The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hoops Tonight - Top 25 NBA Players: LeBron James STILL KING for Lakers, buying Kevin Durant & Suns?

Episode Date: August 29, 2024

Jason Timpf continues ranking his Top 25 NBA players with LeBron James and Kevin Durant. Jason discusses how LeBron and KD continue to defy Father Time as the two head into the NBA season fresh off a dominant performance at the 2024 Paris Olympics. Jason breaks down whether he believes in the Lakers and Suns to go on a run through the NBA Playoffs despite disappointing finishes to the 2024 season and later answers listener questions during an NBA Mailbag. Timeline: 4:00 - Introduction 8:00 - #9: Kevin Durant 29:30 - #8: LeBron James 41:00 - NBA Mailbag (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) #Volume #Herd Follow Jason Timpf on social: https://twitter.com/_JasonLT https://www.instagram.com/jtimpf15/See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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slash F.T. Ball. All right, welcome to Hoops tonight here at the Volume. Happy Wednesday, everybody. Hope all of you guys are having a great week so far. We are continuing our player rankings today with number nine and number eight. We also, predictably, whoever we put at number 10 or number 11,

those fan bases were going to be very upset. Got a lot of upset Joelle and B fans, a lot of upset Steph Curry fans. We have a mailbag section at the tail end of the show where I took a bunch of your guys' stuff. I took some specific, well-thought-out basketball arguments against my case. We're going to kind of have a little debate in the mailbag section at the tail end of the show. You guys know the Joe.

Before we get started, subscribe to the Hoops Tonight YouTube channel. So you don't miss any more of our videos. Follow me on Twitter at underscore Jason LT, so you guys don't miss show announcements. Don't forget about our podcast feed wherever you get your podcast on our hoops tonight. Don't forget it's helpful if you leave a rating in a review on that front. And then last but not least, keep dropping mailbag questions in those YouTube comments. So we're going to be using those mailbag questions to do the debate segment at the tail end of the show. So if you disagree with the ranking, make a basketball case.

We'll get into it in the mailbag. All right, let's talk some basketball. So before we go to number nine and number eight, as I've had to continually kind of reiterate, remember the purpose of this list. This is not a who's the best basketball player for a series that starts tomorrow. Obviously, that would look very different. right now. And we're going to make multiple references to this today. But if I was ranking my top five guys to start a series that started tomorrow, LeBron and Steph are both in that top five.

They're probably not above Yokic and Luca for me, but they're in the top five. But I don't have them in the top five because this isn't how this particular list works. The pursuit of an NBA championship is not about a playoff series that starts tomorrow. It's not even about a playoff run that starts tomorrow. You don't get to teleport to June and just play for all the marbles, especially out in the Western Conference, where there's considerably more talent. There are 13 teams that are actively trying to win the title out of the Western Conference, or at least actively trying to make the playoffs.

I'd say 11 probably want to actually legitimately try to win the title, and 13 are trying to make the playoffs. Oklahoma City, Denver, Minnesota, the Clippers, Lakers, Dallas-Massiz. The Mavericks, the Phoenix Suns, the New Orleans Pelicans, the Sacramento Kings, the Golden State Warriors, the Houston Rockets are going to be trying to be trying to win. The Memphis Grizzlies are going to be right back at the top of the conference. And you bet your ass Chris Paul and Victor Wenbino, out in San Antonio are going to be trying to make the playoffs. So again, 11 teams desperately fighting and 13 that are certainly going to think they're going to be a playoff team. Only eight are going to get in.

You have to navigate 82 games from October all the way, potentially. to a seven-game series that starts in June. That's a nine-month span, guys. So to put it simply, who's the best player in a series that starts tomorrow just isn't a realistic way to rank players? Unless the series actually starts tomorrow, which it doesn't. And so LeBron, KD, and Steph are all players that I believe can outplay basically any star in the league in a series except for maybe Luca and Yokic,

and I still think they can go toe to toe with those guys in a series, but all three of those, LeBron, Katie, and Steph do struggle to maintain that level over 82 games at this point, which is something that if you were a GM, and we were doing this actual exercise, meaning like all 450 players are available, we are drafting for this upcoming season, as a GM, you would have to account for that

with the way that you build your roster. So let's keep that in mind as we continue to move forward in this list. Now, why specifically do I have LeBron, KD, and Steph in the order that I have them in on the list? I'm going to get to that when we get to the mailbag. I want to quick run through the numbers for both guys first. So number nine in our player rankings this year goes to Kevin Durant. He had his best regular season since he tore his Achilles. He played in 75 games. Average 27.1 points per game, 6.6 rebounds and 5 assists per game. 2.1 stocks per game. His shooting splits, 52.3% from the field.

41.3% from three. He's actually shot over 40% from three in three of his last four seasons. A bunch of crazy stats today where you're going to see some of these guys showing up. Only two players in the entire NBA last year averaged at least 25 points on at least 50% from the field

and at least 40% from three. And it's the two guys we're talking about today, Kevin Durant and LeBron James. It is still really rare to be as efficient as KD and LeBron were this year. 86% free throws for KD. 58% in effective field goal percentage when you take a field goal percentage and wait it for threes.

63% in true shooting percentage when you add free throws to that equation. This is KD's 12th consecutive season with a true shooting percentage over 60%. Continuing his dominant run is the most efficient volume score in the league. Shooting stats per synergy, 1.11 points per jump shot, 1.24 points per catch and shoot jump shot. That's outstanding. 1.03 points per pull-up jumper. A little lower on the efficiency there. He shoots 48% overall on those pull-up jump shots.

They're just mostly pull-up two, so he doesn't get as much of the additional value from the three-point shot. Did shoot 54% on floaters, but he only made 31 over the whole season, so not super high volume. Shot 72% at the rim, but this is where it gets tricky. Kevin Durant only attempted 2.9 shots per game in the restricted area. 2.9, less than 3. These are some of his forward peers. His peers at the forward position. Janus, 11.7 attempts per game.

LeBron, 7.7. Franz Wagner, 6.3. Pascal Seacom, 5.9. Julius Randall 5.8. Jalen Brown, 5.7. Jason Tatum, 5.4. Palo Bancarro, 5.2. Carl Anthony Towns, another big forward, who primarily operates from the perimeter.

even he gets to the rim, 5.1 times per game. Kyle Kuzma, like Kyle Kuzma gets to the rim 4.8 times per game for restricted area attempts. Kevin Durant is 2.9. So he basically doesn't get to the rim. And this has been a career long thing for him, by the way. His last year in Golden State in 2019, just 3.6, which would have been at the bottom of that list. And his last year in Oklahoma City, going all the way back to before he went to Golden State when he was in his athletic prime, just 4.3 restricted area attempts per game. So that's been a consistent thing with it. Now, to be clear, he's a way better jump shooter than those guys.

