The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hoops Tonight - NBA Free Agency Reaction: Thunder ELITE contenders, Chris Paul-Spurs, Pelicans trade

Episode Date: July 3, 2024

Jason Timpf reacts to several big moves from around the NBA including Isaiah Hartenstein joining Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, Chet Holmgren, and the Oklahoma City Thunder. Why does Jason believe the addition of Hartenstein and Alex Caruso has moved OKC into his elite championship contenders tier? Later, Jason reacts to Chris Paul joining Victor Wembanyama and the San Antonio Spurs as well as the New Orleans Pelicans trading with the Atlanta Hawks for Dejounte Murray to pair with Zion Williamson. 4:00 - Introduction 7:30 - Hartenstein to Thunder 25:30 - How Hartenstein fits with OKC 50:00 - Chris Paul to Spurs 55:00 - Dejounte Murray to Pelicans (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.)   #Volume #HerdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Yep, that's me, Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

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All right, welcome to Hoops Tonight here at the Volume. Happy Tuesday, everybody. Hope all of you guys are having a great start to your week. Well, we're getting part two of our free agency reaction today. We have three major moves. that I want to hit in today's show. Isaiah Hartinstein to the Oklahoma City Thunder. We're going to be spending the majority of the time on that one.

I think it's a super interesting move that fundamentally changes both the physical profile and the ceiling of the Oklahoma City Thunder. So we're going to talk about that in extensive detail. After that, we're going to get to Chris Paul headed to the San Antonio Spurs. And then after that, a trade that happened a few days ago, Dejante Murray to the New Orleans Pelicans. We're going to get into all those details. We are taking for July 4th. We're trying to get some time off for me and for our staff over the weekend.

So I tweeted out a question asking for mailbag questions. I'm recording that today. That will be airing over the course of the next few days. But unless something major happens, like if we get a major trade, I'm going to get a video out. But unless something major happens, we're going to be taking through Sunday off to enjoy the holiday. But we're hitting the three other big free agency and trade moves today.

We'll have a mailbag coming out tomorrow with some breakouts over the rest of the week. and then we'll be back with our normal schedule starting on Monday. You guys know the drill before we get started. Subscribe to the Hoops Tonight YouTube channel so you don't miss any more of our videos. Follow me on Twitter at underscore Jason LT so you guys don't miss show announcements. Don't forget about our podcast feed wherever you get your podcast under Hoops tonight. And then keep dropping mailbag questions in those YouTube comments so we can keep hitting them throughout the rest of the summer. And then last but not least, it's baseball season.

We are in the swing of it. And there's nothing like getting out to a major league baseball ballpark, having a day out with some friends and family, having some good food, having some beer. whatever it is you like to enjoy at the baseball game. This was something we used to do as a family when I was growing up. We would all load up and we'd drive up to Phoenix and we'd go see Arizona Diamondbacks game. And thankfully, they had a cover over Chase Field that you could air condition that place. Because obviously this play, we're in the mix of it right now here in Tucson.

It's like 100 every single day for the foreseeable future. But I just remember that as a kid. That was just something that was always so important to me. I love baseball season. The D-backs making their World Series run last year, of reinvigorated my love for the game. But you guys got to get out this summer to see a major league baseball game. And this is where game time comes into the picture.

They're an amazing ticket buying experience. I had a great experience with them earlier this year as we went to go. My wife and I went to go see the University of Arizona and the Kale Center play, their men's basketball team play. It was a last minute kind of thing, got a great deal, knew exactly what I was getting myself into. They've got some features that I think makes their process preferable, in my opinion. They have all in pricing.

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So take the guesswork out of buying Major League Baseball tickets with GameTime. Download the GameTime app. Create an account and redeem code hoops for $2. $20 off your first purchase terms apply. Again, create an account and redeem code hoops. That's H-O-O-P-S for $20 off. Download game time today. Last-minute tickets, lowest price guaranteed. All right. Let's talk some basketball. So as I talked about over the, those of you guys who follow me on Twitter, have seen me tweet about it a few times. And, and I've talked about it on the show once or twice before this. But like one of the guys that I viewed as like a really interesting option

for Oklahoma City going into this free agency was Isaiah Hartnstein. I was worried about whether or not they'd be able to make a move on him, just simply because I know Hartnstein enjoyed his time playing for the New York Knicks. And I would imagine that there was a certain amount of money that if the gap wasn't as big, he probably would have stayed. But it's just the Thunder were able to offer him just a whole lot of money, close to $30 million annually for the next three seasons. And, you know, I want to start, we're going to talk about the contract details because

there's a flexibility element to this because I'm pretty sure the final year of this deal is unguaranteed, which will line up with the Jalen Williams potential rookie extension as well as the Chet Holmgren rookie extension. So there's a flexibility element to this, but I want to focus on the basketball first, and then we'll get into some of those details. So first of all, the Thunder had two major weaknesses in the last season. And those of you guys who have been following the show will have heard me talk about this ad nauseum throughout the year, but interior physicality, they were one of only four teams in the NBA that gave up an offensive rebound on more than 30% of their opponent's misses. They allowed 7.7 points per game on putbacks. That was the second most in the

