But here's the thing. Like, there's something about this season, John, where I'm a little looking at USC going, could they be a little bit of a surprise? Like now that we're not expecting anything, you know what

I mean? Like the trend is usually your friend, but every once in a while, it'll bite you. So I kind of look at this and I go, is this the year the USC is sneaky good all of a sudden when we don't, nobody's expecting them. I don't know. They still have some talent. I think Lincoln Riley can coach offense like crazy, he's just about as good as anybody. If they find anything on defense, could they be a little more balanced and therefore could they be better? I don't know.

Will they sneak up on anybody? You know, I always had the theory in college football pre-transfer portal that you know, the head coach, if he's from that overall region, it's much easier when you look at the West Coast. Jeff Tedford, Cal, West Coast guy, Pete Carroll, L.A. guy, USC,

Chris Peterson, UC Davis, Boise, you know, Oregon, Baladi, West Coast. guy. Maybe now with transfer portal, it doesn't matter as much. I mean, Dan Landing's a good example. I do think the Lincoln fit, though, small town Texas guy, Oklahoma is a little weird in L.A. I'm sorry, it just is. I saw, you know, not to be stalkerish, but I saw like a picture of his house. And, you know, Lincoln Riley buys a house was the headline. And here's the photos of the, and I was looking at all the bedrooms and the backyard had a pool. And I was like, this is not

kind of what he came up in and it's not at all him and you bring up mike leach like you know he was a fit at you know texas tech and he was a fit at washington state and was a fit at mississippi state like mike leach at oregon you know wouldn't it wouldn't work and so i do kind of wonder if that is a little bit of the problem the identity of the school doesn't fit the identity of the coach landings another example though too he's a kansas city guy rural kansas city guy he's a went to William Jewell College. He doesn't have an alma mater calling him home. He, uh, you know, I think a lot of people believe he'll stay at Oregon unless it's the NFL, like if the Kansas City chiefs call him 10 years from now, and maybe he goes. Like, but, you know, landing grew up on like five

acres and, and is kind of a country kid. And now he's at Oregon, but there's enough of the woods in Eugene and kind of like it's, you know, still beautiful country. Like he's not completely, you know, out of his element there. And so I think it works to a certain extent. Jonathan Smith pointed out, like, when I was telling him, hey, Michigan State, like, he goes, it's really just Oregon State in the Big Ten. He goes, it's a lot like Oregon State, the fan base, you know?

And I was like, you would have looked so much better at UCLA. But, you know, who knows, man? But I think it's a good point on Lincoln Riley. Like, maybe the act just doesn't fit the stage. Yeah, I mean, I got that thing just red flagged, especially if it gets weird this year. So I'll end on this, actually. What's the successful season for Oregon?

Do they have to win the national championship? Can they make the final four if they are in the Big Ten championship game against Ohio State? How would you view it to be like, you know what? That was his third year. That went well. Yeah, I think, look, he won 10 games in year one. He went to a bowl game. I think he won 12 last year with the postseason and the championship game involved.

But the expectation right now is that they're a top three, top. four team. So, you know, even though making the playoff would be nice, I think he's got to get to the semifinal and show that, like, there's a shot in another year or two that they could win a national championship. Phil Knight put a billion dollars into the University of Oregon. He and his wife have donated a billion dollars in, you know, tutoring center and a library and a law school in the Otson Stadium and the football offices. And you don't put a billion dollars into something to, you know, see your team just make the playoff or, you know, playing a holiday bowl or whatnot. So I think the disappointment would set in if they're not playing in that semi-final weekend.

They've got to play in that semifinal weekend. If they get to the title game, great. If they win the national championship, Phil Knight will have everything that, you know, he's invested in. He's never going to say it. But I think Oregon really wants to get him a national title. So I'll say this. If they don't get to the final four, it's a disappointment. Tell everyone where they can find you.

