The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Colin Cowherd Podcast - Eagles Best In The NFC? Bench Kirk Cousins? Aaron Rodgers Looks Washed, Ohio State STUNNED By Michigan

Episode Date: December 2, 2024

  Colin’s joined by John Middlekauff, host of “3 and Out” to break down all the week 13 NFL action! They start with the Eagles throttling the Ravens and debate whether the Eagles are the best team in the NFC (4:00). They give kudos to Russell Wilson for re-inventing himself with the Steelers and leading them to a huge divisional win over the Bengals (11:30).  They debate whether the Vikings should consider Sam Darnold as their long-term solution at quarterback after their win over the Cardinals(24:00), and whether the Falcons should bench Kirk Cousins after throwing four interceptions against the Chargers (33:30). They laud Jim Harbaugh for changing the football culture of the Chargers in his first season as head coach (37:00), and break down why laziness and complacency caused Aaron Rodgers to  “fall off a cliff” (48:45). They debate whether the Bears are the most dysfunctional franchise in the league and whether it will result in Caleb Williams being “stuck” and unable to live up to his potential (59:45).  Finally, they discuss why head coach Ryan Day isn’t able to maximize Ohio State’s incredible talent and continues to lose big games (1:15:00), and why Lincoln Riley hasn’t worked at USC and why the Trojans might be trapped (1:29:00). Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates!  #Volume #Herd #3andOutSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you.

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What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was crying. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis come in. He's like, you know I love you, dog.

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What time is it? Game time. Well, former scout for the Philadelphia Eagles watching his Eagles again start slowly, explode in the second quarter, dominate the fourth quarter. You know, it would be easy to say, well, Justin Tucker missed a couple of field goals in a PAT. It certainly didn't help. It forced Baltimore into some weird play calling going for it later. But, you know, it is, after a while.

something goes from different, coincidental, to a trend. And Philadelphia, they feel like a heavyweight fighter that feels you out, kind of tries a few things, and then eventually they just wear you out. And Baltimore is a physical team. And I just kind of felt, I mean, Jalen Hertz only completed 11 passes. But Philadelphia, and I think we've talked about this, we've given to do. Detroit, a lot of credit as the best team. I don't know if they met today with the Lions injuries.

I think I may take Philadelphia as the NFC's top team. What say you? Yeah, when I see a headline of Jamal Adams signing with the Detroit Lions, you know they got issues with injuries. I think the star of the day, and he's gone a little under the radar because Sequin looks, I don't know, like Walter Payton right now, is Vic Fangio. I mean, they wanted him two years ago and that Jonathan Gaines. He got the job last minute and it threw Howie and they're hiring off and he ends up in Miami.

Early in the season, it didn't quite look right. I would say this last month, I mean, the young DBs, Mitchell, their first round pick is a star. Cooper DeGine looks fantastic. Immediate plug-in-play slot receiver or slot corner, which is now a starter in the NFL, right? Because every team. And then how about this Zach Bond guy? He looks like Brian Erlacker out there running around. You cannot watch an Eagles game all season long without him making, I would say, over under four impact, impact plays.

And this was a one-year player who didn't sign for much that was an outside pass-rusher special teams guy, and it's been well-reported. And Fangio said, I think we can make this guy a middle linebacker. And I think he's going to be an all-pro this season. And obviously the past rush, I mean, Jalen Carter is really kind of done what they hoped he would be. So it's, to me, it's Fangio and the talent on defense showing out. I feel like the AFC is all about the quarterbacks and the NFC is all about the front offices. Green Bay. I mean, they haven't missed on a tight end or a wide receiver pick or Jordan Love.

Detroit, Philadelphia. I feel like those three teams, and I like Matt LaFleur, and I like Jalen Hertz and Jared Goff and Matt LaFleur. I think the NFC is ruled by front offices because you don't. have as much star power at quarterback. I think Green Bay is a year away, but they hammered Miami. That thing was embarrassing. I look at Philadelphia. You know, it's funny about Baltimore.

I mean, they're league leaders in penalty yards and flags. You know, missed field goals. I like John Harbaugh. I love Jim Harbaugh. It's not that they're, they just don't quite feel. You know what I mean? I kind of, when I watch Baltimore, the other week in a game they played, Bill Belichick was ripping them on like the ESPN, like the Manning cast.

He's like, okay, that's Philadelphia. That's Philadelphia. And you could tell he was kind of like as if he kind of was taking a shot at John Harbaugh, like this team's got a ton of talent. They're never buttoned up. Is that fair? And again, it's not that I don't like John Harbaugh, but man, penalties. they just sometimes leave points and plays on the sideline.

I like the Ravens a lot coming into this game because I thought they matched up well against the Eagles. I'm like, well, their run defense is awesome. And offensively, how can you corral Lamar in this offense? And it actually flipped. They broke the run defense with Sequan as the game went on, like you said, with a fighter. I think when you look at Harbaugh, like I would say, in the Lamar era, him and Lamar have been disappointing in big spots. Yes, yes.

There's no disputing it at this time. They also had a weapon in their back pocket. Yeah. Like when I was a kid, if you had a guy that could hit 40, 50 home runs in the early 90s, it was a big curveball like not many teams had. In golf, if you could hit it 300 plus yards 25 years ago. Justin Tucker is now shot. Yeah.

I did some math during the game. He was 8 of 14 from 40 plus coming into the game. Then he missed two more. So you're talking about a guy that felt like he was audits. automatic from anywhere from 45 or 55 yards, who now is a 50% chance of missing the field goal. And let's face it, in this game, when they lined him up to kick the field goal, did you have any faith that he was going to make it? Because I had none, which is crazy.

Just two years ago, you would have said, like, that's a lock. So you look at a team now that, you know, the AFC is pretty open. We'll see how Buffalo looks tonight and how they finish down the stretch. Obviously, the Chiefs have a remarkable record, but they're pretty flawed. Pittsburgh, they actually look pretty good today, but Cincinnati's defense is atrocious. Arbaugh has guys you've never heard of getting pick sixes, and that's how he's been doing it his whole career. The AFC is not quite what it's been at the top. So that benefits them if you just get in, you got a shot.

So if you look at the AFC, again, we're doing this before the Bills play. Kansas City's the one seed, Buffalo, two, Pittsburgh three, Ravens Four, excuse me, Texans, I believe, four. than it's Ravens, Chargers, Broncos, would be, as of now, the wildcard teams. So I really like the top two teams, obviously, in the AFC. Detroit is the number one in the NFC, followed by Philly. Seattle is the third seat. Atlanta right now is the fourth seed. And then it goes Minnesota, Green Bay, Washington.

So I like the wild card teams, Minnesota and Green Bay today more than I like Seattle and Atlanta division leaders. Atlanta's really, we'll get into that in a bit. But I kind of feel, I do feel overall, and I talked about this last week, I think the top of the NFL is really strong. If we just said, Philly, Detroit, Kansas City, Buffalo, would we agree, those are the four best teams in the league? Yes.

Yeah. And then I think. 100%. And then I think we get into this space where I would, Minnesota, Green Bay and Pittsburgh and Baltimore are all capable of winning a playoff game. I actually right now like Green Bay and Pittsburgh more than I do Baltimore. Because every time I'm like, I think Baltimore can win the Super Bowl, you watch today, you're like, no, they can't. What am I talking about?

And Pittsburgh, you know, Russell has given them so much life on offense and defensively on any given moment, T.J. Watt can just create a touchdown, like at the snap of the finger. It feels like Lawrence Taylor or Reggie White. And that's how many teams have that in their back pocket? Like even Kansas City, like Chris Jones has had moments, but I view T.J. Watt right now is the more dominant player. Now maybe Chris flips a switch come the playoffs. And, you know, the Eagles kind of have that, it feels like, with just all their playmakers on defense. And without Aiden Hutchinson, you're watching Detroit, which sucks for them. usually when you play on Thursday, you get that mini buy.

Well, the NFL, right, over the last four or five years, has taken the two best teams that play on Thursday and put them on the following Thursday, so you just get a normal work week. So Detroit today was basically their Tuesday, which sucks, given that was crazy on Thanksgiving, how many guys were going down. It was, you kind of start feeling bad for them. Yeah. I did.

Yeah. I want to pivot to the Steelers. Pittsburgh 44, Cincinnati, 38. This defense for Cincinnati, listen, the Steelers' offense had, 520 yards, 8 yards of play, 28 first downs. It was one of the great games in Russell Wilson's career. There was a real moment after the game when Mike Tomlin came up and embraced Russell Wilson. And I think it's pretty redeemable. You know, we're talking about Aaron Rogers like he still has it. Aaron's lost nine straight starts. I mean, like to Denver and Bo Nicks when they weren't even a thing yet.