NBA. They allowed 8.8 points per game on post-ups, including passes, which was the second most in the NBA. This was a front line that you could bully. That was a the first weakness. The second biggest weakness was experience, right? And this year was a huge step forward for them. They got two rounds worth of playoff experience for all the guys in-house. They lost in heartbreaking fashion, which I think is actually beneficial to the development of a basketball player. Like, you were up by one off of that Ched Home Grindunk in game six on the road with an opportunity to go home to win game seven and make it to the conference finals. And Shee Gildreder's Alexander fouls PJ Washington in the left corner, which leads to the

series being over, right? That's a heart-wrenching way to lose, right? And I always talk about, like, there's a difference between loving basketball and hating losing. And the greats are usually both. They're genuine fans of the game. Like, they just love playing. They love working on their game. They love tinkering with their craft, all that kind of stuff. But then they also have this, like, psycho-competitiveness, like fear of losing or hatred of losing. And like, to me, there's a scar tissue that builds up when you take those losses that actually motivates you in those situations. You find yourself in a big game, in a big pivotal playoff moment, and you think back to what happened when you blew it last time. It leads to another level of focus and intensity because

you're terrified that it will happen to you again. That kind of, that's why there's like a process to these teams getting to where they want to go. That's why almost every all time great team that you see has a really ugly loss early on in the process, right? Like that's just kind of like inherent in the process. The Nuggets made it to the conference finals and lost to the Los Angeles Lakers, right? But then they conquered them on their way to the title last year. The Golden State Warriors in 2016 lost after winning 73 games. Even going before the 2015 title, the loss they suffered against the Clippers in 2014,

the loss that they suffered against the Spurs in 2013. the Miami Heat losing to the Sturrs or to the to the to the Dallas Mavericks in 2011 that was scar tissue that led to them bringing that level in the future like you there are almost always heartbreaking losses early on in the process I've missed a big one there 2008 Lakers painful loss before they win two championships in a row look at all of the painful losses for Dirk Novitsky before he won in 2011 it's just kind of like part of that growth it's part of that process. And so everybody in that locker room gets two more rounds worth of experience. You added Alex Caruso, a veteran of six playoff series. He's played in 31 playoff games. He started for the 2020 Lakers in game six of the 2020 NBA finals. Literally is one of the most dependable type of playoff role players that you could have. I think that is a huge influx of experience.

Hartnstein himself has played a major role in four playoff series in general, as this team goes into next season, they are older, they are wiser and more experienced, right? That's not something you can like really address through the roster as much as just through just through getting through those wars.

Because even with Caruso and Hartinstein, the main guys who need that experience are Shagielderous Alexander and Jalen Williams who both got a big dose of it last year. Now, from the interior physicality standpoint, there were two routes that they could go. They could get a big center to put Chet at the four, or they could get a big and athletic power forward to kind of anchor

chet at the five. And each one of those routes had pros and cons. Like going with the center, going the Hartinstein route, the pros are you get a bigger look, which will help against large front lines, right, like against Denver or Minnesota teams that play really big front court players. You have a bigger look there, right? It alleviates some of the regular season wear and tear on Chet Holmgren from having to guard centers and deal with just bigger bodies underneath the basket, it's cheaper. Like, it's just easier to get a center than a power forward. As I talked about in our five biggest takeaways video after the finals, I think the big

athletic forward is the most valuable archetype in the league right now. That, you know, Jason Tatum type, that Aaron Gordon type, that LeBron James even, part of the reason why in his old age he's been as successful as he is, is he just plays an incredibly important position in the NBA. It's why I'm excited about a guy like Jonathan Camingo for the Golden State. Warriors. It's why a guy like I think Jeremy Grant could help a team next year in a big way. It's why Lori Markinen, I think, brings a certain amount of trade value around the league. There's just that specific position is just becoming a very valuable position.

A guy who's big and strong enough to kind of sort of hang with centers, but has the perimeter skill to function in a five-out offense. That is the key to that kind of big power forward position. And so as a result, it's just really expensive. If the Thunder wanted to go out and get if they wanted to go out and get Lori Marketing in, talk about what, at least five or six picks, right, to get that deal done? Like, that's just, it would have been incredibly expensive. They would have had to turn around and extend Lori Markinen, probably somewhere in the neighborhood of like four years and $160 million, right? Which fundamentally does change the cap situation moving forward. As a basketball fan, I'd be lying to you guys about it and say that I wanted to see what that looks like, of course, just to see Lori Markinen in that group. But it was an expensive option to go that way. The center position, they were able to just go out and sign a center to a short-term deal and overpay a little bit.

Because who cares, they can afford it on the cap in the short term. That was just an easier option for them to pull off while maintaining their long-term flexibility. The cons, Chet has to be able to function as a high-level perimeter player now. I don't want to get into this yet. I want to save this for a little bit later in the show. But this is my one concern with going with the, Isaiah Hartinstein type of look. Chet, when he's on the floor with Isaiah

