The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Cowboys, Running Backs, Browns, Aaron Rodgers, & athletes-actors

Episode Date: July 18, 2019

Colin discusses the Dallas Cowboys offensive line, running backs, and what he would do with Ezekiel Elliott. Also his thoughts on the Cleveland Browns upcoming season, Aaron Rodgers friction with coaches, and which athletes remind him of certain actors. Guests include Hue Jackson, Will Blackmon, Peter King, Josh Norman, and Jason McIntyre. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode, we're cutting through the noise,

breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source, the athletes themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions in the moment, and the stuff nobody gets to hear. Listen to Sports Slice on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Sliced Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her.

What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, Wreck, my mama want you to weigh better. What? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was harmed. you just understood.

That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Mark keep coming to her. He's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball.

So listen to Point Game on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening to The Heard podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1. Find your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio. com or stream us live every day on the IHeartRadio app by searching heard. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Oh, here we go on a Thursday. This is the

herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening. We are live in Los Angeles on IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio and FS1. I look at my sheet today. I've got Hugh Jackson, former NFL coach, Will Blackman, former NFL player, Peter King, Josh Norman, cornerback Redskins, Pro Bowler, Jason McIntyre, Football. Jason McIntyre, football, Football, football, football. Here we go. I'm all fired up. Joy, Taylor, is joining me.

Joy, how are you? I'm doing great. It snuck up on us. The NBA did an amazing job of leading us right into the NFL season. And today is going to be a big football show. We've got a ton of football. Certainly in Hurdle-Dy news, we'll talk about some other stuff as well. I want to start with the Dallas Cowboys because I've been on the Dallas Cowboys all week.

This is what I've led my show with all week. And so I just, for those of you, and I know that many of you listen to me, maybe once or twice a week, you have a busy life. It's the summer. Your schedule is different. for the last couple days, I've led on the Dallas Cowboys. I've led the show with the Dallas Cowboys, and I've said the same thing, trade Zeke. I know he's great.

But the NFL's all about trading very good players when they're still good. Jimmy Johnson did it with Herschel Walker, and it started this avalanche of trades. Giants just did it with Odell Beckham Jr. Niners did it with Joe Montana. Packers moved off of Brett Farb. The Colts had to move off of Peyton Manning. You move off players in the NFL all the time that are really, really still good off and Pro Bowl or Super Bowl winning talent players.

So a lot of pushback on my takeaway that he's too good and he's too valuable to the Cowboys. Until you read this this morning, he's not as valuable to the Cowboys as you think. Without Elliot, Zeke drawing defenders into the box, Dak Prescott wouldn't be as effective as a passer. That's what everybody says. Because Zeke, he forces everybody to jump up in the box and that leaves big spaces for Dak to throw the ball down the field. Oh, wait a minute.

You've heard that trope before, says the article. A great back forces defenses to load the box, which opens up space in the passing game. The problem is there's a new stat out. There's no evidence to suggest that Zeke does that. Zeke's presence does not draw any more loaded boxes. According to the NFL.com's next generation stats, how many times did Zeke face an loaded eight-man box? 25% of the time that ranked him 19. 18th in the NFL in 2018, right behind Elijah Maguire, meaning is a bunch of nonsense.

We talk about analytics all the time in baseball. We talk about analytics all the time in the NBA. Here's some analytics in football. Nobody's loading the box up for Dak. You know why he, for Zeke, you know why Zeke's a great running back? A, he's talented and B, the Cowboys offensive line. It's amazing to me. Whenever we get a great running back, it's as if we forget the.

offensive line. Can we acknowledge that Zeke in his first three years in the NFL, Dallas has had the best offensive line in the NFL in those three years? We're not going to acknowledge that. DeMarco Murray with this offensive line, it was younger, but it was still emerging as a force, had 1,800 yards and 13 touchdowns. How was DeMarco Murray without this cowboy offensive line? Zeke's numbers last year, by the way, dropped. His yards per game dropped. His touchdowns dropped. Why? Because the Cowboys had injuries off on the offensive line. Travis Frederick didn't play. Supposed to play this year.

Tyron Smith was not 100%. So that offensive line last year, for the first time in the last couple of years, they started getting old and injured. And his numbers went down. As the offensive line is aged, they have more injuries. And Zeke, you start to see a little erosion. By the way, Zeke's talented, really talented, maybe the best running back. I'm not denying that.

But as Dak Prescott, the quarterback grows and matures, he'll become less reliant on him. That's also what happened with Russell, Wilson, and Marshawn Lynch. Russell depended on him for a couple of years. Marshawn Lynch left, and Russell blossomed. By the way, last year, at the beginning of the season when Todd Gurley was healthy, we were having arguments on this show, and I'm sure it was on other debate shows. Zeke or Todd Gurley, who's better? And it was kind of split.

it was kind of a 50-50 thing. And like the Cowboys, the Rams have a young quarterback Jared Goff who has not hit his ceiling and many of you say, oh, come on, he's overrated. Gurley makes Goff. Gurley got hurt,

but because the Rams have a very good offensive line, they found CJ Anderson, a human bowling ball, and they got to the Super Bowl without Todd Gurley. Why? Because Jared Goff became less reliant on Todd Gurley as he's age. which DAC will do.

I'm not saying DAC is Jared Gough. I don't think he's that talented. But they're close. At this point, they're close. So you got all these things. If a team's offensive line is the elite, let's take the Pittsburgh Steelers, then you can lose a great running back.

Labian Bell leaves James Connor last year in 12, 13 games had 12 touchdowns. By the way, I'll give you another example. There's a guy in the NFL named Marlon Mack. He's a running back. He was like a fourth round pick by the Colts. you never talked about him. Then last year the Colts went out and drafted two offensive linemen,

and they were both home runs. The Colts now don't have the best offensive line in football, but it's the best young offensive line. Well, what do you know? Marlon Mack last year in 12 games almost got to 1,000 yards. Did Marlon Mac get better? No, the offensive line did. It's amazing to me that we acknowledge the importance of offensive lines all throughout football.

It's really the key to the New England's dynasty. It's not just that Bill Belichick is brilliant and Tom Brady's great, Tom doesn't get hit. Tom always has time. By the way, in that Super Bowl loss to the Eagles, what was it that lost it for the Patriots? Tom got hit and fumbled. The losses to the Giants in the Super Bowl, what lost it? Tom Brady faced pressure from the Giants defensive front.

Even Tom Brady is vulnerable to an offensive line that gets overwhelmed. If you go to the Super Bowl against Atlanta, Tom Brady had a horrible first half. The Falcons were teeing off on him. Tom Brady had a great fourth quarter. What happened? The Falcons defensive line was gassed and the Patriots offensive line dominated. We don't acknowledge the offensive line of the Cowboys in any of Zeke's greatness. I'm not saying he's not terrific, but if you put him behind the offensive line and then you give me the Texans Lamar Miller behind the Cowboys offensive line,

Lamar Miller is going to average half a yard more a carry and Zeke's going to probably average half to three quarters less a yard per carry. and they'll be a lot closer in what you would get per game out of them. You can't dismiss the Cowboys offensive line in all this. It's been the best offensive line in the NFL for four straight years, maybe six. And now as it ages and gets expensive and more injury prone, maybe now's the time to move off Zeke and keep paying the offensive line and drafting the offensive line. Because if you keep paying all these cowboys,

If you pay DAC and Amari and Zique and those linebackers into Marcus Lawrence, you know what you're not going to pay? The offensive line, which is getting really expensive and old. So, you know, it's, I'll say it again. There's a stat out this morning that shows it's not like people defend the Cowboys and Zieg any differently. That's a bunch of nonsense. And as DAC grows, they will and should become less reliant on Zique.

I trade him and get a haul of picks and get rid of. and get rid of this preseason nonsense. Judicial two years ago and now financial. He wants the new contract two years out. I saw a story yesterday. Chris Sims played in the NFL college football. He was at some golf tournament. And he did a, what do they call those,

like a walk-and-talk interview with Aaron Rogers. And, you know, Aaron had Mike McCarthy, and it worked for a while, one of a Super Bowl. And then at the end, it kind of got corrosive and didn't work. And it was pretty obvious. A lot of different stories out there. Aaron denies some of the stories, but there are stories that Aaron would, you know,

roll his eyes in the huddle and didn't like McCarthy, made it difficult. And so now Aaron's got a new coach. And the new coach is like, I have a system and it's pretty strict and we're not into audibling out of plays. And there's been some pushback in the media. Aaron's like, you know what, I ad lib a lot. I audible a lot because, you know, I do things that other quarterbacks can't do, which he's not wrong.

But I've always thought he ad libs differently than other quarterbacks, and I'll get to that in a second. So he was walking and talking with Chris Sims. Aaron was talking about audibbling and people are making too much of him kind of ad-libbing and audibling. Too much has made it. I know it is. Because there's audibles in every play. Well, I've been trying to defend people and just say, I think it's great that you guys are actually publicly having the conversation.

I think that's a positive, that Lefleur is willing to talk about it. You are, and that means it's going in the right direction. I know a lot of people thought it was a negative, and I just didn't see it that way. Negative about having a lot of experience being able to do things that other quarterbacks just can't do it. Yeah, right. Right. Right. Right.

Here's the thing. I'm for audibly. I am for audibly. Peyton Manning and Brady audible a ton, but there's different ways to audible. Okay. Tom Brady takes the play, goes to the line, sees a defense, and audibles out of a defense that he thinks is problematic. Peyton Manning did the same thing. Omaha, Omaha, Omaha. Aaron Rogers audibles differently. Aaron Rogers, and this has now been reported by somebody who is in the Hudson. is in the huddle, gets the play call, rolls his eyes in the huddle, goes to the line, has given up on the play, and throws it out of bounds. Aaron led the NFL in throwaways last year, meaning it's a middle finger to the coaching staff.

There's a difference between walking to the line, Brady, Breeze, Manning are legendary. Walk to the line. I don't like the defense. This is a problem. I'm audibling out of it. There is a difference between that and the criticism of Aaron Rogers, which I think you can pinpoint to data, which is gets to play, rolls his eyes, rips the coach in the huddle, confirmed by a teammate, Jeff Saturday,

and then goes to the line, regardless of defense, I'm not going to do this. Gets the snap, initial guy covered, chucks it out of bounds. It's called a throwaway, and Aaron led the NFL by a country mile in that stat last year. that's the difference. It is very generous to say some of Aaron's ad-libbing is an audible. Aaron is different. He's got a different personality. You become your personality as a quarterback.

Cam Newton is very expressive. He is a very dramatic. The way he dresses, the way he talks, his press conferences. And he's also like that as a quarterback. He's a very expressive quarterback. He's very, he's got mood. He's emotional. He emotes as a quarterback.

You become your personality. Tom Brady is very focused and driven. You see his home life. And if you watch him on the field, he is very efficient, focused, and driven, and very coachable. Aaron's personality, and this has now been documented by everybody from family members to teammates to coaches, is a little condescending, tends to be aloof, smarter than you probably, also make sure you know he's smarter than you. And that becomes his personality.

ad-limbing in the huddle before he gets to the line. Chris Carter talked about this on First Things First. I'm not here to bash Aaron Rogers. This stuff is confirmed by teammates, the eye rolls, the NFL throwaway lead. I think it's being generous to OSA. You know, Aaron just sort of wants the freedom to add-lib. No, Aaron makes his mind up often before he gets to the line that this play's not going to work. Here is Chris Carter this morning on First things first.

Aaron Rogers, he can learn a lot from what's going on in New England. Tom Brady never complains about what they call and what they're going to do. He makes it work. Aaron Rogers makes up excuses after the game. Now, they might be real, but they're not for us to hear. He's supposed to take the diplomatic approach after the game and blame it on himself, blame it on the teammates that he know are responsible, and then move on.

Aaron hadn't done that. Yes, he hasn't. Remember, adapting is really the way to survive as you age. I'm a broadcaster. If I don't adapt to the changing landscape, I die as a broadcaster. I've seen a lot of sportscasters don't adapt and they die. Okay? I talk some soccer.

