The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Colin Cowherd Podcast - Bears Win The Offseason, Cousins/Penix Situation Could Get Awkward, No New Weapons For Dak, Kevin Durant Is Irrelevant

Episode Date: April 29, 2024

Colin is joined by John MIddlekauff, host of “3 and Out” to break down the NFL Draft! They start with the Cowboys seeming to deliberately not load up on weapons in Dak Prescott’s contract year (3:30) and why the Bears won the offseason (7:30) They rate the Bears chances in a stacked NFC North (11:00) and Colin explains why the Raiders could be set up perfectly to draft a quarterback NEXT year (14:00) They dissect the drama in Atlanta and why the Kirk Cousins/Michael Penix situation could get awkward fast (19:15), and rate Jim Harbaugh’s draft as “substance” rather than flash (27:00) They predict the first and last place finishers for every NFL division (33:15) and rate the Titans draft as the weirdest (37:15). Piggybacking on the Titans talk, they go behind the scenes into why so many NFL organizations are dysfunctional, and reveal the best run team in the league (44:00). Finally, they each pick their biggest whiff on a take from the past couple of years (01:05:00), debate whether the Sixers are a “failed experiment” (01:10:00) and explain why bad business decisions have made Kevin Durant irrelevant in the NBA (01:15:00). (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates!  #Volume #Herd #3andOutSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Volume. All right, John Middilkoff is about to stop by to talk NFL draft for about an hour. We're going to do about 10 minutes NBA in the backside because we both have some strong thoughts on that. And the NBA playoff games have been really fun. Before John comes on, grab your phone. I want you to download the game time. app. You've done this before. Great place. The fastest, easiest place to get tickets. Sometimes

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Lowest prices guaranteed. It's easy. All right, here we go. John Middlekopf, former NFL Scout, three and out, is his podcast. Every Sunday night, we chop it up. Probably 45 of the 52 weeks here. We chop it up for an hour. You know, he deserves some time off once in a while.

So the NFL draft over the course of the weekend. So my one take about the draft, well, I got several, but my first one is Dallas didn't draft a running back and didn't draft a receiver until the sixth round. So, you know, Jerry hasn't been to a Super Bowl in almost three decades. So what Jerry doesn't want to do is get trapped with Dak Prescott. And I thought it was strategic. I thought that was Jerry Jones saying, listen, we're going to rely on you, Dak, this year. We're not giving you all this ammo.

We're going to rebuild the offensive line. You'll get protection. but in a contract year, the last thing I'm going to do is load you up with weapons. Dax production's absolutely going to come down. I mean, they just don't have a running back of note on the roster. And people could say, well, you're tanking the year. They're not tanking the year. They'll be a good football team.

But it felt strategic to me to not address running back and really, frankly, not address receiver until in the sixth round. That didn't feel like just a bad stroke of luck to me. I'm torn because it's hard for me to be critical whenever you go offensive and defensive line early in the draft, which they have, and they're a good drafting team, bad running back draft.

But let's face it, Colin, until they give him that contract extension, which they should not, to me, this is him and McCarthy are playing for their jobs. I mean, this guy, let's face it, they paid him a lot of money a couple years ago off the broken ankle,

and he's been really good in the regular season. In the playoffs, two out of three years, he was atrocious. I mean, he was really bad three years ago against the Niners in this year in that first half and the game was over. Wasn't all his fault, but he did not play winning football. The price has gone up dramatically since they gave him $40 million a year just because of the market, right? So can you give Dak Prescott $55 million a year? I can't. He's better than Tua, but I say the same thing about Tua.

If you're in that business long term, you're signing up at best to be a one-and-done playoff team. And the other thing is, let's face it, the equal. Eagles have a lot more talent on their roster, dramatically more, top to bottom. So you look at a team. Look at this. I mean, A.J. Brown, Devonte Smith, Sequin Barclay, better at tight end, and an athlete in their prime at quarterback. I mean, I don't, and Lane Johnson at right tackle, I don't think it's necessarily close. I mean, I think you're being kind saying they have more talent.

I think it's lobsided in favor of Philly. Well, and if Michael Parsons is the best defensive player of the group, it's not like the Eagles haven't invested in that side the last couple of years in the draft with Jay. Dalin Carter, Jordan Davis. They just draft, they get the top corner in this draft with Cooper Degine as their second round pick, who a lot of people had, and Howie even said, we had a first round grade on him as well. Darius Slay is an older player, but he's still a solid starter. They'll get rid of Bradbury. The Eagles, and now you add Fangio and Kellynne Moore to the mix, because last year their coaches really let him down. Like, to me, this is anything less, like one take away

after the draft for the NFC East. I don't think the Giants are very good. Washington's in this rebuild mode. The Eagles have no excuse not to win this division. I mean, last year they imploded, Dallas kind of lucked into it at the end, remember, but this should not, like, there should be a two or three game difference. Now, I think Dallas is going to be good. I'm talking, you know, nine, ten wins, but the eagle, there should be a gap between the two teams. I don't think there's any question. And listen, there's a line with Dak Prescott. If he does not get a hundred yards run support, Dax wins about 35% of his games. So, it did feel like, to me, they got the cap issue.

So you had to address running back in the draft. You're not going to find running back. Well, they don't really exist. You just got to get lucky with an undrafted free agent, basically. You're keeping your fingers crossed? I will say this in terms of everybody always wants to know who wins the draft. I've had the same formula as long as I can remember. And I usually do it on the Monday after the draft.

I'm not going to project how great your fourth, fifth, sixth, and seventh round picks are. but I will judge your offseason based on your free agent signings and your first two or three picks where I get more certainty. I think the Chicago Bears are a completely different football team with Canaan, DeAndre Swift, Gerald Everett, Caleb Williams, and Roma Dunzee. That's a completely different offense. So if you're asking me who won the offseason in terms of personnel, my take is Chicago won't even look the same. I thought Green Bay got better, but I don't think Chicago will even look the same. What do you think? Yeah, I mean, listen, it's hard not to like Chicago.

I mean, what they've done in the last 12 months. I think that trade that Ryan Poles made, it's got to go down as one of the great trades of all time. I mean, it really does. And it's one that Carolina would like. Yeah, and to get rid of, basically, they traded all that for Bryce Young, that if you could do a redo, they would laugh in your face. And Carolina would throw in picks to swap it back. So, yeah, I think. I think the hype on Caleb, which is the nature of this piece, the same thing happened to Trevor Lawrence.

He does not need to be immediately a superstar. He just needs to be solid, right? And they should be good. Because last year, they could have been a playoff team if their quarterback could have just functioned from the pocket. Couldn't function from the pocket. Now you had Keenan Allen and Roma Dunesay. You know the best part about Roma Dunesay? He doesn't have to do that much. Like he was the lead dog at Washington, which had about 15 guys drafted it felt like. and he was a fantastic player, but he gets to ease in. A lot of people, like Marvin Harrison, we talked about this last on Thursday, has no choice. Anything less than 80, 90 catches, they're not getting enough out of them,

given what in his group. So, Rome, if he just has 45, 50 catches, maybe six touchdowns, you're awesome. Even though it's the ninth pick, you'd like a little more. But given this team this year, Keenan probably be only there one year, so next year he takes a bigger jump. But they're not as dependent on their young,

wide receiver as a lot of teams are when they draft a guy high. They're also going to have a fourth place schedule. That helps. Yeah. Division's hard. The division's hard. It might be the best division in football. I think offensively, I've said this. I think last time we were on, you could make a pro-ball offense out of that division that can compete with the NFL. I mean, there's just stars everywhere. And I also thought, I'll say this about the NFC North, I thought Green Bay, if you count Josh Jacobs, Xavier McKinney.

in free agency, upgrade it back, really good safety, along with Morgan, Jordan Morgan, the tackle from Arizona, Edron Cooper, the linebacker A&M, who I heard the Rams like, Bullard the safety from Georgia. Like, that's five really good players. So, Green Bay, you know, it's interesting. If you told me two teams that draft well the last decade, I would actually say Green Bay in Tampa, but they're so divergent in terms of success because one gets the quarterback right and one hasn't. I always feel with Jason Light, if you go look at Tampa's first four picks, I loved him.

