The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Colin Cowherd Podcast - Best Of: Caleb Williams & Predictions For The Chicago Bears

Episode Date: August 3, 2025

The best of Colin Cowherd’s takes on Caleb Williams and the Chicago Bears. Did the Bears win the NFL offseason? Will Caleb improve enough this year? Will new head coach Ben Johnson turn Chicago into a winning team? Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates!  #VolumeSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Listen to Deeply Well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcasts, network on the iHeart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcast Danny parkins co-host breakfast ball the winner of the mythical fs one NFL picks championship it should be noted it's just like the USA today high school basketball championship it's all mythical so let's not go crazy on this shit listen it is definitely true that I only made it a competition between you, me, and Nick once I started to crush it and distance myself on the field. So, you know, going into next year, if I start four and nine, you know, it's just luck.

But when I'm crushing it, it's skill and you guys are in a competition. You didn't even know you had entered. You know, I said I've had three of my favorite shows, I would say, in the last 10 years, I have had the last three shows in a row. I've had about as much fun as I can have at this point of 30 years of being in. So because I love free agency, I love the movement. I love when stuff breaks on the show. You know, I just, I sometimes I think, you know, the audience thinks we love football and football season,

but I actually find it more challenging when the season's over and we have to sit there for two hours in the morning and figure out ways to be compelling. and there's not a lot out there. So this week, it's basically you've got B-level players, sometimes C-plus players, transitioning to bad teams, and yet I had so much damn fun this week. And I want to start with the Bears, because I honestly, and I don't remember the last time I thought this, it's obvious Ben Johnson now runs the organization

because he basically, by acquiring a guard, a center of guard, is telling Ryan Poles, your picks were not good. You know the organization well. That's my take is there are certain coaches. Vrable in New England is running the show. Belichick for years ran the show. McVeigh's got a lot of power in Los Angeles.

Whereas Brett Veach really runs personnel because Andy Reid doesn't want to do it. Sean Payton's running Denver. Didn't it feel like to you, this is all Ben Johnson's stamp? So I've heard you say this, and I think that you're like, 85 to 90% correct. Ben Johnson clearly now outranks Ryan Poles. And it's not a straight, like who makes more money, but it kind of is. Ben Johnson makes considerably more money than Ryan Poles.

And obviously Ryan Poles' stock is down, and Ben Johnson's stock could not have been higher. So Ben Johnson has more say. And the Jonah Jackson move is directly tied to Ben Johnson. and that was the first move that happened. They traded a late round pick for a guard from the Rams, who had been a former pro-bowler. But before he was with the Rams, he had been with the Lions and Ben Johnson.

Obviously, the Lions have the best offensive line, them and the Eagles and the NFL. He knows how valuable it is. I think Ryan Poles has taken a little too much heat in this regard. He was Matt Ryan's offensive lineman at BC. He is a former offensive line. he was on a practice squad in the NFL as an offensive lineman. His first ever first round pick, because the first year he didn't have a first round pick

because the previous regime had traded one way to acquire Justin Fields. So his first year, his first draft, he had two second round picks and he took Kyler Gordon and Jaquan Brisker, who are both starting players in the secondary. And then the next year, when he had the ninth overall pick, he traded down one spot, passed up Jalen Carter. I disagreed with it, but he didn't think their organization was ready for the headache. And he took Darnell Wright, who looks like he's going to be the right tackle for the team for 10 years. Maybe not an all pro, but he looks damn good.

But he's going to get a second. And some of the draft people were like, should it have been Broderick Jones, the guy who went, I think, 17 to the Steelers, who wasn't able to start for a year plus and definitely is not guaranteed to be a, a 10-year starter in the NFL. And then, so I think first time he had a first-round pick, he drafted a tackle. He gave Nate Davis money. Nate Davis had a pretty good reputation. Mark Schlereth has told me that he's like, Nate Davis was one of my favorite guards in the

NFL when he was in Tennessee. Atlanta tapered off a little bit. Bears paid him. And it looks like Nate Davis got paid and stopped trying. But it's not like that guy didn't have good. good tape and it's not like people didn't like him and it's not like that wasn't a significant investment in the offensive line. Tevin Jenkins was a former second round pick as a tackle who he moved to left guard, Ryan Poles did, and he was a better guard than tackle, but then he got hurt and he

can't stay on the field. And he never invested in center, which has been a disaster. The bears literally haven't had a good center since Olin Croutts. And left tackle is Braxton Jones, who I would not say is good, but I would also not say it's bad. He's a replacement level player that Ryan Poles drafted in the fifth round out of Southern Utah. That's a draft win. What happened last year was a mediocre offensive line got hurt with a rookie quarterback and you fired your play caller and your head coach.