Russell Wilson deserves a lot of credit. He has worked harder and been more focused than Aaron Rogers. You can say all you want about Russell Wilson, but he's a workaholic. He's totally committed to it. Sometimes he's almost hopelessly optimistic. But you know what? When he first got there, he thought, God, you know, it's such a kind of a working class tough guy culture. And, you know, he's Sierra and Russell Wilson and the brand. We have to, give him credit. He is acclimated well. He is fit really well. I don't know. I look at him, and there's two things that he does. He can extend plays, not like he used to, but he can extend plays, and he throws a beautiful deep ball. John, I'd argue that that's enough for them to win multiple playoff games. Especially if they're at home, right? And being at home is something

that has not been kind to them because they've been playing on the road so often because they've been winning nine or ten games in the regular season beside the 2020 season. So the stat, when we rattle off, they haven't won a playoff game since 2016. Well, they haven't been a great regular season team for a lot of those years. And when you're playing on the road, especially in the AFC, you're talking, especially the last five or six years, you're talking Kansas City every year, New England for a long time. Now Buffalo, these are very, very tough places to go play. We saw last year they went into Buffalo. Like no one, the game would have to get so weird for them to have a chance and it kind of did. But I think the best part about football, and you see this in college

and the pros, like, yeah, he does not feel like a Pittsburgh Steeler, right? The way he talks. Right. And his brand. But if you make plays and you win, no one gives a shit. Right. In college, if you're not from the South in Alabama or LSU hire you and you immediately start rattling off 11, 12 wins seasons and being in the semifinals and the national championship game, No one cares. But if you didn't play well, they would have turned on it. Russell came right in and elevated them. And today is a good example.

I mean, the game opened up with him throwing a pick six. Now, it was, you know, Pickens fell, but still, I went, ooh, this could get weird. Burroughs hot. You know, you spot them seven. Even Tomlin, I saw, I watched a clip of his press conference. She's like, you know, impressive, we spotted them seven points before you could even blink. And they never, and listen, Cincinnati's defense is atrocious. It's atrocious.

It is really, really, really. I mean, Joe Burroughs having a great season, and it's, they don't have a shot. I talked to a GM yesterday about, I said, if you're Joe Burrow, you're trapped. You know, we look at Caleb Williams, which we'll get to later and you think, oh, he's trapped. But like Joe Burrow, T. Higgins may not be a great one. He's probably a 1A somewhere. He'll be the winner in this. He'll go to a really good team.

Jamar Chase and Burrow, we're going to be in Cincinnati. Tobin, the GM, this has never been an organization that's been a deal-making organization. They're the opposite of the Philadelphia Eagles. They're passive. They're not aggressive. It's a dysfunctional front office. They're not well-heeled. They don't have a lot of money.

Cincinnati is the Eagles opposite. They just, they'll keep paying Marvin Lewis or Zach Taylor forever. They'll never allow dead cap coaching money. They're just different. And I was looking at T. Higgins today, and I'm thinking, you know what, he'd be better. off ending up with a really good football team. Like, I don't know, you can name it wherever you want to go. But there's going to be a football team out there that goes, you know what, we're a receiver away. We want to go get a grown-up wider. Because these days, John, people will pay for one big receiver.

It used to be years ago. You know, you'd pay a receiver, you know, the old term diva receiver, you'd be like, oh, boy, what are we into? Now, T. T. Higgins is no problem. He'll go out and play. But I just watched Pittsburgh. And for years, we've always, acknowledged. They draft and develop well. They're great underdogs. They're tough. But they lack the creativity offensively. And Russell, between the deep ball and the movement, he gives them a little creativity. By the way, when Ben was younger and moved well, he gave them the deep ball and the ability to create. I'm not saying Russell's big Ben in his prime, but it does look a little bit like those teams. Well, I think Tomlin had a big problem on his hand. The last

couple years with the offensive coordinator. I can't even think of the guy's name, but it was getting pretty ugly. Remember last year he got fired in season? And he hired Arthur Smith and it's completely changed them. And you've watched as the season has gone on and they went to Russell. Like, how did they seal the game today? They went with the Justin Fields run. So they've been able to incorporate.

Like Justin Fields for a backup, he's probably one of the more famous backups in the league, if not the most famous. And obviously Russell at one point, I know he was kind of injured was also the most, by far the most famous backup. He has, it takes a pretty special personality to handle that, and then it takes a good offensive coordinator, because it's not like Tomlin sitting in on the quarterback meetings and the offensive install. So a lot of that is on Arthur Smith, where you see North Carolina's interested in him. Of course they are. Like, he's clearly a pretty impressive offensive mind. And anytime you have the CEO head coaches, John Harbaugh, Jim Harbaugh, Mike Tomlin, Pete Carroll, whoever they hire,

especially for the offensive side of the ball with John, Mike, and Pete, can make or break their season? And that Arthur Smith, you could argue him and Fangio, two of the better coordinator hires in all of major college in the NFL this offseason, because how would he not be in the mix for coordinator of the year right now, what they're doing in Pittsburgh? Joshy Harris, how about him? I thought he was kind of a bust. He looks fantastic this season. The NFL season's rolling along. The contenders are separating from the pack. the one thing that hasn't changed this season is Draft King's Sportsbook and official sports book partner of the NFL, our friends at the volume. It's the number one place to bet touchdowns. Fade of the corner of the end zone, running back breaks through the line, gallop 60 yards for a touchdown. They don't care how you get them. They want to bet on touchdowns and you should at

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Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a... We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special.

So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band. Before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this.

We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it.

Another podcast from some SNL, late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, I'm Deanna Maria Riva, actress, mother, lover, and a Gen X woman walking through life one hot flash and hormonal crying jag at a time. You ladies know what I mean. I'll bet you a perimenopausal chin here you do. So let's talk about it. Join me on my new podcast. How hard can it be with Deanna Maria Riva, where I call on my GenX squads from Ohio to Hollywood as we navigate midlife's most fantastic BS. All of a sudden I'd had hanginess happening on my

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That one's kind of hard now. Well, that's lighting. They say we can't polish a turd, but we're sure going to try. So let's get blunt with laughs, tears, or tears of after and dive into it unfiltered and unbothered and ask, how hard can it be? I cannot believe I'm about to say this out loud in public. Listen to How Hard Can It Be with Diana Maria Riva

as part of My Cultura podcast network available on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before.

And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us

on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court, licking his fingers why he got the ball, like, after you go through a training camp with that, I said,

you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Saigon, the story of my family and of the country that shaped us. The United States will not.

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game. I want to talk about the Bears, Seahawks Jets, Chargers, Atlanta, a lot of college football. But Minnesota today beat Arizona 23-22. And I think most people view Kyler Murray is this superstar player. And, you know, a little enigmatic, but a superstar player. But it was Sam Darnold, who in the last three games is 3-0, 112-passer rating, six touchdowns, no picks. Kyler had an egregiously bad interception and in a couple of big drives. Yeah, two. One was atrocious. And Donald now, once again, had a winning drive.

He wasn't great on third down. They didn't have the ball a lot, but they were hyper efficient. They only had three penalties. And I keep waiting because you know I love Donald. I preferred him over Baker. I thought it was a bigger, more athletic with a better deep ball arm. Baker better as a peer passer in the pocket with time. But I keep waiting for the shoe to drop.

And I got to be honest. Today, Kyler was reckless. And I watched Sam Darnold. And I'm like, you know what? You brought this up last week. You think J.J. McCarthy is better. But off an injury and they go get Daniel Jones. I don't know what they do.

What happens if Sam Darnold wins two playoff games, John? Because today, I'm watching him and Kyler and I'm like, I trusted Darnold late in that game more than Kyler Murray. And I'm a huge Kyler Murray fan. This is where I feel bad for the Lions. They're having the greatest season of all time for their franchise. And if they lose to the Packers on Thursday, which is a fantastic Thursday night game, and the Vikings win, they will have the same record. If I would have told the Minnesota ownership, the Minnesota front office, the Minnesota coaches, and every Minnesota Vikings fan, it's pretty underrated fan base.

Yeah, it's great fan base. Yeah. That December 1st, you would be 10 and 2. And coming in a day, I think he had 21. So if he threw, he has, Sam Darnell would have 23 touchdowns. You would be 10 and 2 and one game behind with the Lions leaking major oil with injuries. Yeah. And in prime position to win.

the division, which we all agree, top three teams, best division in football right now. Yeah, easily. They would not have believed you. And this is, I don't know if you saw the story that I think Jeremy Fowler put out that, you know, the Falcons, if Cousins doesn't get it together, they will look to trade him this offseason. Hell, he could be benched over the next couple games. One, he's got a no trade clause, Atlanta.

You're not exactly in control of this. That's a conversation for another day. But Sam Darnold, to me, if I, if I was. a team. You said, Kirk Cousins, Sam Darnold. Oh, God, Donald. Not even factoring in money. It doesn't even 100%. And then when you factor in, one guy is making $40 million. And you're like, Sam, is he getting that? But even if he did, I would rather, if all money's equal, I will take Sam Darnold every day of the week. And again, look who likes

him. Kyle loved him. And they didn't want to lose them. They just, they couldn't compete with a $10 million, you know, what Minnesota gave him. And look what he's done. And I stand by Because today I was watching, halfway through that game, you went, God, Minnesota finally coming back to Earth, they're going to lose. Oh, I thought, you know,

Arizona, by the way, if you go look at the yards, they dominated time of possession like 36 and a half minutes to 23. Marvin Harrison 7th touchdown. If you watched the game up until the end, you felt like, oh yeah, this is Arizona, who, by the way,

Schizophrenic. I mean, Seattle, they lay an egg, and then they go on the road to me, and I'm like, oh, crap, they're back. Yeah, and when he threw that touchdown to Marvin Harrison, you went, you know, maybe this is just they lose 25 to 10 or something. And then I felt down the stretch. It wasn't even just that final drive. Sam Darnel was really good in the second half. And Minnesota's got really good coaching. I just don't see with a guy who's now had multiple knee surgeries who was a major project. Clearly your team with your coaching staff is just built to win. This is the NFL, it's not the NBA where you're worried, like the Spurs have been worried about five years from now for five years.

