The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hoops Tonight - KEY Game 2 adjustments for OKC Thunder & Indiana Pacers in NBA Finals | Mailbag

Episode Date: June 7, 2025

Jason answers mailbag questions on adjustments that Shai Gilgeous-Alexander’s Oklahoma City Thunder and Tyrese Haliburton’s Indiana Pacers can make in Game 2 of the NBA Finals, how the Pacers starters have outplayed OKC's, and more. Then he discusses the recent reporting that the New York Knicks are planning on making big trade offers for Giannis Antetokounmpo of the Milwaukee Bucks or Kevin Durant of the Phoenix Suns.   #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

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you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the ice. Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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Here at the volume, heavy Saturday, everybody. Hope everyone's having a great start to their weekend. As promised, we're going to be covering a mailbag today. A bunch of you guys dropped a bunch of really good questions over on Twitter. A bunch of stuff on the NBA finals. We'll be talking about some big picture concepts within that series. And then at the tail end of the show,

I have about a half dozen questions surrounding some big picture stuff around the league, some Detroit Pistons, some New York Knicks, some who's going to trade for Kevin Iran, who's going to trade for Janus, some fun stuff at the tail end of the show. know the Joe before we get started, subscribe to the Hoops Tonight YouTube channel so you don't miss any more of our videos. Follow me on Twitter at underscore Jason LT so you guys don't miss show announcements. Don't forget about our podcast fee, wherever you get your podcast under Hoops Tonight. It's also super helpful if you leave a rating and a review on that front. Jackson is doing great work on our social media feeds on Twitter, Instagram,

and Facebook and TikTok. Make sure you guys follow us there. And the last but not least, keep dropping mailbag questions in our YouTube comments so we can hit them in our weekly mailbags throughout the remainder of the year. All right, let's talk some basketball. First question. Hey Jason, Shea took 30 shots and only had 31 points on those shots, not including free throws, while only dishing out three assists. It sort of felt like he tried to be Superman, and it played right into the Pacer's hands. What do you think Shea has to do differently in game two? Love the show. Thanks again for supporting the show. So I, those of you guys who watch yesterday's film session, we'll have a little bit of an understanding of this concept from the film.

but I talked after game one about how it felt to me like Shea was trying to kind of force his way into rhythm under the NBA finals environment. And after rewatching the game and I talked about this in the film session, I actually ended up disliking a lot of the shots that he took early. You know, I talked about in the film session the idea of investing in rhythm. And that to me is such an important part of a point guard's job. You are the ultimate decision maker on a possession by possession basis on the offensive end of the floor. and if you invest in rhythm by moving the ball, it's more likely that later in the game... Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what?

We have some big news. What's the news, new? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a... We're the first people to do podcasts.

Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes.

I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey, Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends.

Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis,

and I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris. Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on clay. Jen Chinch win. I mean, she went down at three to, two. Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me.

And she likes Clay. Listen, Lena Rubakina is arguably the best player in the world right now. And I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports.

Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth.

Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. and you need people to be involved when you need guys to make shots, it's more likely that they're not coming down. We've jokingly been talking about the Indiana Pacers and the damage that they've done in this postseason run with crazy shot making at the end of games. And we jokingly call it like devil magic or voodoo or whatever it is.

And there's a certain amount of like, yeah, it's pretty wild that they've hit as many tough shots as they have hit. But as is always the case, variance or randomness is going to be pretty far. down the list in what plays into that outcome compared to real basketball concepts. And if there's something to be said about the way the Pacers play, it's that they keep everyone involved throughout the game. The usage rate for their top player in Tyrese Halliburton is about 21% in the regular season, right? That's way below what you see from a typical on ball guard, who is usually