So you couldn't scheme around it. The offensive line was a disaster. your quarterback got hit 68 times, and it became a fire alarm. Like, this is, we are going to get Caleb Williams killed. We are like really flirting with David Carr level of sabotage here if we don't overhaul it. So that's long-winded and maybe a little bit more in the weeds than people that don't follow the bears want to know. But like, I don't think it's that Ryan Poles doesn't prioritize the offensive line.

I think it's that when he took over, he had such limited resources with draft capital. that it took a while and last year was never supposed to be a good offensive line, but it wasn't supposed to be that bad. And I think that anybody would have spent on the offensive line this offseason, but Ben Johnson kind of turbocharged it. And so he gets credit for it, but I can't, I have a hard time believing that a smart guy who came up under Brett V.2, by the way, I'll add one more detail. he was the director of college personnel in Kansas City when they lost that Super Bowl to Tampa.

And in the offseason, they signed Joe Tuny, they drafted Creed Humphrey, and they drafted Trey Humphrey Humphrey now set the market at center. Trey Smith set the market at guard. And now Joe Tuni's a bear, and he was an all pro for a couple of years in Kansas City. So he was in Kansas City when Mahomes got killed in a Super Bowl. They brought in three new offensive linemen. He's the GM in Chicago when Caleb Williams got killed. They brought in three offensive linemen, one of whom is literally the same guy they brought in in Kansas City.

So I think Ryan Poles knows about the offensive line, cares about the offensive line, prioritizes the offensive line. He just made a couple of bad mistakes, Nate Davis most principally not investing in a real center, probably right behind it. And he underestimated how little depth he had to protect Caleb Williams last year. Is there anything that, I mean, they have the Vikings back to back in London. I don't like Minnesota like everybody else. I think they're a fourth place team.

Was there anything about the schedule that jumped out to you? I think when you look at, I lump Minnesota and Chicago in the same thing. I got 30 years of history, Green Bay every year, for the most part, is 10 plus wins, right? Right. And the Lions now, I think, have established themselves. What happens in the playoffs? Who knows? But they're going to be a double-digit win team.

When you look at the Bears and you look at Minnesota, because of the divisions that they drew this year in the rotation, it's hard. And the pressure, listen, this Caleb thing, I'm sure we'll talk about it. A lot of pressure on him, a lot of pressure on the Bears, a lot of pressure on McCarthy. And the pressure is not like on DJ Moore or Justin Jefferson. It's squarely on the quarterback. And these games, like you said, you open your NFL career at Chicago. well, that's just, that's tough. And hell, you could argue the same thing on the flip side about at Caleb Williams.

Your first game with his new coach, Monday night for everyone watching. These are just intense environments on these two quarterbacks. Now, Caleb has some seasoning. Like, JJ does not in terms of ever played a regular season game. But I think those two schedules for those two guys, not every team in this division can win 10 plus games. One of these teams is going to go eight or nine or worse, right? It's going to be one of those two teams. I don't know which one.

Like, I know Kevin O'Connell can be a head coach. I love the Vikings roster. But, man, this guy's never started a regular season game. If you told me right now, he's a top 15 quarterback, I'd be like they'll win 10 or 11 games, no problem. But if you tell me it's Rocky, I don't care how you could have 10 Justin Jefferson's. If your quarterback plays overwhelmed, it's hard. I mean, we see it every year.

Good teams and their quarterback plays. Well, and the Packers drafted a first round, wide receiver. the lions are stacked offensively. The Bears have been a fortune on their offensive line. J.J. McCarthy is going to have to throw the ball 35 times. This is not a defensive division. This is not the AFC North. This is the NFC North, and it is going to be a track meet.

And so that's my question with J.J. McCarthy. I would feel differently if you were in a different division. But Detroit is stacked offensively with the best align in the league. You can say what you want about. Ben Johnson is going to be better with Caleb. Williams, the Mattiever Fluse, and Dolman and Tunney changed the offensive line. Yeah. And then, you know, Green Bay is Green Bay.