Hartnstein, which won't be all the time, but when those two guys are sharing the floor together, Chet now has to function as a ball handling wing, essentially. And we'll get into some of the more of those details. We're going to be using the play software today to demonstrate some things for the thunder on both ends

of the floor with Chet and Isaiah Hartnstein. So we'll get more into that, but that's one of the cons of going with the center. It puts a lot of pressure on Chet's perimeter skill. If you power forward, the pros are spacing is always a little bit easier when you have five three point shooters on the floor. Just is, look at the Boston Celtics, right? It puts less pressure on Chet's perimeter skills. He would continue to be guarded by centers who are primarily going to be operating

in drop coverage. He's going to have pick and pop looks. He's going to be able to space above the break while his man sinks into the lane. It's just less pressure on Chet's ball handling and playmaking ability, right? It provides more matchup versatility for when they run into teams that really test their ability to contain the ball, right? Like if they ran into a, in the West, a team like the New Orleans Pelicans now that they have Dejante Marie and Zion Williamson or like Sacramento is a team like this, teams like Boston and Indiana out of the Eastern Conference, teams that have a lot of dribble drive speed, having that smaller look with Chet at the five and another athletic forward next to him just

just is a little more resilient defensively in those types of situations. But quick caveat, it's worth mentioning that most of the top teams in the West don't bring that type of dribble penetration, right? Like, Jamal Murray is not a dribble drive type of guard. I know the Nuggets want Russell Westbrook, which is something I saw yesterday, which it's kind of funny to me that LeBron and Nicola Yokic could end up making that same mistake.

But the teams in the top of the West are either like Denver where they don't have great dribble penetration, Dallas, who doesn't have great dribble penetration, or teams that have great dribble penetration, but have lots of non-shooters for you to sink into the lane on, or at least guys that you're willing to live with shooting. Like Minnesota and Memphis, John Morant and Anthony Edwards, they're incredible dribble drive guys. But that's kind of the head of the stake.

And you can really pack the paint on them. They're not teams that have like bunches of guys that are going to be slashing and challenging your perimeter defense. So like there's no doubt that having a forward next to Chet gives you a little bit more defensive versatility against dribble drive teams. But they may not even have to deal with that until they get to the finals anyway just by virtue of the way the Western Conference is laid out. cons of going the route of the forward. Like we talked about earlier, getting a forward is super, super expensive. And I don't need to go in any more details there.

It's just it's the most valuable archetype in the league. It's really hard to get, like we talked about earlier. So the way I look at it, by going the center route, rather than going the power forward route, it was a low-risk way for Oklahoma City to beef up their front line while also maintaining some flexibility for the future. Now, again, as I mentioned, the initial reporting is that I believe, that final year is, I believe that final year is non-guaranteed. So again, like, they can line up

the cap sheet to where if they need to clear heart and sign off the books when they're signing J-dub and Chet, they should be able to do so. So that's where that flexibility piece comes from. Whereas if they got a marketing in and they had to extend him four years, now, now there's just some overlap there that could put them into some issues with the second apron. So let's talk about the basketball fit, though. So it's not just that they picked a center. They picked Isaac Hartenstein. So where does Isaiah Hartenstein specifically fit within this team on both ends of the floor? So the initial reporting I've seen is that Oklahoma City does not intend to

start Isaiah Hartinstein. They intend for him to come off the bench. But obviously he's going to play 25 to 30 minutes a night and we'll have a lot of crossover with Chet Holmgren inevitably. They will play together quite a bit. So really it's about having multiple looks. They'll have a small look, right? Well, they'll have Shea on the floor with J. Dubb, Alex Crusoe, Lou Dort, Chet Holmgren. There's a lot of perimeter speed there. Five guys who can all defend multiple positions

and can space the teams out on the other end of the floor. That's their small look. Now, without a real forward, it's a really small look, but that is a look that they will have, and it will work in most matchups. It's really just some of the bigger teams that will give them issues there.

But then they'll also have a big look where Chet and Isaiah Hartnstein will share the floor together. Preparing for your upcoming fantasy football draft, do you wish that you could wave a magic, and somehow know who exactly your league mates are going to take? Well, with Draft Intel from Fantasy Pros, you'll know exactly how your league mates draft better than they do.

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slash volume today to get an edge over your league mates right now and forever. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all,

embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying.

Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to me. my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down. a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford

and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of tontons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs?

Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jay. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s.

To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack all day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really?

Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What I want to start with, and I'm going to go over it as a quick monologue for our podcast audience, and then we'll go over to the clipboard. But defensively, what I really like about having Hartenstein and Chet together is it gives you the ability to put Chet in a position where he's the low man, rather than the guy who's defending ball screens.

When you have real length on the back line, that buys you flexibility for the ball screen defender to come higher up into actions more aggressive on the ball. Because the low man has to be in two places at once. The low man, the guy that's on the back line when your screen defender is running up to defend the ball screen. And again, I'm going to show a visual example of this in a minute. He is responsible for the role man coming down the lane.

and for the man in the corner, right? And so there's a certain, like, stunting and recovering element. There's a lot of, like, really hard closeouts. There's a lot of ground coverage, both vertically under the rim and in terms of covering ground out to the corner that comes from that position. And, like, going from a Josh Giddy in that type of role or an undersized, you know, a guy who's not as big like a Jalen Williams or a Shake Gildos or Alexander, Those guys did decently enough.

It's not like they're not capable of being the low man, but they just don't bring enough height or athleticism to that position. And what that does is that puts a lot of pressure on Chet when he's defending those ball screens to make sure that he doesn't let the roll man get behind him. Because if he does, that puts a lot of pressure on the backline of Oklahoma City's defense. When you have Chet on the back line in Isaiah Hartnstein defending the ball screen, you can have Isaiah Hartnstein be aggressive out at the level attacking the ball hand. because Chet brings so much ground coverage and verticality to that low man position.