I talk more NBA. I talk growing sports. I cut stuff that doesn't work as well. Adapting is how you survive as you age. Tom has been the great adapter, his body, his style, his ice cream, his film stuff. He's been the great adapter. Deep drops, short drops. He practices how to get hit.

Brady actually does that. Aaron, smart as he is, not so far a great adapter, which is chief, cowboy, get rid of the football. You're 35 increasingly brittle. Stop ad-libbing. Get rid of the football. And we've already had public discussions on. The new system doesn't quite work for him. So I think it's a fascinating year for Aaron.

I just want to create clarity. I don't think he audibles. He may often audible the way Brady-Brd. reason Manning did. But I think there are other situations where he makes up his mind pre-line-scrimmage, and this is not just me making it up. It is confirmed by throwaways and a report the eye-roll stuff in the huddle. That's just not me making stuff up. By the way, I love the NFL season. You know, I'm into the NFL. So this is obviously everybody's great in the preseason. Everybody's amazing in the preseason. And, you know, everybody thinks I take shots at the Cleveland Browns, right?

Hugh Jackson's on today. But I'll give you an example, the difference between the NFL and college football. Like in college football, Alabama is going to be favored by double digits and all but like one game next year. Same for Clemson. Same for Georgia. But in the NFL, it has always been inches, not feet. The most interesting game in week one just happens to feature the Cleveland Browns.

And I'll tell you why I think there's been so much ridiculous hype around Cleveland. and I'll go right to their first game when I think people are being absurd. And I'll lay it out for you and you can hate me and you can send it to Baker, Mayfield, Nodell Beckham, but they won't be able to deny any of it. They won't be able to deny any of it because it's all factual. That's coming up next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app.

Last night, a blown call changed the game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and no. Nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines.

We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answers. SportsSlics brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsSlice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch.

Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway.

Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me, he goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her.

What? Quarterback on office blue 42. Hey, rec, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's she at? Hey, Ms. Parker. Listen to the Cliverts show on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, fam?

This Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. and our podcast point game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves,

I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reed. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too.

Steve Nass would get that thing. That man, hell get to fly. He running up the court, licking his fingers, why he got the ball. Like, you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you. you get your podcasts. You know, sometimes it's easy in the state of Ohio because they have a national

college football power, Ohio State, that fans would think college football is like the NFL. And they're way different. On any Sunday in the NFL, anybody can beat anybody. And I mean anybody can beat anybody. But in college football, Ohio State can't lose about nine of their games. Three of them, they should win and probably will split. But in college football, you show up for a lot. of Saturdays in Ohio knowing Ohio State's going to win. The question is by how much? They may get

shocked once a year at Iowa, at Purdue, but that is an exception. That is not the rule. In the NFL, it's the opposite. Bad teams often crush good teams. Miami, Adam Gase and Miami gave the New England Patriots big trouble. In fact, in one Sunday, I watched, New England couldn't figure them out. They couldn't figure out Tanna Hill. So the reality is the NFL's different. In Cleveland, this just shows you what the NFL is. The best bet on the board in week one, and I've already gambled on this, I've already bet my money on it, is Tennessee plus five and a half against Cleveland at Cleveland. Now, you think to yourself, Collins just going to rip the Browns.

This is the difference between the NFL and college. Let's just take Tennessee and Cleveland. Tennessee last year, the five-point underdog, destroyed New England and Dallas, and beat Philadelphia and the Houston Texans. They beat four playoff teams, two they crushed. Cleveland went one in five against playoff teams. The one win was over Joe Flacco who got benched. So Tennessee's proven we can go up against the best in the league and hammer them.

Cleveland has not proven that. Tennessee last three years, nine and seven, nine and seven, nine and seven. A consistent winning football team. Cleveland's won eight games in three years. they haven't proved they can consistently win. Most important unit in the NFL is offensive line. Tennessee's is rated as number four pro football focus. Cleveland's is rated 20th and many subscribe to the belief that they're starting

tackles are bottom five in the NFL combined, left-right tackle. The coach for Tennessee, Mike Vrable, 9 and 7 in his first year, they were the least penalized team in the NFL. They're well coached. Houston, Cleveland has a rookie head coach, and this will be the youngest roster in the NFL. Tennessee added Adam Humphreys, best slot receiver available in free agency, and Roger Safford, two high-end players very low-maintenance, productive and low maintenance. Cleveland added the highly dramatic, talented but often injury-prone, Odell Beckham.

So on paper, if I reverse those, you'd say Cleveland should be a touchdown favorite. They're a five and a half point favorite. They have a deficit on consistently winning, beating good teams, offensive line, head coach, and they added more drama than Tennessee did. Like to me, this is the bet of the week one. Now, I'm not saying what's going to happen after that for Cleveland because I think Cleveland's going to win a lot of games, especially post- Thanksgiving. Their schedule lightens up.

But this shows you the hype around Cleveland. By the way, Tennessee is laying in the weeds, has been here in all offseason how great Cleveland is. Baker Mayfield can't shut up. It's taunt great, taunt, great, media, social. Tennessee crickets. Crickets. Crush New England.

Crush Dallas. Beat Philly. Beat Texans. Least penalized team. A coach that's proven he can handle it. Top five offensive line, 9-7, 97-9-9-7. and they're the dog and they're going to Cleveland. That's the difference between Ohio State Schedule and Cleveland.

Every Brown fan has that game as the automatic W. Every Brown fan, Tennessee is their automatic W. It's like Alabama against Troy. Everybody's put it down the W. That's your W. By the way, then you have to go to the Jets, play the Rams at Baltimore, at Niners, Seahawks, at Patriots, at Denver, and everybody in Cleveland, Tennessee's a W. That is the gap NFL in college.

That game has upset, written all over it, and Tennessee may just go in there with that veteran offensive line and just lay the wood on Cleveland for three hours. I've already bet it more than I should have. Here's Joy with the News. No, no, no, no. Turn on the news.

This is the herd line news. Very compelling case, Colin. I didn't make that up. No, no, you have a lot. You brought the facts today. I like it. The Browns fans are not going to be happy with it, though. So the Clippers shocked the NBA,

not only when they got Kauai Leonard and free agency, but also traded for Paul George. And Jerry West, who serves in a front office advisory role for the Clippers, explains his perspective on how they landed both stars. While he admitted he did have a small role in it, he says Kauai deserves the most props for making it happen. You know, in this league today, it's just so different than players are free to move around.

agents, obviously, and players contribute where they go. I've never seen anything like it where players can recruit other players, but I guess it's a modern-day NBA. And I think it's an awkward situation. Those players talk. And I'm not sure sure that maybe if Kauai had had some influence on Paul, that we would have been able to make a deal with Oklahoma City. Yeah, that's true.

By the way, it should be noted. This happens in college, Joy. when you go, this is an old secret in football. Let's say you go to Alabama, Nick Saban has three or four players on his team that he knows are really good recruiters. This is the way college recruiter. So everybody thinks the NBA players,

they're all recruiting. No, no, no. You don't think Urban Meyer knew the five or six Buckeye players, the upperclassmen who were great recruiters to 18-year-olds on campus. This is what players do. All colleges do that. They're not going to send you out with the dud.

The quiet guy that doesn't talk. to say that doesn't even know where anything is. That's not how it goes. By the way, in college joy, they even, they put party guy, like when Zeke came to Ohio State, if he was fun, loose, loose, upperclassman guy, Urban Meyer would give fun loose upperclassman guy to Zeke. You match personalities in recruiting. Yeah, which is, this is kind of the shock that exists with this story because

Kauai Leonard is just a smooth operator because nobody imagines that, I mean, the story on Kauai Leonard was that he doesn't talk. He has no relationship. relationships with anyone. He's just the odd guy and nobody talks to him and he just is a loner. Kind of weirdo. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And he's like, cool, I'll be the weirdo. That's fine. Please think I'm a weirdo. Please underestimate me. And everyone did. And meanwhile, he's just moving. He's changing the course of the NBA, like all behind the scenes. And he's just going to go right back into that role. Like, we're going to all forget as soon as the season starts that he was the mastermind behind all of this.

But Jerry West is right. The league is just different now. And that's just what it is moving forward. Like we have to forget how we used to look at the NBA and the way the teams are put together. So although he's not done yet, it's clear that Chris Paul's prime is behind him. And he's still more than capable of being a star point guard.

But the most recent report from Adrian Wojernowski says the Thunder have parked at their discussions to deal him elsewhere. Quote, an increasing expectation exists that he will start the season with the team. OKC has been working with Paul and his representatives on finding a trade, but nothing is materializing so deep into summer free agency. Sources said, both sides believe there are benefits to Paul playing out the season with the Thunder.

For now, there's a belief that there could be more success exploring trade scenarios after, again, after December 15th. The market expands after December 15th because that's when players who signed offseason free agent deals can become a part of the trade packages. Now, basically, Phil is falling through with the heat because the heat. Heat want the two picks that OKC has of theirs back. The reality is OKC is going to have to put some picks in the deal anyway because this is an insane contract no matter which way you look at it.

I also think that just younger teams don't want to bring in Chris Ball. Like he's a whole situation aside from the contract that you have to take on. He is he is not, I mean, he's an old school point guard. Can you say he's a leader? Like, in that regard, he's going to bring up young guys? He has leadership qualities, but, you know, it's funny. I think he plays well with young guys. I think he struggles with stars.

A lot of Clipper guys liked him, not the stars. So Oklahoma City no longer has any. I don't know. I still think Miami should, I think it's an interesting deal. Pat Riley knows more about basketball than I do, but boy, if you gave me four picks and Chris Ball. Well, I think the other issue is that it will handicap them moving forward at the salary cap because of his contract. So if you bring him in, you're really committing to him and everything he is.

They were much higher on the Westbrook situation, even though it was a different deal. So finally, sticking with trades that we would like to see, but probably won't happen, you love this guy. The Wizards apparently do too. They have zero interest in trading Bradley Beale, according to Barry Jackson and the Miami Herald. next significant event for the heat could be re-engaging with the Wizards if Beal rejects the three-year $111 million extension

he's eligible to sign after July 26. Please do. For now, the Wizards have rejected all trade overtures on Beal, a potential 2021 free agent. Since you've been on this show, who's the player in the NBA? He's a star and nobody

talks about him. Well, because everyone looks at John Wall. I wouldn't say that no one talks about him in the same breath that they should speak about him. Like he is on he's he is a better player than he gets credit for and he would be a incredible piece on

a championship level team. Oh. Like Clay Thompson piece. Like a big time guy. Yes. And unfortunately the wizard is just in a bad situation with John Wall's contract and his injury. So they're they're keeping him for now. I'm sure they want a haul. But everything could change if he doesn't sign the extension. That's right.

So. That'd be a really smart move in my opinion. We got a little a little less than a week to find out if he's going to do that and what they may do if he ends up If Bradley Beale is ever in Southern California, he is welcome on this show for as long as he wants to talk. Bradley Beale, Colin loves you. I love him as a player. Loved him at Florida. Love him at Washington.

Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd-Lie News. You know, Hugh Jackson's one of those guys. We were talking about this this morning. I said, you know, Hugh Jackson could do what Herm Edwards is doing. He could go do college.

Herm's got a personality. and it's funny about this. Not that Hugh can't coach in the NFL, but I've always thought Hugh Jackson is one of those guys. I always felt this with John Gruden. I felt it with Herm Edwards. I felt it with Hugh. Good looking guys, good energy, can talk to talk

and deal with young players very well. Hugh Jackson right now is the former Browns head coach, and he's doing some occasional broadcasting time to time was on the bingoes last year and he's joining us. Hugh, first of all, how are you? How are you spending your summer? I'm doing good. It's been a different summer, but it's been good.

