The Herd with Colin Cowherd - HOUR 1 - Duke-UNC, LeBron, Rams

Episode Date: April 4, 2022

Thoughts on the Duke-UNC game on SaturdayLeBron's April Fools' day tweet was in poor tasteThe reason Bobby Wagner signed with the RamsGuest: Roy Williams Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Yep, that's me, Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

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Tonight, Kansas, North Carolina, I have no idea. I've been doubting Carolina the whole time. They're legendary coach, former coach, Roy Williams, joins me this hour. I think that was the greatest college basketball game I've seen since Christian Leitner hit a fallaway jumper against Kentucky at the Spectrum in Philadelphia. What a masterpiece performance. I was exhausted watching it. It was a great, great showcase.

The tournament's been wild, which we kind of expected. There were so much parody in men's college basketball this year. But it's been great. And congratulations to South Carolina and Don Staley, the championship. dominated Yukon yesterday. Dominated. That's one of the all-time great teams

in women's college basketball. Very impressive. Let's start with this. Coach Kay's career is over. Duke will now have John Shire. He'll go on and do really good things, I imagine. You know, it's funny. The TV rating for that Duke Carolina game

was massive. I tell my kids this all the time. All care about things that you care about. So choose things you care about and we can enjoy them together. Don't fake it. And, you know, college football and the NFL have a partnership. NBA and college basketball, for some reason, don't.

But I think college basketball teaches the NBA a few things. I'm going to give you a list of players in the NBA, star players in the NBA, who missed a game over the weekend as of Thursday until right now. Here's a list of guys. LeBron, Anthony Davis, Steph Curry, Clay Thompson, Bradley Beale, Dame Liller, John Morant, Devin, Becer, Paul George, Kaui Leonard, Jimmy Butler, Zion Williamson, Jamal Murray, Ben Simmons. I know, I know they're all hurt.

Yeah, in most cases, they are. But what if they had one game left to win a championship? Some of those guys would make the floor. College basketball skill level isn't great. The officiating drives me nuts. But, man, do they care? The college basketball media and college sports media is obsessed with players getting paid. I don't know.

When I watch them, that doesn't appear to be. what they really care about. They care about the game. And the sports media really cares deeply about when coaches yell at players. You know what's funny about that? These players cry for these coaches. They always have their back. You know who doesn't have a coach's back? The coddled NBA stars who often undermine their coach. Hard coaching matters and it works and hard parenting matters and it works, and you saw it on display. This was a master's class in American sports. The Carolina Center had a nasty ankle sprain during it. He said after, you'd have to cut my leg off for me not to play against Kansas on Monday night. 18 lead changes, 12 ties, coaches occasionally barking at

their players and barking at the officials and players crying afterwards. Yeah, like if you care, I care. The NBA has normalized missing starts. It bothers me. Maybe I'm too old school. I'm out of touch. But when you watch that game, it wasn't always the best officiated. You don't always think it's the best players.

But man, do they care? And man, are they into it? And that game mattered to the student body and the players and the coaches. It mattered to the bands. It mattered to the stadium. It mattered to everybody. You can't fool people on that. As LeBron was taking another must-win

Laker game off. A kid for Carolina said, you just cut my ankle off. I'm playing Monday. How do I not love that? I'm sorry if I'm old school. But I was mesmerized by this, not always the officiating, not always the coaching, not always the players, mesmerized by how much they care. And whereas college football in the NFL have a respectful partnership, the NBA appears to resent what college basketball is all about. So they create the G League. And yeah, a guy can make some money. I'm not against that.

But I got to tell you, I wouldn't know who these college basketball players are when they go to the NBA if they didn't play college basketball. That's how I fell in love with Jalen Suggs at Gonzaga, now with the Orlando Magic. What if he had gone G League to the Magic? Good luck with a shoe deal. I'd have never seen him play. I just thought this weekend was great. I thought the tournament was great.

it was the one sport that was canceled due to COVID, and the ratings have indicated, we missed it. It's imperfect, but it's incredibly valuable. That's what passion does. Here was Coach K after the loss. As a coach, I'm just concerned about these guys. I mean, I see, you know, they're already crying on the court. And, I mean, that's the only thing you can think about.

