The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Boxing with Chris Mannix - Is the Long Bud-Spence Nightmare Over?

Episode Date: May 24, 2023

Joining Mannix this week is Jomboy Media's Dan Canobbio. Mannix and Canobbio react to the breaking news that Errol Spence and Terence Crawford have agreed to a deal and if Spence-Crawford is past its prime. Plus what's next for Devin Haney, Ryan Garcia makes his choice for a new trainer, Leigh Wood gets back in the ring with Mauricio Lara and more. Later, welterweight contender Alexis Rocha on why he didn't push for a Crawford fight, what he needs to work on before he gets it, Saturday's showdown with Anthony Young and more. #Volume #Herd Subscribe, rate and review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you download podcasts. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Now with interviews, analysis, and everything going on in the world of boxing. When you have talent, you are given another chance. Here's Chris Manix. And we are back. Boxing with Chris Manix, part of the volume sports podcast network, Colin Cowherd's podcast network. Glad you could join me for this episode

where we have some breaking news. I love when that happens. We have breaking news before the podcast and not after it. We have a deal between Terrence Crawford and Errol Spence Jr. for a welterweight title unification invite. The long national nightman. that was Spence and Crawford is over.

The two will meet on July 29th in Las Vegas, all four belts on the line in that fight. Showtime pay-per-view will distribute. ESPN, of course, first to report the news of this story. We're going to get to that. A little bit later in the show, Alexis Rocha, the number one contender, the WBO 147 pound title. He will join me and talk about what the last couple of months

have been like for him as he has tried to navigate the Welterweight Waters while Spencer Crawford were doing their thing. He is back in action this weekend against Anthony Young at Fantasy Springs in California. Stick around for that. Well, as you know, May is a huge month for boxing. You've got

Katie Taylor's homecoming in Ireland against Chantelle Cameron. You've got Devin Haney and Vasily Lomachenko for all the belts at 135. Pay-per-view is always a great option. But I promise you, There is nothing better than being in person for these title bouts. Well, GameTime is the fastest growing ticket app in the U.S.

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Right now, Dan Kenobio, John Boy Media inside boxing live. He will be in Orlando, Florida this weekend for the debut of the Most Valuable Prospect Series, a brainchild of Jake Paul and Most Valuable Promotions. That's a show that you can stream live. on the zone as well. So, Dan, let's start right here with the big news. Spence versus Crawford is done. I had been hearing rumors over the last couple of weeks that they were just finalizing some details that July 29th was, in fact, the working date.

But now here we are seemingly with that fight, good to go. How do you feel about it? I feel relieved, just like, I'm. A lot of fans are feeling right now. Also, we have seen a lot of reports over the last couple of months, years, it feels like. This one feels a little more real. I do trust Coppager. I do trust ESPN and they're reporting.

This seems like it's a go. We've seen a lot of these pieces to the puzzle start to fall. You know, your guest later on in this show, Alexis Roachar, he was supposed to fight, Terence Crawford. That fell out. But overall, I mean, this is the fight that all fans want to see. I mean, this has been a great year for boxing already. now we get to add on an undisputed fight we're going to figure out who the best welterweight of this generation is

is it a little too late probably but it's not like super late it's not paciel me whether they're late i still think both these guys are one and two in the welter rate division i think they're top five in the pound for pound list even though i don't make pound for pound list i believe in the mount rushmore and i think both their faces are slapped on that mount rushmore i'm excited um it's a big fight and And finally, it's here. And it's been a banner year for the sport. So let's go. Yeah, I'm excited about it too.

I do have some Pachial-made with the concerns. Crawford is what, 36 years old. Spence is 33. Crawford has been more active than Spence, just fought in the fall of last year. But Spence has been off since a year ago, April. And this fight taking place in July, that's a pretty long layoff for a guy that, you know,

for the last couple of months, it's been assumed he was going to move up to 154 pounds to fight Keith Thurman. So now I was going to drop back down to Welterweight and take this fight. I'm glad it's happening. Don't get me wrong. But I do have that Pachial-Mayweather spidey sense kind of going off in the back of my ear where I start to wonder if we're going to get the kind of fight that we hoped we were going to get. I agree with you.

They still are one, two, in the welterweight division. They still are somewhere in the top five in my pound for pound list. So I think there's obvious value to having this fight. But I mean, do you not get even a little bit of concern that these two guys get in the ring? We feel that buzz in the building right before the fight. And then 12 rounds later, we're looking at it going on, man, I really wish I saw this like three years ago. I got a little bit of that going on. Yeah, of course, of course, because it is too late, like I said, but it's not over-marinated.

It's not too late. I do still think they're at the, they are on the other end of it, but just barely over that, that top of that mountain. I don't know. Like, I feel like the styles make fights.

That's, that's one of the oldest things in sports, right? Errol Spence, no matter how long he's been out of the ring. Yes, the layoff does concern me. And it's something I talked about Chris Algeria on my show.

It's like, I almost rather them take a tune-up fight. As crazy as that sounds, because it's going to make their fight when they do step in the ring, a better product. But with Spence, he's the guy that throws close to 70 punches around. He's going to bring that pace, even if it goes down to 60, 65, that's still tops in the World 3rd Division.

Then you got a guy in Crawford who was half of that. It throws about 30 to 35 punches around, but he stopped nine of his last 10 guys. He's got knockout power. That right there leads me to believe, even if they're slightly off their game, their career averages and their career norms are going to produce a fun fight. Would I rather add it in 2018? Of course, 2019, of course. but I still think it's going to be a damn good fight. And most of all, we're going to get some closure on this welterweight division.

I mean, this division is supposed to be one of the best in boxing. It's been stagnant. There are guys below it that are just not fighting. We haven't figured out who's the best. Like, if anything, let's just move on past this fight afterwards. If it's a good fight or not and figure out who's next at Walterway after this. Because I think both guys will move up, even though I do, did read it. There's some type of rematch clause in this.

