The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Best of The Herd: 09/19/2018

Episode Date: September 19, 2018

Colin reacts to the new book about Bill Belichick that has quotes from former Patriots coaches stating they could have won Super Bowls with average QBs.  He thinks the Steelers have gotten worse and worse ever since Mike Tomlin lost the momentum given to him by Bill Cowher. Plus, former pro-bowl DB DeAngelo Hall comes in studio to talk Tom Brady and why rookie QBs are tougher to face than you think. Presented by Perky Jerky. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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This is the best of the herd with Colin Cowherd on Fox Sports Radio. Ah, this is the herd. What a show today. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening. Live in Los Angeles. IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS1 packed today. Joy Taylor is joining me. Good morning.

Thursday night football tomorrow. It was one of these days I'm driving into work, and I'm thinking, what am I going to lead with today? What's my story today? And, oh, my, I fell right into my lap. There's a new book out by a friend, somebody that I used to be a colleague with, who I have great admiration for Ian O'Connor, terrific sports writer. Great dude, great family. New York writes a book called Belichick, the making of the greatest football coach of all time. We're going to have them on the show Friday.

The book is out. And there are some unbelievable quotes. 350 people were interviewed for this. I know Ian. This guy's a worker. This guy's a grinder. There's not a quote in there that's not accurate. Okay.

Here, of the many quotes, let me just throw this one at you. An excerpt from the book, Belichick, the making of the greatest football coach of all time. The general feeling, said somebody, wasn't that Belichick's system could make Super Bowl quarterbacks out of all 32 starters. But if he gave any of the top 15 quarterbacks, we could do it. We could do it. Mr. Kraft thinks

Tom's the greatest gift ever. The coaches don't. Time out. So you believe we'd have the same dynasty here with Andy Dalton? Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins, Joe Flacco? Aren't those guys all around the 15th best quarterback in the league? The beige water pistol would be the greatest

quarterback of all time. That's what you believe. Oh, okay. All right. This is unbelievable. Let me just, let me just remind you that, and I'm only going to talk about great quarterbacks here, all-time talents. Tom Brady has a significantly better arm than Drew Breeze, Matt Ryan, and Russell Wilson. He does. He's a bigger athlete, 64, 225 than Jared Gough, Matt Ryan, Breeze, Rogers, and Russell Wilson. He is. He's less injury prone than Aaron Rogers. He is significantly more precise and accurate than Big Ben and Cam Newton. And unlike Andrew Luck, he doesn't just, and you know I love Andrew Luck,

throw it up for grabs six times a game. Oh yes, I forgot. Now that Peyton Manning is retired, he is the best pre-snap quarterback in the National Football League. and I'm not sure outside of maybe Drew Brees, it's even close. Folks, think about this. 64-225. He was drafted by the Montreal Expos.

And in 1995-96, given a scholarship to play quarterback at Michigan at the time of top four, top five program. Have you ever played in a league in high school where a quarterback was given a scholarship to Alabama and the Orioles drafted him. You get how talented it is, right? Did Aaron Rogers get a baseball scholarship? Did Peyton Manning get a baseball scholarship? Did Big Ben get a baseball scholarship? Do you know how talented you have to be?

And people said baseball was his better sport. To get a top five quarterback scholarship in football. Right now, that would be Alabama offers you a football scholarship at quarterback. You're not talented you have to be just to get that? oh, by the way, then a baseball team drafts you. And not like in the 38th round, the 39, because baseball drafts go like 50 rounds. It's like 18th round. You can make the bigs out of the 18th round.

I mean, this is remarkable to me. I was talking, and our thing is Brady's defying age like nobody ever. Like that doesn't count for anything. I was talking to an NFL scout this weekend about Jimmy Garapolo, former Brady understudy and San Francisco. and he said, that whole adult film star Garapolo thing, Tom's too smart to do that. That Garapolo's talented,

but he'll never, ever be Brady pre-snap. He'll never understand the temperature of the room like Brady. This scout said, Garapolo and Shanahan will work, but they'll struggle. He said, because Garopolo's not the kind of guy you can feed information and translate it to the field. This scout told me, he goes, when you tell Tom something, at practice Thursday, you will see it Sunday.

