The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Daniel Cormier GOES IN ON Ilia Topuria #1 P4P ranking over Islam Makhachev

Episode Date: July 6, 2025

In a SPECIAL EDITION of Daniel Cormier's 3 Rounds, the legendary UFC analyst Din Thomas joins the show to BREAK DOWN Ilia Topuria's #1 pound-for-pound ranking over Islam Makhachev. Thomas ADAMANTLY supports Topuria's top rank, and says even with a with over Jack Della Maddalena, Ilia still keeps the top spot in the UFC's P4P list. Thomas and DC also break down Jamahal Hill's losing streak, mistakes made inside and outside the octagon in the UFC, and why Topuria getting a knockout win over Charles Oliveira is the biggest difference maker in the current UFC rankings. #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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They're in your corner with unlimited 5G network that will not slow you down. So you know, last weekend, Ilyathapour, you became a UFC double champion. and you know how much I love a fight. That's why I enjoy doing three rounds so much. So I've been a training camp. Last time I didn't bust somebody up the head on this show was Chris Wyman two years ago, and they've been refusing.

They've been running. So in comes Dean Thomas to try to step up to the challenge. What's up, Dino? I ain't running from nobody. When I heard the challenge was out there, I was the first one to step up because I'm here to take your head, clean off your shoulders.

Hey, this boy about to try to bust my ass. But, hey, that's why we train. That's why we train. That's why we get ready. Hey, y'all know that we don't put about 20, 30 episodes, three rounds in the bank for us. So you know I'm ready for the fight, so let's go. I'm experienced.

Ilya last weekend beat Charles Olivera to become the lightweight champion, making him a double champ. Now, Iliot to pour you on yesterday was announced as the new number one pound for pound fighter in the world. Dean Thomas, do you agree with that? Do you think, though, that by Ilya becoming the lightweight champion, he's palm for pound number one? Absolutely. When you look at his strength of schedule, when you look at the guys that he's beaten, he was already, even without the Charles Olivera win,

he was already in the ranking to being one of the best. I would say top three, top five for sure, maybe top three. But the win over Charles Oliver, first round knockout, solidifies Ilya to Poria as the number one pound for pound fighter in the world, no doubt about it. So, Dino, I was talking to Armand Serukia on yesterday, and he said to me, it was expected that Ilya would beat Charles O'Levara. So that has no bearing on the entire thing, the fact that he won a fight that many say he was supposed to, I get it.

But I must say this. I agree. I think pound for pound is, does your fighting style translate weight classes? We saw. Knocking out Volcanozegov. Knocking out Holloway, his fighting style is effective at 145. Before he started as abandon weight, it was effective there because he's undefeated. Now he's the lightweight champion.

I agree. I think that at this point, he is number one pound for pound because he has shown that his fighting style, regardless of the weight cast, is effective, but not only effective, Dino, he is knocking dudes out. So the power has followed him up to lightweight as it was at 145. He's so clean. It's his technique, and it's not necessarily just his power, like he's, like, bench pressing all this weight.

His technique is so clean that when he's hitting guys and he's hitting them right on the spot, they can't hold up. I believe that he'll knock out anybody from anywhere up until 170. I do believe his power will translate into 170. I swear, I really believe. Wait, so you're telling me, so you're telling me right now you think he beats Islam? I think he beats Islam. Oh, my God.

I always thought he would be Islam. Here's why. Because Islam, I think Islam had struggled with, in the Volcanovsky fight, the very first Volcanozzi, he struggled with getting underneath Alexander Volcanozsche. Islam struggled to get underneath him to be able to take him down. He's going to have a hard time getting underneath Toporia. He's going to have a hard time getting underneath Toporia to take him down. If you don't take him down, he's getting knocked out.

