The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hoops Tonight X Nerd Sesh - 5 Big NBA Questions: Warriors surging, Celtics vs. field, Trae Young to Lakers?

Episode Date: February 17, 2024

Jason Timpf is joined by Carson Breber and Logan Camden from  @Nerd_Sesh  to discuss all things NBA as we head into NBA All-Star Weekend. The guys discuss Steph Curry and the Golden State Warriors getting hot at the right time, and how they can still be a threat to Nikola Jokic and the Denver Nuggets in the Western Conference. The guys then dive into the East as Jayson Tatum and the Boston Celtics have been dominant to this point, and should walk straight through the Eastern Conference, and anything short of an NBA Finals appearance would be viewed as a failure. Last, can the Oklahoma City Thunder or the Minnesota Timberwolves make a run in the yet despite being two of the youngest teams in the league? #volume #herdSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Happy Friday, everybody. Hope all of you guys had an incredible week. Here's a quick breakdown of how the All-Star break is going to go. Today we have the NerdSash guys coming on. We're going to do some big picture NBA questions. I got five of them. We're going to hit some contenders. We're going to talk about duos.

We're going to rank the duos around the NBA. We're going to talk about the top three picks in last year's draft. A little bit of a rookie check-in. Something we haven't done yet this year. It's going to be a lot of fun. And then next week, early in the week, I plan on having Sam Vassini on the show. We're going to go contender by contender and do a deep dive on every single one of them, basically like a two-thirds of the way through the season type of check-in.

And then we'll do one more power rankings video and one more mailbag before we go live on Thursday night after Warriors Lakers. So make sure in this video and in any of the breakout clips and stuff that we release, drop as many mailback questions as you can because we'll get one more. more in before the end of the week next week. So with the NerdSesh guys, Logan and Carson, we're going to start with a big picture question about the Eastern Conference. So we're going to start with you, Carson. So the Bucks are three and seven since Stock Rivers took over.

The Sixers are three and seven in their last 10 games. Obviously injuries have played a huge role there. The Miami Heat are basically all of their top tier athletes, except for Bamatabio, are currently hurt. The New York Knicks entire front line is currently hurt. Literally, they're starting three, four, and five are all out. And so they've been looking pretty rough as of late. The Pacers and Cavs have like some exciting talent. Obviously, the Pacers haven't been able to really play that well with Seacquam in the lineup yet. I think a big part of that is Tyrese Halliburton is still struggling to come back from his injury. He hasn't looked to that good. But the calves are

winning a ton of games, but they don't really check a lot of boxes that you'd expect to see among a a traditional NBA contender. So here's my question for you guys. At this point, is it a safe for bet to take the Celtics over the field in the Eastern Conference? I definitely think so because this is a really overwhelmingly talented basketball team.

And I legitimately believe that there is at least five like sub all-star caliber talents. Derek White, there was certainly a push for him to make it at a stretch early in the year when you consider his incredible defensive value, his secondary playmaking, his pull-up shooting, his catch and shooting, like that's a top 50 guy in terms of winning impact. And then everybody else, I would just say, stamped is an all-star caliber talent.

Like Drew hasn't had the offensive production this year, but he is doing so many unbelievable things defensively. And KP, I legitimately thought should have been there. He's the most efficient 20 point per game score in the league. He has been the second most effective rim protector in basketball in terms of the field goal percentage that he's holding opposing players to at the rim. So it's ridiculous. Like, this is a regular season juggernaut. And they are very much working their way into those conversations when we talk about the best regular season teams of the 21st century at the

very least. We've seen so much more parity in the league in recent years in terms of teams not having those like utterly dominant regular seasons. And they could be the first 65 win team since the 2018 Rockets. They're 11th all time in point differential per game. So I just don't want to undersell how great of a basketball team this is and how I do think the dynamics are at least a bit different from years past on top of them just having even more overwhelming talent because of a guy like Chris Dobbs-Borzingas, because of now how truly overwhelming the offensive skill is, the fact that everybody on the floor at all times

is a high-level shooter. So any drive-and-kick situation when you're forced to help, somebody is going to be getting a good shot from deep. He is also the ultimate mismatch attacker. Like in the NBA right now, Porzingis is averaging 1.4 points per post-up. It's obscene. He can shoot over anybody at will.

He's the most physical we've ever seen him, getting great position, and he's drawing foul at an obscene rate because he's just got overwhelming physical advantages in a vast majority of those matchups. And that's the problem that teams are going to face defensively. against Boston. It's really your weakest defender on the floor can be hunted by anyone at any time. They just have so many dudes who are so skilled offensively and also high-end athletes physically

imposing. And then you consider the addition of a Drew Holiday who brings a little bit more offensive punch, certainly compared to like a Marcus Smart and is defending at an even higher level, especially when you consider what he can do as a roamer, what he can do guarding post players, like the guy's just a freak. Derek White is significantly better than he's ever been. Jason Tatum is stronger. He's more willing to post up. And I know Jason that you and really we on your show have discussed often how he at times it still feels like let's defenses off the hook and should impose himself more physically and does rely too much on those pull up threes at a high volume. And that's killed them in the past.

But he is at least a better version of himself. And introducing a guy like KP, I think is somebody who can allow them to break some of those stretches where they are relying too much on pull up three. one pass catch and shoot threes because he really can find a mismatch at almost any time on the floor. And he is that interior scoring presence. And it's a small sample size, but in clutch situations this year, he has been their number one score and he's done it with crazy efficiency. So I think this team is great. I still slightly prefer Denver because I think they have the best player on the floor by a lot. And I think that offensive formula is just going to be effectively unstoppable for them.

But if Jason Tatum played like a consistent superstar, maybe top five player kind of guy, it would be tough for anybody to beat Boston. And out east, there are some teams that have upside, but they just have a lot more questions. I love the Knicks, but for them to beat Boston, you would need Julius Randall to play at a sustained level that I just don't buy from him. He is like one of the great playoff droppers of the 21st century.

He has fallen apart in every individual playoff series that we've seen him in, and the dynamics are different there because they have so much more spot-up shooting. Their defensive personnel is so much better. but at the end of the day, with Randall in a volume roll, like you're going to need him to deliver, and I just don't trust him. And then the Bucks, you always have the upside because Dame and Yannis can go nuclear, but they would need to somehow figure out a way to guard this Boston team who has all of these skilled and yet big and strong and athletic ball handlers.

And I just don't see that. Like Pat Bev is your point of attack defensive move at the deadline. You can't play a Dame and Pat Bev lineup against the Boston Celtics. like you're just going to get bullied. So ultimately, everybody else's flaws to me are just more significant. And this Boston team is crazy talented. They are crazy talented. They're big, they're physical, they're athletic all throughout the lineup.

And like you mentioned, Carson, too, they're all super skilled. I won't say that I haven't seen a starting five this talented in a long time because I think it would be selling Denver's starting five last year really short. But this is a dominant group. And I think that the rest of the east is very flawed. I would take Boston out of the east, but Carson, I think you point to the fatal flaw, and I'm going to be that guy again. The one thing that does scare me about the playoffs is the fact that Boston is attempting

nearly 44% of all their shots from deep. That's the most in the league. And they attempt just below 29% of their shots at the rim. That's 27th in the league, right? So when we're talking about offensive dynamism and the clutch, Boston does tend to settle a little bit. I think this year, they are more well equipped to get rid of that fatal flaw because they have Christops because they have a guy like Drew Holiday, Derek White, Jalen Brown, Jason Tatum.

These are all guys that, like you said, Carson, in hypothetical matchups against teams, they can kind of get, in theory, the Celtics are so dominant physically and athletically and have these advantages that they should be able to get whatever they want. But it's their tendency to go to those outside shots. But I do think this is a different year. And if we're going to predict Boston to finally break through and get through that ceiling, it's going to be this year because of Christops, because I think he breaks, he can break up those lulls.

You said it perfectly. That's going to be the biggest challenge for Boston to overcome. It has been the past two seasons. And I do think the East is just really far away, man. The Knicks are my favorite contender outside of them, but I just don't believe in Julius Randall enough for them to get it done.

I still think that I want to see Boston's offense be a little more dynamic, but they're just too talented for me to bet against them. So you're taking Boston over the field as well, Logan? Yes, I will. Okay. So I do as well. And, you know, it's interesting.

I'm more or less exactly where I was with Boston at the beginning of the season. Like I predicted before the season that they would be a much better regular season team than Milwaukee. I kind of saw some of these issues coming with Milwaukee. The issues have been bigger than I've expected, particularly as it pertains to Dame. Like, Dame has shot below 40% from the field in 10 of his last 15 games. How crazy is that? Yeah. Like, it's become a safer bet than not that he's going to have a putrid shooting.

night on any given night that he goes out there. It's like, it's like anytime you look at the box scores or you're looking through the nightly slate on the ESPN app and you click on a Bucks game, it's like you could bet it's going to be like five or 17 for Dame. Like it's just like it's become the the trend here over the course of this, especially as of late. Like it's, it's not one of those things where he's gaining rhythm and figuring it out with continuity. It's actually getting worse over time. But with the Celtics, I mean, obviously there are still some things there that are big question marks as it pertains to, like, just look at their most recent losses. Like all of their recent losses have involved going up against the upper level,

upper echelon teams in the league, and then their offense in particular falling apart. That said, any sort of question mark that has risen from the Celtics this year pales in comparison to the question marks we've seen elsewhere. The bucks have defended a little bit better since Doc took over, but their offense has completely fallen apart. Obviously, I agree with you. Like Patrick Beverly, I think as far as the discounted options that were available at the deadline, I thought he was a good pickup.

