The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hoops Tonight - LIVE: PACERS-THUNDER FINALS GAME 1 REACTION: Tyrese Haliburton DOES IT AGAIN to steal comeback win off SGA

Episode Date: June 6, 2025

Jason reacts live after the Indiana Pacers get yet another wild comeback win, this time against the Oklahoma City Thunder in Game 1 of the NBA Finals. He discusses Tyrese Haliburton and Pascal Siakam leading the charge to steal a win against Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, Lu Dort, Jalen Williams, and Chet Holmgren.    Follow the show on Playback for future “Aftershow” content: https://www.playback.tv/hoopstonight  #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Welcome to Hoops Tonight here at the volume. Happy Thursday, everybody. Hope all of you guys are having a great week. As I said, after game one of the Eastern Conference finals, there's some sort of weird voodoo magic going on that makes it so that you have to beat the Indiana Pacers for like five times in a seven game series. And once again, in classic fashion, down against the ropes,

several different times down the stretch, several different runs from the thunder to build more additional margin, and then impossible shot after impossible shot from the pacer's down the stretch. Aaron Neesmith coming flying out of that left corner, rising and firing, like it's game one against the Knicks all over again. Andrew Nemhardt with the 17 dribble step back against Chey Gildes Alexander with a hand right in his face to hit the 3rd. and then Tyrese Halliburton with the clock winding down against Kays on Wala. is a quick little stop and pop jumper a little bit outside of the right elbow. And the Pacers are up one zero in the NBA finals and very much in position to give themselves

a chance to win this series. Just absolutely unbelievable stuff. All my notes, crumple them up, throw them in the trash as far as the narrative of this game goes. We're going to get into as much of the basketball as we can and talk about the different dynamics at play in the series and try to interpret as much of this as we can into what's repeatable and what is not. But I am in complete shock, as I can imagine, just about anybody outside of the Pacers fans who have been believing in this team all season long, I'm in shock and I barely know where to start with this thing. I will say, before we get started, I cannot say enough how much this Pacers team has just injected an enormous amount of entertainment

into this NBA playoffs. The NBA playoffs has just been a lot of blowouts over the years, in recent years, kind of lacking some of that high level entertainment in the later rounds. And this Pacer's team and their unwillingness to give up in the way that they play and the way that they put themselves in position to steal games with their incredible attention to detail and sharpness and relentless motor and effort have just literally injected the enthusiasm and honestly just what I think is a very beautiful brand of basketball for all of us to watch and enjoy for young basketball players to learn from to improve their

own games for basketball teams and basketball coaches to improve the way they play. I can't say enough about what the Pacers have done in this playoff run for my view of the game. I think for everybody's learning of the game and obviously just making for a very entertaining basketball product. You guys know the drill before we get started, subscribe to the Hoops Tonight YouTube channels. You don't miss any more of our videos. Follow me on Twitter at underscore Jason LT so you guys don't miss show announcements.

Don't forget about a podcast fee wherever you get your podcast under Hoops tonight. It's also super helpful if you leave a rating and a review on that front. Jackson's doing great work on our social media feeds on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok. Make sure you guys follow us there for additional content throughout the season. We are not doing a mailbag at the tail end of tonight's show because we're hitting an all-star topic surrounding the new. move from Adam Silver to try to pit Team USA versus the world. We're going to have that, but we will,

when we wrap up here tonight, be heading over to playback. That's playback.com. TV slash hoops tonight. We will be doing a chat mailbag there. We'll also be taking callers. We'll obviously watch the film from that insane fourth quarter and go over how the pacer stole this game. I'm looking forward to watching through that with you guys. So when we wrap up here on YouTube, remember to follow us over to Playback.tv slash hoops tonight. All right, let's talk some basketball. So this game really was a story of two halves

in a lot of ways. I talked about how in the series preview that there is like an opening test with Oklahoma City, these fail points. If you guys remember, I talked about these potential failure points for Indiana in the series where if they just struggled to get the ball to where it needed to be, that they were dead on arrival.

And those, we talked about specifics. We talked about ball pressure in the back court. We talked about off ball denials. We talked about high post entries and low post entries. We talked about double teams in posts and ISOs and drives. We talked about like when they get the ball into the middle of the floor, whether it's through a drive or a roll or a post, the ability for them to pass out of the traffic in those spots on the floor.

and they failed that test miserably in the first half. Like as bad as you will ever see, especially relative to the way that this Indiana Pacers team typically takes care of the basketball. Turnovers, bringing the ball up the floor. Dude's getting poked away from behind as they're not paying attention to what's happening behind them. Turnovers on post entries.

