The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 & Out - Rams and Patriots WIN, Harbaugh in a New York State of Mind

Episode Date: January 19, 2026

Former NFL scout John Middlekauff reacts following Sunday's  playoff games that saw the Rams overcome the freezing cold temps and beat the Bears in OT despite Caleb Williams TD pass in the final seconds of regulation to force Overtime. Later, John talks about the Patriots taking care of business against the Texans and focing CJ Stroud into throwing four INT's. Finally, John talks about the Giants hiring John Harbaugh and how his relationship will be with Joe Schoen. 03:52 - Bears-Rams Reaction  36:59 - Patriots-Texans Reaction 56:00 - John Harbaugh to the Giants Follow John on Twitter, Instagram and YouTube for the latest.  All lines provided by Hard Rock Bet Use promo code “3ANDOUT20” on https://nicokick.com/zone for 20% off at checkout! Check out Gametime - the fastest growing ticketing app in the US, and the official ticketing app of 3 & Out and GoLow -  for tickets to all of your favorite NFL, NBA, NHL, NCAA teams. Concert and comedy show tickets, too. Go to Gametime now to create an account, download the app and use code JOHN for $20 off your first purchase. #VolumeSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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What is going on, everybody, John Middlecock, Three and Out podcast? How are we doing? Hopefully everyone is doing well. We had a massive day. The Rams and the Patriots advance to the Final Four. They will take on obviously the Broncos who don't have a quarterback. well, they have George did them, but now they're starting quarterback, and the Seahawks next Sunday.

So that's exciting. I haven't talked about, so we'll talk about both games today. Big stories, situations, the Bears, the Patriots. I mean, these franchises were dead. Now they've been resurrected. CJ Stroud's performance, Sean McVeigh and the toughness that his team displayed. I do need to talk about John Harbaugh, who signed a massive contract with the New York Giants,

and the good and the bad with that situation. I also have been asked a couple questions. Does Netflix not allow me to do mailbags? That is not true. We will do mailbags. I just had a baby last week. So I didn't have time. I recorded a bunch of stuff earlier in the week.

It just wasn't a normal week. But mailbags are going to be a huge part, as they always have been, a thing here. So firing those DMs at John Middilkoff is the Instagram. We're going to bang out probably a bunch this week. As well as I have a long list to talk about it. the daddy diaries. So now that I'm officially a father, no big deal, takes from the hospital, takes from some early experience with my little guy. So we will do Daddy Diaries probably on Tuesday's show.

So I'll record it tomorrow. That's at least a plan. Maybe on Wednesday's show. We've got to pick a date here soon. But football season is kind of weird. But so obviously mailbag not going anywhere. So make sure you subscribe, three and out. If you listen on Collins' feed, Apple, Spotify, wherever. And obviously Netflix. We've been rocking a week of Netflix. We did a Saturday show. Again, two days after I had a baby. Not toot my own horn, but grinding over here with my people. And back again this week. So they're having me. We find it. Just type in the name, subscribe. And you'll, for alerts, you'll never miss an episode for the video standpoint. But let's talk some football. So let's start with the Bears and the Rams. Obviously, the Rams get a massive win. And I, big picture

thought before we talk anything specific with football, as someone that does this for a living, who since I graduated as an undergrad from Cal Poly, who's now being led by my guy Tim Skipper and is going to resurrect that program, and even at Cal Poly, I helped out with the football program. Through what I'm doing now, football has been a massive part of my life. I mean, I played in high school. I wasn't any good, but I've loved football since I was a little kid, since I was probably seven, eight years old. They say when you're eight years old, I read this in a study, I actually hit my buddy guy, read this in a study. He was on the podcast last week and told the story when we were on air one day.

And I was like, oh, that makes sense. Somewhere between like 8 to 10, but starting at 8, whoever your favorite team is, whoever your favorite player is, usually shapes you as a sports fan the rest of your life. Like usually the team that you rooted for as an 8-year-old as a team you take the rest of your life. And when I was 8, 9, 10, my favorite team was the 49ers. They had Steve Young, Jerry Rice, and they were playing the Cowboys and going to the Super Bowl and winning it.

So that just led me to my love of football. And then right there, Brett Farv comes, and I was hooked for life and still am. And I was just pacing up around this office watching the final stretch of that game and the regulation through overtime. And I think it's really, really cool when a brand that should matters that historically has mattered that's been down and out matters again. And I think the one thing about, and I've told, I said this to coward, I feel. like I watch more Bears football this season start to finish 15 or 16 games. And obviously the last several months, you didn't miss a snap.

And it is that the difference of the NFL and college is obviously the pageantry. But more specifically, like in college, a lot of the big teams, their stadiums are bigger. The, I don't know, theater around the game, right? The pregame, the tailgating, the experience. experience with the alumni is just pretty special. I always said when I worked in radio and it was around the Raiders, I thought it was really, really cool. And Al Davis was dead by then, but Mark was there, they were so good with their former players. I mean, their statement was, once a Raider, always a Raider. It had like a collegiate feel. And they were always welcome. And guys from the 70s, the 80s, they were

always around. And it was just, obviously the Raiders were bad, but the passionate fan base, they just wanted to win so bad. And obviously the Bears are a lot like this. They're one of our best and biggest cities in this I went there for the first time this year and obviously stayed in the burbs with coward. And it was like, this place is fucking beautiful. You know, in a different life, I could have lived there. I've always said this about Philly. The thing I love the most about Philadelphia in my time there, didn't love the cold. I love like the character of the people.

You know, I think their fans get a bad rap. I like that their people, I don't know, there was just like a defined individual. You know, and they get stereotyped. And there's a lot of truth to it. But I kind of resonated with those people. And I think a huge reason was the Eagles were the number one thing in their life besides their family, right, or their job. Like, the Eagles meant so much to that city.

And, like, football means a lot to me. And I talk about football because I love it. And obviously, I'm lucky a lot of people do, right? I remember when I first got into this business and I'm like, I want to work in, I'm a radio host, I want to talk about all sports. And I'm like, I got pigeonholed as a football guy. And someone told me early on, it's like, if you're going to get pigeonholed as anything, that's the best thing to get pigeonholed ass. And watching this Bears franchise not just be resurrected, but host these games in these frigid cold situations, right?

In these frigid cold conditions where there's no way you could feel your hands, your feet, you can barely breathe. Guys today were getting blasted. Like obviously New England hosted a game again today. They had been down and out for what, three, four years? I mean, for 20 years of my life, I'm 40 years old, I watched that stadium host games. They looked exactly like that, and the Patriot win. I have seen that game with Belichick and Brady more times than I can count on my hands and my toes.

But with the Bears, like, I haven't. And watching that city, watching that place rock. And I was someone that didn't think the Caleb Ben Johnson thing would work. It's still, to me, a little weird. Like, I don't think they're on the same page always. Like when they cook is when Caleb just bails them out. And I think Ben Johnson is a fantastic play caller. But so many times use the night.