Yeah, I think that's what's interesting about this fight too, is that there's a bilateral rematch clause. Both guys can exercise it within 30 days of the last fight, which suggests more likely than not, we get two of these fights at some point this year. And look, whoever emerges from all this, hell, maybe this is a trilogy, if it turns out to be two great fights that have different decisions. But whoever emerges would then be lined up to face Jermel Charlo, who, you know, will have most, if not all the belts still at 154 pounds. And whether it's Spence, who has had a lot of back and forth with Jermel Charlo on. social media or Crawford who, sorry, Crawford a lot of back and forth with Charlo. Spence is a stablemate

of Charlo with Derek James, which makes for interesting dynamic in that gym. That's another major fight. So, you know, not only are we getting Spence versus Crawford, but it sounds like we are likely to get Spence versus Crawford to within six months of the first fight happening. And if one guy wins both those fights, well, we could get Crawford or Spence versus Jamel Charles, which is another monster pay-per-view in the first half of 2024. So I guess better late than never is the way that I'm looking at this. I just, I'm crossing my fingers, man, and I'm hoping that sitting there at T-Mobile Arena in the summer, that I'm not sitting there in the sixth round going, damn, do I wish this fight

happened a few years ago. Damn, Crawford's not as explosive. A lot would have to go. I mean, Crawford, I almost don't remember his last, but I know he dropped the guy and stopped him. And that was like. Yeah, David Avination. In the, yeah, to look sharp, Spence, we got to go back to Ugas.

We got to go back to 2021. A lot of it is obviously not by his own doing, you know, the another car accident, which is crazy to believe. I just go back to it. I just still think that they still have enough to give us a good fight. But I feel like just repeating myself once again, we're getting movement. Like you just said, Chris. Like we're getting moved. We're seeing like the light at the end of the tunnel.

Like we're making matchups. Like we're seeing a 135 and one four. carry a sport. We had an awesome six months of the year, right? And we did not, the heavyweight title wasn't even on the line in the first six months of the year. There wasn't any significant heavyweight fights outside of Joyce and Zhang. And if you want to count Joshua's fight, Canello fought in a fight that many fans were not really asking for with Ryder. There was not a lot of the big name stepping into the ring or in significant fights for the first six months of the year and we still had a very good year. So if anything, this brings up business in a big way.

I feel like Spence and Crawford looked at Tank and Ryan and they looked at what they saw this past weekend with Haney and Lomachenko. Like big fights need to be made. Like big fights need to be made in a sport to keep it going. Like mainstream appeal is everything. Every other sport has it. Boxing needs it too. I'm curious to see what kind of business this fight does. A high bar has been set with Ryan Garcia and Tank Davis, which did somewhere in the neighborhood of a million pay-per-view buys.

This is obviously a better fight, a more high-level fight. but it probably doesn't have the mainstream marketability that Gervante and Ryan Garcia had. Both those guys were huge social media presences. Crawford has a presence. Spence has a presence, but neither one of them are as active as either one of those guys on social media. There's no de facto promoter involved, no Oscar Delahoya or Eddie Hearn or, you know, Frank Warren or Bob Aram. You're going to have, you know, Tom Brown most likely promoting it, and he's done a fine job in those situations, but is not the outspoken type of promoter involved.

I am curious to see what kind of business it does on fight night. If it does the kind of numbers it should do because it is a high-level fight, it probably is going to determine who is the number one pound-for-pound guy in all of boxing. I wonder how embraced it's going to be by the time we get to fight night. All right. Let's look fast. Yeah. What number do you think?

I'm curious. What number do you think? I would probably peg it, the over under half a million. Yeah, I would say, I mean, Ryan Garcia and Tank Davis were a perfect storm. Yep. You know, it was a lot of trash talk. It was a lot of good buildup. I mean, these two, Spence and Crawford are going to have some moments during the buildup.

I hope they have, like, press doors that create visuals that, you know, can carry them up until the fight. But even still, it just doesn't have that same magic, I don't think, at least commercially, that Ryan versus Tank ultimately did. Let's look back at this past weekend in Las Vegas, Devin Haney against Facilia Lomachenko. This was billed as a high-level fight between two high-level boxers, and by that definition, it lived up to the expectation. Like both these guys are sharp. Both these guys are elite boxers, and a lot of these rounds were close. Two of the judges scored the fight 115-113 for Devin Haney.

Dave Moretti, who we're going to get to, he scored the fight 116, 112 in favor of of Devin Haney. So Devin Haney comes away with unanimous decisions. There are a lot of people out there, Dan, crying robbery after the fight. Bob Aram, the promoter of the fight of both fighters at that time, he was caught on a hot mic, a hot mic he was holding, a hot mic saying to Lomachenko's manager, you won this fight easy. That's something that Devin Haney took exception to after reading and seeing that on social media. So let's start here. Do you think Hayney's win was a robbery? No. There are no such things as 7-5 robberies. A majority of the fans that I have spoken to are read on my social media are in agreement that Lomachenko won this fight, and he won 115 to 1-13. That's a 7-5 fight. That's not a robbery. Robberies is Roy Jones Jr. 1988-198 Summer Olympics. 86 to 32, he outlanded his opponent and didn't get the gold. There was corruption involved with that time. Robbery is Lennox Lewis of Vanderholyfield, 1999, a fight that was ruled a draw when Lennox Lewis outlanded the Holyfield by 218 punches.

I understand punches landed on the gospel. They are to me and my family at least. But those are robberies, Chris. Those are robberies. This is a close fight. But the thing with social media and the thing with, I'm not trying to get all deep here with society is there's no nuance anymore. There's no black, it's just black or white.

Robbery or not. So there isn't like a close fight. It doesn't get your likes on Twitter and all that. So I understand fans are upset that thought that Lomchenko won and they're upset. and I'm never watching boxing again. It's a robbery. It's just easy to scream out robbery, the same way it's easy to scream out corruption

when you see bad judging. There's no such thing as a 7-5 fight being a robbery. Like, that's a close fight. Those are razor-thin rounds. Like Lou DeBella, our friend, who has seen more boxing than all of us, said that was some of the closest and hardest fight I ever had some of those rounds to score.

I understand he had a dog in the race with Haney, who has a piece of him, but that just shows you right there. These were really hard rounds to score. score. Obviously, I thought Maredes was a little wide, but I mean, that's not a robbery. Stop. No, it wasn't a robbery. I scored the fight eight four in favor of Lomachenko. I had a dead even through eight rounds in the last four I gave to Lomachenko. But I can see two of the last four rounds easily swinging to Devin Haney. I believe the ninth and the 12th in my mind could have gone

either way. And the first eight rounds, to your point, I saw them being incredibly close. I mean, the bodywork of Devin Haney was effective. The flurrying of Lomachenko was effective. There were very few rounds in that fight that I sat there in my seat thinking that's a clear Haney round or that's a clear Lomachenko round. So when it's announced 115, 113 by two judges, no issue with that whatsoever. 12 scorecard wasn't so much a problem because of how wide it was. It was on a micro level when you look at how a couple of the rounds were scored, maybe just one of the rounds were scored. And Dave Morady scored the 10th round for Devin Haney. That was a round that was clear, Lomachenko. Lomachenko had did his best work in the 10th and 11th rounds of this fight. He hurt

Devin Haney in those rounds of this fight. To score the 10th round for Devin Haney just tells me you're not watching and you're not doing the job as it's meant to be done. And I took issue with Dave Moretti on that. Dave Morady also has a bit of a history with some just bonkers scorecards. I mean, he was the one that was the seventh or eighth round in Golofkin, Canelo won that if they had swung it in favor the right way in favor of Golofkin, it would have been a draw. I think he also had, did he have the 10-10 round in Garcia versus Tank? Yeah, which like which had a knockdown. I don't like the, That to me tells me you shouldn't be judging fights anymore.

