The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Colin Cowherd Podcast Prime Cuts - Eagles Manhandle Chiefs In Super Bowl, Luka To The Lakers, Jets DUMP Aaron Rodgers

Episode Date: February 15, 2025

Colin’s top takes of the week! First, he’s joined by John Middlekauff, host of “3 and Out” to break down the Eagles crushing the Chiefs in the Super Bowl! They begin with the Eagles absolutely dominating the Chiefs in the trenches on both sides of the ball (3:15) and why this Eagles team isn’t going ANYWHERE because they’re so talented and well run (11:00). Finally, they react to the news that the Jets are dumping Aaron Rodgers because the new coach didn’t want his personality in the building as they try to reboot (16:30). Then he's joined by Jason Timpf, host of “Hoops Tonight” to talk about all things NBA! They start with Luka Doncic making his debut with the Lakers and why his presence has reinvigorated the team and given the Lakers offense the juice to compete in the postseason (28:30)). They examine all the potential western conference teams that could create problems for the Lakers in the playoffs and why the Lakers should be able to compete with all of them (32:30). Colin calls the Spurs the team he wouldn’t want to face in the playoffs despite having a record that wouldn’t qualify them for the play-in (37:00), and they discuss why Jimmy Butler being the “anti-Wiggins” has proven to be a perfect fit for the Warriors (39:00). Finally, they try to solve the Knicks inability to beat the Celtics (42:30).  Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates!  #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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I put it on my sandwiches. I put it on my pizzas. I love that. All right. Well, between the Luca trade and the Chiefs getting humiliated, I did not have that as a two-team parlay. You know, I was thinking about this. Listen, the Chiefs are going to be fine.

They knew they were going to probably draft an offensive tackle in the first round, and there's plenty of them. But it's interesting, Brady's three Super Bowl losses, the point differential was minus 15. He could have literally run. the table. Mahomes, it's minus 53 with two Super Bowl losses. He'll be three and two in Super Bowls. But I do think I would say this. Again, Philadelphia, we both said they have the better roster. It's just hard to go against Andy Reid on two weeks and Mahomes, who never loses close games.

I did not think it would be this. But I do think, you know, one of the things I was thinking in the first half is that, you know, Brady would always generate something. He was just so good pre-snap. And it was a little, you know, listen, I know Philadelphia's defense is dynamic. And, you know, we didn't think Kansas City would run much on them. But were you a little disappointed that they couldn't generate six and seven yard throws. They couldn't max protect. It was like they weren't moving off their game plan. Yeah, I thought they were overwhelmed at levels in which you just don't.

don't see good teams overwhelmed to the line of scrimmage. Because it wasn't just edge pressures. It was interior pressures. I mean, Mahomes was under siege. They had, I think, seven yards after the first quarter, Colin, or excuse me, 19 yards on seven plays. That's because they got a first down on the first play from scrimmage. And then they essentially went three and out, three and out. So I just thought the defensive line, remember two years ago when the Eagles were in the Super Bowl,

they led the league in sacks. And they had an excellent defensive line. I don't think this defensive line was looked as good as that one because it wasn't productive, top to bottom. But the way they played tonight, I mean, that's as well as you can play. And I don't know what you can do when your defensive tackles are doing that. Well, when your defensive ends are doing that. I mean, the chiefs do have a guard playing left tackle. Right.

Well, 10 quarterback hits, six sacks, zero blitzes. I mean, think about that. And, you know, as I was watching this game with Philadelphia, I kept thinking about this. You know, for years and years when Peyton Manning was in your division or Brady was, it affected how people in the division drafted. You watch Philadelphia's D&O lines. And if you're the Rams or the Lions or San Francisco or Dallas, don't you watch this game and think, Jesus, I'm the Rams.

I'm like, you know, corner or defensive tackle in the third round. Like it was so dominating that it makes me think all the rivals of the Eagles have to look at this and think, you know, we've got to get better in the lines or we're not going to compete with this team for years. Yeah, I mean, that's to me, Howie and Andy has done this too. And the two Super Bowls they've lost, their offensive line has just let him down in those games. I mean, the Tampa situation, remember, they were missing two tackles. And tonight they just got overwhelmed. But it's not just Jalen Carter tonight, right? I mean, Brandon Graham does everything to come back off a torn shoulder or elbow.

