The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hour 1 - Blockbuster NBA trade

Episode Date: February 3, 2025

JMac steps in for Colin reacting to a blockbuster NBA trade sending Luka Doncic to the Lakers and Anthony Davis to the Mavericks NBA reporter Rachel Nichols joins the show to talk about how Dallas arrived at the decision to trade the 25-year-old superstar DoncicSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Find your local station for The Herd at Fox SportsRadio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeart Radio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or Fxport's Radio. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. All right, it is a Super Bowl weekend. We will be in New Orleans, Thursday, and Friday. It is a wild Monday when we had probably the most staggering, memorable NBA or sports trade in a long time. Welcome into the herd. J. Mack joining me.

It's hard to dissect what we saw yesterday because when you just said it out loud, it looks like the Lakers stole one of the top three players in the league and gave up a very, very good player, but not much else. And L.A. does have a history of always getting the guy. The Lakers more so than even the Yankees get the guy. So they have found their guy for the next, we think, five to ten years. and so let's try to dissect it. So Nico Harrison has for not very long been the general manager of Dallas,

and he's a risk taker. He did the Kyrie move. Everybody criticized him. It worked. He made that big move at the trade deadline last year. It got him into the finals. He's taking big swings. He's different.

But this feels like an absolutely egregiously bad move. So why did he make the move? Well, let's start with this. I think the reason that Michael Jordan is the most popular basketball player of all time. Kobe Bryant's up there too is that relentlessness, that work ethic. That's not Luca. He's often in poor shape and is a lousy defender, and he's hurt increasingly more and more and more due to his bad conditioning. So there's a little shack in Luca, and the Lakers moved off shack, right?

They had a choice. They took Kobe, the relentless worker. So is that the reason they moved off him? The Maverick owners are staring down the barrel of $74 million a year contract. And he doesn't defend. He's hard on teammates, but won't play defense. There's a little Barclay. there's a little shack.

He's not the hardest worker. The max contract now is punitive if you get the wrong guy. Maybe the owners look at M. Beds, mess in Philly, or the Kauai Saga with the clippers and said, new owners, no thank you, not interested. Now, that does not give you an excuse to give away Luca for one first round pick. But I do think if there would have been three first round picks. Anthony Davis and maybe in Austin Reeves. Okay, should we consider that phone call?

I can make some sense of it because I don't think Luca is the perfect player. He has now had three calf injuries in four years, same calf, hasn't played since Christmas, missed the last two training camps. There's stuff here, and clearly a general manager who's willing to take massive swings, and he is hit on the Kyrie move. It's been a hit. He hit on the trade deadline move. There's things here.

I see Luca as being made out as the perfect player, and there's a little shack, a prodigy, but the Lakers eventually said, we're going to take the guy that works harder. I would not have made the trade. I don't like the trade. But I get the MB, the Kauai, the E. injuries, the lack of conditioning, these new

max contract extensions, $74 million a year. What really bothers me, though, is the lack of resources they got back, because I love Anthony Davis. I think he's a very good player. He's not offensively Luca, but he's a much better defensive player, and he's older. But the lack of resources is unbelievable. They got one draft pick. Rudy Gobert got four. Kevin Durant got something like nine, one draft pick?

And if you're totally concerned about health and availability, then why trade for Anthony Davis? It's, it's, there were much better trade partners than the Lakers. And they, they traded him in a vacuum. It's like they didn't tell anybody. It was one team, one first round pick. That's unforgivable.

It's not even like they traded him. It's like they discarded him. He's like an old surfboard by somebody who's lived at the beach for 20 years and bought a new one. Like, I don't even understand it. Here's Nico Harrison. It's the resources and the lack of return that to me just

say it out loud sounds like an awful move. Here's Jason Kidd and Nico Harrison. As we turn the page, I think it's important to know that Jay Kidd and I, we've had a vision in the culture that we want to create since we've been here. And the players that we're bringing in, we believe, exemplary

simplify that and you know we think defense wins championships and we're bringing in one of the best two-way players in the league It is a little shocking, but like in the sense we have to push forward We can as a organization as a team we have a game to play and we have to be pros about it But we understand what Luca has meant to the to the Mavericks and we wish him and his family the best in LA Also maxi and smooth but we have to push forward and we believe we have a team that can do that. All right. There's three primary reasons the Lakers stole him.