Turnovers on pocket passes as they're missing guys tagging from the weak side. everything. The big one that they were dealing with in that first half was posting ISOs when guys turned their back. Just like as soon as someone turned their back, the dude was just swooping in from behind and swiping the ball away in the half court. Nineteen turnovers in the first half. A truly remarkable performance defensively from the Thunder. Honestly, I thought it was a showcase of everything that makes them so great. Again, like for those of you haven't, very Thunder fans, maybe if you haven't watched as much Pacers, like, that's a team that doesn't turn the ball over.

lot. That's a team that typically handles that sort of aggression and pressure extremely well, and they didn't in that first half. And it's because of the job that Lou Dort can do on Tyrese Halliburton to make him uncomfortable. It's because of the job that those guys do swarming and swiping at the basketball. Lou Dort, his activity on the backline even in this game, Caruso on the backline, everyone flying around and making plays, even Shea getting in on the turnover forcing. Now, to Indiana's credit, their transition defense in that catastrophe in the first half kept them in the game. We've talked so much over the course of the last few weeks about low-hanging fruit. These are things that are available in every single basketball game to every single team.

Now, you need a certain amount of elite shot making to make it to your ultimate goal in the NBA. Like, that's the fourth time in this playoff run that Tyrese Hallibur. has hit a tough shot in a one-on-one situation to either win a game or to put his team in position to win a game in the final seconds of the, as the clock is expiring. Obviously, the Aaron Neesmith shot, the Andrew Nemhard shot, there were a lot of really tough shots that were mixed in there. And obviously, you're not just going to win a game because you're a sharp disciplined basketball team. You've got to have a certain amount of individual

greatness to carry you over the top, especially when you're staring down, Shea Gildes Alexander on the other end, who outside of his last couple possessions, I thought, had a really good game. And at a certain point, in order to put yourself in position to weather that storm, to live through some turnovers, to live through some sloppiness, you got to be super sharp in other areas of the game. And they consistently got back, protected the rim, and stopped the ball, got contests on three-point shooters. And so despite allowing or despite turning the ball over 19 times in the first half, they allowed just nine points off of those turnovers. And then as we say, when you're going to apply that type of pressure, if you're going to deny, if you're going to double,

if you're going to tag rollers and offer a ton of nail help and double team post-ups and do all of that stuff, the flip side is guys are open. And if you can get the ball through the defense to those guys, they're still open. They are a good closeout team. They're going to make it more difficult than it appears on the surface compared to some other opponents out there. But you can't act, they don't actually have six players on the court. They just feel like that sometimes. If you can take care of the basketball and you could pass it through their defense, you can't get open shots against Oklahoma City's base scheme. And in the second half, just six turnovers total, three in the third quarter, three in the fourth quarter, and just two points off of

turnovers. As a result, mixed in, obviously, with the tough shot making that we saw, a lot of pretty solid, either like wide open catch and shoot threes for guys like Obie Toppin or, you know, moderately contested catch and shoot threes that are good looks for guys like Aaron Neesmith and a lot of pretty high quality attempts right around the rim. And they scored 66 points in the second half. And all night long, their defense held up pretty well. Wasn't perfect. They ran a lot of traditional coverages and at various points against the traditional coverages. They struggled. Shea Gildas Alexander, to his credit, a lot of stars in NBA. history struggle in the NBA finals.

They get a little passive or they get tentative or they, you know, kind of get just, they just look kind of shook from the moment. I mean, you saw it happen to several, you saw it happen to damn near the entire Pacers bench to start this game. Although shout out to Obie Top and he had about as nightmare a start to this game as you could possibly have fumbling the ball and throwing it around all over the place. But he hit a couple of threes and he loosened up and he was awesome from that point forward and hit so many big shots for the Pacers.

this game. But once the, at the start of the game, Sheigeld's Alexander came out and he was like, screw being passive, screw easing my way into this game. I'm shooting the basketball. And he had 11 shot attempts in the first quarter. I think he had like 19 or 20 in the first half. And he essentially accelerated the process with which he became comfortable, which I actually thought was smart, especially as a scoring guard. Like if you're a scoring guard, And again, the formula for this team is elite defense and Shay shot making on a lot of nights, especially when things bogged down the way they did. And he just got himself into a pretty good rhythm.

