The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hoops Tonight - Derrick White on Celtics defying NBA expectations, Tatum/Brown duo, Joe Mazzulla being "different"

Episode Date: April 7, 2026

Check out Derrick's new podcast here: https://www.youtube.com/@DerrickwhiteJason is joined by Boston Celtics guard Derrick White! They discuss the Celtics beating the NBA media's preseason expectations, organizational culture, Joe Mazzulla's offensive system, Jaylen Brown's new role this year, Jayson Tatum's return from his Achilles injury, his development as a player from the start of his career with the San Antonio Spurs, his experience playing in Division II college basketball and at the University of Colorado, his new podcast ‘White Noise,’ and more. All lines presented by Hard Rock Bet.  #VolumeSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Tired and sick.

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Hey, it's Edwin Castro, also known as Castro 1021. And I'm Conky, his best friend and business manager. And we've got a new show called The 1021 Podcast. I'm taking you behind the scenes on how I became one of Twitch's most popular streamers. We also love sports. And with the World Cup right around the corner, we'll be breaking down the biggest storylines ahead of the big, tournament here in the USA.

Listen to the 1021 podcast on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Volume. All right, welcome to Hoops Tonight here at The Volume. Happy Tuesday, everybody. Hope all of you guys are having a great start to your week. We have an extremely special guest today. One of my favorite players in the NBA, one of the most well-respected players in the NBA

for all the things that he does to help a team win. Two-time all-defense selection. Most importantly, NBA champion. Derek White from the Boston Celtics was kind enough to give us some of his time this morning. First of all, Derek, you're at the end of your ninth season in the NBA now. You guys only have four games left. How are you feeling? How's the grind starting to add up after all these years?

Yeah, I feel good. And it's kind of crazy that this is my ninth year. I feel like it's like everybody always says, it just flies by. But now I'm one of the old heads on the team now. So it's been a long season. It's been a fun year, obviously. And now what we really play for is about to be here. And it's exciting times.

Yeah, you know, it's funny. I'm just playing all amateur basketball and I'm 34 and I can feel it on my body like crazy. Have you felt at all like a change in how this has started to affect you physically as the years have gone by? Yeah, definitely. I mean, I feel like at the beginning of my career, the game ended. and I don't need ice. I'm just showering and going home. And now it's all about like recovery as soon as the game ends.

And I got a bunch of different stuff at the house now that kind of help me recover to kind of get my body right for the next game. So it definitely is a process of as you get older, of developing that routine of what you need to do to get your mind, get your body right, and so you can perform at the highest level. Yeah, just all that extra effort, all that extra work. So most people before this season thought the Celtics would most likely drop

somewhere into the middle of the playoff pack. I don't think anybody thought you guys would be bad, but most people thought there'd be some sort of tangible drop-off just because you guys lose Jason Tatum, you lose Al Horford, you lose Drew Holiday, you lose Chris Sopps, Porzengas, just the staples of the team that won the championship in many ways. Yet now you guys are considered by most people

to be like a dead serious threat to win the title. Now, I'm sure you, you guys in that locker room were a lot more confident than most people thought before the season. But is there any part of you that's at least somewhat surprised that you guys were still this good? I mean, I guess a little bit. I mean, when we started the year off, I was like, oh, this might be a long year. But I think everybody kind of bought into what we were trying to do. And in the first moment, like we had a lot of unknown guys. of guys that had played a high level of basketball and we had some guys that hadn't really had

their opportunity yet. And so I think going in, I was excited for them to get the opportunity and see what they could do with it. And really everybody's stepped up and helped us win games in many different ways. And so you never really know with a year coming in with so many unknowns that we had, but I was confident with the group that we had, that the culture that we've kind of set from the last few years, that we'd be a pretty good team. not as bad as people were saying we were going to be in. I mean, this year we just found different ways of win throughout the whole year. And you've kind of seen how much we've grown individually and as a team, especially

like how bad we started the year off. Yeah, the culture is the big one because like, don't get me wrong, there have been some guys that have stepped up. You and I were talking before we started recording about Keda and how amazing he's been this year, just a really impressive development story. Obviously the forwards like Hugo Gonzalez and Baylor Shireman and Jordan Walsh and the job that they've done this year just kind of filling and doing all sorts of dirty work for you guys on both ends of the floor because I think offensive rebounding has been just a huge difference in

this year's team compared to last year's team. But the culture is the big one because like, in my opinion, it's one of the most important parts of sustaining success in the NBA. You've got to have like a standard and an expectation that kind of percolates into every part of the game, even every part of your roster guys that are outside of the rotation so that you guys can have, you know, Luca Garza step up for a long stretch when Vucey, gets hurt, for example. Like, you've got to have that culture be something that is consistent throughout the organization.