So I'm looking forward to the next chapter in my life as well. By the way, take my audience into when you're a new coach, Mike Vrable is going to be in his second year, Freddie Kitchens, now in his first year. What are you doing right now? Are you evaluating personnel? Are you putting in the playbook? What is a coach doing a week before camp starts? First, the coach is making sure that all the injured players, you know, the guys that have had some kind of injury or some kind of anything that kept them out of practice, that those guys are moving towards being able to practice. And then you're just making sure you cross all the T's,

out all the eyes when it comes to your practice plans and your schedules, making sure that this is also a time when the National Football League office comes in from the officials, from, you know, substance abuse and all those things. They have to have time with the team. So you have to make sure you have a well-thought-out plan on how you're going to get all those things done on top of practice meetings and making sure we're ready to go by time the season starts. Your former team, Cleveland's got big personalities. Odell Beckham's a remarkable player. He's a big personality. Baker's got some real talent. He's a big personality. I think

veteran coaches are used to that over time, but Freddie Kitchens is a very young coach by experienced standards. Do you think there'll be some unique challenges for Freddie going forward with this talented but expressive roster? You know, Colin, I think it's that way for any first-time head coach. You know, I think even if you've been there, I still think there's a period that where you need to go through some things that are different when you're the guy that stands in front of the team all the time, when you're the guy that enforces discipline, when you're the guy that, you know, is trying to be the catalyst to winning. So I anticipate that there'll be some things that are difficult, but that's what brings the team closer together too. And if you can handle that the right way, you have a chance to have success. It's interesting for Freddie. he's an offensive guy. David and Joku is a great tight end. They have two good running backs,

three when Kareem Hunt returns. Jarvis Landry has the most catches in the first five years of his career than any wide receiver ever. And now you add Odell. Odell is got a global brand. He's not as patient. His clock's a little different. He's not young. He's been hurt. There's a lot of mouths to feed. How going forward do you feed all this talent? Because you help draft it. It is substantial in that building on both sides. No, they're very talented. They're very talented group. And they're all going to have to check their egos at the door.

It's going to have to truly be about winning. And there's going to be some bumps and bruises there because there'll be times when teams are going to do everything they can to take Odell out of the game and Jarvis is going to have to do what he does. And there's going to be times when they try to take him both out of the game and David's going to have to do what he does. And that's going to be the challenge. I think that's the biggest unknown for the team.

How will they function and making sure that this one football, ball gets distributed to all these guys who have the ability to make play. Hugh, I don't know how you feel about this. I tend to be, I call them my bore four. I like my quarterbacks to be boring. Russell Wilson, Andrew Luck, Tom Brady. I'm not into trash talk. I'm not into that stuff.

I think quarterback's a leadership position, and sometimes you have to swallow your pride and not win the moment. How bothered or are you that Baker doubles down on criticism of you? Does it bother you personally? It doesn't bother me personally because, I mean, again, I've been in the National Football League for a long time, and I've seen a lot of different ways that people handle things. He has to do what he feel he needed to do, you know, and so that's how he's handled it. Again, everybody's going to handle things differently.

That's how he chooses to make sure that he's ready to go, ready to play, or has his team ready to play. And again, the Browns wasn't playing Hugh Jackson. They were playing the bingles. So at the end of the day, whatever that was for him and their football team on those particular days, it worked. They won the game. So, you know, you can look at it how you want to. But I don't look at it and say, you know, I'm really disappointed by it because at the end of the day, Baker has to do what he thinks best for his football team. Yeah, he's got a chip on his shoulder.

By the way, many of the greats have a chip on their shoulder. It's a very redeemable quality for quarterbacks. And I do think there's part of that I really like. He's a little chattery for my taste, but so be it. I want to ask you about two NFL questions. There are people in the league, Hugh, that believe that analytically be very careful about signing a running back to a second long contract. Melvin Gordon, four years of production at Wisconsin, three great years with the Chargers. Do you sign him to another four years?

Similar situation with Zeke. Where do you fall? I mean, we watched New England and Philadelphia. It's running back by committee, and they win Super Bowls. Where do you fall on the star running back in 2019, who's got a lot of wear on those tires, but is really good? The really good ones and the ones that have the potential to be great, I fall that if they're the reason why you're winning football games, you've got to happen.

You know, there's no question about that. There's only a few of those in a national football league that you can go put that stamp on, and those guys have been consistent throughout their career. And I think, again, it's the vision of the organization. If that's how the team is built to win by running the football and throwing the ball when they need to score, then that's what you better do. But if you start changing the approach on what it takes to win, you always said you take the runner out of the equation and now you can't win. Now that's a whole different conversation. If I said to you take quarterback out and you ran your team salary cap, take quarterback out, and I said, who are the next three guys you'd pay?

What would be the positions? It would be the left tackle, it would be wide receiver, and then running back. So you're an offensive coach, you? Absolutely. By the way, Aaron Rogers was talking a couple days ago with Chris Sims about audibling, and he's pushing back a little bit on this whole thing. I audible too much. Were you ever bothered as a coach or a coordinator when your quarterback audibled?

Absolutely not, because, Colin, we work through that process together. I mean, if the quarterback is making changes in audibly, in the game, it's because I've given him the parameters, and we've worked through this process, that when this look comes up, we need to get to this. And again, there's nothing that can be said about experience. I mean, Aaron's been playing the game a long time. And so he knows when things are good and when things are bad. And so I think you have to give the really good players that kind of lead way.

And I would hope that, you know, you don't try to put a guy in a box to where you stop him from being the best version of himself, you know, because that could hurt a player. Hugh, I love talking to you, and I say this was respect. I think you're one of those guys that could hit home runs at the college level if you wanted to, and college pays just like the NFL does. Have you ever considered college? I sure have. You know, and college, it doesn't matter to me where I end up coaching at in the future. I would coach in college in the right situation and a heartbeat.

And obviously, I'd love to go back and coach in the National Football League so that I can get that stink off of me. But, again, I just like coaching. And I don't care where it is or who it's for. Long as this the right situation and we're aligned correctly and we're after the same things. And I think good things can happen. It's great talking to you, Hugh. You too, always.

Anytime you're in L.A., you want to stop by the couch. Love talking to you. Guy knows his football and loves his offense. Hugh Jackson. Thanks, coach. Thank you. Coming up, a crazy, crazy list by USA Today that I, is it the red sections, the sports section. Purple is Hollywood. Green is money. Red is sports.

And they did something in their red section. I just don't agree with. And it's a player I love. Next, the herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending. Opinions are flying. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories. And the behind the headlines. We go straight to the source,

the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games,

from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice.

On the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me,

your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark.

Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses.

Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth? Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person.

Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose. on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What's up, guys? This is Clever Taylor the 4th.

And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out.

Quarterback on office, Blue, 42. Hey, Wreck, my mama want you to weigh better. What? Hey, Ms. Parker. Listen to the Clifferts show on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defying the odds.

Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows. Without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective

on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by,

like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nass would get that thing. That man, hell get the flanks. He running up the court, licking his fingers why he got the ball, like, after you go through a training camp with that, I said, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court,

and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Great to have you in. If you own a sports team, need to be informed, smart decisions to build a champ no different when it comes to buying or selling a car. True car.

Do good choices, new or used. Ready to sell or trade. a new car, use car, check out true car. True cash offer not available in all areas. By the way, I can like a player, but feel like he's past his prime. If you watch football games, teams will tell you what they think about their personnel

by the game plan. So when I watch a football game, the first 30 minutes of a football game, the first two possessions, I'm watching what the team is telling me. How do they think on film? Does Belichick think on film, his corners match up with their receivers? Are they in zone coverage?

Are they in tight man? The coaches watch film all week. They'll tell you what they think about their personality. Remember a couple years ago, Alabama played Washington in one of those semifinal games. And Washington was telling you they didn't necessarily think Alabama could beat him over the top throwing so they crowded the box. Alabama told you the same thing against Washington. They crowded the box, throw the ball over the top of us.

You can see what the coaching staffs thought of their deep passing games. And here's a prime example. Last couple of years, the New Orleans Saints, coaching staff, Drew Breeze, his attempts have gone down sharply. So what are the Saints and Sean Payton staff telling you? Drew's getting older. Drew, we can't rely on Drew to the level. we rely on Drew.

That's what Sean Payton is telling you. Last couple of years, his arm gets tired. USA Today came out with its top 10 current NFL players. They had Drew Breeze at third. Drew Breeze is not the third best quarterback in the league. He's certainly not the third best player. The Saints are telling you by drafting running backs and receivers, Drew needs more help.

What was interesting, and I love Drew Breeze. I always call it my favorite. quarterbacks of all time. Drew is in there. Aaron Rogers and Favre are not. In fact, Aaron's not. Favreve may be. I love Breeze. Huge fan. First ballot Hall of Famer. But if you watch the Saints at the end of last year, they averaged 37 points a game in their first 11 games and like 20 points in their last six. Drew Breeze did not throw the deep ball. Drew Breeze was tired. Drew Breeze at the end of the year was shot. He was a great leader. He works his tail off. He was efficient, but he couldn't throw the ball down the field.

They were not the same offense. Everybody got caught up in the Rams Saints call. The story of that game was, Saints couldn't move the ball consistently. Breeze did not play in Week 17. If you go to the last six games of the year last year, that's with a top three offensive line in the NFL, the Saints have it. That is with one of the great young star receivers. That is with above average running backs.

That is with the best play caller in the NFL. Their passer rating was 86. They passed for 230 yards a game and have 315 yards of offense. That's what their offense was at the end of the year. Go to that Rams game. And they were a BB gun. They couldn't throw the ball down the field. So the last two years, this coaching staff and this organization has told you by their drafting of running backs,

offensive line, wide receiver, they're telling you we can't load this up on Drew Breeze. post-Christmas, he's wearing down. Not everybody ages like Tom Brady. Not everybody gets better post- Thanksgiving at 40 like Tom Brady. Brady's a very unique, and Brady's also a much bigger guy. Brady's 6-5. Drew's like 5-11 and a half. Brady's about 2.35.

Breeze is not. Tom's got a better arm at this point in his career than Drew Breeze does. Tom doesn't wear down quite as much as Breeze does later. Listen, what Breeze is physically is what quarterbacks are physically at 39 and 40. They wear down by November, December, and January. But a weird list, Drew Breeze right now is, and I love him, but he's not the third best quarterback in the NFL. He's not. Mahomes is Brady is Rogers, is, there are a lot of guys I could list.

I mean, if you go to Philip Rivers last year at the end of last year, Philip Rivers was a better player at the end of the year than Drew Breeze. And I love Breeze. But Rivers was great last year. Don't go back to that Patriot playoff loss. Philip was tremendous last year. top of the hour my staff and I have put a great deal of work into something that's completely goofy

it's completely absurd and we'll see if you like it absurd but we thought about it and it made me I was watching Tom Hanks has got this six part series on CNN and CNN's been doing this thing for the last couple years where they have like the 60s the 70s the 80s

and they take you through a decade and they show all the music and the pop culture and the politics and it's fascinating. You're sitting there, if you weren't born in the 60, I was born in the 60s, but they show you the 70s and the music and the pop culture and the angst and the wars, and it's fascinating.

Tom Hanks has a new series, six-part series on the movies per decade. He's already done like the 80s and the 90s, and it's great television. And it got me thinking, Tom Hanks got me thinking about Tom Brady and how many quarterbacks actually remind me of actors. I know it's weird, but play along.

I think you'll like it. Hour one down, hour two coming. Peter King stops by Will Blackman to Josh Norman today. It's the herd. One more herd. The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode we're cutting through the noise. down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the

source, the athlete themselves, their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answered. Sports slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice. On the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slice Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Keer Games. And in recognition of mental health

awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing and we're still chasing it and we don't know when we've done enough because people scoreboard watch life becomes about wins and losses Steve Burns Dustin Ross because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth or are you a good person because you're afraid because that's two different intentions bro absolutely and that that's two different levels of trust I want you to just really be a good person

Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What's up, guys? This is Clifford Taylor the Fourth. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker, this linebacker walks up to me. He goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to. wave at her. What? Come out. Quarterback on office blue with 42. Hey, Rhett, Mom, I want you to wave at her.

What? Where's she at? Hey, Ms. Parker. Listen to the Cliverts show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed.

and finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows. Without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup,

he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stopped by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get to fly. He running up the court, licking his fingers,

why he got the ball. Like, you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah. You figure it out real quick. Oh, yeah. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

All right, here we go, hour two, it's a Thursday, This is The Hurt, wherever you may be and however you may be listening. We are live in Los Angeles on IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS1. Joy Taylor has breaking news in 30 minutes, I'm told. I do not know what it is, but breaking news in 30 minutes? Sure. That was coy?