But that's the main down mark with KD. He doesn't really have another weakness. He's one of the top tier scores in the league who brings the efficiency to boot. He's a good passer. I don't think he's in that great passer tier, but I think he's a really good passer. He can do the offensive engine thing. This was something that really kind of started to come to the surface in Brooklyn,

if you guys remember. And I did a lot of talking about this when I was covering the league separately from the volume and then even after that when I started with the volume, there was a stretch there where Kevin Durant kind of figured out the Steph Curry thing, which was, you know, Kevin Durant's dominant pull-up shooter, right? We talked about it earlier, a shot almost 50% on pull-up jump shots this season. So what that means is, as he comes off of ball screens, if you do not have a big up at the level of the screen, then KD is going to come off of that and he's going to shoot it and he's going to make it half the time, right? Especially if he gets

a decent screen set. So that puts you in a predicament as the defense where you almost always have to have your big up at the level of the screen. From there, as we've talked about, every time you bring your big up to the level of the screen and whoever's guarding KD is chasing over the top, those two guys are now effectively on the ball. So as your big man kind of slips out of that,

you have a four on three there. And there are all sorts of different reads you can make, right? If they tag that roller, there's a skip pass. If they don't tag the roller, you hit the roller. There's an advantage with KD because he's so damn tall. what a lot of teams will do in those situations and this is something that one of the reasons why Steph over the years has struggled a little bit

with turnovers, he gets these super aggressive coverages, but he's 6'4 3. And it's a little bit harder to get the ball over those traps and over those blitzes and even just a good high hands contest from a big man who comes up to the level of the screen. It can be challenging. Kevin Durant's seven feet tall. So all he has to do and you can see, it's so funny, I watched a bunch of Kevin Durant

pick and roll this morning. And it's something that has always stood out to me as I've watched him over the years. He can kind of take a relatively relaxed approach to pick and roll creation. Because all he really has to do is engage that screen defender by coming off the ball screen. And then you'll see him kind of take a step back and just pick up his dribble and just pop it right over the top to the guy that slip into the rim or throw that skip pass if it's there. And it's because he has that physical gift, that height, to be able to easily see over the top. We talk about this all the time. But when it comes to defense, one of the best ways to give your defense an advantage in

rotation is to either force one a looping pass, meaning like in order to get the ball over the contest, you have to throw it on an arc, which means the ball's in the air longer, which means as your guys are rotating, they have more time to get to their next rotation, or to get a deflection. It doesn't matter how good your four-on-three advantage is if you get a deflection on the pass, and now all of a sudden that pass is going to be bobbled or the offensive player is going to have come back to get it, or hell, maybe even get a force a turnover there. And so that's been a big part of what's made KD such a successful playmaker over the years is he's just become an unbelievable passer in those situations because of his height. It's like unfair. He can just easily

just drop the ball over the top. And so, again, he's one of the top to your scores in the league with the efficiency to bring it. He's a good passer. He can do the offensive engine thing like I just was breaking down for you guys. He can just bring the ball up the floor and get the defense and rotation consistently. He's a very good defensive player both on the ball and off the ball, even if his effort can be inconsistent, which is something that is consistent with this tier of guys here below the top tier superstar tier, but the one down mark, the one thing with KD is he just doesn't really get to the rim. And that really comes down to a couple of different things. I think part of it comes down to just how thin he is. And that manifests in a couple of

different areas, right? Like, for starters, if KD's trying to drive to the basket and someone gives him a little bit of contact, like a forearm or a hip check or something like that, Katie's just more susceptible to getting bumped off of his line because of the fact that he's not bringing a lot of momentum with him because he's not particularly big and strong. And so that just makes it a little bit harder to kind of slide through those gaps. Like take for a counter example, a guy like Janus, he only needs this tiny little gap because he'll do that thing

where he kind of gathers and like chicken wings the hell out of the on-ball defender and then like the two guys are coming over and help and he'll just somehow just bulldoze through the two of them and get all the way to the rim. Like Katie's going to lose a lot of those battles. And that manifests in some other areas too. Like KD defensively is a very useful offball player. It could play passing lanes, very good rim protector on that weak side,

very good low man, very good defensive rebounder. But like he's going to get buried by a post threat, right? Because he's not particularly big and strong. So like he can't do like the Jason Tatum thing where I'm just going to guard the opposing center if that opposing center has any sort of like offensive rebounding chops or post-up chops, right? Like that's going to be something that he struggles with. But that's really the one downside with KD is it's a little thing. which prevents him from getting to the rim

and limits some of his ability to be a switchable defender as it pertains to switching onto centers. But I still think that KD on the ball as an outstanding defender because he can guard guards and wings really well just with his length and his mobility. The second piece of him not getting to the rim is just I think he's picky.

And I think some of this comes down to what's happened after the injury. But the big debt giveaway there is the efficiency. He shoots 72% at the rim. He shoot 72% at the rim because he only goes if it's a pretty damn good opportunity. And so he'll be super efficient, but he doesn't get there a ton.

But again, guys who don't apply a ton of rim pressure, that's always going to be something that I account for just simply because I think there's a ton of advantage there. In terms of collapsing the defense, when a defense really views you as a threat to get to the rim, they're just more likely to pack the paint. The second piece of it is occupying the rim protector. The more times you get to the rim and just shoot shots,

it brings that big man over so that your big man can clean up stuff around the rim. It's an advantage, especially when you've got someone like Yusuf Nerkich, who can do some real damage on the offensive glass. Let's get into some play type data. So Kevin Ryan, in pick and roll, was 87th percentile last year, 560 possessions to be expected as he's sharing that load with Bradley Beale and Devin Booker, but got 1.10 points per possession. That is outstanding. He personally shot 51.4% in pick and roll.

Like we talked about, it shoots 48% on the season on pull-up jump shots. And as we mentioned earlier in detail, his ability to see over the defense and get passes over the top when they bring that second defender, that screen defender, up to the level of the screen. Again, that was a big thing that we started to see from KD in Brooklyn, and it's extended to Phoenix. They do a lot of guard, guard stuff. You'll see them do it sometimes with Grayson Allen.

You'll see them do it sometimes with like Josh Okoji, like where he's more rolling towards the rim. Grayson Allen's more like ghost screens and just popping right back to the three-point line. But even with Nurkich, he'll run up to set the screen and he'll just kind of roll into the lane and then he can make the reads in those four-on-threes. ISO situations, down year for KD. It's kind of an interesting little thing with KD. His efficiency as it pertains to one-on-one basketball actually was low for what we expect from KD,

but then he was outstanding coming off of screens. So as we talked about, 1.10 coming off of on-ball screens, 1.15 points per possession coming off-ball screens. He shot 55% field goals on shots coming off-ball screens. So like when KD has a screen, he's still one of the most deadly scorers in the league. His on an island scoring did go down a level last year, though. He had 429 ISOs, including passes, according to Synergy, got just 388 points out of them. That's 0.9 points per possession.

