The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hoops Tonight - NBA Mailbag: Warriors & Lakers TRADE TARGETS, how Luka Doncic & Mavericks win Finals

Episode Date: November 23, 2024

  Jason Timpf answers listener questions during an NBA mailbag segment. Jason discusses which players make the most sense for Steph Curry's Golden State Warriors and LeBron James' Los Angeles Lakers to target in trades as the season goes on. Later, Jason breaks down what Luka Doncic must change about his game for the Dallas Mavericks to win an NBA Finals and why he expects Dallas to elevate their play as the season goes on.   Timeline: 4:00 - Introduction 5:00 - Hoops Tonight schedule 9:00 - How Pistons should build their team 13:30 - Warriors depth 15:45 - Is Kerr mismanaging younger talent? 24:00 - Would Warriors trade for Jimmy Butler? 32:00 - Speed vs. size 33:30 - How Magic have survived without Paolo 43:00 - Dalton Knecht 48:15 - Jason's ideal star player 51:30 - 5 most exciting players to watch 54:30 - De'Aaron Fox breakout 55:00 - Why Mavs will turn it on (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) #Volume #Herd Follow Jason Timpf on social: https://twitter.com/_JasonLT https://www.instagram.com/jtimpf15/  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you.

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What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast, Point Game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was crying. You just understood.

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All right, welcome to Hoops Tonight here at the Volume. Happy Friday, everybody. Hope all of you guys have had a great week so far. Got a jam-pack show for you today. It is a mailbag day. Got about a dozen questions. We'll be going all around the league. Thank you to those of you guys who submitted questions. You guys know the drope before we get started.

Subscribe to the Hoops Tonight YouTube channel so you don't miss any more of these videos. Follow me on Twitter at underscore Jason LT so you guys don't miss show announcements. Don't forget about our podcast feed, wherever you get your podcast under Hoops Tonight. Don't forget, it's also helpful if you leave a rating and a review on that front. Also, we have brand new social media feeds on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook for the Hoops Tonight channel where we're going to be releasing some reels and stuff like that. So make sure you guys follow those feeds. And then last but not least, if you want to get a mailbag question into our mailbags that we do on Friday,

and occasionally an additional time during the week, we drop them in the YouTube comments. Make sure you get the questions there and we'll hit them at least every Friday. All right, let's talk some basketball. question. Hey Jason, I'm a long time listener. And a few times recently, it feels like the mailbag has become responding to cry babies instead of answering thoughtful questions, having unique conversations, et cetera. You don't need to defend yourself against people who aren't listening to the show or delusional fans, maybe using it to touch on some younger, less talked about teams, would be cool to love what you do, man. First of all, thank you for the kind words and the support.

You're absolutely right. And I owe you guys better than that. I shouldn't be stooping to the level of responding to people that are either trolls or people that are having arguments in bad faith. And so I'm going to do a much better job. I appreciate you calling me out on it. You're right. I got to do better. I think you're right. This is this mailbag should be more for getting into some of the younger teams that we don't talk about as much, talking about big picture basketball concepts and getting to those of you guys who have well-meaning, well-thought-out questions. So you guys have my word. I'll do better. Again, I appreciate you calling me out on it. Next question. Hey, Jason, I've been watching since the beginning. I have a little

complaint. And I know real life gets busy, but it seems like we aren't getting as many videos as we did last season. Last season, it felt like every night there would be a quick reaction video. So far this season, there have been days with no videos. I just appreciate your videos, brother. You're doing great. Just a fan complaint. So I was just curious because I feel like all I do is work. But obviously I want to hear you guys out. So I just dug into it. Tomorrow is one month since the start of the season. Or I should say today, since it's airing on Friday. I'm recording this on Thursday. But today, this Friday, represents exactly one month since the start of the season. And I went back and looked and we've done 24 full episodes, which means we're going

more than once or more than five times a week. The general rule of thumb is in a month if you do, if you work 22 days, you're working on average five days a week, right? So like, we're going over five days a week, which is pretty much in line with what we do during the regular season, right? generally speaking, we're going to release five new episodes on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. And then usually about one night a week, I'm going to pick a primetime game and do an instant reaction, which we've done about five times this season. Now, you're right, the very first season, when I first started with the volume, we were going every night. It was a nightly show. But obviously, we transitioned into hitting the big games, but having the shows during the day, which I prefer,

because then I get to really pour over the film. Like, my opinion is that the show is, better in its current format because I can really dig into the film methodically and meticulously and give you guys better information. Even in the playoffs, when we go every night, I also go almost every day because even though we're going every night and that's the instant reaction and capitalizing on the urgency, I also just need to watch the film. That's something that is very important to me. It's been like that since I played in college. It's just what you do. It's just, I like pouring over the film the day after the game. So like the general thing you can expect for me on the show is that from about the beginning

of October, usually it's like mid-September because I do so much season preview content. From about the middle of September to about the middle of April, you can count on me for Monday through Friday, five days a week, plus about one nightly show a week, usually geared around a big national TV game. Then from the mid-April to mid-June, you guys can count on me to go basically every night and every day. Those of you guys who've been around during the playoffs, you know what it's like. We do last year we averaged about like 12 brand new episodes per week during the playoffs. Then after that, during free agency and summer league and in the trade market and all that stuff,

I go back down to about five days a week. And then in that August, September stretch, I'm going to go down to about three days a week because it's the summer and that's when I'm going to take a break. But that's been the cadence we've been following for the last couple of years. And that's pretty much what you can expect from the channel moving forward. but I understand. I know you just, I know, I know, I just wanted to kind of dig into it, make sure I was giving you guys what you guys expect for me on the channel. Next question, Piston superfan here. I believe the Pistons have hit on multiple draft picks over the last three to four years. And that Cade Ivy Duren is a good core to build around.

