The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Colin Cowherd Podcast Prime Cuts - Bench Caleb Williams? Best College Football Programs, Chiefs Start 0-2

Episode Date: September 20, 2025

Colin’s top takes of the week. First, he’s joined by John Middlekauff, host of “3 and Out” to break down the Eagles win over the Chiefs (3:00) and debate whether the Bears should actually bench #1 overall pick Caleb Williams after another outing where he looked incapable of playing within the structure of an NFL offense (8:30) He reacts to Baker Mayfield’s late game heroics for the Bucs on MNF (26:15)  Then,  he’s joined by college football guru Josh Pate and they debate whether UCLA is over their skis in the Big Ten (38:45), and which schools are truly the best five college football programs (43:00).  Finally, they discuss whether Brian Kelly is the right coach for LSU (53:00). All lines provided by hardrock.bet (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates!  #VolumeSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Download the GameTime app today. All right, John Middilkoff, former NFL Scout, 3 and Out is his podcast. We do our Sunday night hour plus, a lot to talk about. Let's not waste any time. Philly beats Kansas City. 2017, although the deep over-the-top throw by Mahomes made it feel kind of closer than it was.

it did feel like in the second half, John, Philadelphia in my lifetime does a better job at one thing than any time I've ever seen. If they need a yard, two yards, or three yards between the O-line, Hertz, Sequin, and some of their sort of counter, tight-end rollout moves, I mean, it's just automatic. They are so good. And Hertz, you know, let's be honest, Hertz trailing in the pocket is not, my favorite guy in the league. I don't think that's his specialty. But I really, this is one of those games. There was never a point. I kept thinking Philadelphia is going to eventually wear this team down. And I'm kind of surprised Kansas City clawed their way back. What are your basic interpretations from what you saw? You know, I thought going into that drive where Travis hits off his hands and they pick it off and they take it to the 50 and did, I mean, that tackle, Josh Simmons, running down the field.

the to save the game. I thought if Kansas City scored there. Now, I don't know if they could slow down Philly. They had that time. But I mean, you just never know with Sequin, like you said, some big playmakers. They were just going to have to win that game on Gile, toughness. And it was going to be, if they had pulled that off, let's say Kelsey catches it, or that doesn't happen and they score, just an incredible championship, like metal type game for them. But they don't have much right now. You know, worthy being hurt, rice being suspended. You know, I thought Travis was having a good game until that moment. Obviously, Patrick missed, you know, Thornton earlier in that driver.

He ended up hitting him, which might have given them a little more time. They wouldn't have to force it. Let's face it, Kansas City right now, I expected defensively. They got shredded last game against Herbert. And Hurtz shredded them in the Super Bowl. So I knew that they were going to bring it defensively. But offensively, I mean, they got an old Kelsey, Hollywood Brown. I mean, their running backs are okay.

They run hard, but are they starting. Starting on most good teams in the league? Yeah, I mean, I think they'll be fine when they get Rishi Rice back in four weeks. I think they will. I think they'll find their way. Denver losing a game they should have won today. That's a huge break for them. So, I mean, that game ends up being big for them.

Big that one Monday night football, someone has to lose between the Chargers and the Raiders. So you're not, they're not running away with you. Yeah. But I did feel, and, you know, Chiefs fans don't want to hear this. But I felt like Siriani and Jalen Hertz, Syriani was coaching with a lot of confidence. Like when they took a lead, his whole thing was, guys, we can just ground this out.

Let's not take any big. I mean, they didn't take one big shot down the field to Devante Smith, and they hit on that. But I felt Philadelphia's kind of felt like, okay, we're on the road. We have the better roster. We're going to grind these guys out in the second half. And it was just one of those things,

especially after that interception on the deflection. And let's be honest, If you have a great coach, great coordinator, Spaggs, and a great quarterback at home, after you were humiliated in the Super Bowl, the game was going to be close. The line was one and a half. I said it Friday on the herd. I'm like, guys, it's going to be a close game late, and Philadelphia will situationally get a key first down or four and win. So the game kind of looked like I thought, but I thought Philadelphia, I felt in the fourth quarter, John, they felt they had the game. It's like they brought in a closer in baseball.

and they kind of, I mean, how many times did they use the tush push today? Seven, nine? Yeah, a lot, a lot. Well, Brady mentioned it, though, on the goal line play where the two guys jumped off size, they didn't call it. And that obviously was a huge play in the game. I do think the Chiefs, they gave everything they have. They just don't have much right now.

And one elephant in the room is Kelsey's old now. Now, granted, he was having a good game relative to what he's been in the regular season. but man, that play where the dude picks it off and takes it to midfield and they end up scoring was a crippling moment for a team. This is not the 2019, 2020, 2021 version. They cannot score against, let's face it, they're playing Vic Fangio, who's one of, if not the best defensive coordinator in the league, with just a really good defensive personnel, right? I mean, you see Jordan Davis looks, look how that guy physically looks fantastic. Obviously, Jalen Carter is one of the best players, you know, Vaughn, all their,

you know, defensive backs. Mitchell's a really good player. So that's a tough loss. I mean, that's pretty devastating because you threw everything you had. Your coaching was at a high level. Your quarterback was just trying to will his way. And you're just still not good enough, right? So you've had two straight weeks, right? You know, the Eagles are going to be one of the best teams in the league all season long. The Chargers, obviously, if Herbert's going to play at that level, they're going to be an awesome team. And you've lost two games, right? It gets really good teams. That's where it's like, You hope once these guys come back, rice off the suspension. You know, if Worthy, can get healthy, you're just going to have to win these games off guile and toughness.

