The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Best of The Herd: 05/27/2019

Episode Date: May 27, 2019

Colin clears up the narrative that Kevin Durant and LeBron James have killed the competition level within the NBA, it's been happening for the last 70 years without you even knowing. History may repeat itself during the upcoming NBA finals with the 2019 Toronto Raptors resembling the 2010-11 Dallas Mavericks champions. Professional mobility can leave you always feeling left out just like Kevin Durant with the Golden State Warriors, and don't miss a Monday special edition of: "Where Colin was Right & Wrong."Guest: Dan Woike - Los Angeles Times Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. I'm Michelle McPhee, and I've been unraveling the strangest criminal alliance I've ever reported on, a Mormon polygamist, and an Armenian businessman.

Multi-million dollar house, Ferrari's and Lamborghinis, private jets, a billion-dollar fraud. But how long can this alliance last? Tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Listen to Kingdom of Fraud

on the I-Heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Life is full of hurdles. So how do you keep going? On Hurtle with Emily Abadi, we're talking with the most inspiring women in sports and wellness from professional athletes, coaches, and Olympic champions about the challenges that shape them and the mindset that keeps them moving forward. At our level, at this scale, being able to fail in front of the entire world.

Like, I can do anything. I can do anything. Listen to Hurtle with Emily Abadi on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of I Heart Women's Sports. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened.

That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to SportsSlic.

On the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman

help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs, banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening to The Best of Heard podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday.

From 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1, find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio. com or stream us live every day on the iHeart Radio app by searching Heard. This is the best of the herd with Colin Cowher on Fox Sports Radio. Ah, here we go. Memorial Day. This is the herd, wherever you may be, however you may be listening. We're on IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS1. One hour from now where Colin was right and where Colin was wrong, we have plenty of both.

Joy Taylor is joining me on this Memorial Day. Joy, how are you? I'm great. Happy Memorial Day, everyone. Happy Memorial Day, everybody. I really like today's show. You know, I've found over the course of my lifetime, people decide what they like and they'll nitpick stuff they don't like. Obviously, we all support stuff we like, but you'll nitpick stuff you don't like.

Republican will always find a way to nitpick a Democrat and a Democrat will always find a way to find the imperfections in the conservative party. It's the way it is. Just be honest. Some of you don't like the NBA. Be honest. You just don't like it. That's fine. But stop using the there's no parity in this league argument.

The final four teams were a team from Canada, small market Portland, small market Milwaukee. That's not parity. If you love college football, want to make a bet Alabama Clemson play for the championship. Again. But you like college football. So you, oh, yeah, I love. Same teams. year. Now, I just happen to like college football and I like the NBA. But I was thinking about

this morning, we have this narrative now that Kevin Durant ruined this league. It's so great. Everybody was having a chance to win and Kevin Durant came around. Now it's Kevin Durant's fall. Yeah, nonsense. I went back to 1949. That's 70 years in the NBA. 70. Lakers 16 championship, Celtics 17. 70 championships. Two teams. That would be like if Bama and Clemson went another 25 years. By the way, in the 80s,

Lakers got to the Western Conference final all but two years. In the 60s, it was the Celtics and everybody else. Michael Jordan's Bulls won six titles. In the 90s, it would have been eight if he didn't decide he wanted to go hit a curveball and single A or double A baseball.

I'm going to give you two stats that are fairly remarkable. And they will not include LeBron James, because there's another guy that gets blamed for moving around to new teams and killing the parody. Listen to these two. In the last 21 finals, that's over two decades. Kobe, Tim Duncan, D. Wade and Steph have been in 21 straight finals. And I'm not even counting LeBron. Those four guys have taken part in the last 21 finals. Oh, no, no, that's not even the best stat.

In the last 62 years, 54 of the last 62 NBA finals have had these five men involved. Red Arbock, Phil Jackson, Pat Riley, Greg Popovich, and Steve Kerr. 87%. And you think Kevin Durant and LeBron because they chose cities are hurting the league? It's nonsense. Katie didn't ruin anything. The NBA is set up for dominance. It's got the fewest starters.

By the way, college basketball, even with the one and done, the top two and three seeds dominate. Go look at the last 30 champions. It's mostly the same teams, rare outliers. But in baseball, pitching dominates the sport. And pitching arms get injured a lot. They get fatigued. Chris Sale, nobody could hit him last year.