Number one, he's 25. He, Dalton Connect is 24. This guy's barely in the league. He is just a new kid. He's 25 years old. He's already got 50 playoff games, and he's so gifted offensively. He's never really been pushed

because he's been so good playing in Europe forever. Number two is he finally lands with a legend in LeBron James. And, I mean, let's be honest about this. LeBron is so dedicated that he has forced quirky players before. Anthony Davis was soft and J.R. Smith was squirley and Kyrie Irving was high maintenance and he got him to work. And number three is the Lakers are aspirational franchise with statues everywhere in the building. And the bottom line here is I think we're going to get a more dedicated Luca. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports

Radio, FS1 and the IHeart Radio app. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers. And guess what? We have some big news. What's the news? Huge news. We created our own podcast called Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to a...

We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band. before Jonas Brothers

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Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guide,

Not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends, me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jared Adano. You might know me as that loud guy who, yes.

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We're back here on the herd. They had to go to the bullpen. Colin not feeling great. A big weekend in Chicago. He's back and he's just chilling out right now in his dressing room. Hopefully back tomorrow. So I'll step in now and take the baton regarding this holy cow Lakers trade. Yes, we will get to Miles Garrett, who about 30 minutes ago demanded a trade out of Cleveland.

We'll get to that. A lot of stuff happening. Super Bowl week here. Very excited. I had a hot take that I'll fire off here regarding the Mavs and the Lakers trade that shook the NBA world over the weekend. And it was operating out of a place of fear is the worst place to operate out of. And I feel like that's what the Dallas Mavericks did here. Okay.

They were afraid of giving Luca the supermax contract $345 million. They were afraid because of why? Because it's conditioning. The guy's always out of shape. Luca shows up. There were reports he was playing close to 260 pounds this season before the cap strain. Fear, they were worried that Luca would never really get his act together off the court. You guys have seen the video from the NBA playoffs this year, or this past season, where Luca was celebrating with a beer, an adult beverage, after the game, celebrating a big victory,

and Michael Finley, the assistant GM, just rolled up and casually, here it is on the screen, and on this one, casually just grabbed the beer from Luca. Luca, that's his father, I believe, in the black shirt. And look at Lucas' face. He's just like, wait, wait, what? But they're in a good mood. They're excited. Hey, we just won.

Luca just brushed it off. But you could tell from that video, it felt like the beginning of the end. I believe that was May 31st of last year. And again, the Mavericks were just simply worried. They were concerned that Luca Donchitz would never be that physical specimen. The guy who was working out 24-7, like LeBron. you guys have seen the videos on his Instagram, and they decided, let's just get him out of town. Now, obviously, there's a mini revolt among Mabbs fans right now.

But Dallas, I'm not going to totally poo-poo the trade from their end. Yes, I saw multiple people grading the trade. Lakers got an A, obviously. You got a generational talent. You get an A. A lot of people gave the Mabbs an F. But there is some excitement. Anthony Davis has a deep relationship not only with Jason Kidd, the head coach.

Jason Kidd, of course, was with the Lakers during. the bubble championship run. But Anthony Davis knows Nico Harrison well, the GM of the Mavs. Nico used to be at Nike, and Anthony Davis was one of his signature clients, obviously, after Kobe Bryant, but Nico signed AD before the draft, and they've known each other for over a decade. So there is that commonality between AD and the Mavs. And let's not forget, Michael Finley, the assistant GM, the guy who took the beer from Luca,

he's from Illinois. He was like a high school legend, ended up playing Michael Jordan back in the middle. the day one-on-one, Anthony Davis from Chicago. So they really felt comfortable with Anthony Davis. And I think it kind of makes sense from the Mabs on what they got in return. What I didn't like, and I'm sure you guys saw this over the weekend, was how could the Mavericks not open this up to the entire league? Why didn't they canvass the NBA and say, hey, maybe we could get eight first-round picks?

I mean, Mikhail Bridges, Mikhail Bridges, to the Knicks was like five first-round picks. I mean, Luca's got to be worth 10, right? 12 first round picks. But it doesn't work like that, guys. Remember, they had to ship Luca somewhere where they know he would sign. Nobody's going to try to rent Luca for a year and then just have him walk and give up the whole franchise. So I actually narrowed it down. And I came up with only a handful of teams, three actually, that could have gone after Luca should there have been a bidding war.

And they're obvious, right? The Celtics in Boston. We know Boston has definitely the ammo. Luca would fit there, a winning franchise, one of the winningest in professional sports in America. They make sense. The New York Knicks makes sense, the AKA Villanova Knicks. Who doesn't love to play for New York? Luca would have clearly gone there and signed long term.