Yes, we do. You have breaking news? Breaking news. It's very important. Okay. I'm a little disappointed, but. You're a little disappointed? Yes.

We'll get to it. Now I feel like I'm just not a good teammate. No, don't be too hard on yourself. All right. I'm in a good mood. We'll get to that Hollywood NFL quarterback thing in a second. It is great to have you in today. Peter King, Will Blackman this hour.

So I'm very excited. 49 days until the Packers played the Bears. Rookies reported yesterday to some teams. Camps open in about a week. I think the Packers are a fascinating team because I think the NFC North, you can make an argument today, and I think it would be a good argument, is the best division in football between the Packers, the Bears, the Vikings, and a really good fourth place team, Detroit. They have the best quarterback of any fourth place team in the NFL, Detroit Lions.

And it's interesting because we were talking about this morning as a staff. Aaron Rogers is always in the news. There's more stuff about him. You know, he's going to have to audible less this year, and he likes audibly and everybody audibles. And we'll see how it plays out with Matt LaFleur. I mean, Aaron's talented. Matlefer's smart. I think it, my guess is it'll work out pretty well. But there's been a little off season. You know, Aaron's like, why shouldn't I ad lib? I'm pretty good at ad-libbing. And he's right. He is. And Matt LaFleur has a much more rigid, progressive system than McCarthy, which you go to the line with two plays and you play one of them. You don't audible out of that stuff. At least that's what I read this morning. So, and I think what's

interesting, we talk about this all the time in sports. Windows close fast for teams. Players get old. You see it in the NFL. Seattle. Seahawks. Wow, wow, wow, wow, boom, closed. And you see it with the San Francisco 40-n-h. Wow, wow, wow, wow, Kaepernick situation, boom, closes. We thought those teams, Harbaugh couldn't get along with the owner.

They're in a Super Bowl. An hour later, Harbaugh's gone. Kaepernick's out. The world implodes. And I think what's fascinating, I wonder, as I watch Aaron, has his personal Super Bowl window closed. Green Bay, by the way, I think they'll win the division.

They finally have a young progressive coach. Last two years, I think they've either drafted or purchased eight defensive starters. Aaron finally has a defense and finally has a young progressive coach. I would make them a slight favorite in the division. But then you've got Chicago, which for years was talented but dysfunctional. Now they've got a great young GM, Ryan Pace. They draft very well. And a terrific young coach, Matt Nagy.

Their defense is ridiculous. They're the most talented defense in the NFL. They were number one rush defense. They allowed the least points per game, 17 in the NFL. So now you got Chicago. And then you have Minnesota. Head coach Mike Zimmer last four years has won 11 games, eight games, 13 games, 8, 7, and 1 has not had a losing season.

They were tied in the NFC for sacks, best third down defense. I could argue Minnesota is a top four roster in the NFL and arguably the best receiving core and certainly the best receiving core and tight end core in the NFL. So Minnesota can play. And now you have Detroit, which Matt Stafford, the most talented quarterback that will finish in fourth much of his career.

They've also, three of the last five years, had a winning season. So the division is stacked, but you see this a lot. Whereas New England and Philadelphia in recent years have taken advantage of their divisions dysfunction. New England's been doing it for 20 years. Philadelphia, New York's been a little dysfunctional. Washington's been a little dysfunctional. Dallas has been functional, but Philadelphia has used to.

and taken advantage of the dysfunction of the giant in Washington to either win their division or get to the playoffs or win playoff games and win a Super Bowl. New England's them the same. Green Bay has not. They had these years when Chicago was a mess dysfunctional. They no longer are. Minnesota underachieved. They no longer did.

If I'd have told you nine years after Green Bay won a Super Bowl, remember they were 15 and 1, Aaron was the best young quarterback, The roster was young and talented, and they were returning virtually everybody. And in the last five years, they've won 12 games, 10 games, 10 games, 7, game, 6 games. And no Super Bowl appearances. So it, and you see this all the time in sports. The windows open and they shut quickly on teams. My question for Aaron Rogers, Chicago's no longer dysfunctional.

Minnesota's got a better roster than Green Bay. Detroit's about the best fourth place team. And by the way, the NFC now, San Francisco is a real player. The L.A. Rams, you could argue after Philadelphia, are the NFC favorites. The NFC is clearly the better of the two conferences. So we'll see if the window is closed. Over the weekend, Aaron was talking about with Chris Sims about, does he audible too much? And Aaron was like a quarterback would say, I think the audibly things that Aaron is overstated.

Too much has made of it. I know it is. Because there's audibles in every play. Well, I've been trying to defend people and just say, I think it's great that you guys are actually publicly having the conversation. I think that's a positive. That Lefleur is willing to talk about it. You are, and that means it's going in the right direction.

I know a lot of people thought it was a negative, and I just didn't see it that way. Negative about having a lot of experience, being able to do things other quarterbacks just can't do it through that screen. Right. Or haven't done. We'll see it. See it how it plays out.

Can't wait. I do think Green Bay wins their division, but I think it's narrow. I think it's really tight. All right. So I was watching this Tom Hanks documentary. He's doing this six-part series on CNN at about movies. And CNN does these decade-long kind of docu-series.

And they're fascinating. I've watched all of them. And I don't watch CNN a lot, but that's the thing that pulled me. Anthony Bourdain pulled me in the late Anthony Bordane, pulled me into CNN. And these docu series are fantastic. Well, Hanks has a new one on movies. And he looks at a decade of movies, the 80s and the 90s. And I'm watching this, and I'm thinking, you know, in my life, Tom Hanks is the most accomplished actor.

He's got like a star named after him. He's on the NASA board. But very rarely, except for the year he won Philadelphia, the Oscar for Philadelphia, has he been the It actor? When he got into acting, Jack Nicholson was the talk of Los Angeles. And then there was Russell Crow got hot and then Ryan Gosling. But if you look at Tom Hanks' career over the last 25, he's America's greatest actor. He's our most accomplished actor. And I thought it's similar to Tom Brady.

that, you know, there's been, now Patrick Mahomes is a hot guy. Before that Aaron Rogers was a hot guy. And before that Peyton Manning had more talent. And very rarely has Tom been, he wins Super Bowls, but is he the it quarterback? Not really. He walked into this league and it was, who was it? It was Farrb. And then Manning was more talented.

And then Aaron, how many times did I have to argue? He's better than Aaron Rogers. And now Patrick Mahomes. So I would say, we started saying a lot of these quarterbacks remind me of actors. Their careers are like actors. And so the first one I'd put up is Brady is Hanks. In the end, best ever at their profession, but have rarely been over a one or two year period, the it guy in their profession.

Aaron Rogers is George Clooney, talented and really good looking. Getting a little arrogant, neither had as much success later. as we thought they would. Cam Newton is Ben Affleck. Man can they be great. Cam on an MVP. The town Goodwill hunting for athlete. But Cam also had a year he completed

53% of his throws, and Affleck made Gile. Great highs, ugly lows. Philip Rivers is Tom Cruise. A little crazy. The couch with Oprah. Right. Phillips, the 38 kids and is the biggest Crash Talker and the NFL quarterback.

Both have been really good for a really long time, but Cruz never won an Oscar and Phillips never won a Super Bowl. Drew Breeze is Merrill Streep. I mean, they've been good for like ever, right? What an excellent comparison. Likeable? Who doesn't love Merrill? Who doesn't love Breeze?

Probably the most respected, liked people in their respective profession. Every time you look up, Breeze is throwing for 5,000. Every time you look up, Merrill's being nominated for an Oscar. Dak Prescott is Chris Evans. He's fine when surrounded by superheroes, but not very valuable on his own. You like Chris Evans. I mean, Chris Evans is Captain America. Well, he was Captain America.

Very excited for the new Captain America as well. Andrew, look, I love him. He's Daniel Day Lewis. Super smart and talented. Not a very good interview. And don't really draw a rating. Daniel Day Lewis, not a box office hit. Andrew Luck, cult TV ratings are average.

Talent, smart, unbelievable. Patrick Mahomes is Rami Malik. Literally, Malik won an Oscar in the first movie any of us ever watched them in, Bohemian Rhapsody. Mahomes won an MVP in the first season as a starter. Ben Rathlisberger is Russell Crow. They're big and they're feisty and they're tough and they've had some real issues

over the years, getting along with people, including hotel clerks for Russell Crowe. But you got to be honest, they had a lot of talent. A lot of talent. Baker Mayfield is Jennifer Lawrence, young, talented, but you read things about their attitude, and I have my questions about both leadership skills. Kirk Cousins is Johnny Depp. He gets paid like a star, but I never go to. any of Johnny Depp's movies.

They get paid like stars. Are they really stars? Don't you have to get me to a theater once a decade? Marcus Marietta is the late Buster Keaton. Neither of them talk. Buster Keaton was a silent movie star. Yeah. That's kind of a bad joke.

Russell Wilson is Chris Pratt. A little stalky, very, very convicted with their religion. Christopher Pratt was part of an ensemble cast. Russell Wilson came into the league with an ensemble cast. But now both are leaders of their respective franchises. Deshawn Watson is Chadwick Bozeman. Both emerging his stars haven't won anything yet,

but we're pretty sure they will. Eli Manning is Will Smith. It used to be great. It's getting a little sad. What is this? Will Smithslander. It's getting a little sad. No, it's not.

Will Smith is still star. I reject this comparison. And Ely. And Joe Flacco finally is the volleyball from Castaway. No personality in a constant blank stare. Wilson. The volleyball from Castaway. Now, that was slander.

Yes, that was. Will Smith is not Eli. Will Smith is a star still? Yes, an international superstar and a social media star as well. And his wife has read, table talk and the Smith family is definitely still on top of the world. Not a comparison to Eli. I have to think

about it a better comparison for Eli. Yeah, I didn't say they were poor. Eli is definitely not that either. Who was Philip Rivers? Tom Cruise. So you must love Philip Rivers then. And I think Tom Cruise is fantastic. He's a part of your favorite movie of all time.

Mission Impossible 9. I think Cruz is great. I think he's a little kooky. But I like, you know, Tom Cruise and Philip Rivers are. And Tom Cruise is supposed to be a great athlete also. He is. Phillips out there. Philip is the biggest trash talking quarterback they say in the league's history. Yeah. He'll talk trash talkers to edge rushers.

In your face, guy that's going to hit me. Like, that's what he does. He's crazy. But he's great. And Tom Cruise, a little out there. But he's great. There you go for our little Hollywood quarterback thing, which was a seven-minute waste of everyone's life.

No, it was very fun. If I ever see Joe Flacco, he's going to say, I'm a volleyball. That's what you think I am. Listen, Wilson was the star of that movie. Well, you would reject that because Tom Hanks is literally the star of that movie. All right. Coming up next, Will Blackman, former NFL DB, Packers, Redskins, Jags, Giants. Funny guy, by the way. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports

Radio, FS1, and the I-Hard Radio app. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending. opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines.

We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the question. questions everybody wants answered. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kier Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing.

And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross. Because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth? Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro.

Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free, our Heart Radio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the Fourth.

And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This linebacker walks up to me, he goes, Hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Quarterback on office blue 42. Hey, ref, my mama wants you to wave at her.

What? Where's she at? Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Cliverts show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, Fam? This is Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano and our podcast Point Game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed.

And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall.

And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nass would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court, licking his fingers while he got the ball.

After you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the, iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In just two days, one of the greatest fighters of our generation puts his legacy on the line as Manny Pacchio battles undefeated world champion Keith Thurman in the can't miss fight of the

summer. Saturday at 9 Eastern live on pay-per-view or order on the Fox Sports app. I got a sign boxing glove from both. You did too. I did. I have Keith Thurman winning this fight. Younger, reach, speed, agility, size. But Packer, Keow's experience. This is going to be a... Do you know that nobody by... I found this out yesterday. Nobody buys...

