The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hoops Tonight - Reaction to Denver Nuggets beating Miami Heat in NBA Finals Game 4

Episode Date: June 10, 2023

Jason Timpf reacts to the Denver Nuggets taking Game 4 of the NBA Finals vs. the Miami Heat. Jason breaks down Nikola Jokic’s latest performance and what adjustments the Heat can make to bounce back. #volume #herdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque.

Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes.

Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of tauntons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith ruling. of two. Listen to Stuff to Bole Your Mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Volume. All right, welcome to Hoops Tonight here at The Volume. Happy Friday, everybody. Coverage of the NBA Finals here at Hoops Tonight is brought to you by Chase Freedom Unlimited.

How Do You Cash Back? We are also live on Amp. So if you're watching on YouTube or listening on the podcast feed, don't forget that Amp is the very first place that you guys can get these shows. Well, the Denver Nuggets have proven so far through four games that they're are significantly better than the Miami Heat, which I think most of us knew going into the series. I will say, though, I've been really impressed with the job that Miami's done in this series just through everything that makes them great as a basketball team, keeping it competitive and keeping it interesting.

But I do think this thing is over, and I think the Nuggets are going to close this out in five. But I have a lot of stuff that I want to get into because I think this Nuggets team represents the second team in a row of a very good trend for the NBA and the direction that it's heading. I'm excited to dive into that a little bit. You guys know the drill before we get started. Subscribe to the volumes YouTube channel, so you don't miss any more of our videos. Follow me on Twitter at underscore Jason LT,

so you guys don't miss any show announcements. And if for whatever reason you guys miss one of these videos and you can't get back over to YouTube to finish, don't forget you can find them wherever you get your podcasts under hoops tonight. And last but not least, you guys have heard me talk about Game Time, the fastest growing ticketing app in the United States. If you're looking to get out to an NBA game,

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If you're looking to get out to a Stanley Cup finals game, game time's got a deal for you there, concert, anything like that. They're going to take great care of you. You're going to get a great deal. You're going to know exactly what you're getting yourself into. It's super user-friendly. I highly recommend it. So no matter where you live, get out and have some fun this week. Download the GameTime at. Enter your email and redeem code Hoops for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Again, enter your email

and the code Hoops. That's H-O-O-P-S for $20 off. Download game time today. Last-minute tickets, lowest price, guaranteed. All right, so you guys know the drill. When I am covering these series, I love to dive into the nitty-gritty of the adjustments and all of the tactical things that are going on. But I also love big picture NBA basketball. It's kind of what I was raised on. You know, before I started playing the game in college and covering the game and understanding it more on a tactical level,

I was a fan, just like everyone else. And I very much appreciated the history and the narratives and the storylines because that to me is part of what makes basketball great. It's never good when that's all we focus on, when we focus solely on legacy and narrative and drive. that's bad for the game of basketball. But it is an important part. And what it should be is it should be the thing, in my opinion,

it should be the thing that frames what happens on the court, especially after the fact. And so I believe this series is over. We're not going to spend a ton of time talking about tactical adjustments and things like that because I don't think there's much more that Miami can do at this point to get back into this series, especially going on the road into Denver where I expect them to play great and I expect them to close the deal and hoist the Larry O'Brien in front of their home fans.

But I do think that there's a lot of really interesting storylines that have come out of this finals as it has progressed, especially this particular game. Because this was a game where Denver looked like a well-oiled machine. They looked like a team that understood how to play with each other at a level that most teams in the league don't. And I think it's the second team in a row that kind of carries that vibe. and it's a very interesting example to me of what is winning in the modern NBA. And it's kind of to me a logical progression as talent has increased.