John Kanzano.com, if you want to read me, get a free subscription or a paid subscription. That's what I tell people. And you can find me on the radio or a podcast of the radio show. Just Google me. I love to hear from people. John, you're the man. And exciting times in the Pacific Northwest because I can't, I think, like most people,

can't wait to watch this Oregon team play. Well, I'm a big fan of your work over the year. So I appreciate you having me on. I was excited to do this one. Thanks, John. Talk to you soon. Okay, John Casano is the man. Now to the lead anchor for the SEC Dari Noca.

Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth.

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And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of Tontons and Wampas on the Ice Planet Hot. or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs?

Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jett. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s.

To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack, so I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now, so. Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really?

Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing.

And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross. Because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro.

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Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Okay, very, very excited to have the lead dog over at the SEC Network, which is a channel that I watch a lot. I've watched more SEC baseball than I have Major League Baseball over the last couple years. You turn it on, there's 25,000 people at these games. Dari Noca, who's Oklahoma Sooners are joining the big boys and coming to the SEC.

So how's everything going, Dari? It's great, man. It's great. Hey, listen, you're right about SEC baseball, too. It's, I fell out of love years ago with Major League Baseball at just too many games. And frankly, SEC Baseball is so doggone exciting. It feels like there's something on the line all the time. So I'm glad you're watching, man. I'm glad you're watching. But yeah, everything's good.

It's funny. I actually literally, we just taped an interview with Brent Venables. And it was the first one we've had with him on SEC now, and it'll be on a little bit later. But look, he's fired up. I'm fired up. We just, you know, finally, we're less than two weeks out. It feels like it's been a long time coming.

But we say that every August, you know. Well, obviously it just means more. And, you know, from Texas, east, college football has always been a really big deal. And listen, I'm a West Coast guy. So I remember when those rumors about Texas and Oklahoma joining the PAC 12, which obviously did not happen,

the Pac-12 doesn't exist. But being at SEC Media Days, now that Venables is really kind of settled into his job, obviously Sark last year, does it feel even bigger? The 12th team playoff has changed college football, but it feels like this conference is in the peak of its powers, does it not?

Yeah, and I think, like where we're going to see it and maybe feel it the most is every single Saturday, especially when you get into conference play, because with those two teams, we just have one more big game. You know, Mississippi State, Texas is a big game that we didn't have before. You know, I'm using anybody. And anybody against anybody in this league, it feels like we've got one more, you know, big game. So, you know, it's not just the Red River game in October. That's going to be huge, obviously, and it's awesome that, you know, that's, that's an SEC game now. But it's just, it adds to the depth, right? We're in a sport where depth is important.

Depth in the conference is important. And we're going four, five, six, seven deep in, in regular season games that, that you don't want to miss. So I think every single Saturday, we're going to feel it. Every single Friday night when we do our SEC Now show, we're going to feel it because we got one more big game to preview. We got one more big game to talk about. So, um, Saturdays are going to be pretty amazing around here. You know, before we dive into some specific questions about, obviously, the high end of the conference, I kind of have a theory with the SEC. Obviously, football has always been a really big deal in that region, but Nick Sabin, to me,

made the conference cool nationally, and obviously the finances and the success. Listen, I'm from the Sacramento area, and I can't tell you how many parents of family friends I know that have sent their kids to Ole Miss, Alabama, Tennessee, Florida. I mean, these kids historically would have gone to San Diego State or Arizona State are now going to the south. Obviously, financially, I'm a big golf guy. I'm sure you guys have talked about that Alabama golf facility. The other programs, the money they're paying college basketball coaches separate from just Kentucky, right? And so Sabin, the money that he's brought in, but the coolness factor of making it like NFL light is kind of,

not really debatable at this point, is it? No, no. And it's not, it's just like, I think that it's a league that, yet there's a coolness factor for sure. I mean, anybody that ever wanted to complain about the amount of money that Alabama paid, paid him, John, over the years is out of their mind because what he's brought the University of Alabama and the state in itself is a hundredfold what they've paid him. But it isn't, it, it's a league that's full of really kind of fun, cool character. and it's not just football.