I'm going to buy the pay-per-view tomorrow. Nobody buys pay-per-view before the day of the fight. I found this out yesterday. I'll lock it in tomorrow morning. I don't want to... Yeah, I mean, it makes sense, though. I don't think I ever...

Maybe one fight ever. I don't want to be... I'm trying to remember which one it was. Freaking out the day of, and there's a zillion people calling and get it this puppy locked in. Well, yes. I encourage you also.

Thank you for this, by the way. This is very cool. It's cool. Will Blackman, 10 NFL seasons, been around the league. You see him on the NFL network. He is a sharp dress man and actually has a sense of humor on Twitter. I got a sense of humor. You don't take yourself very, look at you today. I tell you what? Look at you.

I'm just like a Somalié. I'll take a pinot noir. From Oregon. Actually, I have a WSET level two certification in wine. I own a wine store. I am a personal wine concierge. I drink wine. Dead serious.

You are? Dead serious. Yeah, I saw wine to high-end people. I like a reesling. Where's it from? Germany. Wow. Or you go to a Kung Fu girl in Washington.

Let's do it. Let's do it. I'm serious, bro. I'm not, but I still like it. I'm serious. We go ahead. Okay. By the way, everyone's sleeping on Pacquil, by the way.

By the way. You think Paco is going to win the fight? He has a chance. Well, of course he has a chance. By the way, you ever seen him in person? He's really small. No, I mean, in person, I walked down the hallway with. them. Thurman's like significantly longer and rangier and Pachio, you're like, that's the greatest

pound for pound fighter of all time. Thurman will win the fight if he lands that kind of right hand that Juan Manuel Rake has handed. Right. Anyhow. No, that's not done anyhow. By the way, we were talking this morning about the difference between college football and the NFL is that in college football, if you play for a power like Ohio State, you're not going to lose nine games. You're in about three of them where they have close to similar personnel. Tennessee's a five-point dog to Cleveland in the opener, and they have a top 5-0 line. They were 9 and 7 last year, least penalized team, added at in Humphreys,

and Roger Sapphold in the offensive line. And they're a dog going to Cleveland. And I'm like, are we sleeping on Tennessee, or are we over-hyping Cleveland? So let's start with that. Cleveland's the most talked about team in the NFL. Right, hands down. Are they legit?

I believe they are legit on paper. And I believe they're going to be legit this year. And it's based on the culture. I feel like they're going to come out playing very, very well. What happens when they drop one game? They drop two games. Say if they drop three games in a row,

what's going to happen in that locker room? So that's where culture takes over? Culture takes over, 100%. There's an old saying in the NFL, you can lose two straight, you'll lose a third, a coach can lose a locker room. I never heard that, but yeah, that's very, very true. So the culture is what's going to help that team be really good or really bad.

When you look at that division, though, I take Pittsburgh to win it because I think they have the best offensive line, arguably the best coach, the best quarterback, and I do think they get to the quarterback. They pass, they edge rush well. Right. So I'll take Pittsburgh. You actually like Baltimore. I like Baltimore just because of what they, what DeCosta did in the offseason. He added Earl Thomas once Cleveland added O'Dell.

I feel like that secondary is built to defeat Cleveland. By the way, they also upgraded their running back situation. Right. Get Ingram. There's a couple of teams. in the NFL, Chicago's one and Baltimore's the other, Tennessee may be the third. You can tell

they're going to go a little old school. They don't feel they're explosive offensively over the top, so they're going to pound you. Yeah, Navy's not that far from the Ravens either. I'm sure the coaches talk. I'm sure, I guarantee we're going to see a wishbone. I promise we'll see a wishbone with the Ravens. But their success is going to be based

off what Lamar Jackson does this year. That's what I see. That's what I see. When you, listen, we all know that in the NBA, there are certain players you pay and you just swallow hard. They're going to take your cap up. Anthony Davis, you just got to pay him. And then you figure out little pieces around him. But the NFL, Will Blackman joining us, is different. Historically, people have bailed on Favre, Peyton Manning, Joan Ameth, with years left to play.

That's the NFL. You let go of really good players because outside of quarterback, very few players are worse. even half a point in terms of what Vegas does the odds. I know Zeke is great, right? 100%. Why doesn't the offensive line for Dallas get half the credit? By the way, DeMarco Murray, 13 touchdowns, 1,500 yards behind that all line. What happened to DeMarco when he left?

Is Zeke just that special? I believe Darren McFadamaran for 1,000 yards too. And by the way, at the time, he was considered a shot fighter. When you look at Zeke, do you just think? can't trade him. I think he you do pay him. I think he's worth being paid. But if I was I wouldn't hold out. I would take whatever they're going to pay. I wouldn't hold out because he is based on everything that's going around with him outside of football. He is tradable. You know, I still have them top three running backs. You know, I have them right now the top guy going in this

year. We're going to see what Levian Bell does. And I think by the end of the year, Sequan will be the leading rusher this year. Just, I believe he's just... Giants have upgraded their own line. They have upgraded, yeah. They have. They've done it actually last two years. They've got a good job to upgrade.

And then year or two with the guys they got last year, I think it's going to be a massive improvement. But yeah, I like Seek. But yeah, I think Zeke, he just, he's that good. You know, just playing against him, he is that good. He's big body, extremely hard to tackle. He was a hurdle, all-state herdler in high school, you know, so he can hit the home run.

He can run, you know, really good out the backfield. Overall, he is the complete runnerback and really good pass protection. That's the one thing that's hard to find, too, and a guy who can run the ball, receive the ball, and also protect the quarterback. And he's good at that as well. He is immature. His father acknowledged when he came into the league, the quote was, my son's not ready to be some American football star yet. He's a fun kid. He wants to be around fun people.

His dad said that. Right. And to some degree, his dad's been, we had the Mardi Gras, we've had the Vegas saying, we've had some incidents. You've been in NFL locker rooms for a decade. Go back to your career and the young immature guy, does the green light go on or are they always immature? Have you seen guys literally changed from immature to mature? Yeah, sometimes it took for a player to go somewhere else to learn. So I'll mention a guy.

When I was in Seattle, there was a player safety, Winston guy. Winston guy had dreads and he, I mean, measurable 6 to 215. He could run. He can cover the field. tackle you do other things well. And I think just mentally he just wasn't ready yet. And I'm like, man, you're behind Earl and Cam Chancellor. I mean, what a great place to learn, you know. So I end up going to Jacksonville. He ended up coming to Jacksonville as well after he got released. And he was what Coach Gus Bradley, Gus Bradley knew him. That's kind of how it is. You know a guy, you bring him in.

And he got another opportunity. And I think once he got the starting job, just didn't know how to handle it because he didn't prepare himself in terms of how to be more mature about it. And then he eventually went to the Colts. And then when he went to the Colts... Went to the Colts, he cut his dreads off, you know, became a father and just understood like, hey, I need to take advantage of my opportunity. So he grew up once he went, you know, to a couple of teams. So yeah, I seen that, you know, just to name him, for example, because I was really close

to him and I seen him go through the maturation process. When you came into the league, now you're in Wine, Somali. Were you ready to go maturity-wise? Absolutely not. Absolutely not. You weren't. I was not. It's funny you mentioned that.

On the way here, I was thinking, I was like, okay, we always find things off the cuff. And the things, the two things that's hard for an NFL player is your transition into the league and your transition out of the league. And I've gone through both. Transition into the league, you know, we were talking at the barbershop the other day is like, hey, you know, this guy, you're, you have no responsibility in college. And then all of a sudden, you become a professional athlete. You have to buy a house, buy a car, you have bills, you have all these things you got to take care of. You're like, dude, how do I do? I never did this in college.

There's no, unless you're a finance major, there's no course for that. And then transition out of the league, I play football from six years old to 34. My whole life was scheduled out for me. My whole life. And so now I'm out and I'm like, I need to get something. I need to do something. Yeah. I need to schedule and plan out.

What am I going to do now? because I'm so used to waking up. I do this, I do that, I do this, and I go home. It's the same thing all over again. I've been doing it since I was six years old. That's fascinating. It's crazy. It is crazy.

Will Blackman, Wine Somalié. I was saying, I think it's amazing. No, studying to be one, yeah. Isn't that amazing? I love it. Absolutely. Look up maximum beverage. They're my wine stores in Connecticut.

Go to NFL Wine Guy on Twitter and Instagram. That's Gary V. That's NFL Wine Guy. That's me. That's you? Yeah. You're an NFL wine guy That's my handle

Tell me something about the The Bordeaux region The Bordeaux Well you got Merlo on the right bank You got cab on the left bank We just had something from Truppelang Mondot From the right bank, St.

de Millyan And he brought his His wine It was 85% Murlo 5% cab And 2% cap 3% cab franc I believe it was

And it was good It was awesome I'm thinking of having A Pino Grey What does it go well with? You can, it's light. Actually, what's interesting is Pinogrigio, Pinot Gris. They're all kind of the same. Pinot Gris is gray. That's the word for it. So you can have that with any kind of like white fish or whatever it is. It's very good. I got you. I do this. Joy. You do this. You really does.

You guys discuss them and I'll just try them. Okay, his name is Will Blackman. He actually has a sense of humor. I love your life story. I really like it a lot. I like your life. I appreciate it. No, I like it. You have things to say. You're interesting. You know, you're a guy that I can tell without knowing you that well.

You think about stuff. Yeah. Because whenever I ask you questions, you have thought about. You see my eyebrows already? Is that what it is? I'm like, oh, when you drive in your car, you may listen to music or sometimes you just think. Yeah, I do. Yeah.

You're a thinker. Especially coming here, I don't, it's unpredictable when I come here to hang out with you guys. So I know you're going to, I'm just, I'm just ready. You got to be ready. I pay attention to the world. You do. Wine in Somalia. It's so good to see you.

Yeah, you too. Are you a Napa guy? I've gone to it. Napa's cool. I like Old World. That's kind of my vibe. Like Italy? Old World is Europe, yeah.

You like Old World? Yeah. My thing is like Shablies. People don't understand that Champagne's name Champagne because it comes from the Champagne. Yeah, champagne can only be called champagne if it's made in Champagne, France. Thank you. Otherwise, it's called sparkly. There's other names, but it's sparkling wine.

Prosecco. Ponceco, Cava, mascato. Look at this guy. Cremant. What the hell? What's going on here? At NFL Wine Guys. My new handle, I talk about wine only.

Because I talk about wine on my regular handle, and people are like, oh, yeah, you know, I just drank it. I don't really care. So I'm like, no one appreciates it here. Let me create NFL Wine Guy. This guy appreciates it. Okay, well, we'll follow it. A couple of thinkers. And then all those professional athletes out there that are looking to buy wine, I am your guy.

I'm being serious about that. That's what I do. Good seeing you, Joy, with the news. No, no, no. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. What do, Baker Mayfield, Kyler Murray, Russell Wilson,

Troy Aikman, Nick Foles, Cam Newton all have in common. I don't know. They all transferred in college. Historically, players who transfer from one college to another were required to sit out one season before being eligible to play, and things have changed.

So surprise, surprise, guess who isn't a fan of that? Nick Sabin. The issue with the transfer portal is we've gotten very liberal in giving people waivers. So when we do that, it becomes free agency, which I don't think is good for college football. I don't think it's good for fans. We make commitments to players for four years. They make commitments to us to be in our program. It may not work out for everybody, and they may have a better opportunity someplace else.

but if they had to sit out for a year, it would be a consequence for them in terms of their commitment. Do coaches have to sit out a year when they transfer jobs? No, Nick, they don't. Let's see. Well, you know, maybe he just forgot that he transferred in the middle of the season from Michigan State, Dallas, too. That's available. Sometimes people forget. I don't want to hear this from Nick Staten.

For that reason, and just because I don't want to hear this stuff from really from any college coach. We don't need to get into the conversation about whether players should be paid or not, but you have a very limited amount of time to play college football. If a kid wants to transfer, for whatever reason, he wants to transfer, he's not getting to playing time he wanted or was promised. Or doesn't like his position, coach. He doesn't like his position. Maybe there's some other issue with the school that's personal.