Yeah. And I think he gives them a certain look that they can go to. I think in particular matchups, it'll be super valuable, like going against pretty much anybody that's guard-centric. So like a team like New York, like I'd love to have him to throw at a Jalen Brunson for extended stretches of a series and stuff like that. But I just think the, the question marks that have kind of materialized over the course of the season for Milwaukee

greatly exceed that that we've seen from Boston. The Sixers, even if Embed was healthy, I didn't really view them as a legitimate contender. I didn't think they had enough shot creation beyond Joel Embed, not to mention obviously all the question marks surrounding Joel and Bid, like basically his success this year in large part has fallen on the jump shot, which is pretty much what the success was in his MVP season last year. And so that kind of raised some question marks as to whether or not that would translate to the next level. The Miami Heat, you know, like in a weird way, like they have it. Even before Terry Rozier heard his leg, they weren't really getting much offensive production out of Terry

Rozier to begin with. They're a team that relies pretty heavily on guys like Duncan Robinson and Tyler Harrow to generate offense. That to me is kind of makes them a long shot, although I'll never write off the Miami Heat, obviously. Yeah. But, but I have the question marks there. On the Knicks front, you know, you know, Carson, you were talking about Julius Randall, one of the big things that I look at with him is he's such a rhythm player. And like I almost feel terrible for him with his shoulder injury because once again, he's going to come back and have like 15 games to get his legs underneath and before he gets into the postseason. And that specifically is the issue. Julius Randall's that guy that like if he can play two consecutive months without getting

hurt, he kind of like just gets in a groove or his touch is dialed in and he becomes really did. But like again, if you just zoom out from the Knicks, it's like, you need O.G. Anobie to come back and not have any more issues with his elbow. He literally, didn't they literally have to remove a foreign body from it? You've got Julius Randall and his rhythm and inconsistencies. And then Mitchell Robinson, will he come back or not? There's just a lot of question marks on that front. And so when you just simply break it down to odds, it just feels a hell of a lot more likely

that Boston will win than any of these other stories even combined. And, you know, I did a deep dive on the Celtics earlier this week talking about some of their spacing principles. And, you know, I think there's a pretty clear line to some of their offensive issues being solved. Like, for instance, when they look to attack from the wings in particular with an occupied corner, it seems to kind of bait specifically Tatum and Brown into really difficult pull-up jump shots because they don't see driving lanes because guys are digging down into the lanes. and all the Celtic shooters are good shooters, but none of them are like, like unbelievable dead eye,

like you cannot leave this guy open even for a second type of shooters. They all can be a little streaky, you know, like Derek White, very good shooter, but he's not a, he's not a professional shooter.

You know, Drew Holiday, very good catch and shoot shooter, not a professional shooter. You know, like that's where it gets, these guys, you can kind of sit into driving lanes and close out

and kind of just play the numbers in a lot of ways. but you put it simply, Carson, like, if he plays at a top five level, they're just going to win. That's the way I see it. Like, because the one case is that a team like Denver or a team like the Clippers can just bring significantly more star power to bear in these sorts of situations. And as much as Tatum can close that gap, they just have so much more margin for error than the rest of these teams. And so, I mean, really, I guess this would be my last question for you guys before we move on. do you think with some of the implications of the second apron with the new CBA and with the rise of some of these other teams around the league,

do you view this particular playoff run as an urgent one for Boston? Does it feel like this is the one they have to win? That's an interesting question. I think that there are other teams that are in position to be good for the foreseeable future. I mean, Denver stands out as a team that pretty much has their fundamental core. place at least through this next season. But the Celtics at least basically have all their key guys under control through next year.

So I would say it doesn't have to be this year. But the pressure continues to mount. Like you can only be the most talented team in the league and not win the title so many times. Boston was the most talented team in the league last year, I would say. They didn't win the title. And then they got like significantly more talented. So in terms of is their window going to close?

No, I don't think so. But now they have implemented, right, a more veteran guy and Drew Holiday. He's 33 years old. And so he is not necessarily going to retain his value for years upon years. KP is playing the best he ever has. And it's not that he's old. He's only 28. But the injuries remain a concern.

And hopefully it doesn't bite them this year. And hopefully it doesn't become like a truly inhibitive thing later down the line. But it could. So I wouldn't say that they have to do it this year. But I would say this year or next, there's a lot of. pressure on them to get it done one of those years. Another guy, a key rotation guy that's getting older, too, is Al Horford. You know, I mean, and I think that every year is a must win, you know what I mean?

But I think this year specifically with what you guys laid out about how specifically weak the Eastern conferences, I think it has to be this year, right? I mean, this would be the biggest indictment and embarrassment that this team has ever suffered. And they've had bad playoff shortcomings against Miami and the ECF, against the Warriors in the finals, right? there is a huge monkey on Boston's back. And I feel like it's going to continue to grow unless they get it done this year.

They do feel like the overwhelmingly most talented team. And yeah, I don't think the rest of the East is up to muster, man. Like I said, I like the Knicks a lot, but there's too many moving parts there. I completely count out the bucks. I think they have to, not that they have to get it done, like you said. They're going to have these guys next year. But I think this would be the most embarrassing. if they don't get to the finals.

You know what I mean? I think this would be the worst season for this Boston team in the past five years. I don't think it's a must-win type of postseason opportunity, but I would just put it like that. It's an opportunity in the sense that like Milwaukee kind of reminds me of Phoenix last year where they're kind of dealing with some of the fallout of making a superstar trade in some of the holes that that can open up on your roster. The Knicks, like they just feel like they're.

coming in a big way in the sense that like they're they're they're they're really well run. They've got just a lot of really good basketball players on their roster and they have the means with which to make a superstar trade should something like that come available over the off season. Like there's just a lot of really encouraging stuff coming out of New York. Obviously like the young talented teams around the Eastern Conference, whether it's Indiana or it's Cleveland, Orlando's another team I'd keep an eye on in the future as a team that could be particularly could particularly be a pain in the ass in the playoffs,

just with some of the physical advantages they bring to the table. And then obviously out west, like, it's just going to be a bloodbath out there, especially with some of the older teams on the table. And like whoever comes out of the Western Conference is just going to be in worse shape in terms of how much they've had to endure than whoever comes out of the East. And so I just, I just view it as an opportunity. This feels like the year.

Tatum's 26, are going to be 26. I think. His birthday is very near. Either it just happened or it's going to happen soon. So to me, it just is the best opportunity that they're going to have to go get this thing. And so I hope that, you know, for Tatum's sake, that they can capitalize on it. All right, moving on. Our next question.

We'll start with you, Logan. So the Warriors seem to be taking shape. Right. We know what their front line looks like. It's Wiggins, Kaminga, and Draymond, although Steve Kerr inexplicably at the end of the jazz game last night, played a three-guard lineup as they got absolutely murdered on the offensive glass and nearly blew that game. But for the most part, it's been Wiggins, Caminga, and Jermond in the front line. You know, obviously the backcourt, it seems to be, obviously, Pazemski's going to start,

but they can kind of go with Clay or Pizemski based on, you know, the matchup or whether or not Clay's got to go in the way that he did last night. So we kind of have a general feel of what the team looks like. We know Chris Paul is going to come back and add some more stability to the bench unit. It's basically hopping into the Lester Cignonas minutes is what I'm expecting. But there's been some good and bad. They've won eight out of ten. Their starting lineup has been very, very good. But they've just had an absolute nightmare of a time, particularly in the fourth quarter, particularly when games are close. And so I guess let's just, now that we've seen, this is, it's weird with the Warriors because all these other teams, we kind of knew more about

way earlier in the season. And like we're almost evaluating the Warriors from the perspective of like where we would normally evaluate a team at the end of November. Because we're just like, okay, we got like a good 15 game sample size of like this group of guys playing a certain brand of basketball. And so I guess let's zoom out for a second. How do we feel about the Warriors? Do you view them as like a traditional contender or just a really good playoff team or something less than that? Where are you at with the Warriors, Logan? right outside of real contender status.

I can't imagine a world where the Golden State Warriors win the NBA finals. It's really hard for me to imagine. This last stretch has been very, very encouraging for the Warriors. Like, they are undersized, but they're a super switchable, versatile lineup. It's the most athletic they've been in a minute. I've really liked the dubs in transition. Just the way they get up and down the floor with ease, like, you know, Draymond starting the break.

Draymond is so great, just getting the ball out immediately. And they've got other athletes, like if it's Wiggins connecting it to Comingo, who's finishing, you know, the fast break, whoever it is, like they move really well up and down the floor. They're fast, they're athletic. And on offense, I mean, they really spread defenses out. You know, I think that's been a big key for me is without Looney out there. You know, you don't have a, I mean, Draymond's also been hitting three is an insane rate

too, which I don't know if we expect to keep up. You know, that's a big part of it, too. He's been doing it all season. True. I'm crossing my fingers. Dre has been insane. And so that's a big component. They are really spreading and stretching defenses out.

It's really an optimized offense for virtually every lineup without Looney at the five. You know, if it's Dre at the five, if it's Sarich, if it's TJD, all of those guys are high IQ, good decision makers who can stretch the floor. And, I mean, you see it with a lot of the double screens at the top of the key. And the Warriors run so many different actions. out of that. I love it where, you know, if it's commingo on a backdoor cut, if it's clay relocating, they just run so many actions out of that that it's really hard. You know, it keeps a defense on its heels because of how many different things they can do out of those sets. The one thing that scares me about the dubs, and it's really similar to Boston, actually, three-point shooting

is still going to be the biggest variance and the biggest swing factor for the dubs. You know, this is still a very perimeter-oriented team, and that's the thing that scares me the most about Golden State is the volatility of the three-point shot. 40% of their shots are coming from three this season. That's a fifth highest percentage in the league. And just 27% of their shots come at the rim. That's the lowest percentage in the league. They just don't exert a ton of pressure on the rim. So what does that mean? That means that Dre is going to have to have a great shooting run. Wiggins is going to have a great shooting run. Clay is going to have to swing series. And on top of that, Kaminga is going to have to play like a legit number two when those guys

aren't at their best offensively. Like, I really like. what Golden State's done. But just considering those factors, the fact that I think all of those guys are going to have to reach a different level offensively and are going to have to shoot the lights out. The fact that in a lot of these matchups, I think they're at a huge, massive athletic and physical disadvantage. Jason, you talk about the game the other night where they're getting out rebounded down the stretch. That scares me in any series against any team out West, you know, or the dub's going to be able to hang on the glass. It just, it seems like for me that a lot more needs to go right than to go wrong. And it scares me that in a rock fight in one of these

grimy games, you know, Golden State just goes cold from the three point line and their offense completely disappears. You know what I mean? They don't have these, like Carson, like you were saying, with Christops in Boston, they don't have a guy that can really break up these. It's Cumminga at this point. And that's just a lot of pressure to put on a young guy's shoulders like that to me where I think everybody's going to have to play beyond their means. You need comminga to play like a star. Yeah, they're just at major physical disadvantages, and I think they're a little overly reliant on the three-point shot.