You know, you talk about that influx from the West Coast here. Look at softball. Look at baseball rosters in the SEC, especially softball. I mean, the PAC used to be the kings or the queens of college softball, and now not only is the PAC gone, but that hasn't been applicable for a decade or more. It's here now. And you look at rosters and you see all of these great players

from the state of California and Arizona and so on and so. forth that have made their way here. One of my best friends, Caleb Roe is an assistant at Alabama. She was an analyst with us on the SEC Network for a number of years after she was a three-time All-American at Bama. She's from Eugene Oregon. The Shipman sisters, Maddie and Allie both ended up one at Tennessee and then one at Tennessee and then Alabama. They're Southern Californians. Like, it's a cool place to come play sports. It is because the coaches are great. The characters in this league are great. The weather doesn't suck. Not that it does on the West Coast either. I understand that. But there's a level of importance and and and I mean,

they put so much into this. Like the resources are just, it seems infinite, even in sports like baseball and softball, why wouldn't you come? And then, oh, by the way, if I can like toot our own horn just a wee little bit, like you can leave mom and dad in Orange County. They'll still see every damn one of your games because of ESPN, the SEC Net, Net, SEC Network Plus or ESPN Plus. They're not going to miss you. They won't be here in person all the time, but you're going to get to see mom and dad

are going to get to see you play, whatever sport it is, nine times out of every 10 games you play, because they can find it. So there's a lot of reasons I think people are coming this way. Well, obviously, you know, the elephant in the room in this conference, the Sabin retires.

Dubour, his resume speaks for itself. I mean, the guy's like less than 15 career losses. but he's not from the South. I've known Jim McElwain for a long time. He was a non-southern guy. Went to Florida. It was winning and got run out of town. You never want to be the guy following the legend, they say,

but DuBorgis wins everywhere he goes. You've talked to him. Obviously, followed that program closely at the SEC Network. I saw a picture of the two offices, Sabin's office. He completely remodeled it. Did you see that? Doors new office. It's, you know, Saban had this kind of regal, old school, just like mob-looking office.

Du Boers is like modern. It just looks completely different. And it's just clearly a different vibe. He's a different person. Yeah. But he can coach. So that's at the end of the day what matters most down there, right? Can you win?

Yeah. Oh, yeah. And if he wins, it'll be fine. I don't, yeah, I don't necessarily. I think, you know, we thought the fit was weird. Look, Dan Mullen had Mississippi State number one in the country at one point. and the dudes from New Hampshire. But he had coached at Florida for a while.

That's true. No, he did. He did. I don't think anybody in Baton Rouge is running Brian Kelly out because he's a northeasterner, you know, from Massachusetts or whatever. Like I understand to some degree the idea of fit, but Nick Sabins, West Virginia, by way of Kent State, Ohio and so on and so forth. And so he wasn't necessarily from this neck of the woods. I get why people would say that, but ultimately if you win, you win.

I don't think that'll be an issue. And look, DeBoer, I think, became a fan. Alabamans became a fan of Kalin DeBoer the second Jalen Milrose stayed. The second he kind of slammed the brakes on the departures. He got a whole bunch of people to decide to stay. And when you look, like you said, 12 losses in 10 years. It's just, I don't care where you are. You're still beating your own peers at whatever level you are.

No, the record does accomplishment speak for itself? He'll be just fine. As long as he wins, and I don't have any reason to think he won't. I mean, I don't know about you. Were you surprised at all that Alabama's sitting in the top five in the AP poll, that they were, what, third in the preseason SEC standing? Like, expectations haven't really diminished at all. And they shouldn't.

I mean, they're just hiring a guy that, you know, beat Texas in the final four game has beat Dan Lannning three straight times. I think the question from a football standpoint is at Fresno State is last year he had Jake Hainer, who's an NFL guy, throws the ball. You go obviously Pennix, prototypical pocket passer. Jalen's not really that. So the question is how he's run his offense. Ryan Grubb, who was a huge part, obviously gets stolen away from Seattle.

Now he had a guy that was also with him that kind of took that spot, I think. But that to me is the question mark, at least on this specific season, I think big picture he'll be fine. Are there some question marks with him and Jalen Milrow from a just, just an on-the-field standpoint? I don't think so. I think, I mean, it's crazy. When Milro came out of high school, he was considered a quote-unquote pocket passer. If you look at the ratings, it's P-P.

