The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Best of The Herd for 06/19/2019

Episode Date: June 19, 2019

Filling in for Colin, Doug Gottlieb explains the turmoil between Houston Rockets Guards James Harden and Chris Paul. Doug feels no matter what, the Rockets are stuck with Paul. He also defends on the Boston Celtics from the current backlash. Sports Illustrated writer Chris Mannix joins the show to talk about the top NBA stories.  Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching herd. This is the best of the herd with Colin Cowherd on Fox Sports Radio. What up? Welcome in. This is the herd, wherever you may be. And however, you may be making this part of your day. Thanks so much.

Live from Los Angeles, I'm Doug Gottlieb, filling in for Colin Cowherd. Man, what a show we got for you today. Chris Mannix from Sports Illustrator will stop by in about 15 minutes. Brian Smith from the Houston Chronicle, join us next hour in the show. A lot of things going on. Trade in the NBA is a player who not long ago was actually the highest paid player in the NBA has been dealt. More on that to come.

There's basically three kind of big emerging stories in the NBA. There is the somewhat mass exonism. it feels like from the Boston Celtics. We'll cover that. The reality of what Danny Ains has done as well as what he must do as Al Horford opted out of his contract. And apparently it's exploring other options. Most people thought when he'd opt out,

it would be for a longer term, less money yearly deal to remain with the Celtics. That doesn't appear to be at least the immediate case. Maybe this is negotiating. Then you have the Lakers who, Shocker here, are trying to get rid of everything on their roster, with the exception, obviously, of Anthony Davis, LeBron, James, and Kyle Kuzma in an effort to clear up cap space, they can go after a third star.

But then you have the story of the Houston Rockets. Now, look, I don't know what to make of the Yahoo story, which came out yesterday in, regards to the Rockets. Because in the story, it says that James Hardin told the Rockets, hey, him or me, basically one of us has to go and the hymn is Chris Paul. And that Chris Paul has had it up to here. No one says that anymore, by the way.

I have had it up to here. Did your mother ever say that to you? I've had it up to here with this nonsense. My takeaway from the story is this. Chris Paul, much like the rest of us, can't stand watching James Harden play basketball. We all respect the points and the assistant and the talent, but, oh boy, if I got to watch him go through his legs 15 times, drive in, throw up his hands in the air like he got crushed and hoped to get a foul. I won't do harm to myself, but I have had it up to here with watching that. That's the general takeaway.

Stop me if you've heard this before, but Chris Paul is not the greatest teammate to get along with. Stop me if you heard this before, but James Hardin likes ISO ball and doesn't like to play defense. And stop, you've heard of this before, but the Rockets lost at home. Mike Dan Tony didn't get to the NBA finals, and James Hardin came up short in a fourth quarter. All of these things have happened before. So to quote, a good friend of mine, Ryan Rusillo, saw him say this on TV, which is, Chris Paul doesn't have to have said, I want to be traded without wanting to not play with James Hardin anymore. And James Hardin's not going anywhere. By the way, Chris Paul, to his credit earlier today, said the news of him wanting a trade was news, quote, news to him.

So things are going quite swimmingly in Houston, right? comes in and says, you know, this is unacceptable. We want changes. They fired the entire assistant coaching staff. Clearly that message gets through. I am so mad I'm going to fire the assistant coaches. You go ahead. They have the virtually untradable contract of Chris Paul.

They have James Hardin who they won't trade. And they have Clint Capella who you might be able to find home for. And then you have this from Brian Smith is going to join us later on from the Houston Chronicle. The rockets are expected to pursue Jimmy Butler and be aggressive in their pursuit, seen as an ideal fit on both sides

of the court in helping push the rockets to the top of the wide open west. On paper, that sounds great. Right? On and on paper is what the rockets are about. On paper,

on paper they got screwed in game seven of not this year, last year's Western Conference Finals, right? Because on paper is analytics and stats and numbers. They conducted and they had a quest. Let's figure out why we lost to the Golden State War.

It felt like we didn't get screwed in the officiating. And so they used their analytics department determined that not only should they not have lost, they should have won by like 10 points. It wasn't even close according to them.

I mean, they did happen to miss, I don't know, 27 straight three point shots. But we were fouled on a couple of them. That's, you guys, we were fouled on a couple of them. There's no way we could have just missed all of those on our own. That the old adage, you live and die by the three could actually be accurate. No, no, no, no, no, no. The rockets are, we use the term paper chance. wrong, right? They are the on paper champs. On paper, this move makes sense. Right.