Flawlessly. That is a gift, folks. I don't want to hear about systems. How is Belichick's system in Cleveland? Greg Popovich has a system. You notice they don't win playoff series anymore because Tim Duncan's not in the system? Mark Cuban's one of the smart guys in America told me years ago, owner of the Dallas Mavericks. Billionaire, right?

I brought him on my show and he said, the most overrated thing in business is ideas. He goes, everybody's got a million ideas. He goes, I got a dozen ideas emailed me every day. Everybody's got ideas. What's hard to find isn't great ideas. What's hard to find is great people. Because nothing blows up a great idea like average people.

The San Antonio Spur system doesn't win playoff series much anymore, do they? The further Tim Duncan gets away out of his prime, then he retires the worst they get. Nobody even considers them close to a title team this year. In fact, most people think Toronto who lost Kauai Leonard, it's not Kauai, it's the system,

will be better than San Antonio. What about the system? Three things to remember about system quarterback Tom Brady. And these are indisputable. Number one, wide receivers under Brady have had Super Bowl MVP trophies,

player of the month trophies. have been all pro and have left Brady, not one or two, like eight or nine, and have gone Bermuda triangle, they've disappeared. Number two is, Belichick, not only lost in Cleveland, was five and eleven in New England, and that's what Drew Bledsoe. Dude could spin it. And number three, the coordinators, Charlie Weiss, Bill O'Brien, Josh McDaniels have either have been fired or haven't proven themselves or kind of choke like a cat in a hairball

when they've left Brady. The idea that 15 other quarterbacks in the NFL, Andy Dalton, Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins, DAC, Flacco would be the greatest of all time is so much disrespect. Here's the quote of it. It is disrespectful. It is the most disrespectful I've ever seen.

That's like saying Andrew Bynum could have created the Spurs dynasty. That's what that's saying. That is outrageous. That is, that's like saying, I mean, I don't even, it's incredible. It's really, it's really ungrateful. Wow. I mean, you got to be kidding me. The beige water pistol be the goat.

I'm not saying that those other guys aren't great athletes or good quarterbacks or hard workers. But the thing that separates Tom from everyone else, besides what he does on the field, is everything he does behind the scenes to prepare. When you watch Tom versus time, him being. obsessed with football. He's obsessed with it. Okay. I can't even... Ian O'Connor's on Friday. I mean, I can't even get my arms around this, my brain around this, my tiny brain. All right, let me segue to the Steelers who by the hour are becoming Ringling Brothers, Bartman Bailey. I mean, it's a circus. So Lavian Bell, he's their star

running back. He's not playing. Apparently the staff has a picture. TMZ got this. He's now trolling the Pittsburgh Steelers on a jet ski. Here it is. Out here with the best running back of all time, baby. You already know what it is, man. We out here cooling it on the jet skis, man. We out here getting it, baby. Pick him out, man, his fucking money. Oh, good Lord. Antonio Brown, other Steeler offensive star, according to an NF, AFC coach, was quoted saying it's a circus over there. Mike has no control. He's one of the best coaches, but the player,

have way too much control over there. It's an absolute circus. And I just want to talk about Mike Tomlin. And I've said before he's Pete Carroll. He can coach. I'm not doubting that. But he's too loose, no discipline. We would all admit, here's something that's real in life, momentum.

I mean, Barry Switzer, you don't think of him as a great NFL coach, but he took Jimmy Johnson's draft picks and contracts and culture and momentum and won a Super Bowl. Now, four years later, they were six and ten. He was fired. Mark Helfrich took over Chip Kelly's football team. Use that momentum in year one or two to get to a national title game. Three years later, he's out of work. Larry Coker in Miami took over the Miami Hurricanes.

A couple years really good. Year three, not as good. Year five out of work. Momentum is a real thing. I could take over a really successful company. I wouldn't ruin it in six days. There'd start to be leaks in six weeks. and in six months I'd blow the thing up.

Because I don't know what I'm doing, right? If I was running a business, I'm not a businessman. I'm not a CEO. I didn't go to Harvard Business School. Momentum's a real thing. So I want you to think about this. So when Mike Tomlin is, let's break his career into halves. Okay?

