The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Best of The Herd for Apr 02, 2020

Episode Date: April 2, 2020

Doug Gottlieb in for ColinThe Cowboys did things out of order and now they have to take big risksThe Patriots won't make the same mistakes other teams make by overpaying a QBNBA Playoffs in Vegas are a great planGuest: Greg Cosell, NFL Films Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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this is clivert taylor the fourth and on my podcast the clivert show i'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff like being an internet famous referee we're in the middle of a game this linebacker this linebacker walks up to me he goes a ref my mom wants you to wave at her what Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, Rhett, my mama want you to weigh better. What? Hey, Ms. Parker.

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what up welcome in this is the herd wherever you may be in however you may be making this part of your day thanks so much I'm Doug Gottlieb in for Colin Cowherd Joy Taylor alongside man this uh this should be a super super fun show as both Joy and I doing the home office thing.

Joy, how are you? I'm doing great. How are you? I'm great. You know, it's really, these are interesting times. Okay. And obviously that goes about saying. And I think in many ways, in many ways, obviously,

unprecedented time. And because we have so much more time, right? It's like the one thing you've always wanted as you get an adult, I get maybe two things. And maybe the one thing is related to the two things. Ellen says this thing where she'll go, you know, she says the difference between a child and an adult is that an adult would never turn down a nap, right?

Which I think is an absolute genius way to kind of look at it. You know you're an adult when you never turn down a nap. Right. but the reason that you don't nap is because you don't at least think you have time who's got time to nap which is all we have all we have now is time on our hands whether you're alone whether with your kids and like the thing that you wanted most is like I just have wasn't there a movie like that where where you you got there's a movie

like that where you get more time in the time that you want but with that time have you picked up any hobbies. Is there anything you're doing now that you didn't previously do because you didn't have time? Not really, but I mean, I guess I'm cooking more for myself than I usually do because I really only like to cook for other people. It seems like a waste to me to like have to do dishes and go through that whole process if I'm just cooking a meal for myself. But because I do have more time, I'm just cook. And also I don't want to, you know, I'm trying to limit deliveries. So, yeah, I guess I'm cooking more. Yeah. Okay. You're cooking more? And then like it's interesting, I enjoy cooking and I too am cooking more than I've ever cooked before.

And then you start like trying stuff and then you watch the cooking shows like, oh, I'll try and do this. And I, like I saw this. I was watching, I was watching, was it chopped with my son. I love chopped. Who doesn't love chop? Like the only here's a basket of food makes something incredible out of it. And these guys are amazing. So I'm watching with my 11 year old son and they're cooking lamb.

And he's like, is lamb? good. I was like, you've never had lamb? No. So now I'm like, I kind of want to make lamb. The problem when you have kids is like, if kids don't like it, they just won't eat it. They're just, nah, don't like it. Can I have a grilled cheese sandwich or can you

throw in a pizza? Whereas if adult doesn't like it, like they'll least, you know, eat the food and smile and go like, it wasn't great, but, you know, my belly's full. So I'm considering a, I bring up the cooking is a perfect analogy. Now baking and cooking is different.

and my daughters like to bake, or at least they think they like to bake. And I'm thinking about the Dallas Cowboys. And did you see who signed with the Dallas Cowboys last night? I did, Alden Smith, yes. Yeah. Now, listen, Alden Smith, this could be, like, let's just be fair. This could be an all-time comeback from your personal demon story, right?

He's had a litany of issues with drinking, drinking and driving, some domestic violence issues. He was one of the most talented defensive players in the last. league before he was essentially kicked out of the league during his time with the Niners. Then, of course, he played for a short stint with the Raiders. He hasn't played in over a year in the National Football League. His last incident was in 2019, rest on suspicion of DUI.

But, you know, look, I would guess that in the rehab projects in the NFL, this is something that Jerry Jones has been want and desirous to do. he likes to be the guy who saves people. That's what he does. There's a certain power in that. And, you know, a certain kind of soul cleansing feeling to that. I get it. On the other hand, a lot of this is because they're trying to plug holes

with talented yet inexpensive players. This is just another way of being, I guess, cheap is the best way. You can sit there and tell me like, no, this is a personal rehab project. He's a great player. I think he's a good man. I think, okay, fine. But they wouldn't be doing this if they had, you're talking about rush end,

outside linebacker. This is one of the, if not the most important aspect to a defense. And they wouldn't be going cheap, getting a guy on the minimum, if they had money to spend. They don't have money to spend because, from Jalen Smith last year,

Ezekieliot, obviously what they did with Amari Cooper, a huge $100 million contract. And whatever becomes of DAC, whether he plays in the franchise tag where they get a long-term agreement, his salary cap number is going to spike. We can all, I think, agree that the Cowboys

are going to look like so many of these teams that have these, this is what happened to the Rams. You have five or six super highly paid guys, and then you just have to have either really young players or veterans that have some sort of issue coming off injury, coming off suspension, guy on his last leg. That's what you do when you overpay for other positions. And this is the Cowboys getting back to their own ways.