It really doesn't matter. He should be allowed to transfer schools. Coaches can move in the middle of the season. And if you don't like it, then make it illegal for coaches to move in the middle of the season. Also, most kids don't want to transfer to very. tiny, tiny number. It's so exaggerated. And Nick is always on this because he was talking about guys sitting out of bowl games

too, which I also just dismiss me with it. Like if a guy is trying to protect himself from blowing his ACL and what is overall a meaningless bowl game to him after he's given three or four years of his body to the school, it's okay.

He's looking towards his future. Isn't that the whole point of college to prepare yourself for the future? It's such a small amount of kids that do this. And their kids that are seriously considering the NFL as their future career. They want to play. They don't want to sit on the bench behind another five-star running back. Right.

I mean, it doesn't, it's such a small amount. It's just so exaggerated. And it then it becomes exaggerated because Nick Saban says it. And then everyone starts freaking out that this is this huge, dramatic problem. And then they change the rule. And then it hurts the kids. It's not the rule for the coaches. It shouldn't be the rule for the kids.

It's just calm down. And you did transfer in the middle of the season. Like, it's going to be okay. So the post-Paeton Manning Broncos have not exactly had a very easy time filling that position. But earlier this offseason, they traded for Joe Flacco and then proceeded to draft Missouri's Drew Locke in the second round of the draft. And as a result, GM John Elway is very confident in the team's current quarterback situation. We just felt that, you know, with Joe coming in and be able to get him in a trade and where he is in his career and feel like he's in his prime, and at least we hope he is. and, you know, to be able to have a young guy like Drew learned under him

and be able to kind of solidified that position for a while. Obviously, we've been looking for one since Peyton retired. And so that's always a difficult position to fill, but, you know, finally feel pretty good about that position of where we are. I actually like Flacco to Denver more than everybody else. I don't think they're great at quarterback, but I do feel today, Joy, they're settled for two years. I think they're not pathetic or in chaos.

I never felt like Joe Flack. was a disaster. Sometimes situations just reach the end, and it's time to move on, and there's just nothing else more you're going to accomplish there. He's not that level of quarterback that's just going to keep reinventing himself within the game. Those are, like we were just discussing, outliers are very, very, very, very rare. They are the exception, not the rule. So I think this is a good situation for the Broncos, and like you said, it'll keep them afloat for two years.

Veteran, smart, talented young guy. Yeah. They're good. You know, who knows what's going to happen with Drew Locke. At least he's sitting behind a guy that now also, I'm sure, feels like he has a chip on his shoulder and something to prove in the last few years of his career. So I like that they have someone you can at least feel comfortable with in Denver.

Finally, in 12 seconds, Damien Lillard changed the course of a franchise forever in Game 5 of the Western Conference semis. He drained a bomb to send the Thunder home. And Lillard had an interesting response when Brian Berger of Sports Business Radio asked him about it. Listen to who he shouted out. You kind of changed the fortune of a franchise with that shot. Last question.

What can I say? That was for Seattle. I love it. Now, Damon's from Oakland, but clearly he feels how both NBA fans feel, and certainly Seattle fans, that Seattle needs a team again. Sonic's fans were gutted. You know all about this in 2008 when they relocated after 41 years. It was a great franchise with several great players and a championship and legendary coaches.

I grew up with the Sonics was the first team I loved. They won a championship in the 70s. Downtown Freddie Brown, Gus Williams, eventually Sean Kemp, Lonnie Shelton, Tom Chambers. They had great players. For years, Seattle was always viable. Yes. Kevin Durant, that he left. I would love to see Seattle get a franchise again.

I mean, they do have a WMBA team and they support strongly. It's a great town, by the way. The Mariners don't draw great, but they're terrible. but the Seahawks do. University of Washington sells out. The soccer's unbelievable. It's a great sports town. Yeah. Well, maybe one day. Yeah, maybe one day. Joy Taylor with the news. Well, that's the news.

And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lye News. Okay, Peter King around the corner. Football only today, it's The Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the Internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, Nobody's telling you exactly what happened.

That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down,

give you context and ask the questions everybody wants answers. Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slicelife-Life 12 and the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking. Trip Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase

that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch. Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid?

Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. Join me, Kear Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway.

Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What's up, guys? This is Clivert Taylor the 4th. And on my podcast, The Cliverts Show, I'm bringing you conversations about all kinds of stuff. Like being an internet famous referee. We're in the middle of a game. This line.

You know these kids. This linebacker walks up to me, he goes, hey, ref, my mom wants you to wave at her. What? Time out. Quarterback on office blue of 42. Hey, rep, my mama want you to wave at her. What? Where's she at?

Hey, Miss Parker. Listen to the Clifford show on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. What's up, fam? This Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano and our podcast Point Game. is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed.

And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective

on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's gonna be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too.

Steve Nass would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court, licking his fingers why he got the ball. Like, after you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Peter King, Football Morning in America, NBCSports.com, three-time national sports writer of the year, and a member of the Board of Selectors for the Pro Football Hall of Fame forever is joining us today.

Will Blackman, a wine, Somalia, it was amazing, so was Hugh Jackson. Great to have them all on, and Peter King is now joining us. By the way, the cowboy topic has been big in our show for three days. Todd Gurley got hurt, and young Jared Gough was C.J. Anderson, no Cooper Cup, took the Rams to the Super Bowl. Are we creating a scenario in which we believe Dallas can't win any games if Zeke wasn't part of the Cowboys? Do you believe that to be true, Peter?

No, not really. I do think he is very much 1 in 1A with Jack Prescott. But I think what we've seen, and if you were to take one running back away from a team right now in today's NFL, I think Ezekiel Elliott would be the most. damaging loss of any running back to any team. But I think we just see the way the game is played. I mean, last year, Colin, there were fewer rushing attempts last year in the NFL on average per game than at any time this century. So the game is changing.

But having said that, the game hasn't changed extraordinarily in Dallas. and they need him, but I think they've got a good enough defense that they'd win some games without Ezekiel Elliott. You had Peyton Manning on your podcast, the Peter King podcast, talking about Patrick Mahomes. Share with our audience, Patent, because by the way, you talk about two different quarterbacks. One is thrown it sideways, no look passes, the other one was almost robotic in his cadence and his delivery. What did Peyton think of Patrick? I mean, he loves him. He analyzed him a lot for his tape show that he did for ESPN last year.

But I think one of the other things that he likes and that a lot of people around the NFL like is that, A, he's got a great quarterback coach in Andy Reed, and B, he takes coaching. Yes. If you were around the Kansas City Chiefs, and last year a couple of times, I was there including the playoffs.

And I remember Andy Reid talking, about how much he absolutely loved working with Mahomes. And I'll say one other thing about Mahomes, that I don't think a lot of people see, and I don't think a lot of people know. But he is becoming major, major leader on that team in a short period of time. Last year when Kareem Hunt exited suddenly,

and there was a lot of panic outside the building, Patrick Mahomes asked Andy Reid if he could stand up and talk to this. the team that weekend before they had to continue their season without Kareem Hunt. And so I think he is, he's turned into a real valuable guy. Any question, without any question. He's a guy who manning love, you know, in part because of his football ability and also because of his self-lessness.

I think his coach ability is a very, very good point. Andy has told me the same thing privately that he's an incredible. incredibly coachable kid. By the way, some would suggest Aaron Rogers eight, seven years ago, was Patrick, the armed talent, the ad liber. But is it fair to suggest with McCarthy's exit and some of the stories on Matt LaFleur and the pushback? Is Aaron do you think coachable? Or some suggest he's harder to coach. Is that fair to you? Well, that's definitely been a criticism of him without any question, but I think it's very hard to say unless you're inside that building and you know.

I think, Colin, the one thing about Aaron Rogers is that he is going to voice his opinion, and he's going to be striding about it. And he has been striding about it. He's not just going to be a yes-or-noster guy. He's too smart, you know, to basically things that he doesn't want to do. And so I think that's an easy thing to say that he's not all that coachable. I don't buy it. You know, McCarthy and others who've been around him over the year think it's a lot of bunk.

Yeah. You know, this is the time every year I pick two teams that will double their win totals. This year it's going to be the Niners and Jets. And then I pick a dark horse Super Bowl team. This year I'm picking Tennessee, who was the least penalized team. I think Vrable can coach. line is top five. I thought Adam Humphreys and Safford were excellent,

low-maintenance, high-performing free agents. And frankly, I think they're a team that clobbered New England and Dallas, beat four playoff teams, and I think they're totally under the radar. And again, I think Vrable can really coach if Mariotta can stay healthy. Is there a team to you

that's under the radar? Tennessee is mine that you think is going to sneak up on somebody, and we're going to talk about him in late November and say, how did we not see this? This goes my seventh team in my power rankings when I did them in May. And that's because, you know, they're going to have Jimmy Garoppolo. And again, look, I mean, I can't, no one can predict the future, but a full season of

Jimmy Garoppolo and the 49ers are winning double digits. My other team down there from last year, but not a stunner, honestly, will be because Jacksonville, I think with a. quarterback like Nick Foll. And with Leonard Farnett with a lot to play for, because he's got his contract to play for, I think Jacksonville is going to be a significantly better team than 5 and 11. By the way, Browns, I think they finish in the 9-win category, but I think Baltimore, sneaky good and Pittsburgh rebounds with less distractions.

Where do you fall on the Brown's hype? Youngest roster in the league haven't proven the ability to beat consistently good teams, one in five against playoff teams last year. Where do you fall in the Browns? I like the Browns a lot, and I'll say two things. I think so much of this is up to your best friend, Baker Mayfield, that, hey, look, we've seen Baker Mayfield be outstanding for six or seven games, and to have flashes in those other games when he had Hugh Jackson.

But now he's got to play a 16-game season. If they're going to be a top NFL team, the quarterback is going to be can. And I think he probably will, but it's not any sure thing. We haven't seen it before. I think the other part of their team is, you said it, Baltimore and Pittsburgh right now. I mean, if I looked at that division, you know, what's the best hope for Cleveland? I, in my best hope, if I'm Cleveland, is to go two and two and maybe on the outside, three and one against those two teams.

And that would be, that would be a tremendous accomplishment. Oh, God, yeah. This is not like, you can't just talk about the Browns in a vacuum because they are in a division where you've got to play Ben Rothesberger, you've got to play barbaugh. and Mark Jackson, I mean, you've got a tough road in one quarter of your schedule. And so I look at that and I say, hey, if they go two and two against those teams, I think that's a success. And then they've got to go outside their division over a bunch of games.

So we'll see. But I like Cleveland, but I have a little mental asterisk with Cleveland that I think everybody should have. Yeah, actually, Baker's, I don't worry about Baker at all. Baker, I worry about their offensive line. Baker will be fine. Baker's got weapons. He's smart. He's accurate.

Despite our, you know, social media silliness. I don't worry about Baker. I think he's going to have a great year. Listen to up against the clock. Peter King, I want you to listen to his podcast. He's got Peyton Manning talking Patrick Holmes. It does not get better than that. Peter King, thank you so much.

All the best, Colin. Really appreciate it. You bet Josh Norman last hour. Folks, Nationals take on the Braves. Discover card key matchup. Go further than ever with a Discover at Mile card. Yes. Limitations apply. Discover match for new card members only. Learn more at Discover.com slash travel.

35,000 miles could become 70. They automatically match the miles you earn at the end of your first year. A packed third hour from LA next. Want more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week within the IHeart radio app. Search herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Welcome back. So I saw some crazy video the other day. Josh Norman Pro Bowl cornerbacks, in Pamplona. He wasn't there drinking wine. Let's bring him out to the show. Seven NFL seasons for Carolina, three Washington. Coastal Carolina to Pamplona. Redskins Corner. All right. Let's look at this nonsense and explain what the hell you were thinking. Oh, that's nonsense. You've got to stop. Oh, Brady. That is none.

First of all, I thought it was, I saw it and I thought, Josh, your coaches are going to go nut. Did you tell me you were going to do it? No. I mean, but they kind of already knew. I think I gave a hand of what I was going to do. Is that you right there with a camera? Huh? Is that you with the camera?

No. That's you right there jumping. That's me right there. Somebody had recorded that. So were you scared? Was I scared? You're running with a bull. No.