Ten years of coaching. So let's go to his first five years when he took Mike Tomlin's momentum. Tomlin had nine players on the roster that were either pro bowlers or he had drafted and they were going to be pro bowlers. bowlers. Many move on defense. Cowher was a defensive guys. In the first five years, using Tomlin's draft picks, culture, momentum, he won almost 70% of his games. Five playoff wins, four playoff appearances, two Super Bowls. But since that time, the second half of his career, this is now Mike Tomlin's team. Those Cowher players have retired, free agents, got hurt, left.

Now it's his roster, totally his footprint. The second half, the longer It's his team. The numbers aren't the same. And here's what's more troubling. Is that if you look at the first five years when he took over Cower's culture, defensive players, many of his coaches, the Steelers defensive ranks. And remember, Cower and Tomlin are defensive guys. In the first five years, the defense was ranked first, fifth, second, first, first, sixth.

Wow. But now the defense, and Tomlin's a defensive. guy. It's his, his draft picks, his coaching, his staff, his assistance, his mind, his everything. The defensive ranks have gone to 14th, 18, 21st, 12th, now 25th this year. That's the problem. The offense isn't the issue. Okay, Cower was never an offensive genius. He was a defensive guy. And when Cower was there, first, fifth, second, first, first, six, he took care of his side of the ball. Belichick even gives his offense to assistant coaches, Charlie Weiss, Josh McDaniels, Bill

O'Brien. But if you look as the momentum of Cowr has dissipated, and it is now Tomlin's team, the offensive stars are rolling their eyes, calling out Tomlin because his side of the ball isn't working. It's not that I think Tomlin's a bad coach. I've said it about Pete Carroll. but momentum has always been a real thing. And I don't think people have ever kind of put their arms around this and said,

let's cut Tomlin's career into two halves. The first half, he took some momentum from Cower, a roster, a culture, defensive players, draft picks. After about five years, those guys leave, retire, get hurt, move on, get too old. Then it's yours, your footprint, your draft picks, your colleagues, your coaches, completely your culture. And the defensive side of the ball, frankly, it's not good enough. It's just not good enough.

And that's on Tomlin. So nobody is insinuating he's Barry Switzer, least of all me. But momentum's real. And I think the longer Mike is running this organization, the leaks are real, should be discussed, need to be fixed. because they are a circus and they are not close defensively in the last five or six years to what he inherited. Momentum's real.

He doesn't have it anymore. And I think sometimes Mike is being exposed. All right. All sorts of stuff today. By the way, Whitlock yesterday. Now, Jason Whitlock's always loved Tomlin. And we used to do speak for yourself. I used to say, yeah, I'm not saying he can't coach.

But let's be honest here. This thing is, it's his franchise now. Whitlock talked about this yesterday with Marcellus Wiley. I'll speak for yourself. Marcellus, there's one house that keeps having drama. The police are always, hey, could you turn the noise down? Hey, you know, there were kids partying here last weekend and windows got knocked out. There's one house where it keeps being drama, drama, drama, and there's one parent at the house.

And at some point, you've got to look at Mike Tom and say, damn, man. your house is animal house. Tomlin is respected in the sport, and I'm not calling for his job, but I have been critical of Tomlin and Pete Carroll for the exact same thing. This is a coach's sport and a quarterback sport. Loose ships, loose cultures, unravel.

Fast. And players now are more political. They're more empowered. They're higher paid. They have social media to amplify. their discussions, and right now Pittsburgh has to reel it in. They are a circus. They're a circus.

One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. So Ian O'Connor's got a new book out, Balichick, the greatest football coach of all time. And in it, there is a quote from somebody within the building of New England that Joy Taylor I are, to say the least, dismayed by that the general feeling among staff members wasn't that Belichick's system could make Super Bowl quarterbacks out of all 32 NFL starters. But if you gave us any of the top 15, we could do it. Okay. So Andy Dalton would be the goat. Alex Smith would be the goat.

Good hell. I mean, it's. It's embarrassing. It's the dumbest. You know what? It is embarrassing. It's embarrassing. It's embarrassing. Whoever said that is, it should be embarrassed. And it goes a long way in, like a lot of times I'll be out among the peeps, right? I'll be at the grocery store, car wash, restaurant, somebody will come up to me and they'll have an opinion on sports. And they kind of ask them a question, what do you think of this? What do you think of that? But occasionally they'll state something as fact to me. And I'll be like, I do this for a living.

