The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Colin Cowherd Podcast - Nick Wright Pt. 2, Why Kevin Durant Isn’t In The GOAT Conversation, The Peculiar Minds Of Cowherd And Wright

Episode Date: January 24, 2024

Colin is joined by Nick Wright, host of FS1’s “First Things First” for part two of the pod. They debate why Kevin Durant is more of an “artist” and less about the “business” part of basketball and why that’s kept him out of the GOAT debate with Michael and LeBron (3:00) They  argue that in a game of 1 on 1… Durant WOULD be the GOAT (6:00). Then the guys go off the rails and dive deep into their own psychology, the weird ways their minds work, and why it makes them good at their jobs (15:30). (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates! #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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They saw basketball structurally. They took opportunities about with a coaching. They, befriended the right agents, the right coaches, the right owners, or, you know, and Kobe was very close to bus or, or, and later, they saw it structurally. There was a structural component. Kevin is more whimsical. He's more of an artist. He's actually worked against structure. He should have never left. Sure. Golden State to go to crazy Brooklyn. Phoenix was kind of an out-of-the-blue move for a franchise without great history of winning championships. And that I didn't view him saying that, why am I not on the goat discussion, as narcissistic? It is simply, he is a whimsical personality.

He's a bit of a wander. And to him, it's all about, I can get a bucket over any of these guys. Nobody can get a bucket better than me. So that's why. And that's how he's not structural in any form. So that's why it was such an interesting comment. Because, so I was talking, you'll probably be able to guess who it is. I don't want to say who it is.

But a mutual friend of ours who I think used to live down the block from you or maybe briefly. But a mutual friend who is one of the smartest people. Oh, I know who this is. Yes. Okay. And he said to me, he said, take every. all time great. The 50 best players ever and put them in their prime and have them line up on the side of a black top.

And it's just and you get in someone who's never seen, never seen knows their resume, knows what they accomplished, whatever, you get them at their peak. And they get to pick like we're picking, you know, for five on five.

You know, I have first draft pick. And he's like, okay. And they're like, all right, describe this guy to me. And you get to Michael Jordan. And it's like, okay, well, he's, you know, he's about average height. He's, you know, about average deep shooter, very, very good midrange.

You know, one of the best two or three athletes here. An insane competitor. Insane. I'd say, okay, sounds good. I probably, set of his side, I probably can do better. All right, who's this guy? Oh, this guy's LeBron James. He might be the best raw athlete here.

He's, you know, there's 15, 20 guys here that can shoot better than him. There's 25 guys here that can dribble better than him. But he does everything really, really well, and he can get to the basket at will. It's like, oh, okay, it sounds good, but it probably has a number of more pick. All right, who's that guy? it's Kevin Durant All right, well, he'll tell me about him Well, he's the second tallest guy here

And probably the best shooter There's only four guys here that can dribble better than him He can play every position He'll guard anyone you want That guy would say Well, I'm fucking taking him He's the tallest and the second best shooter Like what are we talking about?

And so under like those auspices I think Durant's like Why am I? Tell me why? Tell me who's better. You tell me that if we were playing king of the court, who wouldn't win. And I think that's how he views it. Yes. And so I understand it.

I've said this. He would win the all-time NBA one-on-one contest. Jordan could not stop him, and he's tall enough to be a pain in the ass. Yes. LeBron's not a good enough shooter to win one-on-one because he couldn't just get to the basket with Kevin's length. So Kevin would out-shoot him. Kareem is not quick enough, nor is Akeem or Shaq. And Kobe, Kobe's smaller, is that if you did one-on-one, Kevin would beat all of them.

Mark Few was on the Olympic staff. Mark few. And pretty good teams. Saw all the players. And I said, you know, you're watching literally the 12, 15 best players in the world, right? And he said, I said that anything, like, did you ever, like, was there ever a jaw-dropping moment? And Mark said, first of all, it was an honor. I loved all of them.