It's like the NFL, you're just worried about week by week next season. No one's tanking. Carolina's playing their balls off every week. Everyone's trying. And now you're 10 and 2. Minnesota internally could be like, why couldn't we, if we were to win the division, what if we were to get the one, why couldn't we win the suit? Why couldn't we make it the Super Bowl?

Right. I mean, they are. And if, again, a lot will ride on these January games, especially because probably some of them are going to be against the Packers and the Lions who you're very comfortable. playing and they're comfortable playing you. But this Sam Darnold thing, I'm not, if things keep going like they're going, I'm not just letting him walk out the door because I just drafted a guy.

We see it all the time. You've been hammering this home. People pivot faster than they ever have in the NFL. You make a decision. They don't even necessarily know it's wrong. I just can't afford to let this guy walk. He's not 38. This isn't Rich Gannon at the end of his career with the Raiders.

This guy's 26, 27, 28 years old. I mean, a lot of guys play for 10 more seasons in the prime of their career. Right. Yeah. And Sam has, I know him a little bit, first of all, very coachable. I think the year with Kyle Shannon was huge. So his last two stops, he's gotten elite coaching. He's a very coachable guy. And, you know, I think the other thing, there was a couple of plays late in the game. It may have been the last drive or the next to last drive. And Sam was rushed and the pocket got money really fast. And he squirled around. And he, you know, Sam was head up looking to make a throw. And I'm like, Sam, eat it. eat it, don't, and he didn't. And he went through a stretch this year in the middle. He had a couple of really bad picks. But again, he didn't early. Remember we were surprised early. Ooh, new Sam. Then he got a little, he got a little, the game got a little fast and he got, I think he's trying to make plays. He's living up to the hype. And now he's come back down to earth. He had a really bad Jacksonville Road game. They were 0 for 5 in the red zone. I don't know.

I watch Minnesota, and also we have to acknowledge this. You pointed this out. Let's say this again. I talked to, I went to dinner with Steve Kime last night, who now runs the football for clutch sports. And he said, listen, you can say what you want about Brian Flores, but their personnel, they're overachieving. Like he's doing a big time. He's going to get a job. So this may be one of these lightning in a bottle where Darnold has the best season of his career. Brian Flores is there before he gets hired. Sometimes it happens. Like you get lightning in a bottle. This is not the chiefs. It's not. It's not. to endure for 12 years or whatever. But again, last three games for Donald, six touchdowns, no picks, lots of movement, 112 passer rating. And this is how much I've pivoted. When he gets the ball late between the coaching Sam and Justin Jefferson, I'm like, yeah, he's going to get him into, he's going to get him into field goal position. He's going to get. I just, I think if we just put him in a category and people are going to think I'm nuts. But his physical skills, and this is why people never in the league always believed in it and wanted to work with him, it's much closer to like the Mahomes and Josh Allen in terms

of the way the ball comes off his hand. Now, he wasn't playing well. You know, Matt Rule in Carolina, like I watched Matt Rule in Nebraska. Can't win games. Maybe Matt Rule is just a little bit overrated of a coach. Yeah. Right. Adam Gase, I haven't heard that name in five years.

I don't even think he works in football. ball anymore. So, like, I see this guy with Kyle Shanhan and obviously with Kevin O'Connell, like, his skills and his maturation as a player, not everyone just hits the ground running. Most players cannot overcome dysfunction. Peyton Manning's an all-time outlier he could have carried any franchise and made them relevant. Tom Brady could not have. Right. At 22, 23, 24 years old, Sam Darnold clearly could not. And now he's good. Is he like a Hall of Fame? I'm not acting like We still a long way to go in his career, but he has been excellent this year. Like, I'd have to really study the NFC quarterbacks, but, you know, Jared Gough, I'm sure

is the Locke Pro Bowler, but he would have to be in the Pro Bowl mix for the three NFC guys, right? There's absolutely no question. Our week 13 reaction presented by Uber Eats get game day deals all season long at Uber Eats. It's time to look at this weekend's tastiest matchup. Okay, the L.A. Chargers go on the road. This would have been a loss. for the Chargers most of their history, beat the Atlanta Falcons, 17 to 13.

The Chargers are 8 and 4. I mean, it is remarkable what Harbonne Jesse Minter have done to the defense. It's the same damn guys. And now it's the best defense in the league. And what I loved about this game, this reminds me of Minnesota. That's why I want to go to this next.

Minnesota was dominated a time of possession. Few penalties, big drives, efficiency. The Chargers, just the, and Herbert, 16 completions, 147 yards. They only had 187 yards total. They're on the road. And yet, they, first of all, four picks. The pick six up the sideline, I don't even understand what it was.

It was like AI, somebody slowed it down. It was, that's the one where I'm like, oh my God, Kirk Cousins is washed. That is a 74 mile an hour major league fastball. It was bad. It was bad. It was just like, holy shit, he has no fastball. But I thought my big take was, it may be Michael Pennock's time. You may give Kurt one more start.

But this is a game. The Chargers have lost my entire life. You're on the road. Your offense just doesn't, it's getting, you know, you just don't have a lot of playmakers. We talked about this a couple weeks ago when they, I think they lost to the Ravens. We're like, they just don't enough. They need a Zayflowers. They need the number one.

They don't have playmakers. So let's attack it. I'll attack it from that. Your thoughts on what to do with cousins, are we in the Michael Penix mode now? Yeah, I mean, I would start them next week. Like, this is, what are we doing here? The four interceptions. Now, they, you know, Tampa won the day somehow in overtime since we started recording this.

So they're six and six. Yeah. Now, they have lost to Atlanta twice. Yes. They're also six and six. Yeah. And the Saints losing the charts. Thursday. Obviously, they're out of it. So it's basically a two-horse race. But Rahim Morris had comments at the

beginning of the season when asked why his coaching staff was so large. And he said, because we're going to win. And when guys get hired off of our staff, we will have replacements already on them. It's like, Rahim, I like you. And obviously, you've resurrected your career, making comments, like, let's just, this league's really hard. Yeah. You know, ask Andy Reid, ask, you know, Jim Harbaugh, John Hart, like, come on, let's just take a deep breath before you start kind of pumping his chest out. And your quarterback's Kurt Cousins. Who's, we've all come around on

and then he tore his Achilles. And like you said, when that happened in real time, the pick six, it just looked like a normal outrout the guy jumped. When I saw the replay a little later, you're right, it felt like the ball floated in the air extra long. I mean, even the DB kind of had to stop. And then you had to, here's a thing, though. I got a text from Daniel Jeremiah who calls the games

with Matt Money Smith. And he said, Harbaugh's out here winning games with defensive players and castoffs that most people couldn't point out of the lineup.

Hashtag coaching matters. Yeah. This, I had to immediately Google that player who had the pick six, who was a fifth round pick. Like, that's not Derwin James,

who also had the game winning pick. Yeah. But, you know, some of these plays are being made by randoms. Ladd McCocky is a good young player. He is their go-to-wife. Yes.

And this team is about to win 11 games. I think Jim Harbaugh, like Andy Reid and Bill, you know, Bill Belichick probably, it's hard to ever surpass the six Super Bowls, two as an assistant. Andy probably ends up with another one, you know, four Super Bowls. He won was an assistant. Like, these guys are all-time, like Lombardi levels. How many coaches can just go back and Jimmy Johnson, college, college, pros never left. Jim goes, dominates college, comes to the pros, dominates, goes back to college, wins a national championship, comes back to the pros and wins it. Who could do that? Like, I don't see who has that pitch.

Yeah. Most guys really thrive in one. He's coming. And now he's in his style. Like, he has a specific way of playing his sport. And it not only translates, it immediately dominates. Yeah. Like, there were four interceptions against a guy that just got $100 million and made him look like a third string quarterback.

Well, and also, Jim does it with culture. So his fastball is culture. You know, he is what Ohio states Ryan Day. isn't, which is Ryan Day, the schemes are fine, but what is Ohio State? You immediately, I can remember when he was at Stanford, Harbaugh goes in as a 40-point dog to the Coliseum, beats Pete Carroll. And, I mean, they had like a confrontation at midfield, and it was like he made Pete what was reeling. It was like, what in the hell? This is before they got good. And I can remember, like, his second year, I was talking to a friend, he was at Stanford. Stanford.

He replaced, I believe, Buddy Tevens. They were a mess. And I remember this because it was about the second year. And Pete Carroll was still in the conference. And I said, you're going to think I'm crazy. They're the most physical team in the conference. Stanford by year two. And nobody was paying attention to him then.

What he's doing, one of the chargers, they are so physical. And he also, I was talking to Jordan Schultz the other day, you know, his dad's Howard Shultz. old Starbucks founder. Yeah. Yeah. And I said, what's your dad's greatest strength? And he said, my dad's a really great delegator.

His ego wasn't in control. He hired really good people and he delegated. And I've heard that before from really good CEOs. Harbaugh does that, like with his general manager, with Jesse Mentor. He knows what he doesn't know. And what he does know, he's relentless in attacks. You watch this charger team. It is, I mean, the other thing, like,

Brandon Staley may never get another job. I mean, he will not get another head coaching job. It's the same players. In fact, I'd argue it's worse because they don't have Keenan Allen and Mike Williams. They have no playmakers. It's much worse. You know, by the way on Jordan's dad, Howard, the Acquired podcast with Howard Schultz on how he built Starbucks. It's basically just him talking to these two guys from start to finish how they built Starbucks.

