The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Colin Cowherd Podcast Prime Cuts - Jayden Daniels A Top 5 QB? NBA MVP Debate, Where Will Aaron Rodgers Land?

Episode Date: March 15, 2025

Colin’s top takes of the week! First, he’s joined by Jason Timpf, host of “Hoops Tonight” to break down all things NBA! They discuss whether Luka Doncic could end up being a defensive liability, or whether the move to LA could motivate and rejuvenate him after questions of his physical fitness were a major part of the Mavericks moving him (2:45).  They break down why Jayson Tatum will never be a true “face of the league” due to both his personality and his lack of one true A+ trait on the court (7:00). They debate whether Nikola Jokic or SGA is more deserving of the MVP award and Colin argues that SGA has been more valuable despite Jokic being more productive (12:45).  They marvel at the Warriors resurgence after the Jimmy Butler trade and try to identify who the toughest opponent would be for Golden State in the postseason (19:00) Then, Colin’s joined by Danny Parkins, host of “Breakfast Ball” on FS1! They start by discussing the constant back and forth of Aaron Rodgers trying to decide between the Steelers and Giants and debate the pros and cons of each destination (32:00).  They try to predict who the most “interesting” teams will be in the 2025 season. Colin lands on the Bears, Chiefs, Packers, and Patriots. Danny offers Colin some pushback on his picks and highlights the Commanders as the most interesting team (39:00) Finally, they discuss whether Jayden Daniels can make the jump to a top 5 quarterback in the league and win the NFC (46:30).  (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates!  #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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The volume. All right, busy NBA docket, a lot to talk about. Jason Temf, host of Hoops Tonight. You know, it's funny. I saw a piece of video. So I had said on the Luca trade, I would never have traded him. But if you gave me three firsts, A.D. and Austin. rivers, I'd sleep on it. And I said that because I've always said Luke is a much better Carmelo.

I never think he's in great shape. I don't know. I think he sometimes takes the ball a lot of teammates' hands. And, you know, I don't think, and I love Luca. But I saw when Luca first arrived in Los Angeles, he looked puffy, hadn't played since December. He's never been in great shape. But my take was L.A. get you in better shape. The lifestyle's different. And LeBron and the pressure, you know, to kind of impress LeBron. You can see Steph's showing off with Jimmy Butler.

LeBron's kind of showing off with Luke. I mean, it's it's ego. It's fun. You finally got your match. And the players, I mean, God, Steph is more efficient. LeBron's playing with an energy of a 27-year-old. So, but somebody pointed this out to me yesterday because I watched the entire game. They said, look at the energy of Jason Tate. him on both ends of the floor. And Luca has bad stretches like right now. Like he has these four or five minute or longer moments on the floor and you're like, bro, you're just, you're a negative right now.

Like you're just getting beat off the ball. And do you think this is something Luca, because you're not in your head, you're seeing it too. Does Luca play himself in a better shape? Or did Dallas, with their concerns about these consistent calf injuries, about not being in shape, and lifestyle. Do you think we're getting 80% in Los Angeles of Luca? That some of the videos on the internet that show him three years ago, dude, he was he was tomahawking it. And you're like, not really quite what I see now. What is your take on where Luca's at and where he'll end up as a Laker? So that's a tough game for under any circumstances to go on the road in Boston, a Boston team that's had some disappointing losses at home this

year. Yeah. And was kind of itching for, they were itching for a signature win. Like the Celtics really wanted that one. I mean, you could tell the level of intensity they brought right from the opening tip. It's a tough game under any circumstances. Luca is not yet back into his peak shape.

It's going to take a little while to get there. I actually think it'll be somewhat, there's a little bit of a blessing in disguise with the LeBron injury because LeBron has been going full bore since like mid-January. and it was kind of inevitable that there'd be some sort of nagging thing that would arise over the course of this stretch. And I actually think it'll be pretty nice for LeBron to get like a month off here, a couple weeks off here, just to take a little break before the postseason.

That'll get more time for Luca to really lean into usage, to really lean into having the ball in his hands and build his rhythm back. That said, like, this goes back to the Dallas series. The Dallas series is a different type of challenge, the Dallas-Boston series in the finals. It was a different type of challenge because Boston had all sorts of of dudes that they could help off of. They were putting Chrisops Porzingis onto PJ and Derek Jones Jr. and leaving him under the basket. The Lakers will be able to create more

space for him, but he wasn't even getting past Jalen Brown for the most part last night. Like, just one-on-one, Jalen Brown had him in clamps and was bringing a ton of physicality. And like, there's this kind of recurring theme I've seen O. G. Ninobe did a little bit on Thursday night. I don't know if you caught the Knicks game. It was kind of a little bit similar in that game, all the way back to the second round series with Oklahoma City last year. Lou Dort gave Luca some issues. Lucas struggles with the really big and strong forwards