One, I'll get into this in a second about going for it. But let's just say the play calls. I do think Sean Payton, but Ben Johnson even more, they are consumed with their way of doing things. Because the way that Ben did it for years in Detroit, in terms of his offense, made him a star. And then he comes here and he's clearly a good football coach. he's good with players.

He's clearly high-end, right? But, like, the way he wants to coach offense, Caleb's best skill, by far, is his playmaking ability. Honestly, he's the best playmaker right now in the NFL. I mean, that play he made to send it to overtime was, I mean, there's probably less than 10 guys in the history of the NFL that could make that play. But part of his thing is you kind of got to let him cook,

especially with his legs. Like, listen, I'm not saying you treat him like Lamar Jackson, but there were times a day when he ran, it's like he's way faster in these guys. Like, why not institute quarterback power? Why not get him on the move? Things that you could never even draw up for Jared Gossom might not be in the playbook. They should be instituted now.

And they go forward on these short-yarded situations. It's not working. It's like, let Caleb's strength excel here. McVeigh doesn't have that option with Stafford. He's 38, 39, can't move. He's basically, you know, Eli Manning or Philip Rivers right now. in terms of athletic ability. Doesn't exist.

He once was a decent athlete. Again, relative to NFL players, relative to us, high-end athlete. But relative to NFL players, like Mass Stafford is now immobile, right? Doesn't move, which is fine because he's MVP-level thrower. But Caleb is an elite movement guy.

I've actually underestimated when he was coming out of college how great of a foot athlete he is, how high-end speed is. But Ben Johnson, who is, there had to be a meeting of the mind, once upon a time years ago in the Detroit offensive meeting room where they got together, it's like gamblers do this, you know, investors, like people with investing strategies,

that this way is going to work and nothing else matters. Typically people, you know, in some sort of like math vocation, right, where this is what the numbers say and no matter what, this is always going to be the case. And you cannot talk, whoever led that meeting, it might have been Ben, it might have been Dan Campbell, but they both believed it and you could not talk them out of it. because I'm a big believer if I owned a team or I had any juice like the team president or whatever we would have a rule

if the game is zero zero and it is fourth and more than I don't even care what it is and you are in field goal range you kick the field goal the game is zero to zero you can make the argument that if the game is in the first half and your opponent has less than 10 points saying that it's not a great

offensive outpouring of points all over the place kick the field goal points match matter. And I get Ben, coach in Miami. I think he played at Carolina and he coached in Detroit in a dome for a while. You were playing in conditions where no one can feel any parts of their body. Sean McVeigh looked like a lumberjack from Alaska. He was wearing the gloves that the dude from home alone. Usually when you see guys wearing gloves, they cover their entire hand. He's wearing the gloves so his fingertips are sticking out so clearly he wanted to feel his play sheet.

when does Sean McVeigh ever put anything over that great head of hair? And the answer is never. It shows you how cold it was. I saw 70 degrees, 7 degrees on the field. Felt like 7 degrees. That is frigid temperatures. So even going into the game, I don't care that you're playing Stafford, Hall of Famer, Devante, Hall of Famer, Puka, Chance to be a Hall of Famer.

They're not going to score 30 points in that weather. It's not going to happen. Nobody does. That's not the way the game's played. It's going to be, it's going to have a stretch in the middle of the game where people are punting and it's not going anywhere. Why? Because it's cold. No one can think it's hard to catch. It's hard to play. So Ben Johnson is obsessed with going for it always. And even the night, a couple of his runs in short yard is he's running up the gut, which I'm pro running the ball. And the thing I respect most about Ben Johnson is his willingness to run the ball. Though tonight he had more pass attempts than rush attempts. Now part of that is at the end of the game they need to throw with Caleb. So it probably would be. been slightly more rush attempts. Manungai and Swift had a combined 20, 31 attempts for, it looks like, a little over 100 yards,

which, again, it's fine. So he's getting 30 plus carries with those two guys, which operate as one back, I would say, when you got two backs like that. But why not use Caleb's legs? Why not run a quarterback power? Why not just run some sport a sprint option where here's your first option, if it's not there, and the defender doesn't bite fucking take off? walk to the first down.

I get Ben Johnson hates quarterback runs. He despises them. I can imagine guys, you know, the Todd Munkins of the world that can do both are going, why aren't you utilizing this guy's skill set? And while Ben had a great season, he resurrected a historic franchise, deserves his flowers. For some reason, hates McVeigh and all of his friends. LaFleur McVeigh, LaFleur's brother, probably hates Kevin O'Connell because they're friends. just in weird relation, hates the Shanahan's,

Cubiaks probably, can't stand that tree, which I also respect. I like it when people don't like other people. It's like, what's your reason? I don't really have one. I just don't like that guy. You need some of that in sports. Can't have everyone beating buddy, buddy. Need some like, yeah, I just can't stand that fucking guy. Like, that's just entertaining to me. Like, we need some just more hatred. That used to happen a lot in sports. Happens way less. At least publicly.

Because we're all human beings. There are always people like, yeah, just don't really like that guy. especially as you get older you just you meet people through your wife or your friends and you just people that you haven't known that long some people you just gravitate toward you and some people you gravitate the other way and a lot of times in pro sports because it's so corporate

there's so much money in the line no one ever wants to admit to anything and you know peter shregor saying that McVeigh knows that they hate each it's like I want more of that we need that I want some hatred so I like Ben Johnson mixing it up kind of like that he's a tight ass that just hates the McVay tree like I sign me up This is entertainment, baby. We don't need everyone to be friends. So Ben Johnson and I think throughout the season,

they had all these crazy comebacks because of what? Caleb just started cooking. Make some plays, kid. But throughout the middle of the game, he just makes him play like a pocket quarterback. Obviously he can do it. But I think part of his strength is just get him moving. And there were some big spots tonight where he just didn't allow him to do it.

And the crazy part is for the first time, and forever, I guess last week they had a half. Their defense was awesome. Throughout that game, the Rams, to start the season, were viewed as not a Super Bowl contender, like one of the Super Bowl favorites. One of the teams, AFC and NFC, you thought was going to win the Super Bowl. And then going into that Seattle game,

especially when they were up 16 points, you're like, this is the team that's going to represent the NFC. Kind of ended weird so people got off the scent, but now they're 60 minutes away from going to the Super Bowl. and the Bears look like they're equal tonight. From a physicality standpoint, their defense was fantastic. Part of the problem for the Bears, their defense has been so shitty all season long

that Caleb's had to play like Elway or had to play like, you know, Forf and just do crazy stuff constantly. Well, he didn't really, I mean, they were good at night. Stafford threw for 258 yards, no touchdowns. Kieran Williams had two touchdowns. And, you know, the one thing that Caleb, clearly, I think the meeting of the minds,

no different than once upon a time in Detroit when they decided we go for it all the time. It's like, coach, we're up 24 to 7 in the second half of the NFC championship. Go for it. It's like, coach, you don't want to take some points here? No, go for it. Coach, it's zero, zero with three minutes to go

or three minutes into the first quarter, go for it. It's like, what? There's no rhyme or reason. It's just a universal, no matter what, we're going. Which I'm sorry, I'm out on. Which I respect people have tried different things. I remember years ago, Tomlin, was like always going for two. I remember, it might have been like five, six, seven years ago.

