The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Colin Cowherd Podcast - Blue Blood Final 4, Coach K's Final Run, Gonzaga Flaws, Coach Cal Disappointment with Aaron Torres

Episode Date: March 28, 2022

First (3:00), Colin explains why an expanded college football playoff would never produce a St. Peters-like Cinderella story, what's behind the across-the-board sports ratings increases, why fans and media are overreacting to the Chiefs moving on from Tyreek Hill, and his biggest pet peave with American soccer fans.Then, College Hoop Insider - and host of The Aaron Torres Sports Podcast - Aaron Torres joins Colin to discuss why this year's tournament has been such a huge success (19:00), why Duke is so dangerous right now (22:00), why Kansas' run was unexpected despite their 1-seed (24:00), how Villanova is still underrated (27:00), why there was so much pushback on the Hubert Davis to UNC hire (32:00), why Gonzaga can't win it all (37:00), how many more disappointing seasons Coach Cal can survive at Kentucky (40:00), why Kentucky is like the Dallas Cowboys (47:00), why it's so hard to fix bad college officiating (51:00). Finally, Aaron gives his Final 4 picks (53:00).Make sure to Subscribe and follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates and check out FanDuel for the best wagering and daily fantasy action! Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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to the Monday morning podcast. Aaron Torres is, you know, in my opinion, as good as anybody covering college basketball today, he's got the Aaron Torres podcast. He bets the sport, he knows the sport, he's connected to the sport, and we've got Blue Bloods. We got Duke and Carolina and Kansas and Villanova,

and that leads me into my opening thoughts. Whenever you watch March Badness, invariably, social media is flooded with this opinion. See? See how great this is? Why can't you do this in college football? A 24-team playoff.

Because you don't want Alabama playing the 24th best team in the country. Now, I know what you're saying. Look at St. Peters. Yet, what about them? They got crushed by Carolina. You do realize basketball and football are completely different. Let's examine two.

So in college football, you have to stay in the sport minimum three years. Even at Alabama, many of their starters red shirt and are in four years. Many schools like Iowa, good schools, Wisconsin, that have fewer five-star prospects and four-star prospects, their players stand for five years. So schools that are not traditional powers, when they face the traditional powers, there is no age advantage. If there is, it's slight. Yes, Bama, Georgia have some guys leave after three years go straight to the NFL, right? But in college basketball, it's completely different. For these teams like St. Peters, they don't get four and five-star prospects.

All their players stay in school until their eligibility is finished. so you can get junior and senior dominated teams all throughout college basketball. What's that mean? 22, 23-year-old teams, great chemistry, same coach, same players, multiple years. The powers in college basketball, unlike college football, their best players are won and doneers. They're 18, 19 years old. They're just forming chemistry. So it's very possible.

oftentimes you're surprised when there aren't multiple upsets on the first week of college basketball's March Madness because you get veteran-laden teams perhaps not with NBA players but 23-year-olds playing 18- and 19-year-olds. That's when a St. Peters can beat in Kentucky. Kentucky losing early isn't shocking. And they're considered the ultimate blue blood along with Carolina and Duke. There is a age and chemistry advantage for, the little guys in college basketball. If you took that out, you'd have virtually no upsets in college basketball. And even then, the last five champs, I believe, have been number one seeds.

But in college football, you see when Cincinnati plays Alabama. I mean, forget the little guy. The SEC struggles to compete with the SEC. You just simply have an age advantage for the little guy college basketball that you don't have for the little guy in college football. I've said, if you want to do a 12-team college football playoff, then give your Alabama's and Georgia's, your Oklahoma's and Ohio states, a buy in the first round. I don't need to see Bama or Ohio State take on the 12th best team in the country in their home stadium. Now, you can say to yourself, well, that's such an advantage for the big dog, Clemson, Ohio State, Georgia. They get a buy. Bys are overrated in football.

Ask the Packers and the Tennessee Titans. Two number one seeds played at home off a buy, both lost. In football, it's often better to play often, not rest, when you're good and when you're hot. So again, college basketball is its own sport with its own sensibility. What works for it doesn't work for football. You may have also noticed, perhaps not. I follow this stuff, although not, as religiously as some, the ratings for the first round of the tournament were up 13 percent,

highest first round viewership since 2017. I know what you're saying. People are tired of the NBA. No, not really. The NBA ratings are up too. Folks, there is a direct correlation to the ratings increase this year in the NFL, the NBA, college basketball, and many college football games. although the playoff because we're getting fatigued with the same SEC teams, the ratings in sports are going up. Why?

Legalize gambling is it rolling out state by state. Gambling doesn't necessarily mean people will watch the games. What it does mean, absolutely, they'll watch them longer. So historically, people watch an hour to an hour and a half of a sporting event. If it's a blowout, it's shorter. But with gambling, you've got the sport. the over, you've got the under, you'll stick around longer. And remember, when it comes to ratings, there are about two things. Total size of audience, that's called QM and time spent listening, TSL.

So the reality is, the audience isn't always significantly bigger, but people are watching longer because of legalized sports gambling. That's why networks and sports leagues are investing in those companies. Third thought, NFL free agency isn't done. I am very interested to see where New York Giants Corner James Bradbury lands. He's good and the chiefs are leading on him. Well, well, well. So Kansas City, which has 12 draft picks and a lot of cap space, loses Tyreek Hill, and what do you know they're adding really nice players? We always overreact to this stuff. About 33% of free agents hit are highly productive. That means almost 70% are not.

