The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 3 Points with Chris Mannix - Will Dame be at Camp?

Episode Date: September 16, 2023

On the debut podcast of "3 Points w/ Chris Mannix", Chris is joined by Portland Trail Blazers beat writer for The Oregonian; Aaron Fentress. Chris and Aaron dive into why a deal hasn't been made for Dame yet, will he be at Blazers camp, and what the expectations are for Scoot Hnederson. #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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So this show is going to be all about diving into three of the biggest topics in the NBA in that moment. I know we are still a couple of weeks away from the start of training camp, but there are still plenty of storylines going on in the NBA right now. And the storyline I want to dive into on this show is the future of Damien Lillard in Portland. It has been months now since Lillard asked for a trade from the Trailblazers. We thought around mid-July that we might get a deal between the Blazers and the Miami Heat. That didn't come to fruition.

and now here we are just weeks away from training camp with Damien Lillard still on the roster. Will he be there? What will that look like? What kind of trades does Portland want? For all that more, we bring in Aaron Fentress. Does a great job covering the Blazers for the Oregonian, Oregon Live. And Aaron, let's start right here with Lillard and why we're still here. Why is Damien Lillard still a member of the Portland Trail Blitzers?

What is the number one reason? because nothing has happened there's been no negotiations no talks no nothing the thing got shut down people went on vacation after summer league people have sprinkled in back from vacation since then

and still nothing happened and it's been widely reported and I've reported it as well that the Blazers did not engage in any types of discussions whatsoever with Miami to try and move this forward and some people argue well who's responsible for that well takes tube tango

and the Blazers have not been willing to put on their dancing shoes. So that stalls things. And so I am perplexed. Sometimes one of my mistakes I make with the NBA is that I kind of believe common sense and logic are going to supersede drama and ego and all that kind of stuff. And so for me, I thought I was going to get done in Vegas. That was my hope, but I was told before it could take weeks. And I put that out there. I've seen some of your videos where you were saying it could take months.

And then growing and funny, it said, it could take time. take months. So I guess I shouldn't be surprised that we're here, but I am. With camp three weeks away, I thought something would at least be rolling, like there would just be stuff going on. Other teams involved, other offers, things trying to push the agenda forward. But there's been next to nothing, and that's why we're here, three weeks away from camp. And I'm not going to lie to you, man. Hard on me, the journalist in me wants Dane to come to camp because it's going to be amazing to cover. But the person in me is like, come on, can we just move on from this and turn the table and shift the focus to scoot and Shaden and Ant moving forward.

So you mentioned Vegas, and that's where Joe Cronin gave kind of the first public update after the trade request from Dame. And at that time, he said, look, we're going to be patient in this process. We're going to do what's right for this organization. It was complimentary of Dame, of course, but effectively said they weren't going to be pushed into doing any kind of deal. You were sitting there in the bowels of the Thomas and Mac Center with me. When Joe Cronin was speaking at that time, did you believe him?

Did you believe that this was something the Blazers would be willing to draw out over the span of weeks and now, obviously, months? Yeah, I didn't know. Like, to me, it really depends on what their overall planning agenda are. My whole thing has been, if he's slow playing this to try and find the perfect third team to enter this thing with what they're. want and maybe he's waiting on it maybe another team was out there like we could be interested in taking hero for example and giving you something else but we've got something else going on so let's see how that goes first and then we'll get back to you like those things can slow things up as well and so if that's going on fine i'm never going to be the one to sit here and pretend like i've ever been

at gm so there's things going on that we're never going to know about so yeah he's going to say that it's going to take a while we're going to take our time great as long as you're doing something So have they really been doing anything? And according to all accounts that people I've talked to and everyone else, what they're reporting, is that nothing's happened. So if it's taking a long time because you're doing nothing, that's one thing. If it's taking a long time because you're actually being proactive and just trying to find a great deal, that's another. But right now it's the former, and that to me, I just don't quite understand. So it's pretty clear that whatever Miami's offer is, whatever it amounts to, is not.

not enough for Portland. That's, that's, I think that goes without saying at this point. But, um, let me, I want to think that.

Do we even know what the totality of that is? No, that's what I'm saying. Yeah. And, and say what, like I've been told that one of the problems, the Blazers is wanting to say exactly what they want.

