The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Best of The Herd: Jul 26, 2019

Episode Date: July 26, 2019

 Colin explains why the Cowboys should buy Dak and just rent Zeke.  He admits Baker will finish near the top of the NFL MVP voting this season.  Plus, former Ohio State Head Coach Urban Meyer talks with Colin about two of his players (Ezekiel Elliott and Michael Thomas) holding out and why college football has a problem regarding unbalanced and unfair schedules  Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode, we're cutting through the noise,

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Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her.

What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, Wreck, my mama want you to weigh better. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. If you're watching the latest season of the Real Housewives of Atlanta, you already know there's a lot to break down. Orsha accusing Kelly of sleeping with a merry man. They holding Kay Michelle back from fighting Drew. Pinky has financial issues. On the podcast, Reality with the King, I, Carlos King, recap the biggest moments from your favorite reality shows,

including the Real House Wise franchise, the drama, the alliances, and the T, everybody's talking about. To hear this and more, listen to Reality with the King on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for listening to The Best of Heard Podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday. From 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific, on Fox Sports Radio and FS1.

Find your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the IHeartRadio app by searching Herd. This is the best of the herd with Colin Cowherd on Fox Sports Radio. Ah, it's a Friday. This is the herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening.

We're on IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, FS1 in Los Angeles. Joy Taylor is joining me. I thought Skip won that Julian Ellman argument. That was a big last 10 minutes for Skip. Shannon does not agree with me. It's great having everybody in today. Joy, how are you? I'm great. Good morning.

Happy Friday. You look like you should be going to a Keith Urban concert. I look at you. You look hip. I thought this is very like business like. Boy, if you... Boy, if you... No librarians at my school look like that.

I guess I could toss some cowboy boots on it. But you're not going to a concert. You're going to like an exclusive... Oh, stop. I want the background story. on this on Monday because this is we're being fooled here. Well, let's start the show with the Dallas

Cowboys. They're having camp and Zeke isn't there. Right. Okay, so I have kind of a rule in life. I'm just going to, this is kind of behind the curtain. I won't waste too much time on it. What do I buy in life? I buy things that I think are growing in value. I'll buy a home. I'll buy a land. All buy a stock.

Because I feel over time they're growing in value. I tend to have a theory on life that I lease my fun. I don't buy a boat. I just lease it. I'll go and pay for the day. I lease my golf clubs. I lease my skis, jet skis. I lease my fun because they're declining assets.

Once you get a jet ski, an hour later, it's worth less. Once you buy a car, you drive it off the lot. It's worth less. So I tend to buy things that are accelerating in value, and I lease things that are declining over time in value. That's just kind of my theory. I don't think it's revolutionary. I think that's what a lot of people do.

with wealth management and with their money, right? I feel the same way about the Dallas Cowboys. DAC, to me, is the land, the stock, the house. He's an accelerating asset. Zeke is a declining, fun asset. I would pay DAC. DAC is a quarterback. Dak rarely gets hit.

That's why Dak can always play. DAC is mature. Dak will get more mature. Dak is good. Dak is getting better. In eight years, DAC may well be twice the quarterback he is today. He is an ascending asset. I would pay DAC. Even if I got to pay a little too much than I want for the house and a little higher price than I want to buy the land for and a little more than I

want to pay my quarterback, I think Dak Prescott is an ascending asset. Now, we can argue about the price on the house. We can argue about the price on the quarterback. I wish Dak would take 29, not 32. but don't get yourself, he is an ascending asset. Zeeke is not. Zek is closer to the car. I'm not saying you don't need transportation, but the minute you get it off the lot, it's worth less. Zeke will never be better than today.

Every hit, he's a little less of a running back. And sometimes I have a test in life. Say it out loud. Immature, running back, demanding money, two years out from a continent, contract at a position that's not trending particularly well. I think it's an easy decision. I got a bunch of people to pay in Dallas.

I'm paying the quarterback first. I'm paying the pass rusher second. They've already paid him. I think I'm paying Amari Cooper in 2019 wide receiver third. Then I'm paying Jalen Smith, the linebacker, great kid, outstanding position. You need athletic linebackers. Byron Jones.