Maybe toward the end of Rathusberger, it might have been like Rudolph's year, gap year. I don't remember when it happened. I just remember the Steelers had a stretch where they just went for two constantly. They'd score like the first touchdown on the game. It'd be like six nothing. He'd go for two. And he clearly got away from that.

Remember Harbaugh had a stretch where he's always going for it too, maybe early Lamar. But like you try things out, you pivot. Like that's life. That's business. Ben Johnson, Dan Campbell, there's no, this isn't trying it out. This is what we do, no matter what. Well, if that's what you're going to do, in Detroit, like, Jared ain't moving. There's no ad libing there. You got the best ad libber in the league, right? Josh Allen's clearly a little banged up, not moving as well. Same thing

with Lamar Jackson. This guy in terms of just speed, power, and the playmaking, like, let him mix shit up. Because whenever he did, that's when the positive stuff would happen. And the game was there to be played. Like, if you would have told me this was going to be a low, scoring game, very physical. I would have been huge advantage ramps. They got Jared Verst, Landman, this is the mentality because this is an organizational game.

Especially less need deserves a lot of credit. We talk a lot of coaches, but the personnel staff building this roster, when you can go as a West Coast team and go to Frisic Conditions and set the tone physically, you're a well-built team. Because you have acquired a lot of guys who are wired the right way. Because you have to be obsessed with football and the violence which comes along with football to play in that environment.

It is not fun at all. I can't even imagine being there as a fan. So the level in which the Rams, look at Miami. They haven't been able to figure that out in decades. Look at CJ Stroud today. They've gone to cold weather two weeks in a row and just, I mean, no pun intended, gone the other way. They've melted, right? but this is a situation where they went and the physical tone was matched.

And you go, yeah, the Bears aren't a very physical team. Today it was. DB's making plays. Dennis Allen dialing up blitzes. I mean, Stafford was a sitting duck on multiple blitzes, had no chance. The tackling from the Bears, I thought was fantastic. And they just got into a run a little bit with the offense where they just didn't let Caleb run around. And listen, I'm a proponent and I understand over the course of,

the season, got to play in rhythm. And listen, Caleb's accuracy is something he has to work on. For him to be a top five quarterback in the NFL, which he clearly has the physical capabilities to do, he's got to be elite at the basic stuff. You know, an out route, any sort of short to intermediate route that the top guys from Brady to Manning to Rogers to now Allen to Lamar and Mahomes, when they're playing well, they hit with their eyes closed. You have no clue if he's going to hit that or miss that. So that is an area that he can, that he needs to if he's going to take the next step. Because if he does that, he would be a dominant player. And I think Ben Johnson has to meet him in the middle and start instituting some just movement plays, because that's what his skill set is.

This is the issue with the Eagles is, you know, Petula got blamed and clearly he wasn't any good. But Jalen, they got to get together like, we got to run a little bit. You know, I heard someone say that in his best season, Jalen's, he averaged 11 carries a game. And this season, I think he was averaging like three. Now, is Caleb ever going to average 11 carries a game? Of course not. But today, I mean, he had five, but how many of those, I didn't track it, are past plays from the pocket in which he takes off.

I mean, I can think of three off top of my head. So I would just have a basic, like, quarterback power run. They run it for Josh Allen. You can treat Caleb like Josh Allen. and there are some similarities to Josh earlier in his career pretty inaccurate, physically gifted, and can move. And Caleb's better probably at the same spot than Josh

but yeah, I just think Ben Johnson the going for it, the not using his legs, when his defense, I mean for the first time if you're a Bears fan, you're like, God, Dennis Allen had us dialed in. And then Sean McVeigh

at the end of the game with two minutes and seven seconds left, they have a timeout and there's a two-minute warning. So it's guaranteed the clock is going to stop at two minutes. Why not pass the ball? And you're a past happy guy. It'd be the equivalent of Ben Johnson kicking the field goal. That was the opposite of everything that I thought what you would do would be.

You have, I mean, a legendary guy in his era, DeVante, who's still an elite player with Devon. they do today. He only had the two catches for 24 yards and one of the biggest catches of the game. And Puka had kind of a light game to, 5-56, but he definitely had two carries for six yards. One of them was a big first down. Again, this is a game where you're not going to see like Justin Jefferson's, well, I had 11 for a 2-10 and three touchdowns. Like, that's not going to be the operation here. Even the bears, 4 for 56, two for 44. It's going to be that couple catches here and there. Where do they come? In what big spots? McVeigh is in

this spot and he runs the ball. It's like you got Pooka Nakua and Devante Adams and Parkinson who's a really good tight end. And hell, worst case scenario, dump it down to the back. Maybe the guy breaks a tackle. You are playing the Bears and my guy slips and you get a first down. And he just kind of did. And maybe Stafford changed the play at the line. But I thought that was pretty head scratching and put them in a position where then they punted and the Bears get the ball at the 50. Do you know what's crazy also about Ben Johnson? Is they get the ball at the 50. They drive the field. Caleb makes, I mean, it's not a better play. It's a more freakish play than the, was that last week? Yeah, the fourth and six against the

Packers, like, to me, that still is the best play of the year. That is just the freakier kind of there was some element of luck involved. I mean, Durant, you can't let a guy. I'm no DB coach here, but I'm pretty sure I got a couple coaching points that I'll never forget. Don't throw the ball high over the middle of the field, C.J. Stroud. And don't let a guy get behind you in a goal line, you know, Hail Mary type situation. This pretty basic, like, you don't need to play for Nick Sabin or Bill Belichick to get those coaching points. But obviously the throw to be able to backing up, you start doing the yardage. He threw that from the 40.