that can guard. And so there's a little mini challenge here. If the Lakers are going to be able to defeat a team like Boston in the finals, Luca's going to have to overcome the Jalen Brown problem. But as far as the big picture goes, he's 25 years old. He's playing alongside one of the greatest work ethic dudes you're going to meet in the league,

one of the greatest take care of your body type of dudes that you see in the league. I think Luca is going to get to a level of better conditioning. That said, I don't think he's going to be the dude who had like 17 dunks in his rookie year. I think that shit might have sailed. You know, I say this often on the show, that there's a real gap in what fans view is hate and what I view is contextualization. So every time I talk about Jason Tatum, I always say, he's great, he's a great player. He's a top eight player in the league.

I don't believe he's top three. I trust SGA offensively more. I trust Yokuch is all around better. I trust Janus defensively more. I think Luca at his best is a better, more natural offensive player. Hell, if you gave me one quarter to win it all, game seven, I'd take LeBron over Jason Tatum. I actually would. But he's a great player. He's going to have a Hall of Famer. He's a nice kid. But I've said this. There are games where I'm like, where is he? Is he on the floor? Now, this was not one of them. He was terrific. And I've watched them now play live three or four times. I get to the arena early. He's the first guy on the floor. But it is interesting. People get very upset about this. And I've said this.

In the Olympics, when you're playing with the world's best players, he was a coach's decision, do not play against Serbia. He had two in the gold medal game. And that LeBron and Steph flourished in those games. So there are players that sometimes when are around great players, LeBron was like this very early in his first Olympics. He was like, finally, it opened up more of LeBron.

And then there are players that actually love playing within a system. I think Jason is one of those players. I think his, God, his DNA is he's a teammate. You know, he likes being part of a collective. He chose Duke so he could play with other great players, right? Like Shoshchevsky makes you play defense. He was there with, you know, Grace and Allen, Luke Kinnard, if I'm remembering right. So my take is, I think he's a star.

I think the NBA's only ever had three true faces of the league. Magic, Michael, LeBron. I think Byrd was a reluctant because he was conjoined with magic. He was facing the league, but magic was the face of the league. He loved it. You know, French lick Indiana, pimples on the face. Grumpy Larry Bird didn't feel face of the league. But, you know, you join him at the hip with magic.

And it's like, okay. And Shaq and Kobe, I think you could argue as a pair were face of the league for several years. Duncan never was. Akeem never was. Carl Malone never was. So what do you make of kind of my criticism of Tatum? It's not a criticism. It's more like, listen, at any one time, the NBA has two faces or one face of the league,

two global stars, and about 15 other stars. Carmelo Anthony guys. Is that unrealistic to say? No, I mean, I heard your rant about Jason Tatum. And frankly, like, there is truth to the fact that Tatum lacks, like, the traditional NBA aura, right? Like, he's a good dunker, but he's not Vince Carter. He's a good shooter, but he's not Kevin Durant. He's big and strong, but he's not LeBron. He's a good playmaker, but he's not Luca Donchich. He's a good defender, but he's not what Kawhi Leonard was in his prime. And he doesn't

really have a very big personality. So like, it's really hard to like put together, you know, something specific about Jason Tatum to like market really well as far as like, face of the league type of stuff. That said, like, he's really good at all of those things. Yes. And so he's become, like, just by virtue of him being a jack of all trades, he's become one of the most useful players in the entire NBA. This has kind of been the interesting trajectory of Jason Tatum's career.

If you go back in the early years, like 18, 19, 20, in those years, Tatum was like projected to be one of the best shooting forwards in the league. He had some unbelievable jump shooting seasons during that stretch. Then what happened was is he started to bulk up and he got really big and strong and it greatly improved his defensive versatility. He improved as a playmaker. But in that stretch, 2021, 2021, 22, 23, 24, his jump shot fell apart and became super unreliable to the point where it was like sometimes it goes in, sometimes it doesn't.

They all 50 in a playoff game, he'll have 17 in a playoff game. You know, like it became one of those things where he couldn't rely on the jump shot. Honestly, I think the Team USA situation right off of the heels of last year's playoff run, as he shot very poorly in the playoffs on jump shots, and then he shot, what, Ofer 16 with Team USA? I think he got humiliated and spent the entire summer in the gym. And he's added, like, a reliable jump shot to the Swiss Army knife that he already was. And now it's one of those things where, like, I agree with you.