And honestly, I think none of us, none of us fault Zeke for wanting a long-term contract and wanting to get ahead of it before Todd Gurley's contract looked like a terrible contract. Before we got to this place where all these second. and contracts are. And the league is, the NFL is in an interesting place, not just not knowing its current status or its immediate future, but the decline in the value of running backs will be challenged as between New Orleans, Carolina, and the Giants, you have three dynamic young running backs

who, based upon their production in their first contract, deserve a sizable raise, right? Like Christian McCaffrey and like you look at all three of those dudes can plex. So it's not that they don't deserve it based upon what they will have accomplished during their rookie contracts, but show me a long-term veteran deal for a running back that works out to help the team. It doesn't exist. Shady McCoy's contract was so bad. Not Shady McCoy. Levyon Bell's contract was so bad, so bad that the GM who signed it was fired almost immediately after.

And they can't find. So I'm not fault. halting Zeke for saying, hey, look, I'm a three down back. Jerry has said I'm the best running back. I'm best player on this team. Strike why they are in his hot. He got his contract. And this is the baking analogy.

And I'm trying to think if there's a cooking analogy because I don't know. I think cooking is the same. And I've just learned this about baking. I baked some as a kid. I had an older sister. She was occasionally, our babysitter. She was a big baker back in the day. Cookies, banana bread, brownies, right?

that's the rotation of what blondeies as well, what teenage girls make, my daughters do the same thing. If you would add the ingredients out of order, it doesn't make sense, like in your, I guess your left brain tells you like, that doesn't make sense. You still have the same number of eggs, the same amount of oil,

the same amount of, you know, baking soda. Right. But if you add them out of order, it just doesn't come out of order. right. I'm trying to think of the baking dish that it's like, but that's the way it works. You're like, wait, why do I have to mix this in one bowl and then mix them together? Why can't I just throw it in one bowl and it just works out? If you go back, Joy, less than a year ago, Jerry Jones came out and said,

Zeke Elliott's our best player. We got a lot of guys that need to get paid, but we have an order of how we want to do this. This whole thing was screwed up not by Zeke getting a new contract. But by the timing of that new contract, through everything out of order. And now you have a, now you want to do pie or my mom makes great banana bread. So let's just say a banana bread that has all the right ingredients, right? It's got the flour. It's got the baking soda. It's got the baking powder.

Yes, guys, baking powder and baking soda are two different things. I didn't know it until very recently either. Very different. They're very, very different. and if you go too much on the baking soda, you will definitely taste it. Baking powder, I think you will feel it in terms of the density of it. Maybe I have those screwed up.

Anyway, when you put them in out of order, it doesn't taste right. Like something's, this doesn't. I use my mom's recipe. I mixed it in a bowl. I preheated the thing, and then I did the other thing. You know, none of us know exactly what these things are called. Get me a cookie sheet. I don't know what a cookie sheet is.

That, okay. When you make them out of order, it doesn't come outright. That's where the cowboys are. It's not that Zieg got paid. He could have and should have, but to get him paid before you figure out the DAC thing, before you figure out the Amari thing, before the salary cap is set. Sure, it benefits Zique because now he's got this massive contract that will at some point be a bad contract, a weight around the Cowboys.

And if it's not already a wait around the Cowboys, it's going to be. And they're plugging holes with important positions like your most important pass rusher is Alden Smith, who it's been five years since he did anything in the NFL. The Cowboys aren't just trying to rehab Alden Smith. They're trying to hide the fact that they don't have the money to spend on what's really left and really important to their team. And they're doing so because this cake, this banana bread was made out of order. Did I find a way to make that make sense?

Yeah. I mean, if you've ever baked, then you totally understand. Well, these are things that dudes are doing that they've never done before, right? That's true. People are going on walks. Did you go on a walk yesterday? I did not actually. I've been really lucky.

I've been super busy. I did not even have time to go on a walk yesterday. So I did some of the event in a time in which all we have is time. You didn't have time? I feel like you're the luckiest person on earth. I feel very lucky. Yes. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app.

Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where sports slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them.