That's in the 41st percentile. That ranked just 22nd out of 24 players to attempt at least 250 shots out of ISO last year, or 250 possessions, I should say. Just didn't shoot well individually. KD's individual field goal percentage in ISO's last year was just 43.9%, which is obviously down for what we expect, from KD. Post-ups, he was over a point per possession, but not by much. He was at 284 points on 277 post-ups. That comes out to 1.03 points per possession. That's pretty

average. I want to say it's like 48th percentile. That was 12th out of the 18 players to make our high-volume post-up list with 250 reps. So definitely a down year for KD as it pertains to scoring one-on-one like man-up with a defender, but he's still about as good as you'll find in the league, anything coming off of the screen looking to score or coming off of a screen looking to pass, as we saw in the points per possession data. So in summary, Katie has definitely lost some of his athletic juice, and that's manifesting in his really low rim attempts and then just on an island scoring, which has gone down. But he's still one of the most profoundly impactful two-way players we have in the league for

several reasons. One, he's still a deadly efficient score coming off of any kind of screen. Two, he has the size and court vision to torch defenses as a passer coming off of those screens. and when he's engaged, he's an extremely versatile defender both on and off the ball. Most importantly, he fits the criteria of this list very well. I've talked about how this list is kind of a combination of regular season availability and motor, like how often you play at the top of your game in the regular season, two, how well your game translates to the playoffs?

But three, how easy is it to build around you? Again, remember in this thought exercise, we're drafting these guys, but in theory, after we're done, we're going back around and we're drafting other players, right? And so, like, if I had KD as my number one, how would it be to build around him? If I had Joe L. Embed as my number one, how would it be to build around him? And as we've talked about, I find KD to be a much easier player to build around than a Joe L&B. Joe L&B. Joel Embed can only defend in one type of defensive scheme. On offense, he kind of needs everything run through him. He struggles with read and react with lots of other good basketball

players on the floor. I know KD. can be heliocentric. I could ask KD to bring the ball up floor on 25 pick and rolls every single game and to just dominate as a heliocentric. shot creator. He doesn't really play that style, but he could if I needed him to. Katie can also play five out on the ball as the guy who's making the decisions coming off the screens. He can also play five out off the ball, operating more with an advantage. On the defensive end, I can use him in a switching scheme. He could pretty much guard one through four and most fives that aren't superstars, right? You can guard off the ball in a bunch of different contexts, jumping passing lanes more as a guy who's playing above the break. He could play

the low man position. I could use him to blitz. He's, He's got all sorts of length and athleticism to use flashing up high on the ball if we're putting two on the ball. I can just do so much more with KD if I'm building a team around him than I can with someone like Joel Embed. And so that for me is like a great example. Like if I'm looking at those three categories, regular season availability in motor is probably Kevin Durant's biggest weakness

out of those three categories. But he just had a season where he played, what, 75 games? What was the number again? I'm looking at it. 75. So he just played 75 games. So whatever your regular season, season availability concerns are he just had his best season of that since his injury.

Postseason translatability, I actually had, I had a comment yesterday talking about how KD isn't a good playoff player, and I just very much disagree with that. He did have a rough series in 2022 against Boston, but that was literally just four games. Overall, in 31 playoff games, since returning from his Achilles injury, he's averaging 30 points, eight rebounds, and five assists on 61% true shooting. So by any measure, he is still one of the most dependably good playoff players in the league. So again, had a good available regular season last year, although I would argue that's his one main kind of weakness is how consistent can he be in the 82. Postseason translatability, I give him an A.

In versatility, how well he fits alongside other players and how many different schemes he can play in, I'd give him an A plus. I think he's one of the best in the league that plugging into playing in any different basketball circumstances. And even as it pertains to the injuries, they were all regular season injuries. He never missed a playoff game since coming back in 2021. And a lot of them were fluky. Like there was the one weird one where he kind of twisted his ankle in warm-ups. There was the, I think he had two separate instances where someone fell into his knee.

Like just someone fell into his knee. That's not necessarily a durability concern. That's a fluky injury that might happen. So like, again, I understand this for all three guys, for KD, Stefan LeBron, there's going to be a lot of guys talking about like first round sweep or, you know, first round gentleman sweep, or always in the play in or whatever it is, or miss the playoffs and all that kind of stuff. Basketball is a team sport. And these are guys that are playing on rosters that literally do not have good two-way players outside of their stars. And that's just

something as you go up in the league, as you look at Oklahoma City, as you look at Denver, as you look at Boston, as you look at the Knicks. Like all these teams have like four or five role players who are legitimately good on both ends of the floor, which just, makes playing basketball a lot easier and is certainly going to accentuate what stars bring to the table. So like, yeah, Katie was one of those guys. A lot of people had lower on their list. I still think he's firmly in the top 10. I have him at, I have him at number nine in this year's list. Preparing for your upcoming fantasy football draft, do you wish that you could wave a magic wand and somehow know who exactly your league mates are going to take? Well, with draft intel from

fantasy pros, you'll know exactly how your league mates draft better than they. do. Draft Intel will automatically analyze your league's history to see who rushes to the draft board first to take a quarterback, who takes too many rookies, and who is going to reach for their favorite teams players over and over again. Everybody hates a homer and every league has one of them. But right now, you can put all that intel to the test by bringing those patterns directly into a mock draft and make your mock draft feel like the real thing. Check out Fantasypros.com slash volume today to get an edge over your league mates right now and forever. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged.

It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered, competition.

conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clivert Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes.

Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of Tontons and Wampas on the Ice Planet Hot. or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to Stuff to Bole Your Mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim?

Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 was big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack.

So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history.

Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hard Way with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it. And we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch.

Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns, Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on Earth. Are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person. person. Join me, Keir Gaines, as we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood,

pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free iHeartRadio app, search Learn the Hardway, and listen now. Number eight, LeBron James, last year 71 games played, 25.7 points per game, 7.3 rebounds per game, 8.3 assists per game. Here's another crazy stat for you. LeBron James was one of just three players in the entire NBA last year. to average at least 25 points, 7 rebounds, and 7 assists. It was LeBron James, Luca Donchich, Nicola Yokic. That's it in the entire league. The all-around play that LeBron brings to the table is still extremely rare around the league.