And the other one, kind of a sleeping giant, the Miami Heat, hashtag heat culture. And yes, you can insert your jokes about Fat Luca not fitting into heat culture. But trust me, guys, Pat Riley runs an amazing ship there. Miami, and I believe that the heat could have been in play should Dallas have opened it up. But you guys know how this stuff works? Come on. There's no, the second that the league got wind of Luca Donchich being on the market, it would have been a total disaster. The price would have gone down. Luca would have checked out. Kyrie Irving and company, what are we doing? We're trading Luca? They would have been destroyed in the press. So technically, I think Dallas handled this well.

Now, I still think, obviously, the Lakers won the trade. And if you're a Mavericks fan and you listen to Nico Harrison and Jason Kidd at the podium, you're going to be a little sick to your stomach. Here's Nico Harrison talking to the media yesterday. As we turn the page, I think it's important to know that Jake and I, we've had a vision in the culture that we want to create since we've been here. And the players that we're bringing in, we believe, exemplify that. And, you know, we think defense wins championships.

And we're bringing in one of the best two-way players. players in the league. Yeah, no doubt about that. Anthony Davis, I mean, that's one of Colin's favorite guys. I mean, Colin has him, like, is an MVP candidate, top 10 player in the league. I have AD more in the top 15 range, but he's been incredible this weekend. Now we need to move to the Lakers portion of the program, and you guys know I coach my kids in sports.

So we had back-to-back games yesterday. My son played and then my daughter. And yes, I am that guy who wore a Lakers T-shirt with a Lakers sweatshirt over it. So when I take off the sweatshirt because I'm sweating on the sidelines like a maniac coaching middle school kids, I've still got Lakers gear on. And folks, I can promise you, if 30 people came up to me at the game, Jay Mack, what do you think about the Lakers? We got Luka.

30 for 30, everybody was stoked. Not one person was questioning this trade. This is rare that everybody loves getting Luca Donchich. And folks, I know Rob Polinka has been one of the most maligned front office guys in the league. Los Angeles, for whatever reason, people cannot stand Rob Polinka. Guys, I'm telling you, all he's done is push the right buttons. He has now set the Lakers up for success for at least, at least the next seven years. Maybe you want to extend it to 10, fine.

But they had no plan post-Lebron. And I think Colin and I had talked about this on the show. Hey, man, can you build around Anthony Davis at 32, 33 when LeBron leaves? I just don't know that that makes sense. and you know, Anthony Davis has a lot of wear and tear on that body. We know Charles Barkley famously has called him street clothes because he's always injured. I don't know how AD is going to fare health-wise into his 30s. So that's why Dallas win now kind of works.

We'll get back to Dallas later in the show. They're really built to hang with the best teams in the West. So why are Lakers fans excited? Well, I don't know. They just got a guy who was first team all NBA the last five years. I mean, he came into the season as the MVP favorite. for my money, and you guys, you can look it up on my Instagram, last July, July 4th, I said, Luca Donchis, best player in the league.

I've held this for like three years. I know Yokic is winning MVP and everybody loves Joelle and Bede. Just give me Luca. He's unbelievable. And for the gibronies out there who want to say, Luca doesn't play, and I get fired up about this because Luca's dad gave an interview over the weekend, and it was translated into English, and you could see what he was saying, he's kind of ticked off at this narrative that Luca's lazy.

Folks, Luca Donchers played 70 games last season, average 35 minutes a night. Okay? Then he went to the playoffs and carried, carried Dallas on his back. I know they had Kyrie and Derek Lively and PJ Washington. It was the Lucas show. In 22 playoff games, he averaged 40 minutes a night. Points, rebounds, assist.

He's doing everything. So he played 92 games last year and we're concerned about Luca being fat and out of shape? This is total nonsense. Yes, occasionally, some of the European players, Yokic is in the same boat, they got that dad bod. Okay, I know Luke is 25 and has a dad bod, maybe not great, but there's a quarterback here in the Super Bowl who's going to be playing this week who has embraced the dad bod.

His name is Patrick Mahomes. I don't know if you're familiar with his work, but he also is not a chiseled LeBron with six-pack abs. That's just, that's not how Mahomes rolls. That's not Yolkich, and that's not Luca. they're three of the best players in their respective sports. Luca's going to be fine. When you can build around Luca for the next seven to ten years in L.A.

And not totally have to worry about LeBron, you've got a secession plan. And everybody knows, like, listen, LeBron, maybe he's got this year left. Maybe he's got two. I mean, you could stretch it to two if you want. And yes, I saw LeBron put up a triple double in MSG over the weekend. No AD beat the Knicks,

who were one of the best teams in the league, one of the top five title contenders LeBron put on a show. Like he could still do it. And him joining forces with Luca Donchitz for a season? Folks, I got a couple buddies out here with season tickets to the Lakers. Trust me. I've already hit them up. Hey, let me know.