Amazing listen. They are much worse. Keenan Allen just had a couple touchdowns on Thanksgiving. He was fantastic. He was a good player. What would Keenan Allen, what would they do? And listen, I know they chose. They had to. And who did Harbaugh choose? The two guys in the trenches. What did he do with the first pick? You know, part of what I think you see a lot of this and the Giants got crushed for this. And we've talked about this over and over. They have a clear identity of what they want and what they need. There's no guessing game. They're not just feeling it out as they go. You know, go back to the Michigan game, which Michigan's best players are still Harbaugh's guys, those defensive linemen, especially those defensive tackles. And the offensive. linemen, like he knows go back to Stanford.

Where did they start dominating before Andrew Luck showed up? Offensive linemen and running backs. And he wore people out. And that what is Howie doing right now with the Eagles? Jalen Hertz is not thrown for 400. He doesn't look like Joe Burrell. He's not throwing for 350 yards a game. They're hammering you.

They're wearing you down. Even the Ravens who have all their defensive linemen. Every team in the league would line up to sign all of them. And they just get worn down over time. why? Because I got a first round or right tackle. I got a second round or a right guard. I got a center that I drafted in the second round. I got a left tackle that was a former first round pick. You know, you just go down the, and it's just the hardball is the same thing. And everyone thought he was crazy when he took alt number five. He's like, you need wide receivers.

He's like, what the fuck are you guys talking about? At the tip of my spear is my offensive lineman. And that's coming from a former quarterback. And I think a lot of guys pivot from their strategy. Yeah. You know, and he never did. He never did. And I don't know if it's just full on belief in himself, if it's just the only way he knows. But a lot of guys would have got scared off at different points in time. I mean, look at Ohio State. They've completely revamped. They're much more of a spread slinging around.

That's not the Ohio State that's dominated my entire life. And, you know, Harbaugh, this team, like, they have a ceiling, obviously, because it's the NFL and, you know, they only have so many guys. But what he's, they won five games last year, five games. Yeah. To pick Kirk. I mean, that might have ended Kirk Cousins. Atlanta career. I wouldn't like bet my life savings on it, but well, I mean, there's a decent chance that by

Monday or Tuesday, it's like Kirk Cousins has, they're going to try Michael Pennix this week. Yeah. Right. And by the way, if that works, it's very flacco to Lamar Jackson. Where Flacco started, has had like a rough three week stretch or four week stretch. And they said, we're going to go with Lamar. If I recall what happened, they went with Lamar in week 11 is a rookie year. Well, Pennix would go in like week 13 or 14 that I had never had a, Kirk Cousins, Michael wasn't ready. Kirk Cousins gets you to six and six. You lead the division.

He pivots out. You segue to Michael Penix, who's been able to now sit and learn from a pretty good OC. I wouldn't be surprised if Pennix went in. You don't know how to defend him. Nobody's got tape on him. You have no idea what to do with him. My issue, and I know you and a lot of people,

you know, the quarterback position quadrupling down on it, my issue with it was Michael Pennix, at the time, free agency hit, a lot of people didn't think he was a first round pick. Yeah. So they had the eighth overall pick. So if they really did love them as much as they ended up loving them, they would have known they could acquire him.

Why not allocate your resources? Hell, give Sam Darnold $18 million for one year. Yeah. Like I think it shows a little haphazard. Yeah. They kind of fell up, the coaches fell in love with him more in April and they'd already signed Cousins. Because now you're in this weird spot.

Couss had a lot of leverage when he signed there. He has a no trade clause. Yeah. Now, if he's not going to start in 2025, It's not like he wouldn't waive that, but his value clearly is not as high as it just was this last offseason. Games like that. Yeah. You know, you're just basically offloading them.

And, you know, your owner, which is not the GM or coach's money, but gave them a lot of cash and impacts your salary cap. So it's just you're now six and six. And who's picking them in the first round against Green Bay or Minnesota? I mean, hell, or even Detroit, not a sole. They'll be an underdog at home. Won't they in that game? I would imagine. Absolutely.

Sunday night football. brought to you by Uber Eats as the official on-demand delivery partner of the NFL. Uber Eats has the best game day deals all season long. Order now, I often do for game day. Hey, it's us the Jonas Brothers and guess what? We have some big news.

What's the news, news, news? We created our own podcast called Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a... We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special.

So how do we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band. Before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this.

We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, Jonas, and offered it up as a potential... title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite.

Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or

wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Deanna Maria Riva, actress, mother, lover, and a Gen X woman walking through life one hot flash and hormonal crying jag at a time. You ladies know what I mean. I'll bet you a paramed apostle chin here you do. So let's talk about it. Join me on my new podcast. How hard can it be with Deanna Maria Riva.

where I call on my Gen X squads from Ohio to Hollywood as we navigate Midlife's most fantastic BS. All of a sudden, I'd had hanginess happening on my own. I was like, what the hell is that? I was married when I had her, so I didn't even consider how empty that nest was going to be. Mood swings, night sweats, fupas, sex drive. Wait, what sex?

Dating at 45, how can it be getting naked at 50 with the new guy? That one's kind of hard. No? Well, that's lighting. They say we can't polish a turd, but we're sure going to try. So let's get blunt with laughs, tears or tears of laughter, and dive into it, unfiltered and unbothered and ask, How Hard Can It Be?

I cannot believe I'm about to say this out loud in public. Listen to How Hard Can It Be with Diana Maria Riva as part of my Cultura podcast network available on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam, Ms. Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defying the art. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what.

He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid.

He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us a lot. everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nass would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court, licking his fingers,

why he got the ball. Like, you go through a training camp with that, I said, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Saigon.

the story of my family and of the country that shaped us. The United States will not stand by and allow any power, however great, take over another country. From My Heart Podcasts, Saigon. Please allow me to introduce Joseph Sherman. You don't think I'm serious about a free Vietnam? I should stop talking so much. I like hearing you talk. One city, a divided country, and the war that tore America apart.

This is for Vietnam. I've taken a hit from Japanese ground fire. Do you rate me? They're pouring patrol all over him. He's holding matches. I'm on a landmine. Or freeze on. Let's get out.

Freedom, mom, hit nine. Saigon, starring Kelly Marie Tran and Rob Benedict. Sting, here's madness. The world should hear about this. There's a fire coming to this country, and it's going to burn out everything. Listen to Saigon on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Jets 21, Aaron Rogers' ninth straight loss. Seattle's now taking control of the NFC West. And by the way, Seattle gave. This game is weird. You had to watch it. So Seattle, Gino Smith,

they had this weird red zone where they had seven tries from the five-yard line and got zero points out of it. But it was really interesting. The Jets, by the way, John, are in the running for the number one pick. So the Jags, Raiders, and Giants have two wins. New England, the Jets, the Titans, and I think it's Carolina, have three wins because Carolina lost in overtime when we hadn't started this. The Jets are in the mix for the number one pick. But what was really interesting after the game, first Aaron failed on another comeback drive in the fourth quarter. Okay, Donald had another successful one. Baker, by the way, wins in overtime.

Aaron has another. I think he's had six this year, a half dozen. Chances to win a game late. It's been one or two plays. But what was interesting is Aaron missed a wide open Garrett Wilson in the end zone. And it was a pretty pedestrian play. It would have given the Jets a 28 to 7 lead.

And on the road, Seattle, I don't know if they have the firepower because Soss Gardner was given D.K. Metcalf troubles. I mean, he'd kind of taken him out. I don't know if the Seahawks win that game. And after the game, Aaron said, you know, it's always one play, and I wanted to just go timeout. It wasn't, it was one play. It was your miss. And then, by the way, he had a pick six.

Remember right after that, it was a pick six. And it was like, okay, total game changer. But I, when that happened, that picks six, I started writing notes down. And I just said, where would I put Aaron right now in the league? And J. Mack and I have talked about this on the herd. He is not a top 15 quarterback. I don't care what anybody says. Like I'm watching him.

I don't trust him late. He's got a little mobility, not as much as most guys. I don't know, I don't know what you do with Aaron Rogers. This thing, I don't remember a great quarterback, John, ending a career like this. I mean, Farrve, remember, it was eight and three with the Jets, right? Got hurt. He went to Minnesota and just tore the league up the next year. This is a really, really, I almost think.

I mean, he's going to be a Hall of Famer, but it's almost a legacy affecting year. Like, he has aged much faster than I thought. Well, a couple things. You need to go to the NFL page, get the Leonard Williams highlight of that pick six, and copy it and send it to Lincoln Riley and say, you need more guys that look like this that you guys used to have. That's what you need. You know, I thought early in that game when the Jets look good. Like, God, are the Jets going to blow these guys out? Well, they had a bye week.

And what happens when, like, Steph Curry or LeBron James missed a couple weeks? They usually look good when they come back. Why? They're fresh. Older guys. And as the game went on, he's an inaccurate player. You said top 15 quarterback? I don't think he's a top 25 quarterback.

I mean, he was 21 to 39. He's objectively inaccurate when you're watching these balls. The Garrett Wilson play is one for, I don't know, up until he tore his Achilles. He would make with his eyes closed with his left hand. And there are other plays over the middle where, again, I don't know, he's not seeing ghosts, but he's so rattled and sporadic in the pocket because he knows he can't really run around. Early in the game, he had a couple runs. You're like, oh, that looks like a little old errand.

But as the game goes on, I don't know if it just kind of slows down. Older guy, then he doesn't move as well. And inaccuracy. Like one thing he dominated, he had an arm-like far, yet he was accurate like Drew Brees. Now I feel like when the ball's coming up, out of his hands, he doesn't know where it's going. And I think he was so pinpoint accurate. I mean, that separated them when he was with Green Bay.