But eventually you kind of run out of gas. Right. And Denver's got a better roster, but Denver gave that game away late today against the Indy. Three dumb penalties in the last 420. So again, you get a break in division and the Chargers probably beat the Raiders. So, you know, I still contend they're going to be a wildcard team in this division. They'll be fine. A game that was hard to watch, but I watched almost all of it, Detroit.

Detroit 52, Bears 21, outside of Roma, Dunzee for the Bears. Not much worked. You know, I was, and by the way, the Lions, they go for it. So not kicking field goals. That's just who they are. That's Dan Campbell. So you got to get over that Bears fan. But I got to tell you, I watched that game today. And after the first drive, take the first drive out, last couple of weeks, Bears have looked fine. It's a timing offense. And Caleb Williams, does not appear to see the field once he's off script, and it just becomes ad-libbing. It's backyard football. I don't think this is going to work. It's the second week in a row. The first series, again, they dial up, they got about eight to ten plays. It looks fine. It's very tight.

But how many plays can you script? And then they go off script, and he clearly, Caleb, doesn't see the field particularly well. And then he's flushed out of the pocket. He made six, seven, eight throws today rolling to his right. He just kind of threw it up for grabs. A couple were picked. A couple were caught. But, you know, I'm looking at my notes here.

And I just keep writing. They're ad-libbing. Again, ad-libbing. I mean, there's just nothing about it except Roma Dunzee. You'd feel good. By the way, Luther Burden, Missouri. Did he play? Did he suit up? Loveland, the kid from Michigan. Cortland, Loveland, or is it Loveland, Cortland? I forget.

The Michigan tied. He had no catches. So, I mean, like, they have weapons. They've drafted good players. They can't get them the ball. I think this thing could go sideways real fast. You know what I wrote down? I watched two documentaries in the last week, Billy Joel and Charlie Sheen. And whenever they get married, you could see the do. divorce coming from a mile away, especially with Charlie. And in this situation, I've been saying it from, it doesn't just speak for quarterbacks. In the NFL, you could be a talented player. And Caleb, to me, is a major question mark. But we have seen Hall of Fame guys get with the

wrong coordinator and it not work. Scheme is in basketball, whatever plays you're running, if I'm a great player, you're going to make it work and I'm not going anywhere. That's not the way football works. Then you factor in, like you said, there was a interception he threw today. It was classic USC. He rolls to his right. Hero Bowl throws an awful pick. It leads to a touchdown. I can't remember if it was 14-14 at the time or 21-14.

But it was one of those plays. They show Ben Johnson getting really mad. That cannot happen, right? Obviously, there are going to be plays where nothing's there. The Lions are going to be hard to beat at home. I like the Lions a lot today in this game. But I didn't expect to see 50 to 20 or whatever the final score was. But this is a marriage that is not meant to be.

Their styles do not mesh up. And we have seen time and time again that these coordinators with quarterbacks when I do not pick you. Here's the thing with Bo Nix, who threw a bad second half pick. He played an excellent first half. Sean Payton is tied to him. That's his guy. He loved him. There is a, like that power of when I draft you, when I believed in you from before you become an NFL player, is powerful.

That is not. Ben Johnson took this job, maybe intrigued by Caleb, but you see through two weeks his. His mannerisms on the sideline with his face. And this was an Iber flus game. I mean, this was pretty embarrassing. It's not all Caleb's fault. This was not like, he was worse last week. But this is not, this, the bears are a joke, Colin.

You and I've been talking. The organization, I wrote down Ryan Poles. Is this roster, the most overrated roster? We've heard in that last couple years. Listen, the lions are missing players from last year. And that looked like Georgia playing Cal Poly or something. It was crazy. It's funny. I remember before Caleb got drafted, a good friend of mine is Steve Kime.

And I said, you know, what do you make and jumping in the stands for Caleb Williams with his mom and crying and the fingernail polish? And Steve's not a real judgmental guy. And Steve was like, don't love it. He goes, you know, if a guy's talented, he's telling. He goes, but he's a very emotional player. And he goes, you know, and Steve has taught me this through the years, like, quarterback's one of those positions where you really need somebody that's even keel and puts out fires. Football is an incredibly emotional game. And as your teammates are getting emotional and the coaches are getting emotional, you know, when you're on, Tom Brady loved to celebrate.