I love the Warriors. I'm going to be honest, guys. I love watching the Warriors play. They're one of my favorite teams to ever watch in basketball history, and I enjoy watching them on a night-to-night basis. It's going to break my heart if they get knocked out in the playoffs, man, because it's kind of kind of feel like the end of an era. But there's really no world in which I see Golden State hoisting the trophy

at the end of this, man. There's just too many factors that I think need to, they're going to need to go right in the playoffs. I agree, but I do think that they are really good. I think that they are a scary first round draw in the playoffs now in a way that they weren't a month ago. And I think that they are clearly now tapping into their ceiling as a basketball team. I think that they are unlocking that athleticism on the perimeter.

I just don't think that Looney was playing at a level this year where you could justify giving him 20 something minutes a game, starting him like you did in last year's playoff run when obviously he was awesome, especially on the glass, but now the spacing is so much better, as Logan mentioned. And that offensive congestion, having the sort of too big approach to just obvious non-shooters with how Dramon was shooting the ball last year, really shrunk the floor for them. And I do still wonder in a playoff setting, there's no question that it's a better situation now and really everybody on the floor can handle and everybody can knock down an open jumper.

I still worry if Draymond sustains this level, if Kaminga sustains the necessary level as a three-point shooter. Wiggins obviously has been super volatile this year. Like those are guys who in the regular season you respect as floor spacers in a playoff chess match. I worry a little bit about having a few guys who yeah can knock down those shots, but consistently aren't necessarily great three-point shooters. But overall, I just think it's so much better basketball offensively. Dremont does unlock so much with his playmaking. Logan, you mentioned pushing the tempo.

Pots has been awesome there too. What Dremont does facilitating those split actions. Like, it's just really pretty basketball. They look like the Warriors right now. They're doing their stuff. And when Dremon comes back, he changes a whole bunch of those dynamics. Not only does he allow them to play these sort of small ball looks because he's such a freak defensively. He really does do so much to unlock everything that this team can do in terms of the creativity

away from the ball. And they've just been way better when he's on. on the floor. When he plays, they outscore opposing teams by six points per 100 possessions. They're legitimately a really good basketball team. And we're seeing that right now, particularly with the small ball lineup that has pods in there with Clay, Curry, Wigs, Cominga and Dre, they've still been good. But when you put pods in there instead of Clay, that is a plus 26 net rating. Not a huge sample size, but we've seen them legitimately run that lineup with good volume over this last 10 plus game stretch with Dre at the 5. And they're just

killing people. So I think that if you are looking at a matchup against, say, the Clippers, as we saw a couple days ago, they easily could have won that game, or the sons, who they did beat, like these teams who don't have these overwhelming, super physical big front lines, then I think this team can run and gun. And I think that they can hold up defensively in those matchups. And I think that they give themselves the best shot at an upset. Where I get concerned about it, the reason I can't say that I could see them winning the title is that means you have to find a way to beat the Denver. Nuggets and the Denver Nuggets are going to be way, way bigger than you, stronger than you,

and still have this tremendous offensive skills, still have this unbelievable perimeter shot making, have all this continuity, have the best player on the floor, and that's a really tough mountain to climb. Against the Clippers also, I think, like, you should play small against them. That gives you your best chance, but also they just have more of those star level shot creators. And that's what concerns me. Logan, you mentioned the reliance on the three.

it's the Golden State Warriors. They've always been relying on the three. They're an outlier because they have the greatest shooter of all time and the second greatest shooter of all time. Like that's on what concerns me. What concerns me is the lack of a second guy who can really threaten defenses with the ball in his hands. They don't have obviously what Kevin Durant did,

but they also don't have Jordan Poole in 2022, who was awesome in that playoff run. They don't have a Clay Thompson who was more comfortable putting the ball on the floor. Like at least was a capable athlete, right? And that to me is the one. thing that they had to find a way to acquire at the deadline. Kaminga, of course, brings you some of that on-ball scoring with his mismatch attacking, but it's different.

And I do worry a little bit about guys in playoff settings who are so specifically reliant on athletic tools and don't necessarily have that skilled shot making. So they are playing so much better. They have found the best version of themselves. But against like the best teams in the West, it's kind of the same thing where it's like, all right, can they hang physically and do they have that second star that all these other teams are going to have. And I'm still not convinced on those fronts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying.

Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show.

This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need. to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan,

so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of ton-tons and wampas on the ice planet hot or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the IHeart radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. So I put the Warriors based on everything I've seen in this last month or so, basically right in the same tier with all of those teams that are below Denver and the Clippers, which is, I think they're really good playoff teams that have big red flags. And you can say that about literally every team outside, like, whether it's the

thunder, just being kind of small and inexperienced, whether it's the Timberwolves, having issues with late game offense and execution, whether it's the sons with their lack of physicality. You know, we can go on and on down the list. They all have their issues. And so first, there's a lot of good. We've won eight of their last 10. The Steph Dremont-Comingo Wiggins lineups, regardless of who it is at the two are plus 16 net 120 offensive rating, that's awesome, 104 defensive rating, that's awesome. But they have, in my opinion, three major issues. And these three issues are specifically bothering them at the end of games,

although there is one of them in particular is kind of stretching into other elements of the game. So first of all, on the offensive end of the floor, they're incredibly, they're incredibly dependent specifically on Steph's shot making at the end of games. I went back this morning, even though I watched the games live, I just wanted to just look over the film a little bit closer at all the Warriors' offensive possessions as they kind of blew things late against Utah and then as they blew things late against the clippers. And it's just like it's Steph running around in circles until he can get a shot. That's literally what it is. And like when it goes in it, look. good. And when it doesn't, they just don't really have another option. And like, here's the thing, Steph throughout most of the season, with the exception of like these last two games have been

a little bit on the rougher side, but like he's, he's made a lot of those shots. But the problem is, is even with Steph making almost 50% of his shots, you know, well over 40% of his threes in these clutch situations, over the last 15 games, the Warriors have gone to crunch time eight of those 15 games and they have a 105 offensive rating. So regardless of Steph making a good amount of these shots, it's not amounting to points on a per possession basis. And like one of the things I talk about, you had mentioned rock fight.

I think it was Logan who had brought that up. When you get into these rock fights, like a lot of times those jumpers do miss because guys are just tired. And that's not to say Steph won't make some of them. He's the best shooter of all time. But like this is why like, you know, early in the season we were preaching. like go get a Siakum because like he's a guy that can turn his back to the basket,

bully his way close to the rim and try to make something happen there. And like honestly, like this is where I have some more like both of you guys are really low on the Warriors as a championship contender. And don't get me wrong. I like I said, I put them in that tier below the nuggets and the clippers. But I think they have as good of a chance as any of those other teams. And the main reason why some of these problems are fixable. For instance, like throw some variety in there at the end of the game's

offensively. Don't rely only on Steph. If you can find a way to give some of those possessions to comminga on post-ups or Wiggins on ISOs or even just running more of your motion stuff and getting the ball in Pajamski's hand, who's done a really nice job of kind of powing that line of aggression and keeping the ball movement. Like if you do something like that, you buy some more time for rest for Steph where he might be able to make more of those shots. The second big piece of it is the defensive end of the floor. They have in those eight clutch games over the last 15, they have a 136 defensive rating. It has been a consistent issue this year.

And that even extends to fourth quarters at large. Now, again, I was like, let's go look at the tape. So I was looking at the tape specifically of the Clippers game, and I think a lot of it is fixable. This is not a group that has bad defensive personnel. Draymond Green is one of the very best backline anchors that you can have for defense in the NBA. Andrew Wiggins, Jonathan Caminga, Gary Payton.

Brandon Pizamski, that is a good core of perimeter defenders. They are capable of being a much better defense than they have been. And one of the big things that I've noticed, and this is on Steve Kerr, they have been a little bit like the old Raptors teams under Nick Nurse where they're just overly aggressive and unnecessarily overhelping. Norman Powell's left corner three, the one that Brandon Pizamski ran over his head, and then he kind of pumped-baked and leaned in and shot. It was a possession where they basically, for no particular reason at all,

double-teamed Paul George on a pick and roll when they didn't really need to, and it left an easy skip pass because Pizamsky had to tag the roller. There was a play where Norman Powell made a three in the right corner. This is the one where Dremont Green went flying past him and swiped over his head and missed, and Norman Powell made the three. Jonathan Kaminga was guarding Russell Westbrook

in the dunker spot and was in a great position to help on James Hardin's drive on Brandon Pizamski, and Dremon Green vacated the strong side corner to overhelp and gave up an open three when he was not the right person to help there. And in general, should not help out of the strong side corner, especially off of basically the best spot up shooter in basketball right now. That is execution based. Steph Curry overhelped on a Russell Westbrook drive out of the right side corner.