determining the outcome of every single possession. Starts from Tyrese and Rick Carlisle and the identity they breed in the team. And then from there, it's just the group of players all trusting each other and keeping the ball moving from side to side and keeping everyone involved. As a result, like, let's look at those tough shots that got made down the stretch that game. I saw Miles Turner hit a contested three over Hartenstein on the right wing. A contested step back three over Chet Holmgren on the left wing, a really tough leaning kind of drop cover, like picking roll pop, like short roll shot around the right elbow that he hit, they're down the stretch. Who else hit a tough shot? Aaron Neesmith flying into that left corner off of the move, right? Who else hit a tough shot? Andrew Nemhardt hitting off the dribble crazy stepback against Sheikh Yildes Alexander, right? Then Tyrese Halliburton hits the game winner. A bunch of different guys hit tough shots because a bunch of different guys are involved throughout the game. With Shagy Elders Alexander randomly, we got some good rhythm for Lou Dort who hit a lot of pretty tough contested shots in that game, but no other thunder player outside of Shea or Lou Dort was in

any sort of rhythm. And that is the downside of approaching the game the way that Shea did. Again, if you guys want to see visual examples of what I'm talking about, go to our film session that we released yesterday. But the long and short of it is, Shea came into this game and took a ton of mediocre shots that he could have got later in the clock. Go move the ball around. If Indiana closes out well and dudes don't get good look. it'll work its way back to you. Go take that same contested 18 footer. But I thought he took a lot of those shots early in the clock

and kind of bailed the Pacers out and it prevented his team from getting into the rhythm that they needed to get into to be better on the offensive end of the floor. Next question. Who is the most important role player moving forward in this series? This is an interesting question. So I think on the Pacers front, I'm going to stick with exactly what I said in the series preview.

And I thought it showed again last night. Miles Turner. When Miles Turner is hitting threes and when he's beating post mismatches or beating offensive rebounding mismatches, he is deadly impactful in this particular matchup against a Thunder team that can't match up with his size, even with their bics, who can be a little small, right, compared to him. So like, Miles Turner to me is the key to everything for Indiana in terms of their role player talent. If he's hitting pick and pop threes and he's successfully beating post mismatches and rebounding mismatches, he is the catalyst for their ability to score against this Oklahoma City defense. On the Oklahoma City front, it's really all of their spot-up shooters, but I'm going to

focus on Lou Dort just so that I can give you one specific player. But it's really all of their spot up shooters. As you guys saw in the film session yesterday, really, really overreacting to Shea and J-dub drives, sometimes three even four helpers meeting in the lane. The kickouts who are there. Kisan Wallace got good looks late. He missed. J. Dub got good looks late. He missed. Lou Dort is going to be the consistent guy because J. Dub, I don't think counts as a role player. He's the co-star. Kaysan might not be on the floor when they go big with Isaiah Hartnstein and Chad Holmgren, right?

So the consistent guy who's probably going to keep getting those clean catch and shoot looks throughout the series and needs to hit them is Lou Dort. So those are who I think are the two most important role players in the series for either team. Other question. Also, one thing that stood out, especially after that first avalanche of turnovers is that Indiana starters outplayed OKC's pretty consistent, pretty convincingly in that second half. Startling trend considering the massive success. The massive success that Turner, Halley, Nemhard, Neesmith, and Pascal have already had. So here's the thing. I agree that Indiana's starters outplayed Oklahoma City starters, especially in the second half of that game.

But I think it's pretty clear that there was an order of operations problem with Indiana or with Oklahoma City, with Shea and J-dub not investing in their other role players more frequently throughout the game. Like there's a chance that you get more out of Chet. You get more out of Kaysen Wallace. You get more out of J-dub even if the ball just is flowing more throughout the game. And so I think in general, Oklahoma City starters didn't play well. And so they're capable of playing a lot better heading into a game two. But I do agree that Indiana starters outplayed them in game one.

How rare is it that the Pacers play with this consistent effort throughout the series and games. Going against the traditional flow of playoffs, usually stealing game one on the road would definitely mean the team will get blown out in game two, but you know that's not going to be the case. So I've thought a lot about this within the concept of game two, right? So in game two,

we have typically seen in this sort of situation, the team that's down one oh, bring a ton of energy. And it's like a kind of a two very, powerful forces of energy clashing here because on the one hand, we have an Indiana Pacers team that stole game one against Milwaukee and then one game two and then stole game one against the calves and then one game two. And then, well, I guess they actually, the games that they actually stole in the Cavs series was game two. But the point is, is they won game two after going up one