Chris Sale for the Red Sox this year can't get anybody out. Can't get anybody out. And his ERA has doubled. That's what happens to pitcher's arms. That doesn't happen to Steph's arm. That doesn't happen to Clay Thompson's arm. That doesn't happen to Kevin Durant's arm. In football, injuries really help parity.

Even now we have a current NFL dynasty. But Carson Wentz goes down. Generally, you don't have a Nick Foles to win it for you. So when I look at the NBA, just admit it. The same college football fan who bemoans the lack of parity, we're going to get Alabama and Clemson again this year. The final four in the NBA was Portland. I haven't seen them in a Western Conference Finals in a long time.

Milwaukee? Good Lord, when's the last time you saw them in the Eastern Conference Finals? Toronto's now in the finals. That doesn't happen. And Golden State. Sometimes, just admit it Democrats and Republicans. You're going to nitpick the other party. You're imperfect, but you kind of glaze and gloss over the stuff about your party

to find the stuff to nitpick the other people. If you don't like the NBA, that's fine. Stop with a parody argument. It's never had it. And it used to be worse. Check out the 60s and the 80s and the 90s. All right, we have a final in the NBA. Let's shift gears.

It's Kauai Leonard and the Raptors. and they will take on whoever is starting Steph Curry and the Warriors. I like Golden State. I think everybody likes Golden State in this series. But we have a precedence here. We have a precedent for an upset. The Dallas Mavericks against the Miami Heat. Now let's go back and remember what the Dallas Mavericks were.

They had the components to win a championship. They had one go-to star, Dirk Novitsky. There was never any doubt where the Dallas Mavericks. Mavericks. Who was taking the shot? For Miami, Bosch, Wade, LeBron, Ray Allen, little indecision. Not with Dallas. Dallas had an excellent head coach. No indecision. Late in possessions. Smart veteran players all over the rosters. Absolutely no drama. And do you remember? These two teams played twice in the regular season, Dallas and Miami. Dallas won both. So let's look at the Toronto Raptors.

Excellent head coach. They come in like Dallas as massive underdogs. There's absolutely no drama with this team. Like Dallas, they have nothing but smart veteran KG players. There is no indecision who to give the ball to at the end of games or possessions. And oh, by the way, they played the Warriors twice this year in the regular season. Oh, and they won both. we have a precedent.

These are the Dallas Mavericks. Now, I'll still take Golden State. But don't kid yourself. Talent doesn't always win in this league. Dallas, like these Raptors, one star, good coach, lots of veterans, the star with no indecision, late possessions, had beaten them in the regular season. And that Dallas team had Jason, Kid, and Tyson Chandler and Sean Marion and all,

these veterans and this team's got Mark Gassall. They got him at the trading deadline. It's Kyle Lauer. It's Serge Abottkitts, Danny Green. By the way, Vegas heavily favors the Warriors, but they do expect a six-game series. And I expect a five to a six-game series. Now, here's something else these Raptors have in common with the Dallas Mavericks. And right now, a Raptor fan watching me. It's like, hey, Collins on our side. He likes us.

Well, here's the problem. When Dallas won that championship, nobody talked about it outside of Dallas. Because that was all about LeBron winning his first title or LeBron losing a championship. And if Toronto

wins this series, remember, all champions are not equally interesting. If Toronto wins this championship, it is not going to be about the Raptors. It's going to be about Golden State, either wins the title, another one, or they gagged

as a heavy favorite. You have to understand this. Not all champions are interesting. Andre Agassiz, Serena Williams, are a lot more interesting than Pete Sampras. I'm looking at the ratings a couple of weekends ago at the PGA championship.

Brooks Kepka. It was the lowest rating in 20-some years. He's just not that interesting. He just happens to be great. So much like the Mavericks, even if the Raptors win, the immediate story will be about the Warriors and the second story will it be about

will Toronto's best player leave and go west. But you won't care. You'll be in Canada. You'll have won. Then you'll start rebuilding. but there is a precedent for this, and I do think we'll have a feisty series because the Mavericks and the Raptors have several components necessary to make it interesting.

Good coach, underdog, resilient veterans, superstar with no indecision, latent possessions, and they beat that team twice and the only two times they played in the regular season. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd, weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect.

We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levant, this went to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history.

