The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Colin Cowherd Podcast - USA-South Sudan Reaction: LeBron & AD shine, Embiid benched, Tatum struggles

Episode Date: August 1, 2024

Colin Cowherd & Jason Timpf, host of “Hoops Tonight” react to Team USA’s win over South Sudan in Olympic basketball. Colin & Jason discuss Jayson Tatum's struggles, Joel Embiid’s benching, Steph Curry's off night and LeBron's performance. They talk about Victor Wembanyama's growth and when he will be the best player in the NBA. So why are the Lakers struggling to win games with a healthy LeBron James & Anthony Davis?   Timeline: 3:00 - Jayson Tatum struggling 7:45 - Joel Embiid benched 12:30 - Is FIBA basketball tough for Steph Curry? 15:30 - Victor Wembanyama becoming a superstar 23:30 - LeBron James is Team USA's best player 27:45 - This Anthony Davis is unstoppable 35:30 - Why length is king in NBA (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates!  #Volume #Herd #HoopsTonightSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Well, they were favored to win gold, but there's been a lot of storylines with Team USA at the Olympics in France. Jason Timp Hoops Tonight who works about as hard as anybody in this business and I want to start with Jason Tatum so there's two reasons why a normally good shooter doesn't shoot well

one, his legs, he's tired that happens you go on a five game eight day Eastern road trip you're an older player back to backs so you lose your legs the only other way a good shooter shoots poorly usually is

you lose your confidence. We've seen LeBron, especially early and mid-career, like just loses confidence in the three-point shot. He acknowledges that. Then he would say, okay, I'm going to go score at the basket for about two games, and then he would build it back up. Jason Tatum's lost his jump shot. And I think what it is, it really is, it defines who he is. It's one thing that he didn't play in one of the games. And I can get into that in a second. But I believe the Celtics traded Marcus Smart because their problem was, okay, it's one thing that Tatum is slightly more skilled than Jason, Jalen Brown. If Jalen Brown takes over late in games, he's still a great player. But when Marcus Smart also started taking the ball out of his hands late, then it was a timeout.

This isn't going to work. And they got him out of town. They got a more talented player with the same skill set defensively, drew Holliday. day, who more understands his role. He's gotten the bag. It's, you know, it's, it's a different player, different mindset. And I think Brad Stevens has told us time and time again the truth about Jason Tatum. He loves him. He's smart. He works hard. He's collaborative. But in big spots against great players or playing with great players, he can kind of lose his confidence. And when I watch him against South Sudan, I'm like, where's, what's going on?

And I don't think it's mechanics, Jason. I think it's a confidence thing. And we're going to have to acknowledge this is a little bit of who he is from time to time. Yeah, it goes deeper than the Drew Holiday thing. It even extends to Porzingis. Because the reality is, is those moves are aggressive in the sense that there is actually some fallout. It's not just the draft compensation, although they actually made out pretty well in terms of asset usage in those deals. But a lot of it has to do with the second apron.

Like you, by virtue of bringing those two guys in and making, making it so that you have five 30 plus million dollars players on your roster, you limit your ability to be flexible in the future. And we talked a lot after the 2022 series about whether or not it was one of those things where the Celtics could bank on Tateham and Brown just improving naturally as time progressed or if there was a certain ceiling there and they needed to be more aggressive. And to your point, I think Brad Stevens has made that pretty clear with the moves that he's made. He understands that Tatum is what he is. and that he does need a large amount of support. And to Tatum's credit, I do think he's kind of the perfect collaborative superstar. Because when you're playing on a team that has that kind of talent, you don't want a dude who's going to hijack things and play super heliocentric. You want a ball mover. And I do actually think there is something a little bit mechanical going on with Tatum.

I don't know if it's from how much muscle he's put on, that he's just a little tight, or if he's tinkering with his mechanics now because he's been missing. but his shot just, it looks like it has a little bit of a hitch in it, like right as he's starting to gather. And that is a little funky to me because this is, this extends beyond the Team USA stuff. As you mentioned, he's struggling with Team USA.

Perce Energy's 0 for 11 on jump shots in the exhibition games and the Olympic Games so far with Team USA. But he took 188 jump shots in the playoffs and got just 151 points out of them. That's 0.8 points per shot, which is not good. Anything below one point is bad. and he's well below one point in a large sample size. So we're in an extended span here of Tatum really struggling to shoot the basketball. And like, there's two ways to look at that.