He would hit these guys in the hands on every different route, whether it was short, intermediate, or long. And now you're watching these balls on pretty basic, like over the middle crossing routes, guys reaching behind them, getting destroyed over the middle. I just think, I don't know all the body mechanics, but from the Achilles, if he doesn't trust his lower body, there have been stories about him being banged up, which I'm sure, like, No one's ever questioned. Like, Aaron's tough.

Like, Aaron's been getting hit hard for a long time. Like, no one's question. He got smoked on the final throw today. Destroyed. Honestly, I was like, is he going to get up? Yeah. And, like, it's not, the toughness is not his problem. I think his skills now are, like, tangibly deteriorating.

And that's where, you know, you go back and forth about him playing next year. I just think that the new coach and the new GM, whoever comes in, you are going to want a fresh start. and if you're Aaron Rogers, are you going to want to keep going through this? You know, I think Therlareth has been saying this for years. Every player with their salt notices themselves first on film and goes, this is hard to watch. Right? Before your career ends, you're like, is that me? That's not me. That can't be me. And Aaron has to, I mean, this is one of, what do you think, top five talents of all time at that position?

Oh, yeah. And now he's making plays that people that he's been laughing at for a decade and a half. He can't even come close. You missed the Garrett Wilson one, which is bad for him. I think it's more of the basic routes that his receivers and are missing behind. He doesn't know where they're going. And it's tough to watch. And this team, they are no lock to win any game, any game.

You know, he's aging like Dan Marino. So, and I have compared Marino and Aaron Rogers because aesthetically, they're just beautiful throwers of the football. But at the end, Marino couldn't move. His legs were shot. He wasn't putting in the time. I mean, he didn't, when Jimmy Johnson got there, he wouldn't show up for off-season workouts. I mean, he wouldn't show up.

Well, Aaron is going to Egypt. I mean, Aaron's doing his own thing. And when you're told how beautiful you throw a football and how great you are, yet Brady, even as he was winning Super Bowl's New England, people said, well, he's a system quarterback. System quarterback. Patrick Mahomes constantly hears, well, it's Mahomes. Or it's Andy Reed. I mean, Mahomes is great. We know that.

But, I mean, let's be honest. Mahomes throws a lot of bad picks. He's got the smartest coach, Travis Kelsey, and that stuff, you know, or Lamar Jackson, you're not a good passer. Josh Allen, you can't beat Mahomes. It motivates these guys. Aaron was basically told for 15 years, you are the, you're better than Brady. Marino was told for years. You're actually better than Elway.

And I think you're human. I think of, you know, I've always been driven by the critics. not by, you know, positive press or whatever. So I kind of, I think Aaron hasn't put the time in, and I think you can tell how hard people work. Like Drew Breeze at the end had lost his deep ball. He was crazy accurate. He was tremendous in the line of scrimmage.

Drew Breeze slowly, gradually eroded. Aaron has gone off a cliff. Big Ben, by the way, not known as the hardest off-season workout guy. got hold really fast. Cam Newton aged very quickly. Aaron reminds me of Marino. He is just not. He is, I said top 15.

I mean, if I said to you, I'll name a quarterback, and you tell me if you take this quarterbacker, Aaron, Baker Mayfield. Baker Mayfield. Sam Darnold. You're going to struggle with a name, guys. Okay, let me. I mean, it's what I'm telling you.

Last three weeks, Bryce Young. Bryce Young. I've watched him. Carolina's played well for a month. That's right. Because of him. Yeah, no, he's played great. No, so you're with me on this.

I just don't think, I think we, he's been adored for so long. He hasn't put the time in, and now you can see it. By the way, since Robert Sala has been fired, the Mets have two wins and the Jets have one. That tells you about Robert Sala being fired. What a catastrophically dumb move it was. I think his whole game, I mean, I would say his past, when you close your eyes, you think Aaron Rogers, it's backpedaling off the back foot and throwing a dart. Or when you think Brady and Manning, his, you know, when you think the three guys of his era, it was Brady, Manning and Rogers.

Two guys had nothing in common with the other. I mean, Tom Brady once said football is the most unique sport. I couldn't play any other position in high school, let alone the NFL. They didn't move outside of a couple yard radius. It's why they practice fundamentals. If you went to a Tampa Bay practice when Tom Brady was 45 years old and showed up for the first 20 minutes, he's in a full-on sweat practicing his footwork. Well, Aaron never had to because he could always get away with that.

It's like a basketball player who's the best athlete in the league who's not a great shooter. Now, Aaron technically was, but once the athletic, ability deteriorates, you're in major trouble if your fundamentals aren't great. Chris Paul's never been that fast, so he's always been able to play a certain style. Brady and Manning, Manning fell off a cliff because his arm, like Drew Brees, did not work. Not because he didn't know everything to do. Aaron Rogers doesn't play like those guys. And you watch him play now the way he's kind of willy-nilly with his foot.

Jordan Love is a carbon copy of him. But Jordan Love, in the prime of his career right now, that arm, it fires out. You're like, geez, Jordan Love's got a hose. Aaron's arm, you know, let's face it. older's not as great. And whether it's, again, the biomechanics of his lower body with the Achilles not being the same doesn't, it's just off. But he doesn't sit in there and work his footwork like Peyton Manning, Drew Breeze, or Tom Brady, because he's never had to. And that was always the knock. And the one year he had a bad season, you know, the McCarthy year, the McCarthy got fired.

And then his last year with LaFleur, he kind of gets off doing his own thing. And when he gets a little off, the fundamentals go out the window with him. They never ever. Peyton Manning sucked because he could not throw in his shoulder, let him down. Not because his footwork and his body was off in the pocket. Same thing with Drew Brees. Same thing with Tom at the end. Tom just didn't want to get hit.

Don't blame him, 45 years old. Aaron's mechanics and I would say fundamentals are just not good. They never have. And he got away with it. And now you're watching them. I have a hard time seeing him play next year. And listen, I understand not many jobs, no jobs unless you're like the CEO of Apple are going to pay a 40 plus million dollars a year.

But he's made a lot of money, and now he's getting peppered. He's 40 years old. Who's going to trade for him if the Jets don't want him? Like, what are really his options? Like, it's probably a situation that you don't even have a chance to win in the summer. Like, it's pretty clear. So if I had to guess right now, we're the last, we're down the home stretch of Aaron Rogers playing NFL football. I want to go back to Thursday and talk about one team.

So the Chicago Bears, Eber Flusses, been fired off that insane, egregiously bad coaching snafu. So I saw Caleb Williams Saturday. I went to the Notre Dame USC game and I sat in Jen Cohen, the athletic director's box. He was there. So was his dad. I said hi to Caleb and talked to his dad for a second. Remember before the draft, I went on the air and I said, you know, I've heard Caleb's got some reservations about the bears. But he didn't know. want to be the bad guy. And the next day, Caleb came out and said, no, no, no, not true. I'm going to go to the Chicago Bears. I'm going to go to the Chicago Bears. Well, the truth is,

Caleb didn't want to hurt his advertising market, his influencer market, and he was going to be a good soldier. But I trusted my source is that, you know, you can't look at the Bears, an educated, reasonable person, and that's Caleb, can't look at the bears and go, this is a great place to go. And you're seeing basically what we predicted. I was told in the last month by an NFL GM, he thought the McCaskies were the worst owners. Bidwell's second, McCasky's the worst. They're some of the poorest. Just an odd group. The guy the president is a former Big Ten president. you know, a lot of opinions, not great on the details, I've been told. Iber flus over his skis.

Ryan Poles has done okay. I love the Montez Sweat move. I love that move. Chase Claypool. People take swings and mess. I'm not going to judge him. Some of his drafting, Jalen Johnson. I like the Keenan Allen pickup.

I talked to Cole Komet this weekend. He was in the box with Caleb Williams. There's, I don't know. Paul's extended commit. I mean, he's there for a while. Yeah, yeah. I don't know if he drafted him, but he extended him. But this organization, what is happening now is what Caleb and any reasonable person feared,

is that I thought Caleb was good enough. He was the only quarterback in this draft like Andrew Luck, didn't get the right GM, an impulsive owner, his coach got fired, bad old line. He was good enough. and Andrew Lull. Now, I don't think Caleb's as good as Andrew Luck as a prospect, but I thought he was one of these top 10 prospects. But the difference is this division is so damn good,

is as good as Caleb is. I'm sorry, again, Minnesota's well-run. They don't have Super Bowls. I've always felt they're pretty well-run. Green Bay is exceptionally run. Detroit now is well-run. I worry that Caleb Williams is going to, to just be stuck having to compensate for an organization that's arguably the weakest in the league

because Andrew Barry is a very good GM in Cleveland. We don't love the ownership, but we like the coach and the GM. I have a feeling here that Bears right now, along with Carolina, and people like Dan Morgan as a GM, they don't love Tepper. Are the Bears the most dysfunctional franchise in the league? It has to be right up there. I mean, I personally have always thought, once you have a lot of and you run a business and you still are really cheap on things that really matter. Like, you kind of have a disease. Cincinnati. Business back.