1.8 stocks per game is shooting splits. This is insane. 54% from the field, 41% from 3, 75% from the line. That amounts to 60% in effective field goal percentage, and 63% in true shooting. percentage. He's still, even as he's coming into his age 40 season, one of the most efficient volume scores in the league. Only two players in the NBA last year, as we mentioned earlier with Kevin Durant, averaged at least 25 on 50% from the field and 40% from 3. It was Kevin Durant and LeBron James. And the crazy thing is, LeBron got better as the season went along. From

over his last 22 games, and I want to say this was like February 23rd on or something like that, I can't remember the exact number. But over LeBron's last 22 games, he averaged 28 points, eight rebounds and 10 assists on 58% from the field and 45% from 3. 288 in 10 on 67% true shooting.

That's not just, that's not like good for LeBron. That's MVP level production that he put up over the final third of the season or so. And then he followed it up with an impressive series against Denver, 28.7 rebounds, nine assists, 64% true shooting. He also shot four out of five from the field in clutch situations.

Remember, after the Western Conference final sweep, I said the Lakers needed to improve in three areas to surpass Denver. The first two were roster-related. I won't get him to right now, but it had to do with Rob Plink and what he needed to do over the summer. The last one, though, if you guys remember, I said LeBron James and Anthony Davis had to hit jump shots. They had to hit jump shots over the top of the defense to keep up with Yokich and Murray in a

shoot out, especially in crunch time. And LeBron did that. He went in the gym, he figured it out, and he did that. He shot 39% on threes in the series. After getting just 0.86 points per jump shot in the 2023 sweep, he bumped that all the way up to 1.06 points per jump shot. So a massive improvement year-over-year in jump shooting. But the problem was, is those first two roster-related issues just simply were not addressed. So even though LeBron brought the jump shooting, even though LeBron brought the clutch shot

making, it just wasn't enough to make it any more than a competitive five-game loss. And again, that series was closer than it looked. You had two Jamal Murray game winners in that game. That series could have been three, two Lakers very easily if a couple of things go differently. But then LeBron followed that up by winning MVP of the Olympics, by essentially being a Swiss Army knife for them on both ends of the floor. So the point is, LeBron has actually been one of the five best basketball players on the planet since February. I'd argue he's been the third best player.

Behind Yo Kits and Luca, LeBron is the only player that he's been better than everyone else in the league since February except for those two guys. Now, he's lower on this list for the same age-related stuff that we're going to get to shortly, the same stuff that's plaguing everybody that's down on this part of the list. But just make no mistake. LeBron is, there's not many players playing better basketball than LeBron at this point in time. Shooting stats per synergy. 1.11 points per jump shot. 1.27 points per catch-and-shoot jump shot, an outstanding catch-and-shoot season for LeBron. There were 117 players in the league who attempted at least 200 catch-and-shoot jump shots.

LeBron ranked 15th out of those 117 players in catch-and-shoot efficiency. He also got 0.96 points per off the dribble jumper. That was 63rd percentile, so above average. Obviously not as good as his skill-oriented peers. Like I think, if I remember correctly, Katie was at 1.03, and then Steph was at 1.05, so they're both, like, roughly 10 percent better. in that vicinity, then LeBron is a pull-up shooter. But LeBron had a, I say 10% relative, not 10% in percentage. But LeBron's still an above-average pull-up jump shooter.

44% on floaters, 47% on hooks. This is an interesting piece, though. LeBron, 67% at the rim. Now, that's still outstanding. That's 83rd percentile, but this is an interesting trend to keep an eye on with LeBron. He is starting to trend down in that department. 67% at the room this year. 69% at the rim the year before, 71% at the rim the year before that, and 72% at the rim the year before that.

So we've seen a steady kind of like trending down very slightly in LeBron's rim finishing. And that's a big part of why this late career jump shooting surge that he's having is so important for him. Playmaking stuff with LeBron. Pick and roll. 1.06 points per possession, which is in the 80th percentile. That's very good. However, just 727 possessions, so he didn't make our high volume list, but that's to be expected. He's sharing touches, kind of similar to KD with Booker and Beal.

LeBron's sharing pick and roll touches with DeLo and Austin Reeves. But he was, again, in the 80th percentile for pick and roll. ISO, similar to KD, not too great of a season, 0.97 points per possession on 328 reps. Only three spots ahead of where KD was in that high volume list. LeBron ranked 19th out of 24 players to attempt at least 250. However, in the post, LeBron James was the second best high-volume post player in the entire NBA last year. He ran 291 post-ups, got 1.12 points per possession, including passes. Only Nicola Yokic was better out of the 18 players to run at least 250 post-ups.

So LeBron, still absolutely dominant with his back to the basket when he can bully players towards the rim and play make out of that as teams send multiple defenders. There are two weaknesses with LeBron that I want to call attention to. One, he can be one of the most inconsistent effort guys in the regular season among the stars. That's to be expected. He turns 40, four months from today. But it's a reality when you're trying to build a roster around him, right? Just like I was talking about KD. So on defense, the main area you'll see that manifest with LeBron.

He's him just, he has a very important job within the Laker defense. He's typically the low man. That means AD is typically coming up higher to the level of the screen. LeBron is the guy kind of filling in behind him to tag the roller, contest shots at the rim, get defensive rebounds, and close out to the weak side. That is an incredibly important job on the defense. If you were ranking the roles on defense, obviously on the ball and your pick and roll defender are probably your two most important, but that next most important role is that low man position.

And so when LeBron's being lazy down there, when he's letting roll men catch and fit, You will see dozens of times this year. LeBron will just let someone catch on the roll and dunk because he just doesn't feel like making the rotation. Right? So that's part of it. Not fighting for defensive rebounds, that kind of thing. You're going to see, he'll always lock in and do it in crunch time

or whenever the team needs to go on a run or something like that. But he will have extended stretches during the course of the regular season where he just doesn't really try that hard on the defensive end of the floor. I still think LeBron is one of the better defenders in the league when he's trying. He just, you're only going to see that big time. moments, big time national TV games, and like playoff games. That's pretty much it at this phase of his career. On offense, where you see that laziness manifest is how physically aggressive he's being towards the rim. One, being willing to post up. Two, being willing to drive hard

in isolation situations. The big one you'll see three is lazy playmaking in ball screens. As I've talked about a lot, in order to get an opening for to make a play as a passer in ball screens, you have to engage that screen defender by getting downhill or by being deadly. enough as a shooter that he has to come up. You have to make him guard you. If you do not make him guard you and he can drop back, there's not going to be anything open. And you'll see LeBron a lot in the regular season, kind of dribble

off picks lazy and just try to like jam a pocket pass in there that's not open or throw a skip pass to a guy who's guarded and so I'll have to put it really high and then the guy will have to jump way back on his heels to grab it and the advantage is gone, right? Or there was no advantage to begin with. And so, like, there are

definitely some things with LeBron where he can be lazy in the regular season. He's He's simply not as good as his younger peers, the guys who were in their 20s, at just carrying the load time and time again over an 82 game season. That is something you have to account for when you're building a roster around him when the season starts in October. The second piece of it. Even within the playoff context, when LeBron is engaged,

he's not as good at doing everything as he was when he was younger in terms of energy resources. He does seem to get a little fatigue. A couple of examples. Game one against Denver in the third quarter. He had a stretch like I described just a second ago where he got lazy with the ball as a playmaker because he was tired. Had a couple of bad turnovers. It sparked a Denver run. Game five against Denver. They win that game. If LeBron secures a defensive rebound against Aaron Gordon where he had inside position. Now LeBron has been one of the best defensive rebounding forwards in the league for a long time. This is something he used to literally never lose. He never used to lose rebounding battles like that. The reason why he did is because he was doing so much, and at this phase in his career, he still is susceptible to a little bit of fatigue, and he lost a physical battle that he doesn't typically lose.