I didn't, which surprised me a little bit when I looked at that. Obviously, what he does with his legs is what makes him Jalen Milro. But I do think Milro can be a very good passer. He's a very accurate long-ball passer. You know, the question is going to be a lack of experience in some ways at receiver with Isaiah Bond, obviously, at Texas. But there is talent galore in that receiver room. Offensive line, I don't necessarily get overly concerned about.

I think Alabama's going. I think defensively, they're probably going to be a little bit ahead of the offense in the early part of the season. But I think they can win games with Jailen Milrow. And I think they win games because of Jailen Milro. And, you know, Jalen had the opportunity to leave. Jalen could have very well gone somewhere. else. But he met Kalin. He liked Kalin. He had made the determination. Like I've told my

my mom, I'm going to get a degree from Alabama. Obviously, that fluctuated a little bit with Saban's retiring. But the second he met Kalin DeBoer, he said, I'm going to give this guy a chance. And they're really, really tight now. And no, I think he'll thrive in his system. You know, with Sabin gone, with Davo hitting a little bit of a lull, it's clear Kirby's kind of the king of college football. And it was crazy. I was looking, Carson Beck, in this modern day football, you know, sat behind sets and Bennett for a couple of years.

Guys, it doesn't really happen as much anymore. And a lot of people think he can be the number one quarterback. Georgia, it's weird. Obviously, they were either two national title teams, the NFL players speak for themselves, but the schedule sometimes wasn't great. This year, open with Clemson, at Bama, at Texas, at Ole Miss. I mean, there's a decent chance they're damn good and still could lose a couple games, right? I think so.

What's your thoughts on the program and their vibes headed in as the preseason number one? Yeah, I mean, I totally get them being number one. You know, and that goes into what, obviously, when you have a quarterback that could be the number one pick in the draft, and he looks the part of a, of an NFL, of a really successful NFL quarterback, and he's got the demeanor of a successful NFL quarterback, and he proved himself a year ago. I have no doubt that they're capable of winning a national championship again. but it's not going to be easy. Like if Georgia runs the table,

that's the best season in the history of college football. Oh my God. I mean, you know, they got to go to Ole Miss. I think they're going to see Ole Miss twice. Like, I got Ole Miss in Atlanta this year. I mean, could you imagine, like, if Georgia has to play them twice and Texas on the road and Alabama on the road, it's almost unfair.

But they're really, really good. And again, 12th team playoff. If they go 10 and 2, do you keep them out? I don't think anybody would keep them out. And once they're in, look out, right? I mean, they could get in as a 10 seed that lost two games and, you know, and run the table. So, yeah, I would expect, I don't think they run the table this year. I think they'd lose a game or two, but I still think in the end, they're one of the last two standing.

You guys talk about this a lot. I mean, over under between the Big Ten and the SEC to me is like eight teams, but specifically on the SEC, do you, if you had to preseason get out. You're going four? Do you think five is inconceivable? It seems four is more likely than three, right? I feel four is the right number to guess at this point. I mean, it's hard, boy, five. One, I think the committee would have a hell of a hard time putting five in because I don't think they want to hear it from everybody else. That seems, you know, tough. But I think four is a good number. It also depends. Like, does the Big 12 just eat each other alive? Like a lot of people think they would, right? I mean, how many big 12 teams with three losses could you put in? Well, to me,

the Big 12 preseason is getting one. I have them chucked for one. Okay. So then you got ACC. What are you looking at there? Best case, two. Two. So now you've got nine spots open. You give a group of five, one. Now you've got eight spots between those two leagues. I'd have a hard time not thinking it would be four and four. But if that's the case, like if there are eight spots between those two leagues, then five becomes very conceivable. I don't think they want it, but it becomes conceivable. Yeah.