So let's go over to the play software and we're going to take a look in more detail at what I was talking about here. So I have a setup here in a typical kind of like ball screen setup, right? So this number three, the small forward is spacing out above the break on this side. This guy's going to be in position where he can dig down at the nail potentially or stay home. He's going to be somewhere in this range, right? We have the strong side corner shooter.

this guy might be a little bit up the lane line, but this guy is under pretty explicit instructions to not overhelp in this, in this particular situation out of the strong side corner. We have the ball screen coming and we have our ball handler, right? So in this case, let's imagine that this is Chet and this is Josh Giddy. As the ball screen comes, in the event that they're icing, what the main point of attack defender will do is play this high side and force this ball handler to work downhill this way, right?

But what I want to look at, I want to start with the ice and then we'll look with our regular coverage after that. At that point, Chet's responsibility is to basically be in, to cover both of these guys. As this ball handler is funneling back this way and this guy's pressuring from behind, this guy's rolling into this space, right? As he's rolling into this space, if this is Josh giddy, he is going to have a hard time bothering a lob pass here and a skip pass to the corner. That's a lot of ground to cover for Josh Giddy. And so as a result, he's not going to come up this high. And now Chet has to drop a little bit further back to keep this role man behind in front of him. He can't let the role man behind him because if he does, that's going to put a lot of

pressure on this low man here, right? This guy's going to keep working downhill. This guy's going to keep pressuring over the top. Chet's kind of working and playing that middle ground, right? but now imagine a situation where it's Isaiah Hardenstein and Chet Holmgren is now the foreman. In this case, if this guy is icing the ball screen and trying to force him back towards the sideline, he can come really high and aggressive because if this five man gets behind him into the zone, Chet can stand right here and provide a good vertical deterrent to any sort of pass over the top. And if this guy, the ball handler, throws a skip pass. and it gets over here to the foreman,

Chet has the length in athleticism to cover that ground and recover. And while he's closing out while that ball's in the air, Hartnstein can recover back into the lane. And so again, by virtue of having a real height, length, speed advantage at this four-man position, you can trust him to actually be two places at once over here. By being aggressive on the ball handler, you can get the ball out of this guy's,

hands, right? Whereas if this is Josh Giddy and Chet has to be a little bit more cognizant of the role man, now this guy has some space to operate in this part of the floor where he can get to floaters, mid-range games, maybe try to bait Chet up and then hit this guy, maybe Josh Giddy's out of position, or maybe he's just not tall enough to bother the role man. Again, this was this was an area where they struggled last year. So by virtue of having Isaiah Hartinstein to add to that look, you give yourself an aggressive pick and roll coverage because Chet can function as the low man in their defense. In general, in general, like we've seen this type of setup work in a bunch of different cases, right? Like this is what the Nuggets did. They put Nicole Yokic aggressive up in a

high drop because they trusted Aaron Gordon to be able to be two places at once in the backline. The Milwaukee Bucks for years did that with Brooke Lopez. Bring Lopez. into a higher drop coverage, we trust Janice to be able to be both places at once. Or even when Brooke Lopez would deeper drop against specific matchups, Janus was just able to help off of that weak side corner and provide another layer of rim deterrent, excuse me, while also being able to recover out to that corner. So again, having Chet at the four just gives you an entirely different type of athlete at the low man position than what you had beforehand.

on the offensive end of the floor. Isaiah Hartenstein becomes now, instead of Chet, basically your main screening fulcrum in five out. And this is something that Isaiah Hartinstein excels at, quickly flowing from side to side in ball screens. This is one of the things I talked about with Daron Sharp from the Denver Nuggets. So the Denver Nuggets just drafted. Like that quick ball reversal is so important from the big man in five out

in terms of getting the ball from side to side. the threat of the backdoor cut. There's a lot of like dribbling into dribble handoffs, right? Like Isaiah Hardinstein will dribble at the guy who's coming at him or at the two guys who are running action that are about to flow into him. From there, he's supposed to, if there's a slip cut out of it to hit that, if the guy like goes to set a screen and then his man stays on the high side, he could slip through.

Hartenstein's job is to hit that cut. If the guy who's the primary, the guy who's supposed to be coming off the dribble handoff, if he's being top locked, like if his defender is just, literally denying him the use of the dribble handoff, and he has to back cut. Isaiah Hartenstein has to make that read. If he dribbles that way and nobody's open, it's his job to quickly interpret that in reverse,

like kind of do a little half spin move, switch ball handling hands, go the other way and kind of signal to the two guys on the opposite end of the floor, hey, I'm coming your way now. There's a lot of decision-making and playmaking responsibility on the five-man in ball screens or in five-out offense,

And that is legitimately something that Isaiah Hartnstein excels at. As a matter of fact, he averaged 4.3 assists per 36 minutes in this last playoff run. Operating is that type of fulcrum for the Knicks. And that was the Knicks team that didn't have a ton of ball and player movement by virtue of the injuries that took place to them and them leaning so much on Jalen Brunson. So let's go back over to the play software. And we're going to, I want to demonstrate this concept for you guys. So we're going to set up in like a typical five-out type of setup.