Commet caught that five yards deep into the end zone. And the first thing I thought of, that moment, and they showed some kids, you know, probably teenagers in the stadium, that's something you tell your friends until the day you die. Right. I just had a child. I will tell him moments that I saw. I was there when Navarro Bowman had a pick at the stick,

and I was standing at the sideline to win the, or the 49ers made the playoffs off of them. You're at some moments that you just never forget and you tell your friends about the rest of your lives. And that's the type moment these last couple weeks, if you're Bears fans and you attended the game, that is priceless. And there's nothing like being a sports fan,

that it's in a weird way, a very communal thing to do. But it's also not that fun. It's stressful. It's exhilarating highs and lows. I mean, the high of that play to the low of them hitting the Devante play and then them kicking the field goal. But I do think the Bears being back is one of those that's really cool for the

league. And in a weird year where there were a lot of injuries and the chiefs have been nowhere to be found for a couple months and, you know, the Ravens didn't make the playoffs and Lamar was MIA for a while with injuries and Burrow was out. You know, the bears in the business model really helped pick up the slack. They did. And they put themselves in a position to do it and ultimately I thought they should have gone for the kill shot in the two-point conversion. Like when I think Ben Johnson, I think, crazy balls, crazy willingness to push the envelope. And he scores a touchdown. He doesn't go for two.

Now, I get you're at home. I get the second round of the playoffs. But it's like, the one thing he is in like specific situations, typically he has pretty good plays. Now, maybe some of the short yardage plays from earlier in the game had been really bad and they had been stuffed in the backfield. Maybe he was torn. To me, it's like, hey, just let Caleb Cook.

I mean, he's cooked in this moment over and over and over again. You go into overtime, there's kind of a randomness to it. There just is, right? This is not, like, it's just weird because both teams touch the ball, but it's football. Like, you could just have a drive where you go three and out. You could have a drive where dude fumbles. You just never know.

Like, you know, there's overtime, it's more equitable now because you're guaranteed a touch. But there's still, that football is not a situation that's played in that type of, you know, a sudden death moment. It's not really the way the sport is. So it's like you go to that, anything can happen. And you're playing a team that has really good players, obviously this great offense that, like, in one play, Pooker Devante could hit like a 40-yard bomb.

Now, so could you. But I don't know, man. I wonder if he could do it over, like, just run a play. And that's where to me, like run quarterback power. Would anyone say have an issue if you're a Bears fan, that to win the game, they just ran quarterback power in that moment? and they just had Caleb pulled the guard and just tried to hit the edge. I don't think they would have.

I really don't. But he didn't do it. And now he's at home. I was also kind of hoping he beats McVeigh to piggyback off the Shreger thing that he hates LaFlears. And McVe in turn now hates him. And he doesn't really like McVeigh because he's not some Nepo baby like him and Shanahan. I kind of like this anger in Ben Johnson. Seems kind of like my type guy.

We probably wouldn't be friends because people like that don't really talk to other people that often. But I do think that we're, you know, there's a respect level I have for that type mindset. I was really wanting to see a post game of what he would have said. I don't even think I kind of waited before we recorded this to see if we got a handshake between the two guys. And we did not. But the Rams are off. They're an underdog on the road against Seattle. I think one deficiency they have is it is very hard in the way this modern day NFL is played

when your quarterback can't really move. You know, Stafford was 20 and 42 tonight, so he's under 50%. He's sacked four times. There is like, you know, cousins have this even when, and obviously I'm not comparing Stafford to Cousin, Stafford's a better player, but Goff has this a little bit too. I say Goff's a better athlete than cousins. when you cannot move. These guys don't exist.

They're just not starting quarterbacks. I mean, look, you know, Denver should have Bo Nix, Seattle is Sam Darnold, New England has Drake May. You saw today Caleb Williams. CJ can move. Doesn't really know where he's going and not great. You see a lot of these quarterbacks, you know, Purdy, these guys that have mobility.

He has none. So it does, like, you better block for him, and these guys better get open. And obviously, their timing and precision is in the routes. have to be key because they kind of play an old school game. And I think it's going to be really, really hard for them. Now, if they beat Seattle, they will be favored in the Super Bowl, and I'd be kind of stunned if they didn't win it.

Because then it would be pretty conducive for them in San Francisco, you know, in a warmer weather place. But I think that, you know, Sean McVeigh, this was a big night, and this was a big season. And he's had two really good teams the last couple years. They've won a bunch of games. They just didn't really advance far in the playoffs. At one point in time when it thought that he might lose this game,

that guy's a pretty big kick in the nuts to lose back-to-back years on the road in cold weather where you're right there. It's like you have a team that's capable of not just winning that game, but clearly, you know, winning the whole thing and you lose in the second round. Right? I say this whole time, like in these other sports, the Warriors won a championship one year and lost, I think, by 50 to the Memphis Grizzlies in a playoff game.

Like individual playoff games, unless they're like six or seven or elimination games, don't make or break you. In football, you're on the edge of your seat, living with every down, especially a game like this that, you know, it's 10 to 10, right, at halftime. No one scores in the third quarter. You're like, this is fucking nuts. This is, the Bears game this year have just been theater. The Rams have played in some great games that the game against Seattle was awesome.

the game earlier this year against the 49ers, against Mac Jones was awesome. So these teams, there's something, you know, the characters with their coaches, that doesn't get any better as a consumer. That's just entertaining. I don't need, I've said this forever, back in the day when Mahomes hit the scene and he played golf in that game, it was supposed to be in Mexico City, but like, I don't know, the cartel sold the grass or something, so they had to play in the Rose Bowl. because the Rams that year.

Remember, they hadn't built so far yet, so they were playing at the Rose Bowl. And the final score was like 58 to 54. It's like, it was fun, but I don't like football like that. I'm not into watching, you know, Big 12 football. Honestly, that's the conference I watched the least. Might have changed a little bit with the additions of some of their schools. Now, Arizona State, Utah, BYU.

Texas Tech is more of a defensive team. But historically, they were always just a bunch of points, no defense. I don't enjoy that. I enjoy this game the night. The physicality of it, how important every first down was, how important every decision was. Like, you can't afford to, you know, make a poor decision. And it was a good, just entertaining kind of throwback game

with just some, obviously Caleb's pass will, I would say, the craziest stretch of last minute passes and like, I don't know, the history of the NFL. I've never seen anything like it. I never have. And for Bears fans that are, I know so many people just living here in Arizona that are from that general region that I've gotten to know,

people I see at the gym that just come up to me and just start wearing me out because they love it. This season has meant so much of them. How much fun the ride of that year was. It doesn't get any better. It's why we love sports because even early on you get a little optimistic, then you look, if I would have told you you're hosting a game in the second round of the playoffs

against McVeigh and Stafford, and you are going to be in position to win the game. In overtime, you're going to get the ball and have a chance to win the game. Are you serious? Sign me that you know what up for that. So grass the bears on a hell of the season and Sean McVeigh, off to the NFC championship game to, you know, a couple wins away from trying to get Super Bowl number two. We'll dive into to a lot of the games coming up this, this, this, throughout the week for this weekend. Today's show is brought to you by our presenting sponsor Hard Rock Bet.