As we have more and more talent in the NBA, every team has a good pull-up shooter. Every team has a big slashing wing. Every team has an excellent rim-pressuring guard. You know, like the talent is spread around the league and everybody's got good players. You know, I have a lot of Nuggets fans that are like, you know, that are like, hey, why weren't you saying these things about the Nuggets a couple months ago? And it's like, because coming into this playoff run, it was like, take your pick. I've got the Nuggets, one seat in the West, but I also have the one seat in the East, Janice Antenacupo and the Milwaukee Bucks who won a title and still have largely the same core players and made some improvements on the margins.

I have the Boston Celtics that were two wins away from a title. I have Joel Embed and James Hardin and Tyrese and Tobias. Harris in the Philadelphia 76ers. Obviously this Miami Heat team that we can never take for granted ever again. And even in the Western Conference, it's like you've got an interesting young Memphis Grizzlies team. You've got the Sacramento Kings team that kicked everyone's aster in the regular season. I've got the defending champion Golden State Warriors with the same six players from last year. I've got the Los Angeles Lakers reincarnated with LeBron James and Anthony Davis and good role players. And all of these great teams are in this field. And Denver has risen well

above that pack. And at the beginning of the playoffs, especially given the way that they played over the last one-third of the season, you were lying to yourself if you thought that they were head and shoulders better than everybody because they just hadn't shown it to that point. They have shown it since. And that's a lesson that we've learned. And that's something we're going to take into next season. But what I find is fascinating is what I just listed for you is a bunch of really talented basketball teams, a bunch of teams that have multiple stars, a bunch of teams that have spent draft capital and money and have made trades to bring in star players to fortify their their rosters. And it's funny because as we look back, from right about 2017 to

2021, that five-year stretch there was kind of like an age of mercenary team building, right? Like we saw the Golden State Warriors go sign Kevin Durant outright in free agency, thanks to a cap spike, and immediately win two champions. in a row, just by sheer force of talent acquired in the open market. And then in 2019, we have the Toronto Raptors trade their continuity for Kauai Leonard, who comes into the building, and overnight they become this juggernaut who wins an NBA championship. 2020, the Lakers ship off all their young players, bring back Anthony Davis, immediately win

a championship. 2021, the Bucks make a big trade, a splashy trade for Drew Holiday, and immediately win a championship. So continuity was not what was winning in those years. It was sheer force of talent. But I don't think the league was as deep with talent back then as it is now. And I think that's fundamentally what is different. Now every team has multiple stars. Now every team has a stable of role players.

And so I think the differentiator has become continuity. Because this is back-to-back seasons now, whereas we looked at the playoff fields, the playoff fields were stacked, and it was older teams that had, and I don't mean older by age, but older in construction, that have come together and risen to the top despite not having the overwhelming talent. To be clear, the nuggets are awesome. They have a ton of talent. We're going to talk about their players a lot tonight.

The Golden State Warriors had a ton of talent last year. I'm not trying to sit here and pretend like they were bums winning a championship. That's not the case. but they are not the same type of stacked rosters of like that super team. I hate that word, or that phrase, but that super team type of vibe that we had over the previous half decade. These were more organic basketball teams that were built over years and years and years with slight tweaks on the margins that supported their core players and pushed them over the top.

The 2022 Warriors, for instance, right? It was Steph, Clay, Dremont, but they had a couple of savvy moves post Kevin Durant that brought them, Andrew Wiggins. And there was a rough year in there when they had some supporting players that weren't very complimentary, right? Guys like Kelly Ubra and Cape Bayes more, right? Then they flipped those guys for guys that are more complimentary role players, guys like Gary Payton, right? Guys like Namanya B. Elisa, right? And the Otto Porter Jr., and all of a sudden, it all just clicks together.