Like it's been a consistent issue. And then so I look at it as some fixable stuff on defense. That's just execution. And then we talked about the Steph Curry focus on the offense late in the game. which I think has kind of led to some diminishing returns. And then last but not least, they are a dog shit rebounding team. Like it is a big problem. Now, they've been a good rebounding team for most of the season,

in large part, like you mentioned, Carson, going with bigger lineups, playing more of Kavanaugh-Luny. But this is a crazy stat. First of all, let's start big picture. Steph Dremont Camingo Wiggins, that main lineup, even with as dominant as they've been, only a 69.8% defensive rebounding percentage. That's not good.

Here's another crazy stat for you. in the Jazz and Clippers games in crunch time, seven minutes of crunch time. They gave up an offensive rebound on 87.5% of their opponent's misses in those two games. Think about how crazy that is. If you were watching the Get Jazz game and it felt like every single time they missed, they tapped it out and got an offensive rebound, it's because they did. They finally got one stop at the end of the Clippers game. It was a James Harden step back three at the top of the key.

Nobody boxed out Russell Westbroke. he got an offensive rebound. And again, if you look down the roster, if you look at Draymond Green, you look at Jonathan Kaminga, you look at Andrew Wiggins, that's a lot of athleticism and long arms. They just have to do a better job.

And so, like some of it is like you mentioned, Carson, like there are going to be certain matchups. Like Denver's just bigger and more athletic than them on the front line, even with those guys. And so there's going to be some limitations in the bigger picture. But I do think some of this is fixable. There is some better offensive process. Can they beat,

can they match some of the, the firepower that other teams can bring to the table? No, but I think, I don't think there are a 105 offensive rating clutch team either. I think there's some room for improvement there. Defensively, again, not overhelping and then as a team doing a better job rebounding. So again, they're just like any of these other teams. Their fate depends on their ability to address their weaknesses and reach their individual ceiling. And so I do put them in that tier. I just think there are a lot of things that have to go right. Let's go back to you guys really quickly, Logan. What are you guys noticing in your time watching the late game offense stuff with the Warriors?

Is it something that you think is fixable or are you more concerned about it? No, I definitely think it's fixable. And I think you make a great point of what the Warriors could be doing differently. Steph Curry has the weight of the world on his shoulders, man. He's Atlas. He is holding up this team in any scenario. You talk about him running around. Jason, I thought about that game.

I think it was double O T versus the Lakers. He scores that one bucket, or two games, actually, the one against the Lowe. Lakers and then one against Phoenix. He literally drives on Anthony Davis, runs all the way to the hoop, dribbles back out to the right elbow, gives him a hesitation. And luckily, Anthony Davis opens up the gate so Steph Curry can go in and get that layup to tie the game up, sends it to OT. Lating the game against the Suns, Bradley Beal bites on an inbound pass and leave Steph

wide open for that deep game winning three. He is the late game offense. I think they can do a much better job of, like you said, said alleviating the pressure, giving him a breather. I mean, if anybody, and I think they have guys that they can turn to. It's like you guys said, it's Wiggins is not at the level he was during the run. They don't have a guy like Jordan Poole, but they have guys that they can rely on. Like if it's Cominga, being physical and just, like you said, get touching the ball in the paint.

It's not even about getting the shot down there. It's about creating the advantage, drawing the attention to the paint, and that'll open up everything else for the team. and I think they should lean on pods more too. Like they have personnel. I think it is about execution, but. Steph's a goat, but I don't think he can carry them single-handedly through the playoffs in these big moments.

It's just too much pressure on his shoulders. But I do think it's fixable. I think they have the personnel in place to make it happen. It's tough. I'm honestly not super confident about this team's clutch offense specifically. and this year they have had like a comedy of errors and of mind-blowing loss is obviously their 27th and fourth quarter net rating like it's them and the pistons that's who they're hanging around with it's crazy some of the games they've lost late this year so it's not

that things are disastrous to that extent forever but I do think this was a bad clutch offense last year they were 24th in clutch offensive rating and then out of 16 playoff teams they were 13th in clutch offensive rating and the reality is when you have one high-level shot creator on your team and that guy is particularly reliant on pull-up jump shots, it's tough to manufacture good clutch offense. Like there are ways to make the most out of the attention that Steph demands, but generally it's more like structured ATO kind of stuff. You think about that Clay game winner where Steph is a super effective diversion.

At the end of the day, though, you're probably not going to run a lot of actions where it's like, all right, can Steph get open away from the ball in these last 90 seconds? or maybe he draws a second defender that opens up something for somebody else. It's like, you're going to probably mostly put the ball in Steph's hands, and the defense is going to know that, and he might have to take a tough pull-up jumper. So I'm not super optimistic about that because I really think when you don't have another guy who can threaten defenses with their shot creation, and I'm just not sure in clutch spots, comming is that guy, there's kind of a ceiling to what you can do.

Yeah, and again, when it comes to the commingo wig and stuff, the idea there would be you're not scoring right now anyway running everything through Steph. Like it's yeah. And it's not and it's not a step issue. It's just a simple matter of like like Logan put it, you're Atlas. You're doing everything. And it's just specifically when you're relying on pull up jump shooting, your legs come into the equation a lot more.

Again, if we could just cut his usage down a little bit, that could go a long way towards him being more efficient. And then again, just part of the. issue too is like because they lean so much into step when another guy gets an opportunity to even like look at the rim they won't they'll turn and look for step because it's like it's almost it's almost become like the it's like you better not like you better get that ball back to step he's our one he's our one hope here and it's like i think in general even though the wiggins possessions might lead to some frustration and the comminga possessions might lead to some frustration his jumper by

the way, has gone right off of the ledge after it was red hot there for a little while. Like, that's one of those things where you are more unpredictable offensively. If we come out of the timeout and it's like, well, are they going to post up comminga? Are they going to use Steph as a screener to try to get one of these guys downhill? Or are they going to run this action for Steph? Whereas if it's like, it's going to be Steph, you know, and it's like, okay, we're going to switch the ball screen. We'll put Anthony Davis on and we'll live with the results.

Like that's, it just becomes, it just becomes really predictable. All right, let's move on. Go ahead. I think that that is absolutely correct, and I think if that leads to marginal improvement, I'm just not sure that it solves the fundamental issue of Steph is the scariest guy on the floor by so far in all those situations. For sure. No, I 100% agree.

Logan, I don't know, we're going to start with you, Carson. Who do you believe in more? The Thunder or the Timberwolves as a championship contender? This is a tough one, and we've had this conversation before. I think that OKC has a lot of advantages. I think that in this series, they pretty clearly have the best player on the floor. SGA is playing at an unbelievable,

consistent superstar level. I think that they clearly have the higher level of overall offensive perimeter skill when you just consider that they're going to play five out a whole lot of time and so many dudes can handle so many dudes are quick good athletes. The spacing is just clearly better, whereas Minnesota, Cat is obviously super skilled, big. They still are running these two big looks with a very conventional offensive five.

And they are really just like a quick athletic team. I'm looking forward to seeing them with Gordon Hayward when he debuts after the All-Star break because to me, the biggest red flag about this team in the playoffs, arguably at the very least, there's a couple other ones experience as we talked about strength physicality in the front court. But particularly playing Josh Kitty 25 minutes a game, just done. doesn't do it for me. I think that when you have a guy who is not a plus athlete,

not a plus touch shot maker, certainly not a plus defender, and then really struggles to knock down open catch-and-shoot jumpers, like that guy's just going to get played off the floor in a playoff series. It doesn't matter how snazzy, how sick of a passer he is. There's too many exploitable weaknesses there, particularly against Minnesota. We saw the Minnesota symbols do what any Rudy Gobert anchor defense

loves to do more than anything in the world, which is Park Rudy in the paint, have him as a full-time helper, say, let's put him on the weakest shooter on the team who can just sit in the corner and Rudy doesn't have to guard that guy. And that's what they did against Josh Giddy. If it's Gordon Hayward, who brings all the same good traits, the playmaking, the ability to create in those driving kick situations to handle out of pick and roll, he does all of that,

but he's better in terms of the scoring on ball. And then he also will actually knock down 40% of his catch-and-shoe jumpers. So maybe seeing that realized changes my opinion on this, because I have concerns about Minnesota. Jason, last time we were on with you or maybe the time before that, you harped on Minnesota's clutch offense. And that has become more and more of a concern to me as of late. It really matters that you're a damn good half-court offense if you want to make a deep

playoff run and they just aren't. And in the clutch in particular, they haven't been. But ultimately, I still think they are a much more mature basketball team in terms of playoff experience. They are much more physically mature. I mean, they are just so much more. much stronger and more physical. I like the depth for both of these teams, so that's not necessarily a huge difference

maker for me. And I really do believe that this defense is going to be elite regardless of the matchup. I wonder a little bit if, like, the Thunder could attack Cat in space because they have so many quick guys who can handle the ball and they can run really those four perimeter players at all time lineups and then Chet at your five who's super skilled from the perimeter too. But you mentioned the rock fight. and it does feel like in those hyper physical environments, Minnesota still just fares a little bit better

and they've been there before. But I don't know, it's really close from me here because OKC is pretty clearly the better offensive team. And I don't necessarily see that changing. But I do think Minnesota can kind of grind people down with elite defense and then just enough of that half court shot making from, from Matt and Kat. It's very close between these teams. And Minnesota does scare me in some hyper-examines. hypothetical matchups, like five out against the clippers, five out against the Warriors, five out against the Thunder of Gordon Hayward, you know, is really effective in those

lineups. Like, I think that's the kind of way to beat Minnesota is to draw them out. But I do just have more confidence in Minnesota. And they've been really impressive. In their last 10, they're number one in net rating, their number five in offensive rating, number one in defensive rating. And they do just have physical advantages where like, you know, in those scenarios offensively and in certain possessions, like the Warriors do scare me, but they're going to crush them on the glass. Like, Go Bear, 7-1, 7-9 wingspan, town, 7-4 wingspan, McDaniels is somewhere between 6-9 and 6-11 with a near 7-foot wing.

