The Herd with Colin Cowherd - 'Boys and Girl - SNF Vikings Loss Reaction; Potential Garrett Replacements; The Athletic Cowboys Writer Jon Machota

Episode Date: November 12, 2019

On today’s episode of the 'Boys and Girl Podcast, Jane and Bobby recap the brutal week 10 loss to the Vikings. Who might be in consideration for the job if Jason Garrett were fired? Plus, Jon Machota from The Athletic stops by..Follow Jane and Bobby on Twitter and subscribe to get all the latest inside information from two of the most connected people in the Cowboys' community.  Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Hello, boys and girls. Welcome in to the Boys and Girl podcast with Cowboys NFL Network reporter Jane Slater and NFL network producer Bobby Belt. a Cowboys community with the inside scoop on the Dallas Cowboys. Now, coming straight to you from the Lone Star State, here's Jane and Bobby. All right, well, full disclosure, everyone. I'm battling a little bit of what I think is a sinus infection, but I'm going to push through this adversity and this setback, hopefully a little bit better than a Dallas Cowboys did against the Minnesota Vikings on Sunday night football. That was a tough one, Bobby.

Yeah, it was. And we've talked a lot about what is this team? team's identity. And that's been the question. And, you know, I think a lot of people are saying, well, now we're heading into week 11 and, you know, we're still trying to figure out the identity. No, you've got the identity now. The identity is, this is a team that beats up on bad teams and can't find the lucky bounces against the good teams. You know, a lot of times people say you make your own luck. This team doesn't make their own luck against the good teams. You know, and I've long argued that DAC is different than Tony Romo in the sense that he finds ways to win instead of

loose. And he certainly tried to do that last night, despite getting down four. 14 note in the, to start this game. I mean, this looked like it was going to get out of hand early. The way that Dak settled in there and the way that he put them in a position to get the win and the final minutes of this game, I think is perhaps the most frustrating thing. And look, I appreciate that the players, Jalen Smith and then last night, Dak Prescott once again pointing the fingers, not at the coaching staff, but at themselves, saying they need to do a better job of executing on the plays.

And while you could make that argument, I think, for a lot of the defensive players, Last night on offense, they were winning in spite of. Oh, yeah. No, I think this was very reminiscent of the Green Bay game. They played minus the turnovers. So the Green Bay game got so out of control so early because they kept turning the ball over. And that's what undid a lot of it. But, I mean, if you look at it, it's very similar.

It's prolific passing attack from DAC. It's, you know, you cannot stop the opposing teams running back in the pass or the running game. They're just eating you up. It was very, Dalvin Cook was very much playing the way Aaron Jones did a few weeks ago. In fact, Dalvin Cook finished with 183 yards from scrimmage. Aaron Jones finished that game with 182. The Packers won that game 34 to 24. Vikings win this game 2824.

So similar performances outside of some of the silly mistakes that were made. So for those of us, and I was one of them who said, you know, well, what does that game look like against the Packers if they don't turn the ball over? Are they able to, you know, make more plays here? Are they able to put themselves in a position to win that game? You have your answer now. That was the Minnesota game last night. And they weren't able to pull it out.

And I think the other thing that stands out for me, Bobby, is this team's commitment to the run is admirable, right? They said that that's their identity. They're going to stick with the run. But on a night when it's not working out that you fail to convert a first down every time you run the ball, it seems as though if you're receiving cores as red hot as they are last night, why not trust them? For whatever reason, it's like they don't trust the passing game. They haven't trusted it in recent years. And like I said, I know that Zicchio Elliott in this run game, as they've said time and time again, as part of their identity.

And you and I talked about this today. It was a fairly balanced game when you look at the way that they were mixing in the run in the past. But when the run game is not working for you, and he go to it on second and then again on the third down, that leaves you sort of scratching your head going why? Yeah. And, you know, I had this debate a little bit with people on Twitter. So I was saying, you know, your linebackers haven't been good enough this year on defense. They're, you know, they've dropped the ball too many times. And somebody said, well, why is it?

The players are at fault on the defense, but on offense, it's the coaching step. So I think inherently, when you're on offense, you're on the offensive. And you can dictate where the play goes and you can avoid some of your weaknesses. And on defense, your reactionary, you are just reacting to what the defense does. There's only so much a defensive coaching staff can do to put you in a position. You've got to finish the plays. So I think on offense, the Cowboys crime or, or. the issue that they had where they failed was not moving away from a weakness late in the ball game.

And Dack said it after the game, and I think Jason Garrett said it as well, that part of the reason they were trying to run the ball there and pick up the first down was you don't want to leave them too much time left. That's dangerous for two reasons to me. One, you're worried about leaving too much time for your defense. What kind of a vote of confidence is that? Two, the assumption that you're going to score. You know, instead of just worrying about scoring, you're worrying about how you're going to score it in what time frame.

I mean, that's confidence, but it's confidence in the wrong thing, which is your running game, which at times the running games look good. You know, ZCAD back-to-back, really strong games against Philadelphia and then the Giants. But the Vikings are a different ballgame. That is a different defense, and you saw it last night. Eric Kendricks had a great game. And that's where it was a little confusing was the balance itself wasn't so bad. It was pretty even early on when the Cowboys got down. They finished the game with, I think, 48 or 49 pass plays and 20 rushes for Z,

22 runs total, I think, for the whole team. And so they definitely were throwing it more. But then you look at first down, and it's like 16 runs and 14 passes. You're putting DAC in these circumstances of 3rd and 8 and 3rd and 12. And, you know, he's making the plays. I mean, last night he was, I think Bill Barnwell had the stat that he was perfect. He picked up five first downs on five opportunities of 3rd down and 7 or longer. And if you look at DAC this year on third and 12 or longer, he is 11 of 17, 220 yards,

eight first downs. He's picking up a first down about half the time on third and 12, which is if you have, you know, 50% conversion rate on third down period, ignoring the down and dis, ignoring the distance, it's incredible. But to have that on third and 12 is Herkulean. So, Dax's doing everything he can to put them in the ballgame or to keep them in the ballgame. That's why it is a little funny.

You're backed up inside your 10. and Dak throws you down into the red zone. And all of a sudden... We don't trust him to throw you into the end zone. All of a sudden, you don't trust him to get it done. And instead you go to Zeke three times in a row. You go to him twice on the run play and then you try and, you know, throw him the ball on the outside. And again, matched up one-on-one with Eric Kendricks.