oh, right? Against the Knicks, same thing. They steal game one in crazy passion. They still come back and win game two. So Indiana has stolen game two after going up 1-0 on the road in all three series. But actually, I think in the Indiana series, they were at home for the first two games. But the point is, they went up 2-0 in all three series. And in the Cavs match-up, and in the Knicks matchup, they managed to win game two on the road despite going up 1-0. But then we on the other side of it, we have Oklahoma City who against Denver toasted

off game one. And then they came out and beat the shit out of the nuggets in game two, right? So which of those forces is going to win in this particular matchup? Well, let's talk about each team. What do we expect from Indiana in game two? Pacers basketball. I expect Pacers basketball with fewer turnovers than they had in game one. So I'd argue the Pacers will probably play a little bit better in game two than they played in game one.

That said, as we saw in the film session, as we've talked about ad nauseum over the last couple of days, She can play a much better floor game, just keeping his teammates involved. J. Dub needs to not settle for so many jump shots earlier in the game and look to attack. and guys are certainly capable of doing a better job knocking down the open catch and shoot threes that those guys generate. Oklahoma City can play much better, and I do believe they will play much better in game two. I'm fascinated by T.J. McConnell, is he the least athletic, gifted rotation player on an NBA finals roster in the modern era? Also, I thought Nemhart bringing the ball up in the fourth quarter

allowed the Pacers to get into their actions much earlier. How does Oklahoma City counter this in game two? Great questions. First of all, T.J. McConnell to me is actually a much better athlete than he gets credit for. He's a pretty damn big and strong guard. Like he's got a lot of power to his game, but he's very good at changing directions, especially at full speed. He plays with a lot of pace. He's always attacking already on the move instead of attacking a set defender. And then he's very good at changing direction while going full speed with crossovers and spins and things along those lines. So I actually think T.J. McConnell is a very gifted athlete. He has been, in my opinion, one of the best, like, dribble drive guards in the league for a while in terms of just beating people off the dribble. I don't think that he's a poor athlete or a guy who lacks athletic gifts. I think he's a guy that is actually a pretty underrated athlete at his position. The pace in general with the pacer's.

I thought they did a nice job pushing the ball off the floor consistently in the second half without turning the ball over, which forced a lot of transition cross matches. I didn't think it was just Nemhard bringing the ball up the floor. I thought it was just kick ahead passes and just playing with a lot of pace and guys running and just playing Pacers basketball. Oklahoma City can only do so much to stop that with the way that Indiana plays. They did stop easy runouts. There's a few of them like Siakum snuck past Chet for an easy layup at one point in the second half.

But overall, it's not like they were giving up like easy stuff in the early part of transition. It's just the cross matches that come from that in Indiana's ability to punish mismatches. I thought the main thing that Oklahoma City clean up defensively heading in the game, too, is just their overhelp. There's just too many examples of them, like, sending two, three guys at a dude in the paint. And when Indiana is not turning the ball over and they're spraying the ball out, there's easy open shots. And it's like, yeah, like, Topin's going to knock that down. You know, Turner's going to knock that down.

The knee Smith's going to knock that down. So there's a certain amount of like they've got to be a little bit more, like a little bit more picky, I should say, about when they decide to help. in those situations in game two. Did Mark Dagonalt blow his wad too early by adapting to Pacer style basketball before trying to play Thunder style basketball? What adjustments does he have left?

Seems like he doesn't think they can get into their half court set against this team. I don't think Mark's worried about their ability to get into their offense. I think he knows that Shea and J. Dub played a poor game, and I think he's going to go over with them in film, and I think they're going to clean it up. I think Shea and J. Dub are both going to be way better in game too. Now, what I look at it in terms of adopting the Pacer style basketball, the big criticism is that Mark Dagnol went slow or went small down the stretch, right?