Sweat was incredible. Milton Williams has that play destroying. He was a third round pick years ago. He's about to be a free agent. He's going to get a ton of money. And to me, the offensive line for the Eagles, How about the difference when they would go back and forth? The Chiefs would punt and then the Eagles would come back and you'd be like,

well, they're just not generating any pressure. Jalen's sitting back there having a hot dog. He's having some gumbo in the backfield. Just who's open? Who's not? I'll just scramble. Where Mahomes, within a second, he's moving around, scrambling left and right. And yeah, I just think the offensive line and defensive line for the Eagles tonight

and really all season down the stretch once they, remember they started slow like two and two. and then since then they were the best team in football. And tonight they dominated. They absolutely dominated this game. Yeah, I mean, before tonight, Kansas City had won the last nine playoff games where they did not score first, where they trailed. But in those games, I mean, it was really interesting. Even early in the game, my first take after the first three drives for each team is it's one thing if you make mistakes. if you're nervous. I'm like, Jesus,

Philadelphia is not even adding edge pressure. They're just putting their four guys out there and they can't block them. You know, as I look at over my notes, only three minutes time of possession in the first quarter. I think we forget, we've been spoiled, John. We've had, first of all, it was a great season. The quarterback play has never been better. A lot of people that were watching, our podcast right now or in their 20s and 30s. This is what Super Bowls looked like in the late 70s and 80s and 1990. I can remember the Giants beating Denver 3920 and then San Francisco beating Denver 55 to 10. And Denver got beat by Washington, 42 to 10. And then the Raiders hammered a couple of teams. You go back to the 80s right now. Google it if you're listening to

us and you're watching at home. This is what Super Bowls looked like. I mean, there was a decade. People was talking about the 70s NBA where there were no great teams. The 80s NFL were very few great Super Bowls. So we were on a run. We've had so many good Kansas City Buffalo games or Buffalo games. We've just been so lucky in the AFC with Mahomes and Allen and Lamar. But there was a run in college football with Alabama. This is what the title games were looking like. The Bama Notre Dame. This is what Super Bowls looked like. So we hadn't had, I mean, I thought the Celtics Mavericks was a lobsided mess. But this was, this is one of those where I think it resonates beyond the game.

I think you look at Philadelphia and they're going to have an impact on the draft and free agency. People will feel like in the NFC, you cannot compete with this roster for the next two to three years if you just don't get better up front. Well, I also think it's pretty rare in, you know, in football, right? The coaches are such stars where in basketball and baseball, the executives can be pretty big names. You know, in basketball, GMs are a really big deal. Listen, I've known Brett Veech for, I don't know, 15 plus years. Brett Vee's a stud. And he's well known.

I mean, he should be. He's been to five Super Bowls. He won three of them. But Howie is kind of the guy that serves the drink with the Eagles. He is much closer to someone in baseball or basketball where he's the boss. You know, when they need a coordinators, he's going after Vic Fangio. And I'm not trying to take anything away from Siriani. Clearly the guys, you know, they beat to his drum.

Like he gets them going from a inspirational standpoint, and he's good with the players. But he doesn't call plays or anything. He's a younger guy. It's pretty rare to see a CEO head coach in his early 40s. But the talent on that team and the offseason moves. I mean, Colin, they signed a one-year $4 million Beckton, who was fantastic guard.

They got Zach Bonn, immediate all pro, and they got Seekwon Barkley, who had one of the better seasons of the history of the league. So, I mean, it's remarkable. Howie Roseman became a Hall of Famer tonight. He's won two Super Bowls with two different coaches and two different quarterbacks. Listen, I don't want to overreact to the game, but in this instance, John, it's hard not to overreact. I mean, I'm watching the Celtics drum the Knicks last night, and I'm like,

this Celtics team has so much depth. I'm not trying to overreact, but when they won the finals last year, you're like, they're like significantly better than every team in the league. and I watched them last night, and I'm like, I'm not overreact. Boston's going to win it again. They're just better than everybody. And I'm watching Philadelphia here, and I'm like, yeah, this team's not going anywhere because it would be one thing if the quarterback was cocky or if they had a bunch of free agents or they didn't draft well.