They went and got another wide receiver, which tells you, we're going to make this Jordan Love thing work. And it wasn't terrible last year. There was just some bumps. So my thing is McCarthy, who never threw the ball at Michigan, is going to be asked to throw the ball 40 times a game a lot because either they'll be trailing or they'll be in shootouts. This is going to be a shootout division. So I just don't love them with that is the marquee to the movie.

But do you feel comfortable, I mean, listen, we have a strong recent history of these young offensive coordinators hitting the ground running and being stars. Some of them get overwhelmed historically in the league. Like Ben Jossom, it is, this is not an easy first job, right? It's like solid with the Jets. A lot of people are watching. There's a ton of hype. The Caleb stuff is already, even though it's weird, right? Everything we're talking about today in this article is based on something 18 months ago.

It's not like he just said this yesterday. but still, I mean, this is something that carries with you. I think there's a ton of pressure on him, because I would say the same thing about Caleb. Like, he's just going to out duel the LaFleur's offense and the Lions group. I mean, it's going to be hard. Like, he's going to get in some shootouts. You know, he kind of freelancers. Now, he's more comfortable.

He has a history. He is used to, I've been in shootouts, I can play like that. JJ was not. I mean, JJ was on a team that, I mean, was the big Ohio State is always built like an SEC team. but Harbaugh built that thing like an SEC team with unlimited NFL players where they hand the ball off and they play defense. That's right. One of those two teams, I got to give it a little more time, but it's just not going to go as well as the hype because the expectations I would say for, I mean, for Minnesota, they have a, what do you think, a top, seven roster in the NFL, minus the quarterback. I mean, they got one of the better teams in the NFL top to bottom.

And I see the Bears have a pretty damn good roster, too. Oh, I totally think Chicago's offensive, you go line, tight-end receivers and Ben Johnson, I just don't see, you know, I mean, go look at Hackett to Sean Payton. It was a touchdown to eight points a game. And I think Iber flus to Ben Johnson is probably somewhere between a field goal and six points a game. But here's the thing, though, Colin, and this is what I get back to with the coordinator. Ben with Detroit, who just became like Kyle Shanahan or McVeigh or whoever, all he had to worry about was the place, right? Now on Monday, what happens when your backup safety got a DUI? On Tuesday, hey, this guy turns out he shattered his ankle.

Like you have all this other stuff coming. You can't just sit there and scheme plays nonstop, especially the first time head coach. And then when the game's going on, you got to manage the clock. You got a lot going on for the first time ever. It's just a tougher transition. and that's where Kevin O'Connell, to me, has a big advantage. He is used to just being the play caller slash the boss.

But there is a learning. If you told me, hey, John, you not only need to get all the content and record a podcast, we now need you to run the sales and the graphics and do some cuts you need to do. It'd be a curve for a couple months of me figuring out how to manage everything, right? So I'm always just hesitant when it comes to guys first-time head coach. It's like, think how much easier. Pete Carroll. He's sitting in that desk.

He's very comfortable in telling who, what to do when. He's just done it before. That's the only thing. And I'm not anti-Ben Johnson. I mean, what he did the last couple of years was awesome. It is just a lot harder taking on a lot more responsibility and trying to maintain your boy genius kind of narrative the way everyone talks about him.

You know, the Caleb thing is funny. So I went on Chicago radio a year ago for the draft. And I don't do a lot of local radio shows because I don't know who the people are. and you know, you can get burned. But I knew I was going to move to Chicago, so I go on the Chicago radio station. I forget which one. And I say, you know, I'm being told that it's Caleb Williams would ideally,

his dad would not want him to go to Chicago. But he's going to bite the bullet and he loves the city and he wants to, he wants to be the first great bear's quarterback. Well, I go off the air and somebody sends me something. something or a clip or something. They basically dogged my sources. Coward doesn't know anything. Well, it comes out, Seth Wickersham, basically. Today came out and said, yeah, basically his dad didn't want him to go there. He's got multiple quotes. And I'm like, well, it may have been that Seth and I had some of the same sources. He had agents. Apparently, Seth had talked to his dad.