I mean, it's logical that they wouldn't want Tyler Hero because they already have, right now they have five guards they kind of need to play with Dave, right? So if you try Jamie and bring in Hero, where's hero going to play? It's not a part of your feature. You're not going to give him Shaden's minutes or Ant's minutes, right? So we get that.

But sometimes you take an asset and then maybe deal with it later. But if you don't want him, great, well, who do you want? And who can we bring in to give you what you want? If you won't have that conversation, then where can things go? So I don't think we know exactly what they could squeeze Irish. But they won't negotiate. Anyway, continue. No, I agree.

Whatever that offer is, whatever the initial offer was, they're not impressed with. And they believe there's something better out there down the line. Now, everybody, I'm sure, within Portland is. hoping that there is a Brooklyn, Phoenix, Kevin Durant type situation or an Oklahoma City Clippers Paul George situation. That might seem pie in the sky, but it does seem to me that the Blazers, part of them believes that if nothing comes of, you know, if nothing improves with this Miami offer, or there's nothing that comes out of this current situation that, you know, bringing Dame to camp, bringing into the season, you know, might, you know, at some point generate better offers.

you might get to mid-season and have a team out there that's in contention. Maybe it's in the Western Conference. Maybe it's in the East that is looking at Damie Little and say, all right, well, now that guy could be the missing link to our team. Do you get the sense that there's a belief that better things could be coming if they drag this thing into the season? So let's go back to the beginning of this. So I was told by a Blazers, and Cronin put this out there himself, right,

that they want to start level trade. And so I talked to a source about that. And they brought up, Gobert, Durant and Donovan Mitchell, right? Well, first of all, I think everyone believes Minnesota gave up too much for Gobert, right? Oh, yeah. I mean, right? So you're not going to get that.

That's one. No one believes that Dame is Kevin Durant. So you're probably not going to get that. And I even think there there was an overpay, but whatever, it's Durant. Donovan Mitchell is an interesting one because I think it was three first, maybe a swap, and then you got Lowry, but Lowry wasn't trained as a future All-Star. Lowry was traded as this guy hasn't reached his potential. We'll throw him in there with Colin Sexton, right?

But I said to this person, I said all these things this person, and I said Donovan Mitchell was 26. And now you brought up Paul George. Paul George was 27. It is fascinating to me that it seems like a lot of people in Portland, and I deal with this on Twitter all the time, and maybe even the Blazers, want to ignore that Lillan is 33. A 33-year-old point guard who doesn't play defense owed $216 million over four years,

who just came off a calf injury, who before that had surgery. Now, he just had his best season ever probably, but we all know that when the wall hits, it hits. And so I feel like everyone on this side of the world wants way too much for him. I think that that's part of the problem. So now, if you go into the season thinking,

well, we're going to wait, we're going to wait out Miami, and we're going to see, you know, if someone comes up with something better, you're asking a team to beat whatever it is, people want to mix a match for what Miami's offer is, to beat that, right? And to do so for a guy, who I just said, four years, $260 million, who does not want to play for you and has made that clear. So who's going to roll the dice on that?

I don't know. Then you risk, are you going to play them? Okay, so if you play him, is he going to tweak something? Hamstring, quad, ankle, calf again. Does that hurt his value? heaven forbid he has a serious injury and you're stuck with him and now he's 34 next season coming off a serious injury so then what do you get for him so it seems like a massive roll of the dice for me now some people brought up well brooklyn didn't give up durrant right away right but brooklyn with

karee and durrant in theory were contenders and they should have contended if kairie hadn't forced his way out blazers have no chance to win whatsoever there's no incentive there to say we're going to bring game back and maybe we'll contend no you're going to be bad because you've done nothing really to improve the team. So I just don't understand the risk there. And I feel like overall, they're chasing something that's not going to be there. See, that's where I diverge a little bit from you, because I don't know that something is going to be there. But I do believe that even with the risk that you laid out there of bringing Dame to camp, maybe he regresses as a player, maybe suffers another injury, those would be catastrophic to his trade value. But if he still

plays and looks like the Damien Lillard we've seen over the last couple of years, where he's been an all-NBA caliber player. If he's still that guy, I believe that because I, you know, I was just the other day making out my Western Conference standings. And I was talking to a GM of one of the teams that I was ranking. And I said, look, I've had you as high as third at one point. And now I've got you 10th or 11. That's how competitive I think the Western Conference playoffs is going to be next year.