Yeah. You see this in all walks of life even outside of football. Like, eventually you got a pivot. Like Walmart, Sam Walton was notoriously very cheap. There came a point in time where you had to pivot with some of the big expenses with the company. And there were stories this weekend. And I gobbled up everything, Iber Flues, the firing. Of them, when they interview coaches, they fly them out.

and they put them in coach. And I had a buddy in the NFL that said when they were interviewing GMs, they put them all in like a shuttle. I mean, just things that in the NFL, in college football at the highest level, that are just viewed like any industry. There are certain standards for the highest level of your CEO, for your head coach, that is pretty embarrassing. And this is a franchise, this guy, a chiropractor at the gym,

who just, whenever I see him, he loves this Sunday show with me and you. He found me through you. and he's a diehard bears guy. And he was hammering, you know, the Kevin Warren situation. And he's like, people don't realize this franchise has been owned by this family since the 20s. I would imagine for 60, 70 years, the economics of the league for the McCasky, you know, Papa Halas was a little different than it's become the last 20, 25 years. But philosophically, their thoughts on everything have kind of been engraved, you know, from their, grandparents, like the way they think about this. Hell, the, the, is it the grandma or whatever,

Virginia McCasky's like 100 years old? Yeah. Do you think she views things like Jeffrey Lurie and Howie Roseman or like Les Need and Stan Cronkey? How can she compete against that? Jet York's 45 years old, running around with Silicon Valley people. How about this? We knew that Al Davis was a pioneer and a visionary and in the last 10 years got really murky and bad. Jerry Jones, visionary, Maverick, last six to eight years as a bad roster.

So those guys weren't, I mean, that was an eight to ten year stretch where you're uncomfortable. I feel like Chicago's been like this for 25 years. And I think whenever you have ownership

that doesn't know what they're doing, Kevin Warren is kind of reported this morning that he's running point on the coaching search. And Ryan Poles will assist him, call him that is insane. sanity. This is a guy that was hired to run the business and get them a stadium. You know the geography of Chicago better than me, but it again, through my buddy said that they basically laid it

all out for them in the suburbs and they want to stay in the city, yet everything's there for them. They already own the land. It's like that's, you got to get the stadium built, not hire the coach. That should be Ryan Poles job and the owner, but the owners want no part of it because they don't know what they're doing. And it's, it's pretty. sad. And this is where in the NFL, like Caleb was in a tough spot. This has gone worse than I didn't think it was going to go well. Like, I didn't even view him as a playoff team. It's obviously been way worse. You know, Jay, it was reported a Jaylon Johnson lost it on Eva Fluce as he just gave his postgame. You know, hey guys, his adversity, it's like, no, we're not giving the the cliche speech anymore

in here, Matt. And he should have been fired in January. Absolutely. He should have been fired in January because now you're repeating the same thing over and over. But who's, it's interesting. You go, who's going to want this job? Actually, on paper, it's a pretty good job. They got a lot of players and a GM that comes from Kansas City, who's a former offensive lineman. I do think the Kevin Warren thing is as big of a red flag. If I have to answer to, Iber Flues and Ryan polls this year answered to him, not the owner. Mike Brable's hanging up.

He's not answering to Kevin Warren. Obviously, Bill, they probably wouldn't even interview them. Ben Johnson's going to have enough leverage. I'm not answering to the team president that does not own. own the team. You know, in Denver, Penner, who is married into the Walton family, it's like, it's all the same umbrella. So it's like, yeah, I answer to him, he is the family, right? It's not, this is, this guy's an independent, this guy could be fired tomorrow, Kevin Warren. And if I'm for able, I have to answer to him, who I don't think knows anything about football.

Remember, he was the guy leading the charge to cancel football up through the middle of August. And if it wasn't for Jim Harbaugh and C.J. Stroud in the Big Ten, he would have canceled football. And I know there's tumultuous times, especially depending on where you live. But that's something that, to me, that's why Jim Harbaugh, like, Jim Harbaugh was never working with him last year. A lot of people thought that they could hire him. And I just think the Bears, man, they are, that's got to be one of the more embarrassing three or four game stretches that I ever remember. Like, I saw some bad Jim Tom Sula, you know, that year, but he didn't have specific games over and over. It was just a bad, like, a joke.

But these specific moments on Thanksgiving, I mean, how many people were watching that? I gave 25 million. The clock just kept ticking. It's insane. What's going on here? It's the worst situational coaching I've ever seen in my life. First of all, rookie quarterback against Detroit, short week. But throw him a life preserver. Like if it's year three, I'm on Caleb's ass. He is a rookie on a short week on the road. Call a timeout. You can see him. Everybody's flailing. I had a lot of scouting buddies crushing Caleb. Like, you know, he's the quarterback. He's 21, 22 years old. short week late in December, never played this long, probably exhausted, had led them back. Yes. Good second half. The coach, he's the defensive coordinator.

He does nothing on offense. His only job is to watch the clock. Clearly, they're discombobulated. They should, he should have called the clock the moment he hit the, his knee hit the ground. He was sacked. It was a no-brainer. Yeah. And honestly, I was surprised they fired him, weren't you?

Or it was just so bad they had no choice. I expect the Bears to play it out the rest of the year. Now for a segment called Making It Look Easy, brought to you by Morgan and Morgan America's largest injury law firm. Today, Russell Wilson, three touchdowns, 414 yards in the Steelers Wilde went over the Bengals. Just like Russell made it look easy, Morgan and Morgan does the same thing to submit a claim. Over 100 offices nationwide, more than 800 lawyers, $15 billion recovered for their clients. They have a proven track record of fighting to get you full and fair, compensation. Morgan and Morgan has been fighting for the people for over 35 years. And if you're ever

injured, just go to for the people.com slash Colin or dial pound 529 to check out America's largest injury law firm. Winning in the NFL is hard. Hiring Morgan and Morgan is easy. Hey, it's us to Jonas Brothers. And guess what? We have some big news. What's the news? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a... We're the first people to do podcasts.

Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how did we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band. Before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down?

Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends, me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam, Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed.

And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup,

he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything. everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nass would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying.

He running up the court, licking his fingers, why he got the ball. Like, you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah. You figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, I'm Deanna Maria Riva, actress, mother, lover, and a Gen X woman walking through life one hot flash and hormonal crying jag at a time. You ladies know what I mean. I'll bet you a perimenapausal chin here you do. So let's talk about it. Join me on my new podcast. How hard can it be with Deanna Maria Riva, where I call on my Gen X squads from Ohio to Hollywood as we navigate midlife's most fantastic BS. All of a sudden, I'd had hanginess happening on my own. I was like, what the hell is that?

was married when I had her, so I didn't even consider how empty that nest was going to be. Mood swings, night sweats, fupas, sex drive. Wait, what sex? Dating at 45. How high can it be? How can it be? Getting naked at 50 with the new guy. That one's kind of hard. Well, that's lighting.

They say we can't polish a turd, but we're sure going to try. So let's get blunt with laughs, tears or tears of laughter, and dive into it, unfiltered and ask, how hard can it be? I cannot believe I'm about to say this out loud in public. Listen to How Heart Can It Be with Diana Maria Riva as part of My Cultura Podcast Network available on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Saigon, the story of my family and of the country that shaped us. The United States will not stand by and allow any power, however great, take over another country. From IHeart Podcast, Saigon.

Please allow me to introduce Joseph Sherman. You don't think I'm serious about a free Vietnam? I should stop talking so much. I like hearing you talk. One city, a divided country, and the war that tore America apart. This is for Vietnam. I've taken a hit from Japanese ground fire. Do you rate me?

They're pouring petrol all over him. He's holding matches. I'm on a landmine. For free time. Let's get out. Freedom from Vietnam. Run! Saigon, starring Kelly Marie Tran and Rob Benedict.

Sting, here's madness. The world should hear of it. this. There's a fire coming to this country and it's going to burn out everything. Listen to Saigon on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Let's go to Michigan 13, Ohio State 10. We have to talk about a couple of college football situations. So I did not think, I think this is the biggest, in the history of this rivalry, it's got to be the biggest upset. Michigan passed for 62 yards, had two picks on the road and still. one. I mean, Michigan hasn't thrown the ball. Michigan's a very easy team to defend.

They can't pass. You could be hyper-aggressive. So I thought one of the things, I compared today in my car, I did a little thing on Twitter. I compared Ryan Day, the Ohio State coach. I wouldn't fire him, but there's a clear hole. He's Mark Rick. So Mark Rick had been a quarterback coach like day, was an offensive coordinator like day, and then got a blue blood job. And I always felt when watching Georgia under Mark Rick. He had several top 10 finishes, but in the big games, you never felt they got the most out of the roster. And that's exactly how I feel about Ryan Day, is that he can recruit like Rickt. He's a nice guy like Ricked. But those Georgia teams never had an identity. They just had really good players, even when they had, like, I think Matt Stafford he had.

Like, he would have, they would have moments and you'd be like, oh, my, this team's the best. in the country. And they won a lot of big games. He won three out of four games he coaches. And Ryan Day wins five out of six games he coaches. But they have no identity. And I thought that game, here's my take. So Ryan Day is one of those guys that, you know, Urban Meyer, he wins at Bowling Green. He went at Utah. He went to Florida. But the time he gets to Ohio State, he has got a lot of confidence. His shit works. Jim Harbaugh. My shit works. Right. Ryan Day, what does he fall back on? So remember when he got really defensive when old Lou Holtz took a shot at him?

And they won a game and the post game, he takes a shot at rickety old Lou Holtz. And I'm like, wait a minute. Why do you care about that? Because he doesn't have a history of success. Mark Richt did neither. is that when you, you know, Saban, Michigan State, LSU, Alabama, NFL, people can take shots at you. You have a formula that works. Ryan Day doesn't have a formula that works.