So is there anything that you can think of? Like, the two things that I have thought about with this year's team is one, the new emphasis on rebound. You guys are killing teams on the offensive glass, like the corner crashing, your bigs are, like, Kada again yesterday, four offensive rebound putbacks against Toronto. And post-all start break, you guys have actually been the best defensive rebounding team in the NBA, which is crazy because that was something you guys struggled with. in the first part of the season.

So do you remember anything from training camp or an emphasis from Joe Missoula, specifically surrounding rebounding and how that has kind of gained momentum throughout this year? Yeah. I mean, Joe's all about winning the margins and I think a big way to do that is didn't care of the ball and rebounding. And so something that we talk about all the time,

and it was definitely a big emphasis going into the season as like crash and trying to create more offense possessions. me guys got like hugo j walsh uh bailer sam like all these guys um we hold we hold everybody to like a high expectation a high standard and um people have to have to deliver or like you probably won't get in much so um those guys are playing playing their butts off and uh crashing doing all the little things to kind of help us win games and then um i think defense prebound obviously was a big struggle for us especially at the start the year um we weren't

biggest team. So we talked about every day and then obviously Adam JT back, it definitely has helped our rebound in a lot as well. So it's a big emphasis in the building. I mean, I feel like everybody talks about rebounding and it's been a big thing for us all year. Yeah, Tatum, he, the most underrated thing about his game is just the way that he can plug so many different holes on defense, the way that he can give you guys all these different pick and roll coverages where you can deploy him on centers. I know that was more of a thing. year. But I thoroughly expect that to be something that you guys use as you go down the stretch of the season. And that, yeah, that defensive rebounding piece because of his ability to contend

against bigger players and boxouts to win contested rebounding battles. It kind of slots everybody into more winnable battles on the glass. And I, at the offensive end, I wanted to slide over to for a minute because, you know, you guys end up having literally a higher offensive rating this year than you did last year, despite the turnover, despite the different type of talent. And so my, I have a theory on this, and I want you to tell me whether or not you agree. My theory is like Joe Missoula comes in and he implements this new kind of style of offense, this driving kick offense. You guys have different ways of breaking it down through like ball screens with you and

Tatum on both sides, inverted and regular or attacking matchups when teams are switching with Tatum and Brown. You get the defense and rotation, you know, the flare screens you use off the top of the key, whatever it might be you start with. But then from there, it's just spacing and then making decisions, driving closeouts, making sure you're in the right spot, being in a position where you can can finish plays. And there were times over the first couple of years where you guys got criticized, and I think rightfully so, where like sometimes you would just, you would just kind of

maybe settle for iffy shots or you wouldn't get deep enough into the progression to get the kinds of really high quality threes that you guys needed to pick teams apart and dominate. And then, like, I think the 2024 finals were like the peak of it for you guys. Like, you guys just picked Alice apart by driving and kicking and just getting great shot after great shot. And you saw the growth with Tatum and Brown and the job that they were doing, just making good decisions in the middle of the floor. Do you think like continuity

and just overall gaining rhythm and experience in this style of offense has started to pay dividends this year? And that's part of why you guys have been so good offensively. Yeah, I think like you said, like spacing is definitely a big key. And I think like all of our guys have gotten a lot better. Like I think only means to make better decisions.

if a team like obviously JT and J.B. You can see every kind of defense. So as they developed, obviously they've been able to score since they came into the league, but I'm developing a way to play, make, and create for others. And it's really whatever they decide to do with, they have an answer or a counter for it. And so it's big time from them too just to develop the other side of the game. And then it's on us to make the right read. might right play and if we get an advantage, which most of the time they will create an advantage

for us. And it's in our job to keep the advantage and make the right play after that. And so it's definitely been a process and something that every year I just feel more and more comfortable with. And we talk all the time about how we can just better create those advantages and then like what teams are going to try to do, how they're going to try to combat that. And it's a kind of fun little back and forth between us and the opponent. Yeah, it's been really cool to watch. And I think it also kind of falls into that culture conversation that we were having earlier. What's it been like watching Jaylen Brown take on so much more responsibility this year and handle it as well as he has?