We're only going to have two, maybe three teams that aren't competitive. competing for a playoff for a play in spot in the West. I'm of the belief that when we get into the season and if Lillard is still Lillard, there's going to be somebody else out there that competes for them, for him rather. And Aaron, I think that's all the Blazes really need. They need somebody else. Not necessarily to go out there and be the team they trade him to, but somebody to be competition that Miami gets wind of.

Right now, Miami believes correctly it is the only game in town. It's the only team out there that is pursuing Damien Lillard. with any kind of seriousness. I think Portland just needs one other team to emerge into that group. Somebody else to sniff around, whether it's Oklahoma City, a team I wrote about earlier in the week that might potentially have some interest in the next couple of months. Philadelphia, we have no idea what Darrell Morey's going to do, but we know he'll do anything to keep Joel Embed happy.

I think Portland just needs somebody to get into the mix. And I think they're doing the right thing at not just pulling the trigger without waiting to see who else will get into the mix. So I can buy the not pulling the trigger thing, but I don't, but my problem is you're not even really holding the gun. Right. There's no, there's no talks going, so we don't really know exactly what it is someone else has to be or what it is Miami is going to have to raise its ante to if another team steps in. So I don't, I don't necessarily disagree with what you're saying, but at the same time, if the Blazers had just engaged and been more proactive, maybe we could have a better sense of what it would even take to force Miami's hand or to beat what Miami's. is offering. Also, if we're talking about bringing in teams into this that have only a small

chance of contending, they're going to run the huge risk of alienating Damien to the point where he's not going to want to be there because he doesn't want to go to a lateral situation or a mediocre situation after giving the Blazers his loyalty and trusting that they were going to build around him. He wants to go to the foreshore can't miss contending situation at the very least, and he believes that's Miami. So I don't know how many teams are going to want to get involved. if he's looking at, I'm going, dude, we're not going to win. Why do I want to come play for you? Because then you're running a risk.

So, I mean, we'll see. It worked out for the Nets, right? They kept Durant. Durant played well. The team played well. They got a boatload for him from Phoenix. I just think it's a risk with Damien. But we'll see.

It's going to make for a fascinating run to see how that plays out. You know, a couple of things you said there, because I've read your stuff on this over the last couple of months. And you've used that word loyalty that Lillard has shown to the organization. I don't know if I'd call it that, honestly. I mean, I was there in Vegas when they gave him that contract extension. And yes, it was on the surface Damien Lillard committing to the trailblazers. But it was also Damian Lillard in his late 30s getting a guarantee of $100 million

tacked onto his deal. And that's, you know, there are not altruistic reasons. I don't know if he would have gotten an extension somewhere else. Look, I think you think he could have gotten an extension. extension elsewhere or would think you would have gotten that money elsewhere? If he would have forced to trade somewhere else and said, let's say he wasn't going to and forced to trade last summer and said, I want to go to a team that I want to want to me. We have a chance to contend. And by the way, I want extension. Why wouldn't people step up

with an extension? If people are allegedly willing to take him on now with the extension, it doesn't make sense to me that a team will take him on knowing it's got to pay him $62 million when he's 66, when he's 36, but those same teams wouldn't give him this extension had they traded for him last year. So he's, he's going to. He's going to get close to that money anyway. I mean, there isn't a team, like, there isn't a team right now looking to give him, there isn't a team interested in that contract at the moment, which tells me there probably wouldn't have been a team interested in that contract,

you know, if you hit grades. Miami's interested. Miami's interested in it. Miami's, but they're one out of 30 right there, one out of 29, I guess, that would be interested. I mean, there's no other team out there that's interesting. I'm just saying I think. But you just said if they play the season, teams are going to show up wanting them. Well, I think teams, and again, I use Oklahoma City as an example,

because they have a boatload of draft picks and young players, and they could, I mean, I kind of love the idea of Lillard, Shea, Gildes Alexander, Lou Dort, kind of a three-man rotation in Oklahoma City. I kind of get giddy thinking about what that could look like. But a small market team that has no chance of ever getting a player like Damien Lillard, somebody like that that could, you know, say, all right, his contract is bad, but for us, maybe it's not quite so bad because we couldn't get them at that type of deal anyway. We're willing to roll the dice in that particular situation.