Let me know when you need somebody to wing man it to a game because this is going to be one of the best shows in the league. LeBron and Luca, essentially a passing of the torch. And I do want to remind some people, okay? It was just last year that the Golden State Warriors made calls to the Lakers about LeBron. They wanted to get in the LeBron business. LeBron is not done. He's still got gas left in the tank.

I don't know how this Luca LeBron thing is going to necessarily work initially, but Luca made it work with Kyrie Irving. There were a lot of questions. Hey, are Luca and Kyrie going to work? They figured it out. They got to the finals. I know they got smoked by Boston. Boston was a way better team.

so now you join Luca and LeBron and you're like, ooh, ooh, the potential's off the charts. And yes, I can hear you guys shouting, we don't have any defense. Luca don't play defense. Austin Reeves is a turnstile. LeBron can't guard anybody. Let's take a deep breath.

The Lakers, by winning this trade, did not give up both of their future first-round picks. So they still have ammo if they want to go out and chase a Miles Turner in Indiana. if they want to get Clint Capella, Nick Claxton, there are bigs around the league that could come in. I'm not saying the Lakers are one in the chip this year, but how can you not be beyond excited for the Lakers' future with Luca Donchich? Okay?

I know everybody, well, not everybody, some people on social media seem to think the league is rigged, which I guess is the buzzword in 2025, right? Kansas City Chiefs. Obviously nobody thinks the NFL's rigged or the NBA. it's a funny topic, right? Boy, Lakers. Boy, Magic Johnson, going back, James Worthy. How are they always getting great players? Shack decided to pick the Lakers. Kobe Bryant famously forced his way to the Lakers by telling Charlotte, I will rather go to

Italy and play. And they had to move on and say, fine, fine, we'll trade Kobe. And then they got Pau Gasol in one of the great heists in NBA trade history. And now, look at this. Look at this. The Lakers players. acquired via trade. Wilk Chamberlain. Decent. Okay, he's a top 10 player all time. Jabar, he's a top 5 player all time.

Kobe Bryant, certainly a top 10 player all time. Palga Sol, he's going to be in the Hall of Fame where he is. AD, who has a title and is on track to be a Hall of Fame player. And now Luca Dantage? Like, guys, that list is unbelievable. At some point, we got to say, you know,

maybe the Lakers just know what the hell they're doing in chasing stars. Okay? And you look around the West and you're like, okay, I got Luca and LeBron and I'm supposed to be afraid of OKC. I got Luca and LeBron and I'm worried about Yokic and the Nuggets. Like I think the Lakers are going to firmly be in the mix, assuming health, you know, everybody's fine. And I do wonder, you know, I mentioned Austin Reeves. He's my guy.

Regular listeners and viewers of this show. No, I'm an Austin Reed's defender. not sure how he really fits now with the Lakers. So I put a pause on my buy the Austin Reeves jersey. I have not done that as yet, but Luca Donch's jersey will be next. I think it makes sense if you're the Lakers. You say, can we package Rui? Can we package Austin Reeves and that number one pick go big game hunting?

Now we've got a rim protector. I know people don't like it when the Lakers are on top. But this Luca Donch's thing, I was grinning ear to ear. So Saturday night, you know, wife was out of town. with her friend, and I'm in town with the kids. We're watching this movie Air Bud. I don't know if you guys have seen this from like the late 90s. I don't even think our producers were born when this movie came out.

And, you know, they need to go to the bathroom. So I just look at my phone and I've got this just a flurry of text messages coming in. And the first one is from this guy who played high levels of basketball. He's now a referee. J. Mack, I got to ask. This seems too good to be true. How did we get Luca? And my first reaction is, wait.

Luca. Again, I'm watching Air Bud. I tell the kids, hold on. Hold on. We got to pause the movie. And I dive in. And for the next hour, I'm just riveted by this just unbelievable turn of events. It really felt like a dream, guys. It genuinely felt, wait, did this really happen? Like, who trades? One of the best players in the NBA in his prime? It's just an unfathomable turn of events. And we're going to have Rachel Nichols, longtime NBA insider. She's going to come on this. set here next and talk about the Lakers acquiring Luca. The dynasty continues in Lakers. Lakers exceptionalism.