I think he's one of the best drafters in the league. They can't get quarterback right. The difference is, and by the way, classic Michael Pratt, who fell to the seventh, Green Bay gets him, he won't see the field for three years. And you look up. He's a big kid, six, three, two, twenty, not a huge jar, but you look up in three years and be like, well, it's a functional starter in the NFL. But that division, you know, it's really interesting about Chicago, Green Bay, Detroit, Minnesota. Minnesota may be the most talented potential fourth place team that I can remember. I was doing this over the course of the weekend. I was writing down everybody's 10 best players in that division.

There is not much that separates Detroit and Minnesota. Like, it's inches. Not if Darnold plays well, you could see Minnesota to the last weekend competing. Well, isn't it a good example? You use Jason Light. They had no quarterback. They insert Brady at 42 years old and just start dominating, right? So if they would have the same roster, you would have put Aaron Rogers. Same thing would have happened. Look at last year. Baker had what, 75% of the season was pretty solid. And they were a playoff team and they kicked the Eagles ass. And they were right there in the second playoff game with the lion. So the quarterback position, which I'm sure we'll talk about, is so important. But I'm with you. I think Green Bay is going to be. very, very dependent on this Jeff Hathley, the guy that they hired from Boston College, who was very well thought of. Kyle Shanahan really liked him.

Ohio State when Ryan Day first got the job, made him a co-defensive coordinator, but he's got to be good because that's really been the downfall of their operation, right? And really goes back to McCarthy with some of their great teams with Aaron Rogers. And listen, McVeigh, what do they do? Defense right away.

Kyle Shanahan, what's he always doing? Defense. They're all the top teams. even Dan Campbell, their first two picks, corners, and they've invested heavily in the defensive line. So you're playing a lot of teams in your conference, Howie Roseman over the last couple of years, Jalen Carter, Jordan Davis, Cooper DeGine, Mitchell, the Toledo. It's just defense. They just invest in that side of the ball.

We know Green Bay, and now the floor is well established. They're going to score a lot of points, and they have explosive players. Jacobs, I think Josh Jacobs is a better player to Sequin Barclay. I mean, that guy is, when he's healthy, he's a top two or three running back in the NFL. but it's going to come down to defense. And like you said, in that division, listen, I don't know how good Sam Donald's going to be, but if you catch them on the right day

with those offensive weapons, they can score 35 points. So it's just, you better, a lot of pressures on that higher. You know, he got rid of Joe Barry, who was his buddy. It wasn't going as well. It's not all his fault. Sometimes it's the players, too. But they have invested a, they have invested a lot of picks,

right, the Packers have on that side of the ball over the last half decade, a ton of high round picks on defense. Yeah, and it's funny because the Bears won seven games last year, and they may not win more than eight this year. That's why I feel like don't judge the Bears and Caleb on wins. The division is, I think it is the best division in football. It's certainly the best division in terms of skill people. I mean, the receiving talent and the tight end talent, that division is insane. Yeah. It's like seven really in the division. There's seven good tight ends. Gerald Everett's good, solid, B, tight in in the end. I do want to get into the quarterback thing because I was I've said this for several years. I think the Raiders have a good roster. They just don't have the tight end right. They're a little bit like Tampa.

So back to back, they go get Brock Bowers, mayor, the Notre Dame kid last year. They've got. They drafted the center from Oregon, right? Yep, yep. And I was texting with Tom Telesco without divulging too much. I said, what you should be rooting for is Bryce Young and Will Levis to hit. I said, because then next year, the number of teams that need a quarterback, giants will probably take a swing.

Jets will, but I'm not sure it's in the first round. You'll want to get Aaron some help. But I said, you know, if you look at last year's quarterback class and this year's quarterback class, and there's not a lot of teams, okay, Will Levis, my guess, they'll move often. maybe. Bryce Young has to buy Thanksgiving, and they got him some more pieces, has to do something. I think the Giants will eventually draft somebody. But, John, I went through it this morning. Also on the free agent market, you could have Tua and DAC. Yeah. There's no question. I think Jerry will re-sign him. But it's interesting with the Raiders. I was going back and forth,

and I said, what you want to do if you're the Raiders next year, if you're, and they'll probably finished fourth in division based on quarterback and a defensive coach facing offensive coaches. You can win seven games finished fourth and have an eight pick. Just cross your fingers. There may not be more than three teams in the league next year along with the Raiders that need a quarterback. I think it hit me on Friday because obviously we were all, and I heard your take on the cousin's panic situation with kind of being an insurance policy. I think everyone got a redid. this offseason. Because when March 15th hits,

teams like the Raiders and the Falcons, they didn't make the playoffs. So they have had two and a half months to kind of prepare. Now, the Raiders were hiring some people, say the Falcons too, so there were some moving parts. It wasn't like a seamless transition. I think if you could get a redo,

you would do something pretty simple. Christian Wilkins, the Atlanta Falcons, the Raiders wouldn't sign him. They would assign Kirk Cousins to a $100 million deal instead of the defensive linemen. because they have a team full of high-end guy. They have no quarterback. And the Falcons would have signed Gardner-Mintu

or a Sam Donald for $10 million and drafted the 24-year-old quarterback who's going to be ready to go and signed the defensive linemen. And listen, I don't blame the Raiders. They kind of got stuck. When you're drafting, not in the top 10, you don't control everything.

Once Panics goes, that's the guy I think that they liked. Maybe they got stuck. But when you're in this no-man position, and what do you do? You know, Gardner Minchew's not fixing your problems. Gardner Minchew and Sam Darnold fix your problems when you can invest in a young quarterback and give you a little breathing room.

But to me, the Raiders, they drafted players that everyone loved. I bet the entire league, you're not going to meet one coach or GM that didn't like Brock Bowers as a high-end player, right? But what does he do for you when your two quarterbacks are Gardner Minchew and O'Connell from Purdue?

It just, and it's no one's fault. Like, this is kind of who they had. The cousins thinks maybe he wouldn't have been that interested. Arthur Blank has more cash so the way he can structure a deal. But going back to Atlanta, you only get so many resources. I remember how he said this in a couple years ago in a press conference. Every team in the league, what makes the NFL different than all these other leagues, everyone has the same resource.

We all have the same amount of money and the same amount of draft picks. You just choose how you use them. The reason the Browns have no first round picks, they traded for Deshawn Watson, and they allocate a lot of money to him. Well, once you allocate all this money to cousins like the Atlanta Falcons did, when you draft a quarterback high, one of his great attributes is the contract. Right. So using that money to sign Christian Wilkins. Well, the quarterback position, only one guy can be on the field.

And this guy is not McCarthy or Drake May who is a, you know, a project, a guy that you want to not force on the field. He is, he was probably the most beside Caleb, like, you just want to see him play right away. And I think this goes back to they fell in love with him over the last month Well, what the hell were you doing? Six months ago. What were you doing? You would have known at the combine,

this is just bad. Like part of the draft, the planning goes. You find Howie Roseman or Veach. They've been planning the shit for six months building out strategies. It feels like these guys are flying by the sea of their pants. No one would argue, and I'm with you, you're better off having more invested in the quarterback position

doubling down. But the resources here are a little funky. And Chris Sims had a good tweet. He's like, well, cousin's not going to be ready at OTAs. Who's going to be out there slinging it to all these young guys? It's going to be penics. So is there going to be a natural gravitation? You know, there's an age gap.