I think Yokic is better. I think Yonis is better. I think Shay's better. I think Luca Donchich is better. I think if you asked like league average role players alongside all those players, I think Tatum is behind those guys. But I do think he's closer to that tier or in that tier at the bottom, as opposed to the next set of guys.

Like when you look at the next set of guys, like I think Tatum brings more a night and night out basis than Anthony Davis does. I think Tatum brings more in a night in night out basis than that next tier of guys, Kevin Durant, LeBron James, Steph, I think he deserves credit for being like a foundational, like reliable, you can count on this dude type of superstar. But I also think everything you said regarding he does not have a flashpoint in his skill set. There's nothing like that. Well, think about that.

You can close your eyes. I've said this. And I can think of like five Michael plays, six LeBron plays, a bunch of magic bird. You close your eyes with Tatum and you're like, it's like Carl Malone. I don't have a Carl Malone play. I don't have a Duncan play. There is something about the persona, the aura, the imagery that is face of the league. Okay, so I watch most of the Nuggets Thunder game.

I missed the first quarter, but Shea went off for 40. Of course, this week, Yolkich had a 30, 20, 20, 20 plus game, right? I think it was the first time ever in league history to somebody to do that. So I love Yokic. I thought he should have won three straight. M. Bede was sort of gifted one. But I'll tell you why I would give it to SGA. I'd give it to Shea.

So I've said this on many occasions. Words matter. You can get in trouble for the wrong word, but you have to watch the words. It's most valuable. Now, production is a huge component to value, right? Like, valuable is, I mean, I always say this. Moms are usually the most valuable person in a house. Dad may make more.

The kids may have a brighter future. Mom's the MVP. She's the glue. And she's super productive, right? Like, at least in my house, mom was the most valuable player. Dad, my dad was the local optometrist. He paid the bills. So, Yokic, you can argue, is more productive, okay?

But he's playing with Gordon, Porter, Jamal, Murray, and a coach that's got a ring, thanks to Yokic. SGA, and this is about 15% of it, is a better defender. SGA plays with a roster that is so young. It only averages one year older than the Auburn Tigers roster. So he is playing with kids, and that matters. They're still figuring out how to play basketball, not to mention Chet Hogan, you know, has been out for a while. I mean, you can argue outside of shade, nobody else on that roster, none of their best offensive players have even hit their prime yet.

So, and that's one of the reasons I worry about them in the playoffs, winning big road games with this young roster. So based on the fact that his production isn't Yokic, but it's damn good. He's a better defender. He's carrying a younger roster and didn't have homeworm for a spell. I would narrowly give Shea the MVP. What say you? So I actually think Shea has a decent size lead. Let's just get to the foundational piece of the case.

He's 12 games ahead of Denver in the standings. 12. That matters too. That's an enormous gap between those two teams. And so when you start to make a case for Yokic, it needs to be overwhelming. And there are some things with Yokish that I think are realities. I think Yokic is a better basketball player than Shay Gildes-Alexin. I think Denver would fall apart more than OKC would fall apart if the two players were removed.

But that's never been the way that we've given MVP. It's never been sheer value in a vacuum. It's never been who's the guy that we think is the best player for a 16-win playoff run, right? That's never been the way we've done it. It's always been a combination of a bunch of factors, team success, your individual value, like your reputation in the league. There's always been a narrative element. That's regardless of how we want to pretend like it should be factored in, it does get factored

in. There's narrative. There's momentum. There's all of that kind of stuff. It's kind of like the Yokic 30-2020 game. It's like, here we are two-thirds of the way through the season. Yokic puts together a stat line that's never happened in NBA. history, hey, let's revisit this thing, even though the Thunder have been consistently a better

basketball team this year. I think two things. One, Shea's having a much better offensive season than people are giving him credit for. You mentioned the youth. The youth for the Thunder manifests an inconsistency. J-Dubb is an incredible player. He is what, 22 or he's young. He's super inconsistent. Chet, incredible player. He's young. He's going to make mistakes. He's not a guy the super dependable night and night out. He shot 20-something percent from three in the series against Dallas last year. Shea is the grown-up in the room. Shea is the night-to-night guy.