You have another job. I wish I had time to explain it. but really jam my car keys in my retina. I can't get out of this conversation fast enough with guy who believes he has the answer in a definitive sports argument. And instead, if I'm at the restaurant, I grab the fork and I just jam it in my eye. And I bleed and I leave the restaurant in an ambulance

because that's more comforting than talking to that buffoon. And this happens about once a month. I have had people, because they know I love Brady, lots of people come out to me in the last 20 years, 15 years, and say, hey, Patriots. it's won 11 games, one 11 and 5 with Matt Castle. Now I bring you the dumbest sports myth of all time. Colin ends the dumbest myth in all of sports.

Okay. Let me contextualize this and talk slowly. Tom Brady, Welker, Moss, great team. The year before he gets hurt, they go 16 and 0. in a league, this is not college football, where you don't blow people out much, they have 11 to 12 blowout wins, 16 and 0, 11 to 12 blowout wins. They set passing records, receiving records. They are called for a single season, the greatest offense of all time.

Then Tommy gets hurt. Matt Castle comes in. Not only does he win five fewer games. Not only are they blown. out three times by over 20 points. Not only do they fail to make the playoffs, folks, seven times they don't score 20 points.

So in virtually half the games, the greatest offense of all time, can't get to the league average of 22 points. Oh, by the way, Randy Moss had 23 touchdowns with Tom the following year, only 11 and 39% fewer yards

with the same roster. only changed Brady. Let me also add this. We know that when Aaron Rogers got hurt and Brett Hundley came in, it was a different offense, right? We know when Carson Wentz gets hurt

and Nick Foles comes in, they're not as good. So let me give you some examples. So the Green Bay offense with Aaron Rogers last year and without him, the difference in total points was eight.

That's a lot of points. That's over a touchdown. When Wentz got hurt to Nick Foles, the difference was three points. Tom Brady got hurt to Matt Castle. It was

11 points. And thus ends the dumbest sports myth of all times. Them. Thus ends the dumbest myth in all of sports. I mean, seriously. You know how many times I've heard that argument, right?

Because that was the Dolphins won the AFC East that year. Yeah. That year, with the greatest offense of all time, Tom leaves, the dysfunctional dolphins won the division. I mean, think about this. It is significantly greater difference between Castle and Brady than Hundley and Rogers. and you watched the Packers last year. Not the same team.

Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app. I put my name on it. I'm here every day. You want to take shots at me. I'm here every day. Show's called The Herd Joy Taylor watching me every day.

Put my name on it. So a lot of you, I know it's going to happen throughout the course of the year. Sam Darnel Jets play Cleveland tomorrow. Every time Darnel loses, throws a pick. You'll rush to Twitter. Hey, we got you. Your table.

Okay. I put my name on it. Sam Darnold, I predicted it would go seven and nine with 18 picks. And I love him. I said it's going to be a choppy year one. So he's one in one through two weeks. I picked him on this show, Blazing Five, to beat Detroit Monday Night Football. That's not me just talking at a bar.

Yep, yep, yep, yep. I put my name on it. I put it on my Blazing Five. I predicted they win. I didn't put it in my Blazing Five. I thought they'd lose. So I predicted seven and nine. Here are the remaining games.

I did this before the season. I predict they lose at Cleveland and at Jacksonville. Those defenses are way too good for a rookie quarterback, and they have a bad O-line and no running game. He'll be one in four. I then predict they beat Denver at home. Then they go on another three-game losing streak. They'll lose to Andrew Luck at home,

Kirk Cousins and the Vikings at home, and they'll go to Chicago, and again, that defense is way too good for a rookie quarterback to dissect. You notice a trend here when they play good defenses. Cleveland, Jacksonville, Minnesota, Chicago. I have them losing. Rookie quarterbacks do. Then I have them going on a little streak, win at Miami,

beat Buffalo at home, and their biggest win of the year, they should have beaten New England last year with Josh McCown. Off a by, they'll beat New England at home. Then I have them losing at Tennessee, beating the bills in Houston, Houston at home, and then losing the Green Bay in New England. This is exactly what I'm predicting. So I love Sam Darnold.