Listen, Tyreek Hill is great, but he's going to go from Andy Reed and Patrick Mahomes to rookie head coach Mike McDaniel and Tua. Call me Zaney. I see a drop-off in production. The Chiefs went out and got Ju-Jew Smith Schuster. He was a good slop receiver. with an old bad quarterback and a terrible old line.

What's he going to be in Kansas City? The reality is, and we know this to be true, if just a bunch of great actors made great movies, then you just, as a studio, hire five or six A-list actors, regardless of the plot and put them on screen. But we know that some of the biggest busts in Hollywood history, the biggest flops, have been when you throw multiple A-list actors together.

You know that fit matters because college preparatory counseling has become a huge business in the last two decades. What a good counselor will tell you, even if you have the perfect student, great grades and ACT scores, that doesn't mean they fit at Harvard and Yale. It's all about the fit. So much of that is true in Hollywood,

where you go to college, and free agency. Listen, you know this and I know this. You can look around the NBA. LeBron is the rare player that works everywhere. NBA is a great example. Chris Paul works everywhere. But we've seen time and time again.

Some guys just don't connect. Kyrie Irving, James Hardin, both are too ball dominant. The reality with Tyreek Hill, Kansas City has good chemistry, a great play designer, and a world-class quarterback. Juju Smith-Schuster's numbers should increase. By the way, so should Marquis Valdez Scantling's number. Why? Because Aaron Rogers generally doesn't trust anybody but his favorite wide receiver

or favorite tied end in big spots. Patrick Mahomes much more willing. to distribute to multiple wide receivers. Take a deep breath. Kansas City is fine. Andy Reed's history tells you, in Philadelphia and Kansas City, it's not just about stars. Chemistry, he makes it work with great play designs. That's what free agency's always been about.

By the way, I'm in a particularly good mood because the United States men's national team, although they haven't qualified yet, it would take an utter disaster at Costa Rica to not make the World Cup starting November 18th in Dubai. Listen, the dominating win over Panama highlighted what has been the case in the last several years. Christian Pulisic is head and shoulders above every other American player.

He's either setting up the goals or scoring them. Greg Burhalter is the latest coach to get pushback. He's a different coach who has been willing to play what we call MLS lifers, but he knows soccer better than you. He really does. And one of the things that bothers me is the precious nature of American soccer fans. Anytime they lose, it's the coach's fault. Anytime they win, it's because of our spectacular talent. We do not have top five, perhaps top ten talent in the world.

We're probably somewhere in the United States between 12 and 20. In fact, Canada, which shut us out to nothing, has played better together in terms of chemistry in the last year or two, much better than Team USA. The last time they collided, Canada won convincingly. It's okay. We're going to qualify. Cross your fingers. Let's stop blaming the coach for every loss and believing our players are significantly better than they are. We have very good players. It's the youngest, most talented squad I've ever seen, and I've been following it since Kyle Rote Jr. Look him up. It's kind of embarrassing. I'm showing my age. But we do not have a top 10 squad. Win a couple of games at the World Cup. Give the country some momentum. You'd have to be satisfied with that. Fandual Sportsbook NBA, same game parlay. What is it?

Gives you a chance to change. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds.

I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care which I'll say it. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions,

my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that

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Listen to what's your problem on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Well, I think he does as good a job as anybody in the country in college basketball, Aaron Torres. I met him a few years ago. He came on my set when people were allowed to come on my set pre-COVID. Fox Sports Radio, host of the Aaron Torres podcast. He really knows his stuff. Author of One in Fun, the book about the 2010 Kentucky Wildcats.

Listen, this is now a cliche, but it's been a really great tournament. We've had Aaron, like the St. Peter's story is obviously great. Miami shocked me. I don't really get them. I, you know, I'm five minutes from UCLA. I watched them all year long and I'm like, they're just, I don't know what I get. Then I watch them in the tournament. Then the minute I fall in love with them, they get whacked by Carolina.

So, I mean, my takeaway is we ended up with a lot of blue bloods. I like that. But it's interesting. I don't feel we have a great team. I think we have four good teams. I think Duke feels like to me the most talented. But you do this, you love this, you watch all of these. You're encyclopedic.

did this tournament have more upsets? Did it feel different? Or is it just the fact that it's been good TV, good announcers, good times mostly, right outside of a couple late games, it just feels this year has been special? Well, Colin, I mean, I think the biggest thing with this tournament, we got to remember, this is the first time in three years that we've had a normal tournament. And, you know, as the Carolina game goes final, we realize we're getting this final four. basically of a television, you know, executives dream, right, as much as there can be.

I went back and you think about it, 2020, the NCAA tournament's really the only major sporting event that really ended up being canceled. We figured out a way to play the NBA in a bubble, major league baseball in a bubble, the NFL with limited fans. Then last year, the 2021 tournament is planned in the middle of the pandemic. And so it was the, it was really the last major sporting event that felt like a COVID sporting event. Two weeks later, starting the NBA playoffs. We have full, full arenas. I mean, I remember turning into that first Knicks game against the Hawks, Madison Square Garden's rocking. And so I think it's a lot of things. I think that the early rounds were awesome. They were fun. You know, you have the storylines that

always carry the tournament. You have the familiar faces in Coach K. J. Wright, Bill Self later. And then I just think fans in the stands, normal time schedule, like you said, if you remember last year we were playing games on like Monday, Tuesday nights, it's just good to have it, feeling a little bit normal again after three full years. 2019 was the last time we had one of these normal ones. And even though we have blue bloods, let's talk about this. So I try to. I watch more Duke and Gonzaga than anybody else because I know Mark Few.