That's not the matchup you want with the way he was playing that game. So it just, it's odd that they seem to be forward-thinking at different points of the game. and you think they've come into the modern era with some of their, and then there are just other times where they go, let's throttle back a little bit. And so then the question, you know, I know that's getting tossed around this morning is, and throughout the afternoon and really will be up until their next game,

which is Sunday against Detroit, is where do you lay the blame? You know, again, we keep talking about the players, while admirable, keep pointing the fingers at themselves. You know, we've got to do a better job of executing. Well, Jason Garrett was asked on 1053 the fan about it this morning, and here's what he had to say. Coach, what was the thought process on that final drive on the second and third down before the Zeke in completion?

What were you guys thinking or what did you guys see that kind of led to the second and third down calls at the end? Yeah, again, you know, Kellan's calling the game and in that situation, it's second and two when he felt like he had a good opportunity against a favorable box to run the ball in those situations. And on each of those plays, we had options beyond just the run. And, you know, unfortunately, we weren't able to convert. And we got into that fourth down situation, didn't convert that. So obviously you want to continue that drive. You want to go score a touchdown there. Unfortunately, we didn't get it done.

So, you know, it is fascinating. You know, when they win, everyone wants to celebrate, you know, Kellyn Moore. He's done it despite Jason Garrett as the head coach. And then when they lose, everyone wants to blame Jason Garrett. Garrett. Yeah. No, and, you know, I think it was Kellan after the first loss of the year where he was out there with the media that week. And he's like, oh, so when we lose, Jason gets off the play, he's like, oh, sweet setup for me. He's like, but no, that doesn't fly. We can't do it that way. And that's true. At the end of the day, Kellan Moore is calling the plays. Now, the question is, and I guess where people are wondering who's at fault here is, is Kellan calling the play? And it's with Jason Garrett saying, why don't we go run here? Maybe Kellyn's picking the play, but Jason, and very well may be influencing if they're going to go run or pass. I know typically Wade Wilson talked about this years ago, the late Wade Wilson, talked about that when the Cowboys get in their

two-minute drill, that's generally scripted, or they significantly narrow down the playbook, and that they had, you know, each game plan has, you know, a handful of plays in it that they used during the two-minute drill. So I'm wondering if they were in their two-minute offense at that point, because when they got the ball back, there's a little under five minutes left. They were already in red zone by the time they were inside two minutes. So I wonder if, you know, there was a limited playbook or if they were working off a smaller playbook and that's where some of these run options came from. But ultimately it is a little odd that something that, I mean, Jerry said it after the game that you could have put up a sign at the beginning of the game that said Zeeks not going.

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And anywhere tonight. And for them to acknowledge that that was the case and then still try and, you know, ram their head into a brick wall, it's frustrating. What's the definition of insanity, Bobby? Yeah, doing the same thing over and over again, expecting a different result. And, you know, I think there's, at this point, it's okay, well, who's the insane one? Is Jason Garrett the insane one? Is Kelly Moore or is Jerry Jones the insane one for putting Jason Garrett out there every single

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Stop. We'll get into that in a second. But, you know, typically when your parents are just really upset with you and they're, it's like the stoic icing, that's what it felt like to me. The silence is the word. The silence is deadly. And there was a word that he used that I'm curious about how deadly. Because we've always talked about Jerry Jones says things that are purposeful, right? Yeah, he's very calculated.

Very calculated. He said to the reporters after the game, he says, quote, it's disappointing. Disappointing will have to pay for this one. Hopefully it won't be terminal. Terminal to their season? Terminal to their coaching staff. I mean, I think he's talking. all encompassing because if it's terminal to their season,

it's terminal to their coaching staff. A little bit early to call it, though? It is, but I mean, that's, I think that's the thing. This was a big game for them. Because as we said, this was going to be, are they contenders or are they pretenders? And this is now out of the six teams that are currently, if the season ended today, the six teams that are in the playoffs for the NFC,

Dallas has played three of them. They've lost all three. They are one and four against everybody except the NFC, except the NFC. This year, the Cowboys have beat the NFC East and the Miami Dolphins. That is it. It's staggering to me, Bobby, because, you know, we talked about heading into the season, just how different this team looked, right?

And we saw it in the first couple of games. Like, look, there is the offense that we were talking about. And I see the talent out there. Oh, yeah. I mean, we'll get into Amari Cooper in a little bit. We've seen Michael Gallup's development. Now there are a couple of incompletions. You know, Michael still has some of the dropsy's,

but he also still makes some pretty impressive catches for a second year wide receiver. That broken play against the Giants where he danced along the sideline and scored the touchdown. And then, of course, you've got Randall Cobb who easily had one of the best games in recent memory. And then I have a lot of faith in Ezekiel Elliott.

Even though Ezekiel Elliott's statbox isn't looking all that sexy this year, if you look at the tape, he's also doing things in terms of blocking. I mean, the way that he goes after some of these guys, the defenders, is impressive. Just go back and look at the tape on a couple of plays. That's what I was watching for because I remember leaning over to you at one point

and going, what is Zeeke doing tonight? And so I was purposeful in this. Every time I'd watch the guys line up, I wanted to see where Zique was and what he was doing and how he's affecting the game. And like, he was blowing guys up. So like as a blocker, he's been impressive for you out there. It's just for whatever reason.

I don't know if it's because teams have enough tape on Zeke these days. I don't know if it was because Zeke missed camp and it's just, you know, there's some rust there. I don't know what to make of it. No, I think that, you know, I looked this up yesterday. If you look since 2016, which is when Zieg got in the league, and the most games with 20 attempts and fewer than four yards per carry, Zekiel Elliott leads the NFL with nine. Next is Levyon Bell and Carlos Hyde.

They're tied with seven. But that may not be as much on Zeeke, as much as it is, this cowboy's tendency to kind of ram their head into a brick wall a little bit. And you make the point that he was doing a lot in Blitz pickup. And that's a big part of the success that Dax's been able to have and that the passing game has been able to have. But also at the end of the day, you go, is a reliable blitz pickup guy and kind of average yards per carry?

Is that worth $90 million? I don't quite know what to make of it this year. And then there's also this, I won't say he's been apathetic more so this year than he has been in years past, because I don't think it's fair to necessarily read a person's body language. But even with just the cutaways during the game, you can see the frustration on Zeke's face. And even when we were having the scrum last night, you know, I asked him, you know, what do you guys make of some of these slow starts?