And then going into the locker room, you know, I've said my entire, career or when I knew what the hell I was doing, that I wanted my seasons to end where my team was either crying tears of joy or tears of sorrow because then you knew that they gave everything. And I had a locker room filled with guys who were crying. A tip of the cap to both schools and both amazing programs for one of the best three hours of sports television, I can recall. It was absolutely fantastic. Tonight, don't look at me.

I got no idea. I've been doubting Carolina the whole time. Caleb Love takes games over. I don't know how Carolina. I thought about this during the game. I thought whoever wins the Duke Carolina game, how in God's name do they match that intensity for Monday night, Kansas, who had an easier dominating win?

I don't know how they do it. I have no idea who wins tonight. Can't wait to talk to Roy Wend. Williams because the man who replaced him has done a remarkable job. And what a story that is. It's very rare when you get a big brand in sports and they're an eight-seater and an underdog. So you get all their brand and all their talent and all their passion and all their

coaching and all their excellence. And they have a chip on their shoulder because nobody believed in them. That's what you have in Carolina tonight. You don't get that. Alabama doesn't go into a lot of bowl games as an underdog. You know, either does, you know, Oklahoma or Ohio State. When you get both of those, hunger. and a big brand and playing well.

Can't wait for tonight. Well, Friday, I didn't work Friday. Joy did, did a great job. It was only an hour show, and she crushed it, Alexie Lawless World Cup draw. We'll get into that later. LeBron sent out a tweet on April Fools. It kind of was a thud.

The tweet was, hey, I'm out for the season officially. See you all in the fall. It didn't really read the room. The problem with the tweet is, I didn't think it was a joke. It was sort of on brand for 2022. There's nothing funny in Los Angeles about this Laker mess. LeBron feels, and I'm going to be as honest as I can here,

because I like LeBron, but he feels disengaged above it all. He wanted Westbrook. It's a disaster. He steers clear of it, not my call. LeBron's fallen into a, and I guess it's almost inevitable, when you're as rich and powerful and great and have the legacy, into a, I'm sort of too cool for this mess. vibe, you know, like he had a checklist of things he wanted to do in L.A.

Move here, get rid of the young guys, get A.D. through clutch sports, win a title and crush in business. Yeah. Yeah, he got all those. And now what's the city of Los Angeles and the Lakers left with? Just an old, dilapitated, uneventful, uninspiring roster. And LeBron, hey, man, not my issue, man. I guess he won.

It's felt in the last year that LeBron got a lot more out of the city of Los Angeles than the city of Los Angeles has gotten out of LeBron. We have a Super Bowl champion now. We also have the best run baseball team. We still have our beaches, mountains, our great food, our great city. And there's really no reason to be beholden to LeBron. He's played about 100 of the 150 games on the schedule the last two years. He's missed a third of the season.

Now, of course, he's in his 19th year, so I'm not holding it against him, but this franchise decided to give LeBron everything he wanted. They're on a six-game losing streak. They're 16 games under 500. Don't joke about it. Like the Duke, Carolina, Kansas kids, Villanova kids, at least pretend you care. They really do.

We know you don't. Kind of pretend you care. You won, you got AD, you blew up the roster. You got your title, you got your brand, you made all your money. I don't resent any of it. But this is your mess too. Be nice if you occasionally cared and owned it. That April Fool's tweet landed exactly how it should have.

Really, really poorly. All right, we got a lot of stuff today. Roy Williams. Boy, was that guy happy? I sat there and it's like, he's like, you. You know, it's obviously, if you're a Carolina fan, it's such a wonderful school. You know, he obviously wants to beat Duke, right? Like, obviously, but, you know, the program gets handed over and you don't know.

You know, does Duke know how John Shire's going to do? You don't really know. A lot of times the legend leaves and you have like a handpicked successor, you bring him in and it looks like it's going to work and it doesn't work. And so for the fact that Carolina, it's working and so unconventionally, the last time Carolina was like an eight seed and ended up in a final four. I don't have an encyclopedia in front of me or Wikipedia. I'm not sure that's ever happened. But there were just so many emotions watching that game. And you see Shoshchevsky's 75 and he's working his way in and

then leaving on a golf cart with Mickey his wife. And it's just, there were so many things. You know, there's a book out, Ian O'Connor wrote a book on Coach K. And when Dean Smith and Coach K. Dean Smith had this legendary program and Coach K was this little guy from Army with a losing record. And one of the first times or the first time they met, you know, Dean Smith's team rolled over Duke. And just before the clock