That's how I feel about Zeke. Nick Wright talked about this this morning. There's a lot of mouse to feed, and Zeke is not doing his so-called friends any good here cutting in line. Dak Prescott has made less than $3.5 million in his entire football career. That is less money than Zeke is scheduled to make this season on a contract that he thinks has him underpaid. I do find it interesting what potential locker room politics. even if they're able to keep it quiet, happen if Zeke attempts to cut the line almost,

where Amari's got one year left, Dax got one year left and has never been paid, Zeeks got two years left and was a top five pick. People tell you who they are. Maya Angelou used to say this. Believe them. Johnny Mansell kept telling you in college, here's what I am. Me guy, immature, not a guy you want to build a franchise around. And Cleveland's like, can't hear you.

Patriots took Johnny Mansell off their board. Colts took him off their board. Cleveland's like, we can't hear you. We can't see what you're doing. Zeke's telling you who he is. Immature. Me over we. I mean, Dak Prescott's got more leverage right now.

He's a quarterback in the quarterback league. He's like, I'm just going to play. We'll get it figured out. I mean, it's become a wide receiver league more than a running back league. Amari Cooper's like, I'll play. Uh-oh, all good. They asked yesterday, they asked Jalen Smith, who, by the way, is an unbelievable linebacker for Dallas.

game now that you need athletic guys in space. Linebackers matter. You know what Jalen Smith said when they asked him about Zeke's contracts? He said, quote, I'm here. People tell you who they are. You got to ask yourself when you're paying people. What's their position? How's the position trending?

Are they long-term employees? Do you want them in the building for five years? Do they play well with others? Are they we over me? Don't get me wrong. They're pro athletes. I get they want the money. But if you're asking me today, deserving contracts before Zeke, I'm paying Dak first.

He's the quarterback. I'm paying DeMarcus Lora second. They already got him. I'd pay Mari Cooper because there's clear signs that Amari makes Dak a better player. I think I pay the linebacker Jalen Smith. I don't have to pay Vanderex for three years. I'm paying Jalen. And the Cowboys were looking for a corner for about eight years since Dion Sanders, maybe 12.

They finally got one. Pay the damn kid. It's the NFL. You've got to have one world club. Even the Patriots pay Stefan Gilmore. Even the Patriots pay a corner. You've been looking for 15 years for a corner. You've got to pay Byron Jones.

Great kid, great corner at a position that's increasingly popular. I'll just keep doubling down on this. I think I've doubled down on this nine times this week. You keep telling me you want Zique and it's an easy decision. I think it is easy. I'm paying Dach, DeMarcus, Amari, Jalen, Byron. I'm not paying Zique. You can get a hall for.

forum. Pay ascending assets, not declining assets. Lease your fund. Dak over Zeke all day. Let's shift to this. You know, it would be nice to come to work every day and have a staff that was supportive and not working against me. And this morning the staff goes out, oh, look, Baker Mayfield, odds to win the MVP. That's so funny. A first of First of all, it's voted on. So of course Baker has a shot, because Baker's got a better story. This is what MVP has become. NBA MVP, it's not about value.

It's about stats. It's called the MVP, not the MSP, but Russell Westbrook won it. Derek Rose won it. Really, Derek Rose valuable. Has there ever been a minute of his life he was more valuable than LeBron James in a basketball court? The MVP is voting. voted on by writers who like stories and romance over reality. Of course Baker Mayfield's going to get a ton of votes.

I would be shocked. As long as Cleveland has a winning record, one game over 500, I will be shocked if Baker doesn't finish top two in the MVP. His story is better. Now, if you're asking me who I think the MVP, the last five to ten years in the NFL, there's three players in this league that I think are way more valuable than everybody else.

And again, the word is value. Andrew Luck is number one. He's gotten teams to the AFC championship, bad rosters to a conference championship. Number two would be Aaron Rogers. He's gotten bad defenses to a conference championship. Third is Russell Wilson. He's gotten horrible offensive lines into the playoffs. Those are the most valuable players.

Patrick Mahomes is gifted, but he's got Andy Reed, fastest player on the the NFL, the best tight end, a very good offensive line. He's great, and don't get me wrong, there's some value there. But Andrew Luck, Aaron Rogers, Russell Wilson are the most valuable players in the NFL. But I'll give you an example of why Baker's going to finish top two in the MVP voting. I'm not saying he's going to win it. It's going to be top two, because people vote stories. Here's a great example. Usually, if you have great receivers and you have great backs and you have great tight ends, people would say, well, you know, Of course, of course they're good.