They're huge. Anthony Edwards is a tank. You know what I mean? They're just, they're big and physical. And I think their track records kind of proven this regular season. They're 20 and 11 on the road. They have the best record in the league versus teams that are above 500. Like, yeah, I do worry about this offense stalling out in the half-court setting.

Spacing issues because of Rudy Gobert, Carl Anthony Towns disappearing on a big stage. Right now, they're 20th and clutch offensive rating. 107.9, that's the fifth lowest of any current top eight seed, any current playoff team that's in there. And OK, see, that's not a problem. They have the number one half-court offense in basketball. They have the number three clutch offensive rating this year. Like, OKCC just doesn't have those offensive weaknesses. Minnesota does, but I like their track record.

I like their defense more. I like their continuity. And I don't know, man. I kind of like the vibes of this team. I don't know, man. I like the vibes in Minnesota right now to say the least. Did you guys see the shirt that Mike Conley was wearing the other night, the Finchie shirt? I don't know, man.

I like the energy of Minnesota a lot as a bit of a cop out. Minnesota is huge. And that ultimately is the distinction to me. I believe in the defense. I believe in their physical and athletic advantages. And in a grimy, nasty playoff environment where it's tough to get a bucket. I think Minnesota is equipped to deal with those environments. So this is going to come off as like O'KC. Slander, which I don't intend it to.

Because here's the thing, I'm super, super high on Oklahoma City in the big picture. I even love the Gordon Hayward pickup. I mean, to put it simply, he's just a way better basketball player than Josh Giddy. And so you basically turned what was a weak fit guy in your best five into essentially a guy who's arguably perfect, maybe not positionally, but at least in terms of like veteran guy who could do all the little things well in terms of like a connectivity type of piece. I think it just makes a ton of sense. I also like I was literally thinking about this last night. This thought hit me randomly because our next question we're going to be talking about Kendrick Perkins in his mythological superstar trade that he says is going to happen this summer. But I was thinking about this last night. I was like, man, what if the bucks just go up in flames in like a really ugly way? And then next year they try it again and it's just as bad.

And then all of a sudden the bucks look around and they have no assets and a bunch of old role players. And then Janus goes like, I want out of here. You know who's getting them, right? Oklahoma City. They're throwing seven or eight first round picks at him and like that's literally the position they need so bad

is that that power forward position and like that that's where it could get really, really scary. Obviously who knows, maybe Janice would prefer a bigger market but like I just look at it like, man, I was thinking about that last time. I was like, oh God, that could be completely terrifying.

But to put it simply, within the lens of this season, I think the Timberwolves are a significantly better playoff the red. And before I even go any further, I'm just going to spit it back to you guys. Let's quit looking at this as Minnesota versus Oklahoma City. Carson, which team has a better chance to beat Denver? Yeah, Minnesota.

Like, it's, they match up so much better physically. Like, again, like, I, Oklahoma City has had some advantages in the regular season against Denver, but Denver's been kind of a mediocre regular, like, they're going through another one of those like kind of patches right now or they could give a shit on any given night. and like guys are hurt and like I think Denver would eat Oklahoma City alive in a playoff series personally. Logan, would you take Minnesota or Oklahoma City

against Denver? Oh, easily Minnesota. Yeah. So like that, like, let's just stop beating around the bush here for a second. Like, like Carson, you actually said earlier when we were talking about the Warriors, like everything has to be looked through the lens

of how do we beat Denver? And I just don't, I just don't think Oklahoma City has anywhere near the physical presence they need to hang in that series for seven games. And I mean, we literally just saw Minnesota, like as much as the issues that they can have offensively at the end of games, they also have the ability to just completely lock up the other team late in games. We literally just saw this against the clippers the other night. And even with some of their half-court offense stuff, there's a physical imposition to where it's like, oh, you finally get a stop, but Rudy Gobert just taps the ball out.

they have another offensive rebound they can have another go at it. There's a look at like there's a pretty consistent theme, albeit in only two series, but like Anthony Edwards, his athleticism just translates to a really, really good NBA playoff player. I just, and then,

and then there's always just the NBA history part. Like, it, like, would you rather have the young, inexperienced small team that has a shit ton of talent? Or the big, strong veteran team that has a shit ton of talent.

Like, like, let's just, let's just, let's just, let's just get down to the, to the nitty gritty here. So like, I, I think, I think I would take Minnesota over them. And to be clear, I'm not, I am so high on Oklahoma City long term. I just think, I think there are a really, really good team that is, that is lacking some specific things that I think are necessary to succeed in the NBA playoffs. Did you guys have any followups there? Can we move on? Just real quick. I mean, literally nobody. the nuggets better than the Minnesota Timberwolves because they have the perfect formula of

Kat can hold up physically as a post defender with Yokish. That's not to say that he's going to make him like actively uncomfortable, but he holds up better than like most teams number one post defense option, which then allows Gobert to disrupt things as help to disrupt all of those lobs and bounce passes to Aaron Gordon. They have the athletes on the perimeter. So I do think that that's ultimately what it comes down to like Yokich would take OKC's lunch every single possession.

He literally said like, Chet, you need to get fast. and that's very real for that specific matchup. So I agree definitely on that. Everything's going to go through Denver and Minnesota. It would still be a long shot, but they just have a better formula. Logan, any follow-ups? I completely agree.

I mean, I just think that they, the physical imposition, Minnesota is one of the most physical and athletic teams in the league. It's just, it's going to, if there's one thing that's been proven to, I mean, that's going to directly translate to go to playoff basketball.

And I think they match up well physically against, and any team they're going to run into. And yeah, I wouldn't pick it, but I can definitely see Minnesota giving them trouble. All right. So I saw something on Twitter the other day from Kendrick Perkins talking about how he is not supposed to tell anybody, but there is a star that's going to be a Los Angeles Laker after next year.

I am almost certain that he's referencing Trey Young. I had been hearing some stuff behind the scenes kind of hinting in this direction for a while. I had heard that Trey Young and Clutch are really, really have no interest in Trey being in Atlanta for a rebuild or reboot or anything along those lines. Obviously, him being a clutch client, it's a name that we've seen mentioned in reports in terms of guys that the Lakers would potentially be targeting. We even had a report that I saw, and I can't even remember who put this out there, but that the Hawks are considering rebuilding around Dejante Murray.

And I was like, okay, yeah. Like this is the clearly direction this is going. So I have my thoughts as it pertains to the Lakers making a Tray Young trade this summer. And it's really this simple to me. If I'm Atlanta, I'm going, okay, cool. I want all three of your first round draft picks. I want Austin Reeves. I want Max Christie and I want Jared Vanderbilt.

Basically every positive asset that the Lakers have. I also think that you could see a team like potentially, like a Utah getting involved. Like, County George had a really nice game last night, so maybe they're higher on him in the long term. But like San Antonio is a team that I could see getting involved. And there are just a lot of teams that have more to offer.

But you know how clutch can be in the way that they can kind of flex their muscles to try to get Trey in a certain spot. And so I think that if you went to L.A., that's what the deal would look like. And maybe if you're lucky, Rob could fight to keep Vanderbilt in a deal like that, but it's hard to say. And so then I think about Trey Young, DeAngelo Russell, LeBron James at age 40, and Anthony Davis. And I don't see that team as being really that much of a threat.

For the same reason, this year's team has some issues. The complete and total lack of two-way perimeter talent. So from there, I look at it more as like a future move for the Lakers. like, hey, we need a post-Lebron All-Star to partner with Anthony Davis to make sure that he's willing to stay and basically venture into this next era of NBA basketball. And even then, I don't necessarily like this idea for the Lakers based on the simple fact that I'm not sure that an Anthony Davis-Trey Young duo is all that highly placed in the NBA, which puts us in a perfect situation to rank NBA duos. So here's what we're going to do. Logan, you're going to go first. I want you to give me your rundown, ranked one through whatever, of every NBA duo, ending with where you would put an Anthony Davis and Trey Young duo. I kind of like the thought of a Trey Young AD pairing.

I would go Yokitin Murray 1. I would go KD, DBook 2. I'd go Kauai and PG3. I think I'd go Stefan Draymond four Jimmy and Bam five Luca and Kyrie 6 and then Trey and AD probably 7 Do you guys think I'm too high on him?

I'm sorry, did you say Janice and Dame in there somewhere? Screw Yonnes and Dame. Oh my God, this guy, bro. Bucks are cooked, bro. I don't know what you want me to say. Dude, that is the most absurd thing I've ever heard. I was like, is this a mistake?

Like, what's going on? I'm confused. Dude, Logan literally thinks The bucks are going to be the first team in NBA history to get demoted. They're going to institute the Premier League system and send them down to the G. That is insane to not have Yonnes and Dave. I'm high. I'm a huge Steph fan too, but Stefan Dremont is not as good as Anthony Davidson Trey. Also agreed.

Also agreed. Outside of that, Jimmy and Bam in a playoff setting, it's like they're capable of really good things. But I certainly think that AD Trey has higher upside. if you get like ADU decides he wants to be aggressive offensively. And then we know that Bam's offense can wax and Wayne. Jimmy has consistently elevated his level. But I don't know how. I don't want to bet against it ever.

But it's like we know what Trey can do carrying an offense with just every single possession. I can get us a good shot out of pick and roll. So for my list, I agree with Yokich Murray. I agree with K.D. book. Yonison Dame,

I think is a no brainer. Then I think you start to get into the territory where you can kind of argue a theoretical tray and AD over anyone. I think that Luca and Kyrie are playing unbelievably well this year. And I think that, of course, Luca is having a historic season and is the best he's ever been. But Kyrie is also doing an awesome job of floating that offense in non-Luca minutes of complimenting Luca,

like just hyper-efficient crazy shot making good play, making all the things that he does. I also think Embedied Maxi is at least on the fringes of these conversations because we kind of got to see Maxi do it as that number two option, as the number one perimeter guy in a playoff environment, but I do think that he's pretty awesome. I think he's a pretty legit efficient 25 point per game score, improved playmaker,

who at least has more tools to defend at the point of attack than like a Trey Young. But those two are both pretty close. And then to me, you have to have Trey and AD because I think that they do complement each other's games pretty well. I think that you would probably get the best version of AD playing with Trey, just because he's never played with a guy who spoon feeds him looks like that out of pick and roll.