was expired, Dean Smith came over to shake Shoshchowski's hand as he won. And Shishovsky pushed back and said, Dean, what are you doing? The game's not over. And it signaled you're going to be in a fight. I may be a little guy from Army and you don't know who I am, but you're going to be in a fight. And I feel like we kind of, now

it's the old Shishki, being the Dean Smith and the new coach at Carolina and Hubert Davis. And it's just like, man, man, the more things change, the more they stay the same. Now it's Duke crossing their fingers. You know, and now Carolina was crossing their fingers, excuse me, with a new coach. He's exceeded expectations. And it's the legendary coach, not Dean Shoshchewski now, moving out. So they've kind of flipped as program.

all these years later. And tonight, Carolina against Kansas, I don't know. I just don't know. I think Kansas is the better team. But as we've watched in this tournament, it's not a seven-game series. It is one basketball game with a bunch of 20-year-old kids and who's going to make shots. That Duke kid, the Williams kid that missed the free throws, you're like, oh, and he's such a wonderful representation of Duke and student athletes.

Your heart sinks. And you're like, yeah, of course he can miss free throws. He's a kid. This is what they do. They make mistakes. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1 and the IHeart Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged.

It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days I'd put on 10 pounds, I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clipper Taylor the 4th.

You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music.

The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes.

Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of taun tons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking.

What the hell does George Bush got to do? do a little kill. Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill

waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS.

on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Good to have you back in.

Roy Williams, legendary. One coach in the history college basketball has taken two programs to over four, four more final fours. and we'll have them on in about 10 minutes. I wasn't on Friday. I didn't get to talk about this. Bobby Wagner signed with the Rams. And it's interesting because he signed with the Rams for a couple of reasons. Number one, he wanted to face the Seahawks again because of how they treated him.

Seattle has this recent history of Richard Sherman and Bobby Wagner and legendary players who were part of all their success and they just kind of find out on Twitter. They were released by the team. Seattle's front office has butchered multiple personnel moves over the last several years. This is another one. And it also feels like the Rams front office and culture is ahead of other teams. And if you think that's what it feels like, it's because they are. Let's just admit it.

5% of America in every industry is ahead of everybody else. Maybe they went to better prep schools. Maybe they're smarter, whatever reason. The Rams are smarter than the Seahawks. And that's why they'll win their division again, and the Seahawks will finish fourth. But the Rams, what's amazing about the Rams is that they are now paying a top of the market price for a quarterback, for defensive linemen, for a wide receiver, for a corner, for a center, and now a middle linebacker. The Giants have no cap space and no great players. Well, Stan Cronkey, the owner is very rich.

All the owners are billionaires. They're all rich. It's a hard cap and a hard floor. everybody's dealing with the same payroll limitations. The Rams do have a very committed owner, but 14 of their 22 starters have been drafted and developed. That's why they can give up on first round picks because they nail their second, third, fourth, fifth, and sixth round picks. No excuses. If you want to know why the Rams are trending the way they are and former Seahawk Bobby Wagner is now a ram, here's a great example.

look at how the Seahawks have recently treated stars as they left. Russell Wilson battled Pete Carroll for years. Bobby Wagner found out he was released on social media. Richard Sherman, all-time Seahawk legend, cut when he was hurt. Look how the Rams have treated their players. Not even all of them legends. Robert Woods, they joined him in finding a perfect spot. for him to go Tennessee. They joined him in that pursuit.

OBJ, we'd like to sign you. I'm going to keep you on as your rehab. Maybe we keep you, maybe we move you. We're not bailing on you. Von Miller, we'd love to have you. But if you leave, you should leave for that money. You'll always be a ram. And Von Miller and Robert Woods and OBJ, look at how those players respond to being treated well. look at how Seahawk players, former Seahawks, respond to how they're treated. If you want to know the difference, and I'm a Pacific Northwest kid, the difference between the Rams and the Seahawks is upstairs. How do you treat players?

Listen, you can't coddle them. The NFL never coddles players. They don't. The Rams aren't coddling anybody, right? They hit each other at practice. They're hard. They let players go. But if you want to know why the Rams are at the top of the time,

the league and the Seahawks are an eroding brand. Better culture, better coach, better fit, better momentum, better owner, better GM. It's not a coincidence that, you know, there's always people. It doesn't matter if it's the streaming business, the landscaping business, law, football. There are people that are better at their jobs. It drives us nuts, right? We think we're just as good. There are people better than us.