Here's what he said. How do you make sense of these slow starts, especially when you see the way that you guys battle, you know, in the second half of these games and then the fact that you guys were so close there in the end? we just got to eliminate them. Like you said, we battled back, and we got ourselves within striking distance. Actually took the lead. But, you know, if we eliminate those slow starts,

so, I mean, who knows where we would be. But, I mean, all we got to do, all we can do is just, you know, focus on going to work this week, watching film, and just seeing where we can improve. I think the battling back at some point, too, it really wears on these guys. I mean, this play from behind mentality. I think some guys relish in it, guys like Dak Prescott,

I think there's other guys that struggle with it. And I think Zeke's struggling with some of the playing from behind this year, whereas a guy that's had a chip on his shoulder his whole life, his mentality has always been this sort of underdog play from behind. That's where we see sort of Dak shine. A guy like Zeke's used to being a proven winner. He's not used to playing from behind. That's not his mentality.

That's not his personality. And again, I don't. don't know if it's fair. This is going to, I'm going to bring up one of my Bobby Belt conspiracy theories this week. I feel like some of that is wearing on Zieg this year. I wouldn't doubt that. I mean, remember that, you know, he had a really successful run at Ohio State and had, you know, little to no adversity his rookie year. The very first bit of adversity we ever saw really was that Denver Broncos game his second year. And he had an issue during the game. There was a checkout. And so it very well could be that. And there's still, you know, he's still a young.

young guy, they're still, you know, maturing to be done and growth to be had. And look, he's given, and I want to be fair here and qualify this. He hasn't given us any indication of being a bad teammate or, you know, or that there's any in fighting or frustration with the staff by any means. I'm just saying that it feels like energy wise, it's worn on him. I think overall, the whole team is sort of worn out at this point because of the high expectations that they were placing on themselves. And I think they really feel like they're dropping the ball now.

And yet another year. I mean, you could point your finger at things in the past, you know, injuries. For the most part, you're not missing some of the key guys that you've missed in years past. Right. And the games that you really should have won were on the front end of the schedule, I think now they're staring down at the remaining parts of the schedule, this is where this thing could get ugly. Yeah, and it's not looking as tough as it once did.

Detroit's cooled off, Chicago's cooled off. Well, if you can, but you still got the Patriots, you've still got the Eagles on the road. There's still, and, yeah, I mean. Okay, but let's talk about this for a second. Yeah. Detroit, they might dodge a bullet. Matthew Stafford has some back issues. You may not have them in the game.

But think about the games that they've caught a pass in the sense. They didn't have Adam Thielen in this one against the Vikings. They didn't have Drew Brees playing when they faced the Saints. Who else am I missing? They lost to the Jets. I mean, they had just gotten Sam Darnold back. And I mean, the Jets were a winless team at that point. And the Packers were playing without Devante Adams.

Okay. So even when you've caught a break from God, good teams. You still can't capitalize. And that would seem to be an issue with the coaching staff. That would seem to be an issue of making sure these guys are mentally prepared to play. Jason Garrett's whole role on this team for years has been the CEO. He's the walk around head coach. He's the leader of men more than he is the call and plays and things like that.

Well, okay, if that's your job, your job is to make sure they're prepared and make sure that they're not checking out and make sure that we're not having these slow starts. his job's in real jeopardy at the end of this year, just if we're grading it through nine games. You know, it is interesting you say that. You know, I cover the Saints, and I've had some extensive conversations with the guy like Sean Payton.

And Sean does things to motivate his team and the way that he ever thinks the motivation aspect is what's always fascinating to me. You know, if you've been on the road with me, the speakers that he brings into the locker room, they are the most obnoxious speakers of any team I've ever covered. And he wants it even when they go on the road

or after a win that they are the loudest things that you hear because it gets them hype. Sean Payton's like a really terrible neighbor to have if you're like an apartment complex or a condo.

He'd be awful. Terrible. And then the people that he has come in and speak to these teams, the way that he's dressed up certain mascots to fire them up. Like everything he does is to get in the headspace of his team.

He messes with their minds the way that the way Bill Parcell's used to. Of course, he's part of that. Bill Parcell's coaching tree. While, like I said, I'm a fan of Jason Garrett. I'm a fan of the process. I'm a fan of the fact that that team continues to battle for him. But the way that he gets his troops ready to play is so different than a guy like

Sean Payton. Of course, we're talking about Sean Payton, too, after losing the 1 and 7 Atlanta Falcons when you were 7 in 1. So, you know, that's something they're going to revisit this week. But it is the thought process that goes into. motivating his men that has always been fascinating to me about Sean Payton and something that I have not heard about Jason Garrett. It's different.

When Jason Garrett does bring in people to speak to the team, though Tristan Hill falls asleep. So, I mean, you were waiting for that one. I was trying to break in and he kept talking and I wasn't going to let it go. I was, I needed to drop that in there. But no, I think it's just, it's different. I think there is something to be said, we've talked about this before. I think there's something to be said about steady stability and not freaking out and not and not changing up routine.

because, for instance, if he was to change things up wildly this week, I don't think that would be viewed as anything that, oh, this can fire us up. I think it would rattle guys. It shows panic. Yeah, what's going on? This is, and that's Jason's whole philosophy. And there's. And I appreciate that.

Yeah, and I think that's fair. It's just different ways of doing it. But, you know, they're negative 18 on their point differential in the first quarter this season. Negative 18. They're plus 99 quarters two through four. Which is insane to me. There's something broken about this team in the first quarter. To those of us on the outside, it's,

felt like the sky was falling, but here is what it sounded like on the inside Monday when we caught up with some of the players. Yeah, we got quite the unexpected treat. So normally how Monday's work for the Cowboys, there's very few guys. It's not a practice day. So there's not a lot of guys in there. A lot of them aren't ready to talk. Not a lot of them want to talk, especially after a loss. So when you head into Monday Locker, you're not usually expecting a lot. It's later in the day. It opens about four hours later than it normally does during the week. So Monday, you're always kind of tempering your expectations about what you're going to be. You're always kind of tempering your expectations about what you're going to hear from the guys in the locker.

But we did get a treat. We got a surprise. Michael Bennett spoke with the Dallas media for the first time. So he talked for about five minutes. So I'm just going to go ahead. We'll play the whole thing here of what Bennett had to say, kind of uninterrupted, and let you guys just make your own conclusions based off of what he said

and have your own thoughts. So here's what Michael Bennett had to say in the locker room on Monday. I don't think it. I don't know. I don't agree with it. I just think we just got to just do the simple things right. I think football is always about the simple thing. It comes down to fundamentals and every single week is who has the most fundamentals who has the most discipline every single week. And sometimes you can get out of your gap a little bit more and sometimes you don't. And so for us it's just regroup in and recommit into the things that we know that football has always been a part of where you are at a junior high level, low league, high school, college is always the same thing. Your hands.

feet and being able to get off blockers. What made Dalvin cooked so hard to be doing with? When you talk about stopping the end, it's setting the edge. It's kind of state about parking. It's not going to be able. It's just like anything we're setting the edge is good. I think for us is just tackled and being fundamentally sound. Just talk about your process fitting in with this team the last couple of weeks?