I thought he passed out of an ISO to J-dub late that he probably didn't need to. It kind of looked like he was just hesitant to go ISO again. And then overcooked his last little pull-up jump shot long off the back end of the rim. But overall throughout the game, I mean, like tough shot making. You have Shay get a decent look. and you know you have Andrew Nemhart hit a crazy 17 drivel step back three right in his face like there's a certain amount of variance that goes into that sort of thing and i thought she played a pretty damn good game under the circumstances with the game with the way that the game went

the pacers came out in a high drop coverage with turner i've talked about this before the high drop coverage with indiana with respect that she has nothing to do with taking away the pull-up jump shot off of the three-point line if he comes off the screen clean. It's all about trying to stop Shay from turning the corner with the runway. And Shea cooked that coverage right off the bat and was getting right around Turner and drawing fouls and getting all the way to the rim. That's why we saw so many Shea layups in the first part of the game. Then the Pacers adjusted and they went from that high drop to more of a low drop

where Turner was meeting him far back. And that was when Shea really started to get going with his mid-range shot making. And that was kind of how all of that initial work early in the game that he did to get his feel and to get his aggression really started to pay off. And like out like, Shea was awesome in this game. Lou Dort was awesome in this game. Lou Dort is it's so funny. He shot so poorly overall in this postseason run. But against the Pacers in the regular season, he killed them and he went right back to killing them tonight hit five threes.

And a lot of those like kind of semi tough contested threes that you need to knock down in the postseason. but outside of Shea and Lou Dort, they generally did a pretty good job. I think there are some things they need to clean up. We saw a lot of, we saw a lot of the attacking of Tyrese Halliburton and Obie Toppin and a little bit of Siakum too and in guard, guard screens out above the break. And Shea had some success, like quickly attacking those guys when they were hedging and splitting action and drawing fouls. And he did a lot of damage up there.

but for the most part, in the aggregate, they prevented the explosive Oklahoma City quarter. How did they prevent the explosive Oklahoma City quarter? By keeping them out of transition. Again, guys, this is a team that in this postseason run is averaging like 23, 20, something crazy in points off of turnovers and pulling it up real quick right now. They are carrying their offense for extended stretches in this postseason

literally by just forcing turnovers and getting out in transition. 23.8 is their postseason average in points off of turnovers, held them to just 11 tonight. Oklahoma City's offense is capable of being very good, but they don't have the depth of elite shot making off the ball and just overall offensive feel to be a super explosive slowdown offense. if you can keep them out of transition by preventing those easy transition points, by getting back, stopping the ball, getting to the rim, forcing them to knock down jump shots, you can keep them from having the explosive quarter.

And that's what Indiana did. Indiana had a 35 point quarter. Oklahoma City didn't have a 30 point quarter in this game. Let's get to some of the other little adjustments that I saw. Oklahoma City, they give up a lot of. open threes with their swarming defense and it is a tradeoff. Like, again, in the first half, they forced a bunch of turnovers and it generally paid off, right? Didn't get out in transition as much as they could have, but overall they had a good half.

In the second half, Indiana was able to successfully get the ball out and they knocked down shots. They could try to loosen that up a little bit. Essentially just being a little bit more picky. I liked when they dove at the basketball when some of the lesser ball handlers turned their head. If Siakum turns his head away from you, go for it. Fobie Topin turns his head away from you. Go for it. If Miles Turner turns his head away from you, go for it. But if he's looking at you or if it's anybody that can handle the ball pretty well,

be a little bit more hesitant to help because this is a Pacer's team that will get the ball out. Almost half of their shot attempts tonight were pretty clean. There were three point shots and they got a lot of pretty clean looks as part of that process. Oklahoma City also, I thought, did a decent amount of damage on the offensive glass in the first half. Indiana flipped that dynamic at the second half. You got started to see some of their size on the interior do some more damage. That's an area where Oklahoma City can do better. We saw them do better in the first half of this particular game.

Just looking through my notes really quick here, bear with me. It was a, uh, an absolute disaster of a planning night for the show with me putting together the show based on Oklahoma City controlling the, I think it was their first lead on the Tyrese Alliburton shot that he made. It's just an absolutely unbelievable game. Overall, Indiana did have success attacking smalls. You saw some of the specific differences like it,

when when they're doing that three quarter front, we saw Rick Carlisle talking about some of those like tight window bounce passes aren't there. It's almost better for them to push the post a little bit further out and then look to attack with a with an aggressive move like spinning off of that guy or something along those lines we also did see a good amount of that damage being done on the offensive glass it's an alternative you get a switch instead of trying to cram in some crazy entry pass put something up from the perimeter a decent you know swing the ball around run a quick

go screen do something to get you a decent perimeter jump shot look and if you shoot it high and soft enough you're going to give your big guy a pretty good chance to win that battle on the flip side. I think that's something that we saw in that second half. Unbelievable stuff. Again, I think Indiana could, I think Indiana could lighten up a little bit on some of their traditional coverages. We saw a lot of them giving up pretty easy stuff. Like the ball screen coverages with Turner weren't working against Shea and either

the high drop or the low drop. Thomas Bryant gave up an easy layup to Isaiah Hartenstein on a play where he was opening up his stance for Siakum to cut through because it should have been a switch. It wasn't. So then Hardenstein, we just went right to the basket for a layup. We saw Mark Dagonal after a timeout after Obie Topping hit a three to cut the lead to eight. They just had Shay set a back screen for Kaysan Wallace on Tyrese Halliburton. Pacers didn't want to switch it. Nemhard was hugged up to Shea. Easy layup for Kaysa on Wallace cutting along that backside. Even in that second half down the stretch, we saw