But he's like, Colin, I've never seen a player. Kevin Durant not only got a good shot, he got any shot he wanted, and it was always a great shot. There are no fallaways. There are his ability, his length, his release, his ball handling. He said, I've never seen. And by the way, Gonzagas had great players. He's been on the Olympic teams. He said, I'm not sure I've ever seen a player.

who gets a great shot anytime he wants. But that's also why that same, but with all that said, there is no goat argument you can even fashion that because he lacks a structural. It's about the context of the accomplishments and the all of it. But it also is why he was so fascinated in my opinion with Kyrie. because along that same logical path, you can argue, why is Steph Curry better than Kyrie? So Steph's a 99 out of 100 shooting and Kyrie's a 89. Kyrie's better at everything else.

So why? And so, but it because again, in that mythical what, what are, you know, how skilled are you discussion? What can, you know, what can you do? those are the ones where Kyrie shines the most within the structure of can you be relied on for seven months all of that you're out the wind that drew holidays better than you but in the idea and so that's so you get why they were drawn to each other okay so it's prime example is that LeBron Michael and Kobe all view basketball to some degree they viewed it as a business there were certain teammates that drove them crazy. They were, Kevin views it as an artist. He's attracted to other artists who lack sort of the structural consistency to be on time, be there every night, play defense. He views it as art and he is Van Gogh. Whereas Kobe, like, love Gasol, his consistency, his brain. I mean, he,

Shaq's a greater player, but Shaq didn't want to practice. Shaq, Shaq sometimes. He's, just didn't want to play. Shack was sometimes distracted. Shack viewed it sometimes as art. So Kobe could struggle with a lack of consistent structural consistency that Gassall provided and Shaq was a greater player that didn't. And so if you look at Michael, Rodman drove him crazy. But Scottie Pippin didn't. He acknowledges that Scotty, when he went to Washington, those guys were all a bunch of goofball players. They drove Michael crazy. They wouldn't put the time and the effort in. So I do think many of the great players, they see the sport as, as, there's a business component to it. Get the right coach, the right teammate, the right consistency. Kevin's the ultimate artist.

And he's not concerned about that. He sees it as a canvas every night and he's going to spill some paint, but he's the best painter. No, that's, that's right. And it is, it, it is a, and I'll, I'll bring it to this. And then, then we got to go. There's a level of, of that it's not the exact same, but the same line of thinking of why isn't Kevin Durant the greatest player ever is the same line of thinking of why isn't Josh Allen the best quarterback in the league? It's the same. It's like, well, okay, tell me why.

Is there a guy bigger than him? No. Is there a guy stronger than him? No. Is there a guy faster than him? Sure, a couple, but they're not more effective runners. Is there someone that can throw it further than? him that can make more throws. It's like you understand the theoretical argument behind it,

but the practical application has never borne itself out. And that's the, and that's the problem. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes, a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clipper Taylor the fourth. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to

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from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of tauntons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two.

Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I always try to bring up something that I saw this week that kind of shocked me and have a reaction to it. We didn't prep for this. So I saw a story this week. Yeah? that just one energy drink a month can disrupt sleep, one a month.

And this leads me to a story one time when I first got a job at ESPN, I went back to visit a friend in Las Vegas. And it was a late flight. This was years ago. Could have been 15 years ago. Red Bull was out, but I wasn't aware of it. And I go and meet these guys at a bar. And I said, guys, I've been doing shows all week.

I'm pretty tired. And they said, have a Red Bull. And the bartender says down, he says, here, you've ever had a vodka and a Red Bull? Oh, boy. Okay. So he pours one, a second, third, fourth, fifth. You're off and running. So it's six in the morning.

When I'm doing jumping jacks, I'm like, yeah, there's something, I had no idea. So I've got it very not unrelated, but not totally related. By the way, cheers. As always, this is the part of the process with you. Listen, I'm just, I'm drinking whatever wine I have until we get the cowherd winery, which I assume is down the road at some point coming. So I don't drink energy drinks at all. I do drink probably four or five cups of coffee a day.