I mean, of course. Baker Mayfield has the first or second best young titan in football, the best wide receiving core, easily the best three backs combined. But he's going to be the rare guy that gets credit for that. Why? Rookie head coach, downtroddened Cleveland, Baker's a short two-time walk-on.

It's a great story. Baker's a great story. And MVP's are about stories. I mean, really, you've ever thought, Russell Westbrook was more valuable than LeBron James. Where? Where? Outside of one city, where in the NBA?

But he was a better story. Kevin Durant left him, triple double, even though it's not a stat award. Okay. Take Jared Goff. Jared Goff doesn't have a wide receiving core as good right now as Cleveland. Robert Woods is excellent. He's a number two. Cooper Cup is excellent.

He's a number two. Brandon Cooks is excellent. number three. You can't name the Rams tight end. What about Todd Gurley? What about him? Couldn't play at the end of last year. Jared Goff has never once even sniffed MVP talk. Like Baker, he's young. He's 24 and 7, 60 touchdowns, 19 picks and a pass rating over 101 and got to the Super Bowl when his best receiver was hurt and his best running back couldn't play. Not a sniff. Why? Because Jared Goff is tall and didn't have to walk on. And the Rams are in big, rich, greedy L.A.

And Sean McVay is a genius, although the Super Bowl disprove that. MVPs are about narratives and sports writers vote on MVP. So they vote for stories. Jared Goff's numbers are absurd in his first couple of years. His first year in the NFL, it was man overboard. The fact that he didn't crumble is amazing. He's done nothing but win and get to Super Bowls. Nothing. No crickets.

Baker's got better tied-in. Baker's got better receivers. Baker's got better back. But it's Cleveland. It's Freddie Kitchens. He's a rookie head coach. Baker will absolutely be top two in the MVP voting as long, as long as Cleveland has a winning record. And I predict them to be nine and seven.

So I'm not shocked at all. It'd be nice if my staff wasn't trying to get me worked up every day. And I walk in there and I'm like, hey, free coffee and donuts for everybody. Look at here, look at here. Time to make some changes. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. On Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the IHeart Radio app. Last night, a blown call changed a game.

This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines.

straight to the source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsClyce brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsClyce on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kier Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it.

And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely.

And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast. Learn the hard way. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What's up, guys?

This is Clivert Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her.

What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue 42. A rep. My mom, I want you. you to wave at her. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Cliffer Show on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows.

without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall.

And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nass would get that thing. That man, hell get to fly. man, he running up the court, licking his fingers why he got the ball, like,

after you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I've been critical of Mike Tomlin through the years, and I've been critical of Pete Carroll through the years

because they're the same coach. Big energy, great at a podium, unbelievable vibe, terrific teachers of young football players. Their young players all get better. And they're a little loose for my taste. Teams get a little loose, little chatty, little this, little that. I'm always left feeling like, it left a lot of points on the table. But Mike Tomlin has a new deal. And even though I've been critical of Mike Tomlin, he deserves a new deal. Listen, here's the reality. You can't look at an all-time great and compare people to him. Take Bill Belichick out of the equation.

He never existed. The next. The next. four or five great veteran coaches in this league are Andy Reed, Sean Payton, Mike Tomlin, Pete Carroll. And for all of them, aren't we all saying the same thing? Shouldn't they have another Super Bowl? Shouldn't they have a Super Bowl? Shouldn't Andy Reed have a... Shouldn't Sean Payton? Shouldn't...

Bill Belichick makes Mike Tomlin look bad. That's because Bill Belichick makes virtually everybody look bad. Okay, it's same with Nick Sabin and the SEC. See, there is no other Nick Saban. LSU was winning 10 games a year in bowl games. They had less miles. Well, he's not Nick Saban. So they fired him.

Now they're not as good a program. You were winning 10 games a year. You just couldn't beat Nick Sabin. Who's beating Nick Sabin? One guy in the country is beating Nick Sabin. Occasionally. Dabbeau Sweeney. That's it. And he didn't have to play him every year in the same conference.