It's a thing, people. So we're back after this with Rachel Nichols talking Lakers. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, Steve Kavino. And I'm Rich Davis. And together we're Kavino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio. You can catch us weekdays from 5 to 7 p.m. Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and, of course, the IHeart Radio app. Why should you listen to Kavino and Rich?

We talk about everything, life, sports, relationships, what's going on in the world? We have a lot of fun talking about the stories behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture. Stories that, well, other shows don't seem to have the time to discuss. And the fact that we've been friends for the last 20 years and still work together, I mean, that says something, right? So check us out. We like to get you involved too. Take your phone calls, chop it up as they say. I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio.

Maybe the most interactive show on planet Earth. Be sure to check out Covino & Rich live on Fox Sports Radio and the IHeart Radio app from 5 to 7 p.m. Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific. And if you miss any of the live show, just search Covino and Rich wherever you get your podcast and, of course, on social media. That's Covino and Rich. Hey, it's us to Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news.

What's the news, name? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide.

range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band

before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey Jonas. and then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast.

But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman

help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and Headwere writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and

friends on the I-heart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The story I've told myself about love or relationships can then shape my behavior and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility of connection.

This Mental Health Awareness Month Tune into the podcast deeply well with Debbie Brown and explore the journey of healing, self-discovery, and returning to yourself. We explore higher consciousness, emotional well-being, and the practices that help you find clarity, peace, and self-mastery in a world that can feel overwhelming.

The world is becoming lonelier. We're not becoming more social and connected. We're becoming more individualized, but we actually meet people in connection. If you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole, this podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to deeply well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, I'm Jared Adano. You might know me as that loud guy who yells out, help on the internet.

Help! Somebody! Please! But there's so much more to me than me. I'm an actor. I'm a comedian. and recently I've become quite the helper myself. And on my new podcast, Hope from a Hypocrite,

I'll be changing lives, helping people in need with my sage advice and thoughtful solutions. Sike, I'm a comedian. I'm not qualified to give good advice. Join me and my comedian friends as we riff rant and recommend some of the most legally dubious advice known to man.

If I'm calling you, even if you're on your phone, let it ring twice. One ring is too skinny. Gary. Cream of chicken suit. Hey, cream. Cream a chicken suit.

This is Help from a Hypocrite, the worst advice from the dumbest people you know. Listen to Help from Hypocrite as part of the Mike Cultura podcast network available on the IHartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Back here on the herd,

Jason McIntyre step it in for Colin Cowherd. Joining us now on the set, the great Rachel Nichols, Fox Sports NBA Insider, covered the NBA. forever. Rachel, how you doing? I am better than Colin, apparently, who's sick. So you and I are healthy, and that's a good day for us now. And listen, great time, great day to be on the show talking NBA. I mean, Rachel, you know, you talk to people around the league. Yes. Look, what has been the

reaction around the league since, you know, the earth shook Saturday night when the Lakers got Luca? It's really almost impossible to quantify the amount of shock that we have felt from every corner of the NBA. I have been covering this league for the better part of three decades. You have GMs, executives who have around the league for 40, 50 years and have never seen anything like this. And part of it is the surprise of trading away a 25-year-old who has made the five last all-MBA teams, who is a perennial MVP candidate who took his team to the NBA finals seven months ago. But in addition to that, even more so than the fact that they wanted to trade him away, it was how they did it. And I think part of that is the nitty-gritty of NBA front offices.

They're always interested in that aspect, maybe more than the fans. But how they did it has been a huge shock because it seems that the Mavericks, in trading away this incredible asset, left a bunch of other things on the table that they could have gotten for him. And really no one understands that. Yeah. It seems like the tipping point may have been, hey, we just got to the finals. Luca comes back kind of out of shape. Then he has the calf injury again.

there were reports he was close to 260. That's like Miles Garrett's size. I don't know. Do you get a sense that's kind of what precipitated this deal? I mean, I think it's a lot of things over a lot of years, and I will say we don't know everything. And I have to assume, Nico Harrison is a smart guy. Jason Kidd is a smart guy.

I know Jason wasn't directly involved in this trade, but in general, this is not a dumb team that has a history of terrible transactions, right? So, you know, they obviously traded away a few guys under the Mark Cuban era you'd like to have back, but my point is that there must have been something that they knew that we don't know. What we do know is that, yes, there have been conditioning issues with him over the years. If he really is in the 260s, that's nearly 20 pounds overweight.