You can take it glass half full and be like, hey, what if he figures it out this summer? And then we have the Celtics from last year plus Tatum shooting the ball well. That's scary, right? But the other side of it is if this is something, if this is one of those things where it's an indicator of him at this physical build struggling to shoot the basketball, that's going to make it really difficult for him to impact winning. at the level of the top five players in the league. Because when you go up into that group, when you look at Shea, when you look at Luca,

like the shooting at that position is incredibly valuable unless you're Janice, unless you're Yokic. And as physically gifted as Tatum is, he's not like those guys. And so I'm just concerned for him from the standpoint of like, he needs to be a good jump shooter to be a legitimate superstar level player. So let's talk M. Bid, who, you know, when he comes into the league, There was a sign early. First couple years, can't play it. Unhealthy. So it's like, uh-oh,

bigs get hurt early. Bigs usually get hurt often. So he's always had an injury history. But most bigs eventually do, right? Like almost all of them, Yao Ming, Shaq. You can just Greg Odin. Sam Bowie couldn't get on the floor. Like it's the position people probably aren't built to last at 7-2, you know, or Shaq sighs with those feet back, it wears out. Like, I get it. But Embed presents something else beyond the injuries. and because he is more dynamic and more fun to watch than Yokic or a Yonis, and there is a Shaq component with better ball handling skills, there is also something that I find,

my eyes keep telling me this when I watch the Sixers, and the Olympics just heightened this, is that they can keep running coaches through Philly and teammates through Philly. I mean, even Ben Simmons for a while, he was an All-Star, like his first year, right? Like, Ben did have promise. They were good. Is that, back then. Yeah.

And Bede really needs to stay closer to the basket. So coaches kind of pushed AD out for a couple years. It was like fashionable. And AD didn't, it wasn't good shooting from out there. AD said, I want to go back. And he has been for two years a monster. To me, the most underrated player in the Olympics and the league right now is AD. He is just fun-turn.

Turn the sound down, watch. You can't, if he's on the floor, it's like LeBron. You can't take your eyes off him. He's dominant. Embed to me, somebody has to just acknowledge, fella, get away from the perimeter. He fashions himself or is told that he is such an important part sometimes of perimeter basketball. He's big. He's aging.

He's not as quick. I thought he literally got in the way of this offense. I'd seen it in Philly, but it was so profound with this team. It bothered me. I'm screaming at the TV. Get him out of the game. Your thoughts on Embed, and are any of these valid that I watch him offensively?

I know the numbers probably say he's great, but he can, he stops. I just feel like he can stop offenses too often. So it's both. It's the jump shot, and it's the ball movement piece. The jump shot piece, this has been a consistent story in Embedd's career,

especially over the previous couple of years. This last year, he actually shot the ball okay against the Knicks. but like in the previous couple of seasons, he would shoot like 50% on these like mid-range pull-up jump shots in the regular season, but then he'd get in front of Al Horford and he couldn't make them. Like he would struggle to knock him down in the postseason. That was a consistent theme and be able to get to the postseason,

his jump shot would go away. And one of the biggest things that he never built out the way Yokic did is those short range shots, the hooks, the floaters, all that stuff that's within like six, seven feet of the room. Exactly. And those are way more dependable in this kind of setting. The second piece of it is learning how to play basketball with other people. This is an epidemic around the league with certain guys.

And we see this, it's kind of like this with Luca a little bit, with more of a perimeter sense, but we see it with him where it's like, as long as everything is flowing through him and he's deciding every single possession, he has this otherworldly value as almost like a force of nature. So for instance, if you took AD or BAM and you put them on last year's Sixers team with Tyrese-Mexie, they're not as good because you, can't just give the ball to AD and bam like every single possession and ask them to determine outcomes they're not good enough on the offensive end of the floor. But when you're actually

playing with people, other good basketball players, and this will be really interesting this year with Paul George now in the equation, when you actually need to keep everybody in rhythm and there's ball and player movement, and B, for lack of a better term, sucks at that style of basketball. He doesn't know how to play quick decision making, flowing from side to side, and especially especially at the center position in modern NBA basketball when you play five out, the center is the bridge between the two sides of the floor. He's the guy who has to catch and turn and go to the other guard and flow on the other side. So when you're trying to keep Booker and Steph and LeBron and all these guys in rhythm at the same time, it's better to have a guy like AD who his entire life