There had been multiple agents. I didn't get it from Caleb's dad, but I did get it from people very close to Caleb. And so I think it was the same station, reached out and said, hey, you want to come back on and spike the football? And I'm like, yeah, I'm going to pass on that. You know, I'm not bitter, but it's like, you know, if I give you that, if I give you the time, don't question my sources. You don't have to like my opinion, but, you know, I wouldn't go on and make stuff up.

So, and the truth was, and I was, didn't Caleb kind of come out or like some of his people right away after you said that and say it's kind of bad. Right, right. Yeah. Well, they said, we're good, we're good. Of course they did. And I, and, you know, like I knew the game. That's why I didn't react to that.

I knew what was going on. I knew what I'd been told. I knew it was the truth. Somebody who'd been good, never burned me. It was fourth or fifth time I'd gotten good information from somebody. But the point was, I didn't blame him. I said, yeah, if my son was a quarterback, I wouldn't want him to play for the bears. They've never had a 4,000-yard passer.

That's literally impossible. that's like driving a car for your entire life and never having like a parking ticket or a speeding ticket. It's just going to happen. It's inevitable, right? And so when the story came out today, my take is it just doesn't bother me. Like they looked into, you know, what could they do legally? And they said, yeah, the only way around it is just to do an L way and go public. And let's just let's just not do it. But it doesn't bother me. We've got an Eli situation. We've got an Lway. And I think the bears are historically unique. They've just never done that position right. Does it bother you now that Seth Wickersham comes out and says,

yeah, they thought about making the stink. No, I mean, ultimately, I don't really give a shit, but I would say this. I don't think it helps Caleb. And I always take the stance of like I never blame, you know, wives, parents, their relationship with a player is so much different. than everyone else, right? So they are so much closer to the son emotionally.

It doesn't bother me. I know people with Oklahoma, I was hearing a long time ago that his dad's a lot. That's part of college sports. You deal a lot with the parents. In the pros, nobody wants to hear from mom or dad. Not a soul. We're paying Caleb $40 million guaranteed. Let's throw 30 touchdowns.

And I think his comments sometimes, like, you know, he's trying to be a supportive dad. No one has any issue with that. Jaden Daniel's mom forces all the flusies to stay away from her son. Well, guess what? Her son's playing really well in football. She doesn't talk anything about his professional life. It's all his personal stuff.

This guy comes out and makes comments about the CBA is unconstitutional, the rookie wage scale. Well, why do they create a rookie wage scale? Because guys like Jammercus Russell were scamming the league where the veterans weren't getting the money. So Caleb, you know, if that rookie wage scale hadn't been, So when you make comments like that, people kind of look side-eyed. Listen, and the other thing that really comes through is Ryan Poles is quoted in there. Like, we're taking you, buddy. So get ready.

Like this, you talk about this a lot. Player empowerment, the NFL doesn't really roll like that. I would say this if you're Ryan Poles. Like, you know, Adam Peters, do you think Adam Peters right now would trade Jaden Daniels for Caleb Williams in the situation? And here's the other thing. A lot of Caleb's, Caleb wasn't making these comments about the CBA or going to the UFL is coming from his dad. But all these comments get aggregated. And a lot of the players in the league see this, and they're like, who does this kid think he is?

And I just think it adds pressure. And again, this is, I would be more worked up if these comments came last week or two weeks ago. This was last January, February, before he got into the NFL. But I'm sorry, it just does not help his situation. It adds pressure. It just has a lot of craziness to this situation. New coach, and they get to start fresh. But I just think that, like, we just need to.

calm down and just win some games and throw some touchdowns before you start. Remember last year the equity talk, we want in on the franchise, you're going to go to the UFL and sit out of year. You're like, give me a break. And again, this is his dad, not, it's Caleb's not saying I'm going to the UFL. And at the end of the day, all these comments didn't come true. He just allowed, he went to the bears. And what they were not wrong about the coaching staff.

I mean, that was a disaster, which we all knew coming in. But I think sometimes with a very aggressive parent like this, and I haven't seen a quote from Caleb's dad since he got in the league, you got to be careful about saying some of this stuff because your son has to cash those checks on the field. So I just think if you're the bears, you're like, oh my God, when you see this come out. Because again, didn't he write a book on a bunch of quarterbacks?