We have tried to be young and fun and ended up being one of the worst teams in NBA history. We're now trying to add some playable vets and win, but we'll likely waffle under 500 this year. All-Star caliber-free agents do not want to come to Detroit. So what would be your suggestion be to build this team without getting outrageously lucky in the draft? Thanks, love the show, longtime listener. Again, thank you for the kind words and for supporting the show. A couple things.

First of all, I wouldn't get too hung up on this year's results. As of right now, Thursday, when I'm recording this, you guys are the sixth seed in the Eastern Conference. I think if I told you that coming into the season, given what we expected out of teams like Philly and Milwaukee and Indiana, you'd probably be pretty stoked about being up at number six. Two, out the gates, the schedule was really tough, and you drop some games. But you've been a pretty serious basketball team since then.

I've watched about three or four Pistons games, and when I watch them, they look big, they look athletic, and they've got some smart young shot creators and some talent that could pan out in the long run. Even with that being the case, even with me admitting and pointing out that I think that the Pistons are having a pretty successful season to start, I wouldn't get too hung up on this year's results. This kind of goes back to some of the concept that I've gone with with a bunch of different teams that I've talked about over the last few years in the sense that you stand to gain a lot through natural improvement over the years, right? Like Jaden Ivy, showing a lot more

flash as like a downhill shot creator knocking down shots at a higher level, like having a good season. Kay Cunningham, having a good season, he's going to get better. Jaden's going to get better. Jalen Duren, right now he's kind of matchup dependent, right? Certain matchups he does really well, certain teams that can spread him out and make him work more on the perimeter. He can struggle with, right? But he's, I like that core a lot. And you stand to get dramatic improvement from that core year over year over the next few years. And so I wouldn't get too hung up on this year's results.

As far as the roster build goes, this is where, again, if you like your build, you like your guards, you have your, you have your shot creators, you like your defensive anchor. Okay. The next step now is trying to find high level role players. in the draft, which by the way, I feel like the Pistons have done. That's what the Assar Thompson pick is. That's what the Ron Holland pick is, right? Like, these are athletes that you can count on to do the dirty work around your best players. Now, the thing with Osar and Ron Holland is they were both so young that there's going to be a little bit more

of a long development kind of trajectory for those guys, right? But this is one of those things where you can also look at in the draft drafting some older players, because you are correct, especially because of having to pay Cade Ivy and Duren, you're not going to get, this last summer was pretty much your last chance to get like really high level role players through free agency, right? And like to your point, I think that finding that additional talent through the draft is the way to go. I don't think you have to necessarily get very lucky though.

Because when you're drafting, a lot of teams are looking for substantial splashy pieces. They're looking for a secondary shot creator. They're looking for potentially the next star to, run their franchise. There are guys that end up in the draft that are role player prospects. Hell, the number one pick last year, Zachary Rusas She was a role player type of prospect, right? Like, there's older guys that end up in the draft. Older guys that don't have as much upside, but that can do NBA ready things right away that kind of fit the mold of what Detroit's trying to do. Dalton Connect falling to the Lakers is a classic example of that. They're drafting at

17 and they get a legitimate rotation piece, right? So like, that's a thing. It's like, You've got some really athletic long-term prospects in Ron Holland and Assar Thompson. Maybe you start looking for like some older players in the draft that are a little bit like more of like NBA ready type of guys because that is where in the draft you can get some discounted role players relative to the overpaying that you have to do in free agency a lot of the time. And so again, I like the core. I like the direction this is going. I think this season has actually been off to a better start than people think or people are willing to admit. I understand that like under 500 is never a reason to be like super, super excited. but the NBA has like 20 really good teams and the NBA schedule is tough.

The Pistons played a tough schedule out the gate. They're going to be fine. It looks like they're going to get their first chance to play some real meaningful, either at least a play in game or maybe even a full playoff series this year. They're on the right track. It's just about a couple of specific types of draft picks they need to hit in the future and then the player development in-house. Next question.

This is in regards to the Warriors 11-man rotation. part of that also is helped by playing 12 guys because like ice hockey you need more shifts of bodies to constantly push at that pace it's a huge edge and step is as an offensive engine uh step as is as a typo here step is an offensive engine that makes all 11 of those guys playable in high efficiency offense and raymond as an enhancer allows them to play against draymond as an enhancer allows them to play against big lineups this makes perfect sense to me this is something that i've been kind of keyed in on a little bit i think it's delicate because a lot of it depends on how many good basketball players you have, right? Like if the Lakers, for instance, started running an 11-man rotation, it could get a little tricky with some of the guys that they have at the tail end of their rotation right now, right? But the flip side of that is, like, when you play this style, the style that the Warriors play, heavy transition both ways. That's the thing.

Like, the Warriors, as of like two nights ago, the last time I checked, had the best transition defense in the league per cleaning the glasses defensive points added per 100 possessions metric, right? So like that's a lot of work. That's a lot of sprinting back in transition and like making sure that you're flying around in the open floor. What they do in offense and transition, the way they run around, I had a play that I put in Tim's tape earlier on Thursday where you guys got to see like how quickly they run in the half court when they're trying to run their action. So like it's one of those things where if you have 11 good basketball players, it does make sense to me that you would go with a bigger rotation in the regular season.