But in the moment of a game, Tom was very even keel. And Caleb's a very, you can see his sideline demeanor. he plays with a ton of emotion and he gets really amped up. He also lose, I think sometimes Caleb loses confidence when I watch him. Like his accuracy is all over the map. So that feels like a confidence and mechanics issue. And I don't know. I just look at it and I think this is a, this coach wants a certain quarterback stylistically,

probably much more like Sean Payton, where you can augment the timing game with, I mean, Bo Nix and Sean, Bo moves, they move the pocket a lot for Bo Nix, as you should. But there's, I sat there today and my notes are all negative on Chicago. There was a couple plays a day in, and I'll take the L on Jalen Hertz, I never thought in a million years he would be a functional NFL quarterback, let alone a Super Bowl champion. and we can debate where he ranks or whatever, but there were a couple plays today where Spags brings the entire house. And he sits in there to the last second, and he throws his one-on-one matchup,

and he's going to get just Mollywopped. And one, he hit the Smith, and I think he missed another one. But it's just, this guy just kind of knows what he's doing. And he's an athletic ad lib in theory, but he can play in big spots. Caleb, when sometimes there's pressure, and there's nothing you can do, you got to kind of scramble. There are times where it's just like he's just taken off.

For years, Mark Slareth was one of the only guys saying, everyone acts like these offensive linemen in Seattle suck. Maybe some of it's Russell Wilson, right? And remember, he would just run into sacks. And you watch him today, when that head goes down and you just scramble into guys, that is quarterback 101 that the coaches hate, right? Head down and his head goes down and then he moves all the time. Like Mahomes, whether he misses or makes the throw, his head's always up moving around.

Jalen Hertz, head always. Even Kyler. Kyler's head is up. Now, he scrambles probably sometimes at the wrong time, but his head's up looking to throw. Caleb just looks in the ground, and then it becomes, there's no way this is sustainable.

Obviously, you start losing like this, but Ben Johnson's not going down with the ship with this guy. Why? Because Sean Payton will go down with Bo Nix, right? Andy Reid will go down with Mahomes. I'm not comparing those two situations, but my point is, I'm all in on this guy. You can't convince me after.

a couple weeks that Ben Johnson is going to be all in with this guy for 17 games. It's not possible. They're clearly the worst team in there. I mean, the Packers looks like a juggernaut. The Lions, turns out they're not as bad. Why? Because the Packers are really good. And we'll see how Minnesota looks tonight.

But clearly, Minnesota is just, they just beat the Bears. So, I mean, they're just a better operation. The Bears are in major trouble, go on. Yeah. And there's a reason in the preseason that Ben Johnson made a point. I mean, remember, we came on this podcast. and we said he was glowing with Tyson Bayesian. He's so smart.

Man, he's having a great camp. And about a week later, they signed him to a very big backup contract. I think Caleb gets one more start. And if it's ugly, can Ben come out and go listen? Caleb's going to be fine. You sell that to the media. But he needs a week off. He needs to get some stuff right.

we need to figure out a way to get this ship going. I could see one more start. I really could, and then you go to Tyson Bayesian. I would say you're crazy because once you bench him, you're done. But we just saw last year, who knows, I mean, Bryce Young is any good or not. I have my reservations at this point. But Panthers just did it, and he was the number one overall pick as well. So there's precedent in the league of like, hey, you can bench a guy, bring them back.

What are the bears going to do? Lose more games? I mean, what are we talking about at this point? So, I would say moving forward, everything's on the table. And if you're Ben Johnson, like, you clearly don't care about feelings. You know, the one thing I didn't quite realize, he's wired. You know, he's not like a loosey-goosey offensive coach, you know, like Kevin O'Connell, Sean McVeigh, always smiling. Like, he feels more like a Shanahan son, like kind of angry, never smiles.

Like this is just, it's way, I bet against it to jump from the jump. It's way uglier than I thought. And today was like a referendum. Not just on Caleb, the entire organization. I mean, Ryan Poles, the roster. I've watched Pennix. I would make a bet now that he can play. I've watched J.J. McCarthy to some degree, and it helps that he has Kevin O'Connell and

Brian Flores, but he'll be able to play. Bo Nix can play. Jaden's a star. Drake May doesn't have a ton of pocket presence. But again, today, he moves the chains. I don't think he's great. I think he needs another year. I mean, that's what they said about Drake May when he came in.

He is unrefined. But it is very possible from what I've seen, and it's not close. We're going to have five hits and one miss. And the number one guy is going to be the worst quarterback in the class. I think the thing with Caleb Williams, yeah, I mean, it's sure headed that way right now. I mean, he's a disaster. I don't care what stats you give me last year is I think when you have that great of an arm, and Caleb has a fantastic arm, I think sometimes you,

which is human nature, maybe you struggle to develop other parts of your game and the touch on his ball. To me, that's glaring. Like, he just has no touch on the ball. And he's one of those guys that feels like he really struggles to kind of throw a softball, a changeup. Because watching him play, did you realize he was this good of an athlete in college? I knew he could scramble around, but he moves really well. And he's in person when you see him, his head, his shoulders. he's six feet tall, he feels when you're around him like he's six four.

He is thick and powerful. And wasn't that the thing with young Russ Wilson? He's like, hey, he's got a huge arm, throws a great deep ball. But Russ had a lot of touch. And maybe it was that, was he a second baseman? Yeah. He had some feel to him. And you watch Caleb like, he could not play second base.