We'll get all of our defenders matched up here. Now, most of this stuff will run and flow out of like a transition push. So like imagine the three-man dribbled the ball up the floor in transition and the five-man's trailing. He's going to kick the ball back to the five-man. Now Hartnstein has the ball. Okay. Hartnstein has the ball.

Let's imagine this is Chey Gildes-Alexander and let's imagine this is J-dub, right? So let's just imagine like a basic five-out motion concept like Chicago. And all Chicago is, is Hardinstein has the ball. Shea is going to run down and set a pin down, just a screen for J-dub. And J-Dubb is going to come off of that screen into a dribble handoff with Isaiah Hartenstein. That is a basic Chicago action that you will see a lot of times in like semi-transition after a quick push in five-out offense.

This is five-out kind of flow, right? So where are the decisions that Hartinstein has to make? as Hartnstein has the ball and is dribbling this way, as Shea is setting the screen, these guys are probably going to try to switch this screen. So let's say this guy stays on the high side, but let's say the guy who's guarding J-dub just lingers on J-dub. As he's coming off,

let's say he just lingers on J-dub for a split second before this switch occurs, and Shay slips it. As She slips that screen, it's Isaiah Hartenstein's responsibility to hit that bounce point. pass. He's got to be the guy that makes that read, right? Let's say that as Shea, let's say that as Shay is going running down, this guy's top locking him and so J. Dub back cuts through. And as he back cuts through, this guy clears. And then let's say Shay then decides, okay, now I need to run the dribble handoff. So now Shea comes up after J. Dub

cuts through to come off on the dribble handoff. Let's say that his defender is top locking him. if he's top-blocking him and refusing the use of it, he's got a back cut. Isaiah Hartstein is the guy that has to make that read. He's the guy that has to hit that bounce pass on time and on target. Let's say, as I mentioned earlier, if the entire play falls apart. So for whatever reason, these guys just do a really good job switching. And as Shay goes to set the screen, this guy stays on the inside position to take away the cut. He quickly switches on to Shea.

As this guy tries to come off, he top-locks him, the entire play. plays butchered. Isaiah Hardinstein is the guy has to go, oh shit, this is falling apart. Let me dribble this way. He'll point at whoever the three man is. Let's say it's Alex Caruso or Lou Dord, and he's going to be like, go set a pin down for Chet. Then Chet, he's going to pin down for Chet, and then Chet's going to come up. That's a decision that Isaiah Hartenstein has to be able to make. And then the last one that will hit is just the big man ignoring him. So in the event, that that this guy, the defender guarding Isaiah,

is just sagging way back in the paint. And we have our matchups pretty normal over here. And this guy's coming down to set this pin down. Isaiah Hardinstein might need to just attack this man. And that was something you saw a bunch in the playoffs. If you guys remember, he did it to Joel Embedde, too. We're like, Embedde would just be playing center field and just ignore Hartenstein and sag back into this painted area.

and Hartnstein would just drive at him hard with his left hand and get all the way to the rim. Those are all the types of reads that your big man needs to make in a five-out offense. And there's a whole other layer to it when he's already set the screen and now he's rolling into space. We've talked about like him needing to score in the short role, like literally made 60% of his floaters in the regular season last year, made 66% of his floaters in the playoffs last year. So like he can score on the role as well. like Isaiah Hartnstein, I think in a lot of ways, represents kind of the quintessential, the quintessential modern five-out offensive big.

He can set good screens. He can make all the reads. He can make the back door passes. He quickly flows from side to side. He can score when he's on the roll. He can score when the center is ignoring him. He's not going to put up massive box score numbers, but he's just a really functional cog in that type of five-out system.

And again, like, I don't even worry about him on the, the offensive end of the floor with this unit. The only guy that I get concerned about in terms of how the offense will function when Hartenstein's on the floor is Chet Homegren. And this is something I mentioned earlier, but I want to get a little bit deeper into it now. Going from being guarded by centers who are slower-footed, usually dropping in traditional coverages on ball screens, which allows him to pop free and clear to the top of the key, when Chet's spaces above the break, his man, the center typically sags way back into the lane. Going from that to that guy guarding Hartenstein and now Chet's being guarded by a forward

who is going to apply more ball pressure, who's probably going to be quicker-footed, at least as quick-footed as Chet, to a guy who's probably going to switch most actions as opposed to dropping in most actions. Going from that is going to put a lot more difficulty or, just challenge on Chet in his perimeter skills. And so we're going to go over to the play software one more time. And I just want to kind of demonstrate this concept. So again, if this is Chet, we'll set up,

we'll just set up in like a five out kind of ball screen kind of situation here. If this is Chet and Chet's guarding the ball screen and this team's going to ice a side ball screen, by the way, the guys, the reason why I keep talking about icing, every single team in the NBA wants to ice side ball screens. That's what they try to do, which all that is is this man, of chasing over the top and then funneling into the middle of the floor, this man is actually going to stay way on the high side of the screen and try to force him back towards the sideline. There are times where ball handlers in the NBA do get to the middle of the floor.

I don't want to pretend like that never happens. They'll just a lot of times like they'll dribble down and then this guy will chase and then they'll use a retreat dribble, which will get them back onto that high side so they can get over. They will get over. and when they do get over the top of the screen, the same exact kind of coverage principles apply. The only difference you'll see is sometimes if the ball handler gets way over here, they may ask this guy to be the low man.