Ice hockey's a great comp. it's the line shifts and the fact that your best player might only play 22, 25 minutes a game because he's just just cascating is so damn hard in terms of the cardio, right? And like that's the thing, like playing this brand of basketball. And it extends to the half court too with all the ground that you have to cover in rotation closing out at a great three point shooters that are spotting up 25 feet from the basket, right? So like, yeah, I'm actually, I'm actually kind of into this concept. Like the, the Lakers run a nine-man rotation, but they play at a slower pace and they've got some guys that are a little bit more lethargic, but like, I'm with you.

I think if you've got 10, 11 good basketball players, you should run a longer rotation. Warriors fan, I'm grateful for Kerr, I'm grateful to Kerr for the last decade, but I'm also pissed at the way he's handling our next generation. Why is Lindy Waters getting more playing time than Moody and Jonathan Cominga? It feels like two years ago when Ty Jerome and Jeremy Lamb got playing time time over Moody and Jonathan Cominga. I don't mean to hate on waters. I love having him, but I'm more interested in seeing what Moody can do. And the last time, J.K. played crunch time, he won the game in overtime against the Rockets.

So this is one of those things where after all these years watching Steve Kerr, we just have to understand his philosophy as a basketball coach. Why do you, everyone wants to cling to this narrative that like Steve Kerr hates Jason Tatum because they beat him by 50 in a regular season game last year or because of what happened in the NBA finals in 2022 or something like that. And it's like actually the reason why Steve Kerr played Derek White and Drew Holiday over Jason Tatum is he kind of looks at the guard position in his offense as a quick-rate and React player that has to be able to shoot on the move.

And if you remember, Jason Tatum was not shooting the ball well at the time. And Jason Tatum isn't exactly a movement shooter either. He's kind of more of an ISO shooter. like he's a guy that you kind of want initiating the offense right and that and the Olympic team they'd already decided they were going to be running through LeBron at the top of the key and they needed players that were going to be more running in that action and in that Steve Kerr system right this is the same thing that's been happening happening with the warriors forever it's like oh brand of Pajamski's getting all these minutes like all these

guards are getting all these minutes while Moody is not getting as much or Jonathan Kaminga's minutes are less consistent and uh that's all it is Steve Kerr trusts Lindy Waters to be a threat off the move as a shooter and to make decisions coming off of those actions at a higher level than Moses Moody. Now, Moses Moody to me is a very good player that just kind of is a little bit of a clunky fit

in the warrior system in the sense that he's a good physical perimeter defender with size, which is like there's a lot of value there. And I actually think he's a pretty solid shooter when he can get his feet set and he's open. He's worked hard as a movement shooter. He's a better movement shooter than he was a couple years ago.

He's a better movement shooter than a lot of the guys that have come through other development programs around the NBA, right? But specifically within the Warriors offense, Lindy Waters is a better movement shooter who is a better decision maker in the decision zone, which is like, you come off the screen, you have to immediately read the screen defender. He's too far back, and my guy's caught on the screen. I'm shooting this thing. he's too far back and my guy's trailing but he's not completely attached.

I want to methodically work down into the lane and see if I can't warp the defense a little bit. Once I get in there, the decision's on around that elbow, I need to make quick reads based on what the help defense is doing. And like, Steve Kerr has traditionally trusted players that are better in read and react situations in those rotation minutes and guards tend to be better read and react players because they've been handling the ball since they were younger. But like, that's the thing is like, I think Kaminga still gets his opportunities and he's playing in this bench role where he gets to come in and be more aggressive. But like, I don't think it's like any sort of personal vendetta or like philosophy involving wanting to be small.

I think it's literally just about that read and react decision making and Steve Kerr trusting some of his guards over the years more than he's trusted some of his forwards. Last warrior's question. Then we'll move on. Hey, it's us to Jonas brothers. And guess what? We have some big. news. What's the news? Huge news. We created our own podcast called Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it.

We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Oh, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our bands.

Before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast.

But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, Not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends, me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform?

We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam. It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Tolodon. and our podcast point game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed.

And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup,

he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nass would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court licking his fingers why he got the ball. Like, you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick.

Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you. you get your podcasts. Agency, the ability to know that we're the experts in our own body. On the podcast cultivating her space, Dr. Dom and Terry Lomax create a space where black women can show up fully and be heard. I wholeheartedly think, you know, you hit 30. You shouldn't have to share one with anybody. Mm-hmm.

From navigating friendships and healing to setting boundaries and prioritizing your mental health. These are real honest conversations. We don't always get to have out loud. Totally unreasonable with different parts of life, right? Like, oh, have all three meals and make sure you're mindful during all of them? Absolutely not. During one meal, I'm standing. I'm standing and handing my children food.

Because healing, empowerment, and resilience aren't just ideas. Their practices. And this Mental Health Awareness Month, there's no better time to pour back into yourself. Listen to cultivating her space on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. This week on Crimless, we're joined by our first ever guest. Sorry, our first ever human guest. I don't think I could be in the same room with Shamrock the pair.

I'd be too nervous. That's right. The very funny Will Ferrell joins Rory Scovel and me, Josh Dean, for an episode dedicated to the many crimes committed by people also named Will Ferrell. They called to his fellow officer for the nippers. What are the nippers? Very good question. No, I was thinking, would that be a good name for like a salad dressing?

Simple assault. And it's a play on word, salt? Maybe not. I say we invest and we see. There's only one way to know. This did not amuse the cops. By the way, normally the cops are amused, but this did not abuse the cops. Will even comes clean about some of his own crimes.

I didn't get caught. You know why? If you don't want to be suspected of anything, you whistle as you walk. Listen to crime list on the IHeart Radio. app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. De Anthony Melton being out for the season is a tough blow for the dubs, as he was the perfect off guard to Steph and their only real two-way small perimeter player. What should they do to make up for it?