has been a screen and roll big. He's going to pitch the ball the other side, set a screen, roll hard to the rim, run up and down the floor and transition. It's a foot speed thing. It's a decision-making thing. You put him in this setting, and it's just a completely different kind of basketball than what he was doing for the Sixers last year. And quite frankly, he has years of needing to learn how to play that style if he's ever going to play in more of a five-out read and react type of system. So during COPA, Team USA struggled, and I, not to make an excuse, or defend Greg Burholt or the coach at the time, but our style is more European. We have more players now soccer players in America playing in Europe and flourishing. So Copa is a smaller,

shorter field. It didn't play to our strength, which is speed and spacing. So as we've become more skilled and more European, which is the Golden Win World Cup, Copa has become a bad tournament for us, which is a grittier, lower-ranked teams, more physical soccer. Similarly, Steph with Fiba, three-point shooting is almost the, it plays with your head, it's closer. It's more physical. You don't get the whistle. More physicality allowed. And as I watch Steph struggle, it's not like Tatum struggling.

It's not a confidence issue. It's a, is it possible that Feeba Olympic basketball isn't really, it's not really built necessarily for Steph all the time. I mean, LeBron's good everywhere. But as Steph struggles, how do I reconcile that? He's a great shooter. It's closer. He should be shooting the lights out.

He's not. Why? So Sudan in particular, and I think their reputation, obviously that them as an organization within FIBA don't have the reputation of the other great European teams or South American teams that we faced over the years, like even back in the old days when it was like Argentina, you know, or France that was given its issues. They don't have that history. But I think South Sudan is the most athletic team in this field by far. Like they have just an enormous amount of fast dudes with really long wingspans.

They're athletic by NBA standards, let alone by Feebo standards. And so if you remember last year when Golden State needed to get some big wins down the stretch of the season, the two teams that were giving them a lot of trouble were Sacramento and New Orleans, two teams that were really fast and really long on the perimeter. And that's like kind of one of those things where as Steph has aged, he's become a little bit susceptible to specific types of matchups, particularly teams that are closing those gaps on him. And then the piece you mentioned about spacing is real. Like the lack of the defensive three seconds is a real thing that people are factoring in.

So to put it simply, the vast majority of teams when they're spacing will put their big man on the opposite block from where the ball is. And so with defensive three seconds, that defender has to step in and out of the lane on the far end of the court. Whereas in Fiba, he can park his ass right underneath the basket. And he doesn't have to move at all whatsoever. And so this, by the way, is why I'm far more concerned about teams like Germany and France or even Serbia against USA, then a team like Canada, who just doesn't have the bigs to deal with USA underneath the basket. Teams that can park big bodies under the rim can force you to make jump shots. And as soon as you force a team to make jump shots,

they can go cold, they can have issues, which is what happening in South Sudan last time. But yeah, as far as Steph goes, like, he, I mean, we, let's put it, let's put it straight up, Colin, he struggled most of the tail end of the season last year, too. So, so this is an extension of that. And I'm really hoping as a basketball fan that this is just a blip and he's going to figure it out because I really want the Warriors to be interesting next year. Yeah. You know, when you have a bunch of kids, I have six in my life. The early years can be frustrating and a lot of work. But what's fascinating about the early years is kids make giant social and emotional and physical leaps in nine months. I mean, my son had a biting stage. He had a coughing stage where he would make coughing noises.

And I always told my wife, I'm like, it's just nine-year-old boys go through weird, weird, you know, cycle. Pases. Yeah, they just do. And I want to use that as sort of a pivot to watching young NBA players, is that when they're 18, 19, 20, players, players just come back of off and off season. and you're like, damn, he got a jumper. So I'm watching Wembe, and I feel like I'm watching a kid grow. Like, I'm watching him in some of these games, and I'm like, oh, no, this is terrifying for the league. Like, you go to his first month in the league, and now, Jason, offensively, he plays with so much more confidence.