So I would imagine that you don't agree with my next point then. Because I was going to say he is the number one pound-for-pound fighter today. But if Islam is able to beat Jack Delam Adelana, it flips again. And then Islam goes back to number one, top of pound. Only because it is, Dean, listen. Only because it is. Fighting style will then be proven to go up to the next weight class. So then Islam will have done everything Volk Toporia is done at a heavier weight,

four title defenses at 155, and then the new champion at Walterweight. So yes, I agree. He is powerful on number one today. But I think the moment if Islam is able to win, he then goes back to Palm Von number one.

Absolutely not. Because the win over Jack Delamadalena doesn't really prove it. I mean, in fact, Jack was like ranked seven until he won the belt. But this Jack was... Jack's not a Hall of Famer?

Like the way he don't have to strength to schedule the Ilya got. Ilya right now will only fight fights he's supposed to win until he fights Islam. Because every one of his challengers right now he's minus 600 against uh patty he's minus 300 against armand he's minus

350 against justin only person he's an underdog to is makachev so if makachov becomes the walk the way champ doesn't he go back to pomp ball number one dean absolutely not the fact that ilia is such a strong favorite already says enough about how good we think he is i think he's great too and if if if mahachev beats jack delam adela man alina that's To me, that's not really the feather in his cap that he needs. He needs to beat a stronger opponent. I think he needs to beat a Hall of Fame. If he were to knock out Kamar Usman, that would be different.

If Islam wins that belt at 170, does it make him powerful on number one again? Or does Ilya still stay there? Because Ilya does have a claim for it. The kid is phenomenal. He is an amazing fighter. He's tremendous. But I just think that the reason he jumped him is because he's won his second belt. But the moment Islam does, if he does, I think he goes back to number one.

Round two, Dino, Jamal Hill. That was a good round. I mean, you press me against the cage a little bit. Use him to cover body shots, but it's okay, though. It's okay. I come back. Hey, round two, former champion, Jamal Hill, is on a three-fight losing streak now. A lot of times, Dean, when people start to lose, they start to kind of talking and trying to explain

what's going on. Jamal said a lot is made of the thing I said before my fight that Khalil Rang Tree was not on my level. And I said the same thing about my last few fights. He said it's only you two. But he said, to be honest, I haven't been on my level for a while.

I haven't been on that level for quite some time. People underestimated the extent of my injuries with his Achilles and his knees. What do you make of that? What do you make of Jamal Hill saying that? as he's on this streak of bad luck. Well, I wish he had told us before that he wasn't going to be worth a damn. I mean, I'm out there, I'm out there co-signing from my brother, like, yo, my man's going

and go out there and do big things. And then every time he showed up, and I don't want to say he let us down, but he let himself down. Yes. And it's unfortunate. Did he let himself down? Because I had high hopes for Jamal Hill. And he let himself down and indirectly let us all down.

those who believed in him. Well, so here's the thing, right? He was a world champ. So clearly he had a ton of potential. I think what you said leads to this very next quote. He said, I'm a natural talent. We see that a lot in people that have a lot of talent and they don't necessarily reach that potential.

I see that constantly with my wrestlers. He said, things come naturally to me at a certain level. Before I could just hang around outside of camp, do whatever I wanted, the way I wanted to do them. When I was in camp, I was able to put work at a level that I feel put me in a very good position to go on and put on performances that I put on early in my career. It brings it back to a quote my coach just told me a long time ago.

Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard. He said his work output may have been up, but he's got to do more. He's got to work harder, grind harder. Hey, Dean, he said his last three camps at the lowest, he was maybe two. 260 pounds. Last camp, he was 265 before the fight camp started. And that's irresponsible.

That's not, that's irresponsible. And that should have never happened. Because if he's trying to get back on track to being a champion, he can't allow his weight to get up like that. He's got to constantly be in the gym. And another thing he's got to do is I think he needs to add more stuff to his game. I mean, it's really, he's become predictable. he's got to add more stuff to his game.