So many of these games break down for the Thunder against good teams in particular. So many of these games break down where it looks like every single Thunder player is uncomfortable and a little bit like a little bit like kind of shying away from the moment. And Shea has to grab the reins and like control things. And like as Chet's been out of the lineup a bunch of. this year as J-dub has had a down-shooting season and he's coming on as of late, but he's had a down-shooting season. Shea's been carrying him through that. Shea has been the guy that has lifted their elite defense to the point where they can win games. And so I think he deserves

more credit than that. The second piece of it is a reality with Denver. Denver has lost a lot of games this year because they can't guard. Oh, at all. And Yokic, for the record, in the 23 postseason had a very good playoff run defensively. He is capable of having good moments on defense. However, there's a simple reality with Yokic that causes a lot of problems for Denver's defense. He cannot switch onto perimeter players and he can't play on his heels back at the rim because guys just jump right over him and go around him. That forces Yokic to come out to the level of ball screens and put two on the ball. So Denver persistently exists in rotation. They persistently exist in four on threes. That's how the Sun score on them so easily. That's how the Lakers scored on

them so easily. That is the problem that they consistently run into is Yokic has to come up to the level. When he comes up to the level, it's a simple pocket pass or skip pass, and they're playing four on three out of it. And they just haven't been very good defensively this year on the backline rotating out of it. And so they just haven't been as good. Their defense is bad. Yokh is a significant part of that. I think that gets factored into this debate. And so when I really look at it in the big picture, there's not enough for Yokic, even though I think he's having an unbelievable season, arguably the best offensive season ever. But if you look at it, it's not enough to justify that 12-game gap in the standings. And then to tie things up,

She just dropped 40 on him today as they got to win. Yeah, yeah. No, I think we're on the same page. I thought a month before it happened, I said, Warriors, just get Jimmy Butler. I don't care what analytics say. Steph is sleepwalking. And I remember saying Butler's the anti-Wiggins. Like every possession is intentional, totally intense. Everything's a street fight. I always thought Wiggins was talented, a little passive.

You know, you didn't know possession of possession if he was engaged. I think we talked about this last time. So I thought Butler would be a big help. It is amazing. There were 11 and 2 since Jimmy Butler arrived. What's interesting now, if you start looking at their playoff position, they could end up against Houston, which I think is the dream scenario for Golden State because Houston can't shoot. Like, that's the team you want to play, a young team that struggles shooting. You can beat Golden State. You know, they don't have a ton of offensive firepower from the perimeter outside of Steph, pods a little bit. But when you watch the war, Warriors, it's really interesting. Oklahoma City, again, is a tremendous defensive team, but I don't trust them OKC in a big road playoff game. They're too young.

I think Golden State has a lower ceiling, but an incredibly high floor. And I think outside of maybe a Cleveland, Boston, could go seven games with almost anybody. Is there a team, let's just look ahead, is there a team the Warriors would not want to face in the West and the playoffs that you just don't think it's a good matchup at all. Oh, that's an interesting question. Because Dallas, if healthy, would be tough with Gafford, lively, AD. They're center rotations, great. They're a big team.

And I could see that team slowing it down and being just a handful for the Warriors. But I think they're going to go into a soft tank here and just keep everybody out. I don't think it's a terrible idea. So Minnesota, if they had the Twin Towers, you know, if they had Cat and Gobert could be problematic. But I sort of look at the West. I'm like, I don't know. Is there a team? I think they're going to get out of the plan. It's been really fascinating just how immediately good they've been.

And it's been kind of like a kind of a proof of concept for me about roster balance. Just like no matter what you're doing, if you ever ask somebody to do too much, they're going to be inefficient. They're going to start making mistakes. and there were so many role players for that team that were being asked to do so much more than they're doing now because there was no Jimmy. And Jimmy's come in and just like crystallize everyone's roles and everyone just has consistent minutes in the rotation now

and everything's coming together for them. They're going to get out of the plane, in my opinion. If that's the case, it's the team that I would want to face if I was Golden State is a team that they can load up on defensively. And so I think a team like Denver, if they got the 6-3 matchup against a team like Denver, that'd be good.

Memphis is another team like that that is a poor spot-up team that they could load the paint up on. The other thing I like we talked about earlier with being able to bring Yokic up to the level, Steph is that guy. Steph is the guy that will consistently get Denver's defense into rotation. And now they have Jimmy Butler to be the guy that kind of helps pay off those sequences as he's been so good in the middle of the floor this year. I think, yeah, I would lean towards if I was, the problem with the Lakers is LeBron and Luca will just hunt their small guards all day long.

space. And I think that that could be a problem for them. And the Laker defense, like we talked about earlier, is keyed up on the ability to help off of people. And there are a couple guys for Golden State that they feel like they can help off of. So I think Denver, if they got into that six spot, I'd be looking at if Denver slipped to the three as a potential matchup that they could upset. Houston and Memphis to me are both getable. I look at it as, I don't know about how you feel Colin, but I think there's a five-team inner circle. I think it's Boston and Cleveland out east. I think it's OKC, Denver, and the Lakers out west. I think those five teams are the, like if those five teams are the teams that have substantial

chances to win the championship. Behind that, all of those teams, I think, are pretty heavily flawed. Golden State has been really good since the Jimmy Butler trade, but they've played a relatively light schedule. So I'd like to see a little bit more before I decide where they kind of fit into all of this. Like the Lakers, before they beat, before they lost to Boston, they beat 14 straight, five, 500 or better teams.