And so, again, I thought he was mostly magnificent in that series outside of those sorts of things. But the point is, in order to get the most out of LeBron James, you need to surround him with enough support for him to be able to conserve energy and pick his spots. because when he engages himself, he's still one of the very best players in the world, but he can't be consistently engaged

without running into fatigue-related issues. And so again, in the regular season, it's more just like conserving energy in the playoffs. It's like he legitimately can run out of energy sometimes. But if I were drafted, like, it's just something that I'd have to account for if I was a GM and I was drafting a team. Now, if we tweaked the rules,

If I were drafting players for a playoff series, just a playoff series, not a season, but a playoff series that started tomorrow. Nicole Yokic and Luca Danchich are the only two players that I'd take over LeBron. That's how insane of a high level he's been playing at since February. He's still one of the top-tier shot creators in the league in both volume and efficiency. As we know, there just aren't many players who can give you 25 points and 8 assists a game. Yokic, Luca, and Trey Young were the only other guys in the league. league last year other than LeBron to give you 25 points and 8 assists. That's how rare that is still

in this league. In LeBron, when he's engaged, is a much better defender than all of those guys. And that's why I have him that high. I'd have him third if I just needed to win a series that starts tomorrow. But he requires a great deal of support in the regular season and can't quite scale up his athleticism in the postseason like he used to, which makes the job of building around him a little bit tougher than it was when he was in his prime and certainly tougher than some of the guys that are above him on this list. So for a list like this, I feel like number eight is the right spot for LeBron James. On to our mailback. Here's our first question. This one is not necessarily a question, just an opportunity to

kind of talk a little bit about the ranking. So what is my rationale for putting LeBron 8, KD9, Steph 10? Why did I have him ranked in that order? Now, mind you, I have them miniscually separated. They're not, this is not tiers of players. They're all jammed up with each other, right? As I've said multiple times, from five to 11, they're all right next to each other, in my opinion. The tiers are more indicated as a separation in level of play.

So here's the deal. Steph was a clear third place for me. In addition to missing the playoffs, even if we all agree that it mostly had to do with the roster, Steph just didn't play well to end the season. Post All-Star break, Steph Curry, 23 points, five rebounds, five assists, 57% true shooting. LeBron James, 28 points, 8 rebounds, 10 assists, 67% true shooting.

Like, that's just a simple example to show you guys the giant chasm in the level of play between those two guys. 10 percentage points in true shooting, 10 additional assists, three additional rebounds, five additional points every game. Katie and LeBron both are just simply playing at a higher level. than Steph. Now, I understand Steph had two really good games at the end of the Olympics. And I personally am really excited about that, and it's a big part of why I think he's going to have a bounce back year.

But I can't just take those two games to erase months of additional evidence that Katie and LeBron are just playing at a higher level right now. And then between Katie and LeBron, I thought LeBron was clearly at the higher level among the three for all the reasons that I just broke down in the two breakdowns that I did. So that naturally left Katie in the middle.

So, like, again, I thought the LeBron, Katie, Steph in that order was pretty straightforward. Had a bunch of Steph-related questions. So let's get into some of those right now. You're entitled to your opinion, but having Steph Curry below Anthony Davis, K.D. or Anthony Edwards at this point in their careers is blasphemous. AD cannot, I repeat, cannot be a number one option on a championship team.

He is probably the best defender in the league, but he's insanely limited on office. If your list is just based on October through June, picking the best player for your team, you really taking AD over Steph sounds a bit like Lakers fan biased to me coming from a Lakers fan myself. Ant is still way too raw to be taken over Curry

and KD's team underachives time and time again despite him really being a plug-and-play masterpiece of a player. It's just that, you know, you can't count on him being that alpha dog and Steph is just a killer. One could even argue that Tatum should be below Curry too, but defensive versatility, age, availability, and champ status certainly given the case to be above. But again, are you really taking Tatum over your number one guy

as your number one guy over Steph Rigg and Curry, nah. As for Embed, I don't have a problem with him at 11. He's an overhyped crybaby that's always hurt, always soaking, foul grifting, and just looking for a whistle if he can't assert physical dominance or if his jumper isn't falling. Way too one-dimensional, way too fragile, way too mentally weak to take for an 82 game run,

especially deep in the playoffs when his parlor tricks stop working with the refs. I'd take any of these top 10 guys over him any day of the week. Awesome show, brother, keep up the good work, and keep creating a platform for us hoop lovers to talk real basketball, unbiased and educated based on arguments and facts, not just blatant smack talk, fan-girling, and personal preference slash opinion. Thank you for taking the time to break down your basketball case. Thanks for supporting the show.

One of my favorite things about what we do here at Hoops Tonight is make just a community for Hoopers to hang out and talk basketball. So that means a lot to me that you guys see it that way. I'll go kind of down the list. So the first comment you made about Anthony Davis saying that he's insanely limited on offense. I kind of disagree with that. First of all, we know AD can be the best player on a championship team because Tatum just did it. So, like, you certainly can build a championship roster around Anthony Davis. You just probably would need a little more help than some of the

guys that are above him, right? As far as the offense thing, like, yeah, I think Tatum had a, or I think Anthony Davis had a rough series two years ago, the Western Conference final series. I thought Yokic kicked his ass. I thought AD kind of went out soft. Like, I didn't think he fought hard enough in that circumstance. Like, I think he kind of let Yokic walk all over him. But if you just kind of pull that specific series out, he's been an incredible playoff player outside of that. He just averaged 28 points per game in the playoffs against Denver. He was straight up barbecuing Yokic in one-on-one. He ran 34 ISOs and post-ups in the series and got 40 points. That's 1.18 points per possession, which is literally amazing. And I mean,

we got like obviously the 2022, 2021 seasons he was hurt, but it's like 2020, best player. not best player, but like just as good as LeBron. Like I had LeBron won in 84 after that playoff run. So like 80 was basically at LeBron's level for a title run and was an incredible offensive player and an incredible defensive player. And then I want to say he had 13 playoff games before 2020 and he averaged like 31 points and 13 rebounds a game. So like the idea that he's an insanely limited offensive player is just something that

I would disagree with. He just had a really rough offensive series against Denver two years ago when they faced in the Western Conference finals. Now, is he as good offensively as some of the other superstars in the league? No, but he's still an insanely good offensive player. And here's the other thing, too. Even beyond the on-ball stuff, I think it's unfair if we give Yokic a ton of bonus points for being this deadly role man who catches on the role with Jamal Murray

and hits those floaters in the lane. And there's no doubt that Yokic is probably the best at that, and he's certainly better than A.D. But A.D. is also one of the best role men in the league. And he's a huge part of what makes the Laker pick and roll attack so deadly, because he can short roll and make floaters, right? Or you can short roll to the foul line and catch and make quick ISO moves out the catch. He can roll a little bit further into the lane to make floaters, right?