You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Life throws hurdles big and small. The question is, how do you conquer them? On Hurtle with Emily Abadi, we sit down with the most inspiring women in sports and wellness, professional athletes, coaches, and Olympic champions to talk about the challenges that shaped them and the mindset that keeps them going. From the WNBA standout, Kate Martin and rising hockey star Layla Edwards.

A boy can do it. I don't see why a girl can't. Like, I've never understood that. Like, it didn't make sense in my brain. It's hard to be in spaces that no one looks like you, but don't ever feel like you don't belong. Don't let that be the reason you don't do it. An Olympic champs Gabby Thomas and Katie Ledecki. The ability to show a gold medal to someone

and have their face light up and smile, that means the world to me. And that's what motivates me to win more gold medals. At our level, at this scale, like being able to fail in front of the entire world, like, I can do anything. I can do anything. Because resilience isn't just about winning. It's about showing up, even when it's hard.

Listen to Hurtle with Emily Abadi on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHart Women's Sports. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves,

their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports slice brings you closer to the action, with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist,

Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing

and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch life becomes about wins and losses Steve Burns, Dustin Ross because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth or are you a good person because you're afraid

because that's two different intentions bro absolutely and that's two different levels of trust I want you to just really be a good person Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app, search Learn the Hardway, and listen now. Warren Buffett's a legendary investor, and he always talks about every generation is going to have a better life than the previous generation, better health care, better travel. I was somebody that grew up. I struggled early, but I never enjoyed the struggle.

My struggle was real. And then I started getting what I would call professional mobility. I moved around the country. And the upside to it is that you can join really cool companies, companies with momentum, companies that have already gone through the initial struggle of growth. And it's a great life. I've joined companies that are established,

companies that are good, That is the upside to upward mobility. That's the upside to professional mobility. You know, like at Fox, I came here. I didn't have to deal with the Simpson years when they were just starting mid-early 90s when they just got the NFL and Best Damn Sports Show. And they were young and they were experimenting and they weren't the company they are today. And I joined the company and it's formed and it's profitable and it's got good management.

and it's stable and it's like, yeah, it's been great. But the downside to that is you kind of feel like you're a little bit of an outsider. You don't get the inside company joke. It's like they have a private handshake at some of these companies and I'm not involved. The downside to professional mobility is you don't go to the 4th of July, you know, party in your neighborhood like everybody else has for 68 straight years. you're in another part of the country. And I will admit, part of me is jealous about that. I don't get that moving around the country.

Kevin Durant is a classic example of mobility. Now, the upside to his mobility, he joined a really good team. They'd already gone through the Monte Ellis Steff trade. They had the coach and Steve Kerr. They had the young players. So he didn't have to go through the early struggle. of Golden State. Not like they were terrible, but there were struggles. They moved through a coach. They moved through some players and there's a lot of controversy trading Mondaella.

And Kevin Mike, he didn't have to deal with that. The struggle wasn't real. He just caught on the surfboard when they were already riding that wave. And this weekend, he was at a press conference and they were talking about the team and he said this. How have you thought about their playing? Our play? Yeah, yeah. Sorry about that. I think we've been playing great. Do you feel like there is that, you know, a split where it's like you and them? Most definitely. I mean, it's been that way since I got here as the Warriors and KD, you know what I'm saying? And I understand that. And I felt like my teammates and the organization

know exactly what I've done. But I also know that a lot of people on the outside, you know, don't like to see us together. And I get it. Kauai is embraced as the new guy because he's giving Canada something they've never had and he was traded there. Whereas Kevin Durant, Golden State won before him, after him, and he's seen as more of a mercenary. And neither one of these is necessarily right. Yes, it's great that Derek, Jeter, and Kobe stayed with the same team. Yeah, it's easy when you're the Lakers in the 90s and beyond, and you're the New York Yankees.

But if Derek Jeter started in Kansas City or Pittsburgh, they probably wouldn't have been able to afford him, and Derek Jeter would have moved to the Yankees of the Red Sox. I'm not saying upward mobility is better. I'm saying there are two ways to do this in life and in sports and in your professional career. Stay with the same company forever and go through the struggles and the roller coaster. And it is perhaps more pure. And you will have these bonds and these lifetime relationships that are just a mile deep and worthwhile. And they resonate your entire life.

You stay in your hometown. Those high school reunions are real. And then there's the people that bounce around the country. And they don't have to go through a lot of those struggles. But they're not quite as deeply embedded in the community, in the company, and they don't get invited to the same Memorial Day barbecue or Fourth of July barbecue that family does. I'm not saying either is right. there are great substantial psychological emotional benefits to both.