All of a sudden, like, why are we playing this old guy if this young guy? It could get weird and it could get weird fast. Yeah, listen, it was odd and it's not what I would have done. But my takeaway is Arthur Blanks is in the 80s. He's getting old. Yeah. And his takeaway is, we've got some really good young pieces in a great old line. And my take is you have to be careful about having a strident opinion when there are realistic scenarios that could ensue.

Cousins could come back and he wasn't mobile before this and you could have a guy that's just a ham and egger. Secondly, which is very likely wouldn't you say? It was 50-50 chance probably. I mean, Aaron Rogers stopped moving about two years ago. What is he now? He's going to be a pocket quarterback. And the other scenario is 66 quarterbacks played last year. Cousins may get hurt.

So I almost feel like Ritter was so bad. Desmond Ritter was so bad. There's a sense in the building like, listen, we're not paying any of these young guys yet. We're really not. We're not paying any of them. They're all just kids. Let's just go get cousins to insure. Because I don't know if they thought when they were doing, when they signed cousins,

Penix was, it's funny, Pennix had a roller coaster. Everybody was red hot on him. Then everybody bailed on him. And then we find out after the draft that four teams, including Atlanta, were interested in the first round. So he went from hot to second round prospect to apparently red hot during the draft. So my take is, you know, I could see Atlanta being like, okay, let's just sign him. We could get him later.

And all of a sudden, because I do. know the Seahawks, the Raiders, like teams were interested in them. For sure. I got no issue taking them, eight. Zero issue taking them eight. I just think when you plan an organization, that's the GM's job, is to think big picture. And I understand at the time, signing Minchu or signing darn old people would have been like, what the hell are you doing?

But you should have had a pretty good idea because you've been picking eight for four months now. Like, the spot didn't change. You were going to get that guy. You have the juice to get that. guy at eight. And I just think using that amount of money, because when you give that amount of guaranteed, and we saw with Russell who was bigger, it does stick on your cap for several years. And that's a position where you can't use them both. Like sometimes if you miss on an O lineman or a D lineman, you can rotate guys or wide receivers. I just think you're so dependent.

And Cousins, what happens immediately? His agents, and I like Mike McCartney, but he immediately comes out, like we're blown away. I saw Colt McCoy say, you know, Cousins are pretty sensitive. So when you get in the sensitive business, and it's not like he doesn't have the equity in the league, like a Brady or a Rogers where it's like, whatever, we're getting this all-time great player. There are a lot of people are like, yeah, he's good, but how good.

I just think the locker room dynamics, and Belichick was always great at this, it's already weird. It's already going to be weird, especially when you factor in. OTAs are going to start in the next month, and Pennix is going to be out there because the other guys in the training room,

getting ready, hopefully, for training camp. So, I mean, fundamentally, I get, like, investing in the quarterback position goes back to Bill Walsh and Ron Wolf totally. But when you factor in the amount of money, it does just limit your ability. And this is not, the other thing with Pennix is even maybe more than Caleb. Like, he's just a plug-in play guy. He's 25, you're 24, 25 years old. Like, what the hell? Like, this is not a Jordan love situation.

And I think that's where a lot of people, the media can say whatever, but like the league's pushing back. Because it's just like, it's a very bizarre situation. I think it does reflect the organization who's like, oh, yeah, Belichick, we're too good for Belichick. It's like, who the fuck are you guys? No, I, listen, I, I mean it times I called it illogical. And on its surface, you know, my take was Friday is, listen, is. I think it's financially illogical more than football illogical. Right.

Like, I'm just, this is the worst division in football. I think they have the best quarterback. And maybe the best backup in the league. I'm like, make mistakes at that position. Just go for it. I'm okay with it. But it, but it, and it also, what's interesting, I would have much more of a problem. Because I think they paid, what did they pay cousins?

140. Was it like 140? Yeah, I think, I think the, the fake number was closer to 180, but they gave them a hundred true guaranteed money in like basically $70 million over the next 18 months. Right. Yeah. So it's very front-loaded. What worries me is that DAC and Tua,

with their current teams will want double that. So I always feel, look, with cousins, my takeaway is it's all front-loaded. If Thanksgiving of the second year you're done with them, you're fine. DAC wants a five-year deal. And it's like, paying $3.50 for DAC is literally ends. I'm with you there. I'd rather give cousins 100 than DAC 250. Yeah, yeah.

So of all the bad things you can do, I can live with a year and a half of cousins on the field competing. I can live with that. Thank you to our friends at Panini America, official trading card of our draft coverage here at the volume and NFT and official trading card. Listen, whether you're looking for a legendary card or a rookie sensation, Panini America has you covered. They have NFL, WNBA, FIFA, sought after NBA cards. This is what they do. If you're into cutting edge digital collectibles, don't miss Panini's NFT platform at NFD. Paniniamerica.net. Got that? So you can be a collector of physical cards or a digital enthusiast.

Panini America has you covered. They have popular cards from Don Russ, Prism, Select, and more. So if you're into trading cards, Panini America is the way to go, especially if you're into digital trading cards. Visit Paniniamerica.net or download the Panini direct app today. It's the official trading cards and NFTs of the Colin Cowherd draft coverage. You're into it. They're into you and they deliver. Prism, Don Russ, select, got them all, all the top cards and more. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged.

It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds, I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care which I'll say. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what.

He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid.

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Like, after you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You know, I thought Harbaugh was going to

have, there were going to be more fireworks with the chargers. I did think they got a couple of really interesting pieces, a couple small school guys. But I think By and large, the Joe Alt pick was interesting because they have a left tackle, though Slater had an injury. And Alt's kind of an – he's an athlete. He was a high school basketball player. He's moved around.

He's been a – he's a very good athlete. You see the pictures after we got off of him sitting with his family, how massive that human being is? So it's one of those things where I never bought into them taking a wide receiver. I just didn't buy – and everybody's mock draft had them. receiver and I'm thinking, that's just not what they're not going to get some skinny kid from LSU. So, I mean, to me, the pick made sense. But I didn't think the, the Chargers had that many fireworks. I thought they did just basic stuff, played it into gym. You know, I think they got a linebacker, if I recall, from the Michigan. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't think there was a ton of fireworks

with the Chargers. You know, what's funny is most people up until the last couple weeks, when I think a lot of people around the NFL, like Jim's not taking a wide receiver guys, so we can stop talking about that. But even the second pick in Ladd McConkey, you know, a lot of people have been like, go get Herbert,

go trade up and get Xavier worthy or, you know, get Keon Coleman, the guy the bills took. And he took Ladd McConkey, you know, who's going to end up to me being more Edelman,

West Welker can play right in the slot receiver. Jim's not into this sexy football. He's not trying to be, you know, Lane Kiffin or Lincoln Riley. That's not the way he coaches. He coaches like he's prepared to play Mike Ditka and Joe Gibbs back in 1988.

And that's the way that's been successful up until him three months ago when he won the national championship. Fundamentally, and I think when he said, we view offensive linemen as weapons. He's not making a – he's being serious as a heart attack because he truly believes that. So Justin Herbert, like they are – I'm actually a little shocked that they didn't get Blake Corum. I'm pissed the Rams that I love that pick. but it's just he's going to the football is going to look no different than if you pull up Stanford year one in 08

it's going to look the exact same and it looked the same in the 49ers early on in Michigan he changed for a minute remember when he hired Gaddis the spread guy from Alabama and he hated it and he hated it and then who became his right-hand man Sharon Moore what's he an O-line coach and that guy became the head

those are the people he likes you see these videos coming out of him at the trailer park. It was not the trailer park, but you know, where he lived right with Greg Roman. What do they talk about? Running game, offensive linemen. They're all that hybrid of the Ravens of him. They're all interconnected.