And the Rams are simply better run than the Seahawks. The greatest example is Bobby Wagner. Think of all the plays he made for the Seahawks. Show him the door with no respect. He's never done anything to the Rams except beat them. And they're like, welcome in. Welcome part of the family in Los Angeles. Now think about that.

All he's done for a decade is punish the Rams. All he's done for the Seahawks for a decade is reward the Seahawks. And in an instant, who is he loyal to today? the team that treated him better. It matters. It always has. Joy with the news. No, no, no, no, no. Turn on the news.

This is the herd line news. Well, that's a good segue to this. Before the Haslam family bought the Browns, they were minority owners of the Steelers, but they recently admitted they didn't really know a lot when they became owners. Jimmy Haslam said, we did a lousy job at first. I mean, let's just face it,

it's probably fair to say we didn't know what we were doing. in some ways. I go 10 years. We haven't won very many games. So I look at it that way. Well, that's honest. Yeah, I don't hate the accountability of it. It is very honest. But we talk about this all the time, and you were just discussing this with the Rams. There's only a handful of great anything. There's only a handful of great artists. There's only a handful of great athletes. There's only a handful of great owners. There's only a handful of great executives. There's a reason why the 1% of the 1% are so separated from the rest of us. they have that extra special something. Think about this.

The Giants have no cap space and no great players. The Rams last year won a Super Bowl paying Stafford and Jared Gough. Like that, I mean, Daniel Jones is on a rookie contract. They're not even paying their quarterback. Yes. And to that point, there's only so many good capologists and GMs. So, you know, I like this accountability from the Haslums, like that we didn't know what we were doing. And I think that's okay.

You can take on an endeavor that you're not necessarily prepared for. What I will say is that if you are stepping up to a situation as serious and as monumental as owning an NFL team, you probably want to take the time, especially if you don't know what you're doing, to really invest in hiring the best of the best. That's not the time to go cheap. That's not the time to be egotistical. That's not the time to take big swings. that's the time to set yourself up with someone who is proven. If you have to steal someone away from someone else by overpaying for them to establish yourself in this league, then that's what you should have done.

Yeah, I mean, I think we've seen with Urban Meyer and the Haslums. Haslums are very successful people. It's been a mess. Urban Meyer is a second best college coach in my life. It's a mess. If you come into the NFL, all sports for that matter, but when you come into the NFL, your previous success out of this industry means nothing. In fact, if you come into the NFL as a coach or an owner and you have sort of an authoritarian view of the world, you are going to crash land like really fast.

Coach, GM, owner. This is a hard league. It is not the NBA where two great players can carry it in titles or it's not baseball where we're not a great team. We've got a great starting pitching. We'll be a playoff team. You've got to be good everywhere. Owner, front office, coach GM quarterback. If you're not, you'll unravel.

Well, it's also a human element of it that is not the same as college, where you have grownups who likely make more than the coach who do this for a living. They're not just, you know, they're not just running off of inspiration because we've seen a lot of times, this is a big criticism of Pete Carroll. It's always raw, raw stuff. Like that stuff's nice. Like it sounds good. It plays good on television. It sounds good to fans. It's awesome and social media.

Where's out pro players? Where's the substance? Like, where's the X's and O's? We could do this in our business too. Come out and have an incredible marketing campaign. Where's the producers? Where's the structure of the show? Where's the graphics?

Where's the research? You have to have the bones of things in place. So, I mean, look, it has not gone well there, obviously. And they've made some other decisions that are being scrutinized as most recently with Deshaun Watson as well. And they still don't know what they're doing with Baker. This is why, again, I think I bought into the Browns. I liked what Baker had brought to the city,

the city galvanized, the fans felt good about it. And he did have some success there. It's like it was a complete failure. But to go as far as to say that the culture has changed in Cleveland, I think I may have gotten ahead of myself there. They have a lot of work to do. A lot.