I went to college up there. So I probably watch a half dozen games a year. I always watch Duke when they're on and they're on constantly. But let's let's talk about that. So let's start with Duke. I think they're the most talented team. You know, they got a five-star point guard who is not as good as everybody thinks. And yet I watch them in the tournament.

And I'm like, oh, total gamer. It feels like he's busting out and becoming like a star. But when I watch them play, my eyes tell me that, and this is, I think, endemic of college basketball. They're figuring out how to play together finally. But they feel like the most gifted team athletically, are they? Oh, there's zero doubt. And it's crazy because, you know, they just, I don't really ever remember anything quite like it where they have a couple really nice wins early in the year. You mentioned being a Gonzaga guy and knowing that program.

Well, they played in Vegas on Black Friday. I was there. Duke won. And you came out of that game saying Duke's the best team in the country because Gonzaga had just destroyed UCLA a few nights before. So that's all the way back in November. Then we have two and a half months where they basically hit cruise control in the ACC. and that was kind of the crazy thing about it to me coming into this tournament was I sat there and said, listen, by the way, I am not the guy that picked Duke, so I'm not trying to take credit and pat myself on the back. But it was also kind of crazy to think about most talented team, legendary coach in a tournament where everybody has stuff to play for.

They have the most to play for, you know, sending out Coach K in style. Yeah. And so I think not only have they figured it out, Colin, but what I notice is, and I'm sure you've noticed it too, they're figuring it out throughout. the tournament, right? Like the Arkansas game felt easier than the Texas Tech game. The Texas Tech game felt easier than the Michigan State game. And so what does that mean for next weekend in New Orleans? I don't know, but they are the most talented team. That's why I thought they would give Arkansas trouble. Arkansas, what they're great at doing is taking away what you do best. But you've got five NBA players on the floor, you can do just about anything you want in any given

time. And we saw that in the Saturday games. And I think you're spot on it. They're by far the most talented team. We'll see if they get these two final wins. But as you said, very much figuring it out here as we go along in this tournament. So I watched Kansas twice this year. One of the times I watched them was against Kentucky. And they just, it just wasn't a good. I think it was a Saturday game. And it was, it was bad in the second half. And I thought they just, they can't, they don't have enough offensive power power. Kentucky kind of, I don't remember the final score. I think I turned it off at one point. But Kentucky was kind of, kind of, rolling, if I recall. Was it a 20-point game? Well, I know because I looked this up after Kentucky

lost to St. Peter's in the opening round. Yes, it was an 18-point Kentucky win. And Kansas, not to bore people with too much here, but it's kind of what you said about Duke. And it's crazy to think about Hall of Fame coaches, veteran players, but they brought in a few guys through the transfer portal. And I know it's been a topic that you've discussed at length, how the transfer portal is changing college sports. And I think they thought they were going to be Instant impact guys right away. There's a guard named Remy Martin who came from Arizona State, all-pack 12 guy. He has injuries. You know, Bill Self kind of sort of publicly says that he's not really bought into the way we do things. And then all of a sudden, the last three weeks,

all of a sudden, he's 15, 20 points off the bench and he's that guy. And so the team that you saw in January was the team that I saw in January and February and March thinking, okay, I get why they've earned a number one seed. I don't see them making this run. And it just kind of speaks to exactly what you just said of the idea that teams get better throughout the year. And I just think this is now the world that we're going to continue to live in as teams get younger. Now the transfer portal is a bigger deal. And Kansas all of a sudden, I'm not kidding when I say it was really like the last four or five games that they started playing at the level that they're playing at now. Yeah, no, this is something I've talked about, the transactional nature of college basketball.

I was joking with a friend. I'm like, I don't know how people bet this sport because in the end. NBA, I kind of know what I get. Even though the Celtics have played really well, I know kind of the player I get with Tatum, the player I get with Jalen Brown, and Marcus Smart. I know their strengths. I know their weaknesses. I've seen them play together.

Like, I kind of know what I get. You could be a casual NBA fan and go, yeah, I've seen Steph Clay and Draymond. You know, they've added Andrew Wiggins, draft Jordan Poole, he's grown, but I kind of know what I get. In college, November to March is a 19-year-old. often the best players. And so it's funny. So I watched Villanova this year.

I thought Houston would beat him. I love. I thought Houston would beat him. I thought it would be ugly, low scoring. Gillespie didn't play well. And as I watched Villanova, I've come to this conclusion. This happens with comedians. There's a hot comedian.

You're like the funniest guy on the planet for five years. Then you get rich and you're not as funny. Right. Jim Carrey can be Ben Stiller. Mike Myers, right now, last six years, Jay Wright's the best coach. That's the best program in the country. Defend at all levels. Tell me how wrong I am.

No, and it's funny, you know, on my Fox Sports Radio show on Saturday, I asked my co-host this, and I'd be curious, I know you've known Jay Wright a long time. I think he's weirdly become under, like, he just third final four since 2016, okay? You know, Kentucky's a lightning rod. They haven't been there since 2015. Duke before this year hadn't been there since 2015. And Villanova wins, and they do it yesterday, and a guy gets hurt, and they close out the game. And it's just like, oh, Villanova's going to the Final Four.

Another Final Four for Jay Wright. And it just feels like to me, and, you know, I think it's some of the way. I think, first of all, part of it is I don't think Jay Wright's very controversial. I know you know him. I've interviewed him a few times. He's the nicest guy in the world that I've ever dealt with, you know, one of the nicest, but, you know, he's a great guy. to get along with, not controversial, doesn't yell at the media, doesn't yell at

reps. And, you know, they, I don't know, I don't know, but that was my takeaway on Saturday night was, oh, Villanova's going to another Final Four. Okay, on to the next game as if it's not a huge deal and if it's not a major accomplishment. And so I'm with you is that's been one of my big takeaways from this tournament is I think we're now at the point where we're just starting to take this program for granted. The other thing about them, too, that I love, you know, we talk about the one and done and transfers and this and that.