Regarding their front court and secondary production issues, do you think there are any realistic chance that the heat would part ways with Bam? And if so, could they get him without completely gutting their roster? I think he'd be a much better fit than someone like Janice and his contract is more modest too. So obviously bad news about De Anthony Melton. I'm just as bummed for him as I am for the Warriors just because that guy's just had a nightmare stretch of injury luck over the last couple of years. But I'm not as concerned about it in their rotation because, yeah, you're right.

De Anthony Melton might have been the best two-way guard next to Seth, maybe, in terms of his defensive ability and his ability to shoot and make plays in action. But you're so deep at the guard that I just am not worried about it. There's just so many other guys that can do that job. It's really the front court where I think that they could, use a real like talent upgrade. Bam would be a dream, like literally a dream fit. But I just think he's going to be way too expensive. And I also doubt that Miami moves him in a rebuild. Like to me, if Miami continues to spiral and they're not doing that bad, there are six and seven and

Eric Spolstra have botched a game where they could easily be above 500 right now in an Eastern conference that doesn't have many above 500 teams. But let's say that they keep spiraling. I think even if the heat looked to rebuild, they would still rebuild. around bam. He kind of feels like the heart and soul of the franchise in a lot of ways. He plays a very specific position that is an anchor on both ends, which is like he's the guy that can anchor a defense at the five spot as a drop big and a switch big and a rebounder. And then on the other end of the floor, he's kind of like the quintessential five out big in the sense that he's really good at dribble handoff action at the top of the key. So like,

even with his offensive limitations, he's still a really good fulcrum on the offensive end and he's a defensive anchor and he's at the right age. Still has a long, a lot of good basketball left, have a hard time believing that they're going to move on from BAM. I also think that they're kind of betting that BAM's development is a shooter in the long run and a guy like Kell L. Ware is like a stretch five next to him, that they might be able to play him at the four and have a bigger front line. So I don't think BAM is the option. Now, I talked about Jimmy Butler a little bit yesterday. And I had some Warriors fans complain like, oh, you can't give up Andrew Wiggins for Jimmy Butler. And for the record, I don't think you should do it unless

you have to. Like, if you have the opportunity to get a guy like Jimmy Butler without including Andrew Wiggins, you do it 10 times out of 10. I mean, imagine a lineup with Steph Curry and, you know, I think you could, you can maybe even consider getting away with a buddy healed in that lineup if you have Jimmy and Andrew at the 3-4 next to Draymond. But like there's a version of it where the Warriors just ask for Andrew Wiggins if you want to make that deal. Now, the reason why I said I would consider it. Let's dig a little bit deeper. One, the Warriors have been going big in the starting lineup anyway.

So there's kind of like this one spot for Ford, which is at the three with Andrew Wiggins, right? And in the event that you have to flip a Wiggins for a Jimmy Butler, you still have Jonathan Kaminga for when you go small, right? You can imagine a Jimmy, Jonathan, Draymond type of look with Draymond at the five, right? But I'm not saying you flip Andrew Wiggins for Jimmy Butler right now. the Warriors are a trade at the deadline type of team. Why? Because there's no version of this where they're desperate. Yeah, if the perfect deal fell into their lap right now,

I would expect them to jump on it. But that's not how teams trade usually. Teams usually want to wait until the deadline because they want to weaponize the market, right? They want to get multiple teams bidding to drive up the price, right? That's how that works. So when we get to February, you make a call at that point. We're going to know a lot in February. We're going to know that Andrew Wiggins is either having a flashback season like 2022

or he's more or less the same player that he was last year, right? Like we have this like roughly, I can't remember how many games of Warriors have played, maybe 15 at this point. So you have like a roughly 15 game sample. It's a small sample still. But like when we get to January, when we get to mid late January, we're going to know, like this is, Wiggins is back. We're in good shape.

All right, let's do this. We're also going to know where Jimmy Butler's at. He's been kind of rough to start this year. right? But like, we'll have a better idea of where Jimmy Butler's at in mid-January. So let's just paint a picture here for a second. Let's pretend that Jimmy Butler looks great in mid-January. Like, really starting to get his legs back underneath him. He looks great. He looks healthy. He looks ready to go. Let's say that the heat are still floundering in the playing area around like 7-8 seed. Okay. And the heat for the heat for the,

office looks at the situation and they go, we can't beat Boston. Maybe they get their butts kicked by Cleveland at some time around that, around that time too. And so then the heat starts to have some serious conversations and they're like, okay, our best pathway to kind of resetting here is why don't we make a deal with Jimmy. And let's say that the Warriors can pull it off. And for the record, forget about Andrew Wiggins for a second. Let's just set him aside. Let's just say that the Warriors are able to make the deal even without Andrew.

but let's just say that they're able to get Jimmy Butler. Okay? All I want you to think about is a big playoff game. Don't think about the regular season. As I talked about, as soon as they got those two wins against the Pelicans when Steph was out, I was all in on this team as a regular season wins juggernaut. They're going to win a lot of regular season games because they're deep,

they're fast, they're well-coached, they've got great leadership on the court with Steph and Draymond. They're just going to win a lot of regular season games. Okay. So we get to mid-January. You already know you're going to be a home, home court team in the first round, or more or less, that's the trajectory you're on. Now just think about a big playoff series. I want you to think about a second round series against

the Dallas Mavericks. They've got it together. Dallas Mavericks are cooking with their system with Clay. Luke has got his legs underneath him, Kyrie's hooping, and it's a two-two series. and you're going into Golden State for a pivotal game five, or hell, you're in a road game, whatever it is. Big playoff game, big moment. I'd want Jimmy Butler out there with Steph. You get into those games, and everyone's uncomfortable, and everything's a rock fight,

and everything's nasty, and having a big, strong forward, who has an alpha dog mentality, who is highly versatile on both ends of the floor. A savage competitor that's going to bring it. You just know he's going to bring it. A true foxhole guy that competitively will match Steph in those moments.