I'm predicting two three-game losing streaks. I'm predicting he loses at the end of the year, which will give you all sorts of ammo. They'll be in playoff contention Saturday, December 15th. They'll beat Houston. And they'll be in that sort of, hey, hey, they have a chance to, and they're going to lose to Green Bay in New England. And you're going to come flying in.

This is what I've predicted. So I do think they're going to go through a real rough, three-week stretch. Rookie quarterbacks are streaky. Even talented rookie quarterbacks are sort of like backups. High-low, high-low. Nick Foles. Ryan Fitzpatrick. Great, terrible, great, terrible. Carson Wentz, Rogers, Breeze, Matt Ryan, Brady, you get kind of the same quarterback every week. So a rookie quarterback, even a good one, tends to be streaky. And the thing about rookie quarterbacks, Belichick's a master at this, especially when they get them in Foxborough, rookie quarterbacks just don't have the ability pre-snap to beat good

defenses if that team doesn't turn the ball over too many times. I have them losing at Cleveland. This is a real good defense. Losing at Jacksonville. I have them losing to Minnesota's defense. I have them losing to Chicago's defense. The teams I think they can beat are often home games with defenses that are dissectable and offenses that are okay. I haven't beaten Buffalo twice. I think they can beat Miami. I have him doing one big win this year. Off a buy. By the way, it's off a buy.

So Donald get two weeks to prepare. And through the years, guys less talented than Sam Donald, Mark Sanchez, for instance, have beaten Tom Brady. So New England and the Jets have always been a very combative, very competitive relationship. You've had real games here. So when he loses tomorrow night, and he will, Cleveland's defense on a short week,

that's a rough, rough game for Donald. And by the way, he also has three interceptions through two games, and I predicted that, 18 interceptions. He will throw a pick tomorrow night at Cleveland. He will throw one against the Jags, and I think he probably throws a couple against the Vikings. And then I think there are some games home against Buffalo, you know, home against maybe an Indianapolis or a Denver,

that he maybe doesn't throw a pick. But I have him throwing over a pick a game. So before you go crazy on all this Sam Donald stuff, I'm realistic about it. There's the schedule. You call me out on it, but I'll put my name on it. I'll put respect on it. I'm put my name on it. That's what I'm all about right now.

Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. 14 NFL seasons, a multiple time pro bowler who had his share of Tom Brady and great quarterbacks and rookie quarterbacks. Sam Donald going tomorrow. DeAngelo Hall is. joining us here on a Wednesday in the herd. How many times you face Brady? Oh, man. What times than I like to remember?

A lot of Tom. You know, it's funny, one of the quotes in the book that Joey and I are just like, it's an embarrassing quote. And one of the quotes in the book, Eno Connor, 350 people interviewed is, we don't think we could win the Super Bowl with all 32 quarterbacks, but if you gave us the top 15 guys, we could do it, to which I say, so you think Andy Dalton could be the greatest of all time with Belichick? So when you faced Brady, one of my arguments is he did get drafted in baseball and a scholarship to Michigan. Aaron Rogers didn't get drafted in baseball. Big Ben didn't get drafted outside of Russell Wilson. Not many quarterbacks in the head. Philip Rivers didn't get drafted to another sport. Tom's a better,

he's a bigger, stronger, better athlete than we think. The second thing, though, you spend a career baiting quarterbacks. My thing is once Peyton Manning retired, I think Tom's the best pre-snap quarterback in the league. Take my audience to what that means and what you've seen facing Tom. Well, when you talk about facing guys like Tom, Aaron Rogers, Tom and Rogers, Drew Brees. You faced all of them many times. Yeah, these are these are quarterbacks that no matter what you do pre-snap is not much they haven't seen. And so they know how to pick up on the little nuances of whether it's myself as a corner. whether I'm playing with a cock position or if I'm playing square,

if I'm sitting at four yards instead of eight yards, like they can sit there and take some of those little nuances that you as a player aren't really thinking about. And you're thinking, man, this quarterback's not looking at me, but he is. What I've learned from offenses and offensive coordinators and quarterbacks, like, we're looking at you because nine out of ten times, that front is going to move around. Linebackers are going to move around.