And we know that leads to soft tissue injuries, which Luca has had several of. In fact, he is out with one right now. So the idea that he might be perennially unavailable, whether he was sort of flouting team rules, whether there was a bit of sort of, hey, we've asked you to do this and you've refused time and time and time again, whether it's the arguing with officials that they've asked him to tone down and that has actually cost his team specific losses that you can point to. And I have to assume there's more to the story, right? So if you add all of that stuff up over all the years, I personally would still not trade Luca Dunchage. I don't know what the unknown thing is that we don't know.

So maybe that would tip me over as well. But in general, the idea of trading a 25-year-old who really isn't even in his prime yet, you are a betting against the next 10 years of Luca's future. That is a heavy bet to make with a guy who has frankly been a prodigy since he was 11 years old and who you were incredibly lucky by like six strokes of luck to get him in the first place. You had other front agents, front offices in front of you, you know, make decisions that they probably shouldn't have made just for you to get him. And the idea that they did and then decided to trade him away is shocking. So you've been doing the media longer than I have, but there have been people who've doubted us.

I'm sure everybody in any job has been doubted. And you know, you look at Luca. Essentially, the Atlanta Hawks were like, eh, we like them, but we'd rather have trade young. Sacramento drafted, I believe it was Marvin Bagley over Luca Donchich. And now Dallas had him. He took him to the finals and they trade him. So that's three teams that have quit on him or passed on him, and he's only 25. And Dallas cost him over $100 million with the Supermax.

Do you think all of this adds up to Luca maybe being more locked in and being like, hey, nobody believes in me. I'm going to get my butt in shape and take over. This could be a springboard to Luca for even more greatness if that's possible. Look, if he does need a wake-up call, this was it, right? If it really is a matter of, hey, he just needs to change his attitude, change his approach. If this doesn't wake you up, I don't know what will. And again, the Mavericks are betting against his next 10 years. The Lakers are obviously betting on his next 10 years.

years, that he will be that superstar that they need to follow LeBron James, that he will get his act together in the ways that the Mavericks felt that he couldn't. And I have to think it's possible. Luca also not a dumb guy. And in fact, one of the guys he really is close with and looks up to in the league is Nicola Yochich, who went through a little bit of the same thing. Obviously not with quite the attitude issues that were described around Luca. Again, I don't know, I'm not in the room. But Yokuch certainly had a very laissez-faire approach to his diet, right? and sort of the team would ask him to get in shape and he really was kept drinking coax every day and all the other stuff and wouldn't really work out and he just decided kind of going into the 2019 2020 season that things had to change and he had a severe alteration to his diet to his workout routine to what he did during this season and it obviously paid off immediately and it led him to multiple MVP it led him to become a champion so if that happens to luka if yokic pulls him aside and said all right now now this is it. Now it's time. If someone in his family or if Luca himself decides this is it,

then we could see a very determined, very different player for the Lakers that the Mavericks and their fans are going to have to watch for the next 10 years. Speaking of Mavs fans, I'm sure you've seen the memes, kids crying with like six Luca jerseys next to them in their bedroom. It's understandable. However, there is a positive here. Anthony Davis is a plug-and-play guy. Now you've got a lot of depth he gets to play four, right? Lively when he comes back and then Gafford. the bigs. They're kind of built to hang with Denver. I think Max Christie, I know people are like forgetting him. He's a good defender. I think the Lakers are 15 and 8 since he became a starter. Like, there's a world where they can hang with SGA and OKC. Like, sorry, SGA and OKC. Do you think that Dallas there's a world where they maybe get back to

the finals this year? I mean, sure. I mean, no one expected them to get the finals last year and they did it. So yes, of course that kind of scenario is possible. And I don't think there's any question. or not much of a question, that they are a better team this year, this season, with Anthony Davis in there than with Luca, who's had a ton of injury issues this year. However, that's this season, which lasts what? Four more months? I mean, come on. And by the way, they have other injuries on their team that they still have to deal with Dallas does. But you cannot underscore underplay anything what the next 10 years that you just traded away was. And look, Luca was due for a Supermax contract. he could have signed it as early as this summer

that also precipitated some of this discussion. Nico Harrison said as much during his press conference yesterday that look, it's clear that they were nervous about signing him for $350 million and then getting into a situation with injuries or other things where they're in the Philadelphia Joel Ambide situation, right? Or, oh gosh, where do the Clippers doing with Kauai Lennar?

Now he's on a better contract than he was before, but still, like you're paying for a guy who generally hasn't been there for big stretches of the season. The fear of that was clearly a huge motivator. I would argue you could have still signed him to that Supermax and then traded him a year later. There's a mandatory waiting period, but you could have traded him after that.