John, seven of their best players are like in year one or two. Well, think about it. They just won the Super Bowl. In two of the better players in franchise history, Jason Kelsey and Fletcher Cox had retired this year. So you know what hit me tonight is remember when Fangio and the Miami Dolphins like got a divorce and then Howie hires him 24 hours later in the Dolphins. He was just too mean.

He was too demanding. It's like, guys, this is football and this is defensive football. I got news for you. The guy knows what he's doing. And the one thing we've seen with Vic, with Jim Harbaugh, the one year when they was he was with the Nagy and the Bears and they traded for Khalil Mack. and then this year with a look you give him talent it is on because one thing you and i talked about is like his record against andy reed but it's like well really if you siphon those teams out he

did not have good teams in denver so nothing of the caliber of talent that he was rolling into this super bowl with i mean collins the when you have one good unit you could have a good defense right when all four of you or three of your levels of defense are good their defensive line is outstanding. The linebackers, they have an all-pro linebacker in Bond who had a pick tonight. And then all their DBs are good. You know, I mean, CJ will hit. Cooper DeGine and Mitchell, the rookie corners are excellent. And Slay is still a solid player. So they're good at every single level of the defense. And they have one of the best defensive coordinators in the league. Like he's, he can't win it because he's a coach. But if you told me they gave the Super Bowl MVP

to Vic Fangio, because the game was, it felt like over pretty early on because defensively, The Eagles were, I don't remember the 85 bears, but I would have bad, they smothered them. And it was like, have they even made it past midfield? And then finally, Burkhart's like, they have not crossed midfield yet. And they're like, it didn't feel like it. You know, John, one of the many reasons the NFL is king. And you and I are both football guys, I do love the NBA playoffs. And I love March Madness.

And I love a good golf major. And I love the World Cup. And by the way, last year, I love baseball playoffs last year. I thought they were just fan. Oh, I thought the National League playoffs were insanely good. But one of the reasons that the NFL continues to have such a visceral connection with this is college football. And the Eagles are an advertisement for get the draft right. And this is why you and I are draft guys.

And I've told my friends this for years is you can't buy your way to a championship. All the bad GMs in football overspend. in free agency. Where in the NBA, if the Lakers get Luca, you're like in a big trade at the trade deadline. You're like, wow, the Eagles are just an advertisement for you start nailing multiple drafts. That's why you can go get A.J. Brown.

That's why you can pay Sequin and A.J. Brown. Because you just keep nailing draft pick after draft pick. Like the Rams are in a spot now. They'll keep Stafford. But they've hit on like six straight defensive draft picks. If they have another good draft, it's like, okay, then you get to the point where you can just go buy elite players. Yeah, I mean, I've mentioned this to you, and I think it's been well documented, once they missed on Jalen Rager for Justin Jefferson, they had an internal meeting that what are we doing over thinking this?

We're going to take the best players from the best program. So when you listed all those players, that was a lot of Alabama and Georgia in that list of players. and it paid dividends. I mean, it paid big time dividends because, you know, from Jalen Carter to Devante Smith to Landon Dickerson to this year was somewhat unique with Mitchell and Cooper DeGine, but Mitchell is a good example of a guy like Ashton Genty this year with Boise. He could have got a million dollars and gone to Alabama, Georgia, Ohio State. But he chose to stay at his program.

That's why he was, I think Tulane or Toledo. I think he might have been Toledo. And Cooper Gene was Iowa, which is one of the better defenses in the league. But they're not drafting little school guys anymore. They've been burned. You know, Carson, I think, you know, that situation. Then obviously the Jalen Rager over Justin Jefferson at the time was the COVID draft. And remember the Minnesota Vikings were on the clock next and they go to the video of Spielman.

And he's laughing him and Zimmer because they couldn't believe that they didn't just take Justin Jefferson. And that scarred Howie. And Howie's come back swinging. I mean, to go to two Super Bowls in three years, and let's face it, this was a lot different team than two years ago, right? Kelsey's gone, Fletcher Cox gone. So they had to kind of reshape the squad with some impact players. And they did it with, you know, Jurgens and Landa Dickerson inside and Abecton.

But to me, Jalen Carter, who, you know, tonight's not going to be his greatest performance, but what he's meant to him this year. He was sick all week. He's a dominant, dominant impact player. Jordan Schultz and then Jay Glazer reported the Jets moved off Aaron Rogers. So for the second time in a couple of years, a team, as Aaron flew out to New York thinking, positively, optimistically it would happen. They moved off him.