And that Steph, Clay, Draymond, continuity carries them over the top as they go up against a young talented Dallas Mavericks team and beat the hell out of them. And they go up against a freakishly talented Boston Celtics team and beat them three times in a row to win an NBA championship with all of the things on the margins that win basketball games and all of the things that are directly associated with continuity. And that's what's gone on with the Denver Nuggets. Like Jamal Murray, Nicola Yokic, Michael Porter Jr., these guys have been in wars. and they made an interesting move after Jeremy Grant left in free agency bringing in

Aaron Gordon to try to fill that specific role. And in a way that was even more complimentary, right? But again, an ancillary piece on the margins to improve the overall compatibility of that roster. And then two really, really smart moves this summer. flipping a guy like Will Barton for Contavius Caldwell Pope, right? And here's the thing, Will Barton's a good basketball player. He's a good basketball player, a solid starting two guard in the NBA. But Contavius Caldwell Pope was a much better fit that had a better big game experience

coming off of that championship around with the 2020 Lakers. Several specific fits with Yokic that made a ton of sense. He is an excellent lock and trail guard, which is super important defensively in drop coverage when you need to keep Nicola Yokic at the basket, right? Excellent transition running guard, right? Which is so important with a guy like Nicola Yokic who can throw outlet passes so well. Offensively, when he needs to create with the ball in his hands, he's great and dribble handoffs and taking and making movement jump shots.

That's a super complimentary piece with Nicola Yokic. That was a really smart move that didn't seem like much, but was obviously going to dramatically improve the roster just sheerly based on fit. And then Bruce Brown, as that guy that could be that athletic guard defender, the guy that could be a guy who brings the ball up the floor with a different type of pace than Jamal Murray because he's more of a like a straight line athlete. How clutch is it that Denver could just give the ball to Bruce Brown

and be like, bring the ball up the floor? Oh, and if you have Duncan Robinson on you and he's, and he's, you know, giving up an angle, just hit the jets and go to the rim. Okay, DeAngelo Russell's on you, just hit the jets and go to the rim. These were little moves on the margins that made a ton of sense. Christian Brown, a rookie that has great physical tools that can play a specific role off of your bench. They are very smartly put together team built in an organic format that allowed the nuggets to capitalize on their continuity. And that's what I enjoy about this, is we're seeing Denver win with the same guys they've had for years,

right after we saw the Warriors win with the same guys they had for years. And instead of trying to trade salary filler for a star, they made small moves on the margins to put it all together. What was so interesting to me about this night in particular was the playmaking down the roster. We talked so much about Yokic, and I'm not going to spend too much time talking about him tonight because I talked about him at length over the course of this series. we had our little four-part bit on what makes him so unstoppable the other night. But it's everyone else that kind of keeps that engine rolling. How many teams have we seen where there's elite playmaking from one specific player

and the rest of the team doesn't move the ball as well? That can be a significant problem, especially in playoff basketball when teams are targeting your weaknesses. Look at the Celtics series for the heat, where Jason Tatum is really the only guy who's a decent playmaker on the roster. you know, other than Marcus Smart or you're not putting the ball in his hands a ton. And so the ball just tends to get stagnant for long stretches. And guys aren't making those quick reads, right? Look at Jamal Murray. 12 more assists tonight.

He's got 42 assists in the series. He had a couple of rough transition sequences where he missed guys, I thought. But in the half court, his playmaking was surgical. And it's been surgical in this entire postseason. He's up over 10 assists a game in the finals, but he's up well over 7 assists a game for the entire playoffs. Contivius Caldwell Pope throwing a beautiful lob from almost half court to Aaron Gordon cutting along the baseline. There was that ridiculous pass from Aaron Gordon as he was on the right wing in the second half when Jamal Murray cuts off of, I think he cut off of a Yokic back screen

and Gorda just threw that like spinning bounce pass that bounced like 20 feet in front of him and just hit Jamal in stride for a basket. All of these guys know how to play together. And they are a old-fashioned basketball team. It's not let's put three stars together in a bunch of veteran minimums and see what happens. No, it's a bunch of really good players that aren't necessarily stars, but are stars in their role. You know, I've gotten into arguments with several people over the course of this playoff run. I do think Jamal Murray's a star, but a lot of the counterpoints are like, hey, it's a lot of it is because he's playing off of Yokic. Okay, fine.