You didn't have any anxiety. I think the excitement of it. Did you do it by yourself? Yes. Nobody else could do it. So you flew over there and said, I'm going to run with the bulls. I've watched video. You know, crazy.

thing is I didn't even think I was going to do that. I really didn't. Like as soon as I got into the arena, I just saw all those people that was surrounding it. It just felt like a gladiator moment. Right. You know, you was in the Coliseum by the Sands, you know? And you was in that moment, and they just let a bull out. And I was like, whoa, wait a minute.

I didn't sign up for this. And then as soon as the bull came out, it was just running around, taking people out, left and right. It was. It was. And I was just like, people running by it, just going by and just like tap. in it and then would move out the way of it and it was just gore somebody.

And I just saw it and I was like, okay, well, everybody was going to run by it. I started doing the calculations in my mind and myself and I was like, I don't know, just jump over it. And you did? Yeah, I mean, literally, I was just trying out my new booster package that I got from the dark night system, so, you know.

Did Washington and your team call you about it? Did they call me about it? I don't think they called me about it. No, nobody can call me about it. I got a text message, but it didn't say nothing. What did your friend say when they texted you? Oh, nothing. I mean, they was just, you know, they thought I was crazy. That was the first thing that came to mind.

Would you do it again? Should I renew that? Would I do it again? Yeah. I mean, the opportunity to present itself, why not? Oh, Lord. I look at it like this. Like, you can't sit up here and we talk about, you know,

what would someone do if they wouldn't put in that position? For me, literally, like, you can go outside your front door, right? And you can get in the car, and there's an accident. accident, right? Do you know most people die within 15 minutes of their house? Exactly my purpose. Yeah, because you have to get in the car to get to work. Yeah, she makes a good point.

You have to drive. You don't have to. But then again, like, is that something that you, like, obviously you obligated to do that to get to work and all the other stuff? But when you have fun, what do you do? You can have fun doing anything in life, right? And you get hurt doing it. Do you have a regret? Yeah, I think I will. We have a policy, Colin and I.

If the fun might end up in death or extreme pain. We don't do it. You don't do it. If I can. Yeah, I mean, I've never gone out of. Me, I don't see it that way. Well, how do you see it? Well, I see it as taking on a challenge that I'm excited to do.

So I've run straight at it. So you run straight at your challenges. I run straight at my challenge. Why avoid him? Why go to the left. Well, in all fairness, he also does run full speed into other people, which we also don't do. I live on the edge of my life. You ran full speed of Gronk.

Grong didn't have horns, but it's kind of the same thing. No, but I look at it like this. I mean, you can live life and die tomorrow, or you can live, you can die and never lived. You know what I'm saying? Think about that. You can live and die and not have anything worth it, or you can die and never live.

All right. It sounds like something Thoreau would say or some great author. That sounds great until you've got a bull running at you. Yeah, but it's like the thrill of it. I mean, I'm running straight at the boy. I mean, the bull running straight at me who's going to win. I look at it as an obstacle illusion like, okay, I'm faking out my defender.

Like, at any given moment, I grew up and I lived on the edge all my life. I play there, cornerback. I'm by myself. I'm really in that whole dimension of you're going to beat me or I'm going to beat you. Speaking of that, you know, your most famous confrontation was with O'Dell Beckham Jr. Well, I mean, it was feisty. Who says? Well, I say.

It was feisty as heck. By the way, now he's in Cleveland. He's an interesting player. Give me some insight on how expressive is he during games. What is O'Dell going to do in Cleveland? What is your takeaway on him? I don't know. He's not in the division no more.

You don't care about him. No, I mean, I don't say I care about him. He's a great player. I mean, I had a couple conversations with him this offseason. It's cool guy. I mean, we had conversations. We squashed whatever that is that the media brought up to being something. We don't even have that anymore.

I think he grew up from that. Literally, he grew up from all that stuff. And now it looks like he's on a team. And whoever knows what's going to happen, I don't. I mean, I play for D.C. So I don't know what they're going to do down in Cleveland. But other than, you know, with his teammates, then they got down there, they have a crew of guys that's very talented.

They can go far if they put it all together. But who knows? We were talking about Aaron Rogers today. He's got a new coach, and a lot of people feel like McCarthy was holding him back, and now Aaron's the coach. And Aaron's really talented, nobody disputes that. He's kind of like Patrick Mahomes. He was Patrick Mahomes about eight years ago.

We're like, who's this dude that we didn't watch a lot in college with a superman arm who moves around a lot and does crazy trick throws? And Aaron and Patrick kind of feel that same way. You've faced Aaron Rogers. He also has a reputation as cocky, get after guys, can tick teammates off. You got an Aaron Roger's story? Do I got a story?

I always got a story for the wizard. I call him The Wizard, man, because that guy, he can do it all. Right. He can do it all. So I would say when they came to us, they played us, it's always a battle of wits between me and him. It's always something that we battle because of where we're at in the league.

high high he is in the quarterback IQ and myself and the defensive back IQ. And literally, we're playing cat and mouse the whole game. I'm trying to set him up and he's definitely setting me up. So I would say it was when they played us at our home in Washington, D.C., we was down probably on the 15, 20-yard line going in. I was on his number one receiver, Devante Adams. You were on him, yeah. All right.

And I think the play was actually going to go to the offense's left side like a run. and I was on the defensive left. So me and Devante was one-on-one in this play, and Devonte was looking directly at me. A-Ride was looking over to Devonte, giving him the eye, like you already know he was going to check fate here, and he was going to do a back shoulder. I know this kind of because I already see how he moves,

and I watched enough film, and I know how A-Roy kind of prepares for these games. So I look at Devonte. I move slightly a hair outside of my alignment. He checks me and watch. He never looks back at A-Ride. And A-Ride trying to check, trying to check, get his attention. Crowds going crazy.

So, Devonty finally looked back at A-Roy. By the time then, the ball had snapped, and then he ended up running like a little in-rout. And A-Roy was going there first, and he had to eat it. And, man, after that play, what happened? I think he gave him some choice words. You got him out of choice words? You heard it?

Did I hear it? I went up to it and tried to say, hey, relax. He's okay. leave alone. And Aaron was tech. He was hot. But, you know, it was about the game, though, itself, just looking and trying to, you know, out with each other.

But I can say that he's definitely over, you know, head over shoulders of anybody as far as competing-wise in this league at that position. I mean, you've only got, like, a handful of guys who's at that level, and he's one of them. By the way, Dwayne Haskins, who I liked out of college at Ohio State, he's young. I don't know if he's quite ready to start, although I think he has a chance to be really, really good. What have you seen of him?

What do you know of him so far? Because he may be pressed into starting duty, Josh. Yeah, I mean, he just may be. What the thing is, is whoever is going to give us the best opportunity to win games. That's all I care about, really. If he's pressing to the line and he's the better choice, then guess what? We'll go with him. If he's not, then we'll go with other quarterback.

And that's all great. And that's all fine. And that's all fine. You know, we've got to start with that. What have you seen with him? What I see? He's got a big arm. I mean, he has a big arm.

He has a talent to be in the league that, you know, it can last long. In case, he's there, too, and he's going to help him, support. And we got a, and we got Colt, too. So you can't really look out side of him so much than you can. The other guys that's on the field, you know, battling for that position because he's a big kid, man. He's coming to his league. And he can do some things and some great wonders, but it's going to take him some time. So we're about a week or two away from teams reporting to camp.

Are you in, do you go into camp in game shape or do you, obviously physically you need to hit for about two to three weeks to get ready? How much work do you do pre-camp? Where are you at physically? Where are most NFL veteran star players at physically this morning? Where are they at? Where are you at? Are you in shape? Are you ready to go?

What does camp provide for you that you don't already have? getting in shape. So you'll get in your win. I think getting your win for, you know, that type of battle that you're about to face. You can never, no matter how much you try to work out, you can never get in shape for what's going to take place. But you're getting put on full pads. You're going out to each other competitive level. Always going to be at a high.

You know, you're in training camp, so you obviously going against folks that, you normally wouldn't practice for. You wouldn't train for, as I would say, when you train by yourself or with other group of guys. when you put those pads on and that hell man you got an extra pack of gear that's on you and you're going against guys that's, you know,

you wouldn't go against in your regular training. So that's obviously going to come into play where you have to exercise in that sense of getting your wind up able to withstand that

in the football season. And so for me, I look at it like I exercise my mind more so than I do my body. My body is going to take care of itself. I always have. I try to take as much time

as I can't off of it because I'm six on, six off kind of, if you look at it, so I can actually have more juice at the end. That's a great point. Oh, that's an excellent point. Like, literally, you got some guys who, as soon as it's seasoned over, guess what they do? A week later, they're in the weight room, and they continue to go all way through, all way up until a training camp. Like, you're going to burn yourself out. You literally are going to burn yourself out because you don't have any more left in the tank. And that guy, you can try to see, they start to peak. not really a peak, but they start to get into an extra level of another season when the playoff time comes.

And that's literally what you want to be. I'm peaking again, you know? And for me, I always look at it like I train my mind as so much so I know what's coming, so I conditioned myself and I push myself to another level. And finally, I want to go back to that Pamplona, Spain, jumping the bull stuff. NFL has been air in football games now for over a decade in Europe. Did anybody know who you were? I heard you.

Nobody knew who I was. was. Probably like a handful of guys but they stopped and they took pictures but nobody knew who I was. And the crazy thing is one guy in the green he knew who I was

because of his girlfriend. Literally. He knew I was for his girlfriend. He was like, oh my gosh, I got to get this because she's going to give me so many cool points.

And the thing is, he ended up taking the whole video of what transpired. That's him taking the video? That's him taking the, that's a fan in the stands that took a video

that sent it to me. Otherwise, you wouldn't have video. stuff. I wouldn't have video. This would be a life experience you didn't even tape. No, but the thing is, I had it, but you can't take anything in there with you. Like when you run, I was running, right?

And I had the GoPro, and one of my friends that was with me at that time, that police saw me with the GoPro and tried to kick me out. So he ended up taking GoPro out with him, and then I ran the whole race. So I ran it all the way through, and then I got into the arena. And once I got into the arena, I started to jump. And when I started to jump, they started chanting his name. And I didn't know what it was until I was told you are the jumper.

So the name was El Sattador. And they were yelling at to you? They was yelling it to me. El Sattador. That was crazy. So I go to that place. They don't know me from Adam Haskett. I'm not, you know, Josh Norman from Washington Redskins there.

I'm El Sattador. The guy who jumps. The man who jumps. Like the Madador? I like that. It's crazy, man. And they started chanting it. And so I started going across the streets to getting pictures taken of me as being a jumper.

So I had to get up out of there. It was too much. Too much. All right, we got to run. Josh Norman, Pro Boulder. Great seeing you. Joy with the news. No, no, no, no.

Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. So Chris Paul, what to do with Chris Paul? Well, he may end up saying with the Thunder, at least for the beginning of the season. In a most recent report from Woj, he says the Thunder have parked their discussions to deal him elsewhere. An increasing expectation exists that he will start the season with the team. OKC has been working with Paul and his reps on finding a trade, but nothing is materializing so deep into summer free agency.

Sources said both sides believe there are benefits to Paul playing out the season with the Thunder. For now, there's a belief that there could be more success exploring trade scenarios. Again, after December 15th, the market expands after December 15th, because players who signed offseason free agent deals can become eligible to be included in trade packages. The heat was being thrown out there as the preferred destination for Chris Paul, but the heat want two of the picks that the Thunder have ended up with through trades. They want those back with Chris Paul. Because if they do take Chris Paul off the Thunder's hands,

they're going to be handicapped moving forward and the salary cap because he is going to make $38.5 million next season and $41 million in 2021. And he's going to have a player option of 44. million for the 21-22 season, which is really why I believe this is being stalled because a lot of teams are not, I mean, if you look at Chris Paul's injury history on top of that contract, on top of what's kind of become his reputation at this point. Hard to move. Those are bad boxes.