When he went small, they started giving up a bunch of offensive rebounds to see Acom and Turner underneath the basket. Here's the thing. There's a certain amount of those offensive rebounds that they're going to be able to get no matter what against switches. Like, it doesn't matter if Chet's on the floor. If Chet's on the perimeter and Turner or Seacom's got a small underneath the basket. And so to me, it's more just they got to do a better job when they're giving up those mismatches of get like gang rebates. get like gang rebounding everyone's got to crash dude's got to come flying in to knock away the ball overall as a team they got to do a better job playing uh winning those contested rebound battles right as far as like defensive adjustments that are available to them the only big one that i see is just

those help and recover decisions that we talked about earlier just being a little bit more picky about when they offer a ton of help and leave shooters open in the process next question why didn't indy take the ball out of SGA's hands and double. So this is complicated. They weren't doubling that much. They were throwing some pretty aggressive hedges in the second half and they gave up some slips and some rolls out of that. But for the most part, they were offering all that extra defensive attention at Shea after he beat his man off the dribble. Like there was a play where he split a ball screen against Obie Toppin when he went to hedge and got right downhill. And then

three Pacers just met him right in the lane. The double team, so to speak, the getting the ball out as Shea's hand, so to speak, came late in the form of sending aggressive help at the rim and there being kickout opportunities. And honestly, I thought Shea did a nice job down the stretch of making those kickouts. Dude's just got to make shots. And the second piece of it is if Shea invests more early in the game at getting those guys shots, they might be more comfortable and more able to knock down those shots when they get into crunch time late. next question how did the celtics out clutch the pacer's four times last playoffs granted without hallie for part of it couldn't that loss or could that loss be part of carlyle's inspiration to

build the most clutch and resilient team we've seen in recent history couple things first of all that celtings team was a special team very very very good team that had the ability to consistently generate great shots down the stretch punish mismatches matches and they were such a high level defensive team last year in the postseason the second piece of it is is, I think Halliburton is the key. Like, in these games that they've stolen, who's been the guy that's had the magic late? It's been Tyrese Halliburton and his ability to beat Janus off of the dribble for ISO scooping layup, right? It's been Tyrese Halliburton hitting that step back at the top of the key in game two over Ty Jerome to win game two against the Cavs. It was

Tyrese Halliburton hitting the step back foot on the line jump shot against the Knicks in game one that sent that game to overtime. It was Tyrese Halliburton last night hitting the off the dribble jump shot. Like Tyrese Halliburton brings the upside because he's just a better player now than he was last year because he's healthier. He has his hamstring underneath him and he's in just in a better physical position to be impactful down the stretch of these games. Then down the roster,

everyone's just a little better. M.R. is a little better than he was last year. Neesmith is considerably better than he was last year. Turner's playing the best basketball of his career. All these dudes are just playing better. And so they're a better version of what that Pacers team was. last year. Last question on this series, and then we'll move on to some stuff around the league. After all the talk about the thunder being compared to the KD Warriors, how even more laughable is that comparison now after game one? A couple things. I agree that comparing this Thunder team to the KD Warriors is silly. That team was obviously better. Kevin Rant was the

third best player in the league at that point in time. Steph was the second best player in the league at that time. Clay Thompson was probably the best three and D guy in the entire NBA at that point, Andre Guadala was probably like a top two or three like Swiss Army knife role player forward in the league at that time. And Draymond Graham was the best defensive player of his era and it's very much at the peak of his powers at that point in time. So like I think there's a pretty large gap between Golden State and the second best champion of this era. If Oklahoma City can can win the series, which is an if, obviously, then I think they kind of take that second spot in terms of talent and what they have defensively and the job they did getting out of that Western conference.

But yeah, I think comparing them to the KD Warriors is foolishness. That team is the most talented roster ever assembled in NBA history, two of the top three players in the league, all veteran experienced talent, not guys that are new and green and unfamiliar with this stage. So I didn't see that comparison. That said, before you go burying the thunder, who cares if they will lose game one if they win the next four and they win the series in five. They're still going to be looked back at as a team that's one of the most dominant teams in NBA history within a single season. So don't bury the thunder yet, even though I don't think they're as good as the KD Warriors, they still have a very good chance to win this series and to win convincingly if they can apply