I think the Colts and the Raiders work. I think Chip Kelly, they have two tackles. They have a center. They have two good tight ends. They need a running back in a receiver. I think the Raiders works for Aaron Rogers. He'd take that over the Colts and Shane Steichen. But, you know, Peyton Manning and Tom Brady late in their careers leave and have some success.

Brett Farved it as well, got to an NFC championship, a throw from the Super Bowl. Are you surprised that it was just two years of nothing and the second team bailed on him? I'm not, but are you? You know, this new culture coming in. You know, Aaron Glenn's a former high-level player. Yes. So it's like, do I want to deal with some old aging? You know, what's the hardest thing to deal with sometimes in pro sports, an aging former superstar, especially one that's a little different.

You know, Peyton Manning that last year. Remember Kubiak and Elway had to sit him down and, like, it was difficult. You took a pay cut. These are tough conversations. But I think it was pretty clear that the Johnson family was over this guy about two months left to go in the season. I wonder if part of the interviews was like, Aaron's done here. Which most of these new code, who cares? Like it's not like, okay, fine. I don't need him anyway. I think the question now is, is he even tradable? Because he's on the books for this year.

His cash, you know, his cap hits $23 million. I honestly think they'd probably have to cut him. Yeah, I wonder if anyone would even trade for him. So it's not, I think they'll, they just cut him. Yeah. You cut them and then someone signs them for $10 million. I mean, is he, is that what he's getting? It's kind of a unique

Because if you think about it, Rathusberger's arm gave out on him It was clear, but he just ends as a Steeler Manning's arm doesn't work Wins the Super Bowl, but then no one would reese on him Breeze's arm started going and it just ended Is he really just going to go play Like, what if the Titans outbid that

And they give him 12 million The Raiders are only willing to give him So he's going to finish his career on the Titans Because I do think it wouldn't just be those two I think a lot of teams would be interested just to try to get their franchise. You know, these owners, give them a little oomph. If you've got some caps base,

I'll give Aaron Rodgers $15 million. If you're the Titans, why wouldn't you pay him? Yeah, he has a house in Nashville. I mean, let's say, listen, we'll give you two years. You got a house in Nashville. It's an easy division. And then you have that number one pick. You could trade down, get a bunch of players around him.

It's just interesting. I was told that Aaron Glenn, for the people that didn't hear my pre-superbub Super Bowl 15-minute rant, I was told by somebody I trust that Aaron Glenn, coming from a really strong culture in Detroit, wants to mimic that, right? Duplicate that in New York, and he didn't want Aaron Rogers, the player or the person in the room. And they'll say all the right stuff. But in the end, I mean, Green Bay caught him off guard. The Jets kind of caught him off guard. Aaron has that disease of has to be the smartest guy in the room. I'm going to do my own homework on

internet. And, you know, I think in the end, Aaron, I mean, I could write chapters in a book on things I've heard from people that have been around him. He's a really moody guy. You can get good Aaron or bad Aaron. But in the end, he's just not good enough now. He's probably the 15th best quarterback in the league. He's just not good enough for the BS you deal with. Like, like, he's not early to the locker room. He's not optimistic. Like, Brady to the end, I mean, was just like high energy, high optimism, high standards. I'm not sure Aaron loves the game. I think, you know how you ever work with somebody or you have somebody in your family and they're like, I work hard and you're like, dude, hard work is 65 hours a week, not 42. I think Aaron says he loves the game.

I don't see it. I don't, I don't see that just unbridled, like just relentless passion for it. I think I think Aaron thinks he loves the game, but he doesn't love it. He doesn't love it. doesn't love it the way the guys that I see it in pro sports love it. I think it'll be very telling that when they cut him, if he's only getting seven, eight, ten million dollar off, he doesn't need the money, right? He's worth hundreds of millions of dollars at this point in time. It was clear he did not want to get hit last year. Don't blame him. He's 40 years old. Right. So is he going to go play for some of these teams, you know, P. Carroll calls, the Titans call. Like, yeah, this might not go well again, right? The one thing

Aaron Rogers has a good feel for, you know, most of his career is what a good team looks like. So this could be really, like, you go sign up for one of these teams. Best case scenario might be like seven wins. And you, you know, struggled to stay hurt last year on a roster that's going to be

better more than likely than one of these teams interested in you. So I wonder if he gets to the point where it's like, am I really going to do a one year for eight, nine, ten million dollars? Yeah. I don't think you will. The Jets this year paying him $35 million. If someone was willing to pay him that, I think he would for sure play.