Listen to SportsSlic on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo SlicLife 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we

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Open your free, our heart radio app. Search learn the hard way and listen now. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game.

This linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, ref, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Hey, Ms. Parker.

Listen to the Clippers show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. If you're watching the latest season of the Real Housewives of Atlanta, you already know there's a lot to break down. Gorsha accusing Kelly of sleeping with a merry man. They holding Kay Michelle back from fighting Drew. Pinky has financial issues. I like the bougie style of Housewives of Housewives show.

I think it looks like to be interesting. On the podcast, Reality with the King, I, Carlos King, recap the biggest moments from your favorite reality shows, including the Real Housewives franchise, the drama, the alliances, and the T everybody's talking about. As an executive producer in reality television, I'm not just watching it. I understand the game.

As somebody who creates shows, I'll even say this. At the end of the day, when people are at home, they want entertainment. To hear this and more, listen to Reality with the King on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Colin and I had the exact same thought yesterday when Daniel Jeremiah tweeted out Bill Belichick's views in the quarterback position, right? Like when you read it, and I heard his segment, I was preparing for my own show, which follows this show on Fox Sports Radio, where he talks about on field awareness and intelligence.

accuracy as the traits that he needs in a quarterback. And so when you see Cam Newton's out there, that's just not how Cam Newton is. You know, when you've been in a league for nine years, you know who you are. And there's a lot of reasons that Cam is out of work, and I think we'll struggle to find a home as a starter. And the question becomes for Cam Newton and James Winston,

do you go somewhere as a backup and wait your turn, or do you wait your turn out of football? then somebody flops or gets hurt, and then you ride in on the white horse and you save the day, right? Either of those, I think, are viable and they have enough money in the bank to do that. But I think here's the bigger thing, and this is the part that we don't talk enough about. Even in the Kaepernick deal, like there's a lot of Kaepernick to why Cam doesn't have his job. I'm not talking about the kneeling before the anthem thing. Colin Kaepernick initially lost his job in San Francisco.

for, but this is before he kneeled. It was because he wasn't seen as a great leader. He and Alden Smith got into it famously. He'd walk around the facility with headphones on, kind of keep to himself. He just wasn't a guy who people seemed to get behind, and he had arm injury, leg injury, much like Cam Newton. But here's the bigger thing.

When he went and visited the Seattle Seahawks, if you remember, they said, look, he can be a starter, wants to be a starter, to the rest of the league is he wants starters money, which is not just, you know, now you're talking upwards of $17 to $25, $30 million, but Kim Newton doesn't just want to sign a place. He want to sign a place for multi-years at, you know, he's not making less in his mind.

It doesn't matter the reality of it. In his mind, I was going to make 19. I should be making more than that at my next job. You know, Teddy Bridgewater has only played really two seasons in his NFL career. he's never been an MVP. He got three years, $20 million. I'm worth more than that. I believe that one of the big detractors to Cam,

even more than James is, it's not just that they want to come in and play and they don't want to sit. It's they want to make quarterback money and they want a multi-year deal. Who doesn't want a multi-year deal? But that's what the Patriots stay away from. Like if we're going to go and get Andy Dalton,

we've got to give a multi-year deal. We don't want to be tied, our hands to tied in. Bill Belichick, I believe, is one of those guys and I think this is a reasonable assessment to make, that he looks at the rest of the league, and he says, how are people successful, and what are the big pitfalls?

Right? And the big pitfalls everybody makes, right? The banana in the tailpipe that everybody falls for is overpaying specifically a quarterback because, well, you know, that's what you got to do. And there's a stat which all of us at Fox have, so I don't know who found it.

but it's a fact that somebody in research for one of the TV shows found, and it's brilliant. The last 10 years, the guy with the highest salary cap number in the NFL has all been quarterbacks, eight of those guys haven't even made the playoffs that year. Nobody's won a Super Bowl. Pabellechek looks at the rest of the league and says, you dope, it's not just about the amount of money you're given to one position, even if it's the most important position on the field.

It's the number of years, so you get locked into a guy that you don't love. Belichick looks around the league and says, all you guys keep getting married. Why are you getting married? Why are you getting married? Why are you signing up to lose half your stuff? Just date. And now he's going to date Jared Stidham and see how it goes.

And he doesn't have to pay him that much because the fourth round pick. And he's got Brian Hoyer, who's the consman backup. He's kind of like a quasi-coach. You could start him. You could never play him. He'll be fine. Instead of locking into a two- or three-year deal, with a quarterback who he doesn't love.