He's two and four in Bowls. He can't beat Michigan now four years in a row. And I thought the game plan was fascinating, John. He was trying to prove how tough Ohio State was in the first half. Say, bro, you have major matchup advantages at wide receiver. he wanted to prove, hey, people say we're not. This game's always decided by rushing yards. I'm going to prove, I'm going to blow this hole.

I can't coach tough football teams because he got very defensive with Lou Holtz questioning that. And this is Ryan Day. And we'll get into Lincoln Riley in a second. He's a little lost. When you start worrying about voices outside the building and narratives, and it starts changing your game plan. Their first half game plan was embarrassing.

Like what was it? He was trying to prove we can win tough. Just win the damn game. You know, I've had this theory with politics for a while that sometimes the media is detrimental to candidates and a certain party. And I think, you know, CNN and NBC, right, are in the headlines a lot, a lot that no one's watching. them anymore. They're losing a lot of viewership. But their clips go viral and I'm on a million text chains that see them constantly. And they're constantly lecturing people that whether it was Biden's cognitive ability or that Kamala was a great candidate. And eventually the people are like,

yeah, just come on. Right. Pump the brakes. And I think for a long time there has been a media apparatus that has told everybody, you Ohio State fans are lunatics. Get lectured them that they're lunatics and this guy is X. Look at his record. And it's like, guys, most human beings now, over 30 years old have been alive long enough to see Pete Carroll, Urban Meyer, Nick Sabin, Kirby Smart, Davo. Like, they know what a really good coach looks like. They also know that the Big Ten, beside a team or two every once a while, is not very good anymore. Yeah. Most of these teams, like beating Nebraska and beaten Minnesota, when you're at Ohio State and you have unlimited resources, is not that impressive.

So you are basically paid to beat Penn State, Michigan, and the other top teams that you play, whether it's Notre Dame or whatever you play in the playoffs and stuff. That's it. Like no one, you get no credit for beating the shit out of Minnesota, Nebraska, whoever. You better win those games, but no one cares. It's like James Harden scoring 50 against Sacramento Kings in January. Like, I'm sorry, no one puts any stock into that after a while. And I think everyone getting lectured constantly about Ryan Day, Ryan Day, it's like, guys, we've seen them in these big games and it sums off. Right.

something's off. And in this game specifically, right, the last couple of years, Harbaugh has had a team that was elite. So you get beat, as happens. Kirby Smart's lost. Last year, Michigan had better players than Ohio State. They had 17 guys drafted or whatever. This year, we've all seen crazy games. In college, we've seen 20 plus years insane. That to me, obviously we've seen bigger outcomes like Vince Young. That was a national championship game, right?

Or even Ohio State lost or won national championship. in a regular season game, I think that's one of the crazier outcomes I've ever seen my entire life. Start to finish. Because not a person in the world, especially a Michigan fan, would have bet on Michigan.

And as the game was going, you kept thinking yourself, this can't be happening. But he tried to get into a heavyweight fight with the one thing Michigan can do. And Chip deserves blame to, run it up the middle. It's like they're two good players

with the defensive tackles. You have three NFL guys. But I keep thinking that after the game and everyone's shitting on Ryan Day, it's like, well, they've been lectured for five years that he's a great, coach. And it's like, I'm just waiting for him to beat another. Like, we don't care that he's

beating James Franklin now four straight times. Yeah. Like, you can't beat Michigan, which in this program clearly is borderline the equivalent of like the national title game at this point. And he loses against the other good teams when he plays them in big spots. So you're watching him and you go, the cockiness, the third base comment, most guys that get those jobs, Jim Harbaugh to get the Michigan job had to coach at San Diego, Stanford, and then win at the 49ers. You know, this guy had never been a head coach. And he got the job and handed to him by one of the greatest coaches of his era. So Ohio State fans literally know what it looks like with Urban Meyer.

And you go, well, we're not that physical. We have this pass. And here's, I was thinking about this too. Because I've been critical of this guy for a long time. And Sarkisian's got Texas in the SEC championship year one. Yeah. And I'm watching him last night. And I went to watch them live.

Sark takes his offensive guy like Ryan Day. Well, he's also the play caller. So half the game is his baby, right? And the program's his baby, but the play calling. Well, Ryan Day is like turned into this CEO, even though he's this offensive-minded guy, he has to hire Chip Kelly, and you're watching him on offense just look terrible against the Michigan team.

Their best corner, Will Johnson, who might be like a top five pick. It's like Travis Hunter 2.0 corner is out. You're slicing. What are you guys doing? Like, you're supposed to be an offensive mind, yet Chip's calling the plays, and then your team's not that tough. And I do think to look after the game where they plant the flag and he stands there.

It just, listen, they're in the playoffs, so you're not going to fire him today. I don't see how this moves forward. Because I think it's very possible that this type loss, they could just lose immediately in the playoffs, depending on who they play. But I do think Ohio State fans, and I'm an Ohio State hater, but if I was in their shoot, I'd be tired of being lectured constantly by, and listen, I get it, Joel Clatt and all these guys, Ohio State is a huge part of the business. And they're awesome.

I like watching them too. But like we have to write a day like Kirby Smart's the Nick Saban's like he's at Urban Myers. He's not even remotely on their level. No, he's not even debatable. No, no. He is much closer to Mark Richt who, you know, George is better now without Mark Rick, who was a really nice guy.

But I mean, I had an NFL GM tell me years ago. He'd love drafting George guys under Mark Rick. He goes, because they were, he goes, if you drafted a Nick Sabin guy at Bama, he'd already squeezed all the juice out of the player. He goes, these Georgia guys, like, they still had two gears of shifting, you know, like they were always like, oh, they're way better than you think. The other thing is that the transfer portal and the NIL have actually created parity. When I was talking with a guy today who's a, he runs a message board for Ohio State,

and I said, you know, you used to be able to, years ago, when you had 125 scholarships, in the John McKay era for USC, you'd take like four running. backs in the West Coast just to hog them even if you didn't play them. And then we got down to 85 scholarships, and you can still do a little bit of that. Nick Saban can do it, Kirby Smart. Well, now a backup left tackle at, let's say, Ohio State, Louisville comes in and says, we'll pay $300,000. You're a starter for us, or a right tackle in Ohio State.

Well, he's, you want to be a left tackle and she'll scouts that? You know, whoever's got money, whatever team, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a Texas A&M could say, come here, start at left tackle. So there's less depth. And then an Ohio state could lose an elite offensive tackle where it's always been my whole life. The top programs have two, they have backups that would start except for there's a first round guy in front of them.

Well, that guy now just goes and plays at a lesser program. Gone. And so if you have an injury, so let's say you're Georgia and you lose, you know, Brock Bowers, and then a tight end gets hurt. and the other tight end who you had, he got purchased by Wake Forest or somebody or Oregon. Well, now you're, now your tight ends no better than the guy at Purdue. So these teams like Alabama and Georgia and Ohio State, if they have a key O line injury or a linebacker injury, they don't have great backups. Those guys have been purchased in the NIL to go to lesser programs.

And, I mean, I know a program that was, I mean, Washington. I mean, they were in the Harbaugh, Michigan teams. They were like, okay, who's not starting that we recruited, who's a five-star guy, who's behind a, you know, a sophomore who's got two more years there. That's the game now. I think Ohio State, though, if you look at this offseason, you know, it's well reported they spent. 20 million. Yeah, I think these numbers, yeah, could be 25, could be 18, could be 12.

You know, who knows the actual number. But they spent a lot relative, and I think widely considered the most of any college football team. And they bought Ferraris. I mean, Caleb Downs would start for every end. NFL team immediately. He's great. You know, they bought multiple sweet players. And then they signed Kansas State's quarterback

who some believe was not going to be their starter anymore because the other kid that was coming up that played this year, they were going to go to him, a little more dynamic. And you look and you go, well, if you're going to buy a Ferrari and a Rangerover and not have a garage,

like it's a pretty risky move. You know, Cam Ward was clearly the guy, but you go, Chip Kelly Ryan day, I bet they wouldn't really love Cam Ward. A little bit, you know, it's not really their type player, especially Chip. Yeah, doing his own thing. Will Howard, or Will Howard, that's, yeah, was much

more their type guy. And you watch Kyle McCourt of Syracuse, who just takes down Miami, he's had a pretty good year. Yeah. They blamed everything on him last year. And listen, he was up and down for him. But I think sometimes in this NIL era, when you're paying people, especially quarterbacks a lot of money, you can start doing finger pointing where

in the history of the sport, you would just give that guy a couple years to be a starter, And maybe that one year you look back, you win the national championship the next year and you go, we live through that. Look what Harbaugh did with J.J. McCarthy and that crew of guys. They lost that devastating game to TSU, right? It was hard to stomach a couple years ago. Everyone came back and they won it.

Well, now in the NIL era, if you're just pointing the finger, you make a couple guys transfer, they're not good enough, you upgrade. How could you lose a game where the opposing team, if I told you at the start, how much money would you put on Ohio State? If they're starting quarterback through for 60 yards and through two picks, you'd be like, I bet they win the game 40 to 10. I thought they'd kill them. I thought it was going to be. I honestly thought 3813 would be close.

I thought it was going to be a blowout. You just can't. You just can't fake toughness. And I've been around these coaches long enough and know these guys and these NFL teams and these programs. Some guys have it and some guys don't. And a small percentage truly have it. Like Urban Meyer, Nick Sabin. It's not about like your size or your coach.