themselves. Blending Vice's signature dynamic storytelling with the high-octane world of sports, Vice Sports brings an exciting and diverse range of programming that goes beyond the game, from action-packed live events to gripping behind-the-scenes documentaries to hard-hitting investigative pieces and in-depth profiles of athletes coaches teams vice sports captures the raw energy drama and passion that makes sports truly unforgettable catch live events and other exclusive sports programs only on vice tv go to vise tv.com to find your cable channel all right let's move around the league a little bit. This was a report. Gary Wulfell reports that the Knicks are preparing a tsunami type offer for Janus. The question was, what offer do you think this is? Maybe McAil and towns? Here's the thing. Also,

if they get outbid, should they shift towards a more achievable target like Kevin Durant? So a couple things. If the Knicks are preparing an offer for Janus, what does it look like? From what I understand, I believe they only have access to one first round pick this summer, if I'm remembering correctly. So they don't have the draft compensation to get into a bidding war for a guy like Janus, in theory. Now, if you get a third team involved, or if you can convince the bucks that they want to take back of McHale Bridges, or, you know, I would argue me,

you might want to even look at trading OG because he plays the same position as Janus. But whatever it is, if you're going to look to move one of those guys, guys and the bucks are like, yeah, we want win now pieces. Sure, let's do it. That's great. But like, I think that the bucks are probably more interested in draft compensation. And if that's the case, then you got to get a third team involved. And so now you're looking at getting a third team involved and trading basically OG or McHale or towns or wherever it is, whatever you, you decide to give up for draft compensation that then gets rerouted towards the bucks in a Janus deal. But like, me it's just the reality is is that there are teams that can absolutely outbid everybody

with respect to yannis like the spurs just have so many more picks to throw on the table the rockets have so many more picks to throw on the table if one of those teams decides to get involved with yannis they can just so much easier get that sort of deal done right and so viewed as a long shot but if they do get outbid should they shift towards a more achievable target like kd absolutely their roster is pretty much guys in their late 20s. So they're a bit of a shorter window anyway, so I wouldn't be overly concerned

about tying myself to an older player. KD's game translates super well in the late phase of his career, especially in a team like this that has so much talent that he wouldn't be depended on as much. And there's an easy vehicle in the form of Carl Anthony Towns.

Phoenix really wants a kind of a franchise starting center. If that's the framework of the deal and it's Carl Anthony Towns and a first round pick for Kevin Durant and the sons get a younger star that's been to back-to-back conference final, and look, do I think that makes the Suns a very interesting team? No, but I don't think the Suns

are very interesting team now. So at that point, whatever. And if you could somehow pull that sort of deal off and get Kevin Durant, that puts you in a pretty damn strong position going into next season, especially in an Eastern conference that is wide open with Boston falling apart, with Milwaukee

falling apart. Like, this is a winnable conference out east. And I would view Kevin Durant as a target there that I think would put the Knicks into another echelon, echelon in terms of reliable scoring talent. Also, Kevin Durant's a very good defensive player in a low man context when he can protect the rim,

be a defensive rebound or things along those lines. So like, again, if you need to get more draft compensation, maybe you do end up including like an OG and a separate, you know, three team structure that sends more draft compensation towards the Sons. But if you can get rid of towns and keep one of your two forwards and keep Brunson and get Kevin Durant, I think that's a very interesting team in a wide open Western Conference,

or Eastern Conference, excuse me. Not quite related to this finals, but seeing how far the Knicks went and how open the East is next year, should the Pistons consider going in a bit harder next year, seeing that they might not actually be that far away. In general, what's a realistic move for them this summer? So again, if I'm remembering correctly, if the Pistons let all of their cap holds walk,

so if they let like Dennis walk and Tim Hardaway Jr. walk and all these guys, I think the max cap space they can put together is about 19 million. It's like 19, 20 million, something along those lines. That's not enough to bring in a super high level free agent, right? Especially when I would argue that Tim Hardaway Jr. and Dennis Schroeder kind of, if you can bring them back on team friendly deals, that's actually better than going out to get a free agent. I would try to get those guys tied up on relatively short-term mid-level contracts, meaning around two years or less or like a team option for the third year, sure, so that you have some flexibility.