Same. And so I'll drink. I basically just drink coffee continuously until I go to work. and then I drink a coffee during the show. But I never drink soda. I don't, and I don't drink energy drinks any of that. Nothing against I just don't. What I do do, however, is I have worn nicotine patches for 15 years.

I wore nicotine patches starting when my wife and I went on our first vacation together and she hated that I smoked. So I got to wear nicotine patches. and I've been wearing them ever since. It's not the greatest thing, but it's not actually as awful as people think. What I don't do is take them off when I go to sleep. So I put one on in the morning and I wear it until the next morning and then I take it off, put a new one on. So this is a, listen, I am, I'm not trying to be Aaron Rogers here and, you know, pretend to be a scientist or a doctor.

So I'm not going to claim I've done the research on it. I am just a sample of one. What I think that creates is my, I'm getting a constant stimulation via nicotine. And so I have, not only do I have vivid dreams, but I have like dreams where I am articulating an argument on the show that I sometimes then wake up. And it's not like a goofy, like, what the hell are you thinking about? I was like, that was a great fucking point. I just had and I like use it. And so my mind is kind of always there's so I don't.

So that's a long way of saying it's on the board that it's been 15 years since I got a good night's rest. Um, and maybe it's my eyes. But, uh, I mean, that is all on the board. But, um, yeah. So I am, I wear the nicotine patch 24 hours a day. And as you can see on the show, I still didn't occasionally hit, uh, you know, nicotine vape.

Well, somebody years ago. go. I had a doctor friend. And, you know, we were friends and he's like, you know, sometimes Colin, I'll be talking to you and I just lose you. And I said, well, you're no longer interesting. So you have to maintain your interest level or I just tune you out and think about other shit. And so he thought that was funny as a doctor. He said, have you considered going on and he gave me something? It could have been riddling or something. I don't know what it was. And I said, oh, I'm not taking any drugs for this. I said, I know that my head is different. I know. know it is because I know people aren't thinking like I'm thinking, but I talk to myself

three hours a day. I do not want to be medicated. I am willing to be zany and weird. So this is because I want to have this conversation with you. I'm so glad we started here. There's so many crazy like it's coming off divisional weekend. I'm so much more interested in this specific conversation for a number of reasons. So you and I don't have the same brain, but we we clearly have a lot of similarities in how. You're mathy. I'm more mathy. You're kind of more ideas, but we have a lot of kind of similarities of how I think our brains work. So I, I for a very long time, there's an article that I have up in my office that was written about me 12 years ago when I was doing a poorly rated afternoon radio show in Kansas City. And I just kind of,

of speed and I say to the guy, I'm like, well, here's what's going to happen. Like, I'm going to beat the guy who's been number one for 20 years. Then I'm going to go to a major market. I'm going to be number one there. And then I'm going to one day take over for Colin Cowherd. Like I was like laying it all out. But keep on, I'm laying this all out as a guy getting, you know, coming in 16th place in Kansas City, getting up one point two share, just saying it at point of fact.

I'm like, and the article is written from the perspective of, hey, there's this guy on the radio in Kansas City who's totally delusional. Like that is the premise of it. It's kind of a hit piece. But in there, I talk about that I thought my anxiety was my edge on the world. And, you know, the guy asked me, I'm like, well, I just, you know, when my then girlfriend, now wife goes to bed at night, I just stare up at the ceiling. for 45 minutes because like I'm so like am I doing enough what do I need to

whatever whatever and that is I by the way if people are listening to this I don't think that I have treated this the right way I don't think it is necessarily healthy for me whatever but I believe in a very thin lane of professionally

medicating that out of me would have been the worst thing possible And so like I I kind of took the downside of the impact it has on my general demeanor or health or whatever because I think it's what makes me unique. Like it is one of the things that allowed me to kind of do what I've done. And what you were saying about yourself is really interesting because it is true. and everyone who knows you on a personal level knows it, like, no matter how much Colin likes you on a human level,

if you guys are having an interaction and you stop being interesting, he's out the door and doesn't even know it. Like, and you don't really, I think maybe you can do this in, like, at cocktail parties with your wife, but I'm guessing you can't.