But you're like everyone, when you walk into the room, they kind of their shoulders. Kirby clearly has it, right? It's a small percentage of guys. And Ryan, he's not bad. But he was also handed, I think the best program in the country with unlimited resources and we'll do whatever he wants. And they are regressing. Four straight times of Michigan. I think he's a loss.

We'll see who they end up playing in the first round. Let's just say they play Tennessee. That's what I thought. They play a team like, and they lose. I mean, now who are they going to hire? Like, it's Mike Vrable's not coming to college football in this era, right? So it's like who, you know, do you hire the Iowa state coach? There's no, it's, you might just get the same thing.

Like, you're probably not getting Nick Saban or Urban Meyer, you know, the next version of that. So you're just, this is where they're kind of, you know, it's not that bad, but it's clearly not good enough. Because if you can't get Michigan now, like, you just beat a team that was so desperate they paid a kid $12, $15 million to be their quarterback who's 17 years old. That's the team you just. lost you. All right, I want to finish USC Notre Dame. By the way, Marcus Freeman, the coach for Notre Dame, Peter Schrager is reporting this, and this is the second person I've heard it from. Marcus Freeman, the Chicago Bears are interested, culture builder. So just throw that out there. That's being talked about in NFL circles, Notre Dame coach Marcus Freeman. Would you leave Notre Dame

making $10 million a year to the Bears? No. If you had to answer to Kevin Wilson, I would not either. No. But it's interesting. They can't get rid of Lincoln Riley. He had his contract turned over. So it's nine years, 90 million left. They just put 300 million into the facilities. Their collectives up to 18 million. So it's not a money issue. Their collective is now up to $18 million. I was told by an agent yesterday. That's not it. But it's so they're not going to get rid of Lincoln. They're not going to do it. U.S.C. is not going to buy them out. It's not the SEC. And his best talent is young, and their defensive line talent they've recruited the last two years is much better, blah, blah, blah. But this goes back to the Ryan Day thing. So he was handed an Oklahoma program. And the culture was set. And he was very clever. He was a better offensive guy than Stoops. So he goes to USC and he doesn't really have to build a culture because Caleb Williams is so much better than everybody else in the conference. And they win 11 games. Should have beaten Tulane. Should have won 12. the following year about halfway through, you're like, wow, they have to replace the defensive staff. He deserves credit for that. But if you, I believe, and somebody said this to me, they said, he's getting, why isn't he replacing offensive coaches? They have one good, not great offensive tackle in the program, three years in. The backup left tackle is six, two, three, ten. He's a center. they have one really nice draftable running back in three years.

He's leaving. They don't have a draftable defensive player on this team. I think Camari Ramsey, the safety is draftable next year. Notre Dame's a better football team. Should have won. It's not that. But now we're going into year four. Forget the defense, which is better, but not elite.

They don't have enough good offensive talent. This quarterback they have is a Hammondegger. I mean, either he can't read the middle of the field or they don't trust him. Everything's up the sidelines. Everything's bubble screen up the sidewise. sideline. They don't throw the ball of the middle of the field. What I am hearing is he is alienated L.A. high school coaches. I mean, they're L.A. recruiting stinks.

So USC is trapped here. They can't buy him out. He's gotten stubborn on the offensive coaching where they're just not getting outside a receiver. They still have good enough players, forgettable running backs, forgettable tight ends, don't have any tackles outside of Elijah Page left tackle. when they signed them to a 10-year deal, you thought you were getting a steal. I'm nuts. This is the first time I look at it and I'm like, wait a minute. They're getting worse every six games from the beginning of Caleb's first year to the next six to the beginning of year two to the last six.

This team beat LSU. At the end of the year, the last three years, they're not a very good football team. That is bad coaching. If I would have told you in August that they would have one more win on December 1st than UCLA, he would have said, John, put down the drugs. I thought UCLA was going to win like two games this season. And honestly, it's not like they beat the brakes off them. That game probably could have gone either way.

Yeah, the fourth quarter, it was close, yeah. UCLA being five and seven and you being six and six, what a disaster for USC for the Big Ten. UCLA has no money in their collective. USC has 18 million. So it's not a fair fight. Well, let's, you know, we talked about Ryan Day. He inherits Ohio State. The recruiting mechanism was already set in place, like what Lincoln had in Oklahoma under Bob Stoops.

It was already the guys flowing there. He just had to keep it rolling. And he's done that. It's why his disasters are 10 and 2. Everyone wants to fire him. Lincoln would die for that. Lincoln had to start it from scratch. To me, if you don't nail the best players in California,

Obviously, the transfer portal has changed classes a little bit. That's pretty embarrassing. And I get this is not the Pete heyday. But like, why do Kirby and Nick and the guys that win in the South win? Because they nail the players in their region. Yes. And there it's harder because you have to recruit. If you're at LSU, at Georgia, at Alabama, you know, Florida ever got good.

Now Tennessee, you're all recruiting against each other. Like, obviously, Oregon has to come down to Southern California, but you still have a huge advantage. And everything the nostalgia of the Reggie Bush of what it used to be, it's just got to be gone. If you meet someone now and young people that work for you and, you know, I'm around young people, like a 25 year old was born in 2000, right? So that guy in the heyday of Leiner and Reggie and Lendell White was five or six years old. So those guys that are now 18 years old, think about it, they were like the Clay Hilton era. So this nostalgia of what used to be exists to me and you or older people,

not to the people that matter the most. And if you piss off these high school coaches, like the high school coaches are the lifeblood of someone's program because they funnel you guys. I mean, they're very, very important. Obviously now money changed hands. But to me, SC, like Caleb Downs, whoever that, the equivalent of those type players every year,

it should be between Ohio State, USC, and Texas. Like if they're not in on every, and why are Sark and Ohio State's roster is so good? Because they're buying all the sweet players who are available. And obviously, they recruit really well. Is Lincoln going to have a top 10 recruiting class this year in the nation? Top 20? 12 to 14. And here's the problem.

Ohio State, even with Ryan Day, is not going anywhere. If they keep for the next five years, they're going to win 10 or 11 games every year. Oregon clearly is going nowhere. And listen, we can. Washington. We'll see what, James. Jed Fish can recruit. So Jed Fish will get that puppy to nine wins fast. And I've heard that they did not use much NIL money this year because they wanted to take a deep breath. They're going to be blown it this year. So they will be aggressive. And Penn State, we've already seen the stats over the last six years or seven years if they would have the playoffs. They'd be in it every year. And the one thing James hangs his hat on is recruiting. Yeah. Right. It's one thing you say James Franklin is great at recruiting. Right. In game coaching. Recruing. So I, you could argue this could just, nothing could change. You know, six and six, maybe they're eight and four.

Right. But I don't know, they'd have to catch lightning in a bottle. I don't know if you're ever going to see the Lincoln that they bought. I think this might be the new normal, you know, which is when you're paying that type of premium, what was that building? Was that a home game for Notre Dame? No, it was, it was 75, that was 80, 20 USC. It was a, it. Notre Dame was not an apathetic group yet, but they've got to be pretty down, right?

They're headed toward apathy? The Big Ten saves them because the Nebraska's Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan, Ohio State travel so well. That's what really saves them. They'll have good revenue because of their collective. And let's be honest, 20,000 Big Ten fans in the winter, they're going to L.A. to watch that game. To me, where you have no excuse, like, listen, you lose Oregon, you lose Ohio State, like maybe you're not as good. you cannot be losing to the middle of the pack. Maryland.

And when you look at the middle of the pack and the Big Ten, what is the difference between UCLA and Rutgers and USC? That's what would really shake me if I was a USC fan. We're not just middle of the pack from a talent standpoint. When I watch them play, it looks the same. It's always been my defense of the SEC. It's like you just watch the SEC talent. Looks different.

Obviously Ohio State and Oregon have the equivalent, but the middle of the Big Ten and the middle of the SEC, see, even if the records are the same, the talent discrepancy is obvious. And USC's, they kind of had an easy schedule this year. Did they play Ohio State? They did not play Ohio State, nor do they play Ohio State next year. So if you look at, I mean, Lincoln got a big break. He didn't get Oregon or Ohio State this year.

He doesn't get Ohio State next year. So even, it's funny you ask, I looked at USC schedule yesterday, and they have the home a ways. It's a really, they get Michigan at home. They get a couple of their, you know, they get a couple of their tough games at home. So they're getting, they don't have an LSU on the schedule. They play like Georgia Southern Southwest Missouri State. They do an SEC out of conference schedule. So if you look at the schedule next year, John, it is by Big Ten standards, it is a cakewalk. The other thing is, and obviously football at USC is way bigger and in basketball. Yeah. But Musselman kind of has a history of winning and just kind of playing the part.

Yes. So he's just, God, he just can shake some hands. He can put on a smile. He can play the part. Like, you don't get to be just grumpy Belichick in college, right? You can do that in the NFL as long as you win. In college, you do have to shake hands, donors, NIL. And now they're going to be comparing him to Eric Musselman, who's been winning at all these places.

And then you got Lincoln kind of honorary scowls, not smiling. I think you ask yourself, This is what I said from the beginning. Does he even want to be there? Did he just get an offer so gigantic that no human could turn down where it's like he was already so rich. He's looking at his main count. My life, do I regret this?

I think he got to say if he could do it over again, is he the coach at USC right now? I think you'd have to say no, right? I still think he believes based on the recruiting, the interior defensive line recruiting the last couple years. I think he believes next year's the season. but they don't have a quarterback. They don't have an elite quarterback, so shit, who knows? John Middlkoff, former NFL Scout. As always. Crushed it, buddy. Thanks, Colin. Talk to you soon.

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