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of on a train to nowhere. And it was like AD was a great defensive player, bit hit and miss offensively, good, not consistent like the great offensive scores. I think he's been the last two years the best defensive player in the league. I like Austin Reeves. if he's the three or the four. LeBron having an insane year, but he's going to take some nights off. And if he does take nights off, or AD does,

then Austin Reeves because you're your second option. That's not good enough. And then I'm watching them last night, and I'm like, well, Lucas missed a lot of time, so he's not taking time off. It's almost like LeBron is going to try to impress Luca. He's not going to take his many nights off. And now I've got Austin Reeves as a third on virtually every night.

Rui can always hit the corner shot. Dalton Connect, you keep him. He creates space. And I'm watching last night, and I'm like, God, there's so much younger and more fun to watch. Like, I got to a place where I really respected them. But I just thought, this is, there's not enough. I don't know.

I know, they don't have a rim protector. Jackson Hayes, again, Alleyup guy, fun, energy. It's weird how just inserting Luca into it, the whole team feels younger and different. Does it feel like that to you? No, absolutely. I mean, I hated this Laker team at the start of the year. They had this personality,

this like, I don't care about the work that was driving me crazy. But over the course of the last, like month, they'd been playing a really likable and fun brand of basketball. Bronn was playing super well. Austin was playing super well. Before AD got hurt, he had a couple of monster games. Oh, he was great. He played really well.

20 a night, yeah. But I felt like they, weren't good enough on either end of the floor to really do what you need to do to win four playoff rounds. And I've been really keyed in on this concept lately. Like, if you're going to win the title, you have to be able to do something well enough that it really gives people problems. Like, where teams can't even match up with it for one reason or another. And the Lakers just didn't have that punch on either end of the floor. Even with LeBron and AD, it's not the defensive team. It was back in 2020. Right. Yeah. So they didn't have that punch. With Luca, one of the unique things he does,

this Laker team has a lot of guys who are good offensive players, as long as they're set up well. Even with LeBron and Austin, one of the reasons why they struggled against defenses that did a lot of switching all year long is LeBron's 40. And it's hard to get him to just get downhill time and time again in a random regular season game in January or December. Or Austin, not an elite athlete in terms of getting past top tier NBA talent.

And Anthony Davis obviously has offensive limitations. but once you bring Luca in, he just has this magical ability to get the ball to the basket. He's so big and he's so strong and he's so good to change of pace and he's so good at getting guys sealed on his shoulder, sealed on his backside.

He can get downhill. And now he's spraying out to all these guys and they're actually all really good offensive players when they have an advantage. Like Rui shoots 53% on unguarded catch and shoot threes. But you need to get him unguarded catch and shoot threes. Luca can do that.

And one of the biggest things that it's allowed is it's allowed LeBron James, like, have you ever watched a guy say like, oh, LeBron should drive to the basket every time? Yeah, it sounds great, but it's really exhausting to do that, especially at his age. Now LeBron, when he gets his touches, can be super physically aggressive because he knows he has Luca to carry the lion's share of the offensive load. And so now when I look at this situation, yeah, they have defensive question marks and we can get into that here in a minute, but I try not to overthink it. This team is going to be basically impossible to guard. And so they have a unit now, their offense, that presents legitimate problems for every single team in the league. That is a foundation you can

build on. Yeah. And remember, Dallas won the West last year, and their two best players are below average suboptimal defensive players, Kyrie and Luca, is that, let's be honest about the West. Denver has Yokic, but they're atrocious defensively. Houston's young can't shoot. And I don't think they translate to a playoff team. I think they're just one of those teams that they are so young and twitchy and athletic in the regular season. If you're not well rested, if you don't have a lot of tape time, they're a tough match. If I get to play them seven times, they can't shoot. There's a team like that every year. Every year there's that team. Yeah. So all of a sudden, Denver can't defend, Houston can't shoot. Oklahoma City, I don't trust Chet Hungren's health. I think they're the best team.