them get a lot of good looks out of those hedges, right? I thought they looked a little bit better when they were just super aggressive on those switches, those hedges, like actually like almost like a blitz just attacking them and forcing them to get rid of the basketball, at least in those late game situations where they're packing the paint. They were able to force some catch and shoot jumpers from some of their lesser shooters down the stretch by doing that. I just think they need to get away from passive traditional coverages. These big guys can't contain the ball well enough. Thomas Bryant can't. Miles Turner can't. They're giving up a little bit. bit too much dribble penetration there. I've liked it against Jalen Williams. We saw Miles Turner

against Jalen Williams and the drop coverage be able to get some stops at the rim and in the short range. But specifically with Shea, I would either be super aggressive or I would just switch and force him to ISO and then be aggressive in your help pinching down off of him. Because again, in those traditional coverages that were given up too many of those openings. blending Vice's signature dynamic storytelling with the high-octane world of sports, Vice Sports brings an exciting and diverse range of programming that goes beyond the game. From action-packed live events to gripping behind-the-scenes documentaries, to hard-hitting investigative pieces and in-depth profiles of athletes,

coaches, teams. Vice Sports captures the raw energy, drama, and passion that makes sports truly unforgettable. Catch live events and other exclusive sports programs only on Vice TV. Go to VicerB.com to find your cable channel. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers. And guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, name?

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So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what you should be. we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this.

We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, people could call in and say, Hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or, wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you

funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis, and I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris, every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on clay. Genshin win. I mean, she went down in three to Roebuckina, but I'm delighted.

Yeah, she's an outsider to win the French. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lena Rubakina is arguably the best player in the world right now. And I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports.

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just how long can their empire survive. The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I know that was all over the place, but it was that kind of game. I'm going to have Jackson come on here.

We're going to talk a little bit more about the game. And then we will get into some of the game. that all-star topic before we head over to playback. Let's do it. Let's do it. First, I think I'm going to throw at you. We got a super chat question from Cole. Are people undervaluing Rick Carlisle's coaching experience

compared to Mark DeGalds? So, I didn't, this is tricky. I think the credit that goes to Carlisle has more to do with foundational stuff. Like, I didn't think it was,

I didn't think Rick Carly went out there and just coached this like super magnificent X's and O's game that diced up the thunder. I didn't think that was what happened here. I think that I think that the credit goes to Rick Carlisle in the work that he's done like guys the the team's basketball character flows from the top down. It's what kind of guys what kind of dudes is your front office going after? So you just strictly going after talent or is he going after guys that fit the culture? of what you're trying to build, right? Obviously, there's a certain skill set you need as well,

but there's a certain, like, are you getting competitive ass kickers that like to play hard and that want to be the best basketball player that they could possibly be? Down to the head coach, down to the star of your team, down to the co-star of your team,

down to the types of dudes that you have in that locker room. But Rick Carlisle from day one of this season and dating back multiple years has just instilled in these guys. this level of intensity, this level of relentlessness, this attention to detail. You know how crazy it is? Off of 19 turnovers to only give up nine points in transition to the Oklahoma City Thunder. You know how sharp you have to be?

You know how dedicated you have to be? Watching that juxtapose was what we saw from the Knicks in Game 6 of the Eastern Conference finals. It was absolutely amazing. But like, I didn't think, again, as far as Dagnall goes, like, we did see a little bit of that like bogging down ISO offense at the top of the key, but I didn't think they got bad looks. They got some clean catch and shoot looks. Again, I thought Shay put, she shouldn't have passed the ball to Jdub on the second of last ISO. You're, you're asking a 23 year old to bail you out there. You're the dude. Go go go get a bucket. And then he overcooked a jumper that if you

makes it, they win. Right. So like, I don't want to overreact. Uh, I want to just give credit to Carlisle for the, the basketball character that he's instilled in this team. Yeah, I agree. And normally, I don't care about stuff like Sham Strontia reporting before the game. Here's how, here's my take on the game. But he did have a stand-up about team building and about how this might be assigned for teams considering both of the teams,

going after some of these ultra-competitive multiple college-year guys as opposed to just hunting for a star every time of the draft. And that type of thing really feels relevant when you're seeing guys like Andrew Nemhart be so successful in the playoffs. You're seeing guys like Lou Dord,

he wasn't even drafted. But guys who just had this super high motor, super highly competitive, are a lot more valuable for teams like this, especially for teams with championship aspirations than taking your dart throw at the hopeful star pick, you know? We talk about this all the time. Playing winning basketball sucks. It's hard, man. Like, it's hard in the normal context of, like, you guys going to play pickup.

