The Herd with Colin Cowherd - HOUR 1 - Giants-Bucs, Brady, Mayfield

Episode Date: November 23, 2021

Colin discusses the Giants-Bucs game and the issues with Daniel JonesThe Bucs so far this seasonThe Browns need to sit Baker MayfieldGuest: Nick Wright Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Be sure to catch us live every weekday from 12 to 3 Eastern, 9 to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS1. Find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Herd. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Oh, here we go live in Los Angeles. On a Tuesday, it's the herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening. Iheart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, FS1, one hour from now. The herd hierarchy is the playoff picture, not as muddy now.

It's starting to take shape. We know who the best teams are, the worst teams are, and we kind of have a feeling the teams in the middle. Either have it or they don't. So one hour from now, the herd hierarchy. and Joy Taylor is joining me. Well, well, well, I gave myself until Thanksgiving to render an opinion on Daniel Jones, and here we are. It was a rule in this show.

We have several rules. Don't compare anyone to Tom Brady. And we're going to decide on Daniel Jones by Thanksgiving. So is it a hard Thanksgiving or are we going to wait until Sunday's Thanksgiving? I have made my mind up. I feel like we have enough material. We have enough materials. Let's start with this.

So years ago, there was a quarterback named Jake Locker. He went to the University of Washington. He was a high school, All-American, went to his local school, Washington, and Steve Sarkesian was his coach. Now, Sark is a college quarterback, right? So Sark's always been good with quarterbacks. He's good with offenses, right? Whether he's a great head coach or not debatable, but he's good with quarterbacks.

And Jake Locker came out after a year with Sark, and in college, he completed 54% of his throws. He was like T-Boe on steroids. He was like a better version of T-Boh. and he went to the Tennessee Titans at 8, and I sat on the air. It's not going to work. If your college coach is known for mentoring quarterbacks and you complete 54, 55% of your throws, it can't be that hard. Well, when Daniel Jones came out, I didn't like him getting picked at 6.

Like Locker, he's athletic, he does some things he runs around. I mean, he's got some skills, but he completed 59% of his throws in college with David Cutcliffe at Duke, who's a great quarterback mentor. It's not like he had a defensive coach or Jake Locker had a defensive coach. They had coaches that elevate quarterbacks. The Mannings are very close to David Clutcliffe. And Daniel Jones, coming out of college,

could not complete 60% of his throws in a bad conference to the ACC, like Jake Locker couldn't complete 55% in a bad conference of the Pac-12. So I came in very skeptical. And now I have all this tape and film and games. And he's still average. It's time to move on. You got to get into the Aaron Rogers, Russell Wilson, Deshawn Watson sweepstakes. You got to go big.

It's New York City. Russell Wilson wants to go to a big city. Deshawn Watson wants to reboot his brand and go to a big city. They don't want to go out into the sticks. And it's time to get a new GM. Dave Gettlement, four years. You don't get four years to build an offensive line and it's still putrid. The Chargers rebuilt theirs in one.

The Packers, enter. this season with a shaky O line. It's already good, and that's despite losing people, injuries. As far as the coaching staff, you can't win in this league with a bad quarterback. I would give Joe Judge another year. Bill Belichick got fired in Cleveland. It's hard to win when you're bad at quarterback. They're bad at quarterback, and they have other issues. But at GM, you don't get four years to build an O line. And you shouldn't have taken, let's be honest, Daniel Jones at six. It can't be that hard. Offense is not that hard in 2021. Think about this. The Saints don't have Michael Thomas.

They don't have Alvin Kamara. And they got 315 yards this weekend against Philadelphia. With Jalen Hertz, he's like a kid. And then Arizona had their backup quarterback Colt McCoy, and they have no DeAndre Hopkins. And they go to Seattle and San Francisco and win. And this week they had 413 yards offense. Backup quarterback, no star receiver with a good, oh, line, not special. It ain't this hard. It can't be this hard. Everything with the Giants on offense looks like a struggle. I don't want to hear about talent. Daniel Jones, off a bye week. The Giants have plenty of good wide receiving talent. Tony and Ghaladay and Evan Ingram and Darius Slayton and Sequin Barclay, who's not the same after the injury, but he's a nice receiving back. It's not that.

It can't be this hard. God, if you're in a marriage for 10 years and you're still going to therapy every week, It can't be that hard. You've got to be able to sit in the couch, watch TV, and enjoy each other's company. So, you know, you come off a buy. You face a Buccaneers defense that's scrambling on the back end. And if not for an Adori Jackson touchdown, you didn't have a single legitimate touchdown scoring drive. Colt McCoy had three this weekend.

One was 90 yards. One was 87 and one was 67. Come on. I don't want to hear about talent. You just saw 48 hours ago, Justin Herbert, throw for 380 yards and rush for 90. Okay. The next night, last night, you watched Daniel Jones.

Do they look close? I mean, they're the same height. One's more athletic. One with a better arm. One makes better decisions. One throws a more accurate football. It's not this tough. I'd keep Joe judge.

I'd flush everything else out. Here's Joe after the game. We've got to do a better job to scoring points. I know it sounds pretty obvious and to the point with it, but I'm going to keep it just very blunt on that right there. We got to do a better job, put our players in a position to make plays. It's too many good players. You know, we got to put in a better position to capitalize on it.