It's been pretty much a good journey coming from. New England and coming here, a lot of great players. I'm just trying to figure out how they get in there. What excites you about being a doubt? being a Dallas cowboy. I don't know, maybe. That's a shoe. Covering the cowboys, I don't know.

Going back to Davin'Clipp for a minute, what made him so challenging? I think being able to have the boot game is something that makes their running game part of stop because they're able to be able to make all the players look like. They do a lot of boot plays, a lot of sprinting, a lot of play action, so, you know,

guys got a really building keys with their offense. I think he's just running their fastest. He's really fast. So I think that's something people are really, you don't see that kind of speed at running back is like great. Now between Saquard and Barkley, they're too fast as running backs I've seen in the league in a long time. Two games in, how you're getting into a groove now? Once you into a group? I haven't played very much.

Yeah, you're like in your escape. How is Chris? Chris Schard. We go way back. I think we grew up together. We're up together when to play a lot of winning for ball together. I'm used to win it. And that's just a part of the process.

I think we've always been friends. Always texts him when I wasn't playing. He was in the off-season, he was in the off-season, so it was always being close relationship. How much is this scheme has been new to you, and how much did you know kind of already coming in? I knew a lot of it. I mean, I say I play a lot of footballers all the same, really,

when it comes down to it. But the scheme is very familiar from something I'm used to. So, like I said, I just came from the place with the most defense is in the league, and so any other defense is pretty much easy to learn. I wish that Mark Tell us talked to you about the Cowboys before you come out of it. I'll talk about, you know, just playing for Garrett and Jerry and this organization before you came here. How important was that just for your transition?

I think he said it was great. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many. incredible guests. I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough.

Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keer Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free, our Heart Radio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Last night, a blown call changed the game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise.

Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people. who live them.

Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me.

He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office, Blue with 42. Hey, Rhett, Mom, I want you to weigh better. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clippers show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

American soccer is about to explode. The World Cup is coming. Ramos sending on the only store at the chip. I'm Tad Ramos. I'm Tom Boe. On our podcast, Inside American Soccer, you'll get the real storylines. I'm not worried about Policicic. I'm not worried about Balligan. I'm not worried about McKinney. My only concern is what happens in the back.

The biggest decisions. If you're going to look at stats and numbers, he has no shot at making this World Cup team. And the truth about the U.S. national team. It wouldn't be a huge surprise if our team ends up in the quarterfinals or potentially a great run into the semifinals. The World Cup is almost here. Experience it all with us. Listen, Inside American Soccer with Tom Bogart and Tabramos on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcast. A fan base, you said that you never going to see a model fan base.

A fan base like this, people who show up to the games. And, you know, Cowboys, everybody lives the Cowboys around the country. I grew up watching the Cowboys, Albert Harper, Michael Irving, Kenny Norton, all those guys. So for growing up, it's an honor to be able to play for an organization that you grew up as a kid in Houston and being able to see this team. So, you know, just the same way. Can you discuss your talks with Jerry Jones, and I know he reduced your contract to one year?

How important was that, you know, getting next year off, you'll be afraid you're not at the season? I'm probably, I don't know. It could be my last year. I've just been chilling, thinking about what's the best thing for my family? What's the best thing in health-wise in the future? So let's take it one game at a time,

one year at a time, It's a great opportunity, but right now it's just enjoying this game, enjoying these seven games, and playing football free, just enjoying myself trying to be a kid out there again. I'm an old man right now, but at the same time, I try to stay as young as I can. With you and DeMarcus, what does the ceiling of this defense look like with you guys? I'm just a part of it. The Marcus is the key to it. Like I said, DeMarcus is one of the best players I play with, and I've played with a lot of great players in the NFL. where there was Ronde Barber, where there was Cliff Leroy, Earl Thomas, Richard Sherman, Fletcher Cox, all these great players that I play with, Gerald McCoy.

And I would say that DeMarcus Lawrence who's probably at the top of the list of guys I play with in his league, and I think he's got great leadership. He's also a great captain, and he goes out there and puts him in line every single week. And I think he leads by example. So for me, it's great to be around a young guy like that, to be able to feel that energy

and feel excited about playing the football. And I think it's just a honor. Have they told you about the hot boys? No, I'll remember the real hot boys. They don't know what they're talking about. Thanks, man. So there you go. Some interesting stuff there from Michael Bennett.

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That's 1-800flowers.com slash tune-in. Look through your children's eyes to see the true magic of a forest. It's a storybook world for them. You look and see a tree. They see the wrinkled face of a wizard with arms outstretched to the sky. They see treasurer.

in pebbles. They see a windy path that could lead to adventure. And they see you. Their fearless guide through this fascinating world. Find a forest near you and start exploring at discovertheforest.org. Brought to you by the United States Forest Service and the ad council. Adoption of teens from foster care is a topic not enough people know about and we're here to change that. I'm April Dinwiddie host of the new podcast, Navigating Adoption presented by Adopt U.S. Kids. Each episode brings you compelling real-life adoption stories told by the families that live them with commentary from experts. Visit Adoptuskids.org slash podcast or subscribe to navigating adoption presented by Adopt U.S. Kids. Brought to you by the U.S. Department of Health and Human

Services Administration for Children and Families and the Act Council. We now welcome in another one of my favorite beatwriters here at the Star in Frisco, John Michota of the Athletic. John, thanks for joining the pod. We are actually heading up towards your, uh, your neck of the world. the woods where you grew up Detroit, Michigan this weekend. I mean, old neck of the woods. Yeah. It's always funny when I go back, because you have, like, friends and family, that would be like, so when you're coming back?

And I'm to the point now where I'm like, never. Like, I love Dallas and, like, especially this time of year. Like, I don't miss any of that. And then going back up there, I think it's supposed to be in the 30s or whatever. And obviously, I love covering the Cowboys. But it is funny, though, because you want to be like, yeah, eventually I'll come back, but I just don't see that happen. I think Dallas is stuck with me now.

Do you like days like today? I know you love that. You love being told like, oh, you must love this weather. It's nice and cold because you're from up north. Yeah. Well, I mean, I've been here now nine years. So it's like, but people don't understand that you adjust to it. You're just like, yeah, this is cold to me because it's been hot all summer.