Or at least you should be forced to be retrained or or there's something should happen. You shouldn't be put on these kind of high level fights. You shouldn't be on these high level fights if you're going to be, you know, scoring fights in this way, whether it should be taken out of the rotation or something. It's got to be some kind of repercussions. You would think so. I look at listen to this. So I look at the scorecards and I dissected them.

Moretti gave the last six rounds. five of them to Haney. If anything, Loma came on strong in the second half of the fight. The judges were only on the same page in five of the 12 rounds. Cheatham gave the last six rounds, four of them to Haney, Sutherland split the final. So you have three guys, ringside, watching seemingly three different fights. Or they're not on the same page. And I don't understand Moretti's going to get the brunt of it because he had the most, the widest scorecard. You know, he's 70 years old. He's been a judge as 1977. Larry Holmes was the heavyweight champion when David already started judging fights.

Like we talked about this a lot of my show. Like he like last week with the referee with Tony Weeks, been around for a long time. Like it's very easy to throw out corruption. It's like an ongoing running joke in the boxing world. But sometimes it's just incompetent. Sometimes it's just these guys are just getting up there in age. Like Jared Diamond, who does great work with MLB. He's an MLB writer.

He wrote he had a study. about MLB umpires. M.O.B. umpire, the average age is 50 years old. The best umpires by the grading system are in their 30s. So guys that just had a few years on the job are doing a better job than the experience. And 20 years of experience, those are the umpires in baseball that are making the worst calls. David Reddy's double that. Like 40 years of experience.

It just comes down to that. I know it's very easy to say corruption, but a lot of times, like, it's just, they just lost it a little bit. I mean, you can lose your prime and judging, too, just like you can refereeing, just like you can in athletics. Yeah, I don't think it's, I've never believed any of this stuff was corruption. It just is incompetence. And there's no sport where incompetence is more dangerous than in boxing. If you're a referee, you're incompetent, stuff like Tony Weeks can happen in the Romero Baroso fight. Or worse, you could have a situation where you don't stop a fight quick enough and a guy gets his head caved in, which may have happened in the Genebec fight.

on that the week before. Yeah, same night. Yeah, same night. So I just think, you know, when fighters put all that into their craft and have so much on the line with the outcomes of these fights, millions of dollars, potentially, world championships, you've got to have the very best of the best refereeing and calling these fights, regardless of what state they are licensed in, regardless of the part of the country that they're from, part of the world, frankly, that they're from. You've got to have the very

best of the best involved in this fight. And, you know, Dave Marready to me is no longer one of the best of the best. Maybe he was at some point, but, you know, now he's not on that list. So, Igas Clema says he's going to protest. That's going to go nowhere. Devin Haney's, you know, the winner of this fight, the rightful winner of this fight. And now Devin Haney has something of a decision to make. He stayed at 135 for the Lomachenko fight because he has been chasing Lomachank. go really since 2018, 19, when he won his version of the WBC title. He gets that fight.

He wins that fight. And now he's got to decide, do I stay at 135 and, you know, take a fight with Chaucor Stevenson, which while being an incredibly skilled fight and incredibly good fight for the boxing purist is not the most marketable fight,

at least not right now. Do I pursue a fight with Jervante Davis, who may or may not want to fight me at this point? Or does Devin Haney move up? up to 140 pounds and start to campaign at a new weight class. What do you think is the best option right now for Devin Haney? Best option for boxing fans and the best option for Devin Haney's pockets is Duranta Davis fight.

Clearly. I mean, that's by far the most marketable fight and the biggest commercial fight. The Shakur fight, I feel like as of when you started recording this, I think is out the window now because I don't think Haney is going to be back with Top Rank, according just from tweets. You would probably know better than me. But I just thought. Yeah, let me just to put a button on that, like, I think it was Pauli Malinaji that first said that Devin Haney resigned with Top Rank.

He didn't resign there. And not because he didn't want to. Maybe he didn't want to, but Top Rang also didn't offer him anything. That's what I was told explicitly. They didn't offer him extension. Not to say that they won't if they have the right fight for him. But as of right now, they have not offered Devin Haney and extension. So a lot of that is kind of, it's social media.

It's much ado about nothing in a way. Right. Yeah, so I still don't think that fight with Shakur makes a lot of sense right now. Chakor just moved up to 135. It would be awesome. I would love to watch it. I just don't see that happening with the whole business sense of the sport. He can also, if you want to stay at 135, this is the least sexiest of all the options.

I'm sure there's a mandatory coming up. I spoke to Jake Donovan, who is the master of the rankings, and he actually keeps track of all that. IBF Gustavo Lemos is the next up at 135. I don't think that's the case, but hey, maybe Devin needs a breather. No offense to Mr. Limos, that's a tune-up fight for him and to stay busy. It gets to the fentanyl's belt to see where everything lines out. The 140 move is intriguing because Devin can kind of take it into his hands, which she's pretty much done his entire career. He's curated his career beautifully from a business standpoint.

At 140, you can use the WBO's clause, where if he's the WBO champion at a lower rate, you move up, you can contend for a title right away. It's what Joshua, or excuse me, Ussik did. with Joshua. The WBO title fight is Tiofimo and Taylor. But once again, that's a top rank controlled fight. Tiofimo can go on social media and say I'm done with top rank. I don't see the contracts.

One of the things that you would probably know better than me, that's another whole top rank issue. So there are a lot of options. I mean, I don't know what the best one is. I mean, for fan's sake, it's Javanta Davis versus Haney. For Haney's sake, moving up to 140 is interesting because he can kind of maybe reset a little bit,

take stock of what's going on there. But then again, like those aren't like huge money fights. He said, I will stick around 135 because it, those what the money fights are. And who's to say, like he can rewrite some of the things we've seen for years now

is marinating fights, not waiting to get into big fights here in your 30s, mid-30s. Who's to say he can't just do it now? Like, go ahead and fight everyone before you turn 27, 28. You're in your prime, make all your money, and then you can figure out what you want to do after that.