Let's just acknowledge that. it's because he's playing with Yokic. Regardless, he's producing at a superstar level. It's the same thing with Raymond Green. Hey, he's an offensive liability. Okay, fine. If that's what you believe, but within this warrior system, he is a positive offensive player.

It's been on the scoreboard for them every single year. They're better when he's on versus when he's off. So I get in a vacuum for the sake of your legacy debates, If you want to have a specific list based on talent and you want to put Jamal lower for one reason or another, fine, be my guest. But the reality is, is this is a game of basketball. It's not a game of one-on-one. And it's about how you can contribute to a basketball team. And every single one of these guys is contributing to a basketball team at a level far superseding what their actual talent level is.

Aaron Gordon, for instance. Yeah, if he's playing in a bigger crowd, do I expect him to dominate in the post the way that he has? probably not but who cares he's on a team with a bunch of shooting and in his ability to capitalize on mismatches matters yeah we talk all about what he does defensively and he's been excellent defensively in this series we talk a lot about what he does as a cutter off and Nicole yokic i tweeted out tonight and i sincerely believe it i think he's the best behind the head finisher in the game which is seems stupid to say but that's such an important NBA skill when you've got elite passers in front of you in the basket behind you and you need to be able to make eye contact catch

behind your head. But even above and beyond that, he had a much, much smaller offensive role in the Lakers series because the Lakers are huge. But now he's in this Miami Heat series, and there have been two specific stretches, the beginning of game one,

and then the entire night tonight, where his ability to consistently punish mismatches, especially against a heat team that was doing a lot more switching tonight than they did in earlier games in the series. That was a huge advantage. Imagine an Olympics. where doping is not only legal, but encouraged.

It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. is a way. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the big. moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you

need to be. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim?

Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 was big to me, not just because of crows. crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know.

I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah.

For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Everyone has been a star in their role. Even Michael Porter Jr. Rough series. And here's the thing. That's what the Miami Heat are going to do. They're going to identify weakness.

He's one of the younger guys on the team. And right now he's a little one-dimensional. Not great when he puts the ball on the floor, not great defensively. But man, can he shoot the piss out of the basketball? So what have they done? They've stayed glued to him off the ball and they've run him off the three-point line.

And so a lot of his weaknesses have been exposed and his minutes have been cut as a result. It's an important lesson for him, and they're so damn good it doesn't matter. And even then, I thought he was awesome in the Lakers series when they were sending a lot more help at the Murray Yokic two-man game, and he was getting better looks. Everyone has been a star in their role on this particular team. Contavius Caldwell Pope. I told you guys, I loved rooting for him when he was on the Lakers. Back to back, massive stops in the fourth quarter where Jimmy Butler is trying to drive by him and play bully ball,

and he knocks the ball free, and then it gets down on the floor and rips it out of Jimmy's hands. And then he stonewalls Bamana Bio on a post-up. Jeff Green, absolutely awful first shift in the first half, just was giving up back cuts, not paying attention, leaving shooters open. It was rough. Then he comes in in a vitally important stretch. Nicola Yokic picks up his fifth foul and a bullshit flop from Bayam and a bio. Awful call. And so you have to play the majority of the fourth quarter without Nicole Yokic.

Jeff Green's at center. Critical late contest on a Duncan Robinson, on a Duncan Robinson three at the top of the key where he was making a defensive effort he didn't make in the first half. Huge three on that swing back from Jamal Murray and pick and roll out of the left corner. Like you just made plays. Everybody, this is an old-fashioned basketball team. I have thoroughly enjoyed watching them. Again, like I know, I know this is kind of just the nature of the sports media business where, like, I'm expected to make predictions. And then obviously, if I predict against your team, you're going to take it personally.