But what Kevin Duran is experiencing is actually, and I know he's a superstar, but it's something many of you watching and listening today, have experienced, and it's real. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back.

Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levant this plant to a billion-dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, Just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me?

Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Life throws hurdles big and small. The question is, how do you conquer them? On Hurtle with Emily Abadi, we sit down with the most inspiring, women in sports and wellness, professional athletes, coaches, and Olympic champions to talk about the challenges that shaped them and the mindset that keeps them going. From the WMBA standout, Kate Martin, and rising hockey star Layla Edwards. If a boy can do it, I don't see why a girl can't. Like,

I've never understood that. Like, it didn't make sense in my brain. It's hard to be in spaces that no one looks like you, but don't ever feel like you don't belong. Don't let that be the reason you don't do it. An Olympic champs, Gabby Thomas and Katie Ladeke. The ability to show a gold medal to someone and have their face light up and smile, that means the world to me. And that's what motivates me to win more gold medals. At our level, at this scale, like being able to fail in front of the entire world. Like, I can do anything. I can do anything. Because resilience isn't just about winning. It's about showing up, even when it's hard. Listen to Hurtle with Emily Abadi on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One,

founding partner of I Heart Women's Sports. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise,

breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight reel. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls,

we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kier Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health

field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it.

And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Ross because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth or are you a good person because you're afraid. Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely.

And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keir Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, learn the hard way. Open your free IHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. All right. We do it every day for those of you who have never watched our show. Monday at this time.

11 o'clock Eastern. What time is it? 10 o'clock Pacific, a 1 o'clock Eastern, whatever time that would be in Albuquerque. Colin right, Colin wrong. I tell you where I whiffed last week and where we were right last week. Here we go. Where Colin was right?

I've said this all year long. There was a poll in the middle of the NBA season. Of the three guys you'd start your franchise with, it was all centers. And I said, I'm not starting my franchise with centers in 2019. Yannis, once again, superstar Yianas, superstar Kauai. who got marginalized, the center.

They don't control the tempo. They don't have the ball in their hands. I don't ever trust the big guy late at the free throw line. And they don't shoot threes, and we've moved analytically into a three-ball league. And by the way, Janus only shot 37% in this series when Kauai guarded him. I just think basketball today. I want to build around guys who can put the ball on the deck and guys who can shoot. and even if you can't shoot like Ben Simmons,

you can get the ball to shooters. I don't believe centers are who I would build around. Where Colin was wrong. The baby dinosaurs, I was a doubter all year. I kept saying, okay, who's your second score? Who's your third? How are you going to get to the finals? You don't have, but I will say this.

The Celtics were dysfunctional. The Sixers are immature. The bucks are too young. and they are a well-coached, resilient group of adults. And it's not like they didn't have a little stress in this series. All their series, they'd lose a road game. But maturity matters. They also made a very nice move at the deadline to get Mark Gassall,

maybe gave up a tad of their depth to get him. And in the end, I was wrong. Where Colin was right? Chris Middleton. I kept saying Milwaukee, listen, I like him. He's a great story. I mean, the kid is really bad. But if he's your second best player, that doesn't feel like a finals team to me.

It certainly doesn't feel like a championship team. Well, this series, he got exposed. He scored 11, 12, 9, 30, 6, 14. That's not dependable. He only scored 15 or more once in this series. And I've said this for years in the NBA. It's not just about your star. If it's just about your star, Michael Jordan would have won every year he played,

and Mike Magic Johnson would have won every year. This league's about who's your number two. Clay Thompson I mean when Katie's healthy Steph is your number two Magic Kareem was your number two so the reality is with Chris Middleton

he may develop into a reliable two but right now on a championship team he's probably a three and that's why Milwaukee is watching the finals where Colin was wrong Kawhi Leonard I mean I always thought he was really talented but he's got an odd personality

he didn't really pass. He doesn't communicate a ton. He just never felt like a guy. He's kind of an enigma. He's a mystery. He couldn't even get along in San Antonio. Like, I'm like, everybody works in San Antonio. It's like everybody works for the Patriots, right?