So it's very, very intriguing to see what, Devin Haney is going to do. His dad's a pretty good manager. I really like Bill Haney. He's done great stuff for his son so far. So I'm just going to sit back and watch and see what he does because it's really intriguing. Yeah, if I'm Devin Haney, the only thing that keeps me at 135 is Jervante Davis, because that is by far the most lucrative fight that's going to be available to him. Devin Haney, Jervante Davis is a monster. It is a monster fight. Maybe it's not as marketable. as Ryan Garcia, Jervante Davis, but it is certainly a lot more compelling and more competitive

in the ring. And you have a great contrast in styles with Jervante Davis, this power counterpuncher who can knock you out at any time. And Devin Haney, this disciplined boxer, who can box circles around you if he gets you in the right moment. So I love that fight. If I'm Devin Haney, I'm willing to stay at 135 to make that fight. I don't know how possible that is. I know Devin Haney is now a free agent. And if I'm Bill Haney, I'm finding my way to getting Al Haman's bat phone number and having a conversation with him about the feasibility of making that fight happen. I don't believe Devin Haney would submit to the same restrictions that Ryan Garcia submitted to.

He's publicly said, no rehydration clause. He's not going to take any kind of catch weight for this fight. He's going to do it straight up 135. And he's going to want his piece of the pie. You know, he may not be as marketable as Jervante Davis, but he sees himself as the undisputed champion, the number one guy in the lightweight division, and he wants to be rewarded accordingly. If I'm the Haney's, I talk to Al Haman and I see if I can make that fight happen. Other than that, nah, pass.

Look, Shakur Stevenson, Dan is going to be available at some point. Devin Haney mentioned this at the press conference after his fight. Shakor and Devin Haney are going to fight sometime, somewhere, some weight in the future. I think it's more likely to happen at 140 or even 147. than it is at 135. If it happens at 140, Shakur will have time to build himself up,

win some titles, become even more marketable. Same thing for Devin Haney. So that's a fight that makes sense to ultimately put off. At 140, there's a chance for Devin Haney to quickly kind of follow

the path that leads to all the belts at 140 pounds. You mentioned the WBO rule there, and he could go for that. But I think it's more likely that Devin looks the, take kind of a lesser fight at 140 early to see how he feels at the weight class to test himself out. Let's say he goes back with Matron, which is something a lot of people believe is going to

happen because the bromance between the Haney's and Eddie Hearn is real. Like that is, that is legitimate. They all love each other. I've seen it first time, haven't you? I've seen it. I've seen the bromance. I've seen the eyes they make at each other at these press conferences. It's a sight to see. And look, Eddie Hearn is starting to invest in 140 pound division. He signs Regis Progray. He's got Richardson Hitchens. Montana Love fighting in July. That's a pretty decent B-level fight where the winner becomes kind of a B-plus level guy. The winner of that fight, in my mind, would be perfect for Devin Haney. You take on the winner of Hitchens versus Montana Love. That's a good fight. It's not the most

difficult fight. And you can see where you're at at 140. And then you win that fight. Hey, we just program. He's ready to go. He'll fight you at 140 pounds. Look, I think there's a possibility that Ryan Garcia winds up fighting Roli-Romer. I don't think that's all talk. I think that's certainly possible. If Ryan Garcia beats Roli Romero, all of a sudden, Ryan's got a belt,

Devin could have a belt, and you could be talking about Devin Haney versus Ryan Garcia in a super fight sometime in the middle of 2024. I just think everything at 135, if it's not tank, it doesn't matter at this point. There are better options for Devin

where he doesn't have to kill himself to get down to a weight that he's been fighting at for his entire boxing career. That's really good points. And that's why it's even more intriguing. It's like we haven't really put much stock into the 140 thing. We're kind of like on this hire right now where we're getting all these big fights and boxing friends aren't used to it.

Even us as media members aren't used to it. Like we're going just taking big fight, big fight, big fight. But we know it's like, okay, we'll still get those big fights. But you've got to slow it down a little bit. These training camps are hard. These press tours are hard. Not saying that a hainy hitching fight would be, you know, something where he doesn't have to train hard for. There would be pressure on him.

But it's not the same pressure as going right into a time. tank fight or right into a Shakur fight but just to go back to the Haney tank thing another reason I would like to see that fight um as being like a boxing nerd would be the I think would be some of the most interesting negotiations ever because it's like hey uh the javan uh Haney goes to Javanta I got all the belts so I'm on the A side Javatha goes I don't give a shit about belts and then uh Geron that goes well uh you got to want to find me I'm the money guy and you go I got all the belts like I mean you got to want these you know this is what boxing is about no no I'm the guy you don't want to fight me oh well see you later I'll go fight

uh you know Frank Martin at 135 so that's intriguing to me that's that whole tank thing where he's kind of right rewriting the history or rewriting the books and kind of doing it in his own way where belts don't exactly matter which I kind of love but I'd be intriguing a guy with all the belts versus a guy who doesn't really care about the belts and it's clearly a bigger star than Haney like the boxing nerd in me would love to see how that negotiation will play out Yeah, the only reason I think that Gervante could be interested in that fight is that I don't know where he goes without it. I mean, I guess he could jump up to 140 again and fight Romero in a rematch for a real belt at 140 pounds. I suppose that's a possibility, though I don't think it's likely again.

I think Romero versus Ryan Garcia is something to keep your eye on over the next couple of months once Ryan Garcia gets settled in his new training camp. And other than that, like, I don't even know who PBC has at that 130, 135 range. I mean, he's beaten the 130s. He's beaten the 135s. It's just not fertile ground right now for Javante Davis. I don't know if I'm missing someone.

I don't know, but Frank Martin. I don't see him fighting Frank Martin, though. I just don't see him fighting Frank Martin. If you just go by the PBC roster, if you just go by the PVC roster, it's Frank Martin jumps to the top of the list because he's simply like process of elimination. I was looking at PVC guys that fight at 135.

It's Frank Martin and I'm probably missing, like you said, like no one like notable that you'd be like demand for a fight. The best fights for Jervanta are across the aisle fights. Yeah, and you see top rank starting to load up on the guys at 135. They signed George Cambosis because they believe if Devin Haney vacates his belt, Cambos is going to be in line for an IBF title shot if he beats Maxi Hughes in July. So, you know, it's just it's going to be difficult for Javonto. to find a super marketable fight.