I just think that- And you give up four first and two young players? I mean, they've got 9,000 first. I'm using Oklahoma City as the example. Oklahoma City can't, they can't use all these picks, Aaron. They've got too many. And all these young players who are nice, cheap, inexpensive talent are about to become not so cheap talent with that organization.

They're just an example I'm kind of throwing out there. I just think Lillard, yes, he did show a degree of loyalty to Portland, but he got something out of it too. He also got $100 million on the back end of that deal. I got to respond to that. Okay. Okay. I have a problem when people bring up the money.

The money is just a part of the game. Like they're all going to get paid. It's not like it was he can leave somewhere and not get paid and stay in Portland and get paid. Was he not going to get any money for the last two years at 35, 36? I think he was. Was he going to get that? You think he would have gotten that much money?

That's a lot. No, not necessarily that much. Plus, I don't think another team could have given him that much because he would have left and that would have changed the dynamics of what he could get. So yeah, he made extra money by signing. But then we're saying that he only stayed because of that extra. So he's going to make $500 million by staying. But had he left, he only would have made $460.

Like I think he would take $460 and a chance to win and then $500 and not win. But he could have left several different times or forced to trade at several different junctures before that extension. 100%. And he didn't have to give Cronin a guy who didn't have to really, well, he didn't have to go through a search and be picked, who had no experience. He didn't have to trust him. He didn't have to trust Chauncey, who had never been a head coach before. He didn't have to do a lot of things. He wanted so badly and wants so badly just to have a chance in Portland that I don't buy for a second that loyalty wasn't a factor.

Of course, money. I mean, shoot, you put $112 million for two years in front of me. I'll go, you know, I'll go cover PetSmart down the road and update people on their biscuits this week for Rover. But at the end of the day, for his totality of his career, how many years has it been since people started saying he should get out of there? Like four or five years now? Oh, many. Look, he has shown, in the past, I agree with you 100%. When people were telling him to demand a trade, he was saying, no, I'm committed to Portland.

I want to win a championship Portland. He 100% showed loyalty back then when he was in his late 20s, even early 30s. I just think when you get to that point where last summer he was 32 years old and he's looking at the possibility of tacking on $100 million. Look, this is the landscape we're in right now, Aaron, where you go back to Carmelo Anthony, where he didn't want to be a Nick, but he won that fifth year. So he signed back with the Knicks. Bradley Beale had no interest. being a wizard for life. He signed on that deal because he wanted to get the contract money when he's in when he's in his 30s. I think that a big part of that was Lillard making sure

he got those last couple of years and those big dollars on that contract. But this is the, situation that we're in right now. So let's just jump to topic number two, which is how likely is it that we get to early October Media Day and Damien Lillard is at. media day, a member of the Portland Trailblazers, how comfortable do you think the Blazers are going to be bringing Lillard into camp? I, after months of believing it wasn't going to happen, I'm going to believe that it's absolutely going to happen unless we start hearing that there's actual movement and talk. Like, unless some news comes out that there's more engagement, there's more activity, this team

might be getting in, so-and-so is interested in Hero, et cetera, et-cetera, then As of right now, I'm planning on Dane being there on Media Day and being a training camp. To me, it's just amazing that we're in mid-September and we're still talking about this. And so why wouldn't it take a few more weeks given the fact that nothing has been moving for two months? So I'm completely flipped my stance on this, and I'm preparing for him to be there. Yeah, I'm kind of with you because every time I talk to, you know, people with teams that, I think might have interest in Damien Lillard. I hear nothing about actual interest.

I hear no interest whatsoever. And like you, I don't hear any kind of movement with the Miami and the Portland situation. I think we get to early October. And, you know, Damien Lillard is there. And look, I think he's going to show up.

I mean, I don't, and I'm with you. I think you've written the same thing. Like, you know, the idea that Lillard, like he wants to go to Miami clearly. But the idea if he got traded somewhere that he would no show, I don't buy that.

The idea if he's still with Portland, he would no show. I don't buy that. He's too professional. Like he's just been this guy and you know this. Like he does not want to exit Portland on bad terms. I mean, how important you think that is to him, like his reputation amongst fans and people that follow the organization?