I don't have to have a dude. Let's just ride this thing out. Worst case scenario. We go draft a guy next year, and we do this dance again. The pitfalls of the league are when you give a guy a contract past his prime and for one or two, too many years. Or you massively overpay at one position, especially the quarterback position, running back is obviously the word. first one that that's the one but i mean like even look at the the rams the rams of a young quarterback but they gave jared golf all that money so early they didn't have to and now they're stuck

they're stuck and in relationships in the workplace no one wants to be stuck and belichick of all the things that do i think he would prefer to have tom brady of course but he also wanted to have tom brady a certain amount financially. The rest of their caps a little bit messy. They were kind of top-heavy, all-in, a little bit older team trying to get as much juice out of this orange as possible. But the mistake they will not make in New England that others will make is, and it's like even Carolina, Carolina needed a quarterback this year.

Teddy Bridgewater had played when Joe Brady was in New Orleans, so there's a relationship there that makes total sense. But three years for Teddy Bridgewater? When you have no idea how sound his knee is, or truth be told, Carolina really wants one of the two star quarterbacks coming out of college this year. Teddy Bridgewater is just a placeholder. But the Panthers made the classic mistake of free agency, which is too much money for a little bit too long.

That's what people do. And Belichick is not willing to do that. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. If you grew up in the AAU culture that I grew up in, keep mind my dad, this is back when it was travel basketball, and he got fired from Long Beach State in 84. He went up to Oregon State for a year. And then he was like Las Vegas, even back then, up until now,

is the epicenter for summer basketball. It's now become about Summer League. And now the NBA players who grew up as AAU players playing in the same big tournaments, and tournaments have changed some. Now, between the NBA having Summer League there, Team USA practicing and having exhibition games there. As much as they don't have an NBA team,

Vegas is synonymous with summer basketball. That's the culture of the sport. And in many ways, I think other sports are a little bit envious of it because for the NFL, it's the combine, right? The combine is where people bring their resumes and they meet up. for basketball, the Final Four is like that for college basketball, but for the NBA, that's basically their summer convention. Baseball has the owners meeting,

but there's no place where the players and the young players and old players and owners and general managers and people love the sport can all go and high school players can all go. There's no one central. Vegas is that place. And, you know, we grew up, if you're my age, if you're from the age of maybe 50 to 35 or maybe 30, and you're a ball guy.

You probably played in a Vegas summer tournament. I don't know when Circus, Circus, went out of style. It's still there. But we used to go and play. Then you go to Circus Circus and pick up on the ladies, which there were no girls there. It was all a bunch of dudes, and you put your quarter on a machine

and wait for your video game to come up. Meanwhile, you know, scout out all the different stuff going on at Circus, circus. You might have stated up. There's a hotel down the street called the Alexis Park, which is almost like a motel, but I'll give it a shout out, because every room's a sweet.

So, you know, when you're an A.U basketball player, you're staying with three other dudes, two beds, somebody may be sleeping on a pull-out the floor, maybe you share a bed with a guy, somebody brings the video games, you go out, load up on a bunch of Gatorades, and then you play several games a day. I know LeBron is against it.

I get it. I've heard it. And I know it's not the core of the glamour of the NBA of playing in these unbelievable arenas in front of, the, you know, especially when you're playing with the Lakers, like first couple rows of, of a big Lakers game, like that's a lot of money. Same thing with now with the, with the Warriors.

I think this Vegas thing makes a ton of sense in terms of basketball getting back to its core of what it has, what it has been about. The only thing these guys won't be able to do is change AAU teams when their team loses, right? That's, that's what happened the last 15 years in AAU basketball, which is like, ah, your team's not any good? just switch AAU teams. Guy wouldn't play a switch. They can't do that. I'm not a proponent of Jay Williams idea of putting guys on cruise ships. I don't know if Jay realizes that he, Joey, he said this. And I love Jay and he's like, what if we just tested everybody for it, put him on two

cruise ships and they played basketball games on cruise ships? Like, no one is getting on a cruise ship anytime soon. Well, we're all just, you know, throwing ideas out there. But these are ideas. That's when we're just going to take a hard pass on that one. I think the Vegas thing works. I really do because like LeBron's like, well, basketball is about playing in front of crowds. And it is. On the other hand,

it's also just about going and playing and competing. And, you know, honestly, look, these guys aren't going to room together like they used to. But if you give them each, whether it's a floor of one of the elite hotels. And we grew up playing. There was a tournament called John Farrow, I believe, had it. It was the, like the AAU National Championship.