That could be the difference between you getting the trophy and not getting the trophy. Flat out. So like, I get it. Wiggins looks great. Jimmy looks old. If they both looked this way in February, no way I'm making that deal.

I'm just saying you make the call when you get to February. And if you get to February and you look like a really good regular season team that just lacks some top end firepower, and a certain type of player becomes available in this case talking about a Jimmy Butler, I do think you've got to make that deal. Because that's the type of deal that gives you the guy that you need next to Steph, next to Draymond, that can be a foxhole guy in that big moment. And he's the, like, I wouldn't trade Wiggins for any other guy. I wouldn't trade Wiggins for, I don't think,

I don't think Brandon Ingram is the guy that's good enough for a Wiggins deal. I don't think Levine is good enough for a Wiggins deal with the way he's playing right now. But Jimmy's the one guy where I'm like, we have routinely seen this guy when he is healthy in a playoff series, he is regularly outplayed players that are viewed as above him in the NBA hierarchy. I just would want him. I'd want him in the battle with me if I had an opportunity to have him in that situation.

The reason it's a mismatch is that speed gets slower and size never gets smaller. Fatigue always favors the larger fighter or basketball player as long as they're at similar levels of fitness. So I actually don't think I agree with this. The thing with the fight is you're trapped in a ring. On a basketball court, there's just a lot of space to cover. And I actually tend to think that, like, yes, the bigger team in a rock fight when everyone's tired will have the advantage in the half court. but if the faster team can spread you out and keep you in transition, I think they can still do a lot of damage.

And more or less, I just think they are generally in better physical condition. Now, to your point, similar levels of fitness, that's fine, but they're faster. And so that they can have some success in transition. And so if you, again, yeah, if you're the bigger team and you can keep things in the half court,

I do agree with you. But I just think it requires a certain type of big team. And a lot of the big teams out there, teams like the Sixers, they're just so slow in transition. it just doesn't matter, right? Hey, Jason, thoughts on the Magic winning six straight games. I thought after Palo went down, they were toast,

but Franz and the rest of the team seemed to have stepped it up in a big way. Now, the Magic did lose to the Clippers on Wednesday night, but they won six in a row before that. Franz Wagner has been leading the charge. His jumper's been a little better. Last year was at 0.83 points per attempt. This year, it's at 0.94. His passing in pick and roll has been awesome.

He does a really nice job of, like, after he gets into, you know, that, like, elbow area, right? So like after he comes off of the screen and he's, you know, in that like between 15 and 20 feet from the rim, he slows down in there. And he gets really methodical. And what ends up happening when he does that is like there's a guy dribbling with a live dribble, you know, in like around the paint, close to the paint. There's like an inherent like natural tendency of help defenders to kind of suck in. And he's just done a really nice job throwing rifles kickout passes and generating good spot up opportunities. And again, like the league average in spot-ups is like something like, it's like around like 1.07, 1.08 points per possession.

And in the half court, a 107, 108 offensive rating is awesome compared to what most teams get in the half court. The majority of teams in the league don't even get a point per possession in the half court, right? So like, he's just really good at generating spot-up opportunities by being methodical in the mid-range in his ball screens. He's run 170 ball screens this year that have amounted to 179 points. He's getting 1.05 points per possession. Out of the 30 players in the NBA that have run at least 150 ball screens this year, that ranks 11th. Ahead of guys like Damien Lillard, Cade Cunningham, Donovan Mitchell,

Franz is having an excellent shot creation season. And then Anthony Black is having a really nice season. Now, he's only shooting 32% from three, but he's shooting 42% on unguarded catch and shoots, which is important because that's when you're open, right? When the defense is playing off of you. And he's hit some really important threes this year, including a game winner.

He's converting spot-ups, even though he's shooting only 32% from 3, he's converting spot-ups at 1.08 points per possession, which is a little bit above average. And a big part of that is his close-out attacking. He's a good athlete. And once he gets his head of steam, I mean, his finger rolls damn near above the rim.

Like, he's just a good athlete in that situation. But he's also just been a legitimate secondary creator. I remember which game it was that I was watching. It was the one where he hit the game winner, where earlier in the same fourth quarter, he ran like a little ball screen with Wendell, Carter Jr. and came off, engaged a screen defender, perfect pocket pass, easy bucket in crunch time. And like, he's been doing that all season. Just he's athletic enough to kind of really pressure

the rim when he's coming over the top of that screen and he just makes the basic passing reads that are available. He's run 118 ball screens this year and he's over a point per possession. That's awesome for a young guard, especially one that coming into the draft was a guy that some guys had some some people had some skill concerns about, right? But what has made the magic be able to go on a six game winning streak without Palo is the same thing that's made them great for the last two years, which is their defense and their rebounding. They've had a 96 defensive rating, they had a 96 defensive rating in the six game win streak. That's awesome. They grabbed 52% of available rebounds in that span. That's awesome. They did a bunch of scoring and transition and off of

turnovers. They forced over 17 turnovers per game in that six game win streak. So like, that's their bread and butter. And then it's a high offensive floor brought by Franz and Anthony Black doing a good job and then scoring in transition off of those turnovers. They had a 1-15 offensive rating over that six game span. That's pretty solid being down your best offensive player, right? I'm actually really worried about the Lakers tonight. Again, by the time you guys hear this, this game will be over and we'll know what happened and hopefully the Lakers can pull it out. They're favored, so maybe they can get it done anyway. But this is the type of team that always is given the Lakers problems. Really athletic guards that can ball pressure,