Golden State doesn't have enough offensive firepower, very step-reliant, even with Jimmy Butler. You know, Memphis is, Memphis plays with a lot of pace, and there are a lot of fun to watch. I don't trust them. You know, said this before, they're just teams like Philadelphia in the playoffs. I don't trust them. Memphis in the playoffs. I don't trust them. I know Sharon Jackson.

I know John Morant. I get it. So if you look at the West, OKC is clearly the best team. They have the most kind of diversity of options. They have so many different players. and they're really good and really young. They're what I think Utah wants to be in about three years with all those draft picks. But the Lakers are an exceptional offensive team.

And if you're giving me, it's also a team. LeBron clearly likes Austin Reeves. He likes to play with him. It's obvious. LeBron's like a 15-year-old with a crush on Luca the way he plays the energy. And I just think they're so good offensively that there's no way. that's complete enough in the West to roll them. Boston would, but Boston's got, you know, Boston's been playing these guys. You know, I watched them the other night against New York. Jesus, they're good.

God, they're good. So my take is if you put them in the East, I don't think they can, I don't think they can beat Boston. I think they're a Western Conference Finals team, and I'm not trying to be an L.A. Homer. Yeah, I'm with you. Every team below, to me, OKC, Denver and the Lakers are the clear top three in the West. And Denver and like you were talking earlier about the young feisty athletic team. Memphis used to be that team. That's right. Houston's that team now.

There's always a team like that. And that team always wins a lot of regular season games and it loses in the first two rounds. It's just that's what happens. And let's just put it this way. Who are you picking in a playoff series? Fred Van Vleet and Jalen Green or one of these duos from the top of the conference, right? So like I'm with you on that. To me, Denver and the Lakers are both closer to OKC than people realize just because OKC is also,

super young and athletic and has a ton of energy for the regular season. The question marks that you talked about in terms of the Lakers with the defense, that's where it gets interesting because the Lakers were playing some pretty damn good basketball before Luka joined the squad there. In their last 13 games, they have the best record in the league, and they have the number one defense in the league. The Lakers do, the number one defense for about a month now. Now, there's a reason for that.

Jared Vanderbilt is healthy. He is an excellent defensive player, and you turn DeAngelo Russell, a bad defensive player into Dorian Finney Smith, who's a good defensive player. And then a huge part of that is part of that excitement from LeBron has manifested and he's playing a lot of defense this year. And he's been very good on that end of the floor. But if you take a player out of that lineup and you insert Luca, you're not going to be as good defensively.

That's just acknowledging reality. So when Luca's in this picture full time, you're not going to be as good defensively as you've been in the last month. But we've seen an NBA history like with Denver. Denver in 2023, they were not an elite defense. No. But they had bad defenders on the court who did a job and did it well. That's right. And they were anchored by good defenders, Contavius Caldwell, Pope, Aaron Gordon, Bruce Brown. They had guys who did compete on defense. They did the hard jobs. And then they created easier jobs. That's the thing. You can imagine a scenario where you've got Luca LeBron Austin,

but you have Dorian, Finney Smith, and Vando out there. This is going to be a, small ball team, Colin. Alex Len hasn't played 1,000 minutes since 2019. LeBron's played 1,600 just this year. Like Alex Len, he's not going to come in there and save the season. So this is a small ball team, but you can imagine a universe where LeBron's playing defense, you've got two professional defenders in the lineup, and what if they just score every time or get a great shot every single time? A team that I think, and I don't know historically if this happens, I'll tell you the team in the West that I would not. want to play. And right now, they're not even a playing team. Keep your eye in San Antonio.

Okay. Stefan Castle out of Yukon is no fun to defend. That guy is this time next year, we're going to have different conversations. Deerrin Fox, I think because he plays in Sacramento, you don't realize it. He's a 25 point a night score with a high IQ. He's so good. We just don't watch him. Stefan Castle, Wembe. Deeran Fox You know, guys that get lost but I don't know

his EPA. Yeah, I don't know what all the numbers are but like Harrison Barnes, you know, it's this guy that Harrison's one of those players that like Shane Batti,

you're like, I think he's really good and he ends up making your team better but nobody wants to talk about it. I think San Antonio, if you told me they went on, like right now

they're not a playing team, I think they're going to go in, Popovich is going to steal a game in a series. Houston's the team we all think's going to be dangerous. I don't. San Antonio, the team, nobody's paying attention to.