You'd play in a pool, pool play, and then you'd, the, the, if you either won or second place in your pool, you would qualify for the championship tournament. And then you play in a 64 team field, and when you lose, you'd go home. And of all the things that I've accomplished in my basketball career, I never played day in the NBA. I play plenty of college basketball, plenty of big games. We got my senior year going into my basketball. senior year, we got to the semi finals of that

tournament. We lost to B.A.B.C., which was the team out of Boston. Their backcourt was Schooney Penn and Eggie McCray. Schoonie and Eggie, that's a great. And they were one of the great AAU teams of all time because they won the Vegas tournament

and then the tournament afterwards was in Phoenix and they did the double. And I don't think anybody else ever did the double of winning Vegas and Phoenix. It's like winning the Masters in the U.S. Open the same year. Like, I know it's been done by Tiger, but, you know, in AAU basketball, but in. Like, I actually don't think it's a bad plan. Get them all to Vegas.

We don't love Vegas. It's in the summer, and guys are used to being in the Vegas in summer. They have great facilities there. You can never leave Thomas and Mack. They have two arenas there. Plus, they have the north and south gym, if you want, like, workouts. You have pool play, and you have a tournament. Like, look, we're doing the best we can with what we got.

And I feel like this is. this would be NASCAR getting back to racing. Like the reason they have at Daytona, they used to have races on the sand in Daytona Beach, right? That was the old, that's how NASCAR at its core was these bootlegging cars, and they raced them on the sand, right? Like this is not Rucker Park where, summer basketball at its core to me is AAU hoop in Vegas and a big tournament.

I don't think it's a terrible plan considering all of the other litany of issues you have playing in any other city or playing in front of fans. I mean, you like, you don't like? I don't, no, I think wherever, if you're going to have a tournament or finish the season or find some abbreviated way to do this, it has to be in one location. Like that's just the only thing that makes sense. And when you're talking about Vegas, I mean, this is why for years I said that they should just build a stadium and have the Super Bowl in Vegas every single year.

It's the best event town in the whole country. It's not close. I mean, I love having events in Miami. The Super Bowl was amazing. Events in New York are fun. Phoenix is a good place for events, you know, but there's nothing like Vegas. There's nothing like the access to facilities, the hotels, the restaurants, and obviously all that wouldn't be going on.

But what you're proposing would work the simplest in Vegas. And yes, Summer League, AAU tournaments, Vegas in basketball are synonymous with the summer. So it's not out of, it's not a crazy concept to think that if this had to happen in an extreme way, that Vegas would be the place to do it. Yeah, I agree. When I first heard it, I was like, one hotel, one resort, right? Like there's the Orleans, which, again, not, it's not a five-star, but they do have a really nice arena where they run all kinds of basketball tournaments out of. The size of the arena doesn't matter.

The quality of the arena does. Right. Like, and now they have, of anything, they have too many, they have Thomas Mac. They got T-Mobile, MGM Grand Garden, and they have, which obviously nothing's like T-Mobile. Team mobile. Team mobile is like a legit NBA arena. They have a pro-hockey team there. Of course, yeah. But you have plenty of, you have plenty of different facilities, but in terms of being connected to a hotel, Orleans is that one.

I actually think it would be better if this were to happen because you would, of course, not be having fans there, that you'd want to play it in a more intimate arena. because you're going to have depth issues in a bigger space that's empty anyway. So the smaller and more intimate the spaces for these proposed games would be better anyway. Yeah, I mean, if they play in the North and South Gym at UNLV, like those guys would look like complete giants and the floor would look so small. So, yes. Well, I mean, look, that's why I always thought maybe the Lakers facility would be the best place because in terms of space, they play G League games.

It's got enough stands there. They have had TV cameras in there as well. Like that's the one. These practice facilities are probably a little bit better set up, but then the problem becomes where do you put everybody? How do you transport people? Right. Whereas in Vegas, they've kind of cleared the town.

And, you know, they're kind of built. Like you said, they're built for this. So I don't know. Like I was dead set against any sort of Vegas things. just like, eh, I don't know, it makes sense. They're at a resort. But now the more you think about it, I thought about, you know, again, basketball at its core of what it is,

like a tournament. And by the way, it wouldn't be terrible to have something to bet on and the fact that it's in Vegas and all these things could be going on at once. While people couldn't travel to Vegas, it would still kind of generate some, you know, some momentum for the town that obviously has to be just devastated by this. I'm kind of in on the idea. And I do, and having talked to some NBA,

people it does have some legs and i and i think what i i think look what what um who is a mark cuban mark cuban now went from having a hard and fast dance up we got to get this thing going by set date to we don't know the nba has to get this thing in i think lebron should if anything he should be we want to get this thing in not just financially but how many years is you going to have this opportunity to win a championship i'm sure he's devastated by the fact that they were and just beating the clippers and the bucks and seemed to have figured everything out. But the window closes a little bit with every passing year, every passing season. I would think you would want to get this one in.