You know, it's beyond really words how committed and dedicated he's been to this community and how desperately he won a chance to contend here. but he saw his biological clock ticking on his prime and it just forced his hand because he he made it clear that he just wants a chance to win in portland like if you just gave him a team where he was going to win like 47 games and if they got into the playoffs if they played really well they could surprise people which which especially in the era now where there's no super team right there's no dominant heat the heedles or anything like that running around we just saw the two playing teams get to the conference finals one to the finals right so that's where the league is right now

That's all he wanted. But Portland's not even coming close to giving him that. So that's where it's just forcing him where it's like, well, I'm not going to stay in Portland and help raise two teenagers. Like that's not what I want to do with the last few years in my prime. I just want a chance somewhere else. But now he wants more of a guarantee chance. And I want to go back to something else that that's really important in all this,

is that when Joe Cronin took over the job up until the draft night, He had nine press conferences where he said he was committed and dedicated to building a round Dane. That was the goal. And that's what Damien heard, which was part of the reason why he signed the contract. And you say maybe it was about the money or two. But it was part of what was that. And I asked Kronin about that.

And Chris Haynes asked Dane about that. And they both talked about the commitment to winning. They have not made that commitment in Dames' timeline. They changed that. And so if I sort of feel like that, if you're going to pull the rug out from under him, which they did. And even if it's justified for whatever reason, do right by the guy and send him where he wants to go. And that's the trouble I have with that.

That's why I think they should sat down with Miami day one and said, let's figure this out. But it was clear that they thought, well, if we draft scoot and keep him, they might ask out. If he asks out, wow, what can we get for him? And that's the mistake they made because now you're treating gaming, this guy who's loyal to you like a commodity, like a piece of property that you're going to flip. You wouldn't build around him, but you'll use him to build around scoot, his replacement. So why wouldn't Dame take that personally and dig his heels in and go out with his agent and say, we're not going to play for you. We're not going to play for you. I want

to go to Miami. That's really his only leverage. But he doesn't want this to be that contentious. He wanted to just go to Miami, Portland gets some assets, and there's still that love and respect and that down the line, after his four years are up, he could come back to Portland for his last year or two, sort of like Scottie Pippen did back with the Bulls, right? And in his career that way. But it's looking like if it's contentious, that might not be the case, at least with this regime. You know, just to, we're kind of ping ponging a little bit here, but to go back to the extension that you talked about and the commitment to winning with Dame, I can just remember being there in Vegas when they announced that extension and hearing all the positive things we're going to

build around him, you know, Dame wants to be a blazer for life, all those things that went into that presser. I remember sitting there, Aaron, and thinking like, there's no way this is going to work. And maybe that's the pessimist in me. I just didn't believe it. I believe the Blazers had a ceiling and it was a much shorter ceiling than the Portland officials at that time were letting on. They were too young. They were too small. They didn't have the kind of talent that some of the other teams in the Western Conference would have. I remember sitting there thinking, you're right, right now the Blazers, even with Jeremy Grant, have themselves a playoff team maybe. They don't have anything that would get them out of the first round. And we've seen as great as Dame is, even when he's been as best, it's only. have been good for one conference finals. And that has as much to do with the talent around him as anything else. But I always thought that the idea that they could build around Lillard to a championship level was always just so pie in the sky. It's why, and even like after Dame made that trade request, when Joe Cronin issued that statement where he said like, he almost sounded shocked by it. Like we're trying to do like, why would you be shocked at this point? Why would

you be surprised that this didn't go as planned? This team never to me, had enough talent to compete with the big dogs in the Western Conference. Okay, so you're right. At that point, they didn't. But when Cronin took over, he had a plan that ran through the summer of 2023. It was a year and a half plan. So at that point,

we're only six months into it. They did get Jeremy Grant, which was a good move because you turned CJ, who was really redundant with Dame and Ant, into at least a 6.8 guy, who was similar to CJ, but gave you some length, gave you better defense. So that was a move in the right direction.

You tank, so you got Shaden, which was nice, although the original goal was to trade that pick for a veteran guy. They targeted OG, but it didn't work out. And so coming to the next season, they felt like either a trade deadline move or something else near the draft or in the offseason would be to find the next piece.