Like, you don't really have the ability to fake it the way most human beings do, it's like, oh, tell me more about your accounting firm. Like, you're just fucking out of there. And you can see it and everyone knows it. And that is maybe a social faux paula. But it's part of the reason you're you. Like, you know what I mean?

Like any of, like all of us, I think, have a oddity that if we had regular jobs, people would be like, not cool. But because of the jobs they're like, Like, it's kind of like he's an artist, like he's weird, but it's fine. Like that I feel that exactly. I totally know what you're talking about, and I feel like I have a similar thing. Well, it's, it's, I have a friend.

He's just a wonderful guy. He's one of my really closest friend, like go on vacation friend. And he's in Hollywood. And I don't want to put his name out there because he still does a lot of business. But, you know, he has told me about interactions. And I am in no way an artist. I'm not putting myself on that plateau. But he was telling me about a dinner he went to with Oliver Stone.

So Oliver Stone's a fascinating guy. I mean, almost everything he's done, even the stuff that Salvador, that may not be a hit, is just fascinating. JFK, Latoon, all of it. All of it. He's a brilliant guy. And he was telling me about a dinner. He had to go to a business dinner. with Oliver Stone. And he showed up at one, an hour and a half late to a business dinner and didn't

really acknowledge it when he got there. And at one point, he took a dessert. He was leaving the restaurant and said, I'm going to take a dessert out to a friend and just put it in his hand and left the restaurant with a dessert in his hand. And he was saying this in admiration of, he said, the dinner was fascinating. He's one of the most brilliant people. He is different. But he's a, he's really you're sitting and talking to a genius on certain levels artistically. And again, he is one of my top ten Hollywood people I'd love to meet. In fact, I just went to a hotel to Beverly Wilshire a month ago with my wife and he was there having lunch and I thought, I can't, I can't bother him. It looked like an important meeting. But I will say is that,

and I'm not an artist, but there is, I could not be, for instance, and my son's the same way. I couldn't be an accountant. I couldn't sit in a cubicle. I'm not capable of it. I'm too, frenetic. I'm moving too much. So the audience is listening to this thinking we're probably too self-absorbed people, but I think what we're doing, we're giving people a glimpse into our peculiar. No, I don't listen. Yes, I mean, of course, anyone who does what we do, there is a level of self-importance. I mean, it doesn't work if you don't. Like, the whole idea is what I provide to the world is my thoughts on the world. That does make one feel self-important. Like there is, so I don't know if it's a chicken and the egg thing, but of course,

Like I'm not building anything. I'm not creating anything. I'm just giving everyone has ideas. And for you or for me and people in our space, like they, you know, people want to hear them or they people think they want to hear them or whatever. So yes, there is a level of self-importance. But what I think is relatable is no matter I, to me, if there's a lesson in such a thing, it's if there is something unique about how your brain or you work,

being able to find the job or career that instead of you having to mute that or suppress it, that rewards you for it, is the quickest path to either success or a fulfilling existence. Like, because there's a lot of jobs you're saying you couldn't do. But it's also what you couldn't, it'd be, you'd be miserable. If you couldn't do the thing that makes you you, and in fact, they're trying to beat it out of you. And so, we're both married to actual artists. They're different types of artists. Your wife creates like paintings and actual art.

And my wife is what I consider a visual artist. She's a designer and a stylist and puts things together for people. But if those, that's the way their brains work. they see things and it makes sense in a way that that's the only thing they should be doing. I shouldn't say can do. The only thing they should be doing. Well, I'll give you a story. I don't know if I've ever told this story before.