He doesn't need one. He makes a bunch of money and he sells out arenas without marketable fights, frankly. But if he wants a mega fight, it's right there for him to take right now against Devin Haney.

And we'll see if he decides to go that route. The other news at the end of last week that was interesting was Ryan Garcia's announcement that he will be training with Derek James for his next fight. Ryan, of course, left Joe Gousson

after three fights, left him immediately after the loss to Jervante Davis. And now he's going to go to Dallas and start training with Derek James, who notably has Errol Spence in his stable, has got Jermal Charlow in his stable, and more recently has Anthony Joshua in his stable. So Derek James is well known.

He's a former trainer of the year. But was this the right move by Ryan Garcia? Time will tell. I think it's the right move in terms of him getting back on track, focusing. I've heard a lot of rumble. Blings for you heard too. The camp was a little messy.

His last camp with Goosin and a lot of cooks in the kitchen. Ryan Garcia, this kind of eliminates a lot of that. Derek James is the consensus trainer of the year. No nonsense type of guy runs a tight ship. Not only that, Ryan's going to be, he's going to be training alongside some of the best.

He's going to be training alongside Joshua when Joshua was in town. Errol Spence, Jamil Charlo, Frank Martin, like we just said earlier. That helps. I know you can just say, hey,

he had the same thing with Canel. he had a pretty good stable there. Things went awry. But maybe Ryan seems like he's got his head on straight a little more, kind of realizing that, you know, if I really want to have a career in the sport, it's like now or never. I said after the fight with Tank that he was at somewhat of a career crossroads.

I understand it's very dramatic, but it's true. I mean, he's beefing with his promoter. He's changing a trainer for the third or fourth time. He doesn't know exactly what's next. He just lost the first fight of his career. So I do think this brings a lot of stability.

We're going to see how all in he is. Is he going to move to Texas or is he just going to dart in, dart out for training camps? I know he's posted on social media that I love Texas and I can see myself living here. He says, you know, kids say a lot of things. So who knows if he'll actually do it. But I think it's a step in the right direction in terms of that. In terms of James' style, like I'm not sure it's a perfect fit in terms of how Derek James trains his fighters. I understand he's very versatile.

Like he has Errol Spence, who we said earlier, is a guy that throws close to 70 punches around, and you have Jermel Charlo, who's the complete opposite. He's a low volume, high accuracy, game-changing power. That's more along the lines of what Ryan Garcia is. Ryan Garcia doesn't throw a lot of punches. He plods forward, got really, doesn't have the best footwork. Maybe Derek James can work on that. If James could look at Ryan Garcia in the same light as a Jermel Charlo,

I know that sounds like a crazy comparison, but if you just go by the punch volume, Ryan has great power. Maybe you can lean more into that. Working on the footwork at this age seems a little tough. But I think it's a step in the right direction for Ryan. But of course, you know, time will tell. Time will tell with this kid. Yeah, I'm kind of with you on maybe it's the right move. I have all the respect in the world for Derek James.

The job he's done with Charlo, with Errol Spence. remarkable. Now with Frank Martin, he's an excellent trainer. The common thread, though, with those guys is that Derek James has had them from a very early age. And when you have guys, you know, when you can mold guys from the beginning, it's a lot different than taking someone that is not a finished product, as in Ryan Garcia, but someone that's been fighting a certain way for a long period of time and is preset in those ways. Changing those types of fighters is difficult. Historically, has only been a handful of trainers that have had levels of success doing that. Emmanuel Stewart was one of the best at it. I mean, he was kind of one of the better guns for hires

out where he would take a fighter, figure out what's wrong with them. Usually it's a heavyweight, and he would do good things with him. Freddie Roach has a great track record for that. Mani Pachio being a high profile example, Miguel Cotto. Freddie coaxed a lot of him later in who I think Teddy Atlas has done some good things with fighters in kind of one-off or two-off situations that he's taken on. I don't know that Derek James can do that. I mean, I watched the Anthony Joshua fight.

I didn't see, you know, any kind of market improvement in Joshua. Yeah, it was only one fight. And he'll be back in camp, getting ready for the next one. But I'll need to see it to see if Derek James can be that guy with AJ. The other thing is that I kind of worry about. Like, Ryan Garcia, when he went with Joe Gusson, Like at that time, Joe Gusson was kind of a cool name, right? He was on Fox.

He was visible. He had a lot of success back in the day, most notably with Diego Corrales. Hadn't trained anybody a while, but he had worked with Ryan Garcia very early in his career, so there was some familiarity there. So that was kind of why he went with Joe Gousen. Right now, Derek James, in addition to being a great trainer, is the cool name, right? Like Derek James is the cool name. He's the hot name that's out there.

He's got Spence. He's got Charlo. Anthony Joshua agreed to move from England. to go and work with Derek James. He's kind of that cool name. So I don't know if Ryan Garcia is going with Derek James because he's the right fit or because he sees the stars that Derek James has built up and believes he can do the same thing for me.

I've been on record, Dan, for a couple of months now, really ever since the goose and slit became official. And it kind of was half joking at the start. But I pointed to the guy to train Sergio Amora, Dean Campos, Southern California. Like Sergio, as much as I mock him, had some of the best footwork in boxing during his heyday. Sergio was an excellent defensive fighter during his heyday.

These are the things that Ryan Garcia like needs. He needs improvement on his footwork. He needs improvement with his defense. Now, I don't know if Dean can take a finished product and work with him and break him down. I know he'd try and he would really make Ryan Garcia work on his footwork and not focus on his power or speed and all the things that made him great. That's why I think Ryan Garcia needs.

He needs someone to break him down at the fundamental level and make him a better fight. It's what Emmanuel Stewart did with Vladimir Klitsko. He took Vladimir Klitsko and said, you are no longer this brawler that's getting into, you know, street fights with, what was it, Corey Sanders, and, you know, guys that used to beat up on Vladimir earlier this career. You are using your size. You are using your reach. You're going to bore the hell of some people sometimes, but you're going to win a lot of fights fighting this way. Klitschko turned into one of the dominant heavyweights of his era because he fought that way. That's what I think Ryan Garcia needs.