You just, you're like, wait, we get Chris Paul, we got James Hardin, we got Jimmy Butler. Here's a question. How many teams is, if Jimmy Butler, it changes teams. I believe that'll be his fourth team in four years, correct? Right. Chicago, Minnesota. He's like Minnesota for a what, a year and a half? Right? They's in Philadelphia for half a year. My math pretty good. You know, this is like when you're, when you're, anybody can get divorced, man.

Marriage is hard. It's not. And, and you know what? You can fall back into it and go, you, you got married the second time, the rebound person, whatever, you get married for the wrong reasons or at that time of your life. Two marriage is okay. You start getting married three, four times.

Be like, you know, maybe they're not the problem. problem. I'm seeing a trend here. But the rockets embody, and look, I don't want to make analytics the punching bag for everything that's wrong with sports. Right? But sports is not just about the numbers. Case in point, the Houston Rockets. By the numbers, they should have beaten the Warriors going back to last year. By the numbers, Chris Paul and James Hardin are actually way more effective offensively than either of them on the floor without the other. Like it's not the stats, the analytics will tell you they are far more effective with Chris Paul and James Harden together, as they well should be.

But sports isn't about the on-paper champs. It's not about some sort of mathematical calculation. If it was, then why weren't the Warriors better without Kevin Durant? The numbers told us that they were back. I was 33 and 1 without Kevin Rand. They're better when that Kevin Rand. And I'm sitting here coming in to tell Colin like, you know, it doesn't actually control who you're playing against

because he sits against some of the weaker teams, the regular season games. Collins' best line, I think, in the last couple of years, is that regular season basketball is the practice tee, is the golf range, the driving range of the NBA. Man, I am good off the artificial turf on the driving range. Who is not? I can shape shots.

I can just pipe my drive, you know, 300 yards. You know what I don't do? I don't even hit the driver when I get out on real course. Do you know why? Because I can't hit it straight when I need to. But the on-paper champs, this is a classic move of a team that would say like, look, Jimmy Butler to Chris Paul and James Hardin. Yeah, but Jimmy Butler can't seem to get a lot.

along with anybody. Chris Paul can't seem to get along with anybody. And no one likes watching James Harden dribble 50 times before taking a shot and then jump into people and try and get a call, which he won't get in the playoffs, even though he will get in the regular season, right? I mean,

this is much like, are you guys familiar with the transitive property? Transit property's basic math calculation. If A equals B and B equals C, then A must equals C, right? The transit property doesn't work in sports. well, we beat them and they beat this other team,

so we must be able to beat the other team. That's not actually the way it works. It's just not. Math makes sense to people who don't get the subtle nuances of life and of sports. Look, in football, the numbers would tell you that you should always go for two. Ask Mark Helferge how that worked out for him in Oregon. He's a head coached Oregon. They played at Nebraska, I believe, and I think they went for two and didn't get it four consecutive times.

And they had a litany of injuries, but he basically got run out of town. And one reason was like, well, they keep going for two! Because even though the math would tell you, you should go for two every time, especially in college football where they make extra points far less readily than they do in the pros. and even now in the pros, obviously, they had to move it back, which is, by my estimation, the greatest rule change in the history of professional sports. When you don't get it and go for two, even though you just scored a touchdown,

you just scored a touchdown. You should be feeling nothing but joy and adulation and success. You feel kind of let down. It's a buzzkill. It's a buzzkill. In baseball, they'll tell you and you shouldn't bunt. The numbers tell you you shouldn't bunt. Did anybody watch

last night? Dodgers, they beat the Giants 9-0. It's a 2-0 game in the bottom of the 6th inning. Chris Taylor comes up, runners at first and third. And you know what he did? He laid down the

absolute perfect bunt. Right between the pitcher and the first baseman, essentially to where second base should be, but second base was covering second base on first and third. And so the first baseman had to try and get it for the Giants he could not. Scored a run, made it 3-0. Clayton Kershaw was lights out last night and the Dodgers win 9 to nothing.

The numbers would tell you you should never bunt. Unless you're Chris Carpenter and they put the shift on and you bunt and you get all the way to second base. Matt Carpenter, sorry. Matt Carpenter, you get always a second base. I'm not completely I'm not I'm not cutting the credibility of numbers as

showing us different ways to accomplish a similar or better success rate. They're valuable. But there's a reason that Chris Paul, whether he wants out or he's just ticked off, or the reason they don't win is because they don't like each other. And you can't explain that on a spreadsheet.