Okay. Like if you had a Michigan summer where it really only gets to be 100 like once or twice, then yeah, then it's hard to like, you know, get acclimated. But when it's 100, like for an entire month, like you just, you change climate is pretty fast. I made the comparison to John. It's like, it's like the kid who was like two years old when they moved out of Mexico. and then people still expect them to speak Spanish. It's like, I've been away from Spanish for like so long.

Exactly. It's not going to work. Exactly. So it's like, no, like I'm just as lost as the rest of you now. Well, and I always joke that Texas, you know, there's that old saying. It's like I'm not from Texas, but I got here as quick as I could. Yeah. There are so many transplants that come down here.

And if you're listening to the Dallas Cowboys podcast here with us, then you probably are a big Texas fan just in general. I kind of feel the same way. I've lived in other places. But Texas, just climate-wise, cost of living. Yeah. Show me a better state to live in. I'm good. Yeah. My brother and I always go through these scenarios like, what if this place offered you a job or what if this place offered you a job? And it's like every year that goes by that list of what I would take is so much less. And like really the only thing that's left for me would be on the West Coast just because I love like when we go out there for training camp and California all that. But then you have the earthquakes and you have wildfires. Right. And it's super expensive to live. You're never going to own a thing. Right. Exactly. I go back and forth. People ask me that all the time. But I think as you get a little settled into your career, and especially when you cover a team like this, it's the golden handcuffs.

I've always said, are there probably more intriguing jobs out there? Maybe. Yeah. But not many. Because we get weeks like this, John, where the sky's falling again. And Jason Garrett, who enjoyed a brief reprieve because he got, you know, the win against the Eagles and it was a bye week, so all sins were forgotten. The play calling's an issue again last night.

And despite heroic performances, by what I've been arguing is this receiving court, Dak Prescott, they can't get it done. So where are you pointing the finger today? Oh, you have to point it at the coaches. I mean, I, I'm one of these people. I hate when people just always blame the coaches, and especially here because Jason's been here for so long in a league where coaches generally aren't around that long.

But that was just a mistake to run back-to-back plays, run plays there. I know that they were trying to run out the clock, but this isn't 2014 Dallas Cowboys where your defense is basically led by Rolando McLean and Jeremy Mincy. Like, you have a good defense. Like, you've been building since 2014 to get to where you are right now. You go and you go ahead, and if they come back on you and they score a touchdown in a minute,

and a half, well, hey, you tip your cat to them and you say, well, that was on the defense, and so be it. But you went out there and got Michael Bennett and Robert Quinn and you've drafted these linebackers. Like, you have players now. Like put them out there to make plays. You should trust your defense. And I just feel like the entire time I've covered this team, it's always been offense first. Well, you finally have a good defense. Give them a chance to make plays there late. And I know that obviously Delvin Cook was running all over them, but you've got to at least give them that chance. I'd taken your foot off the gas, whether you do it in pros or in college. always seems to kill you. And I just thought that that was a mistake. You should have just let

Dad keep throwing. I thought he had the hot hand and he was playing as well as I think I've ever seen him play. Why do you think that, I mean, speaking to, we know the coaches have been an issue, but I mean, I think consistently all year the linebackers have played way below where they were at last year. Why do you think Jalen Smith and Leighton Vanders have seemingly regressed this year? I mean, that's a great question. I was walking out with some other reporters after the game yesterday. And that's all we were saying is just like, how come they're not making those same plays? and I think it's a combination. I don't think that they've done as well stopping the run on the defensive line.

I don't think they've been as strong either. And it's almost like kind of how you see with the Rams, how it's like it seems like almost in a way like they're starting to kind of, the league's starting to figure Shaw McVeigh out. It's almost like maybe there's just tape out from last year where they found little things, maybe Jalen and coverage, things like that where that's clearly not his strong suit. You know, one of the things I notice is that he'll drop way back into coverage so that he can move forward so everything's in front of them,

which, you know, nobody did that better than Ed Reed. I mean, he'd move off the screen, but he was just such a freak athlete that he could just make up that ground. And so with a team like last night where like Kirk Cousins was just dinkin and Duncan and he was completing that stuff underneath, it's like, yeah, Jalen's keeping the guy in front of them, but they're still first downs and they're moving the chains and things like that. So I wish I had a good answer.

It stuns me that Sean Lee would come into that last game and play like maybe the best we've seen out of any of the linebackers this year. I never thought that would have happened. And I thought that Jalen and Layton would have just taken off, built on what they did last year. The more you play together, the better they were going to be, and that just hasn't been it. You know, and they've talked consistently, anytime you talk to Rod Marinelli or Chris Rashar, but specifically Marinelli, when he's talking about defensive philosophy, if you're talking to him on a Thursday, about what they need to do.

Fast will always come up. We need to play fast. And you'll hear that from opposing coaches and conference calls. They'll say, you know, oh, that defense is really fast. They move fast. I wonder if that's why they're getting gashed so bad on these screenplays. If teams are taking advantage of this overaggressiveness and this lets fly and then they just are, let's slowly kind of set things up and then let's hit these screen passes.

And then you're having, you know, 30 yard gains for Dalvin Cook on screen passes. It seems like that's kind of become the way to try and hit the Cowboys is let's use this aggressiveness that they have on defense against them. For sure. And the reason what gets you to play fast is knowing exactly what you have to do at all times. And so that's why they don't deviate from what they do. and that's why other teams know what they're going to do. That's a great point. I was joking with Helman yesterday, David Helman of Dallas Cowboys.com,

that that game, to me, was that Spider-Man meme where it's those two Spider-Men pointing each other. Because that's exactly what Dax said before they were going to play the Vikings, like last Wednesday when he talked to us. It was like, yeah, I'm not really worried about them confused and stuff because that's not what they do. They do what they do. But if you make mistakes, they'll make you pay.

But you know what to expect from them. And that's exactly what everybody says about this Cowboys defense when they're preparing to play them. And so while they have good play, I just feel like the other teams kind of know what to expect when they go against this defense. And the offense. That's been the argument and the knock on them too. That's why I think it's been fascinating to see them mix it up this year and not be able to see this offense capitalize because let me ask you this. Do you think there's good players on this team? Oh yeah. This is, I mean,

I started covering a team in 2011. This is without question the best Cowboys team I've covered, no doubt. So how frustrating is it, you know, just as a beat rider in can you imagine for the fans, that they're not able to piece these things together? Because we're not talking. This is a young team in some respects, but this is a young team that has collectively come up together. In other words, I get when you've got, you know, a whole bunch of young guys and it's addition and subtraction, but these guys have sort of coming this thing together. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games.

And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the things, We get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch.

Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Keir Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway.

Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down,

give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sportslice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice. On the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you're you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok

podcast network on TikTok. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Clivert Show, I'm bringing you conversations

about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this guy, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes,

A, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office, Blue 42. Hey, ref, my mama want you to wave. better. What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Cliverts show on the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your

podcast. Will Ferrell's Big Money Players and IHart Podcasts presents soccer moms. So I'm Leanne. This is my best friend, Janet. And we have been joined at the hips since high school. Now a redacted amount of years later, we're still joined at the hip, just a little bit bigger hips wider. This is a podcast we're recording it as we tailgate our youth soccer games in the back of my Honda Odyssey with all the snacks and drink. Sidebar. Why did you get hard seltzer instead of beer? They had a bogo. Well, then you got it. Do you want a white collar or something here? Just a what are y'all doing? Microphones? Are you making a rap album? Oh, I would. Come on. Can you move? I would buy it.

Cuts through the defense like a hot knife through sponge cake. That sounds delicious. Oh, you're lucky I'm not a drug addict. You're lucky I'm not an alcoholic. You are. I'm lucky I'm not a killer. I love this team and I'm really trying to be a figure in their lives that they can rely on. Oh. Listen to soccer moms on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

The Nuculus has been there. So I feel like you have to take the young thing out of the equation at this point. No, you do for sure. I think one of the problems, though, is because you have a lot of those guys together. I just see a lot of, like, the way they're playing in these games this year reminds me of last year in a sense of it's like they have to be at their best when their backs are against the wall.

And God knows, we've heard this a million times from all of them. But like you look at last season, like even after they got a Mari, they lost that first game. It took them to fall to three to five, three and five to where it was like, well, now we have to win every single game. And I feel like that's how they play in these games this year. It's like, well, we're so talented that we fall behind a little bit. We're going to come back. We're talented.

We're going to make this run. And I feel like that's what's going to happen this season. And now they're going to put themselves in a spot where they're going to be backs against the wall again. And they might have to win five of their last seven games. And they might do that. Which is such a cowboy thing to do. Because I was literally saying, here we are talking all about the front end of this schedule and how easy it was if they need to put those to bed and then focus on this remaining stretch. It would be such a cowboy thing to do to go and shock in all us against the Patriots in Foxborough to win that game on the road against the Chicago Bears, get another one against the Eagles.

and then all of a sudden they've got that hot hand. They get in the playoffs, and this would be the year for them to get it done. I'm not kidding. That's how this team is to me. It's just if you look it on paper and statistically, you're saying to yourself, there's no way. Like this, this to me was the turning point in your season.

You played the six and three team. We've been arguing you're either contenders or pretenders. You look like pretenders last night. Yeah, there's no question about that. And I agree with you. I mean, I know we all cover the Cowboys so people think that we're, you know, we're being homers or whatever. No, this is their best team.

And, you know, I heard you guys talking earlier about, you know, these other teams not having Breeze, not having Thieland, I haven't Devante Adams. The Lions probably won't have Matt Stafford. Like, they're all, what I always say, relatively healthy. I mean, they are. They're not really missing anybody. So if you were to make a run, let's say they won five of the last seven. They go 10 and six, won the division, got in the playoffs.

Like, on paper, I could easily see them making it run. 100%. If you go down, like, the list of, like, you know, everybody compares everyone to the Patriots because they're clearly the gold standard. but like there's clearly weaknesses on that Patriots team. One of the biggest problems is guys like Trey Flowers and they have good years and then teams pick these guys. No, this Cowboys team has been building for, I would say at least 2014 to where they are today. And so, no, I mean, they, I know it's doom and gloom today, but if they got on a run,

there's no question that they could make a Super Bowl run for sure. But it doesn't look like that right now, obviously. You know, the team that this reminds me of, and Jane, I think you were here at this time. John, I know you weren't covering the team back then, but the team that's kind of reminds me of is the 2008 Cowboys. We're in 07. They went 13 and 3 and heading into 08. It was like, okay, Romo's going to take the next step. They went and added Pac-Man Jones and Tank Johnson, and they had really kind of fleshed out their holes. And then they, you know, they started off that year 3-0, and they looked like they were, you know, going to be right up there.

Brady had gotten hurt at that point. People were talking about them as the Super Bowl contender. And then turmoil hit, and they started losing games to teams they shouldn't have lost to. and near the end of the year they would surprise people and oh we're going to beat the giants on primetime football who are first in the division right now and you know we're going to shock everybody and they kept just teasing you a little bit until the end of the year when they get blown out in a winner take all division game against the Eagles and it just feels like that where that 08 team that went 9 and 7 to me is one of the most talented teams they've ever had and it didn't work and that would be my concern now with this team look for your children's eyes to see the true magic of a forest. It's a storybook world for them. You look and see a tree. They see the wrinkled face of a wizard with arms outstretched to the sky.

They see treasure and pebbles. They see a windy path that could lead to adventure. And they see you. Their fearless guide through this fascinating world. Find a forest near you and start exploring at Discovertheforest.org. Brought to you by the United States Forest Service and the ad council. And we're live here outside the Perez family home just waiting for the...

And there they go. Almost on time this morning. Mom is coming out the front door strong with a double-armed kid carry. Looks like Dad has the bags. Daughter is bringing up the rear. Oh, but the diaper bag wasn't closed. Dipers and toys are everywhere. Ooh, but Mom has just nailed the perfect car seat buckle for the toddler.

And now the eldest daughter, who looks to be about nine or ten, has secured herself in the booster seat. Dad zips the bag closed, and they're off. Ah, but looks like mom doesn't realize her coffee cup is still on the roof of the car, and there it goes! Oh, that's a shame. That mug was a fan favorite. Don't sweat the small stuff.

Just nail the big stuff. Like making sure your kids are buckled correctly in the right seat for their age and size. Learn more at nhtsa.gov slash the right seat. Visit nhtsa.gov slash the right seat. Brought to you by NTSA and the right seat. Brought to you by Nidza and the Ad Council What grows in the forest?

Trees? Sure. Know what else grows in the forest? Our imagination, our sense of wonder, and our family bonds grow too because when we disconnect from this and connect with this, we reconnect with each other. The forest is closer than you think.

Find a forest near you and start exploring at Discovertheforest.org. Brought to you by the United States Forest Service and the ad conference. You know, what's interesting to me is Jerry Jones has gambled so much in his business life, right? We even talked about Comstock, this new energy company that he's got and he's invested. I think he's like, it's like something like $2 billion of his own personal money. And my buddies are on Wall Streeter.