I mean, can you imagine Lakers end up, you know, Denver ends up playing them. And Wembe neutralizes Yokic to some degree and castles a pain and gets the whistle. I mean, listen, Denver, you can score on Denver. Like, they're just not good. They're not effective at all. So I think the West is really fun. And I thought the NBA had a tremendous 14-day period. I thought Jimmy Butler, you know, it's funny about this, Jason, is that I know the analytic people think Wiggins may be a better fit with Steph than Jimmy Butler.

I read an article on that. But my take is Jimmy Butler is the anti-Wiggins. He's tough. He's a badass. He's physical. He's ordinary. And he's a really good number two. It's like in baseball.

It's when you try to make a 201, your pitching staff's not good. Jimmy's an excellent two behind Steph, and he's the opposite of Steph. He's tough physically. He's a mid-range guy. He'll defend you. I don't think Golden State's a championship team, but I just thought between Luca, between Deerrin Fox to San Antonio, between Jimmy Butler of the Warriors, I just thought the West got really, and we've talked about this.

The West has been better than the East for 25 years. A lot of it's just better GMs. And I thought the West had a great 14 days. Yeah, they completely flipped the conference over in a bunch of different ways. I liked what you said about San Antonio, like we were talking earlier about, like, having a problem that other teams can't solve. Victor's a problem around the rim that other teams can't solve. And then the Deer and Fox as a two-man game partner with Wembe is a problem that teams can't solve. The Jimmy Butler thing, it was amazing to me how many people overthought this.

And when I was watching the Bucks game last night and I saw Jimmy, Butler constantly operating in the middle of the floor as kind of like a hub out of the attention that Steph would gather. It reminded me of when we'd watch the warriors back in their heyday, where it's like everyone talks about shooting. But when it comes to the warriors with Steph, you don't actually want shooting as much as you want playmaking. Because what happens is is Steph gets two to the ball. As soon as Steph gets two to the ball, it's a four on three. And it becomes more about quick processing and decision making and guys being in the right spots to get dunks and maybe a wide open corner three for a certain player out of that sequence

to pay it off, then it is about like with LeBron or a rim pressuring guy where you want spacing, you want shooting that pulls guys further away from the rim. Steph inverts your spacing in that way. It actually reminded me a lot of Andre Guadala. Remember when Andre Guadala was there, he was never a great shooter, but he constantly greased the wheels for them because he was a rangerie Ford who could screen and operate in the middle of the floor, make quick decisions, new when to cut, new one to relocate, do all those sorts of things. There was a play in the Bucks game last night where Steph took a ball screen from Jimmy. Steph got two.

He dropped it to Jimmy and Jimmy made a little ball fake to Buddy healed and then dropped it off to Draymond Green for an easy layup underneath the basket. And I literally just watched this and I'm like, this just works. You weren't comfortable with Wiggins as a processor in the middle of the floor. You are comfortable with Jimmy. Simple stat. How many times has Jimmy or how many times as Andrew Wiggins had seven plus assists in a basketball game in his NBA career? 14. How many times did Jimmy have seven plus assists last year with the heat?

15. So like it's an entirely different stratosphere of playmaking talent that you plugged in there. You have a guy that can quickly process those situations. And they've been killing teams, Colin, so far, obviously small sample. They've been really good with Jimmy on the floor with Steph off, which is all that really matters. That's the key. I mean, I watched them two weeks ago. when Steph left the floor, not only were the inefficient, they were unwatchable. They were a bad tell. I said this, make the move to be a better TV product.

You're terrible. Well, and like Pat Spencer, like the lacrosse story, it's really cool. He probably shouldn't be your like secondary ball handler in a Thursday night national TV game against the Lakers when steps off the floor. Like that's an issue. But I'm with you. Like I don't see the Warriors necessarily as a substantial threat. To me, what's cool about it is we get to watch Steph play. meaningful basketball again.