Once the ball crosses that midline, this guy becomes the low man, as opposed to on an ice when they funnel this way, this guy is your low man, right? So there are some differences in the floor construct, but most teams are going to try to ice that ball screen and funnel them back towards the sideline, right? So as he funnels him towards the sideline,

this guy's in his drop coverage. He funnels towards the sideline. He's chasing. Chet is going to pop right here, and he's going to be wide open, and he's going to have a slow-footed center closing out at him that he can cook off the dribble and make stuff happen. That's going to be Hartnstein now. Now, this is going to be Chet guarded by a forward.

So now what's going to end up happening is a lot of times Chet's going to have this guy on him, ball pressuring whenever he has the ball. When Chet goes to set a screen, If Chet like, let's say Isaiah Hartnstein goes down to the dunker spot and Jalen Williams calls for a screen and Chet goes to set it, this is probably just going to be a switch. They'll just switch the ball screen and now J. Dub will be going against the forward and Shet will be going against the two guard. That's not going to be a drop or an ice the way that you see in most of these ball screen coverages when he's at the five. So that inherently is going to prevent some of those openings that Chet gets in terms of clean catches on the perimeter.

The second piece of it is having to run action. As we talked about earlier, let's imagine Isaiah Hartenstein is our ball handling fulcrum, right up here, right? So he's our fulcrum, and we have Hartnstein getting ready to run Chicago action. So J. Dubb runs down. He sets a pin down screen for, for Shea.

Shea comes off, the dribble handoff. These two guys switch. Isaiah Hartinstein goes to flow into it. These guys, let's say they deny it, or let's just for the sake of, making it work or look kind of a different look than we've already shown. Let's say Shea gets over the screen. So Isaiah Harden signs that's a pick.

She gets over the screen. He comes down into this zone. Let's say this guy offers nail help. So there's just a lot of traffic in here around Shea. Shea would make the kickout pass over here to Lou Dort. At which point, Lou Dort would flow down into a dribble handoff where Chet would come off. This guy would switch. now Lou Dorts defender is guarding Chet on the ball.

And as Shea kind of cycles through and Jalen cycles up, Hartnstein's going to turn and go set the screen. So now Chet is running action as the primary ball handler in five out because of Isaiah Hartnstein being the five man. That is going to put Chet in positions where he's going against a quicker perimeter defender who's pressuring the ball and testing the ability of his handle as he gets into the lane. testing his ability to play make as they come off of those situations. So like I said, in terms of the offensive end of the four going with two bigs,

I don't worry about Hartnstein at all. My only real concern is will Chet be able to function offensively in more of a perimeter role where the ball is in his hands more? To be clear, like, in the long run, I'm a big believer in Chet in what he can do with the basketball in his hands. But I just don't think he's quite ready for that yet. So I'm really curious to see how he fares in that role next year. And I do expect some lumps in the regular season, especially when they go to those big looks.

But as long as they can figure that out over the course of the 82 and Chet makes enough progress before they gets to the postseason, that'll be a viable look for them. And they will always have the option of going back to their small ball look, which is going to be better this year because you have Alex Crusoe instead of Josh Giddy. Under any circumstances, it's a better look. And I expect them to be better defensively immediately with Hartenstein. on the floor alongside Chet. I expect those big looks to be stifling on the defensive end of the floor. So overall, love the fit, love that it gives them more matchup versatility in the long run by having a big look.

I still think I'd prefer if they had a forward look as well, where Chet has a big forward next to him, just because I think that that would give them a little bit more versatility, because I think they've got like a really good small ball look and a really good big look, but they don't have anything that's kind of in between that's traditional. that is something I'd like to see them address in the long run. But Hartnstein gives you the ability to have at least some of those benefits in the short term and you have the flexibility two years from now by virtue of the way that deal is structured.

So you can be picky and you can be patient in the process of trying to hunt down whoever that four man was. Lastly, kind of talking about the thunder in the big picture, I think the addition of Caruso and Hartinstein makes Oklahoma City a top tier championship contender. I probably still have them behind Boston and Denver by some small amount. at least until we see these guys play. And there are some other teams, potentially Philly, potentially some other teams

who make a trade this summer. There are some other teams that could be entering into that tier, Minnesota and Dallas too, potentially as we kind of look into it. But I definitely view Oklahoma City in that tier right now. They just added two quality starting caliber

players. They only had four of those last year. Now they have six of them, just like Boston does. So we'll actually rank our contenders later in the summer. We usually do that like middle September as we kind of get ready for training camp. We'll rank our contenders. But I want to wait until all of the signings and trades come through before we do that

just because there's just going to be a lot of new information over the course of the next couple of months. But I do at this point have Oklahoma City in that top tier of contenders by virtue of these two moves. I really wanted Hartnstein to the Thunder. We got it. It's going to be a lot of fun. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque.

Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me. Clipper Taylor, the podcast. forth. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be.

Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away,

such as the biology of tauntons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to Stuff to Blow Your Mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jek. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down,

and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me. Not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence.

Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All right,

CP3 to the Spurs. I love this move because it accomplishes two things. It gives Victor Weniama a high-level ball handler to make things easier for him on offense. To give you an idea, Victor only got 2.5 role man possessions per game last year. That's the same amount as Rudy Gobert. Stonehands Rudy Gobert.