Like, when we go play pickup, obviously if you want to win more pickup games, you've got to do all the shit that's hard, right? You got to run back in transition defense. You got to talk through screens. You got to put your body on the line for rebounds. You got to run the floor on offense. You got to do all those sorts of things. Now add the additional layer of advanced NBA schematics.

In all the different game playing stuff you got to remember and all the specific stuff within different coverages that they go to utilize. And it's just extremely difficult. It's extremely difficult. And so you need a certain type of personality, a certain type of guy in that locker room that's willing to put in the work. And it's a little bit harder to find than you'd think. Again, there's, I think that there's a competitive nature trait that is vastly underrated in the NBA. And it's just like, how much do your dudes hate to lose? Because if they really hate to lose,

then they will listen to their coach when their coach is presenting to them a plan with which to avoid that loss. And I just, I just think, man, I know you heard me at the top of the show. I just can't say enough about this Pacer's team and how special they are just to the game of basketball for the example that they represent. Yeah, they, I can't remember a team ever playing like this, ever. Like, it's amazing how relentless they are in both ends. They're like the seven second sons offensively,

but they're kind of dynamic defensively at this point. They, like, for when Pascal got healthy at that point in the regular season, they had the second best record in the NBA, and their defense has been quite good since then. It's hard to remember. I can't think of teams that were this sort of dynamic and speed-oriented offensively that were able to translate that to the defensive end also.

Their relentlessness in rotation, like even like concession shots like, oh, okay, see, bang, bang, broke you down, got a wide open three. They're still throwing a close-out. It's just like a token close-out. Like, let's not let this dude get super comfortable. Let's make him realize he's got to shoot it right now.

Like there's just, it's so crazy, man. And then like honestly, too, I want to hand it to Halliburton to like Halliburton was having one of those games to where he was getting a couple of looks here and there occasionally do that classic thing where he drags out the ball screen and then pump fakes and the dude just goes flying by. But like he wasn't exactly getting super high quality looks, but he just stayed invested and then made a couple plays late when he needed to. This team, man.

And there's the tough shot making voodoo is legitimately crazy because. It's crazy. It's like they are at the end of these games. Andrew Nemhard hit like legitimately a Kyrie Irving dribble combinations to that three. Bro. He was dribbling the air out of the basketball, three consecutive possessions. Yeah. And then he hits one of the most insane threes you could possibly hit at that moment.

Oh, my God. He's missed three before that rattles in. Oh, dude. Just a laser that rattles in. And Halliburton having the, to your point, having the confidence in the balls to take that last shot after not having a particularly effective scoring game. It's one thing to take that shot. If you're a score first player, even if you're having a bad game or if you're having a

great game, he's a past first player who was not having a good scoring game and said, no problem. Give me the fucking ball. And he got like, and he shot that with conviction too. Like he stopped and popped and he put all his legs into it and he shot it high and he shot it soft and it rattled in. It was unbelievable stuff. Before we go over to the All-Star stuff, you texted me about,

halfway through the third quarter. Okay. And I'm going to, I'm going to read your exact text. Okay. And then what I want you to do is just kind of explain if you still feel this way overall. Okay. Yes. You said, I feel like the Pacers are really in this series, surprisingly. This Dort shooting performance is giving me Celtics game one in 2022 vibes. Dort going off and the Pacers can't stop turning the ball over and they're still only down 10. I don't know. It feels like they're in it to me. So do you like, you straight up, the Pacers can win the series. I don't, well, I still really wasn't, kind of wasn't expecting them to win this game.

I was saying that more of like, oh, they're in the series. Not even they're going to win tonight. I was just like, oh, they're more, especially for game one. I kind of thought game one might be a blowout the other way. Or like in, OK, C, might win by a lot. And it looked like that for a little while. It was teetering. It was teetering on the edge of a potential blowout.

And I don't know. I think I am still discounting the devil magic of the Pacers. when I also texted you when Miles Turner missed that wide open three and Hallie missed a stepback three and either of those threes I think would have tied the game at that point or maybe cut it to one possession with like three four minutes left something like that

and I was like that was their moment it felt like their moment it was like dang they were making the comeback had two very good looks to really get over that sort of mental hurdle of tying the game and maybe even take the lead by one and they missed them both and I was like ah there it is on the game two here am I the dumb one I haven't been been I've also

have been discounting the Pacers this whole time. It's unbelievable how they keep doing this. I do feel like, I mean, obviously, they won game one on the road. They're in the series, absolutely. I would expect, you know, a 20-point Thunder win in game two. But how can we not say that they have a chance to win this season? How can we not?