The fortunate thing for him is if he wants to turn this around, he's in a division that he can turn it around him because it's not that deep. The light heavyweight division, he needs a win over a couple of guys and he'll be right back in the mix. But if he was a lightweight,

I'd say it was a rap for him. But the fact that he's in a very weak division, he can turn it around. So when a guy starts to make these types of comments, it's a lot of reflection, right? You start reflecting on the things that you did bad.

Now, when I was at 205, towards the end of my career, I started to get heavier because I was comfortable that I could do what I needed to do in order to make the weight and still fight effectively, especially when John Jones wasn't there.

When John Jones was there, I never got heavy because I had that guy that would truly remind me that if I messed up, he would take advantage. Maybe that's what was hurting Jamal. He needs to have a real direction of what he needs to do in order to change this or the results would be the same.

And you know what's crazy? He's very competitive. He was competitive against Yuri. He was competitive at times against Pereira early. That last fight, man, Khalil Rauntree, it wasn't competitive. I think the first thing he needs to do, and this might be a problem because of his injuries, the first thing he needs to do is get his footwork back and check. His feet aren't moving good like that's the athleticism, right?

He's an athletic guy. He's a basketball player. Why do you think people are so sour on Jamal? it seems like they just turned on him. I don't know, man. I think there was a point where he just kind of came off as being angry, you know, angry black man. Nobody likes angry black man.

That's why we got a job. He's not angry black man. It might be smiling all the time, man. Nobody likes the angry black man. Hey, Ken Jamar Hill, get it back going in the right direction, chat. Let us know if y'all feel, think that he can go back the way he needs to because Jamal needs to change something. I don't know what it is.

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Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, name? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a...

We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how did we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. And, well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down?

Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel

and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the

internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending, opinions are flying, and nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo. Every episode, we're cutting through the noise, breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source, the athlete

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and ask the questions everybody wants answered. SportsSlice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to SportsSlice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slices Life 12 in the TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect.

We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swaggering Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world, he doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levant this went to a billion dollar fraud. But with two kings from a million dollar fraud, from entirely different worlds,

just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, we got a responsibility.

We're smiling. We have fun. We have the best job in the world. But there is a responsibility that comes with it. You've got to be correct a little bit. At times, I can be liable in that. So I heard a story the other day about Iliate Tabori. I heard a story about Iliate Taboria.

Having money as, you know, a family money. Today I get a thing or I hear Ilya telling Ariel, he had four jobs growing up. Dean, I was wrong. How much of a responsibility do we have as the media to tell these people, even though I'm not traditional media. I'm a fighter that is now on the media's side. Hell, Dean, the other day, they had an illegal strike on the ground

where the guy's laying on his back, he stomps him. We're like, man, I have never seen that before. They asked you, and you, Mr. Smartypants, correct us and tell the shit is illegal. Well, here's the thing, D.C. I've always said this. I'm not a real journalist. I'm just a jackass with a microphone. You, on the other hand, you have a really big platform,

and you are one of the faces of the UFC. You have a responsibility to tell the truth and to do your homework. You have to do that due diligence to do your homework. You have to. So am I not allowed to hear a story now from a friend that tells me something? Because you don't know if that friend, you don't know if that friend knows. What if he knows? No, I know.

But you have to always be careful and you have to always preface everything you say with, rumor has it or allegedly. Yeah, because you have the size of your platform, everybody listens to you and they take what you say to heart. So if you start telling rumors, it doesn't go over well. So, so, so, Elliot DePoria, for the record, had four jobs is what he said. Now, I don't believe it. I go to X.