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today. Payable and bonus bets, not a cash offer, offered by Seminole Tribe of Florida in Florida, offered by Seminole Hard Rock Digital LLC in all other states. You must be 21 plus and physically present in Arizona, Colorado, Florida, Illinois, Indiana, Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee, and Virginia to play. Terms and conditions apply. Concerned about gambling in Florida, call 1-833 playwise. In Indiana, if you or someone you know has a gambling problem and wants help, call 1-800-9 with it. Gambling problem, call 1-800 gambler, Arizona, Colorado, Illinois, New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee, Virginia. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers.

And guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, name? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it.

We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. And, well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it.

one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast,

people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen.

We don't care where you hear it. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis, and I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris. Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on clay. Jenchian went. I mean, she went down to three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay.

Listen, Lina Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now. I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHart Women's Sports. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy,

not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes.

Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen, kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey.

I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levant this plant to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Let's get into the other game. I think big picture on Vrable and the Pats. Remember a couple years ago, when Belichick's last year, offensively they had Patricia and like Joe Judge were running the offense and it did not go well but their defense actually was pretty good and so the next year when Gerard Mayo took over and their defense fell apart remember Belichick had like 17 shows on the internet

and was taking some shots like our defense was pretty good last year this is kind of on you very bitter but it's just reality of crumudgeon Bill but he wasn't wrong like they did have some good defensive players and then they get Drake May Josh McDaniels comes back and they've created an offense, there is a grittiness and a toughness to the Patriots, like this team, that has some similarities to a lot of those Bill and Brady teams.

That when you watch them, like the group is better than the individual sum of their parts. Now, obviously, Drake May has a chance to be, I don't know, like one of the best players in the league, right, is excellent. Christian Gonzalez, when he's healthy, is an elite corner. But, like, they got a lot of guys. A lot of people could add dig. A lot of people passed on Bouté from the draft.

Who's Booty, I think his name is. I call him Bouté because it's like New Orleans. He is making incredible plays down the stretch of this season. But pretty sure he wasn't a first round pick. They got a lot of dudes on that team that could have been had by a lot of people. Now, they paid, quote unquote, some people say overpaid, Milton Williams. They went pretty aggressive in free agency. But there is like a cohesion to that group and a toughness that clearly.

starts with Mike. And I think there's some similarities with Mike and Bill, not physically. Mike looks like, you know, former NFL player. Bill looks like a guy you'd see at the deli on Tuesday. But the way they fundamentally think about football, the toughness, the details, the just like unfazed by anything, and the Patriots have that. And to go from back to back seasons, after the run they had to be drafting third overall, they got Drake May, then fourth overall, Like, you know, should Will Campbell be playing guard? You could also make the argument, like Will Anderson makes everyone look like that. Will Anderson was eating his lunch today.

Will Anderson, it might have been hard for Orlando Pace to slow that guy down at it. Will Anderson looked elite. But what the Patriots do? A quarterback can run. They fumble the ball a couple times, and obviously, you know, the ball was on the ground constantly. But there's just an impressive kind of cohesion to that team. Now, do I think this is some loaded? super great talented group?

I don't. But when you got Mike Vrable, who is a high-end NFL coach, you have Josh McDaniels, who's probably the best offensive coordinator in the league who's not a head coach. And because of how weird it's been in his career will never be a head coach again.

They're a motherfucker. And obviously with Bo Nicks being injured, they are favored on the road in Denver. So, like, my initial thought is, I have a hard time seeing a backup quarterback beat this team. because when you're the backup quarterback, you don't get any reps in practice. You obviously don't play any of the games in the Rego season because their young starter gets them all. You're just going to show up in the AFC championship game.

Obviously, it's easier at home, but still, I mean, against a Mike Vrable team, I have a hard time seeing that. I really do. Now, he's not playing the Houston Texans. Like, I wouldn't say Will Anderson and DeNeal Hunter are coming off the edge for the Patriots. But there is just, I don't even know how to say it. They just feel like very fundamentally, fundamental, tough, and kind of boring.

There's an element to that. So I think New England resurrecting this franchise is just pretty remarkable. Again, they had back-to-back draft picks in the top five. And now they're going to the AFC championship as a favorite. Now, obviously, if Bo Nix hadn't been injured, would Denver be favored by one or two points? They would be less than a field goal underdog

on the road in the AFC championship. That's how fast he flipped it around. They had the easy schedule to benefit them, and they took advantage of it. They also beat the bills once, right? So today was impressive. And to have your quarterback under that much duress from those two just dominant players. I remember when Casario signed DeNeil Hunter, and it's pretty rare, right? It was almost like a baseball contract.

Why, I saw Kyle Tecker, the Dodgers gave him four years, $240 million. like every penny is guaranteed. Someone else who just signed with the Cubs. Oh, was it Bregman? All these guys just get like three, four, five-year deals with these opt-outs, huge guarantees, huge yearly averages. They gave DeNeil Hunter two years.

I think it was $49 million and guaranteed $48. Like that's just a throwback. Like, you just don't see those type contracts. He's worth every penny. And those two edges were all over everyone today. And Will Campbell was fighting for his life. but they figured out a way. And a huge reason was

is the other quarterback on the other side was a disaster. Let's face it, the story of the game was twofold to me for Houston. Their defense is pretty incredible. They had the best defense in the league. Seattle's defense is elite. I think Houston's is better.

I think it doesn't get any better in Houston's defense. The amount of times that they were able to get off the field after CJ Stroud literally tried to hand the game to Vrable and Drake May, They had a stretch in the second quarter where they went interception, one play, interception four plays. So they ran five plays, two interceptions, punt. That was seven plays, and then an interception.

He threw three interceptions in a stretch of like 10 plays. He was, the one reason I liked the Houston Texans tonight in this game was love their defense, anyone with a brain does. I thought they're quarterback after the game he just had against Pittsburgh. And I had a buddy on the Texans say, you know what? Obviously the bad plays were really bad,

but he made a lot of high-end plays in that game, which were true. So I thought, listen, you get in the lab, you take a deep breath, we're going to play, we're not going to play Hero Ball. You're not Aaron Rogers. You're not Caleb Williams, even though you tried to son him last year and tell him advice,

which is kind of funny now looking back, but he did it. Because CJ's a good guy. CJ means well. People like him. But he also has this thing in the way he plays, and Aikman was crushing him today. He's like trying to justify he was the number two overall pick

and make plays like a guy that's going to make $200 million one day. I'm going to be a Josh Allen. I'm going to be in my homes. I'm going to be a Lamar. I'm going to be a Joe Burrow. I'm going to be an elite. It's like, bro, we don't need that right now. Maybe one day.

Right now, we need you to play like Trent Dillford. We need you to play like Brad Johnson. needed you to play like Jimmy Garoppel in 2019, manage the motherfucking game. And the plays he made today were, I mean, I'm not one to act like this shit is easy. I worked in the NFL. I've been to these NFL games. I'm on the sideline. I know these coaches and personnel people.