How can we not? We can't. I'm going to put it like this simple. I think it was Zach Lowe that said like, like anybody who's picking anything other than Oklahoma City in five or six is expecting something really weird to happen. For the record, I agree with that.

So I'm not about here. I'm not here saying Zach is wrong. Here's what I'm thinking right this second, though. What do you mean? Something weird's going to happen. This entire postseason for the Pacers has been weird. Like, everything about it is weird. Like, it's a lot of-

Guess what? You got the weird thing in game one. You just did it. Weird thing done. Yeah, exactly. It's like, it's like, here you go. It just got weird.

It just got weird. It just got weird. Yeah. You're right. Like, I thought it was for me, it was the Turner 3. when Turner had that wide open pick and pop three that he missed.

And he had hit two in a row before that. But like he, earlier in the second half, but he missed that pick and pop three and long off the back of the rim and they didn't get the offensive rebound. And I was like, up, there it goes.

And they just, but they just kept going. They, the never stop thing is crazy. Highly underrated play in that sequence was the Pascal Seaccombe offensive rebound put back off of the right way. Unbelievable play. They did a lot of damage on the offensive glass along the baseline.

from their bigs down the stretch of this game. I did think that was fascinating. OKC really controlled things in that department early and then the dynamic flip. Any other thoughts on the game before we move over? No, I don't even know. It's so hard to process. No, I mean, it's just unbelievable.

I'm just so excited for this series now. I was excited for the series before, but now it feels like we're in for a real treat. I was a little worried about the excitement level across the board if there was an OKC blowout. And now it feels like we're all locked in. Yeah, the series, I thought the game was immediately, fun to watch and I wasn't worried about

guys like us or the people that watch this show particularly like enjoying enjoying watching the series but I was in I was concerned about whether or not it could be competitive enough to be interesting to the masses and the pacer's once again like that that's what I meant off the top like the job they've done

like straight up injecting casual joy and intensity and beauty into this playoff run is just crazy man but the pace was there right away hey it's us to Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news?

Huge news. We created our own podcast called Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember.

I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early, names of our band before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing,

a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, Hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some essence. Late Night Comedy Guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to Humor Me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis,

and I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris. Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on clay. Jenchian win. I mean, she went down in three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay.

Listen, Lerner Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world. right now and I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Jacob Kingston grew up in an isolated polygamous sect.

We were God's chosen kingdom on earth. He felt destined for greatness. So when a swag. Ackoning Armenian businessman catapults Jacob into an extraordinary world. He doesn't look back. Ferraris and Lamborghinis, private jets, meeting the president of Turkey. I'm Michelle McPhee, and this is one of the most shocking criminal conspiracies I've ever come across. When Jacob met Levant this plant to a billion dollar fraud.

But with two kings from entirely different worlds, just how long can their empire survive? The largest tax investigation in American history. You need to tell me what you know. Is somebody coming after me? Jacob told Levan, you're ruining my life. Listen to Kingdom of Fraud on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We're going to head over to play back in about 10 minutes. I wanted to really quickly, Jackson and I were going to have a quick little debate about this team USA versus team world, Adam Silver.

audible here. So Adam Silver says that they're going to structure the All-Star game as USA versus the world next year. This has been the latest in a long line of attempts from Adam Silver to try to make these guys compete. It's literally all he's trying to do, give them a reason to compete. And they've been unsuccessful to this point. I'm skeptical as to whether or not this will work. I am intrigued by the matchup, though. So, obviously it gets tricky.

There's some realities to how this could even work. But I want to start by just looking at the starting fives and just putting it together from there and kind of working around. So we can all, I would argue that the world's top five is really obvious. And that is just Luca, Yokic, Shagel, just Alexander, Janus, and. whim. I agree. Wholeheartedly. I don't think there's anybody else who has a case to get into that group. Who is the USA Five? I got to assume they run back some version of the Olympic Five, which is Steph, Booker, LeBron, KD, and either Bam or Anthony Davis, whoever is healthiest, I would assume. But that's got to be the first four, even like, I don't have no, I do not care a single second about how old LeBron James is. Like, you have to run that. group out, right? I, the tricky thing there is I wonder if there's some of those guys are going to get bumped because of just regular season performance. Like is Anthony Edwards going to end up

cramming his way into that into that list, something like that. At least they have some practice playing without Jason Tatum. And, and is maybe the answer ever Devin Booker anyways, but. Yeah. I, this is where it gets tricky. The entire premise doesn't make a ton of sense because in terms of debating these two teams competing because the entire idea is that these guys aren't competing. But like there is an undeniable like the Americans can run the floor a little bit better. I would argue that. It gets a little tricky when they get stuck in the half court. Obviously, Luca, Nicola Yokic, Shake Yildjus Alexander.