But I am putting me down for the team Vegas. Get back to the idea of summer basketball. Let's do a pool play. Everybody can advance to the tournament. You can still do series of three games, five games, best of seven. Don't care. But I think Vegas would be kind of like NASCAR racing on the sand at Daytona. or baseball playing.

You know, they do this with baseball once a year where you play on, you know, up in Williamsport. You know, it would be kind of getting back to the core of what all these guys did before they became collegiate players or professional players. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app.

Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines.

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Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kier Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations. with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing,

we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person

while you hear on earth, or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game.

This linebacker walks up to me, he goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Parker.

Listen to the Cliverts show on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, it's Edwin Castro. Also known as Castro 1021. And I'm Kunky, his best friend and business manager. And we've got a new show called The 1021 podcast. I'm taking you behind the scenes on how I became one of Twitch's most popular streamers. We also love sports. And with the World Cup right around the corner, we'll be breaking down the biggest

storylines ahead of the big tournament here in the USA. Listen to the 1021 podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Greg CoSell stops by, over 40 years of NFL films. We're getting ready for the NFL draft. Greg, let's start with Joe Burrow, likely to be the number one overall pick.

And there's a story out of the Miami Herald that the dolphins want to trade up. And so I guess the question is, can you find an appropriate value? Like if you're Cincinnati, is there something the dolphins can do? They do have two first round picks this, three first round picks this year,

two next year, two second round. year, like, is there a trade to be made there if you're the Bengals? I mean, if you want a trade to pick, there's a trade to be made. For the Bengals, because I doubt Andy Dalton's their quarterback this year, they're going to need a quarterback. So, sure, you can always make a trade, but I think they'd probably like to draft a quarterback, and Burrow would be the number one guy. But I guess the question is by how much, right?

Like, there is, some people have tiers, and they have Burrow and Tua in the same tier, or do you believe that Burrow is, based upon your film study, far and above everyone else as far as a prospect? Based on my film study, I would argue that Burrow is clearly the number one quarterback prospect in this class. What impresses you most about what he's able to do? I think he has every trait that you would look for in an NFL quarterback with the exception of higher-level arm strength, and different people will draw different conclusions as to the relative importance

of arm strength and having a power arm. But other than that, I think Burrow has every trade you would look for, and I think he's clearly the number one prospect in this class. You know, what's interesting, Doug, and this really blew me away. When I was at the Combine, you know, and I got a chance to talk to, you know, a number of people in the league coaches, I remember distinctly one coach telling me that he thought that Tua was a backup at best, and I was blown away by that.

But I think, you know, one thing about Tua is when you watch his tape, he's very efficient within the context of the Alabama offense, but I'm not sure there's anything in watching his tape that wows you. Almost all quarterbacks, by the way, with very few exceptions, are system quarterbacks, and I think Tua falls very strongly into that category. What is he missing? I don't think his arm is real strong. I think that he needs the offense to defunds. the reads and the throws for him.

I don't think he'll be an athlete in the NFL the way many people think. I think he's going to have to be a rhythm-timing NFL quarterback. He can be successful. I'm not suggesting at all that he won't be successful, but I think you need to understand what he is, what his game is. They ran a ton of RPO's at Alabama. They define the throws for him. He's very rhythmic.

And I think there's nothing wrong with that, but I think that's what he is. I think Borough has a much better feel for movement, both within the pocket and outside the pocket. Greg, Goessel, joining us in the Doug Gottlieb show on Fox Sports Radio. Okay, Greg, so if you're not as high on Tua as many analysts and people who are just fans or even pundits are, is there a quarterback who you are higher on that other people are more down on? Well, not knowing exactly what other people think. I happen to like Jordan Love. I watched him last summer with his 2018 season,

and then, of course, I watched him this year with his 2019 season. And I like Jordan Love. I think that he has what I would call ball distributor traits. He's another guy who can play rhythmically. He's big. He's 6'4, 223 pounds. He can move and throw. You know, I think that his combination of traits makes him as intriguing a prospect as there is in the draft.