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We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas, we invented a podcast. Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to our first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's a lot. extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys?

I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band. Before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast where people could call in and say, hey Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little

Notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

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I think he was like super excited going to year, obviously. And this is like an opportunity that he probably has been during about since he was a kid. And so he's been amazing for us. He comes in. And every single night, he brought the standard up. and he brought the energy and obviously everybody focuses offensively and him scoring

and doing all the things he was doing for us, but also defensively taking on challenges and being at a high level on that end as well. And so I think he's been having an amazing MVP caliber year and I think he just continues to get better and better every year,

which is a testament to his hard work. Yeah, you know, it's funny. I always have believed that with basketball reps are what gets you to where you need to go. Like everything is more about like replicating the things that are working and cutting out the things that are not working. And young basketball players tend to like sometimes make the same mistake over and over again. Or like I remember I had a veteran guard I played with one.

So like we were playing three on three. We'd get an easy bucket out of an action. And then I'd go do something else on the next plane. I'd be like, what the hell are you doing? Like just do the same thing we just did until they figure out how to stop it. Like there's a replicating successes and trimming fat kind of thing that you get better at as time goes on. And it's been really cool for me as we've watched the Celtics this year. to see Jalen just like with each game just get a little bit better at being consistently great.

And I thought the second half of the Thunder game was the best half of basketball I've ever seen him play. He was just so relentless attacking great perimeter defenders and getting into the middle of the floor and drawing fouls and getting all the way to the basket and making the good decisions when he got there. And it's just been really cool to watch him develop. But as someone who's been alongside Jalen and Jason for most of this era, what's your point? perspective on the media discourse surrounding like their fit as a duo? Has that always just been stupid to you? Has it been frustrating to watch that

discourse from the outside? I mean, I think the media, I always try to create narratives and I think that's just kind of an easy one for them to pick and it doesn't really make much sense to me because the two of them had so much success. Like Celtics have been into

Easter conference finals, like damn near every year of their their NBA career, which does not happen. And so how much success they've had. Obviously, it's tough to get over that final hurdle. But so, like, all the media and whatever or not they want to say, like that really has come into the locker room. And I think those two handled it really well.

And obviously, they're completely different, but we make it work. And it's been great to see, like you said, a development. And I think every year, like I've said, they get better and better. And like teams have probably forced like, let's try to force them into a crowd. But now like they're playmaking and crane for others. And this is stuff that takes time.

And they definitely put in the working and they want to get better. And they both do it on both sides of the court. So it's a blessing to play with both of them. Yeah. I've always thought it was so silly because like I don't know any basketball player that wants to do it by themselves. It's hard. It's exhausting.

Like you want someone that's there to help you handle the, job of like you said creating advantages and most importantly because of the way you guys play like everyone's touching the basketball everyone's involved if jalen's in a good rhythm and he's going to work tatam's getting all sorts of opportunities to attack closeouts and to play off of advantage and vice versa i've always just thought it was like a basketball misconception that's like oh there's only one ball kind of thing it's like no we're playing basketball like we need help we all need to do this together i wanted to ask you a couple questions about joe mazula and then i want to get into you individually as a basketball player so

what was Joe Missoula like as an assistant? Like, did you see him back then and go like, oh, this dude's going to be a coach and this is what it's going to be like? Or did when he get the job, did it like surprise you how intense and how good he was at that specific job? I mean, I didn't work specifically with Joe,

but like, you could definitely see he had a great mind for the game. And I think he definitely was, like, regarded as highly in the organization. And so when he did get the job, the head coach job, I think, like, everybody is just expecting him to do really well and to kill it. So I definitely knew that everybody, like, had that expectation for him. And, like, when he took the job, it wasn't like we were starting from ground zero. And but he's always been just that basketball mind. And I think when you become a head coach, you kind of see a different side of him.

And he's kind of just stepped into his own. And every year, I think he's gotten better. better and me and him got a great relationship. And so it's been, it's been great to have that trust and that bond. And, like, we go back and forth and we talk about different things.