Like LeBron has never run pick and roll at that sort of volume with the Lakers. Because they just switch it. Yeah, because they switch it. Whereas now you're going to be looking at teams in drop and Trey's just going to toast them and he's going to hit those lobs to AD all game. And it's going to be really easy for him offensively. And then defensively, AD is the best defender on the planet still to me. And so he can hide Trey's issues better than a whole lot of other.

other teams. And I want to be clear, Tray does still have issues just because we've seen like the whole, Tray Young is a good defender narrative brewing. I don't know if you've seen that, Jason, but it's a real hot topic these days. And I think that we have a real struggle collectively between separating improved from good. Tray Young is an improved defender who is playing with more effort, who is making more plays with his hands. All of that is fair. He is still six foot one, 160 pounds with a negative wingspan, a six two wingspan. Like he's one of the most physically limit NBA athletes. And so he's never going to be able to be a plus defender in his career.

But 80 as a backline guy would do a lot to cover that up. So I like it. I think it's fringe top five. So there's obvious basketball fit stuff. The simple fact that AD and Shrey, you're going to have to guard in some sort of traditional pick and roll coverage. If you switch that, you're going to get a lot of bad results on both ends. offensively, I think it would be a match made in heaven.

Defensively, again, if you had to construct a defense around Trey, it would require someone the likes of Anthony Davis on the backline. I'm not sitting here and pretending like it wouldn't be a very successful duo in the league. My thing is like, basically what I'm pitching here is when you start to look around at the other duos around the league and then also the timeline stuff like Anthony Davis is, you know, by the time this trade takes place, he could be what, 31, 32 years old. And is a guy with some injury history. And so the question is whether or not, because I have heard things like Donovan Mitchell

has some interest in playing in a big market one day. You know, like there are some other guards around the league that are in smaller markets playing really good basketball that maybe in a few years would be more interested in playing in a bigger market. The question is whether or not the Lakers should wait for a bigger fish. And then when you really look at it, it's like, are you going to have issues on offense with an Austin D. Lo backcourt? Probably not. So at least not in the regular season. And so that's where I kind of look at it as an opportunity to wait. Now, my list, I have Yokich Murray number one. I actually put Dame Janus too. I did this bit on my show yesterday, but I actually

would pick Janus to win MVP this year. I think he's been the best regular. season player in the league. Not by some large margin over Yokech, but by some very small margin. Hawaii Paul George, I think is clearly better than Anthony Davis and Trey Young. The way you put it is perfect cars. And these are guys you could argue. But I, but like, like Tatum and Brown, like that's, Tatum is like probably right around the same level as Anthony Davis. And, you know, Jalen Brown for all of his flaw. is a guy that's relatively close to a Trey Young. He's in that same conversation.

Jimmy and Bam is who I had at five. Kevin Durant, Devin Booker at six, I think that's a group that you could argue an AD Trey is better, but I would personally rather have KD and Devin Booker. I personally think Luke is better than Anthony Davis. And in terms of the playoff context, I'd rather have Kyrie as my number two than Trey personally, just because especially in that kind of supplementary kind of playmaking role.

like the way he's partnered with Luca. Again, we got to look at, it's kind of like the Yolich-Murie thing. Like, it doesn't really matter how good Murray is stacked up to the other guards. It's how valuable he is to the Nuggets. And the two of those guys are more valuable than all of these other groups. Like a Luca Kyrie duo, in my opinion, is a better basketball duo than a Trey Young Anthony Davis duo.

I even put Embed Maxie over that group. I think Joel Embed has the potential to be a wrecking ball that destroys everyone in the NBA playoffs. I don't think Anthony Davis has that potential. So like, that to me is the swing factor. I do think Trey Young is better than Tyrese maxi right now, but who knows in a few years? You know what I mean? So like, as far as I'm concerned, I would probably take those eight duos over Anthony Davis and Trey Young.

And so from that standpoint, especially given the Lakers and the way that they're consistently a group that is at the top of the list for stars when they're disgruntled and want to get out, I would lean to. I would lean towards passing on Trey and waiting on a bigger fish. So now that we've discussed the duos. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all,

embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th.

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to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of ton-tons and wampas on the ice planet hot or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the IHeart radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. Given those lists, would you, if you were the general manager

of the Lakers, would you target Trey as the next guy to partner with Anthony Davis or would you hang tight and wait for something better to develop? I just want to say this. When the bucks get bounce in the first round. I'm going to come right back to this. Okay, dude. I'm going to come right back to this. All right, man, when the Indiana Pacers beat the bucks, as you've prophesized, and Dame scored 15 on 10% from the field. And Doc calls a timeout they don't have in the last 30 seconds to lose possession and give the other team a free throw. Yeah, and Yonnas takes like three steps and forgets how to dribble. Yeah. Yonah starts taking logo threes. Yeah. If it's Indiana, I definitely wouldn't pick that. I do think the bucks are cooked.

I would do it actually. And I think that Trey and AD would have great chemistry. As Carson mentioned, like, Trey's an exceptional passer out of pick and rolls. I just think about the in-between game, the floaters, the pull-up. I think these are two guys that really complement each other and would work together. And I think the crucial point of this is to just not waste whatever time you have left of LeBron James. And I think this is probably their biggest need. I don't think their roster is there.

And I wouldn't take the Lakers to knock off the Nuggets or to. to make a finals run. I think they need bigger, more athletic two-way guys, point-blank, period. But I also think they need another secondary shot creator, another guy from the perimeter that can carry this offense, they can open up things for them. And that's the biggest thing to me is just whatever time we have left of LeBron James, you have to maximize that. And I'm not saying that it fully opens the championship window. We don't have a gust coming through here, but there's a breeze. There's a little bit of breeze with that championship window that I buy into enough with Trey LeBron and AD. And it's L.A., man. You know, there's a reason that we always theorize these big superstar

trades to L.A. Los Angeles makes stuff happen. They make trades. They make crazy deals. So it's not impossible that one offseason we could see a dramatic, crazy roster overhaul or turnaround that makes the Lakers legit. I probably wouldn't predict it because I think I put the cart before the horse this season by taking the Lakers is my championship favorite early this year. It's not over yet. There's a breeze there too. It's kind of stuffy in here, fellas. I don't know about y'all. If they get Trey, I kind of like the,

I like the championship window breeze that I would get with that trio. I would pull the trigger, man. I mean, what bigger, is Donovan Mitchell the bigger fish? And I understand going for Donovan Mitchell, but I just, here's my thing. If Trey Young became available, I would jump at the opportunity to go and get him. Yeah, that's really the question for. me is would I rather have Trey or Donovan Mitchell in this particular situation? And it's sort of tough

because I almost feel like for the last year or two of Mabran, I would rather have Donovan just for a couple reasons. Like I think that Trey is the better manufacturer of team offense single-handedly, but you know that Donovan Mitchell like can be your number one option for long stretches. We've seen the playmaking from him this year has been very legit. And then he is more of a guy who's willing to give you catch and shoot attempts at like a higher volume. And he doesn't singularly dominate the ball in that same way. He's also having the best defensive season of his career. Yeah.

And he's, I mean, right, a much better athlete who maybe isn't like that much taller, but he's got a six, nine wingspan, longer, more athletic, has played within like a really good team defense. Like he has some of that discipline. And Trey has never played on a good team defense in his life. So for those reasons, I like Mitchell more for that immediate window. long term though if i'm thinking just specifically about how those guys compliment ad i really do love the offensive fit between tray and ad so i think it's honestly going to depend on like

if either of those two are available i would probably take the one who's available if they're both available then i think i leaned donovan mitchell but to me either way you need to add that star guard creator and it's going to be imperfect either way but it's going to make you a more serious contender because you need that sort of offensive pop and guy who can carry the load when LeBron just isn't going to do that for a full 36 minutes at 40 years old. Yeah, I would, in the context of like a bridge move that gives you a better chance to win next year with LeBron while also having a person to partner with Anthony Davis, it's Donovan Mitchell every single time for me. I would much rather have him. I think you could build with Donovan

Mitchell, I think you could build a legitimate championship defense, him and Anthony Davis with a, you know, if you could maintain a Jared Vanderbilt and a deal like that. Like, I think there's enough athleticism on the perimeter between a guy like Donovan and a guy like Jared to kind of make that, that functional in a big way. But I do think the Lakers are starting to get to the point where like if you're starting to make decisions this summer based on the LeBron version of the team, that gets tricky because he's going to be 40 next year. I think, I think it's, you know, last summer, it was very much like, hey, we need to give it one last shot with LeBron.

We got to try to do something. And by the way, they did nothing. But like there is a case to be made that we're officially encroaching on that territory now where it's like, what are we going to do when this guy does, you know, either fall off significantly or experience an old guy injury that takes him out for a season or whatever it is. Like, what are we going to do? And that is where I would not like a Tray Young trade. I, if I was running the Lakers, would be like keeping Austin, keeping Austin.

keeping all of these young players, Rui, Jared Vanderbilt, retain DeAngelo Russell, and just be this really fun, basically the team you saw in Utah the other night, like a really fun team with a bunch of offensive talent around Anthony Davis, and just wait and wait and wait until a legitimate top 10 player becomes available that you can jump on. And within a couple more seasons, you'll have a couple more picks, and that would just be the direction that I would go if I was running the Lakers. available the summer, pounce on him. If it's Trey Young, I'd wait and see if a bigger fish comes available.