And you still would have gotten a ton of takers around the league. And by the way, if you had done that, then you really could have opened up the bidding. Now, the argument is they did a one-team trade with the Lakers because they didn't want to sort of make a mess of the season, stuff you were talking about in the last segment, that, you know, they wanted to not have to, not have that discussion of where will he go and therefore being railroaded into only one or two

choices. To me, that doesn't really hold because the Lakers traded for him sight unseen. The Lakers traded for him without knowing what kind of contract he would sign a year and a half from now. And by the way, I think if you polled most teams in the league, not all, but most, they would take a guaranteed year and a half of Luca Donchich, which is still left on his current contract right now, and say, we can convince him that this is the place he wants to stay. Give us a year and a half. The Mavericks did it with Kyrie Irvin when they traded for him and only had three months to convince him. They traded for him near the trade deadline and then he was going to be a free agent that summer. And they gave a bunch of stuff away for him and their goal was, hey, we think when he's here, he's got a great relationship with Jason Kidd, we can convince him to stay.

And by the way, they did. So the idea that Luca could have made a list and that they wouldn't have been able to have any takers if it wasn't his quote preferred destination. I personally don't really buy that. I think Luca Donchich is such a unique talent and the idea that you would get him for a year and a half, look what Toronto did with Kauai Leonard. Right? They were like, great, we've got him for a year.

We hope we can convince him to stay, but even if we can't, it's worth it. And guess what? They couldn't convince him, and it was still worth it. So I don't really buy the whole, hey, if you had opened it up and his preferred destinations, and that would have put us in a worse position. I can't imagine it would put you in a worse position

than negotiating with only one team and having that team not even give up, it's full arsenal. And again, this goes back to your first question of, hey, what are people around the league saying? It's the methodology as much as the actual trade itself. The Lakers had two first rounders they could have given up, and they didn't. They only gave up one.

And I see from the Lakers side why they're, A, thrilled about that, and B, saying, hey, we don't know, he could go anywhere in a year and a half. I mean, I understand their argument to Dallas. if I am Dallas, I am saying, that's great. We need both your picks to make this work. Otherwise, I'm opening it up to the rest of the league. And I guarantee you, especially in a franchise where ownership really values having a star that Lakers would have said, all right, all right, fine, here's the second pick. So do you think the Lakers use that other pick and maybe Austin Reeves, maybe Rui, to go get a center?

I know Maxi can kind of play center, Marquif Morris, but they're small ball guys. They're not protecting the room. They're not stopping Yokic. No. Your thoughts, do the Lakers make another move? I mean, they're in a great position to make another move now, right? Because before it was, I don't know, do you get rid of Austin Reeves because of what he means to the team right now? Well, you don't need that anymore because you have Luca Donchich.

And so I think that they are much more flexible. They still have a first round pick to give out. There is no question. A, they need a center presence, and they need a defensive center. Because the downside of this trade that the Lakers just made is that they might score 200 points a game. but the other team might score 230. So, you know, they have got to get a strong defensive presence in the middle. And I expect them to go out and do that because they have assets now

that they didn't even have before this because now they have more flexibility with their roster. And they still have the first round pick that should be in Dallas. So I'll get to the Super Bowl in a sec. But one other trade that went down, we haven't even touched on it, Deerrin Fox. And a bizarre trade goes from the Sacramento Kings to now the Spurs playing with Wembeyanama. they didn't give up Castle or Vassel. Spurs look kind of dangerous. They're on the outside looking in now.

Zach Levine, I'm his big Zach Levine guy. He goes to the Kings. You look at the Spurs. Once they make a move and they will, is this a team that could upset a Houston or a Memphis in the first round? I'm excited for Wembenyama. Yeah, absolutely. Look, I think, and I've been saying since before he was drafted,

mark my words, people, Victor Webbenyama will be a top 10 player of all time. All time. Period. period. He could be a top five player. Will Luke will be a top 10 player? I can say that with much less certainty. I would put Victor Webbenyama ahead of anyone other young player in the NBA in terms of my prediction of that. In fact, I put him ahead of, I don't know, I mean, LeBron James obviously is ahead

of that. But there's a very few guys I would put ahead of him in my all-time prediction because, I mean, look, he could get injured and obviously all bets are off. But the way his motor is, his talent, his alien form, quote-unquote, that we've never seen before in this league, his drive and the fact that he's in an organization that, as you just pointed out, makes super smart moves, has a great coaching tree, whatever happens with Greg Popovich going forward, he will clearly be around the team, and therefore his people will be around the team. I mean, he is in the driver's seat of this entire next generation of the NBA, and Darren Fox, as far as I'm concern won the lottery in terms of getting to be the point guard who has the first major