They do a great job in recruiting of evaluating the right guys, of bringing in guys that are going to buy in to what they do. You talk about transactional. I mean, I looked it up today. I think they have two fifth year seniors, a fourth year, June, or something like that. And the point is they buy in. They're not in a rush. They trust the process.

They trust the Hall of Fame coach. And like I said, I think however many Biggie's championships now with third final four since 2016, I do think they're like weird. underrated. I truly believe that. You know what it is, Aaron, and I really believe this. Because their first national title was so shocking, their DNA, even as the best program in the last six, seven years, their DNA is underdog DNA. They view themselves, even as an eight-point favorite, as this hard scrabble.

I mean, Gillespie's dad's a cop, no scholarship offers. And look at him. I think he was a co-conference player of the year. Right. So, and the other kid, the other kid in the back court ripped up his ACL like his sophomore year, Wake Forest offered Villanova. So even they have the advantage, even when they're favored, they see themselves as the underdog when they play all these blue bloods. And that's a, you know what, man, that that's an easy, that's an incredible advantage that they don't get high on themselves. Like I never go into a game and think they didn't show up. Now, there are games that don't shoot well, but the intensity is literally, you could take it game to game for 39 games. I'll tell you a funny story on that. So I had a buddy covering the Big East tournament in Madison Square Garden. You know, I'm a Yukon alum.

They beat Yukon. And I did the joking text of I might just auto-advance them to the final four in my bracket. Yeah, I don't even need to see a bracket, right? And then the bracket comes out. And Colin, I know you like Tennessee. I like Tennessee for the record, not here to criticize. I loved Arizona. I saw them in person twice. I said that's the most talented team in the country. And then, oh, by the way, we got to the Sweet 16 and you just referenced Houston and they're so big and they're so athletic.

So, I mean, just in that region, we're talking about three teams that we spent the last two weeks talking about. Is Arizona the most talented team? Tennessee is the hottest team coming in. Houston, oh my goodness, Kelvin Samson, how is he doing it at this school that's been off the radar for 30 years? So just in that region, just to get to a final four, there were three teams that throughout this tournament, everybody was talking about. So I think that pretty much encapsulates exactly what you're talking about in a nutshell there. Well, I have confirmation bias because I saw Tennessee. They beat Kentucky twice. I watched one of the games.

I watched them like three times. They were great. Every time I saw them, they were great. I watched Kansas twice. They didn't do a thing for me. I watched Arizona two or three times. They were unbelievable. I saw them at home beat UCLA.

I think they beat them by about 15 at home. So again, you watch all the games I don't and I can be lulled asleep. So, you know, Carolina, when I would turn on a game in the regular season. And I was like, eh. But it's funny. Hubert Davis was known as a really classy player, kind of elegant, family guy. He gets the job. And I, you know, I follow stuff on Twitter.

And I'm like, Wow, the pushback. Like he's got NBA connections, very respectful. I mean, he's not selling himself. And here they've done it. He's pivoted. He's pivoted. And you watch him and you're like, of all these teams, I think, what are they, an eight seed?

They're the one that shocks us. But I think I'm more interested. What is it about Hubert Davis? Was he considered a reach as a hire? Why does it get pushback? Yeah, well, I think really to me, and I'll say this, and I said it all year, is that there are those few jobs that, and it goes back to the book that you mentioned. I mean, I remember asking John Caliperi, you know, this was when John Caliperi was hotter

than he is right now, but, you know, you had it rolling at Memphis. Why, why leave Memphis? You made a final forward there, crows, this, that, the other thing. And he said to me, said, when Kentucky calls, you pick up the phone, and you don't say no. And so I've used that analogy many times with Hubert Davis in the sense that Roy Williams retires late in the spring. And I think truthfully, Roy Williams retired at the time that he did on the calendar to make sure that his guy got the job. But I think there was a big contingent of people that wanted to see North Carolina go out and do the national search and throw a bunch of

money at a lot of big names. And maybe one of them would take it. Maybe one of them wouldn't have because like it's fun, right? Like the Lincoln Riley stuff was awesome. It was eight days of content when the Oklahoma coach leaves for USC or the Notre Dame coach Brian Kelly leaves for LSU. And so I think because North Carolina is such a big brand, I think there was this thought that when the job opens, they can't just hand it off to the next guy.

And they did. And so I think that was a little bit of the pushback. And especially when it happened, right? Coach K retires in June. That's a lot. And oh, by the way, he's not retiring for a year and a half. So that's a little bit different than it's April. The coaching kind of stuff is already happening in the midst right there.

Can you make a call or two to one or two with a big name? See if you can get somebody to budge. See if you can get somebody to do what John Caliperi says. And ultimately don't say no. In the way that he didn't say no to Kentucky, you don't say no to Carolina. So that to me is I think why the biggest pushback was with Huber Davis. They didn't play well early either. You know, a lot of bad, really frankly, defensive efforts.

You go back and look at the box scores. I mean, 90 plus points to Wake Forest and Kentucky and Tennessee, they played all these teams early, get destroyed. But he figured it out. It seems to be the theme of this tournament, the theme of our conversation is the teams that were great early might not be great late. The teams that weren't great early are starting to figure it out. And so I think they're the greatest, they may be the best example of that in this tournament. Two teams that disappointed. Let's start with Gonzaga.