It is really hard to do this. And I've said forever, it is way. It's why I'm way more critical of front office and coaching that profession than I end the players. because it's way easier to become one of those than is a player. It is way more difficult to ever find yourself strapping up in an NFL game, let alone the second round of the playoffs. CJ Stroud's a very talented player. He's a touch thrower, though.

CJ Stroud's comp is really much closer to Jared Goff. That's his style of game. He is not some power player like Caleb or Josh. He is Jared Goff, touch passer. Well, what happens in the freezing cold? can't feel your hands. Why did Jared Gough suck for a long time in the cold? He's gotten better as he got older.

His passes, he had no touch on the ball. He had no clue where it was going. And you watch CJ today, he could not control the ball. Even the touchdown he threw to Kirk in the corner of the end zone, Kirk, who's kind of an underrated NFL player, made a great play kind of boxing out the DB and catching the ball. It was behind him. So you're watching CJ, just his asses.

accuracy in that environment is not good. It is actually terrible. And then he, you know, I would say makes it even worse, like magnifies the issues by trying to play outside of his own skill set. He's like run around doing crazy shit that is just leading to him getting sacked and throw picks in the air, balls flying up 25 feet. It's like, what is going on? Do you know what's really rare? In the NBA, you turn on, I mean, I don't consume any of these, but we all see the clips. These former players will talk shit about everybody.

It's actually one thing I kind of respect is like, I think part of the reason NBA podcasts with the former players have had a lot of success, you turn on a mic, they will say whatever, which I respect. Because a lot of former players, like, just kind of beat around the bush and stuff. You get some of these guys, they will just be taking shots to everybody. Yet in the NFL, you know, J.J. Watt said this. Tom Brady said this. Peyton Manning didn't want anything more than the Manning cast because I'm not, I don't want to be critical. I know how hard this is, which I do understand.

And when they came to halftime and they went right to Kelsey, who's a pretty uplifting positive guy, I think you got to bench him. And I think everyone kind of looked around like, hell yeah, you don't have a choice. And D'Amico, former player, you know, who's also a positive guy, which is kind of rare because he's like this, defensive middle lineback or ass kicker. But D'emiko's energy is very positive. Had to have the thought, but also like, hey, he's just giving me my quarterback next year. We can't ruin his confidence. In the 70s, the 80s, the 90s, probably the 2000s,

a player of CJ stature, meaning hasn't really accomplished that much. It's not like he's some all pro. It's not like he's, you know, one of the best players in the league. He's not on a contract extension yet. He's on his rookie contract. Would have got the hook at halftime. Basically, just like Yanking, you know, your number, one starter out of a playoff. He don't have it. And listen, we all go through that. I thought Saturday night, after not sleeping at all, if you listen to my podcast, I thought I was throwing about 60 miles an hour. I didn't have much. I was like, God, that was a terrible podcast. It

happens to us all no matter what you do. It is inevitable. He did not have a good game. His confidence was lost, and he was a gigantic liability. And I do think, and Casario's very involved, I do think they made a mistake by leaving him in there. Because I don't think, and maybe they know him better, that he'll lose his confidence, you won't be able to get him back, but you had to throw a curveball. You could not look Will Anderson,

DeNeil Hunter, Petri, all those guys in the face and saying, we're doing, giving ourselves the best chance to win with throwing him out there. He couldn't play. And right now, coward asked me this tonight, would you give CJ Stroud an extension?

Like, to me, it's not even a con, I wouldn't even have the conversation if I'm Casario. If his agent called me, it's like, this is not on the table. Like, well, you're going to give one to Will Anderson. Well, yeah, he's one of the best fucking dudes in the league. Your quarterback just had a two-game stretch in the playoffs with like 27 interceptions and fumbles.

So, like, one, I need in this conference, we're lucky. In our division, we play in a dome, the Colts playing a dome, the Jags playing 97 degrees, and the Titans are irrelevant and suck. But in this conference, the Chiefs, the Bills, the Patriots, the Ravens, the Steelers, I mean, there are a lot of teams in this conference, Denver, that play in cold weather.

Like, freezing cold, frigid weather. If anyone with the pulse ever resurrects the Jets, like, this is a place where you're going to go on the road in cold-ass games. How many times over the course, you know, the last 25 years, Mahomes, Brady, Manning, outside, I need you to play well in the cold. You can't. And to me, like, you're not playing well. well enough in the regular season for me to overlook that. So we got to have a massive jump next year. And part of it's on us, right?

We have a massive offseason to improve all our offensive line. We have our own first round pick. We have the Washington Commanders first or second round pick, which I think is in the top 40. We got to hit on some players, free agency. We got to figure out how to keep DeNeil Hunter around here. But we need you to, like, you're not Josh Allen. stop trying to do that. You need to become more Jared Goff

and play smart. And I think CJ thinks he's like this ad libber and you saw tonight, it was like, or earlier today, was a nightmare. I mean, let's face it, for a guy who was drafted high and he's been a multi-year starter, that's as bad of a game as you can ever see. It doesn't get any worse.

And I think one downfall of Domeco is, I don't think that would have flown with Rabel. I think he's yanked. Historically, all the defensive coaches, he's out of the game. They just wouldn't have tolerated it because it's not okay. Like this is, my defense is, I mean, they looked incredible. I actually, with every interception that happened, and they would force them a punt. I mean, interception punt.

Interception punt. I'm just reading, those are CJ interceptions, and then the defense, like, it's forcing three and outs. And Drake May is just, it's like, it's like, getting destroyed from all angles. But it's a tough one. And I think part of that is like obviously your skill set, you're not going to be Tom Brady or Ben Rothesburg thrown through the wind. No one expects you to do that.

But to be a high-level quarterback in the NFL, to be a guy like our organization is too well run, we're not going to give a Kyler Murray contract. We'd rather get thrown off a bridge than give it to a contract. That's not going to happen here. we're not getting rid of you but next year is a massive massive year in his career it really is

and honestly he could define is he one of those guys getting a huge contract or does his career kind of derail because let's face it if it doesn't go well and he has some more moments in these colder weathers

even the shitty teams in the cold weather how could you pull the trigger and sign him if he one day became available if he can't play in those conditions so I've always been a fan everything I've heard about them. I become fans of people when I find out about them off the field and kind of what they stand for.

I like everything I've heard from my people that know. But there is also a skill set that comes along with it. And you saw tonight Stafford and Caleb playing these conditions. Then you saw CJ. You're like, what is going on? California kid playing in the dome. I saw one of the basketball, Kevin O'Connor used to work for Simmons,

tweet out some quotes he have. about the things he likes the least about football, and one of them was playing in the cold. Like, you can't have that mindset. Like, what's Will Anderson? From Bama, went to Bama, plays in a dome. You think that guy gives a shit? He'd play in Iceland.