And this is the thing that gets cut. And this is, you know, the headlines going viral, getting just sent around. I'm telling you, Adam Peters goes to bed, like, God, my cornerbacks, just no issues, no problems. And it's just sometimes it's your family, but man, this is, you just don't want to deal with any of this, especially when you're not making plays. I mean, it did not go well. Yeah, I think he's set up for success now. I mean, we were talking about it in the show today. Tua and Jared Goff had bad first years and bad relationships with coaches, or at least coaches that didn't get them.

I do think there's more good offensive coaching than ever before in the league. And your second or third team, Gino Smith, Sam Darnold, Baker-Mayfield. You know, Baker got Liam Cohen and McVeigh after Freddie Kitchens. Like, it does sometimes take a while. It used to be if your first place didn't work, there just weren't that many great offensive coaches in the league and they weren't leaving places where they were located. Now, guys, it's a much more mobile society. There's good offensive coaches.

If you have one or two good years at a place, you're a head coach. if you're an offensive coach. So you can actually have a hiccup in your first stop and maybe your second and maybe get a third shot. So I think that bodes well for Caleb. Like a Jared Goff, I didn't think he stood a chance last year. I think it's much more set up to succeed. Nothing says summer like long days, clutch plays, and firing off a few bets, all with Draft King's Sportsbook. As the season heats up, so do the bets.

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So I want to end with this. So you would, and I would admit this too, I've moved around the country. that generally when I move around the country, the only sports team that I tend to, it's hard because I love football so much, when I lived in Tampa, I was kind of a Bucks fan. I grew up in the northwest. I was a Seahawk fan. I live in Los Angeles. I'm a Ram and Charger fan. I try not to be a homer on the air, but it's, I know people in the front office. I have contacts there. Now I move to Chicago. I've already got connections with the Bears, right? So I'm talking to people. And so, and you grew up here. So I under, I've always understood that. Bill Simmons loves the Celtics. You're going to

to love your teams. I get it, right? Like, like in the audience understands them. They're still objective. But I, but I said this, this week on the show, on FS1, I said, I'm going to take five quarterbacks that we, that we would, we're not going to, I'm not going to take a Justin Herbert overrated, Jalen Hertz, underrated, I'm not going to take guys on the fringe. I'm going to take Andrew Luck, Jaden Daniels, Joe Burrow, who else did I take, C.J. Stroud. I took somebody else. I took five of them. And I said, and I said, I didn't take Mahomes. I took Lamar Jackson.

So I said, let's get Mahomes Allen out. Okay, they're like historically great. Like, so I took five guys that none of us are going to argue, they're all great. How long, once they had a competent coach, did it take for you to go, oh, shit, that's a franchise guy. So C.J. Stroud did not throw an interception until week six. Pretty obvious he was different. Lamar Jackson won six of his first seven. and by the second game, you were wondering if he was even faster than Michael Vick.

He was electric. Joe Burrow, Weeks 2 and 3, is throwing for 350 yards behind an absolutely atrocious offensive line with a coach nobody like. Jayden Daniels, weeks 2, 3 and 4, he's completing like 28 of 31. You're like, okay, this is a cheat code. What is going on? And so I went down and threw all of them. So now I bring you to Caleb Williams. Yeah.

So, again, golf with Jeff Fisher, golf with McVeigh. By week two, he's throwing for 350 yards. You're like, oh, Jared Goff can play. Yeah, like, he's beating Mahomes in a shootout on Monday night football. You're like, you know, pretty early in his career, you're like, oh, yeah, this dude can play. So first week. So my take is good, not great is hard to spot. real deal and sucks jumps off the page.

So, week one, Caleb Williams faces Brian Flores at home, perfect weather. Let's say he struggles. Brian Flores has been punitive to young quarterbacks. And Caleb Williams has banned. What is your take? I won't be handling it well, Colin. I'll tell you that.

I won't be handling it well. He needs to be very good right away. And here's the thing. Obviously, I watched every down of the Bears last year and have for my entire life. He is good. He's good. Now, it was not easy. It was not always pretty.

But I trust my eye test here. If you get sacked 68 times and still have better than a 3 to 1 touchdown the interception ratio, and your play caller got fired nine games in to your season, and then you fire your coach, and you had controversy, and you lost on a Hail Mary, and you had all of that hype and that scrutiny, and the guy who was drafted behind you is having a historic rookie year and goes all the way to the NFC championship game, and you get your ass kicked and you play all 17 games and like you're still standing at the end of it, you don't suck. Like, bad, you said like good, bad.