And I've just, honestly, if you would have told me he would have drafted all offensive and defensive linemen. Those were the only picks, no wide receivers two weeks ago. I would have believed you. I mean, that's not how it played out. But he thinks he can win. If he's winning at that group, he can figure the rest out. through, I would say, psychological and physical warfare, because he wants to shove you around.

And let's face it, most teams in the NFL, you know, when you look at like, once we get to the final four or the final eight, it's a lot of physical teams. And the soft teams, some teams that can score, they got no shot. They got no shot. And you look at the final four, who was it? It was the Niners. It was the Ravens. It was the Chiefs.

What have the lions become under Dan Campbell? Dan Campbell's got a little Jim Harbaugh in him. Yeah. Right? And I would say they throw it. a little more than Jim, but that's part of it. It's their weapons. St. Brown's a fantastic player. But it starts with the offensive and defensive lines with them. And that's where they've invested the last couple of years. Even St. Brown, Jim would love St. Brown. So would Kyle Shanahan.

He's their type breaks tackles. He's not some sexy outside wide receiver, despite his stats. Well, this is what the Rams have done the last two years. O-Line. They paid two guards. I mean, the Rams said, we're going to pay guards and the receivers. Puka breaks tackles. Cooper Cup breaks tackles. Yeah, I think, you know, it's funny. People tend to think offensive coaches are clever and they want finesse. But McVe changed his offense to more power running. That's why Coram was so valuable.

They needed Kyron Williams. They needed a backup. They invested an interior line. Shanahan likes physical football. Harbaugh likes physical football. Andy Reed is a little – he's unique. He's a little bit – I almost put him in just a different class. It's like there are certain people in every sport that just don't like.

But think about when they pivoted, when they pivoted off Tyreek Hill, what did they do? They've drafted McDuffey and Carlavskis with their two picks right away. So he's invested heavily on that side of the ball. This year, Xavier, it was David was too hard for them to pass up with the speed. But I'm with you. So I went, and it was interesting, I went and I went and looked at all my divisions. So we're basically through it. Now we have new coaches.

we have free agency, staffs are all filled up, we have the draft, and I'll just do the first and last place teams. And stop me. This is what you think coming up, or this was based on last year? This season, I have Buffalo first, New England last.

Yes. Baltimore first, Cleveland last. Cleveland had a weird draft. Since he could be a wild guard there, if Burroughs healthy. Yeah, I put them second. Kansas City first, Raiders last, tough division, Houston first, Tennessee's and easy last. Philly first, I have Giants last. I'm with it. Detroit first, Minnesota last, though it's close. Atlanta first, New Orleans last, or Carolina kind of question mark. I have the Rams first, and I have Seattle last. I think the Rams are

I thought they really nailed their first four picks. I thought they really, yeah. Is anything, so we can argue about the second and third teams, but any of those first and last you would push back on? Yeah, let's talk about McVeigh, because I thought he's a good example, what Kyle and Andy and these offensive coaches have invested in physical players

because they know that they can scheme guys open. And he invests his first pick and verse, who's been a feud as a first rounder this whole year. They loved him. I sure heard a month ago. They loved him. This second round pick, one of the guy, when I started at Fresno State, we had a student assistant who has worked his way up and he's been with Oregon State. He's been the GM for Florida State for like the last three years.

And he's Derek Ray, he's, you know, if we talked about college GMs like we do NFL GMC, I mean, look at his draft. I mean, look how many guys at Florida State were just picked. He's done a great job working hand in hand with Norville. I said, what this Brandon Fisk guy, Braden Fiske, tell me about him. He said, think Max Crosby, but inside. So their first two picks. You know, we know that's how Verst kind of plays power.

That's what this guy plays. So you're never going to replace Aaron Donald. But they go back-to-back picks basically in what, 15, 20 pick because they trade it up. They got Fisk in the top 40. So they invest immediately. And they get Blake Coram, who, if he's healthy, we've seen how, this guy was the heartbeat of one of the better

college football programs we've seen over the last 20 years. I mean, this is like Jim Harbaugh's favorite player since Frank Gore. So I think they're, The gap shrunk a little bit. And I think Kyle Shanahan showed you something drafting that wide receiver in the first round. Debo Samuel could not get open in this Super Bowl. He can't run routes. And I'm not trying to talk shit about Debo.

I love him. A lot of stuff he does in football, I admire a lot, the physicality, the ability to make plays. But he is limited as a wide receiver. He can't get open. And I think Kyle was tired of it. And at this point in time, it's not going to change. He kind of is what it is. So maybe Debo moving forward.

You're going to be on this new kickoff return guy. and you'll kind of come in with McCaffrey in the backfield. But we need to have wide receivers like Iyuk who can run routes. And because like look at the ramps. They got a bunch of guys that can run routes. I can't scheme up every single play. We got guys on defense. We got guys on offense.

But they drafted Pearsall. Like that clearly was something that rattled Chanhand. Just like McVeigh, like we need to be even more physical if we're going to get over that hump against all these great offenses and they double down. So I think those two teams right there with the Lions, right there with the Packers, right there with the Eagles. I guess it's pretty clear with the NFC who the cream of the crop is, right? Yeah. And I also think you have to take this into consideration is Debo.

McCaffrey's had injuries in his career. Trent, Kiddell, you can't have your four top guys all feel like they're older than their age. Like if you have, IYuk is a kid, right? He's just moving into his prime. Doesn't get heard. If you're going to move off. And next year, they have to address. left tackle because Trent is a wall.

But I'm with you. I look at the NFC and I think it's, I mean, the Rams were so much better than everybody thought. I knew going into the weekend, they felt Brock Bowers could start for him. Two of the defensive ends, they thought were really good. The UCLA kid and Jared Verst, they loved those two. And then I knew they loved a couple different defensive linemen and the Florida state guy, Fiske, is one of them.

And then I felt Blake, I mean, I knew they loved Corum. But, I mean, they, when people got on them for giving up a second round pick and a fifth to move up, they really felt like they needed two starters in the defensive line, a great backup running back for Karen Williams and a playmaking guy in the back, the Miami kid. Like, they didn't have a lot of needs. A lot of their stuff after those picks, interior lineman, kicker. The Texas receiver is really a special teams guy. Otherwise, they would have taken Taj Washington from USC, who they liked a lot, but they needed a special teams guy. So, I mean, I think a lot of these teams come into the weekend, the NFC teams and the Rams are one of them, I think people forget this. For the elite teams, and I consider the Rams in a group of about seven or eight, they come in kind of thinking, we need two starters and like two really crucial productive backups.

But I've never had a problem, John, with giving away picks to go get up and get a guy. Now, when you were with the Eagles, what was the theory on that? Because I think all the draft picks, here's my point. Rams had 11 picks. There's not 11 guys that can make the team in this draft. Well, how he's going to be there forever so he balances short and long term better than anybody. It's why they're always going up to get guys. And then they led the league in trades this year and they acquired a third, a fourth, and a fifth.

Sean McVeigh almost went to Amazon a year ago. You're living in the present with this guy. You are doing everything possible in 24, 25, hopefully 26. is Sean McVeigh going to be there in five years? I'm with you. A lot of teams give away second round pick. This is about the present. To me, they clearly, the Niners, the last couple of years, been 12, 13, and there was a gap,

you know, even between them last year. To me, they're both 11-12 win teams in the NFC. I have no problem with trading up. One thing how he did is acquiring the third, fourth, and fifth, he thought because of this weird kind of couple years span we've been on with these extra years, a lot of these guys, Did you notice some of these guys getting drafted, started playing in 2018? I mean, there were guys, there was a Jaden Daniels video that went viral of him, throwing the ball to Brandon Ayuk against Justin Herbert, you know,

with Lenore playing corner for Oregon, who's been on the Niners for like four years. So it's all out of whack. Well, a lot of the underclassmen this year, who teams thought were going to be from anywhere from 40 to like 100, guys that would have been drafted on the second day went back to school for NIL, So the draft's viewed as a little deeper next year. And I think some teams kind of factored that in. Sean McVeigh doesn't give a crap about anything.