The reason Jimmy Butler is going to probably be on his fourth team is because either he doesn't like guys or they don't like him or he's a very good player. I mean, he does take his own car, does his old Uber XL to every game which ticks guys off. You know, he has this kind of own thing going on. Numbers can't explain that. Numbers can't explain why at some point in time, bunting is in fact the right thing. At some point in time, you just kick the extra point, even though you could. go for two. And the rockets

are the on-paper champions but not the real champions for a reason. Because games aren't decided on spreadsheets. Chemistry doesn't sometimes it always, always, always matters.

Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app. Last night, a blown call changed the game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode,

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on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough.

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And on my podcast, The Cliver Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me, he goes, Hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Quarterback on office blue of 42.

Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Cliverts show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Will Ferrell's Big Money Players and IHeart Podcast presents soccer moms. So I'm Leanne. Yeah.

This is my best friend Janet. Hey. And we have been joined at the hips since high school. Absolutely. Now a redacted amount of years later, we're still joined at the hip. Just a little bit bigger hips, wider. This is a podcast. We're recording it as we tailgate our youth soccer games in the back of my Honda Odyssey.

With all the snacks and drink. Sidebar. Why did you get hard seltzer instead of beer? Well, they had a bogo. Well, then you got them. Do you want a white collar something? Come here, just a hit it. Oh, what are y'all doing?

Microphones? Are you making a rap album? Oh, I would. Come on. I would buy it. Cut through the defense like a hot knife through sponge cake. That sounds delicious. Oh, you're lucky I'm not a drug addict.

You're lucky I'm not an alcoholic. You're lucky I'm not a killer. I love this team and I'm really trying to be a figure in their lives that they can rely on. Oh. Listen to soccer moms. on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Doug Gottlieb, been in for Colin Coward. This is The Herd on Fox Sports Radio in the IHeart Radio app.

Collins back on Monday. As I think he planned out smartly, the idea was, hey, NBA finals are done. There's a bit of a before free agency, but we haven't had that, right? We haven't had it. Anthony Davis gets traded on Sunday, so Colin's like, all right, I'll pushback vacation. And he's gone yesterday. and suddenly Houston Rockets have massive chemistry issues. The Boston Celtics appeared to be not just losing Kyrie Irving,

but Al Horford, and the ramifications of the Lakers trade, as well as a trade of Mike Conley, now a member of the Utah Jazz, as Ricky Rubio, a free agent, told the world that he wasn't a priority of the jazz, and now we know why. Long-rumored trade has, in fact, been consummated. Chris Mannix joins us from Sports Illustrated.

Of course, he has a new pod out. I was just looking at his tweet, which talks about many of these topics. So this is not the first time he's discussed. Just the first time he's discussed with this year on Fox Sports Radio. Minix, let me get your thoughts on the Anthony Davis trade. Obviously, the Lakers finally get their man. But the old question is at what price paradise? They get to hold on to Kuzma, but not a lot, if anything else.

What do you think of the deal from the Lakers perspective? Yeah, they gave up the store. There's no question about that. But I thought the Lakers were in the same kind of position that Oklahoma City was in two years ago, that Toronto was in last year, where their need to make a deal trumped kind of any serious concerns about what they were giving up. The second they signed LeBron James last summer, they put themselves on LeBron's timetable. And if you look at LeBron as having three or four years at being. somewhere in the neighborhood of the peak of his powers,

you've got to add somebody. And they didn't have much chance of landing a big fish in free agency. So they had to acquiesce the demands of the Pelicans with this deal. Now, could they have done a little bit better? Probably, I think if you survey the landscape and if they had held off a little bit, I think the Pelicans would have realized that the Lakers were their only real suitor out there. But they had to get their guy and they got him. So the latest story out of L.A.

is that the Lakers can continue to try and shed as much salary as possible in order to land a third player, third superstar. Is Kemba Walker their primary target? I think he's somebody they're looking at. I still think Kyrie Irving is somebody they're going to try to find a way to talk to, though I've been troll-told pretty solidly that he's headed to one of the New York teams. and the Nets believe he's headed their direction. But it's going to be a guard, obviously. And Kemba, I think what it comes down to with Kemba is just how do the negotiations go with Charlotte? I mean, what kind of offer does Charlotte put on the table on July 1st?