That's how good the Lakers were playing before that Celtics game. I'm not going to bail on them because they flew across the country after a bunch of a brutal schedule and lost the game. And missing two of their longest players. Yeah. Two vitally important starters. They're vertical spacer and Jackson Hates. Like how often did you see Jared Vanderbilt catch the ball under the basket yesterday

with no idea what to do because he can't finish over anybody? But like that's the thing. Like I kind of have a feeling that the Lakers are one of the inner circle teams because I've just seen them be so good for so long against so many good teams. I want to see a little bit more from Golden State because I do think they can enter into that group, but I just want to see a little bit more from them. But I think between Denver and L.A., I'd want to play Denver if I was then. Who's scoring big in the NBA this season?

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Bonus bets expire, 168 hours after issuance. Four additional terms and respond. responsible gaming resources, see dkng.com slash audio. Danny Parkins, co-host breakfast ball, the winner of the mythical FS1 NFL picks championship. It should be noted. It's just like the USA Today High School Basketball Championship. It's all mythical, so let's not go crazy on this shit. Listen, it is definitely true that I only made it a competition between you, me, and Nick,

once I started to crush it and distance myself on the field. Yeah. So, you know, going into next year, if I start four and nine, you know, it's just luck. But when I'm crushing it, it's skill and you guys are in a competition. You didn't even know you had entered. Yeah, I had no idea. Yeah. So I thought it was interesting today where Adam Schaefter was almost annoyed with Aaron Rogers,

where he came out and said, Pick a team. So I said this on the air today. If you ever tell a corporation, listen, I need more time, I'll get back to you. You have to have the self-awareness to know how that lands to the corporation, especially if you're in a valuable position. It's a big, F you're literally going back thinking, ugh, what a what a prima donna. And I usually tend to think really smart people have excellent self-awareness.

And I wonder sometimes with Aaron, is he the rare smart dude, doesn't read the room well? I mean, he goes on this darkness retreat in Green Bay and then is shocked when they're like, take a hike. Like, how can you be shot? But here's the thing with Rogers, and there's a lot of it. Do we, he talks a lot, but do we believe? leave anything he says. Like, what do you mean? He said he didn't have cell service.

Like, he's like, oh, and I, like, you live in Malibu in like a $25 million house. You have cell service. Like, it was just, I think that he has a lot of narcissism to him. And he's like, I love the silence. And then he brought a film crew. Like, what do you? These things are just in conflict with each other. I just, you know what I mean?

I think that he. is a, so I don't know that he knows exactly what he wants. And I think he loves attention. And I think that he, he told Mark Schlereth and Stink has told the story publicly. He did like a week 16 or 17 Jets game. And he stinks said that they talked for almost 30 minutes. 20 something was about the running game because Sting's insane. And he was like five or 10 minutes was about his future. And he's like, Aaron told me point blank, like, I'm only going to keep playing of the situation. is perfect. Well, now, apparently, it's down to the Steelers and the Giants. Imperfect. Imperfect. Now, at least the Steelers, to me, makes perfect sense. That one makes perfect

sense. He loves Mike Tomlin. Mike Tomlin, apparently, it's impossible for this guy to have a losing season. Mason Rudolph, Kenny Pickett, Mitch Trubisky, Duck Hodges. It doesn't matter. It's impossible for this guy to have a losing season. So obviously you're hyper-relevant. The fans care. You'll look good in the iconic jersey. You'll get to play against Joe Burrow. You'll play against Lamar Jackson.

The AFC North plays the NFC North this year. So the Steelers host the Packers. They go to Chicago. Aaron will eat that shit up. To me, that makes sense. He can have an expectation of playing in a playoff game and maybe winning a playoff game that Tomlin hasn't done since 2016. They're not going to win a Super Bowl.

But that makes sense. If he comes back and he plays for the Giants, it's just pure vanity. It's just pure. I want to... Okay, so I'm going to argue, because this was a discussion today on our show. And I said, because I've moved so many times that I get a yellow pat out,

pros and cons. And I said, I'm going to be Aaron Rogers. I don't have to move. I get an offensive coach. I get neighbors and a really good left tackle, and I'm going to have more juice in the building because the coach and the gym are getting fired. Or they'd lost Naji Harris in their left tackle.