D. Lo and Austin, and make them uncomfortable, picking them up full court, just bogging down the Lakers offense with ball pressure, which is something that has happened all season. They have a lot of bigger front court players that can switch LeBron AD action. So like that sort of switching has always caused problems for the Lakers. Now, with Palo being out and Wendell Carter Jr. Did not play against the Clippers in the first front half of the back-to-back. He might end up playing in the Laker game, we'll see. But like maybe they're down too many bodies in the front court,

and it'll just be a little bit easier for the Lakers to get some dribble penetration in their screening actions. But I'm worried about the Magic are a team that force a lot of turnovers. They pressure the ball well and they get out in transition. And, like, what are the two main weak points for the Lakers? They're, like, guard athleticism in transition and guard athleticism, handling ball pressure. And so, like, I'm worried about the Lakers tonight.

Hopefully they can get the win, but that's the type of matchup that problem that the Orlando Magic can present. And again, like, this is just, I think they're on a really good trajectory because they're just super talented. Franz is having a better season than he did last year. Palo was playing great before he got hurt, and he will eventually be back. They've got size. They've got defense.

They've, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, serious basketball team in a real threat, I think, in the Eastern Conference. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, news? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts.

Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. And, oh, we We were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes.

I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, people could call in and say, Hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy,

not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes.

Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app. podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano and our podcast Point Game is about defying the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what.

He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this. series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall.

And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nass would get that thing. That man, hell get to flyin. He running up the court, licking his fingers why he got the ball, like,

after you go through a training camp with that, I say, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court. and you're going to get the bomb. So listen to Point Game on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This week on Crimless, we're joined by our first ever guest. Sorry, our first ever human guest.

I don't think I could be in the same room with Shamrock the pair. I'd be too nervous. That's right. The very funny, Will Farrell joins Rory Scovel and me, Josh Dean, for an episode dedicated to the many crimes committed by people also named Will Ferrell. We called to his fellow officer for the nippers. What are the nippers?

Very good question. No, I was thinking, would that be a good name for like a salad dressing? Simple assault. And it's a play on word, salt? Maybe not. I say we invest and we see. There's only one way to know. This did not amuse the cops.

By the way, normally the cops are amused, but this did not abuse the cops. Will even comes clean about some of his own crimes. I didn't get caught. You know why? if you don't want to be suspected of anything, you whistle as you walk. Listen to crime lists on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Agency, the ability to know that we're the experts in our own body. On the podcast, cultivating her space, Dr. Dom and Terry Lomax create a space where black women can show up fully and be heard.

I wholeheartedly think, you know, you hit 30, you shouldn't have to share one with anybody. Mm-hmm. From navigating friendships and healing to setting boundaries and prioritizing your mental health. These are real honest conversations. We don't always get to have out loud. Totally unreasonable with different parts of life, right? Like, oh, have all three meals and make sure you're mindful during all of them? Absolutely not.

During one meal, I'm standing. I'm standing and handing my children food. Because healing, empowerment, and resilience aren't just ideas, their practices. and this mental health awareness month, there's no better time to pour back into yourself. Listen to cultivating her space on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, Jason, love the show.

I think a great trade for the Lakers would be to somehow get Cam Johnson and Dorian Finney Smith out of Brooklyn. It would solve their shooting and athleticism issues. What do you think that would take? I, you know, I'm kind of zeroed in on the three as the upgrade now, too. it's ironic because originally I was zeroed in on the two. I was like, well, you know, Ruiz your three, Austin's your one, just put a really good athlete at the two. But the rise of Dalton Connect has changed my opinion on this.

I think the ultimate version of this team is Dalton as a starter. I like Dalton as a starter for several reasons. One, he is an off ball score, meaning like he doesn't need the ball in his hands to be a real threat on the offensive end of the fore, which is important because the Lakers run a lot of their offense in the starting group through Boston and LeBron, and even through AD in post-ups and high post-off, right? So, Dalton is an off-ball score that complements them perfectly. Two, in terms of the defensive end of the floor, I want Dalton playing with the highest IQ defensive players on the court because that'll just make for an easier defensive role for him, right? So I think that

part makes a good amount of sense. Three, he's super athletic, right? And so in the event that, like, let's say for instance, that you get a Dorian Finney Smith at the three, then you're running out a lineup that has Dorian Finney Smith, Dalton Connect, LeBron James, Anthony Davis, now Austin Reeves is your fifth best athlete in the lineup. When he's your fifth best athlete in the lineup, you're an athletic team. If he's your third best athlete in the lineup, you're not a very athletic team, right? Which is some of the issues that they've had over the last couple of years. And so to me, like, originally I was thinking between Rui and Dilo,

Rui's the better player and a better fit with the starter. So, like, why don't we just go Rui and then we'll find somebody that's an athlete to fill in at the two, right and by the way that was the decision that j j reddick made with the rotation right bringing in a cam reddish into that spot right but now that i see dalton is kind of the shoe in starter at the two in the long run now i'm thinking like the even post lebron post lebron you're looking at austin dalton ad as the foundation of the franchise right so like it's forwards that you're looking at his upgrades and to me like jared vanderbilt is very much a theoretical player at this point got another report that he's going to be out at least another two weeks the other day so

like Jared Vanderbilt's got a long way to go. But as far as, as far as like a Cam Reddish goes, there's severe offensive limitations. I also don't think he's necessarily big enough to be the three. I prefer him kind of playing at the two. Jared Vanderbilt is,

I think Jared Vanderbilt is the right decision when he gets healthy for the starters. Like if I was coaching the Lakers and eventually, like I think, I think what JJ's doing makes sense to me. Like going Austin Cam Rui for the short term, but then when Jared Van derby Bill's healthy, I would go Austin Dalton Vando.