That's it. Again, if it looks like a struggle, it's a struggle. An offense in 2021 off a buy can't be that much of a struggle. Screens are hard. Everything's hard. Terrible on third down, bad on fourth down. Everything looks so. difficult. It's time to get into the big boy quarterback sweepstakes.

All right. So I want to talk about now Brady and Tampa. It's funny. Expectations generally for all of us create happiness or sadness. If your expectations are too high, you get disappointed. If your expectations are low and something decent happens, you're overjoyed. So Tampa last year, if you remember, we kept waiting for it to click. right we're like it just doesn't look right it didn't look right and then they had the buy and they beat a bunch of bad teams Detroit and Atlanta were like yeah they're great but their offense wasn't great against Green Bay it wasn't great against Washington and really their defense won the Super Bowl not their offense against Kansas City so this year we're like it's going to be a lot smoother for the Buccaneers I said that it's going to be different this year we got preseason it's the second year we got we got OTAs And it's the exact same. Last year, Tampa averaged 29.5 points a game. This year, they averaged 31.

They were 7 and 3 at this point last year. Last year, they allowed 22.6 points a game. Now, this year, they're allowing 22.2 points a game, and their record is 7 and 3. It's the same team. Why wouldn't it be? They brought back all the same players and the same coaches in the same division. We keep thinking that Tampa has this next gear. But all the inconsistencies of last year are here this year.

They still have a really old quarterback who's not athletic and dynamic physically. The weakness of the team last year was secondary because of age and inexperience, and it's now secondary because of inexperience and injuries. their special teams are okay, but you'd never trust them in a big spot. And their running game is underwhelming last year and underwhelming this year. Last year, they were 29th in rushing attempts. This year, they're 31st in rushing attempts. We keep waiting for them to burst through because Kansas City has that capability.

We've seen Kansas City at the top end. They've got another gear, and the Chiefs right now are not hitting it. They're getting closer, but they're not hitting it. I think Dallas has a really high-end offense if the Mari Cooper is healthy in Tyron Smith. I think there are offenses, Aaron Rogers, if it can finally get a healthy backfield and offensive line this year, I think they could take it to another level. I think Arizona could jump to another level. So there are offenses in this league.

They're kind of simmer in. They either have a quarterback that's hurt like Kyler Murray or like key components that are hurt like Green Bay or like Kansas City. they got a little loose. Mahomes big play got a little loose. But Tampa's not that team. They're the exact same team. There is no higher ceiling. What they are is very good.

And you cross your fingers that Tom Brady will provide magic in the postseason. Because you know, he normally does. But I'm watching him last night and I'm thinking, Tampa doesn't have a problem. The problem is my expectations. The problem is I'm thinking, oh, they're the chiefs. in Arizona when they get Kyler back and they're Dallas. No, or not. They got an old quarterback, average special teams, no running game, and a secondary I don't trust.

And they'll win only in the postseason if Brady is magical, which he mostly is. But my expectations the last two years have been out of whack. Why would they be different this year? It's the same exact offense and defense and running game of last year. It's the same secondary issues, same average special teams. Why wouldn't they be? It's the same players and the same coaches. Tom afterwards.

We played better. Better for all of us when we play better. Better for our quality of life. I mean, every day that goes by is closer at the end of the season and every game is more important because there's fewer of them and you don't get him back. So we're at a decent point, but we can play a lot better when we played.

And, you know, seven and three, you know, through 10 games, there's a lot to learn from. And hoping our best football is ahead of us. Well, coming up next, the definitive opinion, which has always been right on Baker-Mayfield, you're going to agree with me even if you're a Browns fan, and I'm actually going to back him coming up next. Plus Nick Wright for 30 minutes today. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged.

It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined.

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Open your free, our heart radio app, Search learn the hard way and listen now. You are now entering the No Bull Zone, sponsored by credible great rates with none of the Bull. So Baker Mayfield is getting clobbered in Cleveland right now, and he's getting very testing and he's pushing back and he's getting booed. And before I start my rant today, just here's a sample of his attitude and his current demeanor as he's getting ripped by the press in Cleveland and booed by some of the fans. I'd be the first to tell you I played like so it's not about accountable and I don't owe you guys any of that

I owe that to my teammates and I talk to them so that's what matters. Baker, what did you make of some of the booing there in the second half from the fans? Those are probably the same fans that won't be quiet while we're on offense and trying to operate so don't really care. Oh boy.

The only reliable opinion on Baker Mayfield in America has always been mine. No, I mean, that's it. The Browns were too high in him. Fans were too high on him. The media petrified of getting roasted if they're wrong with their vanilla takes. He'll be good. He'll be good.

That was the safe take. My opinion is the only one that's ever been right, which was everybody was too high and unrealistic on Baker initially. And now they're beating the crap out of them and it's not fair. Shocker. Fans are overly emotional in Cleveland. You thought he was Jim Kelly to start. and now you think he's Kyle Allen. So let me once again give the only reasonable opinion on Baker in America

because I don't get emotionally involved in this stuff. It's all biz. You know what I'm saying? A, he's never been a number one pick talent. B, he is a franchise quarterback, but he needs a ton of help around him. And C, he's way too cocky, too much ego for the position to rely on him. Again, all accurate from day one. But right now, Cleveland is roasting him, and it's tall.

Totally unfair. Did you watch him against the lions? He's in pain. He's got a bad heel. He's got