I don't know if it's Dean Campos. I don't know if it's Freddie Roach. I don't know who it is. But I'm not sure that it's going to be Derek James. Yeah, it's a tale is all this time. It's like you said, hiring the sexy name, the invogue trainer, the guy that has all the trainer of the year has all the fighters. Like time will tell for sure. And like you said, is he going to be able to mesh right away?

like I like Ryan Garcia but he has a lot of flaws like the footwork that takes a while like that takes that's not something you're going to fix in an eight week camp you know offense to Dean Campos he's not like a sexy name so I can see why Ryan wouldn't want to go with that he's a Ryan's a guy that likes to make a splash and this is a splashy move he certainly did it yeah so we'll see like we'll say like I'm optimistic Dan that's what they call me I'm a pretty optimist uh optimistic for a boxing fan I was pretty excited when I first saw it because I felt like Like it indicated that he was taking his career very serious. But we'll see.

That's the most I could say on that. I'm glad that he's leaving Southern California and getting out of his comfort zone a little bit. I mean, I hope that, like, some of the things he did, you know, using the midst with his brother and, you know, from what I heard, like, you know, doing the body work with his brother. I think he got to leave all that stuff behind. Like, if you want to bring family down there, great. You like being around family fine. But when you're in that gym and you're working, it's got to be Derek James's way or the

highway. It can't be anything like what you've done in the past. I think he's plateaued for what he is right now. And I think now he needs, you know, somebody to add something to his game to make him a little bit better because 140 pounds is a dangerous division. That is a bunch of killers up there at 140. Maybe not Roli Romero, but when you start talking about Regis progrey and Subriel Matias and the winner of Teifima Lopez versus Josh Taylor and eventually Devin Haney, you have got to be at your best to beat these guys. Ryan's got a lot of confidence in himself, and I like that about him. I like that he took on the challenge of Gervante Davis at an early stage of his career. I like that he acquiesced to a lot of the demands that

were made by Gervante Davis, but he's got to get better if he's going to be an elite guy at 140, 147 or eventually wherever he winds up. All right. Last thing I want to ask you about, We've got a rematch this weekend over in England. Marisio Lara, who at one point was like this opponent that Eddie Hearn found to fight Josh Warrington. Now he is 126-pound title holder and one of the scariest punchers in all of boxing. He is going back to Lee Wood's backyard to take on Wood in a rematch. The last fight a few months ago ended with Lee Wood on his back.

Got up, but was shaky. Ben Davidson stops the fight. Probably did the right thing in that moment. Marisio Lara, time after time, whether it's against Josh Warrington, Lee Wood, he has shown he has bone crushing power at 126. Lee Wood activated this rematch dam very quickly, was immediately saying, I want to run this back. Is this, is this and was this the right decision for Lee Wood to make?

I don't think it was the right decision. This fight was only three months ago. Like, this is unheard of. Unheard of. Like, Oscar Valdez is coming back, April, August 12th. But he wasn't knocked out in his last fight. uh like six months seems to be the norm i look back and even like the hey days like you would see go on box rack you see a rematch and six months later it's pretty standard

i do think that like lee wood burst onto the scene i think people will forget that he's like 33 34 years old he might think this is his last chance at a at a title even though i think it really isn't because if lara wins uh or you know lara could have went on to fight warrington uh and eddie could have say hey lee why don't you take a few months off uh we'll have lara fight warrington He's spit on his face. You can sell it. And then how we'll circle back and you'll get your shot. But I mean, he's going right into it.

You got to give him credit. Do I think it's the right move? Absolutely not. I would go ahead and put money on Lara knockout because I'm that confident. I think Lee Wood has a lot of deficiencies when it comes to defense. He does he was winning though. I think maybe that's in the back of his mind. You know, I was winning that fight.

He was up in that fight until he got absolutely laid out. That's the thing about Lara. I think he's one of the top five points. in boxing. I think he's box office, must watch type of guy, a smaller weight and matcham's going to do their, their magic and try to build him up. Intriguing. Featherweight's really intriguing. You know, I got another fight there too with Conlin and Lopez, and there's a lot of good names that feather the way. It doesn't get a lot of pub because I feel like 130, 135, 140 right now and obviously not 147, Spence Crawford are getting all the eyeballs,

but featherweight's fun. Like, it's not the biggest fights, but they're fun fights. Laura has to be making a killing just beating up on these Brits. Like he goes to the UK and just pounds Josh Warrington. And look, I think Josh Warrington caught a break seven months later when that rematch was stopped in the second round because of the cut over Lara's eye. Like Josh Warrington was battered in that fight. Maricio Lara beat him up. And the fact that Josh Warrington took that rematch seven months later seemed crazy to me. I thought he caught a break when that fight was stopped in the second round.

I think there's merit to your point about Lee Wood maybe thinking this is his last stand. He's in the latter stages of his career. If he turns down the fight, I guess he could fight Warrington in a fight that didn't involve a title, but Warrington's coming off that loss to Lopez and the shine is really off him. And I think you're right, too, that in Wood's mind, you know, six, seven rounds of this fight, he was winning, however long it went before the stoppage. He was landing big shots. He was controlling the fight with his size.

He just got caught by a left hook from hell from Maricio Lara that put him down and put him out. So there's got to be something in his mind that makes him believe he's going to win a decision in a rematch. But a guy like Lara that just has power from everywhere. And after a guy knocks you out like that, that leaves a mark. That takes something out of you. Yeah, it's got to be the back of your head, right? It's got to be in the back of your mind. Like, yeah, you can go be confident and be like, yeah, I was up seven rounds.

But, okay, the fight ended with you in one of the, like, better knockouts of the year. It's an interesting move. It should be a fun fight. But, yeah, I was a little puzzled by that, especially the three-month turnaround. That's nuts. Lars should just move to the UK permanently or moved to somewhere on that continent. Because if he beats Wood, does Warrington out there, who went explicably wants a third fight with

Lara. And then, let's say Michael Conlin wins and has a belt at 126 when he fights Lopez. I mean, I don't give Conlon much of a chance against Laura. I think Conlin's a little bit too chiny in a situation like that. It's a good chance

for Laura to get rich and increase his profile exponentially just by staying overseas in the UK area. I like Robesie Ramirez. I think he's one of the best featherweight. He's got those those sustainable skills. He got the defense. He's very hard to hate. He's got the pedigree. I think Lara and Rebesi Ramirez are the two best. They would probably deliver the best fight in terms

of styles. Probably won't see it because the promotions getting in the way. You know, we might see it, though, because those guys, like Rabisi Ramirez is a tremendously skilled, but he's not the most marketable guy at this point. I would imagine the top rank, you know, if whoever wins out of the Conlon Lopez fight, they match that fighter up with Ramirez next. And look, once you've got two belts of Lars is out there with the third. third and there's no big time marketable fights out there. That's a deal that can be made between these two guys. And it is, to your point, a clash of styles.