Like it's the worst investment. That's why he was up here garnering public support for this while the Zieg deal was getting done. He's ringing, you know, he's bringing the bell on the stock market. But yet he has played the safe hand with Jason. and Garrett all this time because it's like he doesn't want to rock the boat. And I got to say there are times I find myself sort of agreeing with them in the sense that you've only had one losing season. This team is still fighting for him.

But I am curious if the team still fights for him after a game like this. Yeah. I mean, that's the only thing I've never seen them not. Right. So that's why I would be so stunned if that was to happen for them to just give up. Like you talk about that Eagles game at the end of year. Was that 2008, I think? Yeah.

Yeah. Like I just, I don't see them doing it. that with this particular team. And because of that, that's what always he's going to have backing him up because you see it so much. Because name another coach, you'd want to, because look. That's the other thing. There isn't a lot of options out there right now. Well, exactly. You look at what Arizona did, bringing in Cliff Kingsbury, young, innovative. You think you're going to shake things up. Sean McVeigh, we're actually seeing him exposed now after, you know, such a dynamic start as the head coach. It's taken Kyle Shanahan a while, but I mean, he comes from a

ridiculous coaching tree and then you could argue all his success in Washington, D.C. You look at Adam Gase, that's not working out for you that much with the Jets, Freddie Kitchens up in Cleveland, Flores down with the dolphins. So if I'm Jerry and my biggest, you know, he laments that one of his biggest frustrations in life has been wasting Tony Romo's youth. Yeah. These guys aren't getting any younger. I mean, we're heading into what fifth seasons now for DAC and Zique and some of these

because while you're locking them off, trying to lock them up long term, how. How much longer do you want to waste their seasons with either a new coach or staying the course? I would imagine it's frustrating for Jerry. Right. And we were just talking about, okay, so to me, the gold standard is clearly the Patriots. And so like a team, the Cowboys are about to play this week. And Matt Patricia, I mean, the Lions are by far the team I follow the most outside of the Cowboys. That's not working there.

No. So there's a guy. Then Josh McDaniels, who was obviously, you know, their OC. Like, I could see him being up for jobs. But, like, show me a guy that's left the Patriots and had all this success. That really hasn't. Everything just goes back to building. Billa Check, like whether it doesn't matter if it's the GMs, if it's the coaches, assistant coaches.

But he's just a different animal. Right. And then I even look at Matt LaFlor, right? Okay, so he's had some success with Green Bay. But that's Aaron Rogers. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not putting that on the coaching. Well, he's also a first year guy. And that's the thing. It's like, how do you adjust the trends? I remember I listened to an radio interview. It was on 105 through the fan earlier this year with Tony Romo. And he was talking about um, Kellan Moore and basically how like, you know, I can see him having success early on because people won't know what to expect because there's nothing. There's no tape.

There's no film on what he's done. But it's going to be about how you adjust to that. And that's clearly where we're at right now. We're in that stage that it's how are you going to adjust to what they're doing? And as you mentioned with Sean McVeigh, that's what they're going through right now. The only thing that I could see that would shake this thing up. And this would be a wild card.

What if they asked Tony to come back and coach? I think they're, okay, well, then if we're throwing out wild possibilities. I mean, this is wild. I think there's a better chance of Jason Whitten being the next coach than Tony Romo. I've got three wild names for you to stack in likelihood. I love this. Poor Jason Garrett's not even through a season. And it's still a winning record and we're already throwing out wild cards.

What else are we supposed to hear? I'm just curious. You stack the likelihood that you think this is what's going to happen. But I use this as arguments as to why Jason Garrett remains here. So we'll throw out the wild cards and then we'll show you what else is out there. From most to least likely, if Jason were to lose his job, most to least likely would get this. this job. Lincoln Riley?

I don't see it happening. Dan Mullen. Bob Stoops. I don't like any of those options. I don't say you like them. I'll go Bob Stoops. He would be my one. I'd go Bob Sucs one. Yeah. I'd go Lincoln Riley two and Dan Mullen three. You think it'd be most likely out of those three that he would get the job? But why go college? I mean, college doesn't always work.

Well, I mean, but that's it. Name college it's worked other than Jimmy Johnson, who obviously was wildly successful here. Pete Carroll. But I mean, I think in general and I mean, Cliff's. Pete also was in the NFL first, then went back, and then came back. But, you know, the other thing is, has college work? Well, I mean, let's just look at what the Cowboys have been saying. Last year, the Cowboys kept talking about college concept.

So the Cowb was clearly or not bugged by the idea of a college coach. But if you want college that had previously been in the NFL, like, that has been Harbaugh's MO. Finish teams off. Push them over the edge. Oh, you like Jim Harbaugh? I would think that would. I don't think that would be. Why not at the Meyer?

I mean, what Dan Mullen was running at Mississippi. Mississippi State was all Irmaier stuff. Or Meyer, obviously, had success with Z. I just think with the hand that Dak undoubtedly is going to have him to say that. Because, you know, it's funny. You said, why is Jerry stuck with Jason this long? You remember at the end of last year, the thought was they were going to stick with Linahan.

And it seemed like feedback internally is what changed things. It was players 100%. And so I think the reason Garrett's lasted so long is probably player feedback. There was also a little bit of a wild card with Scott Linehan that hasn't come out. That factored into it a little bit. Okay. So Scott Lenehan actually, I was told, had a little bit of a say in some of that. He needed some personal piece for something that was going on off the field.

Okay. Well, and in that- Let's get him on the podcast. Yeah, let's do it. So in that sense, though, that players generally, their feedback matters to this organization, clearly with the coaching staff. I mean, Dak's going to have a hand in it in the next one. And we know how much he thinks of Dan Mullen. And Dan Mullen's done great stuff of Florida already.

I'm a fan of Dan Mullen. I think it's interesting. Yeah. No, he's going to have a big saying it. That's why I always thought that going into this year when, you know, you know, obviously his storyline is similar to what it is now, where it's like, well, when are they going to pay Dak? Is Dak going to be the quarterback of the future?

And I just don't find it funny. I'm like, he's going to be the quarterback of the future. And he's literally going to be the guy if they change that coach's that. He's going to be sitting there and they'd be like, what works best for Dak? It's going to be built around Dak. Like, he's not going anywhere. He will definitely have a huge saying who the next coach is. Even if he doesn't have a say, what he does will have a say in it.

But he is such a Jason Garrett fan. Yeah. I mean, he has literally said to me, go easy on my guy, J.G. when I would argue that I'm probably the softest media commentator out there when it comes to Jason Garrett because I keep going with show me something better, but he will say to me, go easy on my guy, J.G. You know it's one of the things about him and why I think that a lot of this happens too is like you never see him. Like you see other coaches like we'll get into players sometimes on the sideline and there'll be a little back and forth. You will never see that with Jason.