Old, injured, tough to deal with. Those are three bad boxes. And I mean, the Thunder are in a rebuild. So it may end up making more sense to have a star on the team. that you at least know for the regular season, what you're going to get from. And hopefully he's in a situation where the young guys that they bring in, he can, I mean, he is a veteran.

He has that success in the league. Like, he can help teach them how to be pros at the very least because this contract is going to be tough to move. Now, it's not impossible, obviously, because it got moved in the first place, but they're going to have to get some picks if they want to move him along. So the Rockets reunited Westbrook and Hardin by offloading that Chris Paul contract to the Thunder. But can they,

coexist. Well, C.J. McCollum spoke about their cohesion on his pull-up podcast this week and also gave some insight on how him and Dame were able to build their chemistry. For those two, it'll be tough at times. They'll have to make adjustments and get used to playing with each other. But when you get to the point where you just really want to win, I think they're both at that point and have been at that point, it'll be all right. I think they'll be able to get through it. There may be some bumps in a row, but nothing they can't smooth it out. The more you play with somebody, the more it becomes natural where I don't have to communicate verbally. You can have cues where it's eye contact, where I look at him and he understands what I'm thinking.

So we're watching film together. We're studying certain sets. We're studying movement, how defenses are shifting towards us to where now, if I point something out on film, the next day he remembers it. It's kind of like being in a relationship with somebody. It's kind of an interesting point that I think we're all overlooking, like we're saying it, but we're not really thinking about it. Kawhi and PG and LeBron and AD, Westbrook and Hardin are the only two of that, what I consider the three bests in the league, duos, that have actually played together. They've known each other and played together since high school,

and they literally played together for years in the NBA. Now, granted, their games are a little bit different than they were when they played together, but they do have that experience. I understand the usage rates and the turnovers and who's going to take the last shot and all those things need to be ironed out, but the relationship part of it

and the cohesion as far as we've done this before is there. If you rank the question marks that you have with those three duos, the Rockets, Kauai and PG and AD and LeBron. I think Kauai and PG, they have issues too. I mean, Paul George had shoulder surgery. He may not even be ready for the beginning of the season. If Westbrook could shoot, C.J. and Damework, because both can shoot,

the issue with Westbrook is when he gets the ball with six seconds left, no time to drive, will he hit a jumper? Or will he pass to the best available shooter? Yeah, I mean, basically Hardin's going to run the show. This is going to be Hardin's off. But CJ made a point also that I talked about last week. They both are in a position where they want to win. They've been in an NBA finals together before.

So they've seen it. And Hardin has gone through all of this. They both have MVPs. They both have all the individual accolades that they need. What they want and need is a championship. So they're going to have to make that work, however that needs to happen. All right, it's massive, massive breaking news. I don't know if we have the massive breaking news.

I've been told about this for two hours. Yes, okay. So, breaking news. All right. Well, Colin, he had a very massive announcements last week, or was it last week, no, it was Monday. It was Monday. Oh, God, it would mean the coffee thing? Yes.

All right. So let's just play this. I'm spending $450, $500 a month. I can make this stuff at home. And I said, that's it. I'm done. I'm never buying coffee at a coffee shop again. And then I started doing it in my head.

I'm going to spend $30,000. if I live a normal life, drinking coffee I can make it home. That's a new car. What am I doing with my life? I'm no, you can hold me accountable. I'm never going to a coffee shop again. I'm giving you so much credit. I literally thought that was last week.

That was Monday. All right. Well, I thought it was a good move by you. You know, you have decided you're going to save money and you're going against the man, the big coffee, coffee man. Well, I gave you a month and a half because you seemed very convicted about this. So I come into the morning meeting today. We're discussing topics for the show.

Yeah. And I look over at my co-host Colin Cowherd. And what is this, what is this suspicious item on the table there? Okay. Well, it looks like a coffee mug from a franchise coffee shop. Okay. This is Skip Bayless and Shannon Sharps' fault. Okay.

They took the week off. So because they took the week off, we don't have any coffee made in the bill. building. So they hose me. So the week I protested. By Monday, I'll never go again. But I got trapped this morning because there's no coffee in the building anymore. And I can't come in here and prep for two and a half hours without coffee. Tolan, hold on. The reason you were going to protest was you were going to make coffee at home. That is not Skip Bayliss's fault. Yeah. Okay. It kind of is. But it was dark and I had to feed the dogs and I didn't have time and I rushed out. They, uh, you know, it sounds like a lot of excuses.

We don't like when athletes make excuses. They could be reasons, but that's when you say it out loud, it becomes an excuse. I'm disappointed. They have coffee makers that you can literally program to make the coffee while you're sleeping. It just turns on on its own and makes the coffee at a specific time. That's a nonsense. Of course it's nonsense. This is what I told you.

I will pay for coffee because the convenience of going to a coffee shop like you did. I'm disappointed in myself too. It's worth the extra money. I'm disappointed. I gave you way too much credit. A month and a half. By the way, I had football season. You make me look dumb.

I said you would make it until football season. Greg, too, he said four days. He was right. He was right. He's the winner. Dang. Okay. Starting Monday, I'm never going again to a coffee shop. What if you just say that you're going to significantly cut back on the daily coffee?

That's not it. When you need to, like this morning, you're just going to go and get coffee. That's not as dramatic. It doesn't make us good a radio. Don't you have a cup, like a K-cup thing at home? So you did not have enough time to push one button? I don't have that kind of coffee, make. I don't have that kind of coffee maker or time, frankly.

I think that you owe the coffee shops of America an apology. Over my caffeine body. Joy with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lye News. Right, Jason McIntyre, one of my favorite segments. Tomorrow's headlines today is coming up next to wrap up a Thursday.

Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. All right, welcome back. It's my favorite time of the week. off tomorrow, hanging out with the fam over the weekend. And so Jason McIntyre, who was the founder of the big lead.com, moved off that. Now he's at Fox Sports Radio. He's at Fox Sports. He's at

FS1. Jay Mack is joining us. How are you? I'm excellent. I wonder why you keep ducking me in tennis, Cowherd. Where are we going to play? I'm very busy. You're also 20 years younger than me. I don't know if I'm much younger. But I have a tennis tournament coming up. We must play next week when you're back from your gallivanting in, you know,

Park City or whatever. Do you know I was so busy yesterday I had to cancel a lunch with Ron's agent, Rich Paul. We talked on the phone for 15 minutes. He was not happy with me, but we talked about important inside information. Right, right. He's running that talent agency now. He's not, he's running it and then the UTA hired him.

Yeah, yeah. He's, uh, he's at their, I think we're both at their rival agency. They go against them. Yeah, but I still like Rich. Okay. He seems like a nice guy. He's, he's ethical. He's bottom line.

What a word, Joy, to describe the guy. He is. He is. He dumped a client who bailed on a team. He's got an ethical. One of the Morris twins? You know the opposite side of that story. People say that the Lakers wanted him out of the Western Conference.

A bunch of hooey. All right, the segment is called tomorrow's headlines today. You predict what we see in the newspapers tomorrow. What will the big headline for the Cowboys season be? I mean, you've been bashing my guy, Zeke Elliott, all week. I believe the headline will be for the Cowboys. Zeke at running back week at quarterback. Colin, I don't, you know, your take was so hot this week.

I had to get a fire extinguisher in my house. Hose down the TV, Colin. Zeaziel Elliott is the guy there, not DAC. You know the advanced stats. So I started to dive into football outsiders, have advanced metrics, help me with gambling in the podcast here at FS1. And they said that DAC is like a 24 to 26 best starting quarterback in the league.

Don't go by this basic passing yards and quarterback rating and all this nonsense. Dak Prescott is average. He was not as good last year as Andy Dalton. And now Deck Prescott was. it's $31 million. You know, if you got Stephen Jones's number, please text it to me so I can text him and say, the Cowboys are going downhill if they spend $30 to $31 million on Dak Prescott. Yeah, I think he's worth 24, but I think he's going to get 33.

Well, Andy Dalton is a guy who's making $16, $17 million. And he had a better year than Dak Prescott. If I'm the Cowboys, I love, you know, I'll franchise tag Dak, and then I would look at a guy, don't laugh, the beige water pistol that you named him. Andy Dalton down the road for the Dallas Cowboys. How would the Chargers? How will the Chargers handle Melvin Gordon if the running back holds out a new contract? Tomorrow's headlines today.

Yeah, well, you know, the Chargers are very tough with the negotiations. Nick Bosa, of course, famously did not go well there. I believe the headline will be Melvin Gordon. It feels like for the Chargers, they're not going to give him what he wants. And I had a guy on my radio show this past weekend who's covered the Chargers closely and was saying, listen, he's probably not going to get the deal that he wants and nobody's going to trade for Gordon because then you've got to give up like a first or second round pick and then pay him. And that doesn't feel like that's going to happen. This is not

a three down back. He's not Todd Gurley. He's not Ezekiel Elliott. He's not Sequin Barclay. He's a smaller back. He's not a great blocking back. Not great out of the back field catching passes. And listen, I like Gordon. I still think this is a Super Bowl roster, even without him, but it doesn't look like he's going to get the money he wants. Since Anthony Lynn arrived, all their running backs are averaging over four yards of carry. Anthony Lynn's blocking schemes have elevated all the running backs. By the way, they were 4-0 last year without him an average 27 points per game. That was without Melvin Gordon, who wants top dollar.

What will be the big headline for the Browns this season? Tomorrow's headlines today. Oh, boy. Well, you're Cleveland Browns. When they have a mediocre season in Cleveland next year, the headline will be half-baked. By the way, did you see your guy Baker Mayfield took another shot at you in that story? He was on a cover story of some magazine and bringing up Colin Cowherd. People just, you know, Colin, and you talk about this a lot.

In life, you got to work your way up the ladder. You know, the elevator to success is out of order, right? You got to take the stairs, take your time. They're trying to kind of microwave a Super Bowl here, right? Does it not feel like that? A little bit. Oh, and 16, two years ago. And now we're talking about a Super Bowl.

The odds have gone down from 40 to 1. to 14 to 1. The sheep out there, the bad gamblers, the guy who don't know what they're talking about. They're all loading up on the Cleveland Browns. It doesn't work like that in life and especially not in football. By the way, they're adding to what they were already great at. They already had great targets. They just added another one. They didn't upgrade their offensive line, which is the weakness. They added a pass rusher. They already had a good one. They added to their strengths. They didn't solve their weakness, and their division will be better next year. Much better. The Bengals are going to be a live underdog. And as we've talked about,

There's some value on the Pittsburgh Steelers, not only to win the division, but win the AFC. Which NFL powerhouse is about to have a big drop off? Ooh, tomorrow's headlines today. Oh, boy. Well, you've heard the phrase one-trick pony, right? I think you've used that before. I believe the headline will be one trick Mahomi. You know, I probably should retire after that one because I know a lot of Kansas City Chief fans are screen grabbing this.

Their offensive line is not great. There is an avalanche of evidence that, Pat Mahomes will have a massive regression. Wow. The history of all these quarterbacks who have, you know, massive seasons really come back to the pack. And, you know, I do like to talk about gambling a lot. Pat Mahomes and the Chiefs last year, last 11 games, three and eight against the spread. They were destroying teams in the first half with Kareem Hunt.

Kareem Hunt goes away. The offense regresses. They're going into this season, probably no Tyreek Hill for about eight games. That's a guess on the suspension. Travis Kelsey will be there, but, you know, running back by committee. And look at that defense, which was ordinary to begin with. No D. Ford, no Justin Houston. And by the way, Justin Houston's a very good guy in the room.

Locker room. Yeah. So it's a very interesting point. And also, the Chargers are so good. But the Chiefs have historically owned them in recent years. And final stat here, if you look at the Chief's schedule, you got to play that first play schedule. They play five of the top 10 defenses in the NFL this year. And again, as I said earlier, Pat Mahomes' second half of the season, teams started to get up to speed on what he's doing.

Great quarterback, no doubt. He's a top five quarterback in the league already, but there will be a massive regression for Kansas City and homes. Great stuff. Jason McIntyre. Nice job this week. Thank you. Speak for yourself next.

Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo, and every episode we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the biggest moments in sports and giving you the real story behind the headline. And we're going straight to the source,

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