audition of hey i could be this guy's partner for the next five to seven to ten years and the idea that you could get partnered as a point guard with victor and you're basically saying yes sign me up for those championship rings it's a great deal for fox it's why he targeted the spurs in this trade saying that he didn't want to resign with sacramento and yeah san antonio made a great deal as they do, and as we would have hoped the Mavericks would have done with the asset that they had. Very good. I would ask about Zach Levine, but the producers will yell, we don't do

kings on the show. You know, that's really weird. Not you, Ryan. But let's go to the NFL. So I grew up in the D.C. area, and my parents would get the Washington Post, and I would get it every morning read sports section. Rachel was one of the prominent writers. Will Bondcourt. I love the Washington Post.

And you obviously have covered D.C. sports for a while. The commanders just made an incredible run in the postseason. Cowher did make that call. I got to give him credit. Look at my face. I know. You're very excited. But I have to ask, the way it ended was rough. Eagles look good. Do the Eagles have a chance to, you know,

thwart the three-peat here that the Chiefs are going for? I didn't just work in Washington, D.C. I grew up in that area. So I am really genetically engineered to never say anything nice about the Philadelphia Eagles or anyone else in the NFCEs. So as far as I'm concerned, Chief, Chief, Chief, Chiefs. And look, I didn't like, the one thing I didn't like about the way the Chiefs have approached this season is right on the podium. After they won number two last year, they were already talking about three peeting in number three. And I always think that's incredibly dangerous.

It's not how you should be focusing on, you know, Bill Belichick, one game at a time, one day at a time, that sort of thing is how you stack up multiple championships. That being said, even though they've had a ton of close calls this season, they keep winning. and I am just not betting against Patrick Mahomes. I'm not doing it, and I'm especially not doing it against an NFC East team. Thank you very much. And I wanted to start with Washington because we haven't got to the Miles Garrett stuff. It's such a busy morning. But I made a list before the show of teams that make sense for Miles Garrett

who demanded a trade from the Brown. And at the top of my list is Washington. I mean, you've got the quarterback on the rookie deal. You can spend the defense, what they give up, 55 to the Eagles. Miles Garrett is an exceptional player. I mean, Washington is drafting late first. I believe it's 29. Yeah.

I mean, are you willing to part with the pick and whatever, within reason? Yeah. I mean, Miles Garrett would make a ton of sense in D.C. I'm always a big believer as a sports analysis, a sports analyst and sort of just as a fan, frankly, too, is that the known quantity is better than the pick. I know a lot of GMs always love the pick. Give me the pick.

The pick is full of possibilities. Guess what? You are betting if you prioritize the pick that that pick is going to be better than Miles. Guess what? I'm not willing to take that chance. I just want Miles. Yeah, yeah. Bring him in. Absolutely.

And the other team I would have is a team out here that you know well, the Rams, who love to swing for the fences. The GM in the front office, very savvy. Do they, can you see them making a move? One last push. Sounds like Stafford's in, based on the late reports last week. Do you think any chance the Rams get involved with the Miles Garrett, who, you know, is a transformational defensive player?

Yeah, I absolutely do. First of all, they have a very savvy front office. Yeah. And they are more in the win now mode with Starrant. Stafford than they would be if they had a younger quarterback who was, you know, just starting out, obviously, Jaden Daniels is a younger quarterback, but that situation is a little bit unique and different. I absolutely think it would be smart for the Rams to get involved. This is a proven guy. Yeah. And again, that is hard to come by in any of these leagues.

Yeah, all right. Rachel Nichols, she wore red. Is it red for Washington or Kansas City? I mean, I'll leave that to you to just out. I like it. Hey, thanks for rescuing me here in the final hour, you know. Or the first hour, felt like a final hour. Can I say one more thing about the Mavericks and their fans? I think that's the other underrated part of all of this is that you mentioned the Mazz fans and the crying. They actually had a casket out there at the arena yesterday, protesting,

and there were profanity written on the sidewalk in front of the Dirk statue. These people thought they were getting a Luca statue next to the Dirk statue. There's an expression, as I'm sure you know, Mab's Fans for Life, MFFL. That's the sign-off. That's the tag that they put at the end of every social media post. This really shook the for-life part of a lot of Dallas fans. And I do think that damage with the fans is something the franchise did not anticipate. All right, 15 seconds, over under one and a half titles for Luca with the Lakers.

I don't know. Come on, I don't know. Got to go over. Hit the over two times. I'm not willing to make that bet. Hey, guys, it's us and the Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick.

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