So Matt Ryan spent 14 seasons as the Falcon's starting quarterback. It's a long time. Didn't feel that long. 14 seasons? I guess so. Well, some were. just forget. I mean, Matt's interesting. He didn't come in dynamic. He didn't leave Atlanta dynamically. He's just been there and solid for a long time. So there's not a lot of, there's not a lot of

memorable moments you can go, oh, remember that year and that there was one great Super Bowl year, so it moved fast. It's not like LeBron's career where there's the Cleveland years, the Miami years, the Cleveland years, the, you can mark it in your mind. God, this has been a long time. You know, Matt's had that one big year, and it's just, he's been very capable, B-plus for like a decade and a half. Well, the owner Arthur Blank thinks moving on from Ryan was the right call for the long-term health of the franchise. He said we have to get ready for the next 14, 15 years. That's what our fans should expect us to do. We're trying to prepare for that as best as we can.

Next year, we should be in a position. There'll be the biggest cap space that we've had since I've owned the team in over 21 years. So we'll have an opportunity to extend our own players and be more active in free agency than we were this year. He also downplayed the team's interest in acquiring Deshaun Watson saying the word, explore is the keyword and it wasn't more than that. That is disingenuous. You did a lot more than explore. You persuaded Ryan to move his date for the $7.5 million payments, giving them extra time to work on the trade. So the Browns beat you out essentially for Deshawn Watson.

That's fine. But you did more than explore for Deshawn Watson. I get it. You're trying to say face that that was a failure. If you look at it that way, I do not. He's right. Moving forward, you do need. to find your next guy. No question. Marcus Marriota is a nice bridge situation. You should be very honest with your fans. And I actually like that part of it. Like he's being disingenuous about the Watson thing, but set your fans up for realistic expectations of where your organization is. This is not the year. Yeah. That's okay. We're building things. We're working on things. But next year, we're going to go all in. We just are not in a situation to do

it this year. So the South Carolina Gamecocks are national champions once again. They held off Yukon's 6449 victory to claim the second title in school, This is the first loss for Yukon in a national championship game. It's very rare that Yukon felt completely outclassed. South Carolina was clearly the more talented team. Yes, they were up 22-8 after the first quarter, never looked back. Destiny Henderson led the gamecocks with 26 points, four assists, and three steals. She had multiple crazy hoops.

She was great. It was the highest scoring game of her collegiate career. She really stepped up and really put the distance between South Carolina and Yukon. Leah Bossom is the Naism the Naismith player of the year. She had 11.16 rebounds. Three assists in two blocks. Yeah. Yes, I mean, they were just South Carolina was just on another level. Page Becker's

finished with 14 points and six rebounds. She was only Husky in double digits. So they just controlled the game pretty much from start to finish. South Carolina is the eighth program to win multiple national championships and Don Staley is the first blackhead coach in D1 history, men or women, to win multiple national

champions. So incredible season for them. Don Staley is really I mean, she's a legend already, but she is really starting to separate from the sport. And I think she will end up being the first, if this is what she wants,

I think she'll end up being the first female NBA coach. She had interviews already, but she's just done a tremendous job with this program and really happy for them. It's great, obviously, to win a national championship,

but when you're winning over Yukon, who has been the tool of the... Yeah. I mean, like, even bigger than wouldn't UCLA Bruins, who won it multiple times in a row. Yukon has done this for like 25 years. It's been decades of dominance. And they were a great team this year.

I mean, they had an incredible tournament as well. So congrats to South Carolina and Don Staley. Good stuff, Joy, with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lye News. I thought this was significant. Roy Williams around the corner tonight, Kansas, Carolina.

Is Roy ready? Oh, we're ready to go. Oh, I thought I had to take a break. I get Roy Williams. Step right up, joining us live, The Legend. Roy Williams, 33 years of college basketball coach. Holy moly. So you coach Kansas, you win titles.

You go to Carolina, you win titles. And I'm watching you in the crowd. And I'm like, man, you looked as happy, I think, as I've ever seen you. Take me to your emotions watching that game. Hubert Davis takes over the program. You know, it's hard. Eight seed. We didn't know what they were.