It's a little bit. He's not bad. He's not bad. I'm not worried about bad. It's, I still think the guy's ceiling can be MVP of the league. Like, I still think greatness is very likely an outcome here.

But, yeah, week one. Minnesota Monday night football week two. Ben Johnson against his old team. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I will say this. I will say this.

It seems like 40% of the years in the last decade, the Bears have opened with the Packers. I know that's not actually accurate, but it feels that way. That's the absolute worst. Any Bears fan will tell you, Bears Packers,

it's just as like a different thing. All of our families have some Packers people in it. For me, it was extreme. My dad's entire family was from Wisconsin. You just, you're in weddings with these people. You work with these people. Your neighbors with these people.

Like, my old radio station signal, like, reaches far into Wisconsin. Like, you can hear it in Milwaukee. So, like, it's just like, it, Bears Packers, week one is too stressful. There's too many grand. I can handle Bears Vikings week one. I can handle Bears Lions week one. Bears, Packers, if Caleb Williams would come out week one, week one and get outplayed by Jordan Love and they would lose and he'd throw like two picks.

That's just like skies falling type stuff. So I think I can handle Bears Vikings on Monday Night Football Week 1, but if he's terrible, I'm not going to be handling it well. It's going to be tough to be neutral. I'll be totally honest with you. That's going to be unfortunate. But if he's great, oh, deep dish pizza on TV for everybody. No, I saw that first game and I went, oh, God, Flores.

What a nightmare. Flores. Yeah, it's not a great spot. But, but again, like, but it can go the other way. Put up 30. Put up 30. We never mentioned Shane Waldron's name in Chicago ever again. You know what I mean?

Like, wasted rookie year. Why did you hire, why did you blow it all up and start fresh with Kay? Like, put up 30 week one and all of your. are forgiven and we're good. Yeah, you know, the other thing, Danny, that wasn't true years ago, there are so many good young offensive coaches now in the NFL. Yeah. But it used to be if your first coach didn't work, you were screwed.

But like Gino, Darnold, Baker, Tua had Brian Flores, then he was a pro boulder. Goff's first year was not only unremarkable, it was unrecognizable. So the truth is now, there are multiple examples. Sam Darnold's a totally different player. It used to be there were like four or five offensive guys that were next level. Like every other staff has the next Ben Johnson or an offensive coach. So, I mean, God, look at, I mean, you go to the AFC alone. It's like, oh, there's Andy Reid, and oh, there's Sean Peyton, and there's Jim Harbault.

And Chip Kelly. In the same division, you have those four coaches on staff. So I think we've gotten to a point where if you have a Mulligan season, it just, I mean, nobody remembers golf's first season. He was 0 and 7, I think. Yeah, listen. In Jacksonville, Trevor Lawrence showed enough through multiple failed coaches that they still gave them a quarter of a billion dollar contract.

They hit on Brian Thomas last year. They draft Travis Hunter this year. They hire Liam Cohen to be their coach, who was a big part of Baker Mayfield's success in Tampa being as consistently great on offense as they've been. Like, he's in year five. Like, does Trevor Lawrence? enrage me and way too many fumbles and red zone

interception, no doubt. I think that, like, selling stock on Trevor Lawrence has been totally reasonable, but, like, his career's not over. Right. You know, it's, his career is not over. Like, if Liam Cohn

could do that with Baker, it's definitely on the board that Trevor Lawrence turns this thing around and rips off five, six, seven really good years and changes the complete narrative of his career. But no, listen, I think it's still much more likely than

not that Caleb Williams is great than he is mediocre. Danny Parkins, FS1, love him on the volume, stops by about once, twice a month, as always. This was great. Thanks, buddy. Yeah, this was fun. Thanks, Colin. Anytime. People generally speaking, fear what they don't understand. You know, maybe you don't, but I think a huge percentage of people fear, fear what they don't understand. and it's complicated and you don't know where it's going to go. It clearly is the type of thing, though, that is like a tool, right? It's going to make some things worse and a lot of things better. Your small business owner example is a great one.

It's going to help that guy's business. How about this? The Internet. It has killed retail, but it took 25 years. like it killed malls, but it didn't do it in two years. And the people that were invested in malls that paid attention 15 years ago were getting out of malls. Right? Like, so they got out of the business.