That's the three most surgical offensive players in the NBA at this point. I will say this, though. I think splitting it up in putting Steph, LeBron, and KD on the same team, do you think there's any chance that that brings the competitiveness, or do you think those old dudes are like, this isn't worth it? It's a great question. I think bringing the fact that if the Olympics wasn't last summer, if the Olympics wasn't so recent, I would say,

and at this point it will be one year later, so maybe it won't feel that recent at the time. But I do feel like that had such an energy to it, the Olympics, that I'm hoping that carries over since you have that same core U.S. group. And I also think it's good to have specifically Yonis against playing against that team. It's not like Team USA versus France,

Team USA versus World team that has Yonis. That is the most try hard player in the NBA, try hard star at least in the NBA. And so I'm hoping he and Wembe, who seems to be taking things like, not personally, personally. But like, he seems to be taking it a little seriously. I'm hoping that those two can set a little bit of a tone

for the world team because you get those two in transition. I mean, I mean, that's as good of an all-star pairing as you could possibly come up with honestly. And if those dudes just run

and Luca and Yokic just throw kick-ahead passes that could go a long way. You're telling me Luca throwing three-quarter lobs to Wemby and Yannis all game. Like, come on. But we all agree that like,

if those dudes really knuckle down, they're just going to beat the USA, right? Like, we agree on that. What's the case? I don't know. I don't know. The case is, is the old man Avengers just won the gold and they and when Steph is rolling, you know,

who's stopping Steph in an all-star format. There's the other, another wrinkle to this that I just thought of, by the way, is there is a chance that Janice and Wembe are on the same team next year. And if they are both starting the all-star game next to each other, going against the world team, then you're going to get, I think that would even ramp up the intensity a little bit more from from their perspective. But if the world's also going to play harder to your point, I, I, I, think that's where it gets pretty tough. I think we're talking about Steph will be,

will Steph be 38 yet? I think he will be. LeBron will literally be 41. AD will be 32 or 33, I think at that point. And KD, I think will be 38, if I remember correctly. It's a pretty old group. It's an old group. You obviously start to dip into the benches and it gets tricky too. But you mentioned this to me in the text, but like I do, there are some realities to like, how could you even logistically pull this off

in terms of putting together. The format's strange. The format's a little strange. Because we talk about the European and the overseas, not just Europe, overseas stars winning all the MVPs recently and it feels like they're taking over the league

as some of the time to the conversation. But it's very top heavy. Oh yeah. It's very top heavy. And so I'm wondering past guys seven, eight or nine, like I saw some great. graphics people are making up putting Bogdanovich out there. And like that's fine.

Cool, good for Bogdanovich. But right, are we going to give that guy an All-Star nod? Are we getting 15 guys from each team? Are we just hoping that we get a magic 8 and 8? Like, logistically, and because of the, the not in the moment importance, but the historical importance of All-Star appearances and in terms of resume building and that kind of stuff, you can't just be gifting people,

All-Star games. You can't. To your point, you'd have to literally. structure it in a way to where you gave All-Star selections but didn't let dudes play. Like you'd have to have a team. You'd have to have a team USA roster that is like 17 players long. Right.

And then have like to your, you'd have to have like Bogdanovich come in and basically be a filler. I mean, when we start to go down the list, it's like we get to a lot of Americans before we get to other foreign players like Tyrese and I'm just going down the points per game list.

Tyrese Cade Cunningham, Jalen Brunson, Palo Boncaro, Devin, Devin Booker, as we established, would probably have to come off the bench. Lamello Ball, Damian Lillard, Anthony Davis, Kyrie Irving, Zion Williamson, Steph Curry, Carl Anthony Towns, LeBron James, Trey Young, Franz Wagner is the first foreign name to show up on that list. And like, you'll get, Jamal Murray will finally get his all-star appearance. That's cool, I guess.

Good for Jamal Murray. I'll get Jamal Murray up in there. I don't know. Like, after the top five of the world, it is a very strong top five. And they, it's, but it's very topic. After Franz, Cam Thomas, American, Donovan Mitchell, American, Tyler Harrow, American, Joe L. Embedd, adopted American, Deerun, Fox American, Zach Levine, American, John Moran, American, James Hardin, American, Brandon Ingram, American, DeMarter Rosen, American, Jalen Brown, American,

Jared Jackson, American, Norman Powell, American, like, I'm, Jamal Murray is the next guy. Jamal Murray is the next guy. At, he's 39th. And so this kind of goes to KD's, because KD was ranted about this a lot on social media, this idea that he, he like, he thinks some of the talk with the world catching up is overblown. And there's a case for both sides. Like, I could argue both. Like, if I was arguing that the world's ahead, I could be like we have, you know, the world has three of the top three players in the world right now, you know,

four of the top four. Like it's probably Yokit Shay, Janus and Luca are your top are your top four in all likelihood, right? But if I was arguing KD's point of view, I'd be like, it's just random because after you get past those top four guys, it's dominated by American players. at that point. And obviously points per game isn't the perfect indicator there because there are guys like Subonis who you're probably not putting you know all the way down in 40 or something like that.