That ball would be Chuck Knoblock all over the place. And that to me is where you get the Ben Johnson stuff is like, well, a huge part of his offense in his entire scheme is touch place. Look at what look at Jared got off today. A lot of it it's I mean, he threw a couple bombs, but it's a lot of just get the ball out of your hands, a couple steps, throw it across the middle, hit guys in stride. Even if you miss a little bit, throw it behind, give him a catchable ball. Caleb throws some balls that even Randy Moss or you know, Jared Rice at their prime would have, would have a problem catching. Yeah, he rolls out a lot. I think you're the one point you made that I really agree with is.

is that he just puts his head down and he is now a running back. And then they're just, it's just not working. Again, Roma Dunzee is a very good player. But where's Luther Burden, this kid from Missouri? I mean, Colston Loveland, you know, the tight end from Michigan. Where are they? I mean, it's just you've got to use. I mean, I'm watching all these, Bo Nicks is getting everybody touches for the Denver Broncos.

Franklin, the Oregon kid, Mims, everybody's, the tight ends. I mean, he's spraying the ball around. Everybody's getting touches. I mean, in Chicago, it's like, if you're the GM, you've got to be watching this thing. Bro, these are good players. So I'm almost interested in watching Tyson Bayesian. I think offensively, I think they actually have some skill. And they're just not, they're not, Caleb's not equipped to get him the ball.

Well, look at, and I'm sure we'll talk about this game, is the thing that stood out to me, now whether they got lucky to win the game, we could probably argue all day long, Indianapolis Colts obviously in a perfect world you would get a star quarterback but if you just get me a point guard that can get me double digit assists even if he can't score

and Daniel Jones actually is playing pretty well this year but he's getting they got good players they got three or four wide receivers they got this top 10 or I guess he's the 15th because he went after level it was making plays all day they have a star running back and you're watching a guy just distribute

and you're like this team's pretty physically gifted on the skill position Right. But you didn't feel that with Anthony Richardson because balls are skipping. He's running. He's getting sacked. And Daniel Jones, just get it to the guys. Get it to the guys. They're just making plays. They were 10 for 10. They're their first 10 possessions this year. And to your point, their roster is excellent. I don't think Indie's a great team. But it's a prime example is they have a good roster and they're using every player on their roster offensively. Every single one is contributing. Hey, it's us to Jonas Brothers. And guess what? We have some big news.

What's the news? huge news. We created our own podcast called Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to our... We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's

extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. And... Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers.

This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys.

Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, Not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not. not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

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Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their

reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsSlice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. A little instant reaction on Baker Mayfield and the Buccaneers coming from behind.

On a game, they could have lost six different ways and sort of gutted it out. between the Colts and the Broncos yesterday and the Buccaneers and the Texans tonight, it shows you, you know, that's why when fans get worked up and this coach is a bum and this player's a bum, a lot of this stuff is coin flip. I mean, think about tonight. The Buccaneers have a punt block. They give up a huge return, but yet then Houston, the Texans, have a first and goal. and the Texans, it's easier for them to block a punt and get 20-yard gains from Nick Chub for a touchdown, then pick up two at the goal line. And so they just figured out, Baker gets the ball last, and, you know, huge scramble makes a play,

goes seven of nine for 65 yards on the final drive, and Tampa wins it. But Tampa had a disastrous special team's performance at various times. Amica, a great young receiver, dropped what should have been a huge play down the stretch. They struggled in past protection with Baker Mayfield. But the NFL mostly comes down to, in close games, who makes the big plays with under a minute 30 left? And Tampa did. Baker with a huge scramble, Baker with a couple of ropes, Bucky Irving breaking tackles on that run.

They just made their big plays the last time they got the football. The Texans made several big plays in the third quarter. So it's such a go-either-way league. But I was watching, neither quarterback, I mean, again, Texans are 0 and 2, Bucks 2 and O, and a lot of it is circumstantial. Tampa's just made big plays on the road against Atlanta, big plays against Houston, and Baker Mayfield is a big part of that. And I was thinking about this today, I was writing this down going into this game,

because I think C.J. Stroud and Baker Mayfield, both have gotten their teams. into the playoffs. Think about this. I'm going to name the quarterbacks right now that are capable of winning double-digit games or getting to the playoffs. Mahomes, Josh Allen, Lamar, Burrough, C.J. Stroud, Baker, Herbert, Gough, Hertz, Dax Stafford, Jordan Love, Kyler, Kailer, Gino Smith, Aaron, Rodgers, Sam Darnold, Bo Nix, Jaden, Daniels, Brock Purdy, Tua. Two has been a pro bowler. Trevor Lawrence, you know, he did get his team and won a playoff game. that's 21 quarterbacks in 32 teams. I'm not counting Mac Jones, Daniel Jones, or Russell Wilson, who had great games yesterday

when they have the right coach and the right fit. I'm not counting Michael Pennix or Cam Ward or Drake May, who I think are going to make it in this league. I'm not counting Caleb Williams or J.J. McCarthy, who I'm not sure of at this moment in time. Caleb's certainly talented enough. But total between all those quarterbacks, 28. So there's a lot of guys that can spit it in this league, but it comes down to, I mean,

Buccaneers go on the road, punts blocked, returns, surrendered, I mean, dropped passes, sacks, multiple sacks. Baker Mayfield was a pinata for a couple series, and they figure out how to win games. And it's just like the Denver Colts game. That's a go-either-way game. There's an iffy, sketchy call by the officials. Shane Stuyken does actually a portion. job coaching on that final drive.