And for him to trust me and stuff like that, it's been, it's been really cool. Do you have a favorite Joe Missoula's kind of insane, but I love it story? I mean, nobody cares one. Like,

that's probably my favorite one. where I was like a grader son coach of the month he just looks at me like nobody cares like stuff like that just every day it's it's something like one time i got sick and he said he was looking at me differently because i let myself get sick just just stuff like that like it is a lot of fun and he's just a little he's just a little different but he's like our different so we love it yeah exactly you need to be that kind of different to win at the highest levels all right let's sticking to you as a basketball player. So I've been personally very fascinated with skill development just simply because I got into high school coaching a few years back. And then when I

got this job, I couldn't go to practices as much into games. And so I shifted my role in the program to skill development because I had to go in the morning. So I'd wake up at 6 o'clock in the morning and I was working with these kids. And I was super obsessed with like what kind of things actually translated to them actually improving as basketball players. Through your first 263 NBA games, basically through the end of your first season with Boston, you were a 34% three-point shooter. Then through your next 231 games, your next three-season with the Celtics,

you were a 39% three-point shooter on almost double the volume. Do you remember something specific clicking with you in your shooting development? Do you remember a specific approach in the summer of 2022? Do you remember anything that led to that improvement? and is there anything that you could pass on to young basketball players in terms of the skill development piece and going from being,

I had a coach that used to say you're either a shooter or you're a maker. What do you think changed for you becoming a maker in the NBA? I think, like obviously after the finals, when they basically weren't guarding me, that was like, this is what I need to focus on. And so I kind of just started from the beginning. I think a big thing was like my arc and me, staying in my shot.

So that's kind of something that I focused on that whole summer. So I would, like, I would shoot it and then I'd have to, like, go get the rebound. And I think that kind of forced me to stay in my shot, you know? Like, I can't fade back and go to the next drill or whatever. So I did that. And then, like, if I didn't have good arc or I didn't like the arc on that one, like, it wouldn't count. So stuff like that, that kind of just re-emphasize the arc and staying in my shot.

So that was, like, a big thing. for my shooting. I was inconsistent with it. And it's hard to be a consistent shooter if you're fading back. It's hard to be consistent, especially like you never know, especially then I might take three three three three is that game or take one. Like you never know when they're going to come. So if I can be consistent with my form and my arc and everything like that,

I knew that I'd give myself a better chance of putting up a good shot to make it. And so like that's a lot of things that I focus. on and then I think like really a big part was just my confidence like mental. Like I'd make one and I'd be really confident and then I missed two and the third one I'm kind of hesitant and then obviously then you miss three and then it kind of adds up like that. So just staying confident in every shot. Just try to be one for one whether you made the last one or you miss the last one. Just try to be one for one that next shot.

So that was a big one and I think like Joe came in and was like I believe in you. I trust in you and I think just having that and my teammates have always been like we believe in you trusting you like shoot with confidence and like you have all that come together and definitely have made a lot of improvements and I got to just continue to

keep that mindset and like even like this year like I haven't shot it as as well as I did the last couple years but like just you got to get back to that the foundation. Yeah I mean like it is such a a mind fuck

for lack of a better word, because like you said, like that year, the three-year stretch where you shot amazing, you missed 61% of your threes. So like if you can't actually compartmentalize each individual shot and stay confident for the next one, you're screwed. And to the point this year, like, no one's going to give a damn if you shot poorly in the regular season, if you make the shots when they matter in the postseason. Like it's always a next shot mentality. I do think that the point you made for the skill development side of it of like kind of limiting unwaisted motion is important. because like I watched a bunch of your Colorado Springs footage, which we're going to talk about in a little bit.

But like you, you did kick your legs a little bit more. There was like more of like a, like just a lot of more flare on each shot, which is there's nothing wrong with that necessarily, but all it does is make it so that each shot is a little different. And if each shot is a little different, then it's harder to replicate,

you know, your form every single time. And you watch, you watch any of your shots from your time in a Celtics jersey. They all look exactly the same. It's the same up and down motion. It's the same arc like you said. I just, I think that those sorts of things do matter, especially in catch and shoot play,

because like, you know, I think you do need a little bit of fluidity and you become a very good off the dribble three point shooter over the years. But in catch and shoot situations, there has to be a muscle memory piece or you're drawn dead in terms of consistency. And I think most of like the streaky shooters that we see around the NBA have some sort of issue with like actually being consistent with their form. So you're perhaps most famous as an NBA player for being great at the little things. like you're one of the best shot blocking guards ever. You might even be having your best defensive season. For all the talk about your shooting, you're averaging a career high,

two and a half stocks per game. The Celtics defense is over 10 points better this season per 100 possessions when you're on the floor versus off. So you're having an outstanding defensive season. You're a great rebounder at your position. You're a career three to one assist the turnover guy. We talked about that earlier with the read and react stuff. I think decision making is so vitally important in advantage basketball.