I think when you look at the traits and the attributes, you see a higher level arm talent. He can throw with velocity. He can throw with touch. He's got more than enough mobility. So Jordan Love to me is of the top group, probably the most interesting prospect in the draft. Why is he, why did he struggle so mightily this year? A lot of people have said, hey, decision-making, he's a developmental quarterback. Why the thought that there was a regression this year? Well, I think there's some issues that need to be cleaned up. And I think that's true of most. I would say one of his issues was the fact

that he did not always throw with a firm base and the needed balance, and he had a tendency to drift to his left when releasing the ball, and that would cause accuracy and ball placement issues. It got a little better as the season progressed. That's coachable. There were times I would say

he dropped his arm angle, which also caused some issues. I think that he needs to develop a little bit of a better feel for what kind of throw is demanded for specific routes. But again, then it comes down to how coaches feel about what can and can't be cleaned up. But he certainly has high-level traits, and he has a really good size. Doug Gottlieb, Infor, Colin. This is The Hurt on Fox Sports Radio.

Greg CoSell is our guest. Okay, help me out with a quarterback who intrigues me because, you know, there was some that thought he was coming back. He could be the number one overall pick. And then if you look at the awards won, you go, wait a second, he's the MVP of the PAC 12. He ends up, you know, winning a Rose Bowl. When you see Justin Herbert on tape, what do you see? Yeah, and I think Herbert is one of those guys that everybody gets excited because size, arm strength,

excellent movement and mobility. But I think when you really do a close study, you see some things, again, that are a little concerning. and then you have to decide how you feel about those things. He's much more of what I call a see-it-throw-it-quarterback. He does not have a great sense of timing and anticipation. This could also be a function of his offense, but I don't think he shows what I call the ball distributor traits where he drops back, hits the back foot, the ball comes out rhythmically.

I think he's been a little inaccurate. I think that I wouldn't necessarily call him scatter-shot, but I think he missed too many routine throws with less than precise ball. placement. And I think that that was an issue throughout his tape. So I think that there are some things that he needs to clean up as well. And now you get down to specific coaches, Doug, and how they feel about that. Great CoSell, our guests here in the herd. Then you have that kind of in that next group. You have Jake Fromm, who wasn't great at the Combine, small hands,

arm strength issues, but played a lot of football. You got Jacob Eason, a guy, very, very highly touted, well coached at Wisconsin, I mean, excuse me, at Washington. And then you have Jalen Hertz. So, of course, put up huge numbers this year, did start Alabama, has a big chip on his shoulder, is an athletic quarterback. There's Anthony Gordon at a Washington State. You look at what Mike Leach's quarterbacks are starting to do in the league. Of that, of that group, is there one that you believe could be a starting quarterback?

Well, the guy who fascinates me the most is Jacob Eason, because Jacob Eason is kind of old school. He's not quite Carson Palmer, but he fits into that mold. He's essentially a pocket quarterback. He's got some functional mobility, but he will succeed or fail based on his ability to play effectively and consistently from the pocket. He throws the ball beautifully. It comes out easily. He's got a big arm. You know, he's a little bit old school, like I said. You know, now everybody tends to look for guys that can move around and make plays outside the pocket. Now, he played obviously one year as a true freshman at Georgia and did well, and then had this year at Washington and did well. He will be a fascinating litmus test to me in this era of

movement quarterbacks to see how the NFL values the big strong pocket quarterback who can sit in the pocket and make the throws. Now, again, he's got some things he's got to work out as well, but that's essentially what he is. You've been watching a lot of tape on these wide receivers, I know getting ready for the draft, and there's a super depth of, of wide receivers, you know, Jerry Judy, Ruggs is just a freak athlete, CD Lamb, Michael Pittman, T. Higgins. Of that wide receiving group, is there one that separates himself above the rest? Well, I've been on record. I think Jerry Judy is the top receiver in this draft class. I think his ability to run routes as a college player is unmatched.

I'm not going to sit here and say because I've been doing this for a while, that he's the best route runner I've ever seen coming into college. but he has a great understanding of how to run routes. He's got great quickness. To me, there isn't anything Jerry Judy can't do. The one thing, and I've heard people talk about this, and I think it's valid, at this point in time you would not call him a contested 50-50 catch type of receiver. He probably won't win with physicality, high-pointing the ball.

For some, that could be important, and I'm not saying it's not important, but I think his ability to run routes, and he's very good run-after-catch. He's really elusive. He's shifty. He's got stop and start ability. I thought he was the best wide receiver prospect in the class, and I didn't think there was a guy who was that close to second, but I know I'm in the minority when it comes to that.