But that secondary, I'll always have. have to know where the corners are and what the safeties are because if I know where those guys are, I can get, I can guess pretty well what coverage you're in. And I can move guys and say, hey, is it man, is his own? Hey, is it a three deep? Is it, is it a too high shell? And so, those are guys, especially Tom. And I'm going to admit this, but Tom's probably one of two or three only quarterbacks that have played for

extended period of time that I haven't got an interception from. And one time I faced him, he had Randy Moss, who was amazing. But even when he didn't have Randy Moss,

he still found a way to pick us apart. And it was crazy, no matter what we did on defense. And I told the story back in the avocado room. And I was like,

you know, we have, a coordinator who loved man-to-man. Who is that? It's okay. If you don't want to call somebody out. I'm not going to call them out. I'm not going to call them out.

But we were playing New England, and Tom had probably a seven-eight-play drive. And, you know, we're playing pretty good on defense. But the coordinator called man-to-man seven times in a row. And we were successful six times. But somehow they kept getting first downs. whether that was running the ball, whether that was a little five, six yard pass here or there, but no explosive plays.

And we felt like, man, you know, we're in good shape. Me as an older player, I'm like, man, we need to start switching this up. We need to start switching it up. We can't keep giving this guy the same look. And then eventually my other corner gets double moved, touchdown. But he had broke up three passes prior to that. So I'm on the sideline. He's mad.

Everybody's mad. And I just look at the coordinator like, bro, if you don't. don't change these calls, you can't call the same play call on defense and think Tom Brady's not going to eventually figure it out. Like, we played the same coverage six times in a row, and we had decent success. But that seven times, he's going to get you. And that's how a guy like Tom Brady is. Eventually, if you keep showing him the same look, or if you run something that's very similar that he can figure it out by either pre-snap read or by motioning a guy, that's why they move guys all around. If I have a running back out there

out wide, I can pretty much tell what coverage you're in. Because if your corner is still out there, oh, it's a former zone, because the corner's not bumping in on my receiver. If the linebacker's out there or safety, all right, there's a former man. If it's a linebacker, maybe that safety's going to come blitz. And so

it's not much a guy like Tom Brady hasn't seen. That's why he's so hard to prepare against and so hard to really to make plays or win. Yeah. Now, now, The opposite of that, Sam Darnold plays tomorrow. I like Sam Darnold.

And with a caveat, I think he's going to go seven and nine. I think he's going to have 18 picks. He's got little Andrew Luck. I don't think he's quite as gifted as Andrew Luck, but he's reckless. He's a risk taker. He throws picks. But he's also going to be the best quarterback after Brady retires in that division for a long time. Now take me to young quarterbacks you faced.

You ever gotten burned by one? If you had a lot of success against young quarterbacks. You know, as a defensive guy every week when you have a young quarterback, the coordinator always comes in there. Oh, we're going to get them. We're going to confuse them. We're going to do this. We're going to do that.

And, you know, I talked about how experience works in the favor of a guy like Tom Brady and Peyton Manning and some of those guys. Inexperienced quarterbacks, it doesn't mean that they aren't able to still pick up on some of these little things. It just depends how they're coached. A guy like Sam Darnel reminds me so much of a guy that I went up against as a rookie at Matt Stafford. And we were like, oh man.

They both play a little reckless. Yeah, they do. They do. And we all were chomping at the bit like, man, Matt's going to throw it to us and da-da-da-da. And we're all getting excited to play them. And we get in the game and this dude's dicing us up better than Peyton did the week before. And so we're all kind of shell-shocked like, man, this young dude ain't got no fear. Like he doesn't care that I'm out here on the corner.

He's throwing it. Whereas some guys kind of like, you know, Peyton was like, man, I'm not throwing you the ball, D. I believe that. And so it's weird because it matters, but it really doesn't matter. Yeah, I mean, listen, the other thing is too, is that when you face Brady, DeAngelo, you are very aware of his skill set. You get up for it. Whereas you play a rookie, you get a little cocky, turn your shoulders a little different.

You definitely do. You probably do. I heard an defensive coordinator said nobody created more sleepless nights in the AFC than Peyton Manning, that you would literally as a. staff sleep in the office for three straight nights because Peyton would humiliate you. Tom would beat you. Payton could humiliate you. Because I think Peyton's the greatest pre-snap guy in the history of the league.