A lot like Sean Payton. It's very much these next couple years and then we'll figure it out the aftermath. The one thing would the Rams have going for them and you hit on, their team's pretty young now, right? A lot like the Packers. I don't view it now. Their quarterback's aging, which is a unique situation for them. And there's a lot of wear and tear on those tires.

But as we saw, when Matt Stafford is upright and healthy, he's easily a top five quarterback in the NFL. Yeah, it was funny. I felt the Bears and the Packers came out of offseason real winners. I thought the Rams came out of this draft as real winners. Atlanta's is quirky and time will tell. Actually, the pick I hated, I thought they reached by almost a. round on the defensive lineman, which was a weird pick for them. That was the one I'm like, I went to all, I went to all the draft profiles. I went to all the mock drafts. Like that,

they, well, the Illinois defensive tackle goes a couple picks later. He was widely viewed as a top 30 player that the Washington got. Yeah, I thought that was just a miss. I mean, if, if Pennix ends up being great, we're going to forget about the Kirk Cousins deal very quickly. We're just not even going to, we're not even going to care about it. That was just a bad pick. I thought Atlanta had a weird last week. week. I know I know people tend to talk a lot about the Dallas Cowboys to the point of exhaustion. I thought Dallas had a weird draft, and I thought Tennessee taking alignment. The Titans are a mystery to me. So they take this DeMonte Sweat guy from Texas. So when I went to the Chargers War Room years ago, they had a list of like eight guys that were off the board. There was a drug issue. There were no go.

issues. Like, I don't know what the hell Tennessee is doing. Like that, I mean, to me, that team needs players that will produce with no questions. That may have been the weirdest pick of the weekend. Well, to me, you have, when you get a new young head coach, you're in a position where you want to be a smooth transition. Look at Washington. A lot of high character, team captains, not screwing around. You can eventually, I'm sure we'll get into Ballard, take a guy, I think, that had some question marks in the second round, when your team is full of team captain, high character guys. The Titans a couple of years ago drafted a Georgia offensive lineman

who is one of the biggest busts in recent memory. I think he's out of the league, Wilson. And then to get a guy, and listen, I'm not some moral high horse. That's not my style. Drinking, whatever. We've all made mistakes when we were young. But there were a lot of question marks with this guy's drinking, and he admitted to it with teams.

And then three weeks before the draft, he gets a DUI on Sunday afternoon. Sunday afternoon. He weighs 370 pounds. So to get a DUI over 0.1, the amount of alcohol he has to take is a lot different than me or you under 200 pounds. So you just start factoring that in. He was off draft boards, not even a question, off several draft boards, just because it's like not even worth it. I've been in Nashville twice. Probably spent a total of 12 or 13 days.

I drank every single day I was there. It is a party town. There is a lot going on. It is much closer for people that haven't been there to New Orleans or Vegas than most people realize. And they play and their stadium is right in the mix. So to have a guy, it's one thing if you're like, well, he fell to the fifth round. This guy was a second round talent. Okay.

They drafted him right where his value, who's going to go early second round, best case, if everything off the field was clear because he's a run stop, you know, stopping defense tackle, not a pass rusher. I don't get it when you just had a character issue a couple years ago. And this guy literally got a DUI a month ago. And you already knew those were question marks. And you have a brand new head coach. Why would you screw with this? Why would you mess with it? I don't get it. Yeah, no, I thought that was the worst pick of the weekend. And I also think, you're right, Nash, Vegas is what they call it. And I also think that I was told years ago, It may have been my Mike Lombardi when he was at FS1 briefly.

He said, listen, if you're in a port city, New York, you know, Los Angeles, Miami, Miami, like, those are livelier city. There's more restaurants. There's more alcohol. Those are port cities fun. Yeah. And he's like, you know, Green Bay is different. If sweat goes fourth round to the Packers and you're like, well, he could be at the Marriott bar, that's about it. It does feel different than going second round of the Titans.

all stuff is circumstantial in this league. And so to me, I think I've just gotten to the point with Tennessee. I always thought they were well run. I think they're a bit of a bit of an S show. I really do the last couple years, letting go of Rable. And I know Mike, I've talked to Mike on the phone. I've texted him. I don't think they know what they're doing.

I just do not think they know what they're doing. I like the new coach. He brings his dad. I mean, I was pretty bullish on what they're going to do. but this general manager ran Carth and, you know, he came out and said a couple weeks ago in his press conference. This is my first draft taking a shot at Mike. Like, no one let me do anything before.

Like, good luck, buddy. I mean, this is not, he comes from the 49ers where they were not messing with this type stuff. So to do it, if it is your first quote unquote draft, I just, I can't get over. It's one thing like, Dak, remember he got a, he got a doee or whatever, got in trouble. But everyone knew. The character was not a question. It's like, listen, he made a bad mistake, stupid, whatever.

a guy with consistent character marks when you get in trouble for the draft, it's like absolutely no chance I can trust you. Zero with a high pick because I'm investing, taking a guy in the top 40, that's a valuable, valuable pick. I mean, some of those guys in the, from 32 to 38 are going to turn out

to be some of the best players in the draft that happens every single year. So to invest in that player after you got in trouble in your city is like, it's like the opposite of what the Rams are doing. Getting super high character, you know, guys that everyone's swears. Where's my? Like, what are we talking about? This is why I saw it at the combine. It's so enlightening. You walk by and you just see like, yeah, this team's got no shot. This team's got no shot. This team's got no shot. This team front of circles around you. It's not a fair fight. Yeah, I was, I spent the weekend. I spent Saturday eight hours eating smoking cigars and cocktails with Steve Kime. We had like one of the great days of our lives. We found a cigar bar and we just talked NFL, watch the draft and talk stories. And some of the stuff Steve Kime had to deal with in Arizona.

He was with them like 24 years. I mean, he got like the first scouting job up. I don't think fans, I don't think fans realize two things. One, half of these owners are impossible to work with. Just, I mean, listen, Ballard is dealing with the most impulsive guy in the league. Bidwell. Woody Johnson. Woody Johnson.

Like beyond, it would be like having the worst boss of your life. Not really beholden to any corporate struggle. Who owns the company has the unlimited money and who's nuts. Yeah, I mean, Kime had the deal with stuff here on game day and after games, parking space issues. When you got a right tackle that his season ended, it's insane. And the other thing is, you know, fans tend to think everybody's equally competent. And it's like, I mean, there are people in every industry, including the NFL, that just they just don't know what they're doing. And I think, I mean, there are power struggles going on with coaches.

I mean, Bill Belichick, his last five years when he controlled the draft. I mean, I talked to a GM over the weekend who said, you wanted to do business with them. Like Bill didn't really quite know what he was doing in the personnel. He didn't really know exactly what he was doing. He was a great coach, but you could work him a little bit in personnel. So I think you look at Tennessee right now and it just doesn't look organized. And I think this is, I think it's a, I think it's a problem throughout the league. I think some, I mean, let's be honest, the Raiders don't feel as buttoned up as Kansas City.

I think everybody can see it. Yeah. And the Chargers immediately get two guys, one from Baltimore and Jim Harbaugh and feel like they know what they're doing. Right. Now, I always thought Tom's a good GM, but the Brandon Staley element, it's hard because you have to, you can't just draft players you like that your coaching staff doesn't like. So there's always a give and take. But when you have, I watched a lot of press conferences after the draft on all the days.