I don't believe it'll be the Supermax, but I don't think Kemba is necessarily tied to that Supermax. I think he'd like something over the max. But we kind of get locked in on this idea. that if a guy's eligible for the Supermax, he has to get it. It's not really the case. If he gets somewhere in between, I think Kemba stays in Charlotte. He's just got such a strong bond with that community that if he gets the money, I don't think he goes anywhere.

So I think the Lakers are going to hope that those negotiations get derailed in some way and Kemba becomes available. What do you make of the Yahoo story about the struggles with chemistry in Houston? I don't really know what I, I don't know what's true. would not. I've been told pretty strongly that the relationship between Hardin and Paul, while, you know, being damaged somewhat at the end of last year, was not, you know, was unsalvageable, irreconcilable. I have been told, and you've seen Darry be very strong about this. I've been told privately, too, that he has not requested trade, you know, from them. So I think the relationship is strained, say the least, based on the end of last season. But I, I've been told privately, too, that I've been told privately, too, that he has not requested trade, you know, from them. So I think. I think the relationship is strained, but I I don't think it's irreconcilable. And I don't think the rocket, first of all, the rockets can't move in. Like, that that contract is too onerous.

But even if they could, I don't know that the Rockets would do it. I still think they believe that this group, you know, can make a run out there. Now, what they've been doing with Mike Dantone is strange. I mean, they have to figure that out. And I put some of that on ownership and what Tillman-Pretta is doing as the new owner in Houston. But if they can figure out the Dan Tony stuff and get him signed to some kind of extension, you have to look at the landscape, Doug, and say the rockets are at the worst, the co-favorance to come out of the West with the group they currently have.

You would think, right, you would think they look around and go, wait a second, wait a second. The Lakers have three players. We've been at the doorstep, and now the Warriors are maybe not dead, but they're going to have to regroup for at least a year. And, I mean, Oklahoma City is still trying to find a way to get rid of Stephen Adams. and they have their playoff limitations. No one believes that Portland can be any better than they were. Maybe Utah is slightly better.

But yeah, I'm with you. But there is something to the fact that how much of it is they can't move Chris Paul even if they wanted to. So they might as well make Chris Paul not available via trade as of now. I mean, I think both things can be true. They can't move Chris Paul if they wanted to. I mean, I guess they never say can't because all takes us one team. to think that Chris Paul is the missing link to what they're doing. You get creative, and that's about his creative of front office in Houston, as you'll see in the NBA.

But I don't know that it's just about not being able to trade him. I do think that there's some in the organization that believe they can put this together, and that Hardman Paul, as the foundation, are better with the guys they have around him than anything else right now in the Western Conference. I mean, look at the teams you named. I mean, I think Portland, depending on what Nirkich does when he comes back, and how he comes back, they might be able to take another small step forward. But Oklahoma City is vulnerable. I think the Warriors are going to take a massive step back, obviously.

It's just there, Doug. It's there for them to take if they can find a way to make all this work. What do the Warriors do? Well, let's start with this. What does Kevin Durant do? I still think Kevin Durant is going to one of the New York teams. You know, that's been the prevailing sense I've gotten, you know, from people that know him. for a while now. And I don't know. I mean, a lot clearly changed in Kevin Durant's life with this injury,

but does this injury make him think that a five-year contract for the Warriors is the way to go, or does he have enough confidence in himself that at 32 years old, he can still piece together a great career and maybe get another contract on the back end of it? These are questions that only Kevin Durant can answer in the aftermath of that injury. But everything I was told, before the injury was that one of the New York teams was where he's going to wind up. And I just, I have not heard anything to indicate that change. Chris Mannix, joining us from Sports Illustrated. Doug Gottlieb, been for calling this to heard on Fox Sports Radio app.

Okay, so let's say he goes to New York. We assume they resign Clay Thompson and they just kind of sit tight and start to rebuild their bench. Is that their plan B? I think it has to be at this point because, there really aren't a lot of attractive alternatives. I mean, if you bring back Clay Thompson, it's going to be on a max deal. You've already got Steph Curry on a max deal. You've got Draymond Green making real money.