It's the same with Tiger Woods. For 10 years, Goulet, you were with me. For 10 years, I was taking calls. arguing with people. Rory's not the next tiger. And Justin Rose isn't the next tiger. And Ricky Fowler's not the next tiger. And Jordan Spee's not the next tiger. There is no next tiger. What about Brooks Kepka? He's not the next tiger. Tiger Woods was 11 years old and signed with IMG. He was 15 and we gave a rip about junior tournaments. Brooks Kepka's great at 27 years old. You didn't know who he was until he was 26. I mean, Tiger Woods,

At three years old was on TV doing a golf swing, at 11 side run an agency, and at 15, captivated Jack Nicholas. Brooks Kepka is a late bloomer who's kicking butt. He'll never be Tiger. So it's unfair to compare him. Take Tiger out. Brooks Kepka is unbelievable. Compared to Tiger?

Everybody to Sabin. Everybody to Belichick. Everybody to Tiger. Who's the next? LeBron. There isn't one. Just enjoy LeBron. I mean, the only time in my life,

where there's been the next and the history of sports. Kobe Bryant was not that far off Michael Jordan. He sounded like him. He played like him. I mean, that was the only time of my life. You had an all-time great, and a guy came in and you're like, you know, he's about 85% of Michael. I didn't think he was quite as strong as Michael.

Didn't quite have the defensive lockdown. Not quite as great as Michael. But Kobe was about as good as you're about as close as you're going to get. But when you get these iconic figures, like Mike Tomlin, You got to get past the, yeah, but I mean, Belichick owns him. Just take Belichick out. You can't get rid of coaches because they can't beat outliers or golfers or college coaches. Nobody's beating Coach K.

Roy Williams beats him occasionally. That's good enough. That's good enough. Don't try to get happier than happy. Mike Tomlin gets you to the playoffs. I just saw this this morning. I think my staff gave me this. He's zero losing seasons.

Okay. Again, never had a losing season. eight of the 12 years he's made the playoffs, and he was nine, six, and one last year with drama all over his locker room. And by the way, some of it is his fault. But not all of it. Big Ben has his issues, too.

It's not all on Mike Tomlin. So again, can we take the outliers out? Stop firing people because the SEC has gone through 77 coaches since Nick Saban got hired. Really? LSU was winning 11, 10 games a year. Les Miles was winning bowl games. He just couldn't beat Sabin.

Are you better today without less miles? I don't think you are. Nothing against Ed Ors Run. I don't think you are. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. So Michael Thomas, a very talented young wide receiver, went to Ohio State. His head coach Urban Meyer will join us in 10 minutes. Michael Thomas is holding out of camp.

We're seeing a lot of these guys hold out of camp more than usual. Saints offered him 19 million. He wants over 20. He wants to be the first receiver to get over $20 million per year. I think this is directly attributed to the NBA. I think everybody watched the NBA offseason. Everybody got paid, and NFL guys, especially skill guys, look at it and think, let me get paid. Most NFL guys are failed basketball players.

This is fools gold. There's about 2% of NFL guys I'd pay. About 2%. It's about 50%, well, about 35% to 40% of NBA guys I would pay. Over a third of the league I would absolutely pay in basketball. Big money. NFL, I'd pay. about 2%. So I think a lot of this is fools gold. Watch New England once again, not get caught up

in this fool's gold. They're not going to pay their running backs. They're not going to pay their wide receivers. So I just want to remind everybody the teams that spent big money this year, Niners, Lions, Redskins, Jets, Raiders. Now, I do like some of the Niners and the Jets acquisitions, but the Titans spent a bunch of money last year and it didn't equal a win. The Titans spent a bunch of money last year on running back. And by the way, they went nine and seven. Two years ago, last year they won nine and seven. Didn't mean anything. NFL guys, a lot of these holdouts, they're looking at NBA guys and going, got to get mine, you are not NBA players. They got 22 starters in the NFL. You got five in the NBA.

Individually, NBA guys mean a lot more. Now, remember DeAndre Hopkins came out when he was watching the NBA Free Agency and he said, remember that tweet, You all think top NFL guys deserve top NBA player contracts. I do in rare instances. But my rule has always been this. This is my rule for paying people if I was in pro sports, but let's just stick to football. Do your best players, when they are playing their best, translate to wins. So let's look at players who do.

Tom Brady and Aaron Rogers, when they're playing their best football, Tom Brady, 48 best passer ratings. The Patriots are 48-0. Aaron Rogers' career, the 23 highest passer ratings, they're 23-0. So when Tom and Aaron are just spinning it, they win every time. That's a combined 71-0.