What were your emotions watching that game? Well, my emotions went everywhere. There's no question about it. We had some, yeah, that's a weird picture you got there. Boy, I'm not posing for a boxing match, I can tell you. That's Antoine Jameson behind me, so you should probably focus more on him. But, no, you know, the emotions are unbelievable. I mean, I stopped coaching because I just didn't think I was doing it as well as I used to,

and I couldn't handle that. And I really wanted Hubert to be our coach, and he had coached with him. me for nine years and I pushed people very hard to see if I could make sure that happened and he did a great job and Bubba Cunningham and our athletic director came to the same conclusion and it was it's been a fantastic run we had some a little adverse times but at the same time humor just kept coaching he kept coaching he had in mind what he wanted to do and he just did a phenomenal job and it's like I told his dad I feel like his second father but the first father his real dad is just one of the greatest guys ever but there's a lot of

of pride in North Carolina. It was my school, those players, with the exception of Brady, I recruited everybody on the staff I either coached with or coached or something. So it's a very, very special moment for me, too. You know what's interesting, Roy, is the one-and-done culture. You know, you embraced it. It's part of it, but it's tricky because if you just do one-and-done players, gosh, you're asking your coaches to form chemistry in three months. It's virtually impossible. So Villanova doesn't get maybe like a Carolina or a Kansas player, but they've had great success, getting really good players. You were able to get a little bit of both.

You got the Caleb Love kid, the unbelievable high school. And then you got some other guys who are good players. They're going to stay in your program. One in Dunn scared some coaches. You kind of figured it out. Explain how. Well, I don't know. I got lucky, I guess, but I did.

I wanted one or two of those guys. I wanted very good talent. There's no question. I wanted the best players that we could get, but I didn't want a whole team full of them. I wanted guys that I could be around for a long time. And I wanted guys who really wanted to work hard and get better. And we've had, whether it was Marvin Williams,

who was our first one and done after national championship in 2005, on to Dayron Sharp of last year, who's with the Brooklyn Nets now. But I did love the Tyler Zellers, the Tyler Hansbrose, the Joel Berrys, and all those guys were on national championship teams and stayed around for four years. And I'm old school. I can spell technology, but that's all I can do with it.

Emmy was really having to work very hard with me to get this setup. I thought I was going to be talking to you on the phone because what's that great line? I have a face for radio. So it's been a wonderful run for me. I coached for 48 years. And, boy, you can see, I get a little excited at times. So if you're seeing the same video, I am, I'm glad I didn't have to see this much or I would have to quit longer ago. You know, Roy, it is interesting, though, and I was talking about this in my lead today, is the media sometimes gets worked up when coaches yell at players, but yet I see these college players crying for their coaches, like hard parenting and hard coaching is a real thing.

But the world also changes. Players are more empowered that now the NIL, they can make money. money, there is a balance between coaching hard and loving your players. What's the secret sauce on making, because you're, I watched these Duke kids are crying. And Hubert Davis is, is, I mean, I see all these kids. They love their coaches, but you guys bark. What is the balance as a coach? Well, I do think you use the right word there as balance.

I mean, I used to be able to chew a guy out as hard as I could. And then as soon as we walked off the floor, I'd put my arm around him and say, what time is your math test tomorrow. And for me, what I told him that was called Charles Barker, I always laughed. He said, that's called coaching. Well, I think coaching is a little both. Some kids you do have to bark at. Some kids you need to put your arm around them a little bit more.

And I think that the balance is what I always look for. I never wanted to embarrass the player. I never wanted to yell at him in front of all those people unless it was lack of concentration or lack of effort. I never had a player that wanted to miss a shot. or wanted to dribble it off his foot out of bounds or anything crazy like that. So I told them if you want me to jump on your rear end, don't hustle or don't concentrate. But other than that, you know, they want to do well just as much as the coach wants them to do well.

Yeah. You know, Roy, tonight's game is as fascinating as I was watching that game. I said, I don't know how in the world, whoever wins this Duke Carolina game, I don't know how 48 hours later you're supposed to match this in. intensity. So if you were, how would you, and you've done this your whole career, you did it at Kansas, you did it at Carolina. You go through one of these epic games and then you ask your kids 48 hours later, yeah, forget that game. It never happened. Now we got Kansas. How do you, how do you get them tonight to play like that again? It seems like a big ask for young kids. Well, I think it is in some ways.

And Marty Schottnheimer, when he was coaching Kansas City Chiefs, I was at Kansas. He said, always enjoy the victory until midnight. And so I always talk to my teams like that. And I know Hubert is doing the same thing. And he's fantastic. Colin, I'm telling you, he's just fantastic.