And McVeigh had a really good take where he's like, the symmetry seven, eight years into this makes doing business a lot easier with the two of us. And our scouts and our coaches, like, we kind of know what we're doing now. Right. John Lynch and Kyle Shanahan have been in a draft room and Sean McVeigh and Lesneed for eight years together. That's longer than Howie and Siriani. And a lot of, you know, Brett Veach and Andy Reid have been together. Now, Javit hasn't always been his GM for 20 plus years, right? When the Ravens come on, you know Ozzie Newsom, he's tired like five years ago?

He still sits at the head of the table. He sits at the head of the table, like where your dad or grandfather would sit. Eric DeCostas sits next to him, so it shows their power dynamic. John Harbaugh has been the coach there since what, 06, 07? Like, they're just on the same page. I asked Steve Kime, I said, who's the best run franchise in the league? He said Baltimore. He said Baltimore.

He said the owner is down in Florida. Florida, never medals, empowers his employees. He said, Baltimore is the... They're well-funded, so they have unlimited money? Yep, totally supportive of Harbaugh. He said, you know, and Steve, you're not going to throw people under the bus, but he said, Colin, this, a half of the GMs in the league are pulling their hair out six times a year. You're just dealing with nonsense. And he said Baltimore, he listed five or six, but he said, Baltimore is as well-run as any organization. It starts with a very kind of, competent owner who's hands off, who spends the money. And, you know, because if you really think about it, John, the best business in America, I'll make an argument, is owning an NFL team. I mean, think about this. Name another business that gets billions of dollars of free advertising a year. Essentially, you're a TV show. Oracle's not a TV show. Apple's not a TV show. Amazon's not, well, Amazon kind of got into that business.

Yeah, but it's like, it's guaranteed. Also, you don't know if there's disruptions in tech and that Apple is late on AI. And Tim Cook gets fired. They plummet their stock. You know Dallas is going to be in Dallas. The Cowboys are going to be in Dallas and the Rams are going to be in Los Angeles and the Packers are going to be in Green Bay. These are owning an NFL team. It's the best business.

There's 32 in America. Some are the Jags. Some are the Steelers. But, and these owners. know it. I mean, they know it. It is. I mean, and they're old school guys. And I just pitched the show the other day to AMC, a football show with a protagonist being the general manager. And it's, without going into too much detail, basically it's juggling. It's a GM juggling, a meddling owner, a high-profile coach whose wife's a therapist, the quarterback sort of Aaron Rogers

Prickley, who's hitting on the coach's wife's daughter, you know. And it's as I'm doing it and writing it's Netflix written all over it. Well, as I'm doing it and writing these stories and I gave it to a couple GMs, they're like, oh, you can take bigger swings. It's crazier than this. You're not being crazy enough. No, they were like, well, that's a six. Let me tell you a story that's way worse than this. So when you watch the draft and you watch what people do, this is like any other industry.

There's really a lot of chaos and nonsense and incompetence. Well, look at Ballard, who I think is one of the better GMs in the league. Let's talk Ballard, yeah. Yeah, because we talk about his draft, but his owner right now is saying things that I was not under the influence. I did not have an overdose. That's what he's dealing with. This guy owns the team. We talked about his first round pick, Lott, too.

His second round pick, he went on that rant about the character stuff. I think it was after he drafted Mitchell, the wide receiver from Texas rap sheet came on NFL network and basically said, his interviews had been terrible. He sounded disinterested. And I don't think he's just making that up. And then Ballard got kind of pushed back against it. I do think this. I would say Chris's team,

he probably, of all the good GMs in the league, does not mess with character at all for the most part. Like, that's not really his M.O. Of guys that he's going to invest high in, right? Most of his top highly paid players, guys he's traded for, guys he signed are just, I would call like, pristine character. DeForest Buckner, Quinn Nelson, Michael Pittman. I mean, these are Kenny Moore, super high character guys.

I'm not saying Mitchell's not, but he did have some question marks. Guys with his talent typically aren't there at 45. Now, he was with the Chiefs when they took Marcus Peters. He's been around some of this that worked out. I think for the first time he realized, like, if we're really going to compete, because look at Casario, I would say he's kind of similar. Doesn't really meant, well, this offseason, what do you do? He went and got digs.

We don't even need the debate. Like, there's some issues there. So I think Ballard realized, like, listen, there was a small gap this year. We didn't have our starting quarterback. We got to be very careful about getting an influx of talent. and they took a guy who, you know, was very, very talented. I mean, I would say it's immediately just pure tech. I liked him more than worthy.

Xavier Worthy hurt a lot at Texas, a lot of drops. Now, it'll probably work with Mahomes, but I said this two weeks ago. He was my bust. He was the guy that I worry about because I watched him at Texas. I like Mitchell Moore. I thought he was more consistently available. He was a better route runner. He's bigger.

I mean, just not that much slow. I mean, he's still really fast. Yeah, here's the thing about taking swings on guy with character issues. So, you know, McVeigh's got a ring. You can be a little more precious on that stuff. But in Belichick had several rings. I thought the undoing of Bill Belichick was when he told Urban Meyer, and Urban Meyer told the audience, right?

He went on TV and said, Bill said, I just don't want to, I'm going to coach the guys I like. New England got really untalented over about a five-year period. Bill wanted to coach guys. You got to have some badass guys, and they're not always choir boys. Like, get over it. Now, I always think if you have strong leadership, now when Brady leaves, it may be different. Like, you'll lose that power leadership. But if you have good leadership, which the Patriots during Brady always had a grunk, a Brady, an Edelman, a defensive guy, you got to swing.

I mean, you got to take some. So to me, if you like your coach and you. you think DeForest Bruckner, if you got a handful, Michael Pittman, if you're top five or six, Quentin Nelson, if you got six dudes in the room, I have no problem taking a swing on guys. And for the record, John, there's a term diva receiver. Like, it's not diva safety. It's a personality position. I'm okay with it.

You know, Moose Johnson, I butchered this quote the other day when I was recording a podcast after day two. I was talking to him on a radio show years ago, and he said, all the best teams I was on and played against in the 90s were full full of. of players of character, a lot of, and a couple characters that could play. There is no team full of choir boys. You got no shot. Now, you can't have too many crazy character guys, but sometimes those are your most talented. You've said this for it in any industry, has them. Actors, music, you name it, salesmen, I don't care where you go.

Sometimes the most talented guy in the room is a little fucking nuts. And if you can corral that and get the most out of them and Belichick did this for a long time, Peyton Manning was able to work with it over the years. you got a shot, but I, yeah, I mean, I think, I know Ballard really, really values that stuff. So clearly they did a lot of work. And, you know, this thing about the draft, you kind of got to be prepared for anything. If I would have asked them at the beginning of the draft on Thursday night, do you think that guy's going to be there for you in the second round?

He would have laughed. He would have no chance. But this is why when everyone's like, what positions did you scout? I'm like, well, you do everyone. Like, just because you have a quarterback, you still, you just never know. Things get weird. And, yeah, I think, I think the Colts, I actually, think the Colts, if that quarterback's decent, they're going to be right there with the Texans.

I think they got a chance to be pretty good because of the coach. Yeah, and I think that division is now, like, pretty heady. I got Trevor Lawrence. Now, with Gabe Davis and getting Brian Thomas from LSU, you're like Evan Ingram. It's like Christian Kirk. E.N. Yeah, it's like, oh, that's like the bears. That's like real players.

And I think Shane Steichen's going to elevate everybody. You know, Gardner and Minchin is going to go to the Raiders, and his numbers are going to come down significantly. Yeah. You didn't have Shane Steichen. And then all of a sudden, Houston, I think Houston's just done so many smart things. That division now is a real division. And I think I have the Colts finishing third in that division, and I like them. Like, I like Minnesota.