Or quick dribble moves into hook shots. He can also roll hard to the rim, and he brings vertical gravity, like the actual spacing to be able to throw lob passes to him. Like, AD is a far more useful offensive player than I think people give him credit for. As for Kevin Durant Anthony Edwards, Without getting into all the individual comparisons, here's what I'll say. Remember that if I said everyone is healthy in the series of starting tomorrow, I'm doing a different list.

As I mentioned earlier, I'm going Yokic and Luca, and then I have LeBron three. Steph's probably four for me on that list. So when everyone's healthy, I do think Steph is a better player than it. I do think Steph is a better player than KD. I do think Steph is a better player than AD. But the point is, Steph hasn't been playing at that level. as of late. Here's a simple

stat to break this down. Steph, in his last 19 games to end last year, failed to reach 25 points in nine of them. Think about that. When they desperately needed him to score, because they don't have much offensive talent, he couldn't even get to 25 points in half

the games over the final fourth of the season. I am genuinely, sincerely rooting for Steph to have a bounce back year, and I believe he will. But it's all theoretical at this point, which makes him a riskier pick, which puts him lower on this type of list. As far as the Embed piece goes, I'm actually surprised at how many people kind of agreed with me.

There are obviously some pissed off Sixers fans that was to be expected, but it seems to me like most of the other people, at least maybe not as far down as 11, but at least agree that MB can't be on that top tier superstar list anymore when you're factoring in all of his physical limitations in terms of health and his inability to impact winning as as well as he does in the regular season when he gets to the post. And the thing with MB2 is now he's over 30, so it's not like the health issues are going to get better for him at this point. Putting together a top 25 list is tough work,

considering all the talent in the league, so I commend you doing the work and sharing with the viewers. If your criteria for the list is based on who you would pick for an 82-game season out of a vacuum, it doesn't make sense to put Curry at 10, considering the lack of help on his team was directly responsible for the efficiency slumps this past year. When you put Curry on an all-star team or an Olympic roster, or even when his team plays like above-average NBA players,

a la la la the 2022 playoffs, he is clearly an MVP candidate, even in this late stage of his career. An important note about Steph's game is the attention he demands when he's on the floor, which cannot be quantified from counting stats since he's arguably the most heavily guarded player in NBA history. Put Shea on the Warriors,

and I would argue they don't even sniff a play-in spot in the Stacked Western Conference. Having won the chip only two years ago over a better team holds far more weight than Aunt or Shea, who are projected to have better seasons, neither of which are guarded. like Steph. So here's the thing. As far as I agree that that the Warriors are extremely limited in terms of personnel. And I also

agree that that made things harder for Steph. Here's where it's different, though. The 2021 team was very limited as well. They had no Clay Thompson, if you remember. They had funky role players, guys like Kelly Ubrae Jr. and Brad Wanamaker and Kent Baysmore. And yet in that season, Steph averaged 32 points per game on 66% true shooting. He had 26 games with at least 35 points. He wasn't even close to that level this year. So, like, if your case is, Steph is still awesome, he just has a bad team. What happened in 2021? Like, that's where I have an issue. And that team had the exact same issue. Made it to the play in, got eliminated in the playing tournament. And so, yeah, like, I sympathize with Steph for the

plight. And I do believe he still has the ability to get to a top 10 level this year, which is why I put him in the 10 and I expect him to bounce back. But he was down in every major statistical category last year and was tailing off at the tail end of the season. So, again, as I mentioned, big game tomorrow night. Give me Steph as the fourth best player in the league. But that's not the reality of this season. There's a great deal of risk involved with Steph being your foundational piece for this season.

Therefore, I had him at 10 for the sake of the way this list works. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds.

I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions,

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Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics

from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of tontons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the IHeart Radio app, podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking.

What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack all day, but just so y'all know.

I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history.

Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kier Games. And in recognition of Mental Health Awareness Month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests. I'm talking, Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we

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on my new podcast. Learn the hard way. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Search Learn the hard way and listen now. I'm shocked. Curry is this low. I understand why because he had a down year because he's old.

But man, I might be biased as a Warriors diehard, but I don't know how you could watch the metal rounds in the Olympics and not feel like Steph is one of the five best players in the world. Here's the thing. The metal rounds are a big source of optimism for me as well, but two games when the chips are down,

that falls into what I was talking about earlier. Yeah, you're right. Two games, chips are down? I think Steph is the fourth best player. in the world. But this isn't two games where the chips are down. This is 82 games and four series spanning nine months, totally different type of criteria. Here's another Steph one, a bunch of them, but I promise we get into some other stuff. Hey, Jason, I've agreed for the most part so far in your rankings. However, Steph's ranking is the first time I strongly disagree with your ranking,

and I'm a non-warriers fan, by the way. You begin your argument by referring to Steph's extended slump to end the regular season and through the majority of the Olympics. I think this is fair criticism. However, I would argue Tatum's slump is equally as bad, if not worse, than Steph's, and therefore should be ranked lower than Steph in the rankings. I believe the main factor in this argument is their scenarios. Steph was dealing with unideal situations in Golden State, unlike Draymond's. Excuse me.

Steph was dealing with unideal situations in Golden State like Draymond's emotional immaturity, Clay's frustrations, tons of lineup changes, roster injuries, etc. Meanwhile, Tatum was operating on the most talented roster in the league. I don't think it's fair to drop Steph this far below the environment he was working in. Besides that, Curry is still a much better half-court shot maker than Tatum, which is your main factor when making this list. Not just as an on-ball creator, but there is off-ball ability. The amount of quality shots he generates for his team simply by existing in the half-court

greatly exceeds anything that Tatum showed during the playoffs in the last half of the year. I'd also argue for Curry above Ant and AD for the same reason, although the Tatum comparison is my primary reason for commenting. Love the show. Thanks for supporting the show. I mean, it means a lot to me. So a couple things. Tatum slump's a little different.