So to your point, I do think sometimes talented DBs have a little, you get a little cocky on the rookie. You bite on the first move. You absolutely do because you're thinking it's no way he's crafted enough to give me that move. Like that's a move that Tom would give me or that's a move Peyton would give me. And, you know, one year we played Peyton, we literally sat in a cover two shell. because we found out the week before, and really the week before that, too, the last two games,

that teams have more success, not trying to disguise, but just make everything look the same. So line up everything the exact same. Whether you're in man, whether you're in cover two, whether you're in a fire zone blitz, we're going to make everything look the same.

And we did, and we were winning at some point in the game, but before you know it, it was 42, 21, and we lost. And so, you know, Peyton and Tom, and some of those guys, Aaron. By the way, they all win 70% of their games. They're just, man.

They're just built different, man. For the record, Steelers make a lot of noise. What was the, I mean, you got Antonio Brown talking, and you got Levian Bell talking. I generally don't think over time that's great. I'd like to keep mostly politics and chatter and predictions and guarantees. I don't like Rex Ryan when he was guaranteed stuff.

I'm not a big fan of talking. But did you ever play in a locker room that was just loud, Noxy prediction guarantee. It's probably as a player fun. All your years in the league, 14 years, what was the cockiest, loudest, talkative locker room you were in?

Probably in Atlanta. Probably my rookie year. And part of the talking came from me because me not really knowing when I got to the NFL, I got that, oh my goodness moment when Randy Moss embarrassed me in the preseason.

And it kind of had me like, man, you know, this is, this is harder than I thought. But then I realized, too, it ain't but one of them dudes. You know what I mean? And so everybody else was kind of like, shoot, I can handle him.

I can handle him. I can handle him. But yeah, Randy's a little different. And so. You were cocky. You were young. So at first I was kind of cocky and then Randy humbled me

and then I started having success and I was kind of like, you know, this is easing in college. Because in college, I went to Virginia Tech. When I was there, we never played in the BCS game. We never won the Big East.

We always had those historical matchups with West Virginia and Miami, and we just never could quite put it all together. And so as a rookie to be playing in the NFC championship game and having Michael Vic one of the greatest quarterbacks at that time were athletes on the planet, I mean, they were making commercials about Mike, the Michael Vic experience. So your first year in the NFL was better than your three years of college. Absolutely.

Winning was easier. I won a lot of games. Sure. Like I was thinking like, wow, this NFL, it's, easy than college. But I didn't get back to an NFC championship game ever again. But having a guy like Michael Vick on your team,

it exudes confidence. Of course. And so that locker room, we felt like, oh, I don't care what's going on. At end of the day, Mike's going to get it in the end zone, and we just got to be all right on defense. That was for the record, that team when they went up to Green Bay eventually and won. That team was, I don't know how great Atlanta was.

That team was one of the fastest teams in the league. Alan Rossum, you, Michael Vick, That team could run. We used to joke we could get a four by one squad together and challenge some. Olympian teams. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that team was nothing but speed. Good seeing you, bud.

One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. After almost three hours, Colin apparently hasn't gotten to the point yet. Quit holding out on us, Cowherd. It's the best for last. These are the 10 rivals, in my opinion, of either rivals, adversaries, people trying to knock Tom Brady from his perch.

Some intentional, some unintentional. Number 10 would be Eli Manning. There's a reason that Tom won a decade without winning a Super Bowl. It's because in 2007 and 2011, the New York Giants and Eli Manning beat him. It ruined the 2007 year in which that may have been the most complete football team. in the kind of salary cap free agent era. Number 10, Eli Manning. Number nine.

Roger Goodell suspended him for four games. Tom Brady called it unfair. The NFLPA filed an appeal which they lost. Tom Brady went on to get the last laugh, beating Atlanta for the Super Bowl, but there's no question that he was a roadblock, and this is something, deflategate that will be mentioned when his career is over closer to the first paragraph than the last.

Number eight. Joe Montana, and I have to put this in the list because for a long time, Montana and Terry Bradshaw had four Super Bowl rings, and they were like the great quarterback with the rings, and Tom eventually had to surpass that. He now has five rings and four MVPs, but it's a friendly relationship. Montana was a nineer. Brady grew up in the Bay Area. Montana was his favorite player, so there was an initial roadblock, but I never felt like

it was as big a roadblock or an impediment as others did. Number seven. I would say actually the Boston Media. They were given Tom backrubs for about 15 years. But in recent years, the Boston media is pushing back. He's hung up on a local radio station a couple times. Remember this in July when Julian Edelman was suspended? And Edelman is part of the Tom Brady Clinic. Has Alex Guerrero. Remember this moment when the media pressed Tom Brady on that suspension? Tom, with Julian, the test of positive. A lot of people connected it to Alex Cuero.