I go to Twitter a lot. Man, Ben Asker taught me. that. Hats off to the boy, Ben, he got his lung transplants already, so good for Ben. But I go to X a lot of times. Ben told me it is the greatest news platform in the world, and at times, people lie to me. So even to this day, some people are telling me, Ilya did have money and he didn't, but I will take that back once I hear that man from his voice saying that he has that. But when it comes to the rules, right, the stump up and down, when you haven't seen something, right? I don't think we'd ever seen anything like that.

to know. Is that on us or is that on the people in the truck to go, hey, no, that's illegal? No, I think that is on us. I mean, we have to do a good job of doing it. The only person who's able to get away with me being a little misleading is Chale Sondon, and your partner. The stuff he'd come up with, he'd be making stuff up on the spot. I don't know how he'd come up with the stuff he come up with,

but Chale Sondon will make something up on the spot. He's the only one that is allowed to get away with it because we all kind of know that he's full of shit, but we want to hear it anyway. So we just listen. And what are you doing when you sitting with Chale at that desk on those shows? Like, man, Chale just up here telling him after Fiel. I'd be like, yo, where is he?

I'm like, he just made that up. He just made that up right now. He's the best. Bro, he's so funny. I love, I love Chale. But sometimes I know he's not telling me the truth. But the story's so good. It's so good that I want to buy into it.

Hey, really fast in round three. Talk about responsibility. Jack Kermanston got knocked out bad the other day. Herb was running in to save it when he was a little slow. You know, this dude was on his back for like five minutes. Where's that responsibility lied, Dean? Is the ref supposed to tackle him? Yeah, the ref should have tackled him.

Here's what I think happened because Herb Dean is a very good ref. He's always on top of these things. I think what happened was Jack was out so bad that I don't think Herb even considered the possibility of Gregory Rodriguez hitting him with another shot. And I think he just moved a little too slow because he didn't think it was going to happen. So here's the problem. You remember what happened with Hanato Moikano and Jalen Turner? He thought he had to knockout, walk off, knockout. Dude got up and beat him.

Right, exactly. That's another possibility. No one is really at fault. To me, it was more of a miscommunication on everybody's part. I think Herb just thought he was going to stop. Especially in the action, right? But it's Gregory Rodriguez's responsibility to go out there and finish the fight speaking of responsibility.

But I'll tell you one thing. If Dean going to be here on three rounds multiple weeks, ain't no way he up here just correcting me. We ain't going to have that. All right, guys, so it's time for my final thought. Ilya Teporia is great. I tell you one thing. It don't matter if you love him or you hate him.

I don't understand why. So many were booing him over the course of last week when in reality all he has done is the right thing. I get it. There are a lot of comparisons to Connor McGregor, but there's a lot of differences in Ilya to pour you. He has not carried himself in the way that McGregor did. So while there are similarities in the fight career,

we have to understand who Iliate Tupori has shown us to be as the man is vastly different. So while the actions are great inside the octagon, to this point, all he has shown us is great actions outside of the octagon. Now I know my great friends out in Dagestan may not have the best relationship with him, but I do know if I know these guys, they respect what he has done inside the octagon. We'll see what happens in the future. But as of today, just acknowledge that this kid is great and he's different. And what he's doing to this point is as good as anything we have seen in a really long time.

That confidence, that smile, that walk lets you know that you are watching an individual who believes that only success lies ahead of him every time they step into the octagon. Guys, that was another episode of three rounds. Thank you, Dean Thomas, for joining. Thank you for putting up the great fight. I hope to have you back next week. Guys, like, subscribe, tell your friends to tell their friends

that D.C.'s got a YouTube channel. And I'm doing things like three rounds every week, and I'm going to be joined now by my man Dean Thomas because he did a hell of a job. Until next time, for Dean Thomas. I'm Daniel Cormier. Peace. Hey, guys, it's us.

The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. Nice. podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it.

We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know, tired and sick. Tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman, make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel,

help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Winning on Clay is an art. The rallies are relentless. And at the French Open, only the toughest survive. I'd know. I competed there for decades. Join me, Renee Stubbs on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast for no nonsense breakdowns of the biggest matches, the toughest players, and the moments that define Roland Garros. She's an outsider to win the French name.

And she likes Clay. Listen, Lennar Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble

stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. human.