That's terrific. I mean, Ramirez is a puncher. Don't get me wrong, but he is a brilliant boxer, whereas Lara is brute force. A little wild or a lot wild at times, but he is brute force in there in the ring. And you got Ray Vargas just lurking. He's the WBC champ. I know his last time was at 130, so people kind of forget. Like, it's an interesting to be.

I think of Brandon Figueroa, who I feel like it's on the outside kind of looking in. PBC doesn't have, besides Vargas, I don't even know if he's still with the BBC, but he's the WBC champ. Figueroa is another top six-ish or seven-ish featherweight who's probably on the outside looking in because he just, you know, all the fights are with other promotions. Yeah. Spund Division. And it will be a couple of minutes like, yeah, PBC will be playing musical chairs with that

WBC belt. Like Stephen Fulton, whatever happens at the interway fight, he'll be moving up to you're on 26. Maybe he's a candidate to fight Figueroa, fight Vargas. Yeah, that that belt might stay on that side of the street

for a while. But either way, Lara versus Wood, look, I was gripped to that fight while it was happening. It was a great fight, you know,

throughout. I hope this one is equally as compelling. All right, catch Dan Kenobio. John Boy Media, inside boxing live. Check him out Friday in Orlando,

the debut of the most valuable prospects, series in Orlando, Florida that you can watch live on the zone. Dan, appreciate your time, man. Thanks for joining me. Thanks for having me. And when we come back, Welterweight contender, Alexis Rocha. All right, so I very recently finished moving. I mean, I guess you'd never really finished moving because a lot of things associated with a move that take up your time from furniture delivery to taking out stuff that is already there to home repair, home remodeling. all that right now. The most invaluable resource I have had during this process is Angie.

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you can have Angie tackle your home service project from start to finish. Or you can research and connect with local pros. for your specific project. So download the free Angie mobile app today or visit Angie.com. That's A-N-G-I-com. All right, Alexis Rocha is a 147-pound contender on Saturday. He'll be back in the ring when he takes on Anthony Young

in a fight that was originally scheduled for back in January. Rocha Young will take place Saturday. That's a fight you can watch live on DeZone. And Alex, before we get into the Young fight, and everything about it. Over the last couple of months, you have been mentioned with Terrence Crawford. You are the number one contender for Crawford's WBO Welterweight title.

There was even a, I believe, a purse bid, I don't know if it was ordered, but discussed at some point. Walk me through kind of the last couple of months for you and why we're seeing you fight Anthony Young and not a fight with Terrence Crawford. Yeah, so WBO ordered a purse bid with Terrence Crawford. And I believe we had, this was ordered, I want to say late February. And it was the purse bid started March 17th, 16th. So we had a couple weeks.

So we just kind of had to just waited see what was going on with Crawford's team. You know, we just kind of waited to see what was going on. And I believe the day before or two days before the purse bid was going on, we got word that Eric Gomez got word from Crawford seemed that Crawford was pursuing a fight with Spence and they were negotiates to talk

so that would leave us on the sidelines. So we weren't going to do that. So I want to thank Golden Boy and I want to think the zone for opening up a TV spot for me and putting me on the main event and keeping me busy. So a few questions on that. The purse bid gives you some power in that situation.

Because if it goes to a purse bid and there's an actual bid, you know, that fights, you know, it's going to happen one way or the other. Or one of you would have to withdraw. As we sit here talking middle of May, maybe Spence Crawford happens. Maybe it doesn't. Did you expect there to be some kind of announcement for Spence Crawford by this point in the calendar? I honestly did. we've heard that there was going to be an announcement on the rank tank card on the rank tank card and you know where everyone was waiting for it but nothing ever happened so i'm surprised

it's taking this long i don't know what's the hold up but you know i got i got to keep doing my job i got to focus on me would you knowing what where we're at right now where there has been no announcements would you do anything differently would you have pushed for that purse bid about a month to go. Are you happy to be kind of in this situation where you get a kind of a stay busy fight before you go into that? Would you have done anything differently? I don't know what I would have done different. I would have, I would sit back and talk to my team about it. Don't know what I would done because I'm new to this. I'll be honest. The whole explains me of the first bit, I'm like, okay, that's going on. What this is going on. We have to win.

And to me, it was, it was new, no. This is a whole, this is, I'm new to this. And, you know, I'm very grateful for all this going on. I'm beyond blessed for all this because all of this got me from my hard work. And, you know, as a stay busy fight, I don't look at any stay busy fights. Every fight's dangerous, you know, with Anthony Young in the table, he's going to come to win. He's not going to, he's not going to be nervous in a sense. He's not going to go in there and he's counted to lose. I know that.

You know, people are looking at me as the favorite. And with Anthony Young across my ring, you know, that night, you know, I can't take anyone lightly, especially going to come and want to take my dreams away. And, you know, that doesn't sit well with me. Yeah, stay busy probably the wrong phrase. Stay active is probably the right better way to put it because we've seen a lot of times guys waiting for fights to happen, wind up sideline, four months, five months, six months. You're here, middle of May, getting your second fight in this calendar year, which in boxing is ultra-active nowadays, being fighting twice. in a year. Before I get to Young,

if you get through this fight, if you beat Anthony Young, is your mindset, look, whether it's a purse bid, a vacated title, whatever, that WBO Welterweight title shop that you've earned, is yours next? You know, it's, everyone always asking that question, Chris, and I'm going to tell you the same thing I tell everyone.

You have to tell me that. You have to tell me something different that you tell everybody. You have to give me the unique answer. I have this tunnel vision. You know that, Manix. I have this tunnel vision and I'm not going to overlook anyone and you can literally ask me after the fight you know I got to focus on me

I will I absolutely will ask you after the right I'll be standing there in the ring with you asking that very same question after the fight like so you were preparing for Anthony Young back in January he withdrew you wound up facing George Ashley what kind of fighter were you preparing for that fight

you know I've seen tape of him you know he's a guy that comes to fight he's a guy that wants a counterpunch. He's going to want to mix it up. He's going to want to tangle me, you know, fight me in the inside. And, you know, I looked a lot of tape and, you know, I'm prepared for this. Physically, mentally, you know, I'm ready. You beat George Ashey your last time out.