That's so not the case. I have teams I don't like. Wasn't a huge fan of the Memphis Grizzlies this year. A lot of talk, not a lot of winning in big games, right? Like, not a huge fan of, you know, Joel Embed and his foul gripping. I have things that I don't like. but I love basketball. Like, I honestly do.

I can't put it any more plainly than that. And so guess what? I love the Miami Heat. And I love the Denver Nuggets. And I love watching them play. I've had so much fun diving into the film and going over all of these adjustments. I do root for your team in this, just in an organic sense as a basketball fan.

The only team, like I said, who I had a legit rooting interest for was the Lakers because of LeBron and he's going to retire soon. And so I, again, if it feels like it's late for you Nuggets fans because I was harder on them earlier in the year, it's just because I was giving preferential treatment to teams that had won championships in the past, which will always be the way that I cover the game. And for the record, now that I, God willing, if you guys finish it off on Monday, you're going to be one of those teams that I give that same amount of preferential treatment to or that extra level of respect because I think this is the ultimate achievement in basketball,

should be respected as such. For Heat fans, like, look, I really thought it came down to at the end of the day that they're accepting the fact that there just wasn't enough talent. The one way they were going to win this series is that they got an incredible series out of Jimmy and Bam. And in Game 2, they decided they were going to unleash Jimmy and Bam on the Murray-Yokic two-man game. And they got a lot of stops in Game 2, and they got a lot of stops in the first half of

game 4. But the reality was, it wore them out. neither of them could finish around the rim. Neither of them could make their push shots and their floaters and their hook shots and all those little things that they've been killing teams with throughout the entire postseason because that's what Denver does to you. They did it to Anthony Davis and LeBron. They did it to Kevin Durant and Devin Booker outside of two games.

So that's just what they do. I don't have any sort of adjustment or magic fix for you. The only way you're going to win in Denver on Monday is if, in my opinion, and Denver brings a trash defensive effort, which I don't believe they will, because that's the only way you're going to generate quality shots. I mean, we talked a lot about Denver and everything they did offensively in this game,

but, like, I loved that quote for Mike Malone in the locker room before game four. He's like, no one was talking about it, but defense is why you guys won. And if you guys remember, at least those of you guys are listening to the Amp Show, it got cut off for YouTube, but in the Amps show, when I first talked to Colin, I said everyone's going to talk about the Yokage two-man game game game, but defense was the biggest reason the Nuggets won game three. And it was. This team, what, do they have five steals in the first quarter tonight or five steals in the first 15 minutes or so? They had super active hands. They were flying around in rotation. Their defensive scheme worked to perfection. I think the lesson here, as it pertains to that top 10 defense rule is, look, you have to be a top 10 defense if you're not.

unguarded offensively. NBA history has taught us that. But as long as you defend well enough, the best example I can think of for this particular team is the 2016 cabs where they were just good enough defensively. But Kyrie Irving and LeBron James were operating at an offensive level that was high enough that it made up for that gap.

But I don't see an adjustment available for the heat. The reality is, is they need more talent, they need more size, they need more athleticism. It's been a really fun run. They sure as hell have maximized what this roster is capable of. But this is what happens when you run into a real bona fide NBA championship team, which the Celtics were not, which the Sixers were not, for all of the reasons that we've discussed over the course of the season.

So I'm not going to do a film breakdown tomorrow just because I think this series is over and it's not really necessarily worth the time. I am going on Sunday night with Mr. Chris Manix here at the volume to break down everything that's happened in this series and going into game five. I will rewatch the game and watch the film at some point before then. So at least if there's something interesting that stands out, we can go over it.

But again, I think this thing is over. All right, guys, that is all I have for tonight. I will see you on Sunday night with Chris Manix. And then again, on Monday night after game five. As always, I appreciate you guys, and I will see you then. The Volume. Another podcast from some SNF. late-night comedy guy, not quite.

Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all,

embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun,

thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of tontons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to Stuff to Blow Your Mind on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Yes.

This is an IHeart podcast, guaranteed human.