He admits it after that he got too conservative, but they get an officiating break and they win. And by the way, they made a great interception on Bow Nicks in the fourth quarter. So the Colts also had several big plays offensively. Daniel Jones was humming at key moments in that game. But so much of this game, it's just coaching and quarterback play and who gets the ball last and who makes the last big play in a game. And I know you have, I think, you know, you think I don't like Baker Mayfield, but I do think the offensive coaching is the best it's ever been in my life.

And that's why you're seeing Gino Smith and Sam Darnold and Baker Mayfield and Mac Jones yesterday. That was the best game Mac Jones has ever played. Well, it's Kyle Shanahan. So the offensive coaching in this league is really spectacular right now. And what it allows is for quarterbacks who may fail in their first organization that eventually, Baker Mayfield goes to the Rams, and then he goes to Tampa Bay, and eventually he finds his way, and Sam Darnold goes to Caroline and the Jets. Then he goes to San Francisco, understands the system. Kevin O'Connell likes him. Now he's in Seattle, and he's going to win a lot more games than Seattle.

So eventually, the message is in the NFL, if you're talented enough, you will find a good offensive coach or a great situation. Tampa is perfect for Baker. You know, Tampa is a little bit of a pirate. ship and Ebor City and a little bit of a rebel and an outcast city. It can be a party town. It can be a retirement place. But it's always been with Jason Light, the GM. They've got tons of talent. They've always had talent. But until they got Tom Brady and then Baker, they couldn't get the quarterback right. You know, Brad Johnson won a Super Bowl, but it was a stacked roster. But Tampa's got players. They've won their division, what, two, three years in a row. and good GM, good quarterback play, and they've kind of now feel like they're in control of this division.

So I picked them to win this division. And, you know, it comes down to if you give me the best quarterback in a division, I like my chances to make it into the playoffs. But Kansas City with Mahomes is eventually probably going to get a Xavier worthy, healthy, Rishie Rice will come back. They'll figure out a way to win 10 games and get into the playoffs. They're too good defensively, too good of a coach, too good of a defensive coordinator. too talented. They'll figure out how to win 10 games. But, you know, as I watch this game, it could drive you sports better as crazy. I actually like Houston tonight. So, and I thought they had it with two huge specialty teams plays. They earned both of them, legitimate block punt, great

return. The referees picked up the flag, but Baker gets the ball last and has got all sorts of weapons in Tampa. Chris Godwin wasn't available. He's been banged up throughout his career. And so I get ready for Raiders and the Chargers tonight. You know, the other thing, I got a couple of texts after my show today from people in the National Football League in the front office. And they were agreeing with me on my take today about quarterbacks. Mike Sandel also wrote an article about this. Justin Fields is banged up again and Joe Burrow was banged up again.

It's not that they deserve to be hurt, but there is a skill to Brady and Eli Manning and certain NFL players staying healthy. Now, some guys like Josh Allen are just simply bigger and can take more or more durable. But even Big Ben and Cam Newton, who are huge men, like 65, 255, 65, 6,6, 265, Big Ben aged very quickly. Cam Newton aged overnight. Why? They took too many hits. And so Josh Allen similarly gets beat up. And I worry about that could age him. Now, he does have, have a great left tackle. They have now with James Cook developed a run game. And so they're not as reliant on. And they actually run more statistically. If you look at the data, then people would think with the bills. But some of this is just you've got to know your body.

You know, Baker Mayfield, who like tonight, you know, there's a couple times. Baker's a great quarterback if you give him two and a half seconds and let him plant his right foot. He throws a beautiful ball. For the record, so does C.J. Stroud. Baker throws a beautiful ball. When it breaks down, when Baker plays with so much confidence and so much emotion, when the pass blocking breaks down, sometimes Baker extends a play and shouldn't. And I think that's just, it's a little reckless, but I think that's his personality.

Baker is, you know, he's a fullback that plays quarterback. He's a linebacker that plays quarterback. He likes the physicality of the sport. But even as big and strong as Andrew Luck was, it just takes its toll. So I really do believe there is a skill. skill in this league to staying on the field. Eli Manning was the master of just letting go with the ball, getting rid of it.

And there's also players, think how big, strong and physical Anthony Richardson was for the Colts. But he couldn't get the pre-snap stuff down. He couldn't spot blitzes and would get just hammered two or three times a game. And despite his size, Anthony Richardson was dinged up a lot. Justin Fields is a big, athletic, twitchy athlete. He gets banged up a lot. So listen, the Bengals are a cheap organization that should spend more on the offensive line.

I mean, to me, I've always looked at it like your quarterback is your Bentley. The offensive line is the insurance policy. You wouldn't own a beautiful car without an insurance policy. So it's the most important unit on the field is protecting your asset, the franchise, the quarterback. Cincinnati can't figure that out. So it's just time and time again, you kind of roll your eyes at the Bengals. but some of it is on quarterbacks. Sometimes you've got to just let a play end and move on to the next play.