The four right now, obviously Georgia, everyone would put in Ole Miss, very sexy team to put in, Bama, LSU, kind of that group, Tennessee, potential, Missouri. Texas? If you're picking your four, oh, yeah, Texas, yeah, I would say Georgia and Texas, most people would put in, then it's kind of the group of that three or four teams, right? kind of like Georgia, Texas, Ole Miss, Missouri. Missouri's got this incredibly manageable schedule,

but one that they'll be highly punished if they lose more than two ball games. Because it's a schedule that they should absolutely be able to make their way through with 10 or 11 wins. So I think Georgia, Texas, Ole Miss, and Missouri would be the, if I had to pick four now, those would be the four.

Alabama on that cost, LSU, I don't know how much I buy them yet. I'd like to see them play defense first. And I think Blake Baker, was a great hire, and we know they've got personnel over there. Tennessee, let's see. I kind of think they get popped in Norman in their first conference game, and we'll see.

We'll see. I know people love Nico. I'd like to see a little bit more Nico before I start anointing them a playoff team. Won't BK take a little shit if he's not in this 12? I mean, this is what? Going into year three, they're paying him $95 million. They hired him, and he said to win national championships. He can't make a 12-team playoff at LSU.

how big is that game in Vegas on that Sunday night? I don't think it's that big because I think they're going to kill them. Okay. All right. They should. They better kill them. Or kill them. I mean,

win it by 15, 20 points. You know, shoving around. I don't care if they win it by one. Yeah. I think they win. There stings in a big,

big way. I think a win there, I mean, neither team has shown us that they're going to play defense. I like LSU's personnel better. But you got two unproven quarterbacks, you know, and Miller Moss on one side and Noss on the other who's been waiting his turn like Carson Beck did. A lot of people in this league like Garrett Nussmeyer a lot. I think they're mirror images of one another with maybe a little bit more depth on the LSU side.

But I think it could go either way. I mean, I'd like to think like you do that LSU kind of goes in and wins by two, three touchdowns. but I don't know. If they can't stop anybody and they've got this scoring pressure with Garrett Nussmeyer having to produce on every drive, I don't know if I'm ready to say that yet. Well, I was texting with a scouting buddy today.

He likes Nuss. I mean, he's been at practice. I think there's a lot of positive vibes. I mean, Lincoln begged out of that game, and Brian said no, which I think is, I mean, is that a substantiated story? Sounds about right. That sounds about it.

In Lane, I was texting, when I was texting the scouting buddy about the SEC knowing you were coming on, I said most talented team in the SEC or beside Georgia and Texas and he said Ole Miss is right up there Jackson Dart a lot of people like him obviously the Transfer Portal King

pretty sure the stat right first time in Ole Miss history back to back double digit win seasons late beat Brian Kelly last year and I thought one of the more entertaining games of the year it almost feels like is there too much hype behind the squad you like me like most people like Ole Miss playoffs

I love them I love them I love them I love them in the playoff I love them getting to Atlanta for the very first time. I love them. I love both sides. Could they win the SEC? I think they could. I absolutely think they could. Let's see. When Georgia plays them in the regular season, that's going to tell us everything we need to know, I think.

I think Ole Misses. I love, like, I love Darts' demeanor, his relationship with Lane. Trey Harris is a stud on the outside. I know it hurts losing a stud tailback to Columbus, but I think Bentley is more than capable of being the lead guy there on that side. I like the offensive line. Defensively, you talked about the portal and the additions that he's made all over the defensive front, and that front seven, I think they're really, really, really good.

And this isn't like, you know, they're more talented than Missouri. They've got a tougher schedule than Missouri. I put them both in the playoff. The difference is Ole Miss, to me, has been tested. and Lane has been tested for years now and understand what it's like to go week in and week out and have a level of success in this league. Drink hasn't yet. Last year, they kind of came out of nowhere. So for that reason, I like Ole Miss a little bit more if I'm kind of comparing two schools with high expectations that they've never really had before.