I'm paying Tom and I'm paying Aaron. Now, I know what you're saying. Call it that it unfair. What about defensive players? All right, let's look at defensive players. When Aaron Donald got a sack last year. Oh, the Rams were 10 and 0. And when Khalil Mack had a day, the bears were 7 and 2.

Pay the men. Now let's go to wide receivers. Not as convincing. And I'm going to give you great wide receivers. DeAndre Hopkins, Julio Jones, Odell Becker, Beckham, when they had 100-plus yard days, that's a good day for an NFL receiver. Giants, Beckham was 8 and 16, Michael Thomas, a game over 500, same for DeAndre Hopkins. Now, I am not saying quarterbacks are reliant exclusively on receivers, but they are sort of dependent on them.

Odell Beckham, that'll probably be 16 and 8 in two years in Cleveland because they'll have a better quarterback with Baker. So what I would say with riot receivers is use your discretion. If you have a difference maker, there is absolute value there. But the two groups that I see that I'm going to pay, quarterbacks and dominating defensive linemen, those are the guys I'm going to give money to. And I also will give money to one cornerback that can basically force you to throw it to the other side,

of the field, which helps marginalize your great offense. Wide receivers use discretion. Because when the quarterbacks and the defensive linemen have great Sundays, their teams win. With quarterbacks always, with defensive linemen almost always. Wide receivers. And the other thing about wide receivers, you have to be careful. Now, this won't happen in New Orleans because Drew Brees is a veteran. But you do get instances when you get a young quarterback with a star receiver,

and he feels like he has to funnel the offense through him. Dak is better without Des. Dak now can sprinkle it everywhere. He doesn't feel beholden. He doesn't feel pressure. I got to get Des involved. Now, I think Drew Breeze and Michael Thomas, Drew's going to throw it where Drew wants to throw it.

And I think Michael Thomas is one of those guys with an aging quarterback that there's value there. Drew likes him. Drew trusts him. He's a terrific player. Good hands gets open. But my theory on all this paying is when your best person, players have their best games. Does it translate into wins? And so quarterback will pay the most. I'm going to pay a big dominating Aaron Donald, Khalil Mack second. And receivers,

they're going to be in a group of about six positions where I'm really going to, I'm going to count pennies here a little bit. I'm going to be tough in negotiations. I'm going to be a little tougher. I can, you know, listen, I don't want to pay DAC 32, but I'm going to have to pay them 30, and it's four more than I want, but I'll swallow that. Same with the past, Russia to Marcus, Lawrence. I swallow it. Byron Jones Corner. I'll swallow it. Zeke, I'm going to count everything. I'm going to count everything. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the iHeart radio app. Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are

flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where sports slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered.

Sports slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsSlic on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up. in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing

it and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch life becomes about wins and losses Steve Burns Dustin Ross because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth or are you a good person because you're afraid because that's two different intentions bro absolutely and that that's two different levels of trust I want you to just really be a good person join me Keer Gaines is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Clivert Show,

I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff, like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me, he goes, A, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, Wreck, my mama want you to weigh better. What? Hey, Miss Parker.

Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. American soccer is about to explode. The World Cup is coming. Ramos sending on to Ernie Stewart for Chip. I'm Tad Ramos. I'm Tom Bo. On our podcast, Inside American Soccer, you'll get. at the real storylines.

I'm not worried about Policic. I'm not worried about Balagan. I'm not worried about McKinney. My only concern is what happens in the back. The biggest decisions. If you're going to look at stats and numbers, he has no shot at making this World Cup team. And the truth about the U.S. national team. It wouldn't be a huge surprise if our team ends up in the quarterfinals or potentially a great run into the semifinals. The World Cup is almost here. Experience it all with us.

Listen, inside American soccer with Tom Bogart and Tab Ramos on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcast. My favorite time of the year is we move into August. College football is about ready to start. It starts in late August. NFL camps have opened up. And two stories right now, Ezekiel Elliott, former Ohio State Buckeye holding out, Michael Thomas Saints holding out, former Ohio State potentially holding out,

Zeke. We think he is. We're not sure we'll know by the end of the day. But Urban Meyer coached both. Ohio State players under Urban generally go to the NFL and star. They remind me a little bit of the Miami Hurricanes. Back in the Miami Hurricanes heyday, they'd be great in college. Sometimes they'd be better pros.