They could finish fourth. Like, I don't like the New York Giants. They'll finish four. There's a big gap. There's some, you know what, we are getting to a point, and I don't ever remember this. There's so much talent in football right now and so many good coaches. coaches, John, they're going to be third and fourth place teams. I like. I could see the Jets finishing. If Aaron plays 17 games, I could see them finishing third and winning nine games,

and I can see Minnesota finishing fourth and winning eight, and I like them. It used to be the bottom of the league, it was just crappy. It wasn't the NBA bad, but it was just bad. It was five-win teams. Outside of Carolina and the Giants, I'm not sure there's a, Tennessee, it depends on if Will Levis can play. But I mean, Carolina Giants look hopeless. Tennessee, kind of. That's about it for me. Well, I would say this. I mean, the Steelers Brown is probably going to finish and fourth,

and both those two teams made the playoffs. Steelers just had a good draft drafted, multiple offensive linemen high. We know they're, you know, the Browns, I think, are going to be worse than they were last year with Deshawn Watson. But I'm with you. The middle of the league is, and this is why it's going to be, it's hard to win 13, 14 games because you're only getting so. This is not college football.

where you get, you know, Rutgers, and then you get, you know, some Arizona State, like, they do not really exist. And if you do sleepwalk on the New York Giants, and Daniel Jones has the best game of the season, all of a sudden you're down going into the fourth quarter. Because college football to me, I did a little math between Michigan, Washington, Bama, and Texas, the final four. And if you add the other top teams, Florida State, Georgia,

LSU, Oregon, Ohio State, almost 50, I think officially 46 of the top 100 draft picks came from those schools. I mean, you could argue as time goes on, that number could even creep higher. I guess Nick Saban said on Thursday night when he was on TV that the Toledo corner that the Eagles drafted, he's like, yeah, he realized he kind of caught himself. We tried to get him to go into the portal so then we could sign him, but he wouldn't even go into the portal. They just wanted him to go in the portal, then they could make an offer and get them.

But more and more, like that guy at Toledo, we might not see that for a while. It's going to be all these top programs, mainly in the Big Ten and the SEC, and then Florida State and Clemson and Notre Dame, who's kind of a ACC team and might inevitably be one, have all the talent in the draft. I mean, that's where all the high-end guys are coming from, those conferences. Yeah, no, I, it's really funny because I, Eric Shanks is, you know, he runs FS1, and I went to lunch with him. And I said, Eric, the Big Ten is going to start squashing people. I'm like, you know, Lincoln Riley is going to get it going. Oregon just is a machine. NIL. They're up there with like

Georgia, Ohio State NIL money. Yeah. UCLA is kind of mailing in their football program. I think they're going to go back to heavy basketball. That's my guess where you only need about four million a year NIL to really be an elite basketball. It's cheaper. You need about 12 in football. And UCLA just just can't generate that on an annual basis or or their donors have it, but don't want to give it up. But I look at college football right now. And this is, you know, John, we've talked about this, big, eat small, scale beats boutique in every business. College football has always been a bit lob-sided. I think we're going into eight programs.

We'll basically eat the sport. And I'm okay with it because my take is I'm not staying home to watch the holiday bowl and I love college football. You start looking at the big 10 in the SEC games from this point forward. now that you've added Texas, Oklahoma, there's no reason really to watch any other conference. I'll watch Notre Dame. I won't. I mean, now the Pac-12's gone.

There's just no reason to watch the Big 12 or the ACC outside of a Clemson. Yeah, like Florida State's going to beat Boston College by 30 points. It's not even a game. So it's like I'm always looking for ways, not that make my job easier, but make my job more efficient because I have, I'm watching.

I work seven days a week during, the football season, which is fine. I get paid well. But it's like, I'm just going to be watching Big 10 SEC football. That's all I'm going to watch. Same. Thank God the Pac-12 disbanded. Like, I'm not going to watch it. Sorry. I'm in agreement because it's, you know, people have always pushed back. These conferences are overrated. These conferences, no, that's where all the talent is. That's where all the NFL people spend their time. And they do it for a reason. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year.

Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me. Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media.

Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger.

So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. What's up, fam?

This Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Tolley. Donno in our podcast point game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game.

We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too.

Steve Nass would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He run up the court, licking his fingers while he got the ball. After you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball.

So listen to Point Game on the, Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All right, before we go, one, I'm going to ask you, I'm going to give you mine, and then think of yours why I'm saying it. So sometimes, you know, I'm in the take business. Podcast business is a little less like that because we have conversations that last an hour. But I was thinking about it this weekend. I thought the James Hardin of the Clippers was a disaster.

And I'm watching that game today, and I'm like, shit, that thing is working. I don't remember the last time I had an NBA take that was so bad. I thought, Westbrook, Kauai's weird. Paul George is excellent. Tailu can deal with dysfunction, but I'm like, this is like an old rock band where they all had issues and you're trying to work them to get along with each other again. I'm like, this isn't good. It's going to be terrible. And I watched them today, and I'm like, they get a good shot every time down the floor.

What in the world? Lawrence Frank was at a club. I go to occasionally a private club in L.A., and he was sitting having dinner one night, and I sat up next to him like, Lawrence Frank, we talked for an hour about it. And I said, God, I thought it was going to be a mess. And he said, you know, Hardin bought into it. Hardin just said, I want to win. I got a $300 million in the bank.

I want to win some games. And so I'm watching today, and I'm like, God, was I wrong on that thing? Give me your sports take when you look back and think, And mine may be Kirk Cousins. But with James Harden, in the last year or two, have you had a huge whiff? I thought that the Russell Wilson trade from Seattle would go down as the worst trade in like one of the history of the leagues for the Seattle Seahawks. Because there's no way you could trade a player of that caliber, what he meant for your franchise, and how good he would be for them. And it actually went the polar opposite way.

Like Deshaun Watson, it was clear, like, I don't know if I would be doing it. on this. That was weird. Aaron Rogers was old and it had gotten weird, but the Russell thing, right? He's 32, 33 years old. You're like, I get it was weird, but he's going to go to Denver. And this was before Sean Payton. And he didn't even last two years. I mean, he was benched before the second year ended. And it is easily on Denver side. I mean, I thought, in a weird way, it kind of ended Pete, though it wasn't because of the trade. It was just they kind of petered out and you saw. But it is, you could argue from, now, I would say the Browns are in the mix, but it's got to be in my lifetime when you factor in the dead money, all the picks you gave up, the situation it created

for Sean Payton. I mean, one of the worst trades any sport ever, ever. And it's, you know, the Aaron thing, when he got old, all these, Deshawn Watson, a bunch of weird shit off, the Russell thing, and you've talked, never seen, because even James Hardin, I went to a warrior game in his heyday with the Rockets. I remember in like game one, he scored 35. Like he's, he can have these moments. He's had a lot of bad moments, but no one's ever disputed like his talent and his ability. He just doesn't give a shit on defense.

And he kind of loaf sometimes when he's not feeling it. But when he tries, like, he is a high-end player. Russell just went from like James Hardin, high-end player to just average to not any good. It's crazy. With no injury. I don't think I've ever seen in athletics. I mean, it doesn't. happen in sports. No, I was the same way. I'm like, Pete, you've been fired two times before this

in the NFL. You were seven and nine, seven and nine before Russ. What are you doing? And Pete was having some issues behind the scenes that I've had validated. He and John Snyder were really at the end where people don't know, you know, John Snyder had Pete's son on the scouting staff and went to Pete and said, we're going to move off him. The next day Pete puts him on his coaching staff. So that was kind of a facial. But like Steve, I'm sure Steve told you yesterday, that's happening all over the league, the head coach and the GM's buttonheads about stupid shit. You know, not even big picture stuff. Yeah, so Seattle had some of that stuff going on behind the scenes.

But yeah, in my lifetime, I thought I don't, I've never seen a player in their early 30s who I thought was elite. I mean, Jesus, Russell's passer ratings were over 100, four years in a row. Now, you can say, well, the passer rating is a little overvalue. But over a hundred. If he just watched him, he was good. Yes. And then he was terrible. Awful.