But like a two year deal somewhere in the 15 to 20 million range, if you can do something like that for those guys where they're mid-level contracts where like, you know, one of them's in the, you know, five to 10 million range and the other ones in the 10 to 15 million range or something, they become trade pieces at that point. Trade filler if the right sort of move just kind of materializes this summer for you to jump on. But again, don't jump the gun on a player that is going to shorten your window. Cade is a franchise altering type of talent. He has proven that he can succeed at the highest levels of basketball. I'm a believer in him. You have Jaden Ivy coming back. You've got young role player talent in the Sarr Thompson.

You have the ability to be patient here while also having guys like, Tobias Harris, guys like Malik Beasley, guys like Tim Hardaway, Jr. on team friendly deals that you can still be competitive in the short term, but then turn your attention in the draft towards off ball scoring talent. That's the big one with the, you know, I think Assar Thompson obviously has the ability to be one of the better kind of like perimeter like D and three types of players in the league, right? As a guy that can guard the opposing best player. he's a guy that obviously they can unlock

some of the vertical spacing stuff that the Rockets do with the men Thompson. He can become a better offensive player and we'll see how his jump shot develops overtime. Ron Holland obviously is like another kind of like athletic type of young wing. What they're missing is like older college talent. So like guys that are in, you know,

three, four year college guys that you can find in the middle of the first round, late first round, guys that can, that have been playing in a in context as like weak side scores, guy that can knock down jump shots and drive closeouts, things along those lines. I think there's a lot of opportunity in the draft for that sort of talent. So the point is,

is like, let this thing grow slowly. Don't jump the gun for an Eastern Conference finals appearance that ends of shortening your window. Don't make the mistake that the Cavs did with LeBron in early, you know, in the early part of his career where they kept making these kind of mediocre, aggressive deals and getting guys like Antoine Damison,

Jameson and Mo Williams that were, good players made team better, but didn't make them a championship team. And so patience is the name of the game. The specific type of talent that I mean, I like where they're at at center. I like where they're at with their shot creators. I like where they're at in terms of having athletic guys on the perimeter that can guard and fly up and down the floor. What they're missing is just off ball skill. Basically guys that you can phase out Tim Hardaway and Malik Beasley and phase in younger versions of those players that you find in the middle to late portion of the first round in the draft. All right, we have five more questions. I heard San Vassini suggests the framework of an Austin Reeves Derek lively trade.

What are your thoughts on that from both sides? I said this a while back and it's kind of my current stance with respect to an Austin Reeves trade. I think it makes sense to trade Austin Reeves as long as you get back either one, a very good ball handler that can be that. secondary ball handler next to Luca and is a better athlete, okay, or two, two high level starters. Okay. If I can turn Austin into Derek lively and the guy like a PJ Washington, then sure, I think it starts to make some sense. But if I'm just getting Derek lively, I feel like Austin Reeves is a better player, a better asset, even though I think lively

obviously fits the big picture goals of the Lakers. And so I would trade Austin for Derek as long as I also got PJ back as a legitimate starting caliber piece of forward depth, right? And that's a guy that when LeBron retires, PJ Washington could just slide in at the four, you know, and obviously he brings a depth piece in that regard in the short term, right? But like just flipping Austin for like a starter, he's a better starter. That doesn't make any sense. I think it makes some sense to at least look around trading Austin because I don't think it makes a ton of sense to have two unathletic guards in Austin and Luca as foundational players in your starting lineup, but you don't just get rid of them for the sake of getting rid of them. You get rid of them for high value and nothing

less than that. All righty, I changed my mind. I actually doubled up the, the Janus question. So we actually have, um, we actually only have three questions left. Looking at this Pacers and Thunder team, what could they do in the off season to further push them to the chip? Both have a good amount of draft picks and it seems the thunder needs scoring and playmaking help. Well, I think the Pacers use an upgrade at the two three position. So actually disagree with this. I, uh, I don't think the thunder should make a move for Janus. They're obviously very, they're either a championship team, which the series isn't over or they're very, very close to being a championship team. And Chet's going to get better. J. Dub's going to get better. They're young. The sky's the limit. Like,