And I always just saw him as kind of an odd, enigmatic, super talented guy. Well, he was great in the fourth. I said this. If you gave him Kobe's personality physically, he's the closest thing I've seen to Michael Jordan. Hands, dexterity, both. He wins, great in the fourth quarter, trustable to free throw line. There is no disputing now. He is a top, I mean, seriously, he's a top three, maybe a top two player in the NBA.

Where Colin was right? Never liked these 10-year contracts in baseball, especially when it's these Seattle, Minnesota, Cincinnati, the medium-sized markets. Sprinkle the money around. Give it to four and five different guys. Well, Robinson Canoe didn't work with Seattle. The Reds are awful. Joey Votto with that huge contract. And Minnesota's fascinating.

So this is the first year they haven't been locked in in Minnesota to Joe Mowers' contract. And what were they the previous seven years? Irrelevant. Have you noticed them this year? Best record in baseball. Ten game lead in the American League Central. I understand the Yankees paying huge money because the commerce and revenue they have, It doesn't matter for the Dodgers.

It didn't matter for, you know, the big revenue teams. But when you're a Seattle, you're a Minnesota, you're a Padres. By the way, the Angels, they're not a huge revenue team. The Angels are out of it with Mike Trout. The Reds are out of it with Votto. The twins move off Joe Mauer, sprinkle the money around, and they solve all those little issues they had. Never, ever, ever, like 10-year contracts.

I guess I would swallow it. if you're the Yankees or Red Sox maybe massive revenue, but I think they're bad for teams long term. Where Colin was wrong. Oh, I thought the Steelers drama was all over. Hold on. We got a little bit of it. Joey Porter came out this weekend on the NFL network and said,

Ben Rothesberger has power, and he uses it all for himself. I thought the drama was over. It was for three days. He said, listen. Terrell Davis on the NFL network said, listen, John Elway used to go to management. He had power. and give veterans time off because he thought they were getting beat up in practice.

Ben Rathlisberger has the kind of power in Pittsburgh to get practices off for other guys, and he doesn't. Ben's into Ben. Here's what I'll say about Rathlisberger. He's polarizing. You can find seven guys to line up behind him and seven guys to criticize him. I don't like polarizing quarterbacks. As much as I like Ben, I'm not a fan of polarizing quarterbacks.

I like my bore form. I like my Russell Wilson. I like my Andrew Luck. I like my Jared Gough. I like Tom Brady. I like boring. Ben needs to get more boring because he's in the news way too much. Where Colin was right.

One of my mottoes in sports, and kind of in life, but in sports, be aggressive. Sometimes be aggressive to a fault. If you want to be patient, get in retirement planning or chess. But in sports, be aggressive. Toronto's a great example of this. They were a number one seed, had the NBA coach of the year in an all-star and Demarge Rosen. And they blew it all up. They fired their coach.

Didn't have to. He won't coach of the year. They got rid of their star for Kauai, who's potentially a one-year rental, and they went at the trading deadline, a very good team, and they went and got Marcus Saul to give up some of their depth. They went super aggressive, and it paid off. Dwayne Casey was coach of the year. They gave him the award and then ran him out the door.

They didn't have to do that. I love it. This is a prime example. Toronto was good enough to sell out every game. They get excellent ratings. They are loved in the city. And they said, no, no, no. We're going to get aggressive here.

We're going to go for it. If you want to be patient, play chess or get into retirement planning. In sports, three words. Go for it. Toronto didn't. Was rewarded. Where Colin was wrong. I apparently like Clay Thompson way more than everybody else.

He didn't make the NBA first team. He didn't make the all NBA second team. He didn't make the all NBA third team. Let me get this straight. A plus shooter, A plus personality, A plus low drama, A plus defender, and he's a fourth team guard. I just like him more than everybody else says. Now, he had a bad December, and he wasn't great in October, but who's watching the NBA in October and early December? I mean, outside of scout, not many of us.

I still consider Clay Thompson, the one player in the NBA. There's one that fits on every team. There's not a single NBA executive. if he said a two guard, Clay Thompson, everybody would take. Everybody would not take Steph, because they have a point guard. Steph wouldn't work in Houston with the guys they have. I don't think Durant would work with everybody. But Clay works with everybody.

Quiet, shooter, defender, smart, not going to argue about minutes, and didn't make one of the first three all-MBA teams. Where Colin was right? Jay Glazer this weekend saying the Rams now have genuine control. concerns about Todd Gurley's knee. The story came out last year. They were just, you know, they weren't going to use him as much to rest him. And I just never bought into it.