So the last several years, let's take the last two. it's not that they've lost, it's the way they've lost. I feel like they get out physicaled and pushed around a little. Now, they do a good job, Mark Few does, to get out a conference. They go to Hawaii. They'll go to the major, you know, they'll play the Dukes and the Kansas, whoever. And then they go, not that they put it on cruise control, but they win regularly by 25, the Pepperdine, San Diego's, Loyola. You know, it sounds like places where you'd want to go vacation.

And I don't think of that conference, the WCC, is that. the gauntlet of, you know, the ACC or the Big 12 this year, which was outstanding. The SEC this year was outstanding. So, and then they get into the tournament in the first couple of games because they're a one seed, they cruise through it. And I said the other day, because they don't have football, they're probably not going to go to another conference. But should they tweak their recruiting that they've got a very, they're very finesse and

very clever offensively. I never worry about that into the floor. But Baylor pushed them around. Last year, UCLA pushed them around. Arkansas won a lot of the 50-50 balls. And I think do they need to tweak their recruiting or am I overreacting to a tough loss to a good team? No, I think, you know, when I think about Gonzaga, what I would say is people always say they're overrated. The program, I don't believe the program's overrated. Would I go back to? Either do I. Yeah. Like, when I keep going back to, they got destroyed by Baylor. I'm not defending that. But there was last year. year one team in that tournament that was better than them. And we've all watched the tournament forever. Rarely do you get the two best teams at the end of the season. And, you know, if Baylor is a twisted ankle or a bad foul call away, Gonzaga wins last year. And so it's hard for me to be

overly critical of Markview or the program when they've been to two title games in the last four or five years. And again, they were clearly the second, like they go back and look at the box scores. They beat in the elite eight they won by I think 20 points against USC with Evan Mobley last year. So I don't believe they're overrated as a program. I thought this year, I thought maybe they were a little bit overrated as a team. And I did too. I didn't love this team. First of all, Chet Holngren, I think it took them time to figure out what the hell, how to use him. You know, seriously, I think he's really skilled. I don't know how he's going to pivot to the

NBA. But I even against Arkansas, I'm like, do they know, Exactly. I mean, it's hard, right? You get these kids. They're top recruits. You don't want to coddle them. You want, but you know, they're really gifted. I didn't love them all year. No, I didn't either. And so yeah, so and I think, like what I've said is I, I, I, the conference doesn't help, but I don't think it hurts as much as people think. But this year is the year that I thought it hurt because I do think in a normal conference, they'd be what Duke was, what whoever was. They'd be 24 and 8 and we'd be 3.4 and 8 and we'd be 3. talking about them as a two seed and we'd say, okay, they're good, but they have, but they just, they didn't play good enough competition in the season because the conference just doesn't give them those challenges. So I'll be curious to see what they do going forward because Tommy Lloyd, that assistant coach, that's now the head coach in Arizona, you know, it's a little cliche, but he was the international guru. He was the guy that really brought in all those guys,

Turiops, Sabonis, who's playing well in the NBA, Rui Hachamora, who's playing. And so, do they go more American? Do they try to stick international? And, you know, I hate to say it, but we all know the American kind of system and culture is kind of different. You want to get out of school faster. It's the reality of the situation. So I'm genuinely curious. You asked about recruiting. I'm genuinely curious just to see what the next three to five years for them looks like because I think as Tommy Lloyd is out, again, the new Arizona culture, the now Arizona coach for a year, I think that international influence is going to wane. And how do they recruit, where do they recruit? One thing they've done really well, develop players in their program,

third, fourth year players. I don't know. You know, Mark Few, you know, maybe you could get him on the phone and get me some insight because I'm just curious how he envisions where he wants this program to go over the next four to five years. So another disappointing team was Kentucky. Now, we know now they lost to a pretty darn good team, but I'll throw this at you. So he, Calipari really jumped on the one and done and had like a three to four to five year jump on everybody. Then Duke started getting beat by one and done teams that said, let's get into it. I would argue now they're beating Kentucky at their own game. So he's not getting quite as many, still getting first or second best recruiting class, but he's not,

it felt like for four to five years. He wanted him, he got him. Okay, now he's losing some. Now we have the transfer portal. So now you've got an even more transitional sport. And does he need to tweak that a little. And again, they're winning 28 games a year. This is, let's not go overboard, but they haven't been to the final four since. Let me look it up here. 2015. So that's for Kentucky, that's like Alabama not getting to the playoff for three or four years. Like that's a stretch, right? So do they have to tweak? Well, the problem for Cala Perry is, you know, he tweaked a lot. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque, others say it's

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couldn't get out to see players last year, all that stuff. So he brings in four or five guys. And I think that's really why Kentucky fans are frustrated. And I know that certain fan bases get bad reputations and all that. But I understand their frustrations because four or five year, probably closer to eight or nine, every time something bad happened, we're young, be patient, give us time. It's going to be okay. and when you lose, it's we're the youngest team in the country. What are you going to do? Well, this year, he had one of the oldest teams of the country and he loses in the first round. And you know what he did? I don't know if you saw this call. He goes to the podium and he goes,

well, none of these guys have been here before. What did you want? It's like how many guys on St. Peters had played in the NCAA tournament before that night? And so, you know, I don't, that to me is, I think the most interesting kind of maybe topic in college basketball right now. I think Gonzaga is right there as well is what does he do? Because I think he's at a point now and I've said this. I truly believe it. I don't think there is anything that John Calipari can do to win back the majority of his fan base until the 2023 NCAA tournament. I heard you kind of talk about the recruiting. They've signed every five star there is to sign. They've gotten the best players out of the portal now. He shook up the coaching staff last year. And it all resulted in a first round loss to a 15 seed, who admittedly is better than we thought. But it doesn't change the fact that you lost to a I don't think there's anything he can do until next year's NCAA tournament to win back the majority of the fan base.