I was digging through your college stats. even as far back as your sophomore season at UCCS, you had eight games with multiple blocks, you were having high assist totals, you were impacting the game in all these different ways. Do you remember a specific point in your basketball career where you embraced the little things, or was it just something that you were always great at?

I think it's just, like, I've done so many different, like roles in my freshman year. I was just basically like a shooter, like a spot up. Like in high school, I was just, that's all I did. And then, like, my sophomore year, I was a little bit more playmaking. And, like, in my junior senior, I was scoring. And then, like, I go to college and, like, I'm trying to figure out what I'm going to do, like, what role I'm in in college. And so, like, I've been able to just be a little, a little different each year, basically.

And so when I made it to the NBA, like, they need me to do just defense. Like, I felt like I could do that if they needed playmaker scoring. So, like, I feel like just having that, like, a lot of guys in the NBA, like, they've been the score of their whole life and they've been the best player. And so I think me being able to kind of have those different roles as a kid growing up, you kind of see the importance of those roles. You see how they impact winning and why they're so important. So kind of has always had that. And now it's kind of helped me have a career that I've had so far. And then I think like my parents kind of always taught me to just to play hard.

And so that's kind of like the foundation of it is just playing hard. Like you can want to do all the right things. But if you don't give the effort, then you probably will be a step behind or you won't get there. And so I think that's kind of the foundation of like I just try to go out there and play my hardest every day. And then just trying to make the right play and compete and help us win as many game as possible. Yeah, it's a habit. it's a skill playing hard. I think it's always been an underrated thing over the years.

It's so interesting the way you broke that down because like there's lots of examples of this throughout the NBA with some of our other stars. Like I think Paul George and Kauai Leonard kind of come to the forefront as examples where like when you have smaller roles where you're not on the ball, the way you stay in the rotation, the way you get minutes is by doing the little things. And so you kind of have to develop that part of your game. And then when the offensive game follows it,

it's not like that stuff gets lost. that just kind of gets brought along with you. And then all of a sudden, you just become this really well-rounded basketball player. That said, you have become a hell of an on-ball player over the years. I think I know the answer to this, but I want to hear what you think. So you're in a great rhythm.

You've just made two or three shots in a row. Everyone on the floor, Jail and Jason, Peyton, they all know that they're going to play through you on this possession. Obviously, you're going to make the right play. So if they blitz you or they get the ball out of your hands, so you're going to make the right play. But you're starting the possession looking for your shot because you're in good rhythm.

what's the first shot that you're hunting? You're bringing the ball up the floor. You got the ball and your high hesitation dribble. You're looking for your shot. What's the first thing you're hunting? That pull of three is dribble down. Try to get them back up a little bit and go prize off for that pull up three. That or just get a picker roll.

Try to get advantage off of that. And so you feel like you've got it going. We definitely give the freedom to kind of go down there and just kind of rise up. So I think if I had that scenario, like it's probably hesitation, pull up three. Hey, it's us to Jonas Brothers. And guess what?

We have some big news. What's the news? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a...

We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey, Jonas, guys. I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it.

Oh, we were thinking. I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band. Before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas.

And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey, Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite.

Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Last night, a blown call changed a game. This morning, the internet lost its mind. Highlights are trending. Opinions are flying. And nobody's telling you exactly what happened. That's where Sports Slice comes in. I'm Timbo.

Every episode, we're cutting through the noise. Breaking down the plays, the controversies, and the stories behind the headlines. We go straight to the source. The athlete themselves. Their locker room stories, their reactions, the stuff nobody gets to hear. The laughs, the drama, the triumphs, the moments that never make the highlight real. From viral moments to historic games, from buzzer beaters to controversial calls, we break it down, give you context, and ask the questions everybody wants answered.

Sports Slice brings you closer to the action with stories told by the people who live them. Listen to Sports Slice on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slic Life 12 and the TikTok podcast. podcast network on TikTok. Yeah. So I do you're going to say that. And one of the reasons, so every, every young basketball player that doesn't play in the NBA idolizes NBA players and picks little pieces from their game and tries to add it,

you know, like whether it's like hardened stepback footwork or it's like fade away footwork from different post players, whatever it might be. And one of the shots that I have tried to implement that I've stolen from you is I just call it the switch interchange pull up three, but basically like any sort of, ball screen where they're switching. So guard guard screens. There's always like a little gap when the on ball defender is trying to get underneath so he doesn't get beat on the slip.