You're going to have a heads up on stuff. Nothing happens overnight. Even if it kills consultants, it will be over a decade that it will kill consultants because not everybody's going to use AI, just like it took our grandpa and our dad's years to figure out the internet. So things just, everything needs to bake. You know, give you an example of this in sports. So when the college football playoff was announced for 12 teams, eventually 14, 16, it cut right down the middle.

There were the people like myself that are like, oh, this is awesome. December's going to be awesome. These bowl games are so dried up. Like, we got 45 bowl games I watched four. I thought it was obvious. Like, December now is going to be even better, and December's great with NFL playoffs. And we saw that to be true. But there was another group, including a lot of the media, that said, oh, it's going to kill rivalries.

And my take is when Texas played Georgia last year was the highest rated game, right? I think before the national championship, that's not a rivalry. People watch good. When Texas plays Ohio State on Fox over the Labor Day weekend, people watch good. And they'll watch it a second time. You watched Oregon, Ohio State the first time. Sure. It was a terrible game, but you'll watch it the second time.

my take is it doesn't matter. We watch NFL football. Teams can play three times in the season. I remember years the Steelers and Ravens played three times. I watched all of them. So that's like to me, I was shocked by the number of people that were college football fans, like diehards or media that were like,

this is bad, it will kill urgency. Well, what it actually did is it allows teams now, like Ohio State and Texas to play opening week. And whoever loses is fun. There'll be more big games in December and more big games in September. Do you think it makes the week one game less big, though? I watch great. I know you do.

You are a super fan of college football. Michigan, Ohio State, last year, the loser of the game wins the national championship. And on some level, not to a Michigan fan and not to an Ohio State fan, but to a guy who went to Syracuse, it did take away. And I watched it, and I will still watch it. It did take away a little bit of the first Michigan, Ohio State game. Because it objectively matters less. But it didn't take it away in the moment. As Michigan was shocking them as a 20-point dog, it didn't hurt then.

In retrospect, you look back and go, well, it doesn't feel as big. Well, that's like saying a year after you got a Christmas present. I don't feel the same today as I did a year ago when I got the Christmas present. No, I know, but I guess you take the lesson and you go forward with it and you say there's good. There is some like the NFL has expanded the playoffs, right? Easier to get in. We love the playoffs. It's more football.

Week 17 was terrible because most of the teams were like sitting, we're, sitting guys and teams have been eliminated. And it's like, oh, well, what's the difference between being the five seed and the sixth seed? Like, we're in. It doesn't matter. We're going to still, we're going to sit guys. We're going to play guys for a quarter. So I think there is a tradeoff that comes with more games and all that. And with college football, listen, I understood, I always was like, more games I am going to watch. And more big games. More big games. I am going to watch. but I had a hard time with the college football argument for the expansion of the playoffs was like how many times in the BCS era even did you feel like the fifth best team in the

country deserved a shot at being the national champion? I didn't think that it existed. And so if your argument is, well, expands the tournament, get them in, and then any given Sunday they can, or any given Saturday it, they can win it. That's fine. But then it does take away a little bit of the regular season to me. And again, I will watch, but I get, my guess is as they keep expanding this playoff, people will come away with it all, it'll blend together.

And the week six game is not going to feel as big. But in mid-October, double the number of teams to triple are still in. the hunt for a 14-game playoff or a 12-game playoff where it used to be, if you lost a game in September, you lost another one you were done. And so the last six weeks

of the season, you're out and going to talk now, like Ohio State loses to Oregon, then they lose to Michigan. You're like, shit. Oh, my God. Ryan Day is going to get fired if they lose to Tennessee. So the story went from winning to

Ryan Day's getting blown. Oh, they just blew out Tennessee. Well, he better beat Oregon. Oh, they blew him out. Well, they better beat. So the story changed from just the game to, are they going to blow up Ryan Day's career? So to me, it pivoted from, okay, Ohio State's still going to get in. Remember the story before the Tennessee game? Ryan Day can't lose re-spired. So there was a different drama. It wasn't, and nobody thought Ohio State, most people, even in Columbus, didn't think they were going to win a Natty after losing to Michigan. People were like, no. And they were like going overboard.

They were. It was insane. And now you're going to get games. Like Arizona State's going to, you know, they made it. And it was a nice story. And then the spread in the game was like 20 points. Right. For a college football playoff game.