But it's also why I think Old Miss is a conference and frankly national championship contender because Lane understands that grind. Lane has been there. He's lived it. he gets it. I think Dart has lived it and gets it. And it's a team that isn't backing down from anybody. They're not. Nobody's going to walk in there just because, you know,

you have that G on your helmet. They don't care less. If you got a number on your helmet, they don't really care. Like, they know they're good. And I feel like Ole Miss is that team. I wouldn't be shocked at the end of the year if they're raising a trophy. You know, me and Coward were talking about it.

He's kind of established himself as a top five coach, and he has a lot of success to me. he wins 10 plus games and they're in the playoffs. It won't even be, you can't even argue it. And then the question starts, weirdness already going on in Florida. There's just, you know, who knows how that thing plays out, the Arkansas situation.

Clearly, they got a lot of money. Do they get to a position or now all these schools have so much money that if he feels comfortable there, he can stay? Or it's just going to be, start being a conversation. Because it feels like schools, not scared off, but, you know, clearly not been super aggressive based on his resume. Does that change? if he just hammers an 11-win season, he's in the playoffs,

and it's just he's going to offend people, Ole Miss got to fend people off to keep him? I think they're always going to have to. I mean, I think they're always going to have to, right? I mean, his track record says, he's kind of always kind of looking maybe for that next thing. I hope not, man. Like I, you know, I know.

It's fun at Ole Miss. What's that? It's fun at Ole Miss. It's fun, man. He's got everything he could ever want there. He's got, clearly they've got resources. They clearly are better positioned in. NIL than maybe people assumed that they were.

I don't know the numbers. I don't know where they rank in the SEC, but they've got more than enough to get the job done clearly, right? That's a special place. Like, it really is that that has never experienced what they could potentially experience now. I hope he never goes anywhere. Like, I hope he never goes anywhere.

It's hard to really know, like, the level of interest of other places. When Auburn was looking, right, they ended up with freeze. and there was all this talk about Lane this and Lane that. I don't know. Like I talked to a lot of like people in that Auburn program and decision makers. I mean, they were never really as interested in Lane as the, as we were made to believe. So, you know, are people scared about a lack of loyalty? Are people just kind of being told, look, I'm not going anywhere.

I don't know what the answer is. But I'd love to see Lane stay there for 10 years and get them to six more, six playoff births and make them nationally relevant every year. because he's a lot of fun in that place. He'd be fun anywhere, but that's a pretty cool place to have Lane Kiffin, I think. I would agree. Okay, I get you out of here on this. Texas and Oklahoma. We'll start with Texas.

You know, obviously with the money they have support in that program and Sark, they've been recruited. I mean, their roster is loaded. But they come into this conference kind of with a bullseye on their back of like, okay, let's see, guys. And they're going to get everyone. It's like almost, I mean, obviously they were right there to win a national championship last year right until the end in the final four.

how do you think that's going to go? Because there's a ton of hype, the roster's loaded, but they are going to get, even the random teams they play on their schedule in the SEC's best shot, and the atmosphere's on the road for them is going to be bananas, right? Well, I think they probably should be a playoff team.

I'm real careful to have some national championship expectations for them. They are really talented, but man, oh man, John, like this grind in this league, they've never seen it. Same with OU. they've just never, ever experienced what they're going to get week in and week out.

And, yeah, the game in Ann Arbor in week two, Michigan might have the best defense in America. So, like, that's not going to be a walk in a park. Are they going to have a loss on their schedule before they get into conference play? They certainly could. But it's just a grind. Like, I need to see Texas navigate it before I anoint them too much. I need to see OU navigate this first, you know? and that's the, that's the, you know, look, you remember when Utah was in the Mountain West and they made a transition to the Pact 12, and we know where Utah left the Pact 12.

They were obviously the most consistent program over probably the last three or four seasons, but it took some time. Yeah. The Mountain West to the Pact 12 then, I'm not going to sit here and say that that's not what I see in the Big 12 to the SEC. I think it's a similar type move. and there's just some, I just think it's going to take a little bit of time to navigate it to the point where we say Sark is a, where Texas is going to be a national championship team this year. I'm just not ready to go there. But they have all the teams and they have all the resources and they have all the talent, and I get that.