All right, before we get out of here, we're going to have to go somewhat quickly here. I want to just do a quick little round the table on each of the top three picks in last year's draft. So we'll start with you, Carson. Victor Wembenyama, are you higher or lower on him than you were when he was drafted? Tough to believe, but I think that I'm a little bit higher, and he was universally acknowledged the best prospect that we've seen in the last two decades. I think that he is the best rookie that we have seen this century, like since the guys coming straight out of high school into one and done era where we weren't getting finished products. We weren't getting 22 year old grown men like Tim Duncan anymore. I think that he's the best that we've seen.

And on a per minute and per possession basis, what he's been doing offensively since moving to center is ridiculous. He's scoring 27.5 points per 75 possessions, which is a pretty good estimate of like what a star player should be playing in a normal game. He's just only been giving you 27 minutes a night. So he's outscoring like every other rookie that we've seen this century. He's doing it with legitimately good efficiency now over 59% true shooting. And he's just transformed. He like took a full on leap midseason to where now playing at the five is just better for him because the spacing is better in a situation that was really rough offensively.

rough because of the guard play. But now he does also have Trey Jones, who was just more capable of setting him up. So he's getting some more of those manufactured looks around the rim where he is a physical outlier like we haven't seen in 60 years. It's ridiculous. Put the ball up there and he'll finish it. He's the best transition scoring big in basketball, more outlier athleticism there. He to me has been more decisive and assertive attacking the rim and a bit more comfortable with NBA physicality. He's shooting way better. Like he's just playing like a bona fide star right now. and he's barely 20 years old. And he's the best defensive rookie that we've seen this century.

That to me is the separator between him and any other candidate that you could have in that conversation. He's averaging six stocks per 75 possessions. Like he's far in the way leading the league and steals and blocks combined in 27 minutes per game. He just has physical tools we've never seen. 7-4 with an 8-foot wingspan and can also move this fluidly and has these sort of instincts and IQ at this age.

It's unbelievable. He wrecks games defensively in ways that like you almost can't, conceive of until you see it in the NBA. Like, you can't really conceive that a physical outlier to the extent that Wembe is can actually exist. And blending that with basketball skill, he's been playmaking better. He's everything that we expected. And I think even a little bit more.

Yeah, the skill, the physical ability, the IQ. I couldn't believe it. Like Carson said, I mean, he's the high, he's the most highly touted guy we've seen since LeBron. And I think he's even better than we expect. expected. I said this on the show, our last show, and Carson laughed at me. Like, he's a baller. And what I meant by that is just he's focused on the game. He is all about some ball. And that's my favorite type of players, the Joe Burroughs of the

world, the guys that are getting to bed early. They're focused on their craft. They're focused on the game. And his, it really is. You can talk about the skill and you can talk about the physical imposition and the traits. His IQ is off the freaking charts, man. The way he sees the floor is is insane. And I think if we opened up the conversation to other guys, like I do think Carson did a great video, a great breakdown on Victor and why he's the best rookie this century on our YouTube channel. I mean, I think you could expand that conversation. We're going to do an all-time rookie draft later, and I'm really intrigued to see where Wembe goes. I mean, I think you could make the case that Victor is, you know, one of the best rookies in an NBA history point blank period, dude. It is ridiculous.

and yeah, he's exceeded my really lofty expectations too, man. He's one of the best rookies ever, I think. Yeah, I'm higher on him as well, and it's really this simple to me. Like, I didn't expect him to, like, be this impactful at the NBA level this quickly. Like, I, like, Wembe, I think the ceiling is more or less exactly where it was when we talked about him all summer long. We knew he had this type of potential. I just didn't think it would happen this quickly. I mean, like you had mentioned Carson, he literally underwent a leap in the middle of the season.

And, you know, you had one of the things that stands out to me, because I'm trying to get some more time with the Dallas Mavericks in the film sessions because I'm going to try to hit them early next week. And I was watching the Maverick Spurs game from the other day. And like, his first shift was fucking outrageous for lack of a better term. And, you know, there's one guy that I can remember having this type of athletic impact as a rookie in its LeBron. And even at a lower level, but similar in the sense that like, because Janus had this two in like 2018, 2019, but he didn't have it early in his career. but where like when you watch an NBA game that has 2018 Janice in it or rookie LeBron or rookie Victor Wembeyanama, it looks different than other NBA games because there's an athlete on the floor that doesn't even resemble any of the other athletes that are in

the league. And you actually see established NBA players be like flustered by some of the things that they run into. you know with yonis and lebron it it was like the transition like holy shit he caught it with three dudes in front of him and somehow just with a live dribble just raced past all of them and dunked it or oh i threw this pass to the wing and they jumped this passing lane and they just shot like a cannon the other way in transition for a dunk or whatever it is like they just had this like like crazy combination of straight line speed and in power to do it but victor just does it with the

absurd link. And that's what it is for him. Every time I'm watching a game with Victor Wembenyama, it just, you can tell there's like an initial phase of every single one of these games. Because a lot of these Spurs games have looked like that Mavs game has where like in the first shift, the other team is just completely shell-shocked because they don't know how to handle what Victor does. And then finally they kind of settle down.

And they were like, oh, yeah, we're way better than this team. And they kind of figured out and they go along the way. But like, yeah, it's just he has a truly, a truly. unprecedented physical profile that other teams don't know how to handle. And to me, that has impacted winning at the NBA level much faster than I expected. Logan, you're first on Brandon Miller. I was really high on Brandon Miller coming into the draft. I wanted the hornets to take him second overall. I'm higher. I think we all did, right? Yeah. Yeah. I believe so. Yeah. Brandon has also exceeded my expectations. Like, first of all, he's an all-time shooter, I think. The way

he shoots off movement at these different speeds, at the different distances. And one thing that six out two is his foot placement. Like it doesn't really matter where Brandon's feet are. Again, from any distance, he can just put it up. And he's just got such a buttery smooth stroke, man. That's the term that I use for Brandon Miller, man. Butter smooth. He just has a smoothness and a fluidity to his game.

It's really elegant and beautiful and beyond his years, something that you don't really see with rookies. He's a great athlete. He is a great defender. He's a good defender now, but I think he's going to be great as it goes along in terms of positioning, on ball, off ball as a help side guy. He's got great length and physical tools too.

Like, Brandon's everything to me, and he's got an advanced handle and IQ. I think Brandon is the building block. Carson, I know put a poll out on our YouTube and on Twitter as well. Who would you rather build around through the Hornets, LaMello, or Brandon Miller? For me, it's wholeheartedly Brandon Miller. And I think it's kind of got lost in the shuffle.

You know, I feel bad for guys like Brandon Miller, for guys like Chet Holmgren, because they're in a rookie class of Victor Wenban Yamas. And we're also enamored with them that you can kind of get lost in the shuffle a little bit. Brandon's also one of the most advanced rookies that I've seen this century in terms of winning impact and in terms of versatility. I think Brandon's a future superstar. I love Brandon Miller. and I would say that with him I'm probably a little bit higher too. Like he looks pretty darn similar to what I expected.

And it's funny, like the hilarious quote from Brandon Miller was when he said over the offseason that Paul George was his goat. But like my God, he's got so much Paul George in him. Like there's a little bit of a different level of athleticism with PG, but when you're talking about six, nine dudes, you just have like,

obscenely smooth handles, crazy comfortable pull-up shooters, the ability to excel both on and on off the ball to defend multiple positions. It's like there's a lot of the same stuff in there. And I think that he's just an archetype that really translates to winning anywhere. And Jason, I remember when you came on our draft show with Colin too, when we were talking about the number two pick,

we were all in agreement that it should be Brandon. And one of the things that you pointed out is that the archetype of hyperathletic downhill guard like Scoot Henderson is one that people often become enamored with, but doesn't always translate to like winning at the highest level, whereas this versatile wing, like a Brandon Miller, two-way shot creator, off-ball shotmaker with some playmaking chops, like that guy is always going to have a spot as a star. And I thought that that was very true.

I also think that Miller was just a slightly better prospect and a better fit alongside Lamello. But he's delivering his last 10 games, he's averaging 23.8 points per game on 48, 42, 89 splits. And I agree that his pure shot making is unbelievable. But the other things that stand out to me, He really does have a rare handle for a guy at this size at this age. And his feel and pace out of pick and roll is pretty exceptional.

Like he will trap people on his back. He's got the hostage dribble down. He can get to the flow to range, but he can also playmake out of those situations. And it's just very atypical, especially from a guy who does have that sort of scoring skill. Wing playmaking development generally is something that takes several years. And guys come into the league much more score first. and then they realize, okay, to be the best offensive player, I need to weaponize my defensive attention to create for others.

And I think that Brandon's already on a very good trajectory there. And defensively, he's in Charlotte, so you can only be so good. Like I wouldn't say he's been a good defender. He's a rookie in Charlotte. But I think you see that he cares more than the other guys. I think you see that he has all the tools. He's super mobile. He guarded oftentimes the opposing team's lead guard at Alabama,

but then he was also this impactful rebounder and secondary rim protector. The guy's just a stud. I think he's going to be an all-MBA kind of guy. I don't know that he'll be like superstar top five player, just because again, like a PG does have that athletic advantage over him. Brandon doesn't have a great first step and he's slight. So getting to the rim for him was an issue in college and it remains an issue in the league. I think he's outside the top 150 in the league in terms of restricted area makes per game.