They're completely toned off to offense. I'm old and don't want to get hit, and they haven't had a good line for seven years. I'll have really no power in the building, and I'm going to have two guys that are both going to demand the ball, and neither one runs a complete, route tree. I can make an argument selfishly. Like, every time I've ever thought about moving, my take is, who is my Spangali in the building? Will somebody get me? Brian Dable's work with

Daniel Jones. He's worked with Josh Allen. Brian Dable's been around forever. Man, Jeannie calls him one of his best assistants he's ever known. Like you go into a building with a guy, you can literally be on the same wavelength. I mean, Arthur Smith does not appear to be likable. And Mike Tomlin does not appear to care about offense. And you got two receivers who want to be ones. I look at Pittsburgh and think, this is a powder cake. Okay, so two things. One, I could be wrong.

I obviously don't know the man. I don't think he cares about moving. He'll, like, come on. He travels to Tahiti and Thailand, and he lived for 15 years in Greenback. Wisconsin in, you know, he'll be fine for eight months in Pittsburgh. I have a hard time believing that that is going to be a determining factor for him. Maybe I'm wrong, but I just, I think he'll be fine.

He's a very well-traveled individual. He'll have as much power in the offensive side as he wants. Who knows, maybe he'll fire Arthur Smith and they'll hire Nathaniel Hackett. Like, he's the offensive coordinator in and of himself. I think he loves Tomlin. I think that they flirted with each other. They wink at each other on the sideline. He shouts him out when he does the McAfee interviews.

I think he's got a respect for him. Conspiracy theory. McAfee today retweeted a video of Rogers talking about Tomlin from like 2021. I think it's happening. I think it's happening. I think he's going to announce it on that show. McAfee is a Pittsburgh guy. Pennsylvania guy, whatever he is. He's doing some show in Pittsburgh coming out soon.

He's calling it Big Night Act. I don't fully understand the McAfee universe, but like, I think Rogers, who's apparently making seven figures from the guy, which is amazing. Good gig if you can get it. I think he's announcing that he's going to Pittsburgh with McAfee at his show in Pittsburgh, and he's a stealer. That's what I think's happening. All right. You're probably right. I'm just telling you, the stuff that matters to me, which is, don't have to worry about moving. Left tackle, offensive coach, great weapon, and I'm going to have power in the building.

I'll get a say in the building. Where do you think he wins more football games? Pittsburgh. Yeah. So I guess, okay, and this is the other thing I wanted to say to you. And this is like developing more as my media career continues. I just get older or whatever. I root for interesting.

Powder keg? Great. Awesome. It is so much more interesting. if Aaron Rogers is in Pittsburgh with Mike Tomlin. That, you know what? Great point. I've said it.

I had our guys work up a Photoshop of him in a Steelers uniform the day the season ended. Like to me, it's made, obviously, if Minnesota wants him, that's a better situation, obviously. So I see him holding out for that. I think they're going to go with JJ McCarthy. We'll see. And the Steelers would be on national TV six times. they would be hyper-relevant and hyper-interesting. Good or bad.

Good or bad. If he's going to play and we're going to talk about him and he's going to suck all the oxygen out of a room, I would much rather him do it on a 10 or 11-win team than a 5- or a 6-win team. So I personally am rooting for Pittsburgh. You know, it's interesting. You and I both, that's, you know, I like fresh produce.

I'm a chef. Just give me the best ingredients. That's all I care about. J. Mack last year before the season said Chicago's the most interesting team. And they were early until they were just, you know, obviously bad. And then by week like 10, you're like, okay, they're not interesting. Let's think about this. The three most interesting teams next year.

So I think this year, the Bears are really interesting because if Caleb struggles again, he may not be the guy. In fact, he's probably not. So rookie quarterbacks, I never think the team is too interesting because it's going to be ugly and you can't make any stern judgments. Like obviously, Jane Daniels is terrific. He's Lamar Jackson, NFC. It's over. We don't have to argue about that. So I think Chicago is my most interesting team.

Well, then let's get those weekly hits on the TV show going, buddy. Let's go. Chicago. Okay. Let me think about this for a second. I mean, I think Washington's pretty high on the list. I will say this. I think Kansas City pulling back for a year because the offensive line is absolutely in flux.

Their left tackle has never been a starting left tackle. It's like, boys, that's honestly like having a Bentley and finding the cheapest insurance on the market for. It's like, no, just call progressive or something. Okay, let's not go discount insurance. So I think Kansas City, I predicted the Niners in Dallas would pull back last this year. They did. I'm going to say Kansas City is going to pull back for a year. Their offensive line is in flux.

I mean, if this kid from San Francisco to left tackle doesn't move, also Joe Tooney may have been the most, had more dexterity than any offensive lineman in the league last year. He's gone. So Chicago, Kansas City are fascinating. How about this? Green Bay. I loved Jordan Love.