He'd play in Alaska. He'd play in – it wouldn't matter. He'd play in the parking lot. He'd play on, you know, a turf field, rocks. It doesn't matter. And I think anytime that's kind of in your head, you kind of play like that, and you could see it happening. So just a disaster.

And listen, maybe I'm more excited about this because I had money on the Texans. But even as I'm watching the game, it's like 21 to 16. Like, you're right there. It's there to be one. And it wasn't because he was that bad. He was, I just don't remember anything quite like that. Not when a defense has been playing that good. Really, not when a defense have been playing that good.

And I think it also gets back to this unwillingness to pull guys now. I saw Davis Mills bring them back. in a 29-10 game against Jacksonville. How many games is Jacksonville? 13, 14? They were one of the best teams in the league. He brought them right down. Now, I get, if I remember correctly, I think that game was indoors.

But still, yeah, they won 13 games. So, it's just, that one's tough, man. That one's really tough. So congrats to the Patriots, congrats to the Rams. Always, you know, a really big deal when obviously you win this round. You're 60 minutes away from being the Super Bowl. which about as cool as it gets.

It doesn't get any better. We'll get into all the different angles of this game and some big picture thoughts. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, name? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, a wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys?

I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. We were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas.

And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis. And I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs.

And on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris. Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on clay. Gentian win. I mean, she went down in three to Rovachina, but. I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lena Rubakina is arguably the best player in the world right now.

And I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guide, not. Quite on Humor Me with Robert Smygel and Friends, me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back.

Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levan this went to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life.

Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The other big topic that I wanted to touch on that I haven't yet was John Harbaugh. I do just want to say that there has never been a time, and this is not going to last forever. I've been saying this for a long time about football. It's not going to be this powerhouse, best business in America or one of them for the next 40 years, for the next 100 years. That's not the way the world works, right? Things ebb and flow. Things are on top, and then they're not.

their societal shifts. I mean, there's one going on right now with alcohol, less people drink than ever. That impacts, like if you alcohol sales used to be recession proof. Now they're not. And now they get impacted dramatically. Younger people value their health now more than ever. That impacts certain industries more than others.

Football will one day, I don't know when. I'm not making a prediction that it's anytime soon. And I'm not rooting for this at all. I hope until I'm dead and if my young son loves football, I hope he gets to live through golden ages as well. But that's not the way things happen typically, right? So one day football will come down and the money will change. But right now, the money is aflone.

And John Harbaugh just signed a contract. You know, these college coaches, like Signetti or Lane that signed for $90, 100 million, It's typically like nine or ten years or seven or eight years. Like it's long-term contracts. Lincoln Riley was like 10 for 105 or whatever. John Harbaugh signed a $100 million contract five-year deal. I mean, if this goes well in a couple years, he will get an extension. John Harbaugh's probably, what do you think he's been making the last five years?

$15, 17 million? John Harbaugh just in the last like from 2020 to 2030 will have banked money like he's a Fortune 500 CEO. He's a man that shows up to the opportunity. office with a whistle around his neck. So it is a great time to be a good football coach or a great football coach. You were paid incredible amounts of money. And John Harbaugh for the Giants made a ton of sense. I've only been to New York a handful of times. Obviously, I lived in the general region when I lived in Philly. But I think it's pretty clear. It's just a sports fan. The best coaches in my lifetime in New York

have been father-like figures is almost an understatement that they had there was just a swag and a boss-like feel to him Bill Parcells, Tom Coughlin, Pat Riley, coached in the Knicks,

Joe Torrey coached in the Yankees. You just knew that guy was a one. That guy ain't a two or a three. He's a one. He's the leader of this operation. And I think the Giants have gone through a stretch where they've had a lot of twos and threes. And I've said this forever about the NFL.

If you're going to be a two or a three, the NFL is a great industry to be won in, because it pays millions of dollars. Now, if you're a great one in the NFL, John Harbaugh, you get $100 million. But John Harbaugh. His family is a family of Alphas. Jack Harbaugh, John Harbaugh, Jim Harbaugh. Those guys are badasses. I will spend a lot of time around Jim for a couple years when he was coaching the

Niners going to those practices. There was a swag and a feel to him when he watched. in a room when you just saw them. I remember one time at the Combine, I was a young scout, and we had a box in Indianapolis, and we're all just, like, in the box, and like, I don't know if I got sent on a sandwich run

or someone got sent. There was, like, this place that either Howie or Andy loved in Indianapolis, and we ordered, like, 25 of the sandwiches. And we come back in with the bags of the sandwiches to watch, like, you know, some guys run routes on air or something. And all of a sudden, I'm kind of by the door,

and I see John and John and, gym turn in the room. And this is 2010 or 11. And I see Coach Reed light up and they all hug. And it was just, there's something about like, these guys were born to be head coaches. Bill Parcells was put on this earth to be the boss. Pat Riley was put on this earth to be the boss. Not like the VP of Sales, not an assistant coach to be the head fucking honcho. And the Giants have been desperate to hire someone who can be the, the head honcho, who can be the leader of the pack. And John fills that role. Now, my one concern is, the Giants, kind of like the Packers, are a throwback organization. They have had an organizational

hierarchy that had gone through the general manager, which is kind of rare. Like, John Schneider has that in Seattle. Like, Mike Vrable ain't answering anybody. Sean Payton ain't answering anybody. Obviously less is a powerful guy, but Sean probably makes three X's salary. Like if Sean wants something, he's getting it. You know, typically these coach, like Kyle Shannon, and if he wants something, he's

getting it, like, Ben Johnson at this point in time, like, you think he's, if he wants a player in this upcoming draft, he's getting told no? You think after that year, what he just did with the Bears? Fucking high on crack? I mean, so typically, coaches have a lot of juice.

John Horbaugh's been very lucky. He got to work with Ozzie Newsom, who is going to go down right there with Ron Wolf, Al Davis, short list of individuals, John Schneider, maybe one day, Howie. I mean, the great GMs in the history of this sport. And then to Eric Dacosta, who had basically understudied under Ozzy. And their personnel department is elite. So I was told this about D'Amico. You know the best part about Domingo's job?

Obviously, he's a great coach and knows what he's doing. He doesn't worry about players. Texas personnel department's really good. Like, Casario can handle that. It helps. You know what Mike McDonald doesn't need to worry about? The roster. You know who's got that handled?

John Schneider. John Harbaugh now, and listen, I respect it. He's just telling Ian O'Connor everything. He's like, hey, I just, I had a steak, two potatoes, mac and cheese, and a glass of Pino, 1987 from Napa tonight, meeting with Damaras and three other people that I don't even know their name. And he's just, like, tweeting it out. So he was just telling it all.

He's just quoting, like, I answer to the owner. He put that out. Not in a statement like through the team. He put that his own statement that he told the reporter, which I respect. And John has all the leverage in the situation. The Giants need him. He does not need them. He would get jobs.