It turned out that things fell apart. And so they got a high draft pick, and that was the nugget. Flip that pick into that dude. That was supposed to be the plan. So, yeah, on the surface, it looked like, yeah, this is going to be tough. But when you got that lottery pick, that should have made it easier.

The problem is the lottery pick ended up being too good and the offers were not quite reaching the bar for Cronin. And so he shifted gears. But I do believe that had they been able to find trade partners for number seven last year and number three this year, they could have acquired the veterans they needed to help Lillard at least again have a shot. Like it's just a matter of just get me in there and give me some vets, give me some length.

I mean, my God, give me some, some, some, some, one other star I can lean on. And then let me be the determining factor as to whether we win or lose, as opposed to I got score 55 at Denver and we still lose because I'm pretty much all of them. Yeah. Hey, look, if they had gotten OG out of Nobie, even then, I don't think they were much of a contender. It would have been a more of a better short-term fix than Shaden Sharp is. I don't think Shaden Sharp is going to be a pretty good player. I just still didn't see them as a contender. So the final topic I want to get into, though, is about Portland's future.

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, it would have been OG. and the sharp deal and then someone else with the next pit. So it wasn't just OJ. It would have been signed. Right. If they got, what were they penciled in for? Like fifth or sixth? What was their draft slot if they didn't move up to fifth?

Yeah. And that would have been easier to trade. You can't trade the number three pick if it's going to be Scoot Henderson. You can't do it. I think Scoot is. But, yeah. I mean, look, but if Scoot, I think Scoot's going to make that Brandon Miller pick look stupid. I think Scoot is really, really good.

I got a chance to watch him a lot last year playing for the G-League Ignite. I think he's going to be special. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year.

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I mean, what are realistic expectations for Scoot Henderson this year? Because Aaron, I think he's the rookie of the year. I know a lot of people are pointed at Chet Holmgren. Some people might be pointing at Victor Wenbenyama, Brandon Miller upshore, has his fans. I think Scoots the guy. I think Scoot's going to step into that starting spot, assuming Lillard has moved at some point, right away, and take over. look like the transcendent player that Portland believes it's getting.

So I've set the bar pretty high for Scoot Henderson. What do you think the bar should be for Scoot? So first of all, he's not going to start of Danes here. Yeah. He's not going to be a rick of the year of Danes here. Right? Yeah, you're right. I mean, I'm assuming at some point a deal gets done.

So Dave has to be traded for Scoot to have a chance to do any of those things you just mentioned. But let's just pretend Dame's gone for the sake of argument here. I've been told, and I've had this conversation a couple of times, that he's not he's got to beat out anthony simon and that's not a given and if he doesn't beat out aunt and answer to starting one the only way scooke can start is if they decide well we'll move an to the two if scoots beating out shady so he has to beat out both of the guys to start unless the blazers just say we're going to start him and he's the third pick and there's all his controversy over

him basically pushing dame out the door they make that decision they make that decision but as of right now there's no legitimate argument on the planet that he's better than anthony Anthony Syros doesn't play in the G-League last year and average 16 points on 42 and 27 shooting. He averaged just 35 on 55 and 45 shoot, right? So, it's way ahead of scoot. And my problem was scoot in the whole, and all the transcendent, like the whole, and I'm not dogging you, it's just when I think it almost means Godlike. You know, this whole generation, I'm not even sure what that means anymore. It seems like generational means once every three years and not as opposed to once every 20.

It's just bizarre to me. But you're dealing with a 19-year-old point guard who's 6-2 who can't shoot yet. He had in 19 G-League games last year, he shot under 40 percent nine times. He turned the ball over a lot. People talk about his defense. He had a 118 defense rating. I just can't fathom that this kid is going to walk into the NBA and be this transcendent dominant guy out of the gate when he wasn't even out of the G-League.