Last year gave me pause. What if Jordan Love struggles this year? Like, what if it's... From your mouth to God's ears. Chicago's better. Detroit's really good. As long as Kevin O'Connell's coaching Minnesota, they're viable. I really like Jordan Love.

And then there were times I watched them last year and I'm like, oh, I don't know if the coaching staff right now trust Jordan Love. Like, I'm not sure they do. So I'm going to go Chicago, Kansas City, Green Bay. And we'll do four. I'm going to say, and I don't know how interesting they'll be, I think New England, Vrable, Drake May, a basically 30% new roster. think they'll get Travis Hunter, I think that's going to be a pretty damn interesting team. Those are my four, Bears, Chiefs, Packers, Patriots. Yeah, so let's revisit this after the draft because I'm not at all convinced that the guy that the chiefs paid is for sure the left tackle.

I think it's for sure the left tackle now, but I could see them, this is the last year of Kelsey. He's made it clear. We don't know how much more Chris Jones has in him. Obviously, Mahomes is going to be there and Reed will be there and they're going to be good for a long time. But I could see the chiefs trading up in the first round for a tackle. I could see that happening. Or a tight end. Or a tight end.

Yes. I just think I could see a big draft day move for the chiefs to try to inject a blue chip offensive player. So, you know, where should? Shador Sanders goes, how far he falls, is Dion Sanders like coach in waiting? Like that, like, does the Shador Sanders fall to 21 and he goes to Pittsburgh and he goes to Mike Tomlin and he sits behind Aaron Rogers? Then they're really damn interesting. Or does he go to the Giants and it feels like a mortal lock that Brian Daibald gets fired and

they hired Dion Sanders? Pretty damn interesting either way. So I think that we're going to change a little bit of this out of the draft. I loved what Urban Meyer said on your show, by the way. Side note, parenthetical on Travis Hunter. If you believe Cam Ward is a superstar, then Cam Ward's the number one pick in the draft. If you have any doubt, then clearly Travis Hunter is the number one pick in the draft, in my opinion. Because it's just a value proposition.

Like, if you think he can be a Pro Bowl corner, well, that's. that's $25 million a year. And if he can also be a slot receiver, well, that's $15 million a year. Even if he's a slot receiver for 12 snaps a game. So I love it. And so I think wherever Travis Hunter goes, his team immediately becomes interesting.

But let's remove the draft from it to get back to your point. Obviously, I'm with you on the Bears. I think the chiefs in an all-in situation is a great pick. The thing that I don't agree with on the England point is, is that all the guys, the guys that they added are new, but not terribly interesting. And while I love Drake May, I think he looks like Justin Herbert to me, I was disappointed that they didn't figure out a way to get him a number one. He has nobody to throw the ball to. And even if the line is better and Morgan Moses upgrades their left tackle situation,

no doubt. Vrable, they spent all that money on like, Carlton Davis and Spillan and Milton Williams. And I'm like, man, help your quarterback with a rocket arm, please. Like, now I know Godwin went back to Tampa. They can't help that. I know the Bengals franchise tagged. T. Higgins can't help that.

You couldn't beat the 58th pick for D.K. Metcalfe. like Cooper Cup better be a patriot. Like do something to help out Drake May in terms of past catchers because he has nothing in that regard. So to me, they need some weapon to totally get there. And Green Bay is just not new enough, but everyone's back. Watson, Dobbs, Wicks, Reed. They're so young, you know, they're so young that there's just not a lot of turnover there to make them all that interesting. though I'm definitely rooting against Jordan Love

and the Packers in general, just like the Chicagoan in me. I don't think who you left out. So I think Washington, the reason I said Washington while you were thinking about it is I think Jada Daniels had the best rookie quarterback season of my lifetime. Yes.

No question. I think it was better than Herbert, who set the touchdown record. Better than Andrew Luck. RG3, Cam Newton. Especially if you look, at his third down and fourth quarter numbers. It's in Joe Montana, his 11th year in the league.

They led the league in fourth down conversions. Fourth down conversion with a rookie quarterback. They led the league. It was remarkable. And then he won playoff. He went to the NFC championship game. But the guys who've had amazing rookie seasons recently, Justin Herbert, it's been up and down.

C.J. Stratel. this past year. He won another playoff game. I don't think it was all his fault. He was staring at the sky so much as offensive line was the disaster. Diggs got hurt. Tank Dell got hurt. Nico Collins got hurt at various points. But C.J. Straud did not take another step from his rookie year. We could say plateaued. If Jaden Daniels takes another step, like the year two in the system, year two in the league jump, well, then he's going to win MVP. He will win MVP. Like Mahomes won MVP, his second year in the league.