And the guy who's switching out is like still in the process of coming out to you. There's like a little gap in there where there's space to take a pull up. And you've always killed teams with this where like you'll come up with the guard guard screen and the guy will sink underneath and the second guy is not quite there yet. And you just find that gap and that's when you take the pull up three. will do a ton of damage to teams just by like hitting that little gap in the switch. But yeah, definitely that that hesitation pull up three, especially since you got good size at the position and you have such a high release and you shoot it with so much arc.

It's definitely the one that I was thinking that you would say. Yeah, I like that. I like that three, too. That's a good, it's a good pull. So what do you think, I have a guess here as well, but what would you say is the best game you've ever played in your basketball career, considering, stakes, everything involved. Like, is there a game that you think back or like, that was

my biggest moment? That was the best game I ever played. Any level? Let's stick with the NBA for now because I think I've won. I have a pull for that one too, but let's go to the NBA first. Best game. Probably when I had 38 against the heat, like game four or something of the 24.

either that one it's got to be some playoff game like with the stakes are that highest and so I guess probably probably I'd say that one I mean the game winner the tip in is pretty cool but I'm gonna go with

the one when I had 38 so I think like game 4 24 there's a lot of good options to pick from as you mentioned I'm actually going to go 2024 finals game two specifically because of the stakes in the moment. So game two is always the toughest one, right? Home team holds serve, game one.

You know, you know Luke is coming in game two. And it ended up being a pretty close game late. And you hit two massive threes, including that one that's off the left wing when the shot clock was running down, that like absolute bomb. Then you hit the catch and shoot three off of the right wing. And then there's the crazy sequence late

where you guys had the fast break going the other way. It's five point game. There's like one minute left. And you have this crazy chase down block of PJ Washington at the other end of the floor where like if he gets that or like say you foul him and he makes it, it's a two point game. It's a three point game. All of a sudden it's like they get a stop. Lucas got the ball with the chance to tie.

He wins that game. It's a one one series going back to Dallas fundamentally different series. I've always thought like we're so quick as basketball fans to look back and go like, oh, they won four one. That means it was easy. But like usually these series tend to swing on a big. play here, a big play there. And I just thought, like, given the stakes championship on the line, game to 2024, you just made so many huge plays late in the game to help pull that one out.

But as you said, you did play at other levels. You played three years of D2 ball at Colorado, Colorado, Colorado. I just moved to Colorado. I love it here so far. I heard you spend your time here in the summers. I don't blame you. It's beautiful. But you also played a year at Colorado. I want to talk about the transfer thing in a little bit. But I want to go back to 2015 first round of the D2 NCAA tournament. You score 50 points against Colorado School of Mines. Your team's trailing late. You guys were trailing for most of the second half of that game.

And it kind of like was like the flash forward to future Derek White. First of all, I really enjoyed watching that film. You hit this like nasty spin move on a baseline inbound play where you kind of flashed to the left elbow and then you ripped and went right into his spin and just completely dusted the dude and got all the way to basketball for a layup. You had a bunch of highlights in that game. But down the stretch, it was the pull-up threes. You started getting into your pull-up three-point shooting game,

and you hit three massive ones down the stretch that helped close the gap. And I don't know if you remember this play, but you actually ended a win in the game with this beautiful skip pass to Tim Billingsley in the left corner. He hits the massive three. You guys get a stop. You close it out of the foul line.

Do you remember that game? Is that the game you were thinking about? First of all, was that the game you were thinking about? Yeah, yeah, that's definitely my... best statistical. I mean, even like stakes and everything first round in a state tournament. Yeah.

I mean, you score 50 anywhere, like, especially in college, I think that's there. But I just think like, first time school history won an essay tournament game and just everything that we kind of had to do to get there. And basically the same, like, team we played the year before, well, we played matches the year before,

but same kind of situation. And for us to come together and get a win, But, yeah, I think, like, the pull of three definitely kind of brought us back. And I kind of remember, like, I just had to dribble down and would just make a play. Like, I wasn't trying to do any offense, like, just make a play. And so the pull of threes are definitely a big. And then I do remember the past to Tim. And Tim made a huge shot for us.