Like if he's that good, why was he destroying the G-G? Now you can say the teammates around him, the situation, coaching, whatever you want to say. But that's, we're asking for him to make a huge jump in order to be better than Shaden. It's already bigger, a better shooter, and more experience. We watched Shaden average 24, 6, and 6 over the last 10 games last year while shooting 46 and 38 from the field. I've watched Anthony Simons carry this team to wins by scoring 40 plus. I've seen him get 11 assists twice. When Dan was out two years ago, he had this team playing so well that they had to shut him down with a magic interest.

shut down Nurk with a magic injury because they were in danger of making the play it. So I've seen Ant do it at that level. So for me right now, Ant and Sharp, that's your starting backward, unless you just decide we're just to give it to Scoot for the sake of giving it to the scoop. So Scoot to me has a long way to go to get to the point where I'm going to buy that this guy is that dude. And one of them, you have to shoot in this league. You agree with that, right?

I do. I do. I go 5 for 15 every other game. No, it's definitely a weakness in his game as he comes to the NBA, the three-point shot is not there for him. I do think the playmaking is going to be there. Obviously, the athleticism is there. I just think that feel when I watch him play, I think that feel for the game is there. It's an intangible, but I think he's got that thing that all great players tend to have. And I think he's going to show that at some point over the next couple of years. So I think he's

going to be a really good player. The question I would have, after some years, I agree. I'm talking about this year. Yeah, yeah. I mean, like, well, rookie the year. I mean, I don't know if he needs to average 25 to win rookie the year. I think Chet's going to have a good year. I think Webbanyama is going to struggle. on what Brandon Miller is going to do. Maybe somebody emerges from that back half of the top 10 that plays well also. You mentioned Simons. I'm curious what the Blazers' opinion of him is, because he's a very good player, but he also has a very good contract. He's the kind of guy you could trade to get something else. Do they look at Simons as being part of that future? They drafted Sharp, of course, he's one of their

guys. Do they see Simons along that same line? Yeah, Simon's is an interesting piece of all this, because in addition to trading the lottery pick, the idea is that you were going to trade and some other picks to get even another guy. That's why I thought about the point. The vision and the idea was there. Just nothing got executed, right? Because that could have been another play

you could have brought in to help this whole situation. But they weren't necessarily able to move him. And nothing incentivized them to unlock future picks because they owe the bulls the first round pick, right? Which I believe wholeheartedly, without a doubt, that they know that's going to be a lottery pick. So you don't want to have. you don't want to do anything to where you give them that pick outright so you can unlock other picks

and then you end up in the lottery because it's lottery protected, right? So, but the problem now is that what was the problem with Dame and CJ? Like I preached this for years. You're never going to contend when your best two players are small guard. Only one team's ever done it. And that was the bad boy pistons. And they were backed by the greatest front court defensively ever, right? So unless you're going to accumulate that, it's not going to happen.

So finally they move CJ and who they start? And who's basically a more athletic version of CJ and not a very good defender. So now you go out and you get Scoot, who's 19, and you still have Ant, and even if you move Dan, you're still redundant there. And you got, so to me, you need to move at some point if Scoot and Shaden are your guys in the back court. Otherwise, you're going to end up paying a lot of money to three guys, and there's going to be some redundancy there, and you're still way too small.

There's not the only viable player on this team, other, NERC's viable. There's two players on this roster over 6'6 for a viable. You can't win like that. It's not a six-four and under league, right? So to me, they need to start and showcase aunt and move in. Anne needs to be running his own team. And if I'm Ann and you tell me a scoot better and play scoot ahead of me, whether he's earned it or not, he's going to ask for a trade.

He doesn't want to spend his career backing up this kid when he probably is better than him. So the ad situation is fascinating. But he's a really good offensive player. I still think he's coming to his own. One of the things last year that hurt him, and people said, oh, he regress. He didn't regress. It's difficult playing next to game. Well, you're not sure what you're supposed to be doing.

Am I the two guard? Am I the point guard? Now, Dame's going to be the two guard. I'm acquiescing to him, but then they want me to be aggressive. Like, it's a tough situation. But when he was the guy, dude was amazing that one year. So he needs to be running his own team. Yeah, I think it's a fascinating.