And it's very hard for guys like Baker Mayfield who are super hyper competitive. He's just trying to, he's squeezing every ounce of talent out of his frame. But Baker tonight just took some shots that he should not take. Because this team in Tampa has got a pretty good defensive front and have some nice weapons. But if Baker's not playing, they're not a playoff team. Baker is a huge, huge, the most important part of them dominating that division the last several years. And by the way, coaches also get second chances. Todd Bowles in New York didn't feel he quite, he wasn't quite ready to be a head coach. He's done a great job in Tampa. They always come with surprises, always make big plays. They just had a really bad night in special teams. But Tampa wins at 20 to 19. And that is the NFPA.

Look at the Buccaneers' first two games. They could be 0-1-2, they're 2-0. They got the quarterback, they made a couple of key situational plays, they have played completely imperfect football, and the Bucs are 2-0 with two very narrow wins. All right, Josh Pate joining us. He cuts through like nobody else with college football, obviously host of Josh Pate's college football show,

which is fantastic. So I got into this discussion the other day. I'm known as a USC Homer. And I lean into it because I think it's obnoxious and funny. But whatever. We all have our team or our region or whatever. And I was talking to a friend the other day who's a UCLA Bruin. And I said, I just don't think UCLA is a good job.

I think it's one of those where it sounds like it should be good. You're like, oh, there's a lot of money in Bel Air. but it's an international university. NIL punishes college football programs. You can be a top 10 college basketball program with about $4 million a year in college basketball. If you're not at 16 to 18, which is where USC's at now,

I mean, there's a reason USC's defensive front looks better. They bought a lot of it. So my take with UCLA is they are bottom half of the big, 10 in NIL. Because it's in Bel Air, Josh, you can't really, and it's a public university, your coaches have to drive 45 minutes or an hour to work. I don't think it's a good job. I do not think it's a good job. If I was an agent, I would not send my best clients there. I don't think it has a huge brand. You tell me, you live in Nashville. I spent eight, nine years

in Los Angeles. I don't think it's a good. I don't think it's a good. I don't think it's a good. I don't a good, I don't think it's a top 30 college football job. I would go further. I don't think it's top 45. Like, you're talking about multiple G5 jobs that are better than UCLA. And I, when we say that, by the way, I know people who don't live in this world and who don't immerse themselves in it, they, they almost think you have an ax to grind, like you just talked about. Oh, that's USC homerism. Well, dude, I grew up in Harris County, Georgia, so I got no dog in this fight. I'm just telling you what I perceive, but I could be wrong. So then you ask. ask around and you ask, forget agents.

Yeah, of course, agents are echoing that to me. Colin, I just go to coaches. When I see a coach's name and they're running for these jobs, I'll just go to the coach. And I'll ask him and they'll usually shoot straight with you. And I just think probably even I've been a little taken back by how many people who in a previous lifetime we would look at at the job they're at. And you would think, oh, it's a slam dunk. Yeah, if he can get the UCLA job, he's going to take it that in the modern day.

look at it and say, dude, there's no way. And we're not just talking about head coaches. Like I'm telling you, there are coordinators out there. There are pretty high-level coordinators out there that would not leave where they are right now for the UCLA job. And you mentioned its bottom half of the Big Ten, well, that's in a vacuum. So yes, it's bottom half of Big Ten and vacuum. But then, like you said, when you factor in, hey, if you take the Indiana job, I mean, you could do like Signity and blow it up. But even if it's not what Signity has made it.

You're going to live in Bloomington, Indiana, very affordable. So you're asking me to go take a bottom half job. You're going asking me to be distant second in my own town. You're asking me to be second on my own campus when it comes to the athletic department. You're asking me to take over a place where the NIL infrastructure is really discombobulated. They're not fractionally as put together in football as they are for basketball there. And you're asking me, by the way, to compete with superpower programs like Oregon and Ohio State and Penn State and Michigan, there's just, I don't have much good to say about it. I wish I was wrong. I wish you were

wrong. We're not. Yeah, I mean, I, and the football stadiums 45 minutes off campus. I think there was a time when you could, you could get away. There was a time when it was Terry Donahue and then Dick for meal and it would get on ABC and it was part of the Pact 12. And there was something to be said about you're playing in the Rose Bowl and the weather was cold everywhere else. And now you're like, oh, it's warm in UCLA. Like, I could see a quarterback or wide receivers. And they do put guys in the NFL. But I think there was a moment when Chip Kelly said, I'd rather go be a coordinator

in a Big Ten school than the coach of UCLA. And to me, it's like, oh, that's the tipping point. Because Chip knows, you know, Chip, Chip, Chip's coached in Oregon. He's coached at the NFL. He's like, no, yeah. And I know Chip. Chip was at my 60th birthday party. Chip likes L.A.

Chip and his wife love L.A. It's not that. He's not an outsider. So, you know, it's funny. I said years ago I felt this. I don't feel it anymore. I said years ago, I thought the Texas job, I said, take away the top three quarterbacks in the NFL. Whoever has those, and they're in their prime, those are the best football jobs in America. Kansas City, Buffalo, Baltimore, you know, Those are the best jobs. You have an NFL pension. Your coaches don't leave. You don't have to recruit players. But I always said fourth is Texas. And as we talk about what kind of job it is, I always think like Texas is the best college job, Ohio State, Georgia, then we can argue. Like Notre Dame, there's an academic umbrella.