He's the nicest individual I've ever known in my life, who is also fiercely competitive. And the kids trust him. They love him. He loves them, the passion that he has. I was not in the locker room. I've tried my best to,

I'm paranoid about getting in the way, but I do know that he's going to have them ready to play and he'll put that game out of their mind. They will do it. Their experience last year we had eight of our top 11 players were freshmen, but RJ Davis and Caleb loved two guys right there starting back court last year. Well, there's sophomores. Now they're experienced sophomores. And so they'll take care of that. I'm a little concerned about that, but I'm more concerned about do we get a hand up on every shot and make sure it's challenged kind of thing. Yeah. Finally, you

and Coach K are two of the three or four biggest names since I've been a sportscaster in college basketball. I can make an argument. You're one and two. You're very different personalities. You have this Southern gentleman charm to you. And then Mike's that feisty guy from West Point. But you battled each other for years and you built your empirical programs differently. Do you sense some similarities with you and Mike?

Because from me, as a sportscaster looking out, I think, boy, There's two different personalities, but you had to have some similarities, did you not? Oh, we really did. We were on the National Association of Basketball Coaches Board for many years, and we agreed so many times on what we thought was good for college athletics, and particularly college basketball. But on game day, yeah, I don't like him. There's no question about that on game day.

But we compete like crazy, but we do love our sport. We do love our kids. I made a joke one time to the media. They were asking about a relationship. do we go out to dinner and I said oh guys he's got basketball and his family I have basketball in my family I said besides how can you trust somebody that doesn't play golf and Mike I Mike said why would you say that I said Mike it's a joke but he doesn't play golf so he didn't even understand the joke but no we have a really really good relationship based on total respect

nay Smith basketball hall of famer inducted oh gosh it must have been 15 years ago you're a legend. Hard not to root for either program tonight, but the joy on your face flashed across millions of households. Roy, it's a pleasure. It's just a great story. I was just telling Joy here, very rarely do you get a power program like Alabama football or Carolina, and you're like an eighth seed? You're an underdog. You know, I don't even remember. Has there ever been in your career, did you ever have a Kansas team or a Carolina team that felt like that? It felt like, like a big underdog, an overachiever, and ended up here? Well, we were fortunate enough to win it three times, but all three times, we were really good.

I think we were not favored in 05, and I think we weren't a favorite in 17, but we were big favorite in 09. But yeah, I like the spot. I like to be favored because that means we've won a heck of a lot. But I think that somebody said this is only the fifth time somebody as an eight seed has made it. And I know that one of our Kansas teams went as a five and one of them went as a four, but we've had a lot of times we were won seeds and lasted two weekends and then our butt was going back home.

But you know what counts day? The referee is going to throw the ball up, and the back of the team that plays the best their butt's going to win. And if you don't play as well, you're going to lose. And the name on that jersey on the back doesn't make any difference. And the name on the front doesn't make any difference. You've got to play on game day. I'm excited.

I'm excited for watching the game. The Carolina Duke game was maybe the most exciting college basketball game I've ever seen. Yeah. And I just loved it. And I did get excited in there. And then Huber Davis is the best I've ever seen. So it's going to be a fun time for me. Roy Williams, absolute pleasure, coach.

Good luck tonight. And thank you so much for giving us 10 minutes today. I appreciate it. You guys have a great day. And I's hoping it's a great day for everybody. And North Carolina wins by one. There you go. The legend, Roy Williams.

I believe it, too. It's the best college basketball game. You know, recency bias is a powerful thing. I remember the Duke Kentucky game. I sat, you know, at home watching that. That was the Spectrum in Philadelphia. I was at the UNLV Duke game when Duke upset them with the freshman Grant Hill. That was the loudest crowd.

It was so, even through the television, it was so loud. Well, this game also had. historical implications with it being Coach K's last year. Yes. And having that kind of feeling like, oh, this is Duke's year. They have this like emotional. Well, they got four NBA players in the first round. I thought they would win. Yeah. I mean, it wasn't a blowout. It was a very competitive game. Go look at an NBA mock draft. You're not going to find Carolina guys. And it's all these Duke guys. And you have the rivalry added to it. Oh, so good. All right, Colin right, Colin wrong.