You get the stoppage win in that fight. How did you feel about that performance? It wasn't my best performance. It really wasn't my best performance. I was staying in the pocket too much. I was getting hit with shots that I should have not gotten hit. And that was more of my mistake because I knew he was a smaller guy coming up and weight. If it was a 140-pounder, you probably would have hurt the guy. Me being a bigger

47-pounder, he was not hurting me at all. So I was taking the necessary dumb shots. And those are the mistakes I need to, I need to correct. Not correct, but I need, I can snap out of it. I know I can step back. I do it all the time in sparring, but just that fight, some other fights, these guys hit me and I'm like, all right, I could exchange me knowing that I'm a heavy punch and I'm strong physically. I know that I can sit in the pocket and, you know, underestimate those shots, but I can't be doing that in this type of this level right now that I'm in. I know I've got to take more corrections, and that's what I've been working on this game plan. Not my game plan, but in my performance is from here on now. Yeah, and it's funny when I was talking to your trainer,

Hector Lopez over the last couple of months, you know, one of the reasons he was, I don't know, happy's the right word, but okay with you getting. this kind of in-between fight is that he did see things needed to correct. He did see some things you need to work on before you stepped up to that world championship level against the fighter like Crawford. So what has been different about this camp? What kind of work have you done to try to improve on some of the things from the Ashy fight? Me, not stepping in.

They throwing my combinations, breaking them down, but taking that step back, taking those sides, you know, move that head more, move my waist more, just more on the defense side. You feel happy with the way you've developed offensively because even though you took some shots. I mean, you were, it was fun to watch, Alexis. You were in there and you were ready to bang with that guy. Yeah, it's fun to watch, but it's not good for my long-term health. I don't want to be taking shots like that. But yeah, definitely, you know, I have a fan-friendly style. You know, I could bang, you know, I could box. And I haven't showed that I could box. I have a very nice amateur background. You know, I practice it all the time in sparring, but sometimes

I rely too much on my power sometimes or apply. I rely on my, me being strong physically. and trying to bully these guys away, but that doesn't always work. You've got to use your brains, and I'm understanding that now to not get hit, to use my defense, they hit and not get hit, just like Mayweather's serves.

How do you balance that, though? I mean, being a great offensive fighter is not only what makes you successful, it makes you entertaining. It helps draw the crowds to come see you fight. How do you balance good offense with enough defense? I believe using the defense as a counterpunch. it comes very natural to me.

You know, if you were seeing me in sparring, it's very natural to me counterpunching, taking those steps, using those angles. But like I said, I've relied too much on it. I'm not going to fall back on that. That's not my bread and butter. I know what I could do.

I know what more I could bring to the table. And it's very easy for me being a Southpaw, you know, slipping the right hand or slipping the hook, slipping bobbing and weaving. We just saw your stablemate, Ryan Garcia, drop a loss or take a loss to Javante Davis.

I mean, great for Ryan Garcia for stepping up, being fearless in that moment. Give him all the credit in the world for that. Just, I think part of the reason to my eyes, Alexis, that he lost was because I don't know if he was quite ready for that stage against that caliber of an opponent. Is there anything you can learn from watching that as you kind of prepare for your big step up, you know, down the line this year or whatever? Really, you have to believe in yourself. You know, if you believe in yourself and you put yourself to that pedal stool and then you train as hard as you can, you have that self-belief, you know, it's going to get there. You're going to be there. You're going to be on top of all the names. You know, you just have to have that chip on show, that confidence in you, to go out there and say, this guy's not going to take it from me or I have to go and take it from this guy. I have to fight whoever it is. What's your confidence level with your skills right now? I mean, I'm very confident.

I'm a very confident guy. I know that I have to work on things and I don't have to improve on things. And that's what drives me. That's when it gets me out of bed. It's the fear of not losing but letting myself down that drives me. And to every fighter, I believe there's every fear and every fighter. And if they say there isn't, then they're bullshitting because no one wants to lose. No one wants to get humiliated.

And that's what drives a fighter. your promoter Oscar Delahoya one of the all-time great welter weights as well in addition to other weight classes what's been his advice to you as you started to move towards that elite level over the last year or so I really talked to Oscar as much but he's always telling me that I'm very close you know just stay busy stay hungry and he's always telling me never lose never lose sight of what's what's to come what's to come next anthony young on Saturday Fantasy Springs in Indio, California That's a fight you can watch live on the zone. Glad to see you get back, Alexis,

and you better believe I'll have a Terrence Crawford question for you if you come out victorious in that ring on Saturday night. Thank you, Chris. And when we come back, this week's picks. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential.

Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all. embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators,

and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right what you need to be. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to? to do a little kill. Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J.

And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack.

So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS. on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history.

Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All right, time now for this week's picks, and it was a tough week last week. I thought I was giving you two winners. I gave you two losers. Katie Taylor drops the decision to Shantel Cameron. I should have known better. Vasily Lomachenko drops the decision to Devin Haney. I thought Lomacheco won the fight,

but I should have known better. Shout out to the guy in the MGM Grand Garden Arena that was shouting at me from the upper level that he took my advice on these picks. I saw you, I heard you, I remember you, I apologize. for that. This week, the fight that I am locked in on is the 126-pound title fight over in England. You've got Lee Wood, Maricio Alara, part two. It was just a few months ago that Maricio

O'Lara stopped Lee Wood with a spectacular knockout, left hand, put Lee Wood down and ultimately out. Lara coming into this fight, understandably a pretty significant favorite. He's at minus 320, Lee Wood plus 230 to win. Lara by knockout is minus 190. Honestly, I thought those odds would be even worse because Lara's not a great boxer and his best chance to win is to stop Lee Wood again. And Lee Wood has been stopped now a couple of times and that knockout loss was pretty nasty if we're being honest. Lee Wood, to win by points is at plus 420. I almost want to go there. I almost want to take Lee Wood to win by decision because he was winning that fight before Maricio Lara knocked him out.

but I think Lara is such a vicious puncher that he's going to win this fight and he's going to win by knockout. So my official prediction, Maricio O'Lara to win minus 3.20, you want to get into the method of victory, Maricio Alara, to win by knockout at minus 190. Tempted to take Lee Wood, but I want to give you a winner this week. And I think Maricio O'Lara is just too big a puncher for Lee Wood to hang with him over 12 rounds. Those are my picks. Hopefully they're better than last week.

That's it for this week's episode. My thanks to Dan Kenobio and Alexis Roachiff for joining the show. As always, subscribe, rate, review this podcast on Apple Podcast, Spotify, wherever you download podcast. And I'll see you next week. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel.

help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast. The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that

not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. others say it's unleashing human potential.

Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.