Tatum is a in his prime athlete who's in a jump shooting slump. Steph Curry declined in every single phase of the game last year, including the defensive end of the floor, including just his ability to get separation from defenders, all that kind of stuff. So it's not necessarily the same to me. I will admit that I, ranked Tatum under the impression that his shot is going to come back around.

Because again, over a large sample in his career, he's been a good jump shooter. He's had a bad jump shooting stretch. I mean, we've had our criticism with Tatum in terms of off the dribble shooting, but he should still be a much, much better catch and shoot player than he has been. He's just been in a slump. But again, it's a little different when you're Tatum's age. You're in your late 20s, you're in your prime. I would be shocked if Tatum didn't come into next season with a revant,

jump shot ready to go. But like the bottom, let's just take Tatum for an example as what I mean when I talked about the value over the 82. Okay. Let's say I drafted Tatum because I had, you know, the pick that I have Tatum ranked at, which I'm not going to reveal yet. But let's say I drafted Tatum. I'm going to get 75 games out of him. Like he's going to play 75 games, or at least around there. I think he played 74 the last two years, right? So like, going to play mid-70s in games. He's going to bring motor every single night. he's in his 20s and he's just young and, you know, he just has a lot of that youthful exuberance, right? He's going to play hard. We're going to get the better version of Tatum, the vast majority of

nights. Three, he's going to be a foundational piece to my defense and rebounding backline. I'm going to be able to use him to guard star forwards if I need to. I'm going to be able to use him to guard guards even if I need to. I'm going to be able to use him to guard centers if I want to, just like Boston did through their entire playoff run. I can use him as the low man if I need to. I could count on him to help secure the defensive rebounding part of my defensive backline. That's a huge asset to me as I'm building a team around him. Four, he's going to give me somewhere between 27 and 30 points per game. That's basically guaranteed.

He's going to give me eight or nine rebounds. That's basically guaranteed. He's going to give me five plus assists. It's a super safe bet. If I take Tatum, I know what I'm getting from October. all the way to June. If I take Steph, there's two versions of that story. There's everything somehow breaks right and he gets back to form and he stays healthy and I get superstar Steph and yeah, you're damn right. That's a better player. Put it simply,

guys, like basketball is a team sport. If I put Steph on the Boston Celtics for Jason Tatum, the Celtics are winning the title again. So like, yeah, I'm not debating that Tatum's had it easy. Of course he has. He's flat out had it easy. Yeah, the easiest title run I've seen from a star in a very long time. Right? So, like, I'm not trying to debate that, but we're looking at these guys in a vacuum. If I was drafting players at Tatum's age,

I know I'm getting 75 games, I know I'm getting high motor, I'm getting excellent defense and rebounding, and I'm getting 27 and 5, at least, in terms of points and assists. He is a super safe bet. And so, in this list, that has a very, very tight grouping

from 5 to 11, I'm giving Tatum a slight edge for the 82. Now, to be clear, if I had to win a single game tomorrow or a single series tomorrow, give me Steph over Tatum 100 out of 100 times. I do not think Tatum is better at basketball than Steph. I just think he's younger and healthier and more likely to provide more winning impact over a nine-month span or anything can happen. And I know I've explained that a hundred times during this list, but I just feel like I need to hammer that home.

The rankings are not important. Basketball talk is the only thing that matters. It's our next comment. Amen. We do this to kill time in the summer and to give us something to argue about. But in the words of Kevin Durant, when October comes around, it's checkball, and we're playing basketball. And everyone's zero and zero.

And every player's averaging zero point zero rebound, zero assists. Let's see what everyone can do. If I have Steph at 10 and I'm actively rooting for him to bounce back, that has no bearing on what actually is going to happen for the Warriors this year, and we're going to cover it thoroughly. This is what we do during the summer, but what I love to do, my favorite thing about this show is to talk about basketball games. It's why I was so thankful for those Team USA games this summer.

How great was that that we got another couple dozen games between Team USA and some of the other teams that we covered to just talk about basketball? actual basketball games that are actually happening. And so I appreciated that comment because that is the truth. The rankings are not important. The basketball talk. Well, I would just remove talk from that. Just say, the basketball is the only thing that matters.

And that's what I love to talk about the most. And that's what we're going to do literally here in less than two months. Can you believe that? We're less than two months away. We are one month away from training camp, guys. It's right around the corner. Next question, or I should say comment. You all have to understand this is a business.

having Curry at 10 is going to get him a lot of clicks and engagement. He knows Curry is top five at worst. This is just silly. I mean, the Warriors are probably still our largest fan base within the Hoops Tonight community. We have some big ones, right? Like we have a lot of Laker fans, a lot of Denver Nugget fans, a lot of Dallas Mavericks fans, a lot of Boston Celtics fans. We've built up certain fan bases that we have a good chunk of that follow our show.

But I still think the Warriors are the largest fan base that we have. And a big part of that is Steph. Steph's one of the most popular players in the world. But, like, I would have gotten more views by putting Steph number one. That's what would have gotten views. But it's legitimately hard for me to do this and, and to, like, to actually put these guys in the right spot. And I'm working really hard to follow my own criteria. It was tough for me to put KD, Steph, and LeBron as low as I did.

But I'm not here to propagandize. I'm not here to lie and say things I don't believe for clicks. That's not even how it works. I put KD. Stefan LeBron where I would draft them in a snake draft style or a snake draft doesn't even, it's not even relevant, but just in a straight up draft between 25 teams starting with all 450 players just to start a franchise with. That's the entire purpose of it only for this upcoming season from October to June. I put Steph at 10 because I view him as the,

the 10th safest bet to build a franchise around for this upcoming season for 82 games and 4 series. Dude is saying, I still think he's top 10 like that's a compliment. It is a compliment. Steph didn't play at a top 10 level last year. Steph did not have a top 10 season last year by any measure. Guys like Donovan Mitchell had a better season. Guys like Jalen Brunson had a better season.

Like there are a lot of players that had better seasons than Steph Curry last year. I'm giving him top 10 as a. a payment of respect to what I believe he is capable of on a better roster and because I think he's going to bounce back. I'm projecting a better season from Steph next year. That's why I haven't met number 10. He requires a ton of regular season support as well as postseason support. Who are you talking about, Tatum or Embed?

And you got Tatum higher, that's comedy. So, in my opinion, Tatum is the far more available regular season player, and he's actually been a better playoff player than Embeddie. including out playing him head to head. Specifically in Game 7, a few years back, he exposed one of Embed's biggest weaknesses that we talked about on this show, his ability to come out and guard in space,

either switching in pick and roll or coming up to the level of the screen. Tatum was just repeatedly torching him in that game 7. So putting Tatum over Embed was a very easy decision for me. He's a more available regular season player, and he's been a better postseason player in his career. That was just a no-brainer for me.