But like there are other like do everything types of guys that are going to be higher on that list. But there is a reality to like once you get off of that top tier of superstars, it's a pretty steep drop off from there. So like I, I feel like Adam Silver he didn't seem to have much of a plan for how this is going to work yet. He doesn't seem that much of a plan. I admire the. I admire the. I admire. the intention in the intention of trying to get guys to compete. My thing is like if you're not going to give them something to compete for, meaning like if you're not going to throw a bunch of money on the table,

then really your only chances, the character of the players. Like you need more, Giannis is more Wembees, more guys that come in are like, I'm playing hard tonight. And if you get enough of those guys, it'll work.

It's just like any pickup run. If you go play pickup and you get seven or eight pretty high level players to play super hard, like you can mix in some riffraff and it's going to, to work. But like once you dip below the like mandatory minimum of like understanding of high level basketball like it's going to fall off of a cliff. And like similarly with effort and energy and competitiveness, like if you get like five or six dudes on the floor who are like really going for it, you'll have the other three or four or four or five. They're going to look at each other.

And they're going to be like, we're going to be embarrassed and look stupid if we don't also start playing hard. And so it's on the players. We need competitors. We talked about competitiveness at the top. You need competitors to come in and actually raise that level. Yeah. Last thing before we go. I do think that there is a chance that it works if it happens.

And I think if this actually does happen, they really need just a stroke of good luck like they got with the first year of the ELA bending. It was the first year after COVID. And the first year. And it was unbelievable in the fourth quarter of that game. And the fact that in the next couple years, it wasn't because it wasn't. wasn't even close in the fourth quarter. Getting to the fourth quarter, right? And so if by whatever stroke of luck,

you get a close game heading into whatever the fourth quarter of this new format will be, then you have it, I think if it's get down eight minutes left or a target score, these guys will turn on the country pride thing from the Olympics a little bit. But if it's not close at that point, then it's going to flop heavy. So in all, like if there's one thing I agree with the Adam Silver approach over the last few years,

he's gotten really janky with everything, but it doesn't make sense to play 48 minutes if the guys aren't going to play hard. Like for sure. But my thing is like if this doesn't work and it's more or less the same dynamic that we've seen in other years, I think you just go back to 48 minutes, you go back to East West, you go back to your normal rosters and you just leave it up to the players to compete. And, you know, I saw, we saw Kevin Durant quote tweet the thing with Stephen A. Smith when he was like saying like it's going to be like basically like saying it's going to be something that these

players will be remembered for as like the players who killed the All-Star game. Katie's like, this is dramatic. I agree with Katie in that regard. Like, you know what I think about when I think about the NBA? I think about what we've seen in this playoff run. I think about the dozens and dozens and dozens of incredible regular season moments that we get every year, crazy games, crazy star performances, game winners, showdowns between rivalries. Like, that's the stuff that I think about. Like, even when the All-Star game was better, it was pretty far down the list of things that I cared about. And so, like, the idea that, like, this is the legacy of this generation, I think,

is foolishness. I think Adam Silver owes it to the league to try a few more ways. But if he, if he backed out and he was just like, look, the All-Star Games, the All-Star game, I'm leaving it as is I would respect that too. All right, guys, that's all we have for YouTube tonight. We are headed over to playback. The first thing we do when we get over there is we're rewatching that fourth quarter. So we're going to get over there.

We're going to watch some film. We'll take some callers. We'll take some questions. Again, at playback.tv slash hoops tonight. For the YouTube audience, I will be back tomorrow morning with a film breakdown. I'm also going to be doing something else on Saturday, but keep an eye on my Twitter feed for that.

But tomorrow morning, a film breakdown, and then obviously we will be back live after game two on Sunday. I will see you guys then. What's up, guys? As always, I appreciate you for listening to and supporting hoops tonight. It would actually be really helpful for us if you guys would take a second and leave a rating and a review. As always, I appreciate you guys supporting us,

but if you could take a minute to do that, I'd really appreciate it. The volume. Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick.

And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions.

Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. but, you know, tired and sick, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel. Help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas.

And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was harmed. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis keep coming to you.

like, you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Deanna Maria Riva, and on my new podcast, How Hard Can It Be? I call on my Gen X squad from Ohio to Hollywood as we navigate Midlife's most fantastic BS. Unfiltered conversations from night sweats to futas to scheduling sex. Wait, what sex? Is it just me? Or does every woman my age want to live? look at Pinterest instead of having sex sometimes. They say we can't polish a turd, but we're sure going to try.

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