You're very limited in terms of your flexibility in what you can do. I mean, I think the biggest question that Golden State has to answer next season is what do you do with Draymond Green. I mean, Draymond's going to be a free agent in 2020. You assume next year maybe it's a playoff season, but it's not going to end in a chance. It's not going to end in a trip to the finals. So you go into the summer of 2020, and Dremont's going to be looking for real money. This is probably going to be his last significant deal as he hits 30 on this new contract. If you're the Warriors and you see what Dremont is right now and you sort of play out what

he's going to be in 2020, do you want to be the team that gives him that? Or do you turn around and look for maybe 75 cents on the dollar with players and draft picks that could benefit you with how you build around Curry and Thompson. I mean, those two guys are going to be the next five years of this Warriors team. If you don't believe and you don't want to pay Draymond, who is, let's be real, he is kind of a depreciating asset to that team. Still a great player, but the shooting has slipped and defensively, he's great against fours now.

When you talk to Scouts, he's not great against fives anymore, he's not as great against threes anymore. So if you want to pay him or you want to try to get pieces that make more sense around Curry and Thompson, I think that's going to be a big decision for Bob Myers and that staff, either this summer or into next season. What's your take on what's going on in Boston where Al Horford opted out? Most people thought he'd stay at a reduced rate but a long-term contract. Now it looks like he's looking elsewhere.

I have my own thoughts, but I'm curious of yours. Look, I think Al Horford wants to stay. If all things were equal, I think he'd want to be there. He's got a tremendous relationship with Brad Stevens, with Bill. Danny Ains with that entire organization, with the city of Boston, frankly, he's developed a pretty strong bond with. But Al Horford and his agent aren't idiots. I mean, they know that this summer has a summer of 2016 field to it, where there are

going to be teams with this max and double max cap space that don't get the guys that they want, and will turn around and have a four-year close to or full max-level offer ready for Al Horford. So if you're Horford, you're not going to take like a three-year-six-year-old. -ish million-dollar deal from the Celtics if there's a much bigger contract that's out there for you to take. So that's kind of my big takeaway from it. It's not that Al Horford wants out of Boston the same way that Kyrie Irving wants out of Boston. He just wants to get paid.

And I don't think the Celtics are willing to give him that four-year high-level contract to do it. I've heard almost the exact same thing. That it's not that the Celtics don't like him. They do. But the Celtics, they can't sit there and go like, hey, we're going to shout everything for Al Horford. We're not that close. We lost Kyrie.

Gordon Hayward's not where we thought he would be before he joined the Celtics. We're like we're not that close. He's not the icing on top of the cake. So it's not that we don't want him. We're just not going to give him some huge contract to this point in his career because it doesn't make sense for us. Right. And look, it's crushing for Boston. I mean, you lose Kyrie and it creates a lot of questions, right?

Like maybe you bring back Tara Rozier and see if you can rehabilitate him into the player we saw him in the 2018 plan. I don't know if that would work. But even if he's something close to that, second year post-injury Gordon Hayward's going to be better. And this guy's a great ball handler, great playmaker. There was a window for the Celtics to really surprise people next year, to win more than 50 games. And depending on what happens with the teams above them,

with the Toronto, Milwaukee's, Philadelphia, maybe even put themselves in the mix to be a conference threat. But without Al Holford, I just don't know how they'll do it. I don't think they'll be terrible, but I think they'll take a pretty safe. significant step back. Kauai, stay in Toronto, go to the Clippers. Man, your guess is good as mine

at this point. I mean, all I know from talking to Raptors people is that they feel they've done everything. And, you know, the obvious things, which is winning a championship, but also behind the scenes, treating him like a franchise player, you know, the load management stuff, the medical

staff, they feel like they've done everything there. One thing Raptors people tell me often is that they hope that these playoff moments resonate with Kauai Leonard, not just winning the championship, but the game seven ball bouncing winner against Philadelphia, winning the conference finals in Toronto's home floor, the parade, and being part of a crowd of two million people winning a championship. I don't think there's illusions in Toronto that they're going to be able to get Kauai to sign

a five-year deal that they'd love to have it happen, but I don't think they believe it, but I think that their only sliver of optimism here is that Kauai wants to come back on a two-year deal or maybe one plus one to maximize what's left of Conle, Gasol, and the veterans on that team. But even that, it still feels like the clippers of the leader in the clubhouse. Tyree, any chance of the Knicks or is it all Nets? I think there's a chance, but I think there's probably going to be, if there hasn't already, been conversations between Kyrie and Kevin Durant about what they're going to do.