It's kind of, you know, it's in the middle of nowhere. It's, you know, it's small. It's private. bad weather. I mean, my wife wouldn't be overjoyed to move to South Bend, Indiana, like all things consider. If I said to you, top five jobs, I want you to consider pressure, pay, conference, geographic location. Remember, Oregon, you know is an outsider.

If you don't have a lot of players in your state, you generally don't have a good program. Phil Knight changes that. California changes it. If I said to you, top five programs, all things considered, where are you? going to think I'm joking with you, but Kentucky football would be the job that I would want to take. Mark Stoops makes close to $10 million a year. The goal there is to win seven games. You can be there forever. He's got a massive buyout. And unlike a lot of these other guys, he is the only place where you blend SEC pay scale without SEC pressure. I can't believe

people don't look at Mark Stoops and say, that guy figured it out. Now, if you do want to compete for a national championship, the answer is the University of Georgia. Georgia has long been that. And I remember when Saban was at Alabama and everyone would look at Saban and is he going to go to Texas. But I remember someone saying, no, forget Sabin to Texas. Like, yeah, if he were to take that job, it would suck for Alabama. But he'd do probably the same thing at Texas. I don't think you could dominate much more than Sabin did at Alabama.

But what people kept saying was you need to be paying attention to what. happens with Georgia. This was like the Mark Ricked Georgia era. Yeah. Georgia for a long time, I grew up there for a long time. Georgia like good was the enemy of great and they were just good. It was pretty good. It was kind of good. Yeah. And there was this, there was this like nether region. They were never bad enough for a firing to happen. They were never good enough to win a title. And the rest of the SEC was so happy with Georgia being like that. And finally it got to a tipping point. I really think Saban and to an extent Urban Meyer turned the heat up in the SEC enough to where Georgia made a move. And then Georgia went and got Nick Saban's guy and Kirby Smart.

And the day they hired Smart, there's no guarantees in this world. But I thought to myself, if that is the guy that can replicate Sabin's model or come roughly close to it, if you take those ingredients and you throw them in Athens, Georgia, I just thought it was a powder keg, the likes of which in a generation prior to me being born, they used to talk about Florida. You read the books, you listen to the interviews, you read the Paul Bear Bryant quotes when he was at Bama of hoping no one ever figures out Florida. Because if anyone ever figured out the University of Florida, then they'd be a monster to deal with. So Kentucky, if I don't want to win a title, Georgia, if I do want to win a title, would be my two answers. Well, I'm fired up to announce Hard Rock Bet as the volumes new presenting sponsor.

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Payable and bonus bets, not a cash offer. Offered by the Seminole tribe of Florida in Florida. Offered by Seminole Hard Rock Digital LLC and Alder States. Must be 21 plus and physically present in Arizona, Colorado, Florida, Virginia to play. Terms and conditions apply. Conserved about gambling in Florida. Call 18888. Admit it. In Indiana, if you or somebody you know has a problem, wants help. Call 1-800-9 with it. Gambling problem. Call 1-8-9 with it. Gambling problem. Call 1-800 gambler, Arizona, Colorado, Illinois, New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee, Virginia. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, name? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember.

I think it was on a call about what we should call. it and well we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas brothers was this is how you guys remember it going down yes I have a very different memory of this we were talking about a thing a bit for the podcast people could call in and say hey Jonas and then I wrote down on my little notepad hey Jonas and offered it up as a potential title oh but thanks for remembering that guys listen to hey Jonas on the iHeart radio app Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and

friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque.

Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect. We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness.

So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee. And this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levin this went to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know.

Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I like Brian Kelly. I've said, I remember when Urban melted down with the media in Florida, and I've seen it. College basketball coaches do it. And I've said, you know, you don't see it in the NFL much because you're in a big city. The media is tough everywhere.

And you also have an owner above you that you don't want to embarrass the franchise. But in college football, the coach is often the highest paid state employee. You can really control practice. The media is small town. So you get into kind of this kind of power vacuum where you kind of are the biggest guy in the state. And you kind of get into your ego. And Brian was got very tribal and protective. And it, you know, he doesn't have a natty.

It took him a while to get it rolling. There was the incident where the student died on campus. Like there's a lot of stuff here with Brian Kelly. He's not always the most likable. There was the fake Southern accent or whatever it is. But I still contend that I don't know if he has the relentless recruiting energy he used to. I like Brian Kelly, but I found the media historically plays favorites. For years, they were tough on Harbaugh.

And I'd be like, guys, he got to a Super Bowl. I know how bad Stanford was. He can coach. Take a deep breath. I think Brian Kelly is a top 12 coach. Am I misguided? Nobody yet buys him in the SEC because LSU's been, when they have the right coach, they're great. I don't know.

What are you, if you had to grade him at LSU, where would you be? About a B minus, B minus to B. I think, look, first off, I love BK as well. So he's never rubbed me the wrong way. I mean, I've gotten along great with him. I think that he walked in there, like I told you 20 minutes ago, and there has always been a very, very unique connection culturally, just the fabric of Louisiana and LSU football that I don't think you can fully appreciate it unless you've been down there for a long time. That's right. I totally agree.