Just what's your reaction to that? You think it's fair? No comment. That's just ridiculous. Tom. I'm out. He left. He walked away.

Now, you can't on radio hear it much. But that's increasingly been a factor. The media now in Boston, no longer just back rubs and lattes. They're pushing back now. Number six. This is weird, but Giselle. His, wife, Giselle Bunchin. Remember, Monday morning quarterback reporter that Giselle has tried to find

friends of Tom like Jay Feeley to talk him into retirement. She went on CBS this morning and said Tom had suffered a concussion and then Tom had to answer it. Tom Brady has been quoted saying if were up to my wife, she would have me retire today. Now again, the most powerful person in any married man's life is his wife and she wants to be. He wants him out of the game. She wants a healthy Tom at 50, 60, and 70. So she has been, to some degree, that is a discussion at the end of every football season. Number five. This is my top 10 list of people. Tom Brady's been so great, so good for so long. How many rivals and adversaries he's already had, I would put number five, Jimmy Garapolo. Sports Illustrated reported that Bill Belichick texts him after every win in San Francisco. He's the only quarterback that New England's ad that's better looking than Brady. and he won two games as a starter during deflategate. And there are reports that Tom forced him out of town that said,

listen, I'm not going to have this guy hovering over my shoulder. So he's a bit of an adversary. I mean, when Garoppolo wins, you think about Brady. Number four. Aaron Rogers. Tom's always been the great team quarterback. Aaron Rogers has always been the talent. And statistically, Rogers has several categories.

He leads Brady in. Aaron's got the all-time best passer rating. Brady's third. Rogers has the best touchdown interception ratio of all time. When you think of Rogers now, they're conjoined. You think of Brady, you think of Rogers. You think of Rogers. You think of Brady.

Number three. I don't think there's any question now that Belichick is not always the world's best social lubricator in that locker room with Tom Brady. The new book out by Ian O'Connor stipulates, matter of fact, 350 people. interviewed that Tom has thought about a public divorce, that Tom Brady has found it increasingly difficult to go to work for a guy that doesn't give compliments that's rough on him and that is incredibly demanding and won't keep players like Wes Welker or Danny Amandola, who Tom is not only

professionally in need of, but personally close to. Number two. Time. I think we all look at the number two adversary for Tom Brady is how long can he stay healthy. He can no longer deal with a severe injury because I just don't think he'd want to do the rehab to get back. He's 41 years old. And by the way, he talked about in that documentary he did Tom versus Time, which if you haven't seen it's very good. He talked about defying age in the national football league.

A lot of players retire at 33, you know. I mean, you look at football 10-year career. That's an amazing career. I mean, I think the last eight years in my career have been better than the first 10, though I should just prolong it. That's what I'm trying to do. And the number one rival roadblock obstacle would be Peyton Manning. That's the single best individual rivalry. It's the magic and bird of the NFL.

I can't think of magic without bird vice versa. And all of Montana's biggest rivals, they played in the AFC. Tom's played around the corner, and they often met in the playoffs. Now, Brady played him 17 times when 11 and 6. Peyton got the last laugh beating Brady in the AFC championship on his way to his final Super Bowl. Peyton has always been the more relatable one. Y'all kind of country, little southern, very relatable, very Midwest. Tom has been supermodel, elite, Ugs, you know, the private jet, the private watch,

Peyton Manning's Oreos, Buick, Subway sandwiches kind of thing. So to me, that's the greatest, the greatest individual rivalry in the NBA was Magic and Bird. And the greatest NFL rivalry, individual rivalry, was Peyton Manning and Tom Brady. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports slice comes in. I'm Timbo.

And every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the head. headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends.

Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me, he goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out.

Quarterback on office blue of 42. Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clifford show on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Joey Dardano. And on my new podcast, Hope from a Hypocrite, I'll be changing lines.

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