And I think Darius made free throws and is an unbelievable game and something I kind of whenever forget. And so I don't know. I got to watch the highlights or the game film here. sometime. And so I haven't, I haven't seen it in a while, but, uh, yeah, I definitely remember it. Yeah, I'm going to try to, I'm going to talk to Jackson. We may, we may splice the footage into here because I, it was, it was fun to watch just for me as a basketball fan. I, I played at the NAA level. And I think a lot of people think like OD2 NAA. It's not, the, their, the coaching is insane. The, the skill level is insane. The size is everyone's big and strong. There's a lot of

grown men playing at that level. Like, it's so much harder basketball than people think playing at that level. And do you remember that game as sort of like an inflection point where you're like, okay, I'm ready for the next step? Or did you already know, like, let me frame one more like this. Like, did you already know you were transferring to Colorado at that point? Or was that something that happened after that? No.

I mean, we went to this next round and we lost. Like, after we lost, I was like, all right, we'll come back next year. And like, I got to get better. and we're going to try to get a national championship. Like, that's where my mind was. And it was probably, like, a week or two after, like, my trainer, my longtime trainer, Marcus Mason was, like, he said, I think it might be time for you to transfer.

And, like, there was, I was thinking about it, but not really thinking about it after my sophomore year. So, like, I knew there was, like, some D1 interest. But then he was, like, I think, like, C.U would be, like, interested, like, this is the Pact 12. This is, you're, you're going to. like you see your hometown team and stuff like that and so I'm like yeah not bad and like meeting with my parents and um talking with like some other coaches and stuff and so then I was like

all right I kind of have done everything I could in division two and if I want to get to the next level I have to go D1 and see how I can stack up against some of the top competition and so um I didn't want to leave I love to dare and um love the coaches and love the team and I didn't want to leave, but I definitely thought it was probably my best decision. It was scary, but I think it obviously worked out for me and something that I had to do. Yeah, Derek, it was the right decision. I hate to break it to you. The right decision. Okay, what was it like having to sit out a full season after that? Like, do you remember? Because I, I've seen obviously this is less of a thing now with the way the transfer portal works, but like

back in the day, that's what you did. If you wanted to transfer, you had to sit out a year. Was it, like, agonizing going from, like, 50-point game, best game of my life, I'm peaking as a basketball player to, like, suddenly not playing for a year? Or was it actually kind of nice to have a year to, like, just strictly focus on your skill development?

Yeah, I think, like, obviously, the transfer of D-1 to D-2, but, I mean, even back then, like, if you transferred D-1 to D-2, you didn't have to sit-out, but D-1 you did. I'm, like, that doesn't make any sense. Yeah. but I think like when I did it I was like this year off is going to be great for me and like I'm going to need to work like I need to get bigger I need to get stronger I need to kind of adapt so like when I transferred I was like this is going to be actually really helpful for me and then like I could treat those when they had games like I got to treat those like my games and like I was like at best player you might take what 20 shots at most like I can take like 500 shots so like I can get so much better than everybody that's playing.

So that's kind of like my mindset. And I'm like, I got to treat these practices like going against the starters as games. And so like I thought the rest of year was like was amazing for me. And like I learned a lot. I grew a lot. I got a lot better. But by the end there like, I kind of like basically the best player in practice. And so like I was like, damn, I could really help the team right now.

And like they made an NCAA tournament that year. And so I was like, damn, I could really help us. And get that. That's when I really wanted to get out there and compete. like it was hard watching the games like that. But in the end, like it was great for me to kind of develop my body gets stronger and kind of learn the division one because it's a big jump from D2 to D1. And so I hated not being able to help the team, but it was great for me.

That actually makes a lot of sense the way you broke it down. So like it was almost like a year for you to prepare for the physicality difference going from D2 to D1. Like, yeah, that makes sense. Like, go, if you were to jump right in, there might have been a lot more growing pains dealing with just the difference in athleticism and size and all that kind of stuff. But you got to literally practice against those guys go through a D1 weight training program. You saw me in D2. Like, I was skinny.

I was 165 pounds. I worked there, but I was not going to work at the, at the D1 low, especially in the PAC 12. And so I needed that year. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense. All right, two more quick ones, and then we'll get you out of here. First of all, tell us about the White Noise podcast, what that experience has been like for you and what some of your goals are in that area. Yeah, it's been a lot of fun. I didn't really ever think I'd have a podcast or be one of those people that do podcasts.