And he walked in, and his attitude, frankly, I can't blame him for having, because I think I would have been the same way if I were him. I would have walked in and said, basically, I'm Brian Kelly. I know what I'm doing. I know what the formula to win is. And contrary to what you people think, the formula to win in South Bend is the same as it is here. Get good players, develop them by into the process we define around here and we'll win. And I think he heard about Louisiana this, Louisiana that to the point where he almost wanted to prove a point. And when I tell you, he flushed Louisiana out of that building, I mean some people that it wouldn't have mattered whether they stayed or went.

Desk receptionist. Oh, you're from Tibadoe, bye. So he flushed that place of Louisiana. Now, it wouldn't have mattered if they won immediately. But they didn't. And because they didn't internally and culturally down there, that's been held over his head. Now, on Saturdays, they're fully behind him. In recruiting weekends, they're fully behind him.

But there are a lot of people that haven't I told you so attitude towards Brian Kelly, his own state because he did that. Well, organizationally, university-wise, they course corrected collectively. I don't really think that decision was entirely on his plate. if you get what I'm saying. Right. You know, you bring Blake Baker down there as your defensive coordinator. You bring Austin Thomas in as your GM.

These are people, you cut them open and it's purple and gold. And not only that, they're the best in the world, some of the best in the world at what they do. And it's no coincidence that LSU, you all of a sudden feel it. You can sense it. You could have sensed it. Their defense looks like big boy defense. Like, I mean, that was the thing last year. They were atrocious.

So to me, I never worried about. Brian's offenses. I think he'll always figure those. He's rough on quarterbacks. But LSU's defense is like Georgia. When you got the right coach, it's just all NFL players. It's 11 guys who will eventually play on Sunday. Yeah, which was shocking that you have Jaden Daniels there a couple years ago. And if you told me LSU was going to have a Heisman Trophy caliber quarterback come through, I'd just blindly say national championship. Tell me who the coach is. I mean, I'm rolling out a top 25 defense if my mom's the DC there, as long as you're keeping in-state kids in state. So for that to have failed them was mind-boggling. It's just like Mario not being able to stop anything last year at Miami

with Cam Ward. It's crazy. So it's funny that we've talked about this because I feel there's a very, very, like closely correlated story that's been told over the past few years in college football about Brian Kelly and Lincoln Riley. Ironically, the whispers were initially, oh, Lincoln may take the LSU job. Well, then he winds up at USC. So then LSU goes and gets Brian Kelly, and they both had the wrong defensive coordinators at the outset. And then they both corrected. And now they're both massively improved defensively. I just feel like the story arc is headed for a playoff matchup one day. I just feel like I get USC LSU one day. But I do agree with you. And it's, I don't think it's something that will really be appreciated by them unless he wins a national championship there,

because everybody else this millennium has who's been the head coach at LSU. Yeah, I mean, listen, Ed Orgeron, who's a very funny guy. I love Ed. Does not consider a schematic, you know, kingpin of the sport. He's a recruiter. I mean, for years, I thought he was more of a position coach, like a line coach, than even a coordinator, broke his heart when he didn't get the USC job. And I would argue today that LSU team with Burrough is the most talented I've ever seen.

Period. End of story. I mean, they had the hardest schedule, won every game. So if Ed can do it, and that's not a knock. I mean, Ed would be the first to admit, Ed never scheduled a bad time. Ed was a distracted, funny, great guy. But I think Brian's too good of a coach. The older I get, I tend to just look at people.

And if I have to hire somebody or something at the volume, hire smart people, they'll figure it out is my rule. And I think Brian, it took him a while. I mean, it just, it took a while. He couldn't get the accent down. But eventually, I think three years in, like, I feel like they figured it out. Yeah, they're one of the teams I'm looking most forward to watching here. The SEC is just going to be a bloodbath by the end of this thing. And they're, they're one that, you know, the Clemson game goes the way it does. I was actually glad this week. He publicized the Garrett Nussmeyer injury because it's kind of been whispered about in the South that Nussmeyer, had injury leading up to that week one game against Clemson, like an abdominal thing.

Never got publicized. And they go and win on the road. And then they were very lackluster in week two against an inferior opponent. And then week three, Lagway turns the ball over five times and LSU wins 20 to 10. And you can clearly tell, hey, we're undefeated. Something feels a little off offensively. Right. Well, your quarterback's been hurt.

That's what's been off. Here's the thing, though. There are teams with healthy quarterbacks that are one and two right now. and you're a 3-0, that's the surest sign that the defense is fixed. The volume. Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe.

I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts.

We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Winning on Clay is an art.

The rallies are relentless. And at the French Open, only the toughest survive. I'd know. I competed there for decades. Join me, Renee Stubbs, on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast for no-nonsense breakdowns of the biggest matches, the toughest players, and the moments that define Roland Garris. She's an outsider to win the French fame. And she likes Clay.

Listen, Lennarabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcasts on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHart Women's Sports. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened.

That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source the athletes themselves. Their locker room stories,

their reactions in the moment and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to SportsSlic on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slicalif 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. This is an IHart podcast. Guaranteed human.