There is a big group. Is there one, though, that jumps out, and you're like, a little disappointing the more I watch on tape? I'm not necessarily disappointing. You know, I mean, C.D. Lamb, I think is a strong prospect. I know a lot of people really have him rated highly. above duty i don't quite see him that way so i don't think he's disappointing but uh... i don't see him

uh... you know that way i mean i you know when you ask me a question like that the thing is is you know i said i don't get to know these kids necessarily so i said and i watch tape and because of my NFL background i think about is projecting and transitioning to the league so i don't know how others think uh... i know how i see these guys in my own way uh... i think it's a really good class what i'm most interested in to be honest with you about this wide receiver class, and it's one of the main storylines in the 2020 draft is

there's a ton of big receivers. And I'm really curious to see how the league views these big receivers. Because we've reached this point where the big receiver isn't as valuable. You need guys that are better route runners. Is it because they're more valuable?

The Mike Williams of the world where you can just throw it up to them? Why is the big receiver intriguing to you? Well, with very few exceptions. I mean, there's not 50 Julio Jones. He's a special, special guy. Sure. So with few exceptions, big receivers are not as sudden and

explosive in their movement as smaller guys. So then the question becomes for a lot of people, can they win and separate versus NFL quality man-to-man corners, or does it not matter if they can't separate because their size, body position,

can compensate for it. And then they do have the ability theoretically to go up get the ball over smaller corners. So those receivers become in the eye of the beholder. That's why I am fascinated to see where some of these guys, like T. Higgins from Clemson, a player, I really like his tape. He had a very poor pro day in terms of certain times and measurables. I think his tape suggests that he could be a really good player in the league.

I'm very anxious to see where he gets drafted. Yeah, and it also has to correlate, though, with the quarterback they play with, right? Like if you have a quarterback, some of these guys aren't crazy accurate, so you need somebody with a great catch radius. And then you have other guys that are crazy accurate, and you need somebody who separate. There has to be kind of a correlation between, you know, when Cam Newton was in Carolina,

obviously had Steve Smith, who was a great route runner. But other than that, they tried to surround him with bigger wide receivers because he wasn't a crazy accurate guy, so they needed guys with a bigger catch radius, fair? No, you're 100% right. and so it depends on what you're looking for and what fits your team. Sometimes you can also get a quarterback who may not be super accurate, but if you have a really good defense and you can run the ball effectively,

you know, you look at Buffalo with Josh Allen, a really good example of that. Josh Allen may never be a precise ball placement thrower. Justin Herbert may be that guy as well. He may not be that precise ball placement thrower. Then it becomes a function of the team. There's many other variables because, as I said, very few guys are transcendent prospects. Greg CoSell joining us.

Last one. My concern about Tom Brady is not that he can't throw the deep ball, but if you look at tape, with the exception when he had Randy Moss, like his leading wide receiver is Troy Brown, Roshay Calwell, Wes Welker, Julian Edelman, you know, Danny Amindola. I know they had the one year, obviously, where Gronk was his leading wide receiver. They have tight ends. They don't have a gronk, but they have two good tight ends in O.J. Howard.

Cameron Brate. They obviously have very good wide receivers, but he's always used the back, and he's always used an underneath slot guy on those option routes on third down. That's who Tom Brady is. Does he fit the style by which and personnel of the Tampa Buccaneers? Well, let's start with the fact that Bruce Ariens has been doing this a long time, and he's a smart guy. And secondly, as far as the deep ball, he can throw scripted verticals. And by that, I mean routes that are called where you drop back. It's a timing throw. And and he can make those throws. But I think ultimately he'll fit.

There'll be a marriage between Ariens, what he wants to do and what he likes to do, and what Brady does. It's like Peyton Manning when he went to Denver. If you're going to sign Tom Brady, you understand what he does well. He's a terrific play-action quarterback. He's a rhythm player. And then you add in some of those scripted verticals. But their receivers work fine.

Evans and Godwin, if you hit them in stride on in-breaking-type routes with their big bodies and their run after catch, you'll gain yards. So, yeah, I don't see that as being a problem at all. Great, great stuff, man. Hope you're healthy and safe. Same to everybody at NFL films, and we appreciate you spending some time with us in the herd.

Same to you, Doug. I really appreciate it. Be well. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the Internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode,

we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment,

and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy,

not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests. from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band

with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, what's good, y'all?

You're listening to Learn the Hardway with your favorite therapist and host, Kier Games. This space is about black men. experiences, having honest conversations that it's really not safe to have anywhere, but you're having them with a licensed professional who knows what he's doing. How many men carry a suit or armor? It signals to the world that you're not to be played with. And just because you have the capability that does not mean that you need to,

listen to learn the hard way on the AHA radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, guys? This is Cliver Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliver Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me, he goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her.

What? Time out. Quarterback on office, Blue, 42. Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Cliverts show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

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