Because Kyrie to the Nets alone makes zero sense. The Nets are Boston-Ly. They're coached by a reasonable fact simile to Brad Stevens, who believes in all the same things that Brad Stevens believed in, which is all the things that Kyrie Irvin kind of chased at over the course of the season. It isn't built to care as much about the regular season as Brad Stevens and Kenny Atkinson are. So I think it's got to be Kyrie and somebody else. Kyrie, I'm sure, would love to play with Kevin Durant in Brooklyn. But if it's not Durant, it's got to be a Tobias Harris. It's got to be a Jimmy Butler.

If you just bring Kyrie in, and we all know that DeAngelo Russell's not going to be there, if Kyrie's there. But if you just bringing Kyrie alone, I don't know how that makes sense for the long-term interests of the net. I'm with you. I'm with you. They had such great chemistry. On the other hand, they probably think, hey, we fix DeAngelo Russell, we can fix Kyrie Irving. But it's a completely... There's got to be somebody we're not talking about, right?

Like we keep talking. Everybody's talking about the same teams, L.A., two L.A. teams, two New York teams, Toronto, Milwaukee, like, Dallas, the heat. There's somebody out there who's going to make a big splash. Who is it? Well, I mean, Dallas is the one you'd point to just because of their cap flexibility and their history of chasing free agents. And I've heard Al Horford's name connected to the Mavericks as,

as one of the potential suitors, which, again, makes some sense. If you bring Porzing is back, you have Horford in the front court with him, alongside Luca Donchik has a tremendously skilled three-person combination there. So Dallas, I think, would be the one team that's lurking out there that could be a factor with all these top-tier free agents. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week, within the IHeart radio app.

Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines.

We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase

that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth? Are you a good person because you're afraid?

Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app.

Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me.

He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Quarterback on office blue of 42. Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clippers show on the IHeart Radio app. or wherever you get your podcast.

Will Farrell's Big Money Players and IHeart Podcast presents soccer moms. So I'm Leanne. Yeah. This is my best friend Janet. Hey. And we have been joined at the hips since high school. Absolutely. Now a redacted amount of years later.

We're still joined at the hip. Just a little bit bigger hips. Wider. This is a podcast. We're recording it as we tailgate our youth soccer games in the back of my Honda Odyssey. With all the snacks and drinks. Sidebar. Why did you get hard seltzer instead of beer?

They had a bogo. Well, then you got it. Do you want a white color or something here? Just a hit it. Oh, what are y'all doing? Microphones? Are you making a rap album? Oh, I would.

Oh, I would buy it. Cuts through the defense like a hot knife through sponge cake. That sounds delicious. Oh, you're lucky. I'm not a drug addict. You're lucky I'm not an alcoholic. You are. I'm not a killer.

I love this team, and I'm really trying to be a figure in their lives that they can rely on. Oh. Oh. Listen to soccer moms on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. There are people, some in my industry, many are just fans, that are gleeful, gleeful, that is full of gleeful, at the thought that the Boston Celtics and their championship aspirations are no more. And some of this comes from the fact that the city of Boston, though the Bruins lost in game seven of the Stanley Cup finals.

Because the Red Sox are defending World Series champions, because the Patriots are defending Super Bowl champions, because the Bruins are defending, do they call it Eastern Conference? What is the, I have no idea in hockey. I swear to God, I have, is when the, I know the cons smite the award. That's about, I know the Stanley Cup.

I don't even know the breakdown of divisions anymore. But, I mean, like, look, Boston, professional sports-wise has been killing it, right? So I think some of it comes from an anti-Boston sentiment. Some of it comes from the fact that the Celtics are run by Danny Aange. And when Danny Ains was a player, he was pretty much the least likable dude of anybody who's a Celtic hater out there. He's like, well, he was, he was that guy.

I'm trying to think if there is that guy in the NBA now. Right. Like, like, if Grayson Allen, who was just traded from Utah to Memphis, if Grayson Allen had massive, massive game, because Danny Angel is a good player, then you would say, all right, all right, that's Danny Aange. I'm trying to figure out there's the way you hate, Draymond Green is the way people hated Danny Aange.