That generally is not the way it works, even with Alabama players now. Ohio State guys hit under Urban in the NFL, and Urban is now joining us via the Coward Global Satellite Network. Let's start with the Michael Thomas Zecchio Elliott thing. You coached both of them. You know, it's funny about Zeke because even his father admitted Urban coming out of college. He said he's a young

18-year-old man. He is young. He can be a little immature sometimes. Now you're stepping up, could pay him over $100 million. Would you worry about that? Was Ezekiel Elliott, who's outspoken, he's playful, he's fun? Do you think money would change him? Would you worry about giving him the world?

Well, the thing that listening to your early part before I came on here is that when you talk about Mike Thomas and Zeke Elliott, we have a saying that Ohio State was that your best players have to be your hardest workers. And that's what I look at as a coach. You know, when your best players are not your hardest workers, when your best players are screw-offs and they really set a bad example, that's the issue to me. But you're talking about Zeke is legendary, still in Columbus, about, we used to call him the best player in America without the ball. He was the best blocker,

downfield blocker. I haven't studied that much for the Cowboys, but I know that's any. Same with Mike Thomas. Mike Thomas was the hardest working receiver we've ever had, and we've had some great ones there. So that's the biggest thing. When I heard you first talking about, without understanding the fiscal responsibilities of each team, what's, you know, I heard you talking about the quarterbacks and the defense

alignment, I can't agree more. However, your best players have to be your best workers, or you're going to have a bad team. Yeah, that's really fascinating to know that when you say that. I remember USC had a kid a couple years ago, Juju Smith-Schuster. I had a scout call me, and I said, I've never seen a kid work harder at practice. He had a

legendary reputation. So to your point, Tim Duncan had that reputation, Brady's got that reputation. Hard work sends a signal that you got the right guy. You know, it's funny about And we've seen, we've seen, we've seen teams with the great players that don't work hard. And those are usually worst teams in professional

sports, certainly in college. You know, it is interesting when you look at what's happening to football. Passers are now receivers today. I always felt as a kid growing up, running backs were more valuable than receivers. Your last couple years at Ohio State, and I watched the trend in the NFL,

if I told you in your first recruiting class, you can have the best receiver or the best running back in America, who would you take with today's football? There is no question years ago I would have taken the running back without any hesitation whatsoever. Receivers a lot of times are fill in guys, but that game's changed. And I remember I had a long talk with Coach Belichick one time.

We had some issues on defense and giving up the big play. And he is one of the few coaches that starts from the back end forward. So he's always going to take away your best receiver. And he says a team legitimately can't just run the ball at you consistently and win the game nowadays. You have too good a de-Lyman. You can scheme up against to stop the run. It's hard to scheme up to stop the pass if the guy's better than your corner. And so I think the game's changed so much.

I think this is a space game. it is in college, and I see the trend in professional football, too. You know, it's funny. It used to be, the quarterbacks had to be 6'4, and they had to have a rocket arm, but I'm watching Baker Mayfield. I'm watching Kyler Murray. Now, you generally at Ohio State, you had the bigger, kind of prototypical guys, but it is funny to watch what's happening.

Should I be concerned? How big is height to you? Because I'm seeing these guys in the NFL now, coach. Kyler Murray is like five, nine and a half, Baker's under six feet. How do you look at quarterbacks now going forward? Well, I stand behind the quarterbacks for my entire career, and I am concerned. I coached against Baker two years in a row. We beat him in Oklahoma, and they beat us in Columbus, and he's one of my favorite players of all time.

I know he planted a flag, I think, in middle of the horseshoe when they beat us, but he's as competitive. He raises the level play around them, but there's legitimate issues when you're, Offense alignment are six foot eight. You have these big defense alignment trying to tear your throat out coming at you and you can't see. So I think it's a concern, but Russell Wilson's done a great job. Drew Breeze has done a great job. And I think Baker Melford, I don't know enough about the player, Kyle Murray.

I met him at the Heisman this year. And I was a little bit taken aback. He is short, but he's dynamic. And I think that's going to be the coach. To say you're going to run traditional drop-back pass with those players, I don't think he can do it. Yeah. You know, Pat Fitzgerald, you respect him, Northwestern coach, very smart guy. It's a small private school and he wins a bunch of games.

He came out this week and he said, you know, kids are on their devices. College football attendance is going down. And I said, well, I think that's part of it. But I also think part of it is there's too many cupcake games on the schedule. You're asking kids to spend a lot of money and people to spend a lot of money in America. They don't want to watch, you know, Alabama take on, you know, Panera bread or whatever. I don't know, some school I've never heard of. But here's my point, Irvin.