If you wanted to take a year off, travel with his family, he would have teams lined up for him next year. He is in high demand, right? The Titans were ready to throw $100 million out of them. Now, I wouldn't take the Titans job. I would love to live in Nashville, but if I was a football coach, I wouldn't touch that job with a 20 football. I think it's very risky. It's got a lot of issues going on. The Giants have had issues, but it's still the New York Giants. It's one of the most prestigious organizations in all of sports

when it's right. You have all of New York, you're a massive brand. And you also get in at a great time. It's like when Sabin took over Alabama. If you do resurrect this, you get extra credit because they've been so shitty. So when I saw that John Harbaugh won't answer to Joe Shane, I don't blame them. If I was John Harbaugh, in what world, like I get the GM, Jerry Reese or, God, I forget the guy's name, who, what's the guy's name, Ernie O'Corsi, like, you answer to the GM, that's not the way it's going to work here. I'm not answering to that guy because he's Joe Shane. So if I'm the Giants, and I get you have this personal relationship with him, I'm sorry, you have to fire Joe Shane. This is not an apples-to-apples situation, but I remember when Mark,

Mark Davis hired John Gruden, gave him 10 years $100 million, which at the time was insane. But he had to do it because Tampa was offering a ton of money and he really wanted John Gruden. He said, John, I'm giving you $100 million. You're in charge. But I really like Reggie McKenzie. Will you just work with Reggie McKenzie? John, because he just got $100 million, had to suck it up. It was like, yeah, I'll give him a try.

Reggie McKenzie was never going to survive with John Gruden. And he didn't. He was fired a year later. And then obviously, I like Mike Mayak, but that was at the time pretty risky hire and kind of backfired. But why wouldn't the Giants go, hey, listen, John, we understand that you don't want to answer to Joe Shane. Again, don't blame you. In what world would John Harbaugh take orders about the draft or personnel people to them? But we're also not that comfortable paying a coach $100 million and then just giving him the ability to pick all the players and make all the personnel.

decisions when you've never done that. And if anything, the most successful coach, post Belichick, Andy Reid said when he left the Eagles and got his new job, the number one thing he said is like, I don't want to do this job anymore. It's, it's, I want someone to help me out that I know. And that's where I think, I don't know exactly. Obviously, I don't think John Harbaugh wants to be the bad guy and go in there and fire him. But I also think the Giants then need to step up and just, hey, put it on us. I saw this clip on Instagram. that this dad was doing an interview. It must have been a finance guy.

And he puts in the will for his kids that it is mandatory for them to get a pre-up when they get married or they will be kicked out of the will. And he said, part of it is when you get married, especially, you know, my kids, if they were going to get married young, you're not always thinking straight. And if we have a family business, you get into this position where even if, you know, you don't have.

regret it later on. There is a pretty big risk. But also, I don't want to make you the bad guy in the relationship. So you can look at your significant other and be like, my father is the bad guy. Put it. And the dad was like, put it on me. I don't give a shit. Say, I make it. If we're going to work for this company, the pre-up is mandatory for this operation to keep going. And it's like, that's kind of genius. Because think how many people have had this conversation over the years. I don't have a pre-up, but then again, I didn't have much to bring the table in the first place. she technically had more assets than me but I kind of understood I was like that's kind of genius

it takes the pressure off the person the giants could have easily done that that would have been the number one thing Chris and I don't know exactly John's situation of the cancer and fighting it is but John what do you need we know you don't want to come out and Diana Rusini and Albert Breer

saying like John Harbaugh demanded Joe Shane because I think he respects the profession and doesn't want like that blood in his hands the giant should have got the hint and figured it out and done it for him. That this relationship, and who knows, maybe that happens over the course of the next week. But if it doesn't, I think that's pretty crazy.

Because clearly John wanted no part of the previous hierarchy and answering to Joe. But to force him then to work with him is just so stupid. Because you basically have Joe, who has a year to be the greatest yes man of all time, and do everything he can to prove his worth to this guy. which might never have mattered, because you were never going to be his guy. And why didn't you just hire that guy right now?

Now, you could argue that every once in a while it happens. It happened with Sean Payton and George Payton in Denver. Maybe it happens with Elliot Wolf and Vrable. Now, the difference is, Elliot Wolf has worked in the NFL for like 25 years. He's Ron Wolf's son. Pretty highly regarded. I don't know him personally. He met him a couple times.

Never heard a bad thing. I think it's safe to say he knows what he's doing. Patton was, or Peyton, I always get it messed up. I used to call him General Peyton, but, or Patton. I think it might be George Payton, which would be like Sean Payton, but whatever. I'm sorry, screw up your name. I just talk about Sean Payton so much if you're listening, which I hope you are, because that would be pretty cool. I do believe that it's possible to figure it out, but he was another guy that was interviewing for GM Jobs forever.

And I think the Giants should be really excited. And if you're a Giants fan, this is a massive. moment because it brings back credibility for a franchise that was kind of dead. And this situation is the only thing that could derail it. It's just being weird. And kind of a waste of everyone's energy of trying to force feed something that doesn't need to be forced fed. So that to me is something I was going to keep an eye on.

I was going to talk about this other thing, but we've been going for a while. Basically, would you rather lose like the Niners of the Bills? and my theory was if you're the Chiefs or the Brady Patriots and you've won a lot of Super Bowls you would rather always lose in excruciating fashion like the Bears tonight

and the Bears are you if you've sucked forever you want to be in the game you want to play a great game even if you lose but when you haven't won losing in the worst possible fashion I just I feel for Bill's fans I really do. That just, I was thinking about that today, like, God, that sucks.

I mean, their players are all in tears, their fans are in tears. You know, when you just get beat like the 49ers, because I think if you were told 49er fans, it's like, oh, yeah, we were playing with house money. True, but if you would have been in overtime with Seattle and then lost, today would have been rough because you've never won't have to bowl with Kyle. You've been really close, and now you've been really close again. I think sometimes it's either just to get your teeth kicked in,

then just lose in the worst way possible over and over and over again as the bills have. So both ways suck because you lose and the goal of the game is to win. But the Vikings have gone through this a lot over the years. Awful losses, when you haven't got over the hump, I feel like staying really, really hard. And then there's a category of the Bears where you're just so happy to be there.

It's going to sting, but within a couple of days, you'll be able to hold your head high and be excited. Adios, we'll see you guys tomorrow. I guess we've got a college football game. Indiana playing Miami. Like Indiana in that game, actually, the more I thought about it. Probably going to bet on Indiana. Wouldn't shock me at all. Stucky brought up a good point.

Sometimes you look up at the end of the season this happened with LSU and Joe Burrow, and they just blow everyone out. Would it shock anyone if you just Indiana wins the game, you know, 38 to 10? I'm tempted, like, I wanted to take Miami and the more and more I thought about it. Like, I'm just not betting against this Indiana team. The volume. Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers.

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