Top of next hour. It's the hurt. Be sure to catch live editions of the. heard weekdays in noon eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, it's Ben, host of the fifth hour with Ben Mallor, along with my trusty sidekick, David Gascon, would mean a lot to have you join us on our weekly auditory journey. You're asking what in God's name is the fifth hour? I'll tell you, it's a spinoff of the Ben Mallor show, a cult hit overnight on FSR. Why should you listen?

Picture, if you will, a world where we chat with captains of industry in media, sports, and more every week explore some amazing facts about human nature and more. Listen to the fifth hour with Ben Mather on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential.

Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying.

Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, untrower. filtered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose,

and even music. The Clivert Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far far away, such as the biology of Ton Tontons and Wampas on the Ice Planet Hot.

or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to Stuff to Bole your mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast.

I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know.

I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack, so I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now, so... Thank you for finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah.

For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Just because you win an argument in the moment doesn't mean you win the argument. Be careful about trying to win the argument. Aaron Rogers won the leverage play against the Packers. He's the highest paid quarterback in the league. He won. or did he?

So the last remaining good receiver on the market, Devante Parker of the Dolphins, went to the Patriots. Right now the Packers, in a weapons league, have easily the worst wide receiving core in the league. And I mean New England may be second and they're miles better. D.K. Metcalf may be available on the market, but is Green Bay making a play for him? There's a story this weekend that he's available if you call,

has Green Bay called. I just want you to think about this. It's not a conspiracy theory, but it's something to think about. Green Bay doesn't have an owner. So the front office doesn't feel pressured by Jerry Jones or a Haslam or, you know, a stang cronkey. There is no owner. And the Green Bay front office has, let's put this politely, a fractured relationship

with Aaron Rogers. He won the argument. He got the money. are we sure Green Bay's front office knowing how prickly and sensitive Aaron Rogers is is thinking

no this is your wide receiving core champ you won you got your money and they know when Aaron has a bad year and struggles and they will with this wide receiving core you can defend this team much more easily today without DeVante Adams and he finishes second to the Vikings

which I think he will he does not take well to criticism and in a year he'll say, get me out of here. And then for one year, Green Bay will have a salary cap mess for a year, like Atlanta now, but they can start over. Aaron Rogers won. He got his 50 million. There's been lots of wide receivers available at very reasonable prices.

Why won't Green Bay go after any of them? Now, maybe I'm wrong. They get D.K. Metcalfe later this afternoon. Certainly possible, but it has been kind of odd, right? that's the one advantage to not having an owner. Because owners are tough. They're billionaires. They get their way.

When you don't have an owner, the front office doesn't feel pressured to make a big splash in free agency. They kind of do what they want to do and they trust the process. They haven't gone after any wide receivers. I mean, this wide receiving corps now is a joke. I mean, do they have, I don't think they have a wide receiver who could start in division for the Vikings. That's just in division. Forget Tampa or the Rams. or the Chiefs or the Bills or the Raiders or it's JV squad.

I'm just saying, Aaron won. Congratulations. But if they end up being like 9 and 8 or 10 and 7, look at their schedule this year. It's a first place schedule. It's not easy. It just seems to me if they don't make a move. And by the way, where they're drafting in the first round is bottom of the first round. The best three or four wide receivers will be gone.

So if they don't sign D.K. Matcalfe and they don't move up to get a wide receiver, they may be telling you or telling on themselves. Aaron won. Good luck. Those front office people in Green Bay, they're not getting fired. They're not getting fired. They're coming back. And Aaron's not going to take well to people once he starts losing this year saying,

well, selfish guy all about you. You took the money. This is on you. He's going to take a lot of heat. And he doesn't like to take heat. I'm not saying this is true, but if they don't make a move on anybody and they don't draft a wide receiver in the first round, yeah, I think they're telling us something. I don't think it's that big of a reach to think it.

Hour two next, Colin right, calling right, calling wrong. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day. and head writer Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group

perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and

college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing. all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced

games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, what's good, y'all? You're listening to Learn the Hard Way with your favorite therapist and host Kier Games. This space is about black men's experiences, having honest conversations that it's really not safe to have anywhere, but you're having them with a licensed professional who knows what he's doing. How many men carry a suit or armor.

It signals to the world that you're not to be played with. And just because you have the capability that does not mean that you need to. Listen to learn the hard way on the IHard radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. This is an IHart podcast. Guaranteed Human. You know,