It doesn't, it doesn't, that part of it is going to feel a little weird to me. Because can they win? in, yes. But was there any part of you that thought that Arizona State could have gone on a run and won the national championship? No. No. No.

But zero part of you. So it felt a little bit like a waste of time. Okay. But I think there's only five teams that can win the Super Bowl next year going into the season. Yeah, but that's just not true. That's just not true. Well, Kansas City, Buffalo, Baltimore, or just got better players, better coaches. Yeah.

I think we both think Denver and the Chargers are interesting, but Bo Nix hoisting a trophy seems rare. We know Philadelphia is really, really good, and McVeigh and the Rams will be there. And then there'll be a couple of really interesting teams. I don't think Brock Purdy now with an older team and a shaky old line works. But I've been arguing this for years. There's way less parity in the NFL than everybody thinks. And the reason I know that, because for the second year in a row, I can pick the division winners easily in the AFC.

And it's getting to the point, picking division winners in the NFL 6 of 8 is not that difficult. Okay, but do you think Washington could have won the Super Bowl last year? No, no, no. There's always a shocking team. I had picked the Rams

the year before as the shocking team. I picked, by the way, last year, Washington and Denver to be the shocking teams. How did I do that? Well, because I think they were so poorly run with Dan Snyder that all the new guys, easy division wins against Dallas and the Giants. So I actually pick Washington and Denver to be much better. Like this year, I think it's obvious. New England and Tennessee

are going to double their win total. So even the surprises are pretty pretty pretty. I've done four years in a row where I've picked the double your win team. It's going to be New England this year. And, um, Chicago. Tennessee. Tennessee. So let's go to Chicago. I, I don't, I find the division very weird. Oh, listen, I mean, we could go, we can do the, listen, we'll do a lot of bears at some point before the year. Here's the thing. Big advantage to the bears. Yeah, they got a lot better.

J.J. McCarthy, you're going to see it very quickly, is not what people think. And the Lions lost both coordinators. So whereas we look at the AFC West and go, God, that's a good division. We say that about the NFC North. We don't know about Jordan Love. We really don't. J.J. McCarthy is a C quarterback. You ever seen J.J. McCarthy's fourth quarter college stats

and playing from behind fourth quarter stats in college? With Michigan and Harbaugh on that O line, they're terrible. Detroit's pulling back because they're O line in the middle is a mess, and they lost both coordinators. That is a real bonus. That division we think is really well, it's well coached. I think the Bears have an opportunity to win 10 or 11 games. I don't think it's as good a division as people think. Well, then they would be a double your win team if they can get to double digits.

I mean, I think that having the level of coaching in that division is just very, very, very high. And so I think that that makes the worst team in that division. Like, let's say you're right about J.J. McCarthy. he still is Kevin O'Connell, Jordan Addison, and Justin Jefferson. They got Kirk Cousins to be near 5,000 yards. They got Sam Darnold $100 million. Like, J.J. McCarthy doesn't need to be awesome in order for that offense to be pretty good. And let's say Minnesota is the worst team of the division this year.

They won 14 games last year. It's a pretty good worst team if that's what they are. or if the Bears are the worst team in the division. That's a pretty tough, worst team. So, like, even if they're not top-heavy dominant, I don't see there being any team in that division that's just, like, straight up bad. There's no Cleveland Browns in that division.

You know, there's no, there's no jets, there's no giants, there's no push over there. So I think that's what's going to make it tough, is they each just have to play each other six times, and the team that does the best in that division might go four and two. You know, they might just beat each other up this year. Volume. Hey guys, it's us

and the Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. Nice.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it out. We get to ask other people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform?

We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. If you're watching the latest season of the Real Housewives of Atlanta, you already know there's a lot to break down. Gorsha accusing Kelly of sleeping with a merry man. They holding Kay Michelle back from fighting Drew. Pinky has financial issues.

On the podcast, Reality with the King, I, Carlos King, recap the biggest moments from your favorite reality shows, including the Real House Wise franchise. The drama, the alliances, and the T, everybody's talking about. To hear this and more, listen to Reality with the King on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The story I've told myself can then shape my behavior, and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility of connection. This Mental Health Awareness Month, tune into the podcast deeply well with Debbie Brown if you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole. This podcast is for you. To hear more. Listen to deeply well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

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