He's just one of those guys that would say whatever, do whatever. Like, I hate that guy. But if you're a selfie fan, you're like, dude, Danny Aang is awesome. Yeah. So I think some of it, some of it comes from, the fact is Danny Aange. Some of it comes from, some of it comes from the fact that. that it's Boston. And I think some of it comes from the fact that they seemed so close

and were able to remake themselves after winning a championship. And people have thought they've gotten a pass for flaws. Maybe there's this thought that they made Isaiah Thomas play when he's hurt. Right? There's a lot of anti-Seltics sentiment out there. One of it is, well, they made. made Isaiah Thomas play when he was hurt like, okay, maybe.

Maybe that's what happened. Or maybe Isaiah Thomas was in a contract year, thought he had a chance to make $100 million in an upcoming off season, was an MVP candidate within their system, and he wanted to get back out and play and prove to people that he was healthy enough to play so that it wouldn't hurt him when his contract came up. And he ultimately cost himself, I don't know, $100 million or so.

So whatever it is, I do think that it's okay to point out that there's some anti-Seltics sentiment. But what I've heard over the last 24 to 48 hours is, well, the Celtics, I mean, what has Danny Yange really done with that trade? What is he? What has he possibly done with that trade? And congrats on all the draft picks. You won the offseason. You won the draft. You didn't win any real games.

And you're never going to get any free agents because nobody wants to go to Boston. Now, I'm young, but I wasn't born yesterday. And I seem to remember in 2016, Al Horford was available. He was a member of the Atlanta Hawks. He was an unrestricted free agent. And a lot of people thought he would go. to the Oklahoma City Thunder. Why? Thunder were close.

Thunder were coached by Billy Donovan. Right? The Thunder were trying to hold on to Kevin Durant. Remember that? You're trying to hold on to KD. At the time, the thought was, well, maybe you get Al Horford. Brings me more shooting at the center position, steadiness, professionalism. Oklahoma City didn't even get a meeting. They went out and traded for Victor Oladipo.

That's what happened. And Al Horford signed with the Boston Celtics as a free agent. And people thought, you paid too much. Why? Because they're Boston. Because Danny Ains. Because Brad Stevens is a college coach. I don't know.

The very next year, the Boston Celtics, the same Celtics who, they don't get free agents. Do you guys remember who the prize was of the 2017 free agent class? Anyone? Anyone? Anyone? Yeah, that was Gordon Hayward. They got him to go along with a wealth of draft picks, young players, talent. They were returning Isaiah Thomas from the year before, who was going to come off of a hip injury.

That was before they traded for Kyrie Irving. And when they traded for Kyrie Irving, the logic behind the trade was he fits in with our timeline, with our plan, with the age of our players, like, it was a great plan. Do you guys remember what happened? Yeah, Gordon Hayward broke his leg in half in the first two minutes of his game with the, first game with the Celtics against the Cleveland Cavaliers and National TV. So did the plan end up in a championship?

No. Did the plan end up in an NBA finals appearance? No. But if even if you want to say that, look, when you traded for Kyrie Irving, you could have known something would go wrong with his knee. Okay. Like, I have never heard of a player in the NBA having metal that holds together their kneecap that had to be removed.

That's the initial, that was initially what he had done. It was bothering him when he was playing. he had metal taken out because they was holding the screws kind of together as the kneecap, which had broken in pieces in game one of the NBA finals, back when he played with the Cleveland Cavaliers in the first NBA finals. That was what he had taken out. And then when they did that, then he still had an infection in one of the screws. So they'd take that out, clean that out. But even if you said like, look, Kyrie, he had the toe in college.

He had a litany of injuries when it was with the calves. You had to know that Kyrie Irving would break down. Okay. I'll go, I'll go okay. But if any of you armchair quarterbacks, if any of you Twitter gangsters saw Gordon Hayward as possibly who had never had an injury, breaking his leg in half in the first two minutes of his first game at the Celtics, dude, you need to go to Vegas. Nostradamus has nothing on you. And you read now articles where they're like, well, the reason that he lost, Brad Stevens lost a team was he kept playing Gordon Hayward early in the year when he wasn't ready. Like, yeah, okay. Look, I understand the Gordon Hayward thing.

One, Gordon Hayward is a former player for Brad Stevens at Butler. So even though he's not the son of the coach, there are going to be guys who are like, yo, they're boys from way back. there is the white guy element to it as well. That's the reality of not just Boston, the NBA, but anywhere in the NBA, well, you know, he's a white guy in Boston, he's going to play. There's also the reality of how much money he makes and jealousy. And guys are like, look, I'm better than him. He's making a bunch of money.