I saw it at the ultimate test and it was when obviously Greg Hardy was slapping playboards out of hands. And, I mean, he's not getting involved in anything like that. Like he doesn't throw players under the bus. He never, like, calls him back up. No, he just throws challenge flags at refs really hard. I mean, there's that. Or Kellett Moore's offensive coordinator on Monday morning. Well, but even that, even that, like, so that seems like a lot because of how little that he was so jarring to us because he doesn't do that stuff.

Okay. I got one other conspiracy name. And Jane and I talked about this with Calvin Watkins last week because his contract's about to come open. And there has been talk about this is kind of do or die for him too. Zimmer. Well, they obviously like him. And if you listen to Jerry talk. The way they talk about Sean Payton and Mike Zimmer.

It's as if a guy is dating you, but he's on Instagram scrolling. And he's like, but that girl, man, she's a good looking chick. She works out really. I wonder where she works out. Well, they had a chance of that. Right. I wonder where she got that outfit. And so there's a little bit of the one that got away.

So like, because that's the name that I've been kicking around that I thought. He's well respected. I thought Zimmer would be one that makes sense because they know him. He's known to be kind of like a light. your fire, you know, under him. He comes from the Parcells tree. I think they would feel like they're still keeping some of the structure that Jason has. He'd bring Terrence Newman back. Terrence Newman's on the coaching staff. Can I be selfish for a second here? Yeah. I want them to stick with Jason Garrett then. Mike Zimmer with the media is just not,

I'm trying to have fun here. Okay. And as everybody, like, let's go hire Mike Leach. Okay. Well, yeah, let's get crazy. But like the Jason Garrett that people see on the podium is clearly the same Jason Garrett that we see in the walkoffs or we see at the combine or on a training camp. stuff like that. And I think he's pretty media friendly. So selfishly, I would, and the reason why I'm saying that is because I don't think that there's going to be a major difference. Like, I don't know. Like, I mean, are you going to be surprised if Mike Zimmer, if they lose in the second round of the playoffs? Like, clearly the other side. Because what's Mike done? That's what I'm saying. Like, so if you're going to get something, again, the Spider-Man meme,

I don't know the big difference there. What's the biggest overall issue with this team right now, though? Like, like in general, like, not like position specific, but just the way they play. Are you talking about just this season? Yeah, slow starts. People have been questioned preparation. But the thing that is crazy to me, it's a slow starts. But to me, what's more impressive about this team is the way they battle back when their backs are in so. You're down 14-0 in the first quarter.

It was the first quarter, right? 14-0 Sunday night football. And you battle back the way that they did. Like, that to me is impressive. Well, no, so was the 21 to nothing to the Packers and it was 31 to 3. But that's not a crummy team. That's not a, that's not a poorly coached. coached team.

But this is Stephen Jones and Jerry Jones both in the last 24 hours when Zimmer has come. They brought up Zimmer on their own. And when they bring up Zimmer, they bring him up with the idea of. But I think they talk that way about any guy that's on their staff because they look at it as he's one of ours. They may talk. There's a pride about that. They may talk glowingly about him. But the attribute they both brought up on their own was he had that team really well prepared.

I think it's. He might expiles music. He loves his conspiracy theory. No, whether it's Zimmer or not, I think that. it is fresh in their mind that they don't feel like this team's fairly each week. Why would you leave what he's got right now? I'm saying that his contract's almost up and they've kind of been to the edge and never pushed over.

I'm saying if that, if he came open. To John's point, it's kind of the same reason why Sean ultimately wasn't the, look, the Cowboys have won at Sean. That's no secret. Then he goes and he gets his, you know, long-term deal in New Orleans. One of the factors that played into that is everything that comes with Dallas. Mike Zimmer is kind of a golden god in Minnesota. Sean's a golden god in New Orleans.

And the media scrutiny is not the same. When I go and cover Minnesota or New Orleans, it's different. It's different. But what if you have that type of personality that you want to be known in China? Because Sean is the one that likes to say that. That's a Sean personality. That's not a Mike Zimmer personality. That's true.

No, no, but this is home for Zimmer. This is where Zimmer cut his teeth as an NFL coach who's here for 15 years or whatever it was. I mean, I think Zimmer does have an affinity for Dallas. And what I'm talking about, obviously, you guys know that quote that he said about how they hit where, after they won the Super Bowl, I think you said that like, yeah, they know who I am in like the other cities in the division. But when you're the head coach of the Dallas Cowboys, they know who you are in China. There's an ego that you have to have, an ego to be the head coach of this team, but an ego that can remain checked. Right. When you've got Jerry Jones and Stephen Jones is your bosses.

My theory is Dion's using the FSU offer to leverage the Cowboys job. That would be terrible. Don't even bring that stuff up, man. Don't even speak that stuff out there. Florida State fan, John, Michelle. Don't even put that out there. I don't like that. All right, so your thoughts heading into this game, John?

Well, if Matt Stafford plays, then I think it's a close game because he's playing at his highest level. And although I don't think the lines are a great team, they are pretty talented, and they will be playing at home. But if he doesn't play, I don't think there's any reason the Cowboy should win by at least a couple touchdowns. I mean, they would be going with Jeff. Driscoll. I mean, that's, I don't know, that seems like the recipe for exactly what this team needs right now.

And they have beaten the bad teams that they've played. And the Lions are a bad team if they're not, if Matt Stafford isn't playing. Now, Stafford plays. We've seen when the Cowboys have played against Matt Stafford. They've all been, like, they've been some of the most entertaining games that we've watched recently. So I think that's the key. If he plays, then it goes down to the wire. But if he doesn't, then, yeah, the Cowboys should easily win this game. John Moshoda, my man. I'm looking forward to some of the restaurant wrecks and going to visit the town that you are now far removed from. Where can some of our followers follow you on social media? Follow me on Twitter. I'm on there from time to time. At John Moshota. J-O-N-M-A-C-H-O-C-A. Go for the content. Stay for the memes.

That's it for this episode. We appreciate you sticking around. We'll be a couple days removed from Doom and Gloom. And we'll check in with the guys in the locker room on Wednesday when we drop this next pod. So when are you coming back? And I'm like, never? Set right to the romance and find the way to wow this valentines with 1800flowers.com. From classic roses and bouquets to decadent chocolate-covered berries, gourmet treats, and more. Surprise your valentine with 1,800flowers.com.

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