That's the one thing. But he is like a dream number two on a contending team to me for years. Yeah, I don't think him or scoot really have like, top five player in the league potential, which is, you know, that that would be the one thing that could have made that more complicated in terms of the two archetypes in whether or not you take one at two or at three. I've noticed the same thing in terms of like the first step and just his overall physical strength and like ability to get to his spots. I think you see that in ISO in particular when he tries to beat people straight up. But like it's extreme. I'll have to dig into it.

but like, I can't remember a player walking into the league and being this good of a pull-up shooter as a rookie. Like, I don't, I can't even think of a guy off the top of my head that's in the same conversation. He's already one of the best pull-up jump shooters in the league. There are 66 players that have attempted at least 150. He's 19th on that list in efficiency. And over a point per possession at 1.03. Like, it's just there aren't that many guys in the league, regardless of age, that are, like, efficient pull-up jump shooters. and he's doing it as a rookie. It's extremely rare.

Carson, you mentioned the pick and roll kind of like feel. And Logan, you mentioned the footwork. The handle and footwork stuff has been what's most impressive to me. In my opinion, one of the most important parts of really dynamic scoring in the NBA is the ability to get to a pull-up jumper out of many, many different kinds of footwork and dribble combinations. and that's the thing is like none of these look alike. He can do it. He can square up in midair.

He can do it off a step back. He can do it off a side step. He can, he's got that like one of the ones that he has that's really nasty is he's got that like really aggressive dribble in one direction and then just rise up. And then while the defender's doing the defensive slide, he's already getting up into his shot. He,

like there's some really, really high level stuff there. There was a play at the end of the Pacers game, crunch time possession. where he ran a ball screen and the pacer switched it and he ended up with Miles Turner and his straight ISO at the top of the key and he like dusted him with a dribble move

to a pull-up or jumper at the elbow where Miles Turner just wasn't even in the frame anymore when he rose up and I was like, that was disgusting. And like, again, that's, you know, it's funny, he's been better as like a mid-range shooter than anything else in these pull-up situations, which a lot of times people look at as a downside but like in my opinion those are often the best shots that you can get in rock fights.

And so having a guy that can, that feels comfortable rising and firing at a different combinations and footwork at 15 feet is just super, super valuable. He's also been one of their best plus minus guys. They're five points better per 100 possessions when he's on versus when he's off. All right, Carson really quickly before we get out of here, scoot Henderson, higher or lower than you were after the draft. I'm a little bit lower on scoot. and really that to me just boils down to. I thought that his insane athleticism,

like the combination of first step and really being a strong guard and having this bounce. Like I thought that he would just have a little bit more easy offense on the back of that. And he hasn't really. I think that he's a guy who's settled for a lot of tough jumpers and wasn't a very good jump shooter for Ignite.

Like he has these stretches where he really gets in a rhythm for midrange, but he's erratic even there. And then from three, he was a poor shooter for Ignite. And he's like 31% this year. And at the rim, I think you've seen that he can't physically dominate against NBA guys immediately like he could, those younger or just lower level athletes that he was facing. So he's shooting 51% inside of three feet. So it's just been like a sort of erratic rocky start for him.

The efficiency numbers will look awful. I think that to some extent, like we have moved the goalposts, too far for guards where we've had some guards in recent years who are like really immediately ready to produce at least with good volume and like respectable efficiency like what trey and lucca did in the same class what jaw did that's not normal normally rookie guards are super inefficient they're super turnover prone like and maybe they make some improvements mid-season and i do think that scud has taken some strides as of late so i still see a really athletic guard who i think plays with some good pace out of pick and roll himself who has playmaking

who I think if he wants to be can be a plus defender. But he's certainly further behind on the trajectory compared to a guy like Brandon who it's like, yeah, he's delivered everything and even a little bit more that I expected. Scoot, it's like I still see all the tools, but in terms of production, he obviously hasn't delivered this year. I'm pretty aligned with Carson here. I had slightly higher expectations out of the draft. I have been a little disappointed, but I think Scoot has legitimately gotten better during

this season. And I think it's important to contextualize. I know that Brandon's not in a winning situation either. This year for Portland kind of is. Hey, Scoot, go out there and show us what you can do, man. You know what I mean? This is really a year for him to just get reps and to get better. That being said, you know, I think his jump shot was a question mark heading into the draft. It doesn't look busted. It doesn't look ugly. I like the shots that he generates. I think that Scoot can tend to get off balance a little bit, a little bit with his pull-up jumpers. And I think he needs to work on that. But, you know, like mechanically, it doesn't look busted. It doesn't look ugly. And I did think, like you said, Carson, I did think he was going to be able to physically

impose himself a little more with his athletic traits. But the thing that I really like is his change of pace and his ability to hunt space. When he gets a screen, like Scoot is really good at finding the open area in just navigating and getting into the lane, right? And so for that to me, that's really encouraging. It's going to take time. More of these tough shots are going to fall. He's going to produce better looks. He's going to develop better feel for the game. And that's ultimately it for me. I really like the way that Scoot navigates the half court as a ball handler.

He's really good at hunting space. And while he hasn't been crazy dominant athletically, when he catches defenders flat-footed, damn, Scoot can just blow by somebody and get into the lane. So I'm a little lower on Scoot, but I really do think that he's going to be a, I think Scoot's going to be a really good player one day. I just think it may take a little bit. longer for him to get there.

I'm a lot higher on him than I was a couple months ago. I'll tell you that much. I was really, really disappointed at the start of the season. The one big, you know, kind of silver lining early on was it was clear, kind of similar to what we talked about with Anthony Edwards, that he can get to his spots. Like, in terms of his athleticism, it is difficult for guys to really bump him off his line and get him away from

from where he wants to get on the floor. but the shooting was just so bad early in the year. But there have been some really encouraging trends there. Like he's made 25 pull-up threes this year at 35%. That's not bad. That's over a point per possession. He's an 82% free-throw shooter that typically, you know, kind of bodes well in terms of a player's, you know, touch.

He's actually been a pretty good pick and roll shot creator this year, 0.98 points per possession. That's really not bad for a young guard like him. And he's shown some higher level passing chops than I think a lot of us were expecting. And I think, again, one of the things that I think is important to acknowledge here too is Portland's kind of a weird team in the sense that he's not really getting handed the keys and like, hey, go lead this bad team for 82 games. Like the Blazers were like putting him out there with a bunch of guys who like to get buckets.

Like Dionne Drayton, he loves to take his little face-up jump shots and have his post-touches. Jeremy Grant, like, in his dream world would be a 20-point-per-game guy on a bad team. You know, Anthony Simons is like literally a more further along in his career version of like a high-usage guard. Like Malcolm Brogden has been a guy that they've leaned on in crunch time, a lot of situations. Like they have not just straight up giving scoot the keys and been like, hey, go go get these reps. And so I do, I think, here's the thing. My opinion of Scoot's like ceiling hasn't changed at all. But yeah, this season has definitely been a little bit disappointing just in the way that it's gone down.

That said, I do think Brandon Miller at number two is the right choice. And I think Charlotte is satisfied with their decision there. All right, guys, we've gone for about an hour and a half. So I think it's about time to call it. God bless Paul our producer is probably getting frustrated behind the scenes. thank you all for for supporting the show before we get out of here actually Logan and Carson thank you guys for donating your time today it always means a lot to me can you guys shout out some of the work you've been doing

lately yeah of course well first of all thank you for having us I don't know if I would call it a donation it's more fun than that but yeah so you can find all of our stuff at the nerd session YouTube channel Logan mentioned actually I specifically have done video breakdowns on two of the guys that we just talked about going more in-depth like 10-12-minute video film breakdowns on both Wemby and Brandon Miller. So we're doing that. We also have all of our full shows over there with video talking now, all NBA, but we do NFL stuff when that is in season. And then we do some trivia content on our YouTube channel and also across social media,

TikTok at nerd sesh. Instagram is the same and Twitter is at nerd underscore sesh. I am a huge basketball fan and I could not possibly care less about the All-Star weekend. Do you guys give a shit at all? I agree. I think All-Star weekend is not in a good place. But then I think about it and I compare it to where like the Pro Bowl is at. And I'm like, you know, things could be worse because I literally haven't watched a second of the Pro Bowl in a decade because they're playing flag football.

Like they're not even playing the sport. Yeah. Go ahead, Logan. There's just been very few things. It's disheartening as a football fan to watch the Pro Bowl fall as far as it has, man. And last pro ball I enjoyed was when they played it on Madden. So yeah, at least the All-Star game hasn't dipped that low, man. Yeah, it's crazy because like, like, Paul texted me the other day and he's like, hey,

I need you to record a video, like a 45-second video like with your picks for like who's going to win the three-point content. And like I did it. But it's like we have done no other All-Star content and I have no intention of doing any other All-Star content. Like I thought the Dead giveaway was when they did the Elam ending and they got like two really good games out of it. the LeBron one like fadeaway game and then the one where Anthony Davis won on the free throws and Janus was like you know the block in LeBron

and LeBron was ripping Janus that stuff they got a couple of good games out of it and then they quit on the Elam ending too and they started playing. Why did they do that? Well but to the league's defense the last couple ones were bad though. Yeah. Like I put it on the players.

Yeah. Yeah I guess but like the two best All-Star games that we had gotten since that one, I can't remember exactly of the year, but there was that one really fourth quarter when Kobe was still in there. Maybe it was like 2012 or something. But then outside of that, it's like we got two good All Star games and they were both with the ELE amending.

So yeah, it got bad. But I just think they need to be decisive. Like they're changing everything up. Now we're back to East West, which I'm good with. But then why did we do drafts for a half decade? Why do we do the ELE amending for a few years and then abandon it? It's just all. It's weird.

It's too inconsistent. They don't know what they're doing. But yeah, it's not great. I'm not very excited. how Carson's take how the league has managed the all-star game the way Darwin Ham has managed the legors. All right, guys, that is all we have for today. Like I said, we appreciate you guys supporting the show.

We're going to take the rest of the weekend off and we'll be back next week with some contender talk with Sam Vassini, some power rankings, and a mailback. Make sure you get those mailback questions in. The volume. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob O. to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged.

It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfilts of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it.

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