I don't want to pick on Nick, but here's my point, is that I do think coaches are in a tough spot. You want to get bowl wins. You don't want to lose. But the end of the day, some of this is consumerism. You can't put a bunch of cupcakes on the schedule. How did you think about it at Ohio State

in terms of what's entertaining, what's getting us better, what's easy, what's too easy? You know, Billy Donovan, when we were in Florida, he was my neighbor. And one time we were sitting there and having dinner and he said, you know, March madness is out of control. And I'm like, what are you talking about? So you can't lose a game. Once you get the March Madness, the stress, the pressure you cannot lose a game.

And I looked at him, I said, Billy, what the hell you're talking about? College football coaches at the top five, six programs can never, you're 365 March Madness. So when I was the head coach of Florida, head coach at Ohio State, it was all about win every game. and I could care less about the schedule. I never even thought about it. When I saw that we had to go on the road to Oklahoma, to Virginia Tech, or a tough game on the road, or Florida State when we're at University of Florida,

and I would look at some of the other teams not playing a schedule like that, yeah, I would always think, you know, why are we doing this? Yet you don't really think of the fan. However, that's the job as an AD. That's a job of people at the, you know, administrative level that you have to do. You have to worry about that.

But here's the concern I have. That's supposed to be one of the top. top issues to get into the college football playoff, and I'm not sure it is. You know, I am not sure that's the number one, you know, some conferences are playing nine conference games, some are playing eight, some are playing FCS school, some are not. There's got to be, you know, I do believe that has to be looked at in a very neutral voice, neutral eyes and say, what's the right thing to do for attendance, but also who's going to get in that playoff?

By the way, we all know Alabama Clemson, Georgia are going to be really good. and I have a feeling Washington's going to be good out west. You know, Notre Dame people are pretty good. I think Ohio State, Michigan. I think Michigan's O-Line's pretty good. Ohio State, they're stocked.

I got two minutes here. Injuries are a huge part of the NFL. It's a game of attrition. College, you have 85 scholarship guys. Like when you go into a season, do you look at your schedule and go, okay, here, here, here, here, here? How do you stay focused week-to-week with 17-8?

18, 19-year-old kids. Is that hard knowing they think Ohio State kids know they got better talent than 11 games they'll play? I just actually had a conversation with Coach Day about that and other friends of mine in the profession that, yeah, you have 85 scholarships, but there is a difference between, you know, you'll have, especially, say, the quarterback position, you have to be so cautious. And I've changed over the years. I mean, we used to, you know, inside your, I'm sure you've understood. That's offense, defense line. That's full go, full contact. You used to have 20, 30 reps of it.

Now you have about six, maybe eight, maybe 10 max, because you're so concerned about the time and effort you put into a player, a guy getting hurt. And you do? When you're at a place like Ohio State, you'll look at your schedule. If you're starting off with Oklahoma, they have FAU and then Ohio State has FAU and then Cincinnati.

And they better be careful. You better not look past them. There's times where I have said, okay, we're not going to practice quite as I didn't tell anybody. That was between me and our strength coach. then I'm going to kind of save it because I'm looking at that as almost a warm-up to the season.

However, you get two scrimmages usually before you play a big game. If it's a big game, you have to have those two scrimmages to be ready to go. If it's not a big game, I would actually use one of those games as kind of a warm-up to continue to get ready

and not risk your guys getting hurt. By the way, we've got a minute. I want to ask you about Trevor Lawrence Clemson. We'll have to be somewhat succinct. Can this kid live up to the hype? Because he's the best college quarterback I've seen since Andrew Luck. Can he live up to it?

Yeah, I watched him this week. I was kind of studying the ACC, and Clemson separated themselves in many areas and the program that Coach Sweeney's put there. And the fact they've not had coaches leave, that's amazing to me. However, the quarterback's dynamic. He's got a great release. You know, it's a matter of I don't know him. It's a matter of can he handle the hype?

Can he handle, you know, what's coming his way? You know, we've had Nick Boses, we've had Dwayne Haskins, we've had great ones. And that's legitimate concern. You have to constantly be having conversation. Once again, I don't know Trevor Lawrence. I understand he's a wonderful guy. But that's real. You become big man on campus.