And who doesn't play with passers, right? And that's half as many as the star bigs at the top of the league guys like Anthony Davis, guys like Joe L. M. B. because those guys play with high-level ball handlers who consistently set them up with those opportunities. Here's a crazy stat for you guys. Victor only logged 2.2 cut possessions per game.

Those are easy feeds around the rim for quick finishes, right? Trace Jackson Davis are the Warriors, who played less than 17 minutes per game, logged more cut possessions per game than Victor Wembeyanma. In about half as many minutes. Guess who was the primary? guard for most of those Trace Jackson Davis minutes, Chris Paul. So like, is Chris Paul going to make the spurs into a championship contender? Obviously not. But he's just going to allow them to function more like

a normal basketball team on offense. He's going to generate those higher quality opportunities for Victor Wenbanyama that most of his peers at the position get. And again, like, the big thing is in the long run, they are eventually going to have a star ball handler next to Victor. And we don't know who it's going to be, and we'll talk about that in a minute, but he's eventually going to play alongside this type of guy. Why not let him get some reps learning how to do that in the short term, while the second thing this accomplishes maintaining flexibility? Because it's a one-year deal. A lot of the ball handlers that were available to the spurs this summer didn't make a lot of sense. Dejante Murray isn't good enough to be your primary ball handler. Trey Young is good enough,

but he comes with a lot of other issues, as we know, attitude issues, defense issues. Donovan Mitchell just re-uped in Cleveland, so he's not an option. Darius Garland's kind of an interesting option in terms of the fit, but I don't think he's good enough to be the best ball handler on a championship team. Paul George was too old. Brandon Ingram isn't good enough either. This is the summer for fringe stars to be hunted by contenders, not for young teams to look for foundational pieces.

And so, for instance, we just talked about the Thunder. This is why the Thunder went for Hartnstein instead of making some sort of other deal. They're probably looking at it like, you know, we don't view Lori Markinen as a guy on a max contract that is worth it in the context of Jalen Williams and Shea, we would rather wait for a different type of player, right? So Hartnstein, they have the cat flexibility to do it. That was them kind of making the same type of decision that the Spurs are talking about. There weren't a lot of foundational type of talent available this summer to try to go after. CP3 gives the Spurs another year to wait things out. And maybe Devin Vassell

takes another step forward. He had his best scoring volume and efficiency year last. year. Maybe he takes a step forward. It looks like he could be that guy in the long run. Stefan Castle, who the spurs drafted at the top of the first round, like, maybe he learns how to shoot this year. And maybe that kind of turns into a guy that the spurs project as a ball handler. Or maybe a different guy becomes available in the trade market. And the spurs can jump in there and try to make a move. And like, the one thing is Victor is so talented already that he applies more timeline pressure in the sense that like you don't want to wait five years to be good because Victor could be a top 10 player literally next year.

year. And there's a certain pressure that comes with that, right? But I thought this was a savvy move by the Spurs. It just, again, is going to give them that flexibility to wait out a better ball handling option while giving them, or giving Victor at least a facsimile of that to practice with for this season. And most importantly, it's going to make the Spurs more fun to watch. The Spurs were like watching college basketball last year. Just the ball handling capability was so low. It made them really difficult to watch. Victor Wemigniama was the only saving grace of them as a television product, getting a CP3 out there and having them look more organized on offense will help a lot. Last hit for today, Dejante Murray to the New Orleans Pelicans. This move was all

about rim pressure, in my opinion. Guy like C.J. McCollum, the average 9.9 drives per game last year for the Pelicans. DeJante by himself averaged 15.1. DeJante attempts over eight shots per game in the paint. And so this kind of, like we talked about earlier, is going to go back to what we talked about after the playoffs in that five biggest things. One of the things that I took as one of my five biggest takeaways from that playoff run was rim pressure is the most valuable thing for shot quality. And there's a bunch of different ways to get rim pressure. You can do it in the post.

You can do it cutting. You can do it crashing the offensive glass. You can do it rolling in ball screens. There's a bunch of different ways. But the most resilient way in the playoffs to do it is dribble drive penetration, right? The ability to beat people off. the dribble is the easiest way to generate that type of rim pressure. And so in these situations, like if you look at the Pelicans, Zion Williamson was really

the only guy for them last year generated sustainable rim pressure. Jonas did a bunch on the glass in the post, but he was so matchup specific and like incapable of being played against certain types of teams that it didn't really add up to much in real tangible value for the Pelicans, right? Like Zion was the only kind of dependable rim pressure they had. And you guys watched in that Lakers playing game just how damaging Zion can be just because he can beat people off the dribble. And even CJ and Brandon, Brandon Ingram, they're like pull-up shooters who are like in ISO situations, mainly going to step back or turn around jump shots. They both need screens to get all the way to the rim.

DeJante is a guy who can legit just beat the man in front of him off the dribble. And that is where he's going to bring the most value of value for. for this team on the offensive end of the floor. I like this move because when I think of like the idealized version of the Pelicans in the long run, I view them as a drive and kick team. I look at them as a team that should use Dejante Murray and Zion Williamson to break down the defense at the start to get the defense in rotation. And then these guys, Trey Murphy is like a professional closeout attacker.