He's only making money and only playing because he's making a bunch of money, which is real. Even if you took the actual reality to how anybody who runs any NBA team was probably thinking, which is like, look, we know Gordon Hayward's not good now. We know that Jalen Brown and Jason Tatum may be better than him now. But we've seen Gordon Hayward be an all-star before he got hurt. He was an all-star in the West before he got hurt. We saw that. So we know what his...

We think Jason Tatum can ultimately get to that, but we know what Gordon Hayward has been in the NBA. So if we bite the bullet now, maybe by the end of the year, he'll be back to the Gordon Hayward of old. And there were some signs, but it wasn't meant to be. look, the truly what's happening with Al Horford in Boston is this. Danny Ains is not an idiot. He has one seemingly every one of these trades.

And the, well, he didn't go and get Anthony Davis. Yeah, because you know what he's not willing to do? He's not willing to do what the Lakers were willing to do, which is sell the farm for one player because he's seen that not work in New York. He's seen it not work. elsewhere in the NBA. He didn't have to do it in order to build the big three in Boston. He didn't have to do that. And so instead of selling the farm to get Anthony Davis, they're sitting there reasonably going, well, Al Horford is 33 years old. Why would we give him four years

max money? One, he's probably not worth it. Two, that's the act of either desperation, which we're not, or aspiration to win a championship, and we're just not there. We lose Kyrie Irving. We're not a championship team. He's got great character. He's a very good player. He's solid.

But you know what he's not worth? Just like Anthony Davis isn't worth trading off all of your primary assets for one guy when you have a good, strong, young nucleus that you can build around. Al Horford is not worth giving a max contract to because you're not one player, you're not one player away from winning.

a championship. You're just not. Tell me the trade that Danny Ains has lost. How'd they get Jason Tatum? They had the number one overall pick. They traded back to the number three pick. The number one pick didn't play in the NBA last year. And maybe you could say, well, no one could have seen the Markell Foltz thing coming. That's fair. But they seem to do pretty well with that one. They trade away nothing to get Isaiah Thomas and then trade away a broken down Isaiah Thomas to get Kyrie Irving. Go through it. He's been so good that no one wants to pick up the phone

because you feel like did whatever Danny Aange does, he's going to try and win this trade, which he should do. Danny Aange is a GM is Danny Aange as a player. If he's your GM, you're like, you know what? He doesn't

waste money on a team that's not going to win a championship. He pockets resources. He recruits good players. He's got a really good coach. and he gets more out of his team than he could. Like, dude, they were good, then they tanked. Then they got good again. What am I missing here? You don't like him because, what?

He boondoggled your team in a trade? And you can say to me, well, they haven't won a championship. And you're right. You're right. They haven't won an NBA championship since 2010. But they've been to the conference finals, three other times. during the last five years, they've been to the playoffs all five years. And if you want to compare them to all the other franchises,

the bulls have been to the playoffs once, the historically good franchises. The Lakers have gone through these six worst years as a franchise. The Knicks, do you want me to start? Any punchline, any joke can end up with the New York Knicks, and you're like, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, right? So if he was your GM, he'd be like, all right, I'm in. Whatever he does, seems to have a plan. And when it doesn't go right, like Gordon Hayward breaking his leg,

he seems to try and figure out the problem with a reasonable solution. So instead of wasting money on a player that's not going to get you closer to a championship, he's going to rethink things and let somebody else get a really good player. Be very careful of dancing on the ground. grave of the Boston Celtics and Danny Aange. It's been done before. People have thought they've gotten over on him before. Go through his trades. Tell me when he's lost. When you're consistently in the playoffs, when you manage your money well, when you have good young talent, even when the chemistry goes awry, you stop, you take a breath, you figure it out, and you don't have a

Chris Paul contract or a Joe Johnson contract that you cannot trade, that you can't trade, that you cannot move. And that's why they're swallowing hard and letting somebody else, like the Dallas Mavericks, overpay for Al Horford. Because either desperation or aspiration, and they are neither. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. And every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear.

Listen to SportsSlic. On the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Clivert Show, I'm bringing

you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me, he goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office, blue, 42. Hey, rec, my mama want you to wave at her.

What? Hey, Ms. Parker. Listen to the Clifford show on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, fam, it's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast. Point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season.

And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was hungry. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Mark keep coming to you. He's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love.

This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.