You become people talking about insurance policies and all that. That does distract you. But he's the best quarterback in college football. Yeah, boy, he is. Andrew Lux, the last kid I saw in college and thought he could play as a sophomore in the NFL. Urban Meyer, we're going to run. Have fun golfing coach. And I'll see you soon.

Good to see you. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, FS1, and the I-Hard Radio app. People don't get football topic patriots. People don't get smart people just don't get, like, dumb. Like when Phil Jackson used to coach the Lakers, you know, he was really smart guy,

and then he'd get conveniently dumb. I'm not criticizing officials. I just made a random comment. No, Phil Jackson's too smart to get conveniently naive. The New England Patriots do virtually everything well. except one thing. Man, they are lousy at drafting wide receivers out of college. They're not even mediocre.

It stink. Julian Edelman was a rare get, and it took it five years to work. And so yesterday, a video came out. The Patriots went and drafted a wide receiver in the first round. Nikiel Harry from Arizona State. I watched a ton of them in college. He's a very nice player, hard worker, juju Smith-Schuster, big, strong, tough, physical player, not a burner, doesn't separate, but good after the ball,

works his tail off. Belichick called Herm Edwards coached at Arizona State and said, can he fit into our system? And Herm said, yeah, and I think it'll be a nice player. There was some video out yesterday. Everybody's like, oh, my, here we go. Tom's finally got a guy. But it's interesting because I was reading an article, Bucky Brooks wrote an article a couple months back on what the Patriots do. What's the secret sauce behind the Patriots? And they listed five things, Bucky said, as a former player in Scout. They focused on each player's best trades. They build a roster that features

versatile players. They place greater value on intelligence over athleticism. Toughness matters. It's always about the team. Blah, blah, blah. A lot of football cliches, right? The one thing I'll say about the intelligence is this is where I think sometimes Brady and Belichick,

this is why my theory on why they can't get college receivers right. You've got the smartest coach in NFL history. You've got an older quarterback. This is a complex, daunting, overwhelming system. And the one player that is

tied to Tom on that field is the receiver. You keep drafting these college guys and after about two years when they can't synthesize perfectly with Tom, it's like, we're out of here. Listen,

offensive linemen have their own coach. And running back is just a simpler position to play in terms of see the hole, hit the hole. The defensive player, Patriots draft every position brilliantly. They can't get receiver right. And so I do think when I look at Nikiel Harry, everybody yesterday is like, oh, and I'm like, I'll believe it when I see it. I will believe a rookie receiver can come into New England and be a big playmaker.

I haven't seen it in 20 years. got Edelman right and it took five years. And by the way, he was a college quarterback. So he was probably better at kind of understanding Brady's kind of mind. This offense is tough. A, on the offensive side, not on the defensive side, this offense is rough on young players and it's brutal on young wide receivers. And so everybody's getting hyped up in New England. And Nikiel Harry's supposed to be a great kid. I watched him in college. Herm Edward has told me, wonderful kid. But, man, I've seen this offense, Brady Belichick chew up.

Star college receivers, chew them up. And they just, it's just, man, Reggie Wayne came into this. Remember Reggie Wayne? Reggie Wayne went to New England and said, I don't like it. It's just no fun. It's too demanding. It's too. This offense, it is just squeezing every bit of that sponge.

And I think it's tough on receivers. That's why they go, that's why they, by the way, they get Hogan was in the league. West Welk was in the league. Randy Moss worked, because Randy Moss is like a Zavant football knowledge. Randy comes in and he just instinctively, Randy's one of the, first of all he's one of the greatest players ever, but he's instinctively, it worked

immediately. But Ocho didn't work. Reggie Wayne didn't work. A lot of guys, they basically go get NFL guys who have kind of understand the league. Veterans work a man. I'll believe this when I see it. I've just seen them just, I think it's hard.

Because you can't tell me they're great at everything and can't get one thing right. There's got to be a reason for it. And I think the reason why the receivers, young ones don't work there, it's just too much. And Tom won't throw to anybody he doesn't trust. He doesn't trust a 21-year-old who he's never seen until two months ago. Believe it when I see it. See, a lot of people are hyping that out, not the journalist. That right there was Big J journalism. John, take notes on that. Take notes on that. A lot of people on the hype train on that. Not all. Uncle Colin.

Nope. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where SportsSlice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline.

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This is Clever Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me, he goes, A, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Look, quarterback on office blue with 42.

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