Again, I think Jared Vanderbilt, he's surrounded by incredible offensive talent, which can make up for his offensive limitations. And Dalton is surrounded by incredible defensive talent that can make up for his defensive limitations. Also, all of a sudden, a very athletic group. Like, Dalton Vando-Lebron-A-D is an absurdly athletic two through five. So like, that makes some sense to me. I think that would be like, again, short-term, Cam Rui, Vando gets healthy,

Dalton Vando, long-term, upgrade at the three, it goes Austin, Dalton, whoever that future three is, LeBron and AD. Dorian Finney Smith would be a perfect example for me. He's like a stereotypical defensive three. He's a very basic offensive player in terms of like shooting and driving closeouts, which I think makes some sense in that Laker starting group because, again, one of the important things about Dalton, Dalton is a legitimate threat coming off of screens that is going to grab a show, meaning like when he comes off the screen, the screen defender is going to have to show on him.

we've already seen a lot of opportunity for AD in particular to get open off of those actions and to get switches where he gets smaller defenders on. I did a whole breakdown on the Lakers offense and the Thursday show that I recommend you guys check out. But like, to me, Dalton's offensive ability to fly off of a screen and make a play makes it less important for the three man to be the kind of guy that can fly off of a screen and make a play. So like to me, Dorian Finnis Smith makes a lot of sense. I think, you know, Cam Johnson would be interesting, but like I still really like Dennis Schroeder. I've always like Dennis.

He's a good ball pressure player. He brings something to that the Lakers don't really have, which is a guard that can beat people off the dribble, which I think would be really helpful. So like I think I'd look for more of like a Dennis, Dorian Finney Smith type of upgrade. I think Dennis Schroeder would be a massive upgrade over a Gabe Vincent, for instance,

which I was wrong about when they went after Gabe instead of Dennis. Mind you, Gabe was a different player in Miami than he was with the Lakers. But Gabe, I thought Gabe was an upgrade over Dennis. I was wrong. Dennis is a better player. He'd be an upgrade. So like the Nets are going to, be fire sailing people and if they were able to get dorian finney smith and a guy like dennis then it starts

to make sense to me where you can kind of see a rotation where it's like okay we have austin dalton df s lebron ad the bench group is you know you have dennis leading the the bench group it's hard to tell who goes goes out in a trade like that but let's say it's dennis let's say it's max ruy you know uh jackson hayes or christian coloco is your nine-man rotation right so like i think that that kind of tends to make more sense in terms of the strengths and weaknesses of the team. Hello, Jason. Can you please explain your preference for offensive swish army knives that average 30 points per game versus defensive juggernauts that average 30 points a game? Personally, I prefer what AD and Janus bring to the table versus what Luca and Yokic bring. I find more value in

players that can score while single-handedly anchoring a defense, especially in the case of AD where he makes one of the worst defenses in the league competitive just by virtue of being on the floor while putting up 30-11 and 3. Thanks so much for the content. And please, ignore us Warriors fans. It'll be better for your mental health. Again, overwhelmingly, you guys are positive. I've done a bad job of shining too much of a light on the negativity. That's not going to happen anymore. I do appreciate you guys. So first of all, there's no exact science. Like, I personally believe that I'd rather have the offensive, like, like just surgical half-court shot creator because I believe it's easier as a coaching

staff and as a front office to make up for defensive stuff elsewhere. Right? Like, a lot of these guys that are Anthony Davis and Janus, they end up having to cover for weak defensive players anyway, right? So like, it's okay for your star to be that weak defensive player if he's anchored by a ton of defensive talent as long as he does his job, right? That's the key, right? Both archetypes have won.

Anthony Davis and Janice are champions. Nicole Yokic and Steph Curry are champions, right? But what I do think is fascinating is the Hardin and Lukat types have not won a championship yet. And the reason why, in my opinion, is the offensive guys, the Steph and the Yokic types, they at least did their job on defense. They competed on defense. They just had athletic limitations.

They won the title being solid defensive players, right? So, like, that's really the key. But there is no exact science. I have my personal preference. The reason why I believe it is because I think I can anchor a good offensive player through good coaching and management in the front office, right? but I mean, I'm not saying you're wrong necessarily because there's versions of it where AD and Yonis have won. And so it really is a matter of personal preference.

And by the way, this is one of the things that frustrates me as far as like the guys doing their job, like Stefan Yokic doing their job. There's this thing that happens in the NBA where it's like a guy gets better at something and then wins. And then everyone goes like, you owe him an apology. And it's like he won because he changed. Like that's the difference. Right. I think Luca will eventually win a title. He's not my favorite player, but I think he's too freaking good.

I think Luca's going to win a title eventually. When he does, he will defend better. He'll be in better shape, and he'll work harder on the defensive end. He'll be less of a sieve compared to what he's been in the past. So what'll be funny is, is Luca will win, and then everyone will be like, oh, everyone owes Luca an apology. He proved everybody wrong. Where are the haters now? and it's going to be like actually the haters were right

because Luca did need to improve on defense and he did eventually improve on defense and now he has the trophy, right? Like, I can already just see it happening. Luca eventually he's going to win and he's going to win because he's improved and then everybody who was critical in the past is going to get criticism, which doesn't make any sense to me.

All right, two more, and then we're out of here. This first one's a double. Two mail that questions. From a pure entertainment standpoint, who do you think are the five most exciting players and teams to watch? And two, what do you think about Deer and Fox's breakout games this weekend and his overall outlook?