I'm like, timeout. Todd Gurley, next to Ezekiel Elliott, is the best running back in the league. And all of a sudden, late October last year, he just wasn't getting the carries. And it's what I said on the Super Bowl, why I tick, even though I thought the Rams had better players than New England, I'm like, I can't go into a Super Bowl. and have no idea what's going on with Todd Gurley. Why is he on an exercise bicycle? Why did they get C.J. Anderson?

I've always been, the Rams smartly downplayed this, but my feeling was by late October, something's going on here. For the record, there were many people in the NFL that questioned why the Rams gave him that contract a year early. Rams may, according to this now, may regret it. Colin Wright, Colin Roy. on a Monday.

One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week, within the IHeart radio app. Search Hurd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Dan Wojke is a national NBA writer for the L.A. Times,

known him for some time. And now the national writer, you are in the hub of it, baby, because the clippers may lead for Kauai Leonard. And the Lakers, I think, it's a little bit of a Hail Mary, but I think they land Jimmy Butler, and that's all guesswork.

But let's start with Kowai. because you're covering the story as much and as well as anybody. Let's just talk Raptors and Clippers the team's vying for him. Yeah, I think what's so interesting, Colin, about this free agency is that the two kind of clear suitors have done such a good job in their recruitment this year, right? So let's look at the Clippers and what they needed to do to kind of get Kauai Leonard. Okay. Right? They needed to establish a really good infrastructure. They'd establish stability.

They had to stay in Southern California. Obviously, is a big part of this, too. And then they had a really good year. They showcased great young players, feisty in the playoffs. They did a good job, I think, showing Kauai that they wanted him. You know, as recently as game two of the Eastern Conference finals, you saw Clippers executives kind of hanging out, hanging around. And they've done a really good job, I think, on that.

And they've made it a place where a credible free agent could go sign and nobody would say anything, right? Nobody would make a fuss about it if he ended up with the Clippers. It would be like, oh, that makes a ton of sense. Toronto, I think, and they're sort of one-year addition. They had to show him culture, and they've showed him that that is a good basketball culture. And I think most importantly, they had to keep him healthy. And that was what he said in his opening press conference.

It was like, I want to be healthy. I want to get to the playoffs and be like kind of optimized. And look at what we've seen. We've seen a historic playoff run. By the way, the Raptors bit the bullet a little bit on this. They wore it, yeah. They didn't love him missing 22 games. No, and I think part of it helped in the fact that,

You know, they played pretty well without him. At times, Pascal Seaccom and those guys, they did a really good job in the regular season without Kauai. But in the playoffs, we've seen a different animal in this guy. We've seen him turbocharged, playing 52 minutes, guarding Janus one night, you know, career high in rebounds in the playoffs, the next, career high and assists. This guy has done it all.

He's made a real stake at best player in the world. And I think, Colin, if you notice what Maasai Ujiri said on the podium, after they wanted. It was what Saturday, I think. I can't even get my days straight. It's the playoffs. That Kauai Lenders, we believe he's the best player in the world. And I think for, MESI wasn't, that wasn't an accident that he said that out loud. I think in that public stage to declare, Kaui Lander, you're the best player of the world. You play here,

I think it was a message, not just for those fans in Toronto, but it was a message for Kaui Lanker. Dan Oakey joining us L.A. Times National NBA writer. This is an interesting thing. Psychology is a factor, obviously. Kauai was overlooked by Pact 12 schools. He was overlooked in the draft. Then he goes to San Antonio and they are like, and he's a system guy.

Yeah, fit into our system. There is a chip. And by way, I totally get it. And he has earned every bit of my respect. But Kauai doesn't have an ego, but man, does he want to be loved? And I think he wants to be, I mean, I think he wants to be respected.

And I think every player at that sort of level wants like a shot at that crown, right? Like best in the world. I think that does matter. And being regarded at the very best at your craft. And he's been able to showcase this in this playoff run. And I think, you know, whereas the Clippers probably felt really, really good about Kauai Leonard going in the playoffs. And I still think they feel pretty good about it. But they would have to feel less good.

He's had moments there in Toronto, you know, a shot that hits the rim four times. it's in the air for about a week it feels like. That's a moment, right? Standing on the podium with Kyle Lowry, like, that's a moment. I asked Kauai Leonard a question post game, sort of like, it's been five years since you've been to the finals, considering everything you've gone through, what's it like to be here now?