I may have told it to people at parties, but this is brain function. So my wife and I have been together 17 years. And I would say the first 10, nine or 10, we were feisty. I mean, when we dated, she broke up with me six times. So, I mean, a lot. She broke up with me all the time. And, you know, part of it was just not understanding she's just a different person. She was like, and still, I've never been with a woman like Anne on a million levels.

She's just an amazing person. And we have totally different brain functions. So I'll give you an example of this, which is something that I hope I haven't told you this story and you're surprised by it. So when I first moved to Los Angeles, there was a lot moving in my life. I was moving all these kids out west. My career was restarting. I had a lot of shit going on. Yeah.

So I went to a therapist near where I now live. And I'd gone to him 10 to 12 times. And I was getting to the point where I felt like I was, I had come through. I'd kind of passed through my issues and my anxiety. And that usually takes me 10 to 12 times. And so I'd go to the same office. And so it was, I think, the last or second to last meeting, therapy session. The therapist says, well, I was talking about, you know, he didn't care what I did, but after about five or six of them, I was using a metaphor and analogy and he's like, did you, where did that come from?

That was interesting. And I said, oh, this is what I do for a living. He's like, oh, you were connecting things interestingly. So at the last meeting, he says, well, that is why you can't see the frog. I was like, the frog? And he's like, this is the 12th time you've been here. And you've never noticed the frog. And I said, I have no idea what you're talking about.

And he said, I want you to look at me and move your eyes two inches up. And so I went, and there was a giant frog hanging from his light from South America, he later told me. He goes, you've never seen it. He goes, your wife would literally have spotted it. It would have been our first conversation. She would notice my African art. He had art all over the walls. He goes, she would have noticed all of it.

That's what, and he was talking about brain function. And I was like, so humiliated. I was like, oh my God, I apologize. He goes, no, no, no. He goes, just remember this. You and your wife have totally different brains. You picked a partner that is going to be the most challenging for you. And since that time, I walked out of that, literally very emotional.

I may have been crying. I'm like, why have I argued with this beautiful, smart woman for seven, eight years? I can't tell you. I don't know if we've had a fight in eight years that in that moment I realized we have different brains. She's a complete creative, sees things I could never see. I'm more of a stacker, more of an organizer and a stacker. And it was one of those, oh, my, I felt so much guilt. I'm like, I'm punishing her and arguing her brain functions at a different level.

So here's the thing. I didn't realize until the punchline of the story that years ago, I don't think it was on a podcast. I think it was at your house, but it might have been on a podcast, but you have told me that once before. And the reason I realized that the punchline is because I was so struck by it that I went home and told Danielle because that is, it is a very similar story there. and then the extra, you said, you know, arguing and fighting, whatever it is, and these are things all couples to different degrees of different levels go through. But the thing that I have to be constantly reminded of is there is a part, whether I acknowledge it or ignore it or try to deny it's there, there's a part of me that is wired to argue because it's what I do. You know what I mean? Like it's and that I might somewhere subconsciously want to and feel like I better fucking win.

Like I'm not in the losing arguments business. Yeah, yeah. Which can be incredibly tough on the people, you know what I mean? The people you care about the most, the people and wrecking like being able, but for me, being able to like toggle that part of my brain is it takes conscious. effort because it's just kind of it just I'm not as you know like you said our brains are different I'm a stacker

but I am I think I am more like of a combative personality like hey there like Wilds gave me a hard time this morning he was like you know when you're the angriest on the air he's like it's not when you're wrong he's like it's when you're right

I was like what do you mean he's like he goes watch any of our YouTube clips from the days after the Mondays after the Chiefs got a big win versus they had a big loss. He's like the Mondays after they lose, you're laughing. You know what I mean? You're taking it on the chin. The Mondays after they win, he's like, you are furrowed, brown, and angry.

And so we were kind of like talking through like, why would that be? And because, let me guess. Yeah. Because you are so angry that people didn't see. vision before. That's exactly right. I was so angry that I was like I had to defend this for five days. And now it's all there. And now I'm going to like, so I was, I was a, and I went back yesterday. I went back and watched Monday's A block. And I'm like, he's right. I look furious when I should be jubilant, but I'm indignant at the situation. And so that is, I don't know if it's a malfunction, but it just is my brain.