But I think it's just a great way for me to connect with different people. I think a lot of the episodes we've done, like I've learned so much about our guests and different ways. like they're successful or what they do. And so that's been really cool for me. It's been cool to kind of show like a different side of like myself. And obviously doing it with Well, she's been amazing. Someone that, I mean, roommates at UCCS together and kind of stay together throughout everything that I've done

and everything that he's done. And so like just all of that's been a lot of fun. And people are enjoying it. So I'm enjoying it. So it's been a fun journey. we continue to make it better and better and people continue to enjoy it. Yeah, it's, it's when you love basketball, you love to talk about basketball. And like, it's just like an opportunity, like you said, to connect with fans with it,

which I think is super important. I was reading Brian Winhorse was talking about this the other day, but I think it's one of the most fundamental parts of the fan experiences for us to understand NBA players to get their perspective. I mean, you don't want to just hear about the game from guys like me. You know, I'm not in the trenches with you guys. I don't know what it's like to deal with the things that you guys got to deal with. And so it's so important to have that additional perspective. Everybody who's listening to make sure you guys head over there and check out the White Noise podcast.

One last thing, though. So when COVID came around, you couldn't get in a gym. I was lucky I had a couple overseas guys that I played with where I would occasionally get to open up a gym with them and play. But it was kind of tough because we'd play like once a week, which is like really, really hard to build any sort of rhythm. And then they took down the outdoor baskets. it's like you couldn't even go outside and play anywhere. And so I was like, I was going stir crazy. I was going insane.

And so I picked up golf and I really enjoyed it because like there were a lot of similarities in the sense that like, you know, it kind of reminded like a golf swing reminds me of a jump shot in a lot of ways, the refinement, the muscle memory, the mind fuck that we were talking about earlier. The lack of wasted motion, all those different things. I did hear from Dan, Dan, a buddy of mine who I've been playing basketball. with here in Colorado. I've heard that you have picked up golf. So tell us what that experience has been like. It's been a journey. So I've been a lefty golf for my whole life. And then like I was messing around like so I got my, I'm a natural righty like in baseball.

My dad made me a lefty when I was a kid for when I was in baseball. So I have to golf left-handed because I bet left-handed. And then like a couple months ago like I was joking around like swinging right-handed and if you were like, I think he might be a righty. So last time I played golf, I golf, I golf right-handed for the first time. So we can say I'm, I don't even know if I'm a left-you or a right-y. So I'm not very good right now. But I do agree with like it's fun to be outside. It's fun to compete.

It's definitely like a challenge, mental challenge. You hit one good shot. You're like, why can I do that every time? And I do enjoy just like just being around. the good people and going out on the course. And so hopefully I get a little bit better and better here. And I'm going to have to, I think I'm going to stick right-handed. I think that's what I'm going to do.

And hopefully I'll figure some things out. Hit the ball a little straighter, be a little more consistent with it. But it's a lot of fun for the first like 12 to 13 holes right now. I got to get my gall stamina up to go past that. Oh, dude. That's literally what happens around that 13th, 14th hole. you get tired. My back starts to get sore too from the rotation. And like it just starts. Yeah. And then your form goes to shit.

Yeah. I'm done with this. Like the ball is not going anywhere. Like whatever. I'll just throw it on the green. It is a little bit better in Colorado. I'll tell you that. I grew up. I just moved here from Arizona. Arizona golf is a little bit different when you're when you're dealing with a hundred and seven degree weather. There's not the same views and stuff. But Derek, Kate, thank you so much for all your time this morning. I thought this was incredible. I thought it was super informative for our listeners. I just can't say enough about how much I appreciate you giving us your time today. Yeah, I appreciate you guys. That's all we have for today. As always, we appreciate you guys for supporting us and supporting the show. We will see you tomorrow. Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe.

I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast. Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to us. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, Sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know, tired and sick, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it.

Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform?

We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Joey Dardano. And on my new podcast, Hope from a Hypocrite, I'll be changing lives, helping people in need with thoughtful solutions. Sike, I'm a comedian. I'm not qualified to give good advice. Join me and my comedian friends as we riff, rant, recommend some of the most legally dubious advice,

known to me. This is Help from a Hypocrite, the worst advice from the dumbest people you know. Listen to Help from a Hypocrite Wednesdays on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, it's Edwin Castro, also known as Castro 1021. And I'm Conky, his best friend and business manager. And we've got a new show called The 1021 podcast. I'm taking you behind the scenes on how I became

one of Twitch's most popular streamers. We also love sports. And with the World Cup right around the corner, we'll be breaking down the biggest storylines ahead of the big tournament here in the USA. Listen to the 1021 podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.

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