I truly believe it. I really do. Yeah, listen, he's a good salesman. And I think his ability to fend off Kentucky fans in these disappointing years, it illustrates his ability to, he's a salesman. And that is often seen as a negative. But he can sell players. He can sell media. He can sell fan base.

He can be confrontational and argue back. You know, he's not passive aggressive. If he thinks something, he'll say it. He was feisty when he was an assistant. I mean, that's his reputation. He's a feisty guy with everybody. But, you know, listen, it's when you're great, expectations are high. You know, the New York match will put a wild card banner.

The Yankees don't in their stadium. I mean, that's just the reality of Kentucky basketball. And that's part of the frustration that I get is, you know, some people say, oh, you know, he's all these elite eights, a couple of final fours. I get all that. He's also paid $8.5 million a year. Like this isn't, you know, this isn't a little league baseball. He's doing it out of the goodness of his heart. Like, he's cashing a big check at the end of every season.

And so I'll be curious to see what happens. You know, I mean, he's going to have talented players no matter what. It's just, it's fascinating. And I think, like I said, the fan base, I believe, has the right to be frustrated. You missed the tournament last year. It's COVID, whatever. Who cares? Oh, by the way, Duke missed the tournament.

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Every time Duke has a great run, I know it must eat away at Calapari. Because I think, listen, he took a shot at Duke in their recruiting, their one and done stuff saying, you know, they say, we'll take care of you for life. And he's like, you know, we don't sell that stuff. And my takeaway is it's recruiting. You do whatever you got to do. You just show the kid more love. If that's the way Duke shows the love. But I do think, because I think we understand Duke is a, you know, private, small academically.

You know, I understand athletes can take classes, but I think instinctively, I think, Kentucky should be better than Duke. Right. Like Kentucky should be better than Duke. The revenue. The arena is bigger. You know, they recruit in the South big. They are the name in the South. Or is that unfair?

and that Duke, because they're so prestigious, should be the best team in college basketball. Well, Duke has the 30-year track record of the same guy in that seat. And now, you know, I mean, Coach Kay, you can say what you want about him, but what, five national championships that the other thing that Coach Kay did a great job of selling probably about seven, eight years ago, all those Olympic gold medals, oh, yeah, I coach Kobe, I coach LeBron, I coach Katie. You know, there's no, there's no high school player that.

that there isn't a comp to in, you know, Coach K's roll of decks. So, you know, are they supposed to be better? I don't know. What I would say is definitively, they're not supposed to be losing to St. Peters. And it's like you said, you know, seven years. So final four, 2015, that's seven years. One year, there's a COVID season. There's no tournament played. So really the last six tournaments. What I would say is this. So actually, I think you'll like this, Colin. I don't know if you saw me say this the other day. But right now, to me, they are the Dallas Cowboys of college football, a college basketball. And it's because they win in the regular season.

They win enough where you can't really like just clean house and start over, but they don't win the games that matter. And that's to me where I think Kentucky and Kentucky fans would say, oh, you know, the Cowboys haven't won a Super Bowl since blah, blah, blah, blah. But I bring it up because where Kentucky is now is I don't think their fans are national championship or plus. If they got to an elite eight and they lost to UCLA or Baylor or they got to a final four and lost to Kansas or North Carolina, they'd be frustrated, but you can't lose to St. Peters. And it's like I said with the Cowboys, you can lose in the playoffs.

You can't lose because Dak doesn't know when to spike the ball and when to go and you're running up field. And that to me is where we are with Kentucky. I really don't believe that the fan base is, if we don't win a national title, fire everybody. That's not what it's about. But you can't lose to St. Peter's as a 15 seed. And again, by the way, in a season where Duke is in a Final Four, Kansas is in a Final Four, all those schools that have all the advantages that you do, they're in the Final Four, elite eight. You're at home to St. Peters beat you.

So finally, listen, college officiating isn't great. And one of the reasons is because in college football, you have 131 programs or 130. College basketball, you have like 350. It's a math equation. three referees, right? And there's 350 programs. It's a numbers. The NBA only has 70 refs. They work them hard. They're all well compensated. I think you'll make almost 200 grand a year, your first year in the NBA, 550 or more with some comps once you're a senior official. So the NBA, very small, highly compensated group of mostly veteran officials. In college basketball,

you get some young guys. It's hard to find them. You know, these guys are hustlers. Now, an SEC ref can make 175, 200 a year. No question. Those guys are hustlers, right? So I have this, I was talking to a friend about this. I said, I wonder if you could do this. You have 12 to 15 full-time college basketball officials. That's it. Paid for by the NCAA. You put one in every Power 5 conference, three guys, three people, Pac-12, Big 12, Big 10, ACC, SEC, SEC. And they do the big TV games. So the stuff going out to the public. It's the number one crew. Then the tournament comes. Those guys again get the big dog seeds. And it sounds maybe idealistic. I don't think referees altered this tournament. But there are times that aesthetically, it's just bad optics. The NFL preseason. It's just bad optics. There's nobody in the stands baseball in April. That's why I've said, cut some games out, start in May.

There's like rainouts for 30 days. And I do think college basketball officiating that first weekend, all those teams, it's just hard. You got so many teams. Is it something they're concerned about? Or is this just me pie in the sky? Or do they look and say, you know, we got to get a little cleaner in these big TV moments? Well, yeah. I mean, I think anytime.