Herb Jones made a lot of progress this last year as a closeout attacker. Like I even prefer C.J. McCollum and Brandon Ingram operating with an advantage because of their high level of skill. And so like, to me, this is a move in the direction of the Pelicans being more of a driving kick team, which I think is going to be good for them in the long run. And then they can layer their pull-up shooting on top of that. As we know, CJ and Brandon Ingram are pull-up shooters, but there's not as much resilience there. You saw in the Thunder series, it's like those pull-up jumpers start to miss. Suddenly they both become relatively ineffective basketball players, right? And so like there's more resilience to drive and kick basketball than pull-up three-point shooting.

It's like the difference between the Sons and the Boston Celtics, right? Like Boston was more diligent about driving. Phoenix wanted to settle for a ton of pull-up jumpers and ended up being the death of them, right? So like this to me is a good move in that direction. But DeJante also brings high-level pull-up shooting as well. He shot 45% on pull-up jumpers last year, 51% when you weighed it for threes, 1.02 points per shot. He was one of only nine players in the league to attempt at least 500 pull-up jump shots

and to maintain an efficiency over one point per shot. shot. He's in a rare group of efficient pull-up jump shooters in the NBA. He also had the best catch-and-shoot season of his career. You got 1.17 points per catch-and-shoot jumper. He shot 46% from the field, like just straight field goal percentage on unguarded catch-and-shoot jump shots. So if that's a trend and not a blip, then we're talking about some real upside to this trade. And Dejante's got like real scoring pop. He was one of the best ISO players in the league last year. He got 1.1 points per possession out of the game. of ISOs including passes according to Synergy.

That I ranked sixth out of 19 players to run at least 300 ISOs last year. He had 13, 30 point games. He had four 40 point games. He had multiple game winners. He had at least eight assists in 25 games. Like, he's just a damn good basketball player. And like, again, part of it is just Atlanta in their situation. And just the lack of success, the lack of team success that came out of that situation,

I think put DeJante in a position where he's discounted. But he's a player I was a huge believer in. I really wanted him for the Lakers. And so I'm really excited for Pelicans fans because I think they got a good one here. He's also a bit of an asshole. And I mean that in the best way. Like you need to have that asshole streak to be like an effective basketball player and knock down, drag out fights.

And he's just that type of guy. And I think Pelicans fans are really going to like him. I have two main concerns. And there are the same concerns I talked about when Dejante was first being rumored. for the Lakers last year around the deadline. Just hasn't been very good defensively since leaving San Antonio. But the capability is obviously there. It's not like he lost his talent on that end of the floor.

It's just about commitment. Hasn't done it since leaving San Antonio where he was an all-defense guy. So he just needs to get that piece back and hopefully by virtue of just being on a team that has this much talent. And the Pelicans have a ton of talent now. Just by virtue of being on that sort of team, I think that he'll have more energy resources to devote to that end of the floor, but that'll be a big piece.

Then the second piece of it is he struggles to make layups. Shot just 52.9% on layups last year, according to Synergy. That ranked 37th out of 44 players who attempted at least 300 layups last year. There's pros and cons to that, right? Like missed layups usually mean occupied rim protectors, right? So like there are opportunities for offensive rebounds that come from that. But the Pelicans are not a good offensive rebounding team. They were 19th in offensive rebound percentage last year.

And they just lost two of their top three offensive rebounders in Larry Nance, Jr. and Jonas Valenciuna. So that isn't really a value add for the Pelicans. The downside is missed layups, specifically from guards, especially when they're driving from above the break, that leads to bad floor balance, which can lead to transition opportunities.

To put it simply, just imagine two guards above the break. If one drives in and misses, there's only one guard back, and that can lead to some transition opportunities. With Russell Westbrook, when he used to miss layups, it was an overwhelmingly bad experience for the Lakers. So like really for, and to be clear, on tape, it's mostly about decision making. Dejante will just overpenetrate sometimes, drive into rim protectors and try impossible layups that end up hurting his percentage. So really it's going to be about just better rim decisions, better decisions about when to drive, not over penetrating when the help is already there, making sure you have a plan when you get on the dribble into the lane, making better reads when you get there in terms of kickout passes and drop off passes.

As long as he does those sorts of things, he should be able to clean that up. But again, those are the two things. He's just got to recommit on the defensive end, and he's got to be able to make layups or at least better decisions when he gets to the rim. I had a third there. Last year's catch-and-shoots season was a little bit of an outlier for him.

That needs to be a trend and not a blip for him to continue to function as part of the driving kick that the pelicans are going to try to build out. Overall, I like the deal, though. Dyson Daniels is a really interesting young player, but Dijante is just a better player within the context of trying to win right now, which I think the Pels are trying to do.

And I'm just generally really high on DeJante. As I mentioned earlier, I wanted him for the Pelicans, so I'm happy for Pelicans fans that they get to root for him this season. All right, guys, that is all I have for today. We're going to be back tomorrow with a mailbag. Probably have a couple mailbag breakouts over the course of the time that we're off.

I hope all of you guys enjoy your holiday weekend, and I will see you on Monday. Oh, I'll see you on the mailbag, and then I will see you after that on Monday. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. On The Look Back at it podcast

For 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 was big to me. I'm Sam Jay. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s.

84 was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to Look Back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me.

Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.