So, okay, five most exciting players, no particular order. Steph Curry, I just love his combination of skilled motor and competitiveness. Anthony Edwards, after the LeBron Steph era, he's going to be my favorite player. I can just already tell. I love how psycho-competitor he is. I love just the athleticism. I find him to be a very aesthetically appealing player. Kyrie Irving, still to me, like, just amazing.

The show that he put on in that Warriors game that I covered last week, just his shot making still is one of the most aesthetically appealing players in the league. LeBron James is still someone that I really enjoy watching. I think he's just a showman. He's got a gift for just being an entertaining player to watch. Also, like, it just feels surreal to me to watch LeBron. Like, I have a Friendsgiving thing tonight so I can't watch the magic game. But, like, I'm so thankful that like 70 times this year, and I get to watch the games in the morning for my job, right?

But, like, it's funner to watch it as a fan live. Like, that's kind of the other thing we talked earlier about the schedule. one of the reasons why I like working in the morning too is in addition to being able to put on a more detailed show it also allows me to watch more as a fan the night of right but like I every time I sit down and like watch a Laker game I'm like I just feel lucky I'm like it's the year 2024 it's about to be 2025 and we still get to watch LeBron James

play like serious basketball like it just it just feels like historic to even be watching it and then John Moran specifically when he's in Memphis he just is such a showman. It just, it feels like every time John Morant plays in Memphis, it's like an event. And like you're going to get four to five ridiculous highlights. He's going to light the crowd on fire an additional 10 times.

John Moran's in that top five for me. As far as teams, Celtics and Warriors, because they run really beautiful modern basketball concepts that I enjoy. Specifically, the Celtics, I really grew to appreciate over about the second half of last season. The Lakers on offense, they're my favorite team, obviously, so that's part of it.

but two, they run a really pretty brand of offense. I did a video breakdown in the show on Thursday where they generated 17 easy shots, easy makes in the second half just with awesome ball and player movement. I find their offense to be very visually appealing. Nuggets, same sort of thing. I think Mike Malone does a lot of really fascinating stuff to capitalize on Yoko double teams and just how sharp they are

with their cuts and their spacing. And then lastly, the Suns when KD, was healthy. I thought they were playing a fun brand of basketball. KD. was playing incredible on both ends of the floor. They were kind of surgical in the half court at the end of games, and the shot making is always really pretty with that group. So those are my five most exciting players in teams in no particular order. And then Dearen Fox, I had him in my top 25 this year. I had him over Kyrie. And one of the big reasons why I had him over Kyrie is like, I just trust him as a number one to be able to generate more rim pressure and more quality

shots for his team over the course of the game. And like, he's really taken off over the course of more than just this last year with his jump shot. And it kind of reminds me some of the stuff with Ant, where it's like when you combine true elite downhill athleticism with elite jump shooting, you become incredibly difficult to guard. And I think that he's just kind of entering a point right now where he kind of everything's coming together for him

and he's becoming a little bit on the unguardable side. And he's on a pretty fun trajectory. Deerun Fox has become a really great player in this league. Last question. look, as bad as the MAV's record is, they are still top 10 in both offensive and defensive rating. What's the unwritten rule? Teams that are in the top 10 are in both are contenders.

Mavs are just like the Bengals. Slow start, but trust me, by the end of the season, they're going to be a threat. P.S. I know the Bengals aren't doing good this year, laughing my ass off. I have a feeling this year's Mavs are going to look a lot like last year's Mavs. It's going to be more because of health and continuity as opposed to the trade market. But I think they're going to have to go on a run at the tail end of the season. And that's kind of what I expect. I expect them to be one of those teams that wins like.

22 of their last 30 games and goes into the playoffs as a serious threat. They're a team that like, you know, do I think they can win a championship without getting an upper seat? Probably not just because that's what NBA history tells us. But I do view them as a substantial playoff threat and no awkward start is going to change my opinion on that. A lot of this is just Luke has been hurt. He's hurt again.

And Clay Thompson is a different type of piece. A lot of different types of pieces that you're incorporating, which takes time to build that continuity. All right, guys, that's all have for today. I always appreciate you guys for supporting me and supporting the show. We'll be back on Monday with Power Rankings. I will see you guys. The volume.

What's up, guys? As always, I appreciate you for listening to and supporting Hoops tonight. It would actually be really helpful for us if you guys would take a second and leave a rating and a review. As always, I appreciate you guys, I appreciate you guys. It's us and the Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick.

And guess what? We created our own podcast called Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We get to ask people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know.

Tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. on Humor Me with Robert Smygel and Friends, me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to Humor Me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, I'm Deanna Maria Riva, and on my new podcast, How Hard Can It Be? I call on my Gen X squad from Ohio to Hollywood as we navigate Midlife's most fantastic BS. Unfiltered conversations from night sweats to futas to scheduling sex. Wait, what sex? Is it just me or does every woman my age want to look at Pinterest instead of having sex sometimes? They say we can't polish a turd, but we're sure going to try. So let's get blunt with laughs, tears, or tears of laughter.

Listen to How Hard Can It Be with Diana Maria Riva on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast, Point Game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was part of you.

You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis' keep coming to him. He's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball.

So listen to Point Game on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts. Most people out here think that taking care of one another is important. And most people would step up for a neighbor going through a tough time. Most people around here help out friends and family when they need it. But the funny thing is, most of us won't look for help when we need it. Talk to someone if you're struggling with mental health. Because most people out here really care.

Find more information at loveyourmindtay.org. That's loveyourmindtay.org. Brought to you by the Huntsman Mental Health Institute. Institute and the Ad Council. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.