And he mentioned how Kyle Lowry, you know, was such a good teammate to him this season and kind of help him get adjusted. And that was a messy situation, right? They made big kind of changes. They fired the NBA coach of the year. In the span of two months, fired the NBA coach of the year. They hire a coach who spent most of his career coaching in the British Basketball League. And then they trade the most popular, most

loyal player they've ever had in DeMar Rosen, you know, for a guy who could maybe be a one-year rental who most the league thought was gone. This could have been a mess. Yeah. And they've hit on all of these, obviously totally worth it. The risk, sort of the scared money doesn't make money, sort of kind of, you know, that has been what the, if anything, Masayu Jiri, not getting enough credit this year for taking really big swings and, and coming up big. Great stuff. You also cover the Lakers.

Now, when you say NBA National Beat Rider L.A. Times, that always meant you just cover the Lakers and occasionally went to a clipper game. We got a lot of people over there, so it's good. I'm able to kind of move around. I'm going to throw it out here. I believe Jimmy Butler is a lot of teams number two free agent. I think a lot of teams think like if we get him great,

but we want Clay, Durant, Kauai. I think he's the Lakers number one. I think they have to position themselves as, listen, you're our guy. He's famously likes L.A. If I said to you all these free agents, who goes to the Lakers? Who's your guess? I mean, I think Jimmy Butler seems like the safest bet. And it's for a lot of the reasons you just said is that I think he's a plan B for a lot of teams.

You know, when you look at Jimmy Butler, you see things like he's got Tibbs minutes on that body, right? Which is like his clock is ticking. Like, this is a guy who's played a lot of like high intensity best. Hard practice guy. should be a better shooter. You wish you would want a better three-point shooter, I think. You know, the career, I think, is around like 33, 34%. You'd like that number to be a little higher, I think, for a star player.

But what you saw in the playoffs, and one of the things is that, you know, where I think this is the, there are a lot of reasons to not like Jimmy Butler. Obviously, the teammate stuff. And, you know, the fact this is a guy who's left a lot of places. And teams have been kind of like, see you later. Yeah. You know, like that's a concern. But what you saw in the playoffs and what I think there aren't that many guys,

Who can body up a superstar, chest into a superstar and go toe to toe with someone and play like they're better? There aren't that many guys who can be credible in those situations. Jimmy Butler is one of them. To me, I think he's a pretty good LeBron fit. I could see them poking around at some other guys. I think like Nikola Vucevic is a guy who's a really good player, not a super big star. I think he'd be a good LeBron fit. He's someone that I think is on the Lakers and the Clippers radar.

We'll see what that money looks like if you don't want to quite max out a guy. giving Jimmy Butler a four-year-max is a scary proposition. That contract is going to look pretty bad at the end of it, but their clock's ticking over there, and they kind of got to go, and that's where I agree with you. They're in this, the Lakers, I think, are in this weird situation where they've got two different masters

that they're trying to serve. You have LeBron James, you know, an all-time great NBA player, maybe the best ever, tremendous winner. This is a guy who lives in the NBA finals. His whole year is built towards getting to the NBA finals, right? And then you've got a team by and large the rest of your core

are guys that are 22, 23 years old who are learning every day, who are trying to go through mistakes and play through those things. I think this was a really big challenge for Luke Walton. It's going to be a huge challenge for Frank Vogel is how do you coach a team that's trying to do two different things?

Trying to develop a young core, you're trying to win now with the all-time great player who's at the end of his prime. To me, I still think the best path forwards for the Lakers is a trade, whether it's Anthony Davis, whether it's Bradley Beal, whether it's whoever else hits the market. There's going to be two or three names that aren't on the market now that will be,

that we don't know yet, just the way things shake out. They need to turn some of those young guys. They need to get a more simplified plan, I think, and move in a clearer direction instead of trying to do everything. Yeah, this is the Lakers current flow power org chart. We wrote this down next. Instead of a success pyramid, it's a spider web that can't find its way. John Wooden would not be happy with this.

No, John Wooden would be like Oh, wait, timeout. This is not going to work. All right, Dan Woeke, L.A. Times sports reporter. He's the national NBA writer for the L.A. Times. A newspaper in America, by the way, that's hiring people. It's hiring dozens of people. Dan, great seeing you.

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