Because I do think they're going to get out of the playing tournament. I do think they're going to end up getting at least a first round series, and that team's just going to be fun to watch. I think the NBA has always been better when the Knicks are relevant. In between Bacale Bridges, Jalen Brunson, Kat, Josh Hart, OG. It's a really good basketball team. But they do not match up with the Celtics. And this is where you're really good.

I mean, I've watched them play the Celtics twice, and that shit's not competitive. Like, it does not work. Now, it's almost like the Celtics have circumvented the NBA CBA. The NBA, CBA, they don't want you to have like five really good players. And it's almost like the Celtics figured out a way to be the last team that can have a roster that you're not supposed to have anymore where Derek White's your fifth best guy some night. And now they're trying to sell the team. So someone else has to pay for it.

Yeah. Yeah. Like, it's like they're almost circumventing the new CBA. Like this is not really fair. And you can tell. So I think New York's a really good basketball team. And I think I trust them in the playoffs. I think they're smart.

I think they've got, you know, it's well chronicled. They're kind of got a Villanova feel. They play hard. They're smart. I think they're one of those teams that'll be a better playoff team than a regular season team. And they're a good regular season team. There are teams like Houston, I think, are a better regular season team than a

playoff team. The next are going to be fine. But I watch them now twice play Boston. And I want you to break it down because they don't match up. And this is a good team. Let's just be honest about this. They got five to six guys in that rotation. The Knicks can match up with almost every team in the league.

Why is Boston? And you can tell Boston, like when they played this past week, that's a national TV game. They're like, okay, all right, guys. I mean, that thing was, I mean, four minutes in, you're like, yeah, yeah, Boston came to play. Boston's not effing around. Why doesn't know you? because I think New York has enough different players and they play hard enough

and they're really smart and they're well coach. They kind of match up with everybody. They do not match up with Boston. Like, what is it? So there are two kind of prevailing theories in NBA offense right now, which is like matchup hunting versus like running motion. And the motion is like what you see with the Warriors.

There's tons of screens. Guys are running in circles all over the floor. Boston's like, where's your weakest defender? Let's get them up here. Let's play some basketball. And like, that's literally all they do. And when I watched that game, the way they surgically attacked Jalen Brunson and Carl Anthony Towns every single time down the floor, they'd get them both in. They'd bring the ball up the floor.

They'd have Jalen Brunson's man come screen for Tatum. Okay, now Jalen Brunson's on Tatum. Okay, now we're going to get Kat into the action. So now it's like Tatum and one of his teammates attacking Kat and Brunson in the same action. And there's just nothing they can do about it. The Knicks are really, really good. They can score whenever they want. they get out in transition like crazy.

They've got all of these good players that are super bought into their roles. Fun to watch. Fun to watch. They're super fun to watch. And they have beat the shit out of some good teams this year. Yep. But every time I've watched them against Boston, it's the exact same issue. We are going to get Carl Anthony Towns in space and make him guard and just get right past him and then spray out and get great shots and beat you.

It's actually kind of funny, Colin, because you can tell that they really want to beat the Knicks. Because the Celtics have played some pretty bad basketball in the middle of the season. where they're not deliberate and where they do take bad shots and they settle and they don't do the things they need to do. They see the Knicks and they like snap back to the playoffs last year and they just get surgical in the way that they pick on those guys. But it really just comes down to they go at New York's worst defenders every single time and then they play driving kick out of it to get great shots. And that really is the issue. And then Jalen Brunson, he just has this wall of athletic bigger defender every single possession as they go.

down to the other end. It's like, here's Jalen Brown, here's Drew Holiday, here's Derek White. He's just, it's such a difficult job for him to consistently break down that Boston defense because they just have so many different defenders they can put on him. Yeah, it's interesting to say that because I really like the dexterity of the Knicks. I think they're a matchup problem. Carl Anthony Towns is offensively gifted. He's shooting threes like right now, like the best he's ever. I mean, he's really shooting the ball well. He's quirky. I've seen him play live four times and there will be halves, you're like, is he a top 10 player in the league? Like, he can destroy people. He can embarrass people. And then in the second half, you'll be like, did he take a sweepade?

Did he have a Therafluid half? Like, what happened? But it is interesting. You break it. And I'm so glad for our audience listening, Jason is so good at this. And that's why I just foisted it up to him is when I watched them play twice as Celtics, and it shit is not competitive. They just do not match up at all. The volume. Hey guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe.

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