I don't think it makes a ton of sense to shorten your window to make, to give you a better chance at, you know, one single championship in this regard. Like I, and also I just think it'd be bad for the league if Janus went to Oklahoma City. So I don't think Oklahoma City should do anything. As far as the Pacers go, like, like honestly,

there's a bit of a five out spacing concept with a guy like Siakum, where even though Siakum is not as good as Janus, I think there's a little bit of a diminishing return. The Pacers are very ball and player movement heavy offense. And Janus is more of like a like brute force, you know, just sheer force of will and power type of weapon. not a guy that is known for being a super, super high level, quick decision read and react player

and three point shooter and all those things that are so important in the Indiana Pacers offense. I don't really see that as a realistic type of move. And as far as the two and three goes, I think, I think Nemhard and East Smith are strengths in this offense as ball pressure guys that can run action and shoot. Like, I don't necessarily think an upgrade there is something that you look outside the roster for. or if anything, Ben Matherin in his potential, and it continues to grow and develop in coming years

and he becomes your upgrade at the two and three in the big picture. Highly unlikely that this would happen due to the current circumstances and the beat, but I feel the Pacers are the perfect team for Janus. He'd elevate the defense, and I feel Hallie would compliment Janus perfectly with East kind of in limbo right now. Thoughts on this.

As I mentioned earlier, I just don't think Janus fits as well with Indiana as he does in some other situations. mean like Janus would make the Pacers better. He's Janus. But the point is, is like you'd have to give up a ton to get him. And it is a little bit of a diminishing return in a system that prioritizes three points shooting and read and react quickness, which are two kind of weaknesses for Janus relative to his strengths. Last question. Did we undervalue Indiana's shot making ability before the series while weighing, while weighing Oklahoma City's ability to turn people over too much?

Game is about getting buckets, making tough jumpers. And if the playoffs is any evidence, they do it better than almost anyone we've seen. This is an interesting question, and I appreciate you asking it because it's caused me to look at things a little bit differently. I would argue that Shea and J-dub are better tough shot makers than Hallibbberton and Seacom as a unit, mainly on the strength of Shea, obviously.

But where I think it gets interesting is as you go down the roster, I do think the Pacers are a better aggregate tough shot-making team. Neesmith can make tough shots. Nemhard can make tough shots. Turner can make tough shots. T.J. McConnell will make tough crazy fadeaways. Ben Mathrin can make tough shots. Obie Toppin can make tough shots.

I do think there's an aggregate tough shot making piece with the Pacers, which is really fascinating and has shown in a big way in this postseason run. And so honestly, with the way that their offense works and all the whirling around looking for great shots, it doesn't really matter where the ball ends in the sequence, you know, with four or five seconds on the shot clock. any of those dudes can put the ball on the floor and create a decent look for themselves. And I do think that that aggregate shot-making talent has been a little bit underrated. As far as Oklahoma City's ability to turn people over and whether or not that's being weighed properly, we have one game and in the first half it worked marvelously and in the second half it did it.

So I think we just need more data before we can really speak, you know, with conviction in that specific regard. All right, guys, it's all a half for today. As always, I sincerely appreciate you guys for supporting me and supporting the show. Again, we will be back tomorrow night after the final buzzer of game two of the NBA finals with Colin Cowher. So we'll have a breakdown with Colin. Then we'll be heading over to playback after. Then on Monday morning, I'll do more of like a detailed breakdown. And then we'll do film on Tuesday.

All right, I appreciate you guys. I will see you tomorrow. What's up, guys? As always, I appreciate you for listening to and supporting hoops tonight. It would actually be really helpful for us if you guys would take a second and leave a rating and a review. As always, I appreciate you guys supporting us. If you could take a minute to do that, I'd really appreciate it. The Volume.

Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. Nice.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We get to ask other people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was funny. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow.

Then after that game seven, Marquis come until he's like, you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Will Ferrell's Big Money Players and IHeart Podcast presents soccer moms. So I'm Leanne. Yeah.

This is my best friend, Janet. Hey. And we have been joined at the hips since high school. Absolutely. A redacted amount of years later, we're still joined at the hip. Just a little bit bigger hips. This is a podcast. We're recording it as we tailgate our youth soccer games in the back of my Honda Odyssey.

with all the snacks and drinks. Why did you get hard seltzer instead of beer? They hit a bogo. Well, then you got them. Listen to soccer moms on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.