Like Lamar Jackson won MVP, his third year in the league, second year in a system. Like he will be the MVP of the league. Well, also, if he's great, not to interrupt, but if he's great again, then we have found our top five quarterbacks. Mahomes, Alan, Lamar, Burrow, Jaden. Because we all like Jalen Hertz, but we're like, well, the line that. I think it's ridiculous. I think it's ridiculous. still. Eagles fans kind of bothered me with this.

But I don't remember a time. Most of my life, there have been three great quarterbacks, maybe four in the league, and then it kind of peters out. To have five first ballot level Hall of Fame talent, if Jaden comes out and even duplicates last year with much better players around him, then we've got five first ballot guy. And by the way. Now I'm moving because of his mobility. I'm moving Stafford to sixth. And he, I believe he, especially if he could get in that Super Bowl circle again, win or lose, you're going to have a hard time keeping him out. I think Stafford now that he has a ring is pretty, I would be shocked if he's not a Hall of Famer with where his numbers are going to end up. He's not far from his prime,

okay, for him to be the sixth best quarterback in the league, mostly because he doesn't move. and the other guys move. The NFL, like I've said this, we're in the gold mage of quarterbacking folks. Like, if he's six, if Herbert and hurts are seventh, can we not forget about Herbert? We are an all-time high.

By the way, do you have a line to Harbaugh? Can you, like, yeah. Can you tell him to throw a little bit more, please? To who? Yeah, that's fair. That's fair. But you use the Bentley analogy.

I know that the winning went up. and I know the passer rating was very good, and I know he loves to run the ball. Can you just from the football appreciation society, don't let my guy Justin Herbert not be 26th in the NFL in attempts again or whatever he was, please. Well, they lost Palmer. So now they have Ladd McConkey.

They need a tied in in the first round and a receiver in the third. It's one of those things where, and I've said this about Jim Harbaugh, it's kind of fascinating. San Francisco. He had Michael Crabtree. It was an O-line, D-line physicality. John Harbaugh's the same way.

What's the one thing the Ravens haven't had? White receiver talent. They've always been a little shy. The Harbaugh's, it's their nature. He could have taken Michael Thomas, who he loved. He took Joel. It's who they are. Their DNA is, we want to intimidate you.

We want to physically, like, listen, they let go of Mike Williams and Keenan Allen. They kept Boast and Khalil Mack. That was very clear their DNA. I know. I just as a guy who, loves Justin Herbert. I want to see the guy throw a little bit more.

What were we just talking about? I'm sorry. I feel like I lost my train of thought. Oh, but Washington, what Houston did off of CJ Stroud's rookie year was correct. Oh, my God. We have a quarterback. He turned our franchise

around. We won a playoff game. We have a ton of cap space and a stud quarterback who we know we have to pay on a cheap deal. Let's go all in. and Stefan Diggs was crazy expensive, DeNeil Hunter was crazy expensive. They paid Mixon. Like,

Mixon didn't really work. He was fine. It wasn't really his fault, but the offensive line was a disaster. Diggs was working, then got hurt. DeNeil Hunter was fantastic. Washington is in the exact same spot. And we've now seen what they've done.

Like, they, Debo, we're going to give Kingsbury and Terry McClaren and Jane and Daniels, we're going to give them a toy and see how it works. We are going to trade a ton of capital for one of the best pass blocking left tackles of his generation to protect our investment. And then they paid Kinlaugh, I think too much money,

but they didn't want to get too much weaker on the defensive line when they lost Allen and they brought in Kinlo. So maybe they'll do one more trade for a move or whatever, but they're going to maintain Cap Flexible, but we've seen their moves. D-Tackle, left tackle, D-Bos-Samuel, plus what they add in the draft. They're better.

And Philly got worse. Now, Philly got worse by design, and we know it, and they should, because they didn't want to pay Milton Williams $100 million so they could pay Jalen Carter $150 million next year. Philly's top 10 players are still all excellent. They deserve to be the favorite. But I think that what Jaden Daniels did

in, like, year two, Does it plateau? Does it go down? Does it go up? Because he's got way more talent and he should be only more comfortable in the NFL. So to me, they are very high on my list of interesting. Danny Parkins. This was fun, as always. The volume. Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe.

I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know, tired and sick.

Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was crying. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis' coming to you, he's like, you know, I love you, dog.

You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Deanna Maria Riva, and on my new podcast, How Hard Can It Be? I call on my Gen X squad from Ohio to Hollywood as we navigate Midlife's most fantastic B-S. Unfiltered conversations from night sweats to futas to scheduling sex. Wait, what sex?

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