I have to tell one story about you and then we can move on past all this. This is not related, but this is funny. And I don't think I've told this on the air. In fact, I'm almost certain. And I won't name names. But this is a good window into how you're just different. It's one of the reasons I love you, but you're different. And I don't even know if you know this story, even though you're the central figure of it.

So seven years ago, seven and a half years ago, I am four months in four months in to starting at FS1. I'm in LA, and I have now become your regular filling. I've probably done four or five shows. And one day, I'm on the main floor of our building, which has right when you get past security, that long corridor hallway, where there's like four different ways you can go,

but it's one long hallway. And at the end of the hallway by the lobby, you are standing, you are standing facing me, but you don't see me. I'm 80 feet away down at the end. And someone who I won't name, different on-air person, their back is to me. And I'm like, oh, Colin's there. I'm going to say hi. So I'm walking.

And then I hear the person is talking to you about me. And they're not being negative, but they are clearly more than a little annoyed that they feel I have jumped them in the line to fill in for you. And I'm like, oh, no. But at this point, I have nowhere, there's, I, I, I, I, I, I've nowhere to go. And so I'm like, oh, no. I'm like, all right, what am I going to do? And then I'm like, okay, if I go another 20 feet forward, I can duck into this office or this corridor to the right. And you are facing me, this guy's back is to me. And, and I, he's like, you know, know what and you you haven't seen me yet and you then say something he responds and then you and you're

being nice and then you see me and you say oh nick's right here we should ask him and i'm like sweet jesus and you turn to me and say and this guy is now mortified because he knows i've been walking this here the whole time here's all of it you're like nick why is it you're filling in for me and not him? And I'm like, what in the world? I'm like, who does this? But you were like, oh, I don't know. I don't know.

Like, I think it's probably because Nick might be better. I'm not sure you didn't say this, but you just were like, hmm, seemed interesting. Let's find out the answer. And I'm like, oh, I'm like, oh, God, I don't know. Because I got no other job. I'm not sure. Like, I don't know.

and that was that, like, unbelievable. But yeah. So, I'm so awkward socially that I didn't even consider how jarring emotionally that would be to you and the other person. I mean, for both of us, I think both me and this guy looked at each other and we liked each other. And I don't think he was taking a shot at me. I think it was just kind of frustration, like whatever.

I never, I have no ill will towards this person. But I could not believe that you were just like, Well, Nick's right here. Let's ask him. I was like, oh, my God. So that's Colin Coward. Go ahead. So, folks, yes, that's why I have just a handful of friends. You know, I had my, we had a, I had my 60th birthday party recently. And it was pretty small gathering. My kids, my sister showed up, hadn't seen her in eight years. So it was really kind of a small gathering. But it was funny because I did, it didn't. I had very few new friends. There were a lot of them. I mean, some of them were due. But I was kind of as I drove home. I told, you know, I told my wife, and I said, you know, just such neat people. And we're so lucky that so many of them live around us, right? Like all in this little area. And I said, you know, it's one of those. I'm like, I just feel really lucky. I have many of the same friends. And as I said it, I thought to myself, yeah, that's, they've learned to deal with me. That's why. I don't, my barking garage is full. Nobody else is driving in looking for a spot. People are, they've had enough, right? Oh, that's great. Okay. All right.

Nick, this was fun. An hour and one minute. I know I started on frogs from lights and Red Bull. No, actually, we started about the way our brains work and how weird we are. But that's fine. I loved it as always. And I'll talk to you, you know, probably the next time I'm talking to you, we can do hardcore football because we're going to be previewing the Chiefs in the Super Bowl. Can't wait for it.

Talk to you later. everybody. The volume. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heartre radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque.

Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app. Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast.

Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of tontons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the eye-heartedly,

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