I love me some hands. I get a little passionate about him. No, no, look, I think he's a great player. I think they've got a lot of really good young players down there. And I think they're up there. I think they're going to have a bright, future. It's when does that future start? Right? You've got Damien Lillard under contract. You had Jeremy Grant, which still don't quite understand that. I don't, I just, for the life of me,

let's do this quickly. Let's do it as quickly. Like, for the life of me, that's one of the most bizarre contracts I've ever seen. Like, there was no, no, as far as I know, there was nobody else out there looking to invest that kind of money in Jeremy Grant. I don't think they were in any kind of real danger of losing Jeremy Grant. And the fact that they do this deal, what was it, 24 hours, 40 hours before Lillard makes his trade request was wild to me. It was just completely wild to me that now as a rebuilding team, they have this contract on their books that I think, Aaron, is going to be, I don't say impossible, but incredibly difficult to get off. What do you think the Blazers are looking at right now with this this grant contract and how they handle his situation yeah so grant came to

the park and it was it was a given that you know grant would stay and help win with dame but when things became shaky with dame after draft night it was like okay so what are you going to do with grant but they went ahead and made the offer because they knew that the first step to keeping dame happy was signing grant but to me you had to double clutch that bad boy and come back and with a trade because just being in grant then you're that status quo that's where you were game was wanting to other dudes

with grant right and then you could pay them like you could always were in the driver's team with grant because you've given the extra year and given more money than anyone else now I think grant on the open market still gets four years 100 if they ain't yeah if gillin brooks and get four years 20 or whatever oh yeah I think you know

but if I'm grand I can get five one 50 160 was it 160 I can't remember when it was. I'm taking that. Over 150, yeah. Yeah. So now, yeah, you're Portland. You started this timeline with two kids who can't buy alcohol. That's at least grants around, I guess, to buy drinks on the road.

I don't know because he's 29. You're going to be paying him 30 million a year until he's 34. It doesn't make any sense. I have zero doubt whatsoever that they're going to begin trying to, like, to me, I'm trying to feed him early this season and see if someone will come get him because he doesn't fit what they're doing at all. He fits Dane, not scoot and shade. And it doesn't make any sense.

The entire thing is completely good. dysfunctional. So you said you were in Vegas. Do you remember when I asked the question? Are people think you might be tanking? But this looks like you're trying to win. What's the plan here? Which I got criticized for asking that. But it was an obvious question to me. And Cronin insisted we have a high talent level we think we're going to win. And I'm thinking, really? Do you really think you're going to win? I mean, at best, at best, it's 13th in the West right now. At best, you know, competing with Houston and with with San Antonio for those bottom three spots. And that was another thing I mentioned, because I'm like, is it more advantageous to give another lottery pick?

Because you have to keep pace with Oklahoma City and Houston who are not only laughing you in young talent, but they have young talent over 6'6. All over the place. All over the place. And in this league, length, tight, athleticism, matter. You don't have it. It's just, look, I started covering the NBA when I was living in Boston. and I've said this before, but I, you know, the GM that I covered the closest early on was Danny age.

And there's no more proactive GM in sports than Danny Age. Like Danny Age, if he doesn't believe his team is going to win a championship or can compete for a championship, there's no sense having a team like that. You know, it doesn't matter making the first round second one of the playoffs. It does the nets trade. Look, he goes to Utah, pushes the Donovan Mitchell deal through, like blows that thing up. And both the teams that he did that with Boston, who picked up Tatum and Brown because of that, and now Utah, which is in a pretty good position at the moment,

to kind of rebuild that thing moving forward. You remember when Danny was supposedly talking to the Blazers about their top job for a minute, or at least was rumored to be talking to them. I just thought to myself, if Danny Aange takes that job when Joe Cronin took that job, he would have detonated that roster within months. He would have blown the whole thing up,

ripped it down to the studs, and then rebuilt the ways rebuilt teams in the past, which may have been the right call, you know, dealing away Dane before you give him a contract extension and starting the whole thing over. I don't know. That's kind of where the blazer at. But I'll say this much, Aaron, your readership is going to quadruple in the next few months if Damien Lillard is still

on that roster. There's going to be a fascination with how that team looks in training camp, how Lillard responds, how the team responds to him, what kind of offers come to the table. You're going to have a very busy at least first few months. I appreciate you joining me here, Aaron. Good luck as training camps open up. Football is back in full swing with another epic week of games. got you covered in the action for every single one of them, Draft King Sportsbook, an official sports betting partner of the NFL. New customers can bet $5 on football and get $200 instantly

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help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smygle and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all,

embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying.

Yep, that's me. Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Cliver Show. This is a place for raw,

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