Defensively, he's blocking stuff with his elbow. He is now way more aggressive and assertive. hurting himself. And I'm watching this and I'm like, I said by the trade deadline, I said this on our previous podcast, by the trade deadline, he and aunt will be the faces of the league. I'm not sure it's going to take that long. Like, Yokic is still the best player, his ability to not only dominate, but compliment other players and elevate them. It kind of separates LeBron's magic. Certain guys, I always say, Michael didn't make everybody better, not every teammate. LeBron Magic, Yokic, Chris Paul. Every teammate's bad.

You play your best with him. And now we get Chris Ball with Wemby. But I'm watching him, and maybe I don't see him as much as you do. I'm seeing major jumps from Wembe, even in these Olympics. No, absolutely. They've been running a lot more offense through him than you would expect. And a big part of that is France doesn't have an amazing guard core. Like Evan Fournier is their best guard, a guy who couldn't crack the rotation for the Nix last year.

Right. So like, but what they're doing in a lot of cases is they're feeding him at the elbow. and they're like running literally ball screens. Like the way you would typically with a point guard in a center, they're running with him and Gobert at the foul line. And they're letting him determine the outcome of possessions. They're throwing it to him down on the block. He's the,

he's become a lot quicker at like reading the floor and making reads than I would expect a player at his age. And part of this, I think, has a lot to do with him playing professionally, as opposed to coming up through the college system. Like he's just been around a lot of really smart basketball minds in his development. the big one to me that stands out is the dude is just a savage competitor and is not scared of the moment.

Like he was kind of on the back burner for a good portion of that second half against Japan. And then it went to OT and he just took over. Immediately was demanding the ball in the block, got an and one. He missed a three on the right wing and then immediately called for the ball back and knocked one down at the top of the key. He's got like just incredible scoring polish all over the floor. He's handling physicality really, really well. obviously you mentioned the defensive stuff. It's hard to even describe.

It doesn't even look like other NBA players that have come before him. I'm with you. I think we got to think long and hard about him being a top 10 player right now. Right now. And I think by the deadline next year, we could be talking about a guy who's second team all NBA. Like this is a real potential outcome for him in the short term. Now for a segment called Making It Look Easy, brought to you by Morgan and Morgan. America's largest injury law firm. Bam out of Bayou for Team USA made it look easy. A couple of

corner threes, 18.7 rebounds over the win against South Sudan at the Olympics in Paris. Well, just like Bam made it look easy, so does Morgan and Morgan. They have over 100 offices nationwide. They fight for you and fair compensation. Over $15 billion recovered with over 300,000 clients through the years with Morgan and Morgan. Fighting for the people. For three and a half decades, 35 years, America's largest injury law firm. If you're ever injured, go to for the people.com slash Colin. That's me, for the people.com slash Colin. Or dial pound 529 to check out America's largest injury law firm.

Winning gold medals is hard. Hiring Morgan and Morgan is easy. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year.

Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me. Cliver Taylor the fourth. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media.

Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life. mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger.

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What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because. of crack.

I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah.

For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your You know, it's, you put a bunch of alphas together and some alphas will shrink and some alphas will rise. LeBron is now the best player on this team. It's like, it's now it's gone past. But what's interesting is that Nick Wright said this to me today on the show in FS1. He said, deep down LeBron may realize these are the last games of his career that people,

people are really going to watch, like have a huge audience and are going to matter. And listen, you and I have been critical of the executive wing of the Lakers. A.D. and LeBron on any given game that I've watched Team USA are the two best players. And they're struggling to win a playoff game. It's really frustrating. There's Jeremy Grant may come to town. He would be a solid three, a better, a four on a really, really good team. He's probably a four, not a three, but be that as it may. But as I, as I watched LeBron, what it tells me is he's not having to fight to be the alpha. He is so respected that other young players are like, hey, big fella, you run the offense. I mean, like, Magic and Michael,

when they went together, they were fighting. Magic didn't want to give up the baton. Michael grabbed it. Like, even aunt, all these guys, it's like, no, no, this is LeBron's, this is LeBron's world. and I know you're not surprised by it, but it does jump out of the TV, does it not? I'm glad everyone's seeing it too. First of all, to what Nick said, I agree. I think LeBron has always been very aware of the narrative surrounding him. And I think that he saw an opportunity here to be like, if I am the best player on Team USA, it will resonate with people for a long time.