Here's another basketball case from somebody, as it associates to Embed specifically with regard to Anthony Davis. Hey, Jason, love the video. I know you haven't released AD's ranking, but here's a basketball reason why I'm taking Embed over Anthony Davis. First, both players have struggled with injuries. I know AD has been more durable than Embed in the past two years, but it's undeniable that if you're concerned about, that you're concerned with both long-term health in any given season, so durability is mostly a wash between these two players. Second, I think Embed's playoff struggles are almost exclusively due to injury, whereas AD's playoff struggles post-2020 have been consistency and mentality-related. Especially

against Yokich in the last couple of playoff runs, AD would have 30 plus points one night and then 15 or 16 the next night even though he wasn't injured. Commentators often lament during games how AD seems to be out of it and not being aggressive, which is never a problem for Embed. AD post-2020 has not been that great of a playoff performer

in my view, at least not good enough for the Lakers to beat Denver. Finally, and most importantly, Embed eats AD's lunch every time they play. Yes, it's regular season, but Embed is 7 and 1 against AD in their last two matchups. Embed had 38 and 12 and a 30-point triple double on 75% and 60% shooting respectively. AD's best case for being higher than Embed is he's a much better defender than Embed.

The fact that his superior defense doesn't affect Embedd when they play is evidence to me that Embedd is a full tier above AD as a player. Appreciate the content, and I'm looking forward to the rest of the rankings. Again, thank you for taking the time to break down your basketball case, and thank you for supporting the show. It means a lot to me. So starting with injury risk, I disagree there. I don't think it's a wash between both players.

AD has had some health concerns, particularly in the 2021 and 2022 seasons, but he's been good since then. And I actually think it's far more likely that Embed has a health-related issue this year than AD. Now, obviously, anything can happen, and we'll see. But my read on things is like Embed is a guy that, like, it almost feels like a certainty that he'll break down, whereas AD it feels like it's a maybe. and so I don't think that they're on the same tier, although I agree with you that both of them do have some health concerns.

I just think it's Embed to a larger extent. As I mentioned earlier, AD did have a rough series in 2023 against Denver. There's no question about it. And I was very critical of him after that series. But he's been literally awesome in every playoff run outside of that. Even just before that series, like before the Denver series where they got swept,

AD was like so good defensively in the Golden State Warriors series. series that every adjustment that both teams was making, it was geared around the Warriors trying to avoid AD and the Lakers trying to keep AD in the action. That's how dominant he was defensively in that playoff run. He was the best player on the Lakers because LeBron wasn't as good. He was playing with that hurt foot, if you remember, during that playoff run. So, like, he was awesome in the playoff run before the Nuggett series. Then this past year, I thought he basically played Yokic to a draw.

He averaged 28 points and 16 rebounds. like straight up fried Nicole Yokic one-on-one. Then again, obviously hurt 2021 and 2022, but 2020, incredible both ends of the floor. They win the title. First 13 playoff games before 2020, you average 31 and 13. So, like, I think AD's playoff resume

is substantially better than NBEats. Just flat out, bar none. I don't think it's close, to be honest. And to put it more aggressively, I just think AD is a better basketball player in that setting because he's so good defensively, because he thrives in rock fights, because he can win when things get ugly,

because his impact on winning is not tied to whether or not he's getting to the foul line or knocking down his jump shot. Now, here's the thing. Everything with Embedit is theoretical. He has a remarkably dominant level that he can get to. He certainly had remarkably dominant regular seasons that have eclipsed what AD has done in the regular season. But we can keep imagining that all,

coming together all we want. We can imagine M.B. Just wrecking ball everybody through the playoffs. Hell, I've been imagining it. We talked about it on the show. But for whatever reason, that has never actually materialized. And then the last piece of it, to the big piece of our criteria,

that, like, versatility, how easy it is to build around you. AD is much easier to build around. He's a prototypical five-out big man who excels as a role man as a screening and rolling into space as a score with and without the ball. He plays really well alongside other stars. He doesn't require the ball to be in his hands all the time. And he's the best defensive player in the world

that can defend in any scheme that you want him to defend it. Deep drop, you know, catch hedge, up at the level, blitzing, switching. He can do it all. So, like, that's the thing. Like, there's no doubt that Embed's ceiling is higher than AD. That just goes without saying. But Embed just can't get there often enough.

and when things get to those higher levels, AD has just played at a much higher level far more consistently than MB. And again, like, yes, he has some offensive limitations, but in the regular season even, as I'm drafting players, if I draft AD, you know how much easier everything else gets for me at that point? Look at the Lakers' defense.

They were playing literally, like, Austin Reeves, an average defensive player, Dilo, a bad defensive player, Rui Hachamura, a bad defense. defensive player, LeBron James, good defense player when he's trying, most of the time he's not trying, and AD anchors it all, and just hides them all. That's a huge asset to a general manager. Yeah, so, like, yeah, the, again, it's hard to do this kind of thing, guys. It really is. It's painstaking. Let's just say, let's say the two guys that everyone kept throwing out today.

I would have put aunt at 11 and 80 at 10. You don't think Minnesota Timberwolves fans are going to be crying to me nonstop about how Anthony Edwards, average 28 points on 60% true shooting in the playoffs and like eliminated the defending champs. Straight up alpha-dogged everybody on the Phoenix Suns and got within three wins of the NBA finals. You don't think I'm going to have people crying about that. Anthony Davis, he was what, the fourth best player on the Olympic team,

the fifth best player on the Olympic team. He is the best defensive player in the world. Just played Nicola Yokic to pretty much even in that, The differentiators in that series were like Michael Porter Jr. And the fact that Rui was terrible. Like they're like the sweet, LeBron and AD went, LeBron and AD outplayed Murray and Yokic in that series and they lost a series in five.

Because LeBron outplayed Jamal Murray. It just Jamal Murray hit two big shots. And Michael Porter Jr. made everything he got his hands on. And Aaron Gordon had a dominant game three and the Lakers just got no contributions from role players outside of Austin Reeves. And like, and again, like, if I would have put AD at 10, it just would have been an issue. It would have just been a whole other issue.

And that's the thing. There was no version of this top 11 that wasn't going to piss people off. But at the end of the day, all I can do is kind of give you guys my reasoning and hear you guys out when you disagree and we can go from there. But as I'm going to reread this comment from earlier, as the gentlemen shared earlier, the rankings are not important. Basketball is the only thing that matters. All right, guys, that is all I have for today.

As always, I sincerely appreciate you guys for supporting the show. We'll be back on Friday with no. Number seven and number six. I will see you guys then. The volume. The NFL seasons right around the corner. We'll be breaking down all the off-season storylines on the Colin Cowherd podcast. My best takes.

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