It's just something else that it takes to be able to navigate this. I completely agree with you. And that's where I think on the flip side, Oklahoma kind of gets to fly in under the radar. Not everyone's anointing them. And they get to kind of come in with a little chip on their shoulder. You know, Oregon, so high right now on Dylan Gabriel, but didn't Oklahoma kind of tell him, we're going to go to Jackson Arnold. So I'll see you later, buddy.

Now, you know, anytime you get a first year quarterback, but I think Oklahoma, listen, you go eight and four, but you knock someone off around the way. Like, that's kind of what I expect, where everyone's gunning for Texas. Oklahoma kind of gets to cruise in, like, Mississippi State or something. They're really good. Like, they're really good. Oklahoma might have a top three group of receivers in the SEC. They've got a quarterback that nobody talks about because he's relatively unproven,

but he's got as much talent as anybody in this league that plays that position. And defensively, like, you know, this isn't Lincoln Riley, Alex Grinch defense. Brent has done a wonderful job through the portal and just in general high school recruiting, but mostly through the portal of building a unit that is going to be, I think, top half of this SEC. And you want chip on the shoulder. When was the last time OU was picked eighth in a conference?

I was in college there in the late 90s when they were God-awful with John Blake as a coach. Like, they have not had, yet 16th in the country. In the AP, it's pretty wild to see that. But they're really talented. Like, they'll beat a couple of teams. They're not supposed to beat.

I don't know if it'll be in Oxford early in the season. I don't know if it'll be in Dallas against Texas, but they certainly could. They've beaten Texas teams that are better than them on paper dozens of times. So, yeah, and they, oh, you, I think, is going to be better than people think, for sure. So on that quarterback, Carson Beck, obviously Jackson Dart, Jalen Millrow, a lot of hype.

We've seen Oklahoma, Rattler, a ton of hype, didn't live up to it. Caleb opposite, ton of hype, clear he was a star. Yeah. Kind of feel somewhat similar of a hype machine behind this young guy. You follow the program closely. I think you were there. I saw some on YouTube. at the program. What are your thoughts on the hype machine behind this young quarterback?

Well, I think one thing is he doesn't buy into the hype. That dude's really humble. Like he's really humble. He will work. He's in early out late. He has an incredible relationship with his receivers. Watch for a guy, Dionne Burks, Purdue transfer that's at Oklahoma now. That guy is, he could be an all, he could be a first team all SEC guy. He and Jackson have a really good relationship to this particular point. You know, the question is, can he get the protection he's going to need? And the offensive line is probably their biggest outstanding question right now. But that, that dude himself, that he has grown.

He's really, really smart. He works really, really hard. And he's as accurate as, you know, I've heard people compare him and his accuracy to San Bradford, who to me is the most accurate quarterback that ever went through that program. One of the most accurate I've ever seen. So I think he's got all the tools and all the makings, and he's in the right headspace. So I like him a lot. Yeah, I mean, I was thinking about going to a big time college football game this year,

and the easiest one, you know, and the SEC can be hard to get to coming from Scottsdale, but the Red River rivalry in Dallas. Yeah. I would imagine you'd recommend that game, wouldn't you? Anytime. I would recommend that 100. You know, in this league in the SEC, there's a little bit of arrogance. You know, like I'm...

Should be. It's earned. There's the Iron Bowl. there's the Egg Bowl and there's Georgia, Florida. And in many ways, people don't think there's anything else. There's going to be real awakening, I think, to people when they get a good up-close look at Oklahoma, Texas. I think it's awesome.

Yes, I would say, go to OU, Texas. You know what? You want to go experience something in Norman? I'm sure you probably have before. But the first conference game with Tennessee coming in and Josh Hyple, coming back to Norman, that's going to be special, man. Like that's one on the schedule. I'd put a little circle around, too.

Okay, Darry. I appreciate your time. exciting times, you know, in the SEC. So enjoy it and watch Oklahoma take down some people along the way. I would love to, John. Good talking to you, man. I appreciate you reaching out. Oh, no problem.

Have a good one. See you. Bye. The volume. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel.

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I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast. The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

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