And the thing is, too, I mean, the most prominent voices in this sport, I mean, I hate to say, if you can't watch a game that Jay Billis is calling without Jay Billis, I'll be polite. He gets a little frustrated at the time. So I don't think it's good. I think the biggest thing, Colin, I don't think people realize this, as you said, they're independent contractors. I mean, some of these guys and girls, they'll work five games a week, like four games a week. They'll be in Syracuse on a Tuesday, you know, get on a flight and be at NC State that night, you know. and they're 50, 60, 45 year old people.

And there's nothing wrong with it. Make a living. Do what you got to do. But, you know, I don't have all the answers. And I do think sometimes it's a little bit overblown. Like, you know, most of these games, I'm trying to think off the top of my head, but the right team won, the better team won. Yes.

Beep whoever because Duke is the best team right now as we speak. But I do think it's just, it is tough with the block charge. It is tough with just the inconsistency. And it is like it is kind of, I don't know if funny is the right word, I kind of feel bad. But there's been two or three times where they've had to bring in Gene Stere to or the rules expert there. And I don't know him at all. So, you know, but, but he's basically had to say, yeah, you know, they kind of missed

that one on the court. And it, you feel bad for him. It's like, you know, these are his friends and colleagues and things like that. So I do think there's an optical thing. I think like here's the thing though, right, is like everything else with the NCAA, there's no leadership. And so because there's no leadership, because there's no one at the top, and it's the same with the transfer portal. It's the same with NIL. It's the same with every major problem in college sports right now is who do you go to, who wants to make those decisions, who wants to put the plan together, who rubber stamps it.

And so that's the unfortunate part. I love college sports. I love college basketball. But this is where we are with college sports right now is there's no leadership at the top at the NDAA. There's no leadership at the top with Indianapolis. And until it gets there, I don't see very much changing. I really don't. All right, give me next weekend's matchups, who you like and why? Well, you know, Villanova, Kansas is the early game. It's hard for me to pick Villanova, not because I don't love Jay Wright. I think he's unbelievable, but they just lost their second best player right before we started recording here.

We find out there's an Achilles tear. You feel awful for the kid. I mean, you know, final minute of the game, all that stuff. Jay Wright's awesome. They were already short-handed. You know, they really only play about seven guys. They lost the guy last weekend. they now lose this guy. They're down to five or six guys. I just think it's hard, man. I just think

it's hard against this Villanova team. And then the coach, like coach K's got, this is what do you say, Colin, say it out loud. Duke has the best coach. Duke has the best players. And what I say before, they have five guys that potentially could be in the NBA next year. They'll certainly be in the NBA at some point. I know Carolina beat them. And, you know, if you say on social media, you think Duke's going to do this. Oh, Carolina just beat them three weeks. weeks ago, you don't know anything. Maybe I don't know anything, but I'm just saying, Duke's got the best players. As you said, they're getting better every single game in this tournament. And apparently the stage isn't too big for them, right? I know sometimes that's a little

bit of a cliche, but they get better late in games when they need to make plays. The Michigan State game, the Texas Tech, that's what stood out to. Yes. They got all these young guys and they're fearless. Ben Carroll's hitting threes. Jeremy Roach, your guy is going into the paint and getting buckets. So I find it hard to believe that Duke's going to lose to Carolina. Again, I know Carolina is playing well. But what an unbelievable Final Four. I cannot believe we're getting Carolina and Duke did the Final Four. Well, and I also think, and Jeremy Roach gets a lot of crap, but I will say this, not everybody excels high school to college. Like Duke's a big environment. And, you know, he's a kid that people kind of, they didn't love him much. And the other day,

I was like, oh, my God, he's having. He'll probably be a second round pick in the NBA. He's not like wildly athletic. His comp is Lowry, the longtime NBA guard. Good, good, smart player. But what I noticed with Duke in this tournament, and again, you watch all these games, but there's a clarity to the way Duke plays. Six minutes left against Michigan State. The ball was in the best player's hands, and you could tell they were like,

I got to score the ball. And it was like, okay, it had a little NBA feel. It was like, all right, guys, the C's part, wing player, get in the ball. That's a big advantage, Aaron. Get a bucket players. They got more of them. That's what it comes down to. It goes back to, you know, first of all, even with Roach, he had some injuries in high school. So I just think it's been a really slow recovery process. And you know how injuries work. Guys aren't confident, all that stuff. But that's what I go back to with Duke. You know, and I go back to that Arkansas game the other night. Arkansas,

the head coach, Eric Musselman, I know well, came from the NBA. And the NBA is, we want to isolate whatever you do poorly on defense and go after it. And we want to take away your strength on offense when we're on defense. And you saw that in the Gonzaga game when Arkansas played them. They didn't let them run the fast break. Andrew Nemhard, the point guard couldn't get it going. Then he played Duke. All five guys could beat you. So, you know, how do you take away a strength? How do you take away a strength when four or five guys can beat you at any given time? So, you know, like I said, I'll readily admit I wasn't the guy that came into this thinking that Duke was going to win it. I thought they were too hot and cold all year.

I never questioned the talent. But like you said, it just feels like they're gaining confidence every single game, every single time they take the court. And listen, I know a lot of people are anti-duke. I think it's kind of been fun to watch. And like my whole thing is if Duke's here, I think a lot of people assumed it's going to be the refs or it's going to, they're just going out and winning games, man. And they're making plays late.

Like, yeah, it's like Matt Stafford in the playoffs. I don't care if you like Matt Stafford. When he's throwing the ball 60 yards downfield to Cooper Cuts, like he's making plays. He's doing what he has to do. So. Yeah. The Aaron Torres sports podcast. He is encyclopedic with his knowledge.