And for the record, I think LeBron came right out of the season and started prepping forward. He looks like he's in great shape. He is flexing every other time down the floor. I know. Like he's, he clearly prepped for this as though it was an NBA playoff run. Like that is abundantly clear. And he,

and he's playing at that crazy high level. I'm glad you mentioned the Lakers because like so many people are like, oh, they're a playing team. They're this, there are that. And it's like, guys,

the reason they're a playing team is they don't have a single player on the roster other than LeBron and AD who can play both ends of the floor. That's literally why they've struggled. It is a personnel issue. It is not a LeBron, James, and Anthony Davis issue. Those two pull their weight, they pulled their weight in a major way last season, and the organization is what let them down. And so I don't really see it that way.

As far as, as, as far as LeBron with this team USA context, what's been super fascinating from a basketball perspective, is what you're seeing is what it would look like to run five-out offense with all the ball and player movement, step flying off of screens, with the best playmaker of this air. kind of orchestrating it at the top of the key. He's not taking a ton of shots.

He's seeing his openings and he's shooting the gap and he's attacking the basket. But they're ducking under all those picks at the top of the key. He's not jacking up threes and hijacking possessions. He's just reading the floor as Steph is running around and as Devin Booker's running around and waiting for guys to make mistakes. One of the most classic decisions that you'll see from that part of the floor is Steph runs off a screen and the guy screens for him. If those defenders make a mistake, that guy can.

slip it and LeBron is just making reads based on what the mistake the defense has made. And so it's kind of like a juiced up version of Draymond with the Warriors, but surrounded by all of these, you know, world class types of players. And it's been the perfect role for him. And then quite frankly, to your point, and this is where it gets really scary, Colin, I would argue KD and LeBron and Steph have been the only consistent offensive forces on this team and we've been disappointed by Jason Tatum. Anthony Edwards has given us some mixed results. There's been good games. There's been bad games. I think it's just a bad look that here in the year 2024, Steph, LeBron, and KD are playing the way they are and the younger generation is

struggling to keep up. It's like, thank God for AD and BAM being as good as they've been because it's just been, it's been a disappointing performance from some of the younger American players. Yeah, it has. And I, let me just say this again, is that I do a segment every week called Colin Wright, Colin Wrong. And I wish somebody in politics did it because I don't think being right should be the be all end all of being a host, being interesting and informative and being fun should. And I was so anti-A-D when we started doing this podcast together. I went like two years. I'm like, it's a dad bod. He doesn't work out. He's out of shape. He never plays hurt. And some of that was confirmation bias because I had said I had heard that going in and he became it.

the last two years he is after take yokech out i'm not sure there's a big guy i'd take over him including yonis i mean i always use this rule there are time when you turn the sound down of a game when and i'll use magic johnson when mad more than michael when magic was on the floor he had the ball so much unmistakable you you could literally just go magic's there magic's there magic literally was a six nine point and then lebron comes in and he he kind of plays point. So the point guard you always kind of knows on the floor. But a lot of times forwards, especially guys who aren't aesthetically beautiful games, you cannot mistake Anthony Davis in a game. Dominant defender. He's gotten significantly more physical to me. I don't know what

happened, but he was almost, this is weird, he was a rugged finesse player. Like, like, you'd be like, run over people. Dude, I don't know what it is. is. But when I watch him, he goes after people. He attacks players. Now, some of this, he's playing against second team guys in this space. But he's aggressive against Yokic. And I just think to myself, I don't know what it is, but it does prove young people improve. Young people are coachable. Young people hear criticism. This is weird because he was already good, but he's one of the most improved players, and he did it, like, as an established great player, to me, he's taken another level. This is the AD we thought we were getting out of college, and he just

wasn't emotionally ready for it. I think the injuries played a role. Like, to your point, but I agree, like, in that 2021 to 2022 stretch, he was kind of like a finesse dude that was really big, but it didn't seem like he was inflicting it on people. But in his defense, he had, like, repeated ankle injuries and he had an Achilles injury during that time. So I really think AD just didn't trust his body. And I think the reason why we're seeing him be so physically dominant now is he just is in a really good physical place. And I think that's gone a long way towards helping him facilitate that. You mentioned it bouncing off the screen. It's crazy like his block that he had on one of the first possessions against Sudan. He just he just just,

just pogo sticks above everybody or that donkey had on the feed from KD tonight where he like takes off from the foul line off of two feet and just throws it down clean. He just has the craziest combination of length and mobility in the league still. Even at his phase of his career where he's a little bit bigger and not quite as mobile as he was when he was younger. And at the end of the day, like a lot of the focus has been on what he hasn't been since the bubble. Like he hasn't been knocking down all these crazy jump shots the way he did in the bubble.