Yeah, it's, but it's one of the things, this weekend to me is the best weekend of the year, not counting the NFL season. Now, you may throw in the Masters because you love golf more than I do. I like it. But this weekend, I watched draft the whole damn weekend. I watched, you know, I watched the Knicks' Sixers. You know, I watched the Lakers Nuggets a little bit in the second half, but I had a ball. Are the Sixers one of the greatest failed experiments in the history of

sports. I mean, they tank forever and they get, and now they're, I mean, they're going to lose this series. You're not going back. Somebody said this on the internet and I thought it was really accurate. Embedd maybe seven, two. He plays six four a lot. We shoot three is nonstop. Nonstop. He's screwing around at the top with a ball. He gets beat, uh, rebounding regularly late in games is that in Bede, you can't convince me you're a great player. If in the week Eastern Conference, you can't win a second playoff series. If you watch the Nick Sixers, there's no question. Brunson's

the better star. That's not even dispute now. He takes a lot of shots, but there's no question. Nobody on that team resents him. Like everybody's in on Brunson. You kind of feel with a Sixers sometimes that if you could privately talk to the players,

Maxie and Harris, some of these guys, they'd roll their eyes at him. He plays for his size small. Brunson for his size plays big. And I just come out of this and I'm like, Embed, I know you hated Yokic and you gave him the MVP. And that's always been a story award

more than the truth. Westbrook won an MVP. But we have to file what MBEED under. He's been a media darling more than he's been great. And in another life, Tom Fibito is not coaching basketball. He's an NFL coach. Probably start as no line guy.

That's the vibe I get from Tom Thibito. Because the Knicks, when I was a kid, they played just like this. Ugly they just, it felt like at any moment a brawl could break out. It's enjoyable. And clearly, their fans like it. I saw Embed was set after the game.

Like, it was half Knicks fans in there. Well, they're only 90 minutes apart. Yeah, it's not very far. It's easy drive. And the Knicks fans have been starved.

I've said this before when I lived on the East Coast, and I really did. I really love the people in the East Coast. Now, the winners aren't great. But, you know, as you get older, I can wear a coat. Like, I can get older. Yeah.

I love the people. I always said this. People always said New York was a baseball town. And I'm like, Yankee Stadium was empty in the 80s. The Knicks have been a mess for most of the last 20 years. You can't get tickets to a Knicks game. There's two baseball teams, right? There's two an NFL team. There's one NBA team. And when I was there, everybody I knew loved the Knicks. Half the town didn't like the Giants with their Super Bowls. Half the town was a Mets fan. So it's New York is, it's one of those things where you just, forget. People did this with the Warriors. You forget what a great basketball city it is. Like when I grew up in the 70s, Golden State won a title with Rick Berry, Al Addles, Clifford Ray, Mullins, Jeff Mullins, I think Jamal Wilkes. And they were really good for a stretch. The 70s was weird. Everybody won like one title, the Bullets with Elvin Hayes, the Sonics, with DJ, Gus Williams, Jack Sigma. Everybody won one, the Sixers with Dr. Jay. Didn't Washington win a title? Yeah, Kevin Greby, Elvin Hayes, West Sunseld, Bobby Dander. I think Bobby Danderer, was on that

team. That was my indoctrination to sports. I was a huge NBA guy. I collected NBA cards in the 70s. And the Knicks, by the way, won in I think 71 or 72. Lakers May 1 in 72. Knicks 1 and 71. Could be wrong. I'm in the ballpark. Fraser Monroe, Willis Reed, that stuff. But one of the things that you forget and you forgot it about the Warriors, it was always a great NBA city. Always a great NBA city. Just had either bad ownership or bad teams for 30 years. New York, I think it's a basketball city. I think it's just, I think there are no shows all over that town when teams go sideways. The Knicks have been embarrassing, feudal.

Some would argue, you know, Dolan now feels like he got, he has Leon Wood. He's kind of got, he's stepped back. He trusts, he trusts his ownership. So James Dolan now is like, he's like a normal owner. But when I watch those Nick games, the league has all these small teams, all these OKCs, Indiana's that are fascinating right now, they need the Knicks. Like the NBA needs the Knicks. Can I give you a guy that I don't think they need? And I had the game on the other day, I looked up, and it was sad. The Kevin Duran experience is just an all-time these last four or five.

I mean, the gutless performance, they got destroyed. And it feels he's kind of gone full mercenary and just kind of goes from team to team. And just there's no emotion. Like, LeBron's clearly not the same, but you see him trying, Curry and those guys go out swinging. You just watch Kevin Durant, you're like, what is this? It's, it's pretty sad for a guy at one point in time, look like, I remember going to games thinking, it's like one of the best players I've ever seen. It's not like he's 42 years old. I know he's a little older now, but it's, it's a tough watch. I mean, I thought it was pretty embarrassing. No question. I was talking to somebody in my field recently and they were talking about somebody who it's a media person that is struggling.

And I said, weird doesn't work. Eventually, weird doesn't work. People don't like to be around them. They're unpredictable. You know, Aaron Rogers has gotten a little weird. Kevin Durant's gotten a little weird. Kauai Leonard, a little odd. Now, you know, when I say weird.

I say this for Rogers. He was winning MVP's a couple years ago. At least he produced later in his career. Yeah. Aaron's gotten old single rich, no kids, no pets, no mate. It's like seven houses all over the place flying around. Yeah. Podcasters.

It just doesn't, you know, Kevin and Aaron Rogers have always been sort of, again, rich, no wife, no kids, no pets, spend too much time. Rabbit ears on the internet. And they're both gifted. But those people are hard to build around because you don't. Like, mystery is great for books and movies. It's not great for sports teams. Like, Brady, you know exactly what you got. Kobe, actually, you know, Kobe, from people that knew him, was like, he was just a creature of habit.

He ate the same thing every night of the season. Fresh salmon, like, every night of the season. Small glass. I mean, it was just bizarre. And it's like, but you know what you get with Kobe. You get some ego. You get some shots. I think Kevin is kind of just.

I think mercenary is the right language, the right word. He just wants to shoot, score and do other things. And it's like, it's hard to build around that. Yeah, to me, he kind of represents, you know, with LeBron. I bet the Lakers probably losing five. Obviously, Curry's gone. He just feels like, those guys, if you just ask someone casually about LeBron or Curry, you could have a long conversation.

I feel like Kevin Durant, you're like, yeah, I don't even care. He just kind of lost everybody. It's like, yeah, whatever. Yeah. He's become, frankly, kind of an irrelevant NBA. He really has. He really has. He had the best owner, arguably in the league, the best coach, and the best teammate.

Lacob, Kerr, and Curry. And he left for Kyrie Irving. And I said, the NBA media supports more than reports. If Mahomes left for the Jets, he said, yeah, a slot receiver. I love him. I'm going to the Jets. He'd be like, the fuck are you doing? He would get crushed.

What are you doing? In the NBA, Kevin leaves the penthouse and goes to a fixer-upper. And everybody's like, well, he's a unique spirit. That's a bad business decision. Yeah. And it hasn't worked out, not even close. Yeah, if I left Fox and went to vice or something like that, that's a bad business. Don't do that.

So I think Kevin got a little bit of a pass because, you know, the NBA is, you know, creative. And these are, you know, like international soccer guys. There's egos. They're highly compensated. They're artists. is a terrible decision. Get over it. Deal with Draymond. Get therapy. Get over it. I'm with you.

All right, John. As always, great chatting. And we'll talk soon. We'll have a good week. See you. The volume. Thanks so much for listening. If you've enjoyed the podcast, take a moment, rate, and review. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you

funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart

Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clever Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media.

Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeard Radio app,

Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all,

embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Thank you.