Also, he's a mile deep in his passion. And I follow you. You argue. You're feisty. I love it. It's exactly what you should do in your space. Listen, first of all, got to have fun in this. We're just talking about sports.

And yeah, I got all the NBA Twitter upset this weekend because I said something, which is fine. It was misinterpreted. It was misinterpreted as many things are on social media. But, you know, at the end of the day, you know, we all have opinions. And I said to my producer the other night, it's like the old George Costanza. It's not a lie if you believe it. It's like, it's not a bad opinion if that's what you actually believe. And so, you know, so sometimes I hit and sometimes I miss and, you know, you move on to the next one.

So great seeing you. Continued success. You are one of those guys that has never wavered. on your love for college basketball. It's because of the nature of what has happened culturally in basketball, where it's almost like the NBA has taken an anti-college basketball stance, whereas the NFL is very collaborative with college football. They like it as a teaching and mentoring stage, a minor league system.

The NBA does not view college basketball that way, I don't believe. and sometimes to the, you know, the peril of the sport. I've argued this now for two to three years. Coach K or a G-League coach. So, but when I say it, I'm the college basketball homer. So I let you say it. And, you know, and here's the other thing, too, which you know, because you have been around.

I'm telling you, like, let's go to one of the biggest NBA stories right now, Zion Williamson, okay? But when he goes into the league, everyone's like, oh, you know, well, I mean, he'll lose that baby fat because he's going to get with a real trainer and real. I'm like, have you been to Duke? I was like, I guarantee Duke's got better, weight training, meal prep, you know, nutritionists, massage therapists, you name it. Duke basketball, Kentucky basketball, Kansas, USC football, Notre Dame football. They're not lacking for anything. And so that's another conversation for another day.

There's plenty of kids that have taken that G-League route, alternative route. I have the sport continues to go on. I do think, no, now, NIL helps. I do think, I'll say this, I think having a normal NCAA tournament helps, right? How big has it been for Paulo Bancaro? Let me ask you, did you know much about Paulo Bencaro, the Duke Star before? Yeah. So, Chet Holmgren, I mean, people are busy.

And you said it right, I love college basketball. I understand that 99% of people are busy. They follow the NBA. They follow the NFL until February. They play fantasy football. They'll tune into a game here or there. The NCAA tournament was good for Chet Holmgren. The NCAA tournament last year was great for Jalen Suggs.

Davian Mitchell from Baylor, Palo Bankero this year. So, you know, the sports got its flaws. And I get it. It doesn't, you know, I understand it is a three, four, five week sport for most of mainstream America. And that's okay. But man, tell me, tell me this. Once the tournament tips and there's people in the stands and not everybody's six feet apart wearing, it's a fun event to watch and follow. Am I correct?

Okay. Yeah, New Orleans isn't a top 10 city for me, but Marty Gra is probably the greatest two-week stretch in any city in America, right? Yeah. So like not everything is everything. Like, like Los Angeles winners are unbelievable. So are Phoenix. Try living there in the summer. Sure.

So like cities have events and they have three in week festivals. And I think March Madness is the best festival in sports along with the World Cup. Those to me are like the World Cup every four years, college basketball. The World Cup's about three weeks every four years. And college basketball is three weeks every year. And those are the best like events that we have in sports. And instead of criticizing it, I tell people this all the time. I don't talk regular season baseball or regular season college basketball.

It's an event. And for three weeks, that's when it just owns us. And it should just embrace it. It's okay. It's not a criticism. As a sportscaster, if you're a sportscaster in Canada, you do 70% hockey. If you're a sportscaster in London, you do 70% English Premier League. In this country, you do 70% football.

because we bet it, we watch it. They, as a league, they space it out, free agency, combine, draft, camp. So sometimes I think college basketball fans, you don't watch all the game. No, no, you watch the games and then we'll come in, enjoy the festival, and give it tons of marketing and promotion. It's not a negative. It's an unbelievable, wonderful three-week period in America, and we missed it. We really missed it. For two years too, because last year there was a tournament, but like I said, and we don't have to belabor the point.

But in one stadium, half capacity, you know, whatever, you get the point. So it's great to have it back. And I'm happy that everybody, I think, is starting to appreciate how fun, as you said, tournament festival, whatever, how fun it is. Like, it's just fun. Just enjoy it, grab a beer. You don't have to, you know, I don't know. I love it. And I'm glad to see people realizing, you know, how much fun it can be, even though, again, I get it's not a 365 day of year sport.

That's okay, you know. Yeah. And for the people that argue it's luck, it's random, Duke, Carolina, Villanova, Kansas, no, it's not. Like every other playoff, one game playoff or seven game playoff, the best teams overwhelmingly the cream rises in every sport, which to me validates the tournament. If we had St. Peter's winning it, you'd be like, okay, this is nonsense. No. Just like college football, Ohio State, Alabama, we get the Blue Bloods. And that tells you that it works.

If we had eight seeds winning this thing, we'd be like, okay, we're making this too difficult for the most talented teams. Well, and I was going to say, no, even Carolina, I mean, the kid Caleb Love was the top 15 kid coming out of high school. It didn't click right away. Credit to him. He didn't rush the process. as he came back for a sophomore year, they got McDonald's, All-American's up and down that roster. They got the best coaches, again. It goes back to what you're talking about.

Best facilities, best training. They recruit the best players. Yes, they're an 8C, but go back to the preseason AP poll. I think they were ranked like 12 to 13. Aaron, great seeing you, buddy. Anytime. Next March. Just let me know.

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