And that's true. But he's improved so much as a passer, his overall feel for the game. He is a lot better at those. short shots, like the stuff I was talking about with Embed, AD was well over 50% on hooks and floaters last year. That's what he does. And to your point about attacking lower level bigs and Fiba, he was awesome against Yokic. He was awesome most of the tail end of the season. AD has been playing in the calendar year 2024. He's been playing at an MVP level and he deserves more credit for them. Yeah. In a weird way, you watch more film than I do. I wonder if it wasn't this.

when he was a perimeter player, when he was almost forced to go outside, it was like, well, he doesn't want to play five. So instead of just backing up three feet, let's back him up nine and go shoot threes. He ended up slashing to the basket a lot. He ended up being a bit of a slasher. And when you slash and go to the floor, you fall hard. When you take out the perimeter, he's much more around the free throw line route. He's not slashing as much. and therefore he's not crashing as much.

And I'm just throwing this out there because he went through a stage with a Lakers that he was just hitting the floor hard, like three times a night. And he's playing twice as physical and doesn't hit the floor as often. So I do wonder, I do wonder a little bit, Jason, if as he's reduced his perimeter touches,

he's just not in a position to have to race inside for the rebound, put the ball on the floor, come off a screen, that he's just not in position to crack because he hits the floor occasionally. But it was like an epidemic. Those bubble years. It's like you would watch a Laker game at least twice. You would wince. You're like, oh, he's not getting up. He doesn't seem to do that as much. I think that's completely fair. And I think a huge part of it is roster construct.

I mean, going from that Javille McGee Dwight Howard group were like 80 was playing the vast majority of his minutes at the four in that 2020 year. And then even going into 2021, I mean, you add Marcusal to the equation. That was when they added Andre Drummond at the tail end of the year, if you remember, like they were going with AD at the four almost exclusively. And one of the big impacts there, to your point, it's not just the slashing and operating from the perimeter. It's constantly having a big guy in help.

We talked earlier about that geometry of the guy being in the opposite block and the guy stepping in and out with the defense of three seconds. They're still sliding over and getting in the way all the time. It's just their steps slower than Fiba. But that's the thing. AD was constantly contending with if he got past, his man, there was another center waiting underneath the basket for him to deal with. And I do think just in general, him kind of functioning more as a big man screening,

rolling into space, but not rolling hard too. Like he doesn't always roll directly to the rim. Like he'll roll into that short area around the foul line like you talked about. He'll take jumpers there. He'll take more floaters. He's just playing more of a grown adult, like grown man old school style of basketball. And I think it suits him well. Like honestly, like to your point,

AD, you always will have these moments where you're watching the Nugget series and you're like, man, like, LeBron is still so good. Like, is he the best player, blah, blah, blah. But if you get past the shot creation piece and just zoom in strictly on winning impact on both ends of the floor, there just aren't many guys who bring as much to the table as he does. And the simplest explanation or example is this. If AD were to sprain his ankle and miss 15 games next year, as the Lakers are currently constructed and you slaughtered Jackson Hayes or Christian Wood into that spot, they're going three and 12th. They're going three and 12. And that's really all you need to know. So much of the duct tape that is holding the Lakers organization together is Anthony Davis.

Yeah, but if LeBron misses a night and Austin Reeves can be the shot creator with AD, if you get a favorable interior matchup, they can win the game. Yeah. And they did and they did last year. And like, and that that really is is the crux of it. Like they, he, and by the way, I don't know if you noticed. Did you see that deal that Jared Allen just signed? He signed a three-year, like 90-something million. So Jared Allen's going to be over 30 million a year at the tail end of his current deal. Isaiah Hartenstein just signed a deal with the Thunder this summer for 27 million a year. These are guys that like, you know, Jared Allen's in that like eighth or ninth best center in the league.

Hartinstein's in that 14th, 15th best center in the league. More complimentary guys. Yeah. Isn't it crazy that they're getting that much money, though? And that to me is a really strong indicator of the league telling us that like, Oh, shit. We need big dudes underneath the basket that can do the work. Well, I think the game's getting longer and longer players are getting more skilled.

And, you know, I've said this ad nauseum, but the whole small ball thing to me was such nonsense. It was like, no, the Warriors have the best shooting back court ever. You can try duplicating it. But like, there's some things Patrick Mahomes does that your quarterback can't. So let's just do what you do and play to your, you know, the Rockets tried so desperately to do small ball. And it's like, sometimes you just, you know, I mean, let's face it, the Splash Brothers next to West and Goodrich, there's never been a back court like that. Now, I'm old enough to have seen both, but this is a big man sport.

You know, like the NFL is a big dude sport. The NBA is a length sport. It's always been that. I mean, I can remember standing at a Laker game once on the court next to Pal Gasol. And I'm like, like, what planet created? I mean, his arms were so long and I'm just sitting there. I'm like with a buddy and I'm like, that's just an NBA player. Like, what are you going to do?

Like they're just not, you know, just so much of it just, you know, obviously skill matters. But this is a length league. I remember talking to Mark Warkintin, former executive in the NBA. I think Mark passed away years ago. He was a UNLV, Tark's number three guy. And he always said to me, he said, Colin, he goes, people do not understand. He said Tark gets this length. He goes, the Bulls were a great team, but they were one of the longest teams ever.

And he goes, the only team in the Eastern Conference that had their length was the Cleveland teams with John Williams, ILO. He said, that was the only team in the league that could match up length-wise. And he said, length gives you three possessions a game. Tip passes. He goes, Michael scored two baskets in those three possessions. He's like, if you have a great finisher and you're long, that's three possessions. And if you can get two baskets, NBA games are, you know, now this was in the pre-3-shot era, so maybe those three possessions don't equal as many wins.

But I think the reality of it is, is, you know, that's why Wembe, it's the whole small ball thing, outside of Isaiah Thomas in a different league and stuff, guards don't lead you to titles. They lead you to wins. They don't lead you the titles historically. Yeah, really quick, the, my buddy Sam Vistini came on the show. after the NBA finals. He works at the athletic does an amazing job. And we tried to come up with the two biggest things that we learned from this

playoff run, one for offense and one for defense. And what we settled on was on offense was spacing. And that goes beyond shooting. But it has to do with like how you actually set up the floor, the way you actually run your offense. We won't get into it. But on the defensive end, what we settled on was ground coverage. And that does not just mean foot speed.

Length is a direct like. So for instance, like if you have a. big on your back line who can help at the rim but also contest the shooter in the weak side corner. It's like being in two places at once. And that's what Yonnes did on the bucks with Brooke Lopez that made him so dominant as a defender. Like your ability to eat up chunks of the floor with an athlete that has a seven two wingspan. South Sudan. Yeah, it's exactly. And that's the thing. Like everyone's like, oh, they're struggling with South Sudan. And South Sudan, by the way, as good as the USA team played today, they were within 11 in the early part of the

fourth quarter. Like that just having a long athletic team that plays hard, like automatically check so many basketball boxes. Well, also, Jason, it's not even, it's not even blocks. It's shot alteration. Exactly. It's literally, it's penetrating and then circling out and saying, I'm not going to go there. Like, you stop shots, you alter shots, you block shots. It's like certain things don't have to happen to have an effect. And length is one of those things where, you know, you'll see sometimes a Chris Paul or a Steph going the lane. And they see the Redwoods and they're like, yeah, I'm going to do a U-turn and get out of here. There's no happy ending to this story.

That's Derek White and Drew Holiday, by the way. They're guards for Boston, but they have the length of wings. And so that could be a problem. Yeah, boy, Derek White's a good player. Derek White's such a good player. Hoops tonight. Jason Tim. This was a fun 40 minutes.

Good to see you and we'll talk soon. Good to see you, Colin. The volume. Hey, are you not playing best ball at Draft Kings? My opinion, you're missing out. Draft King's best ball millionaire contest is their biggest fantasy contest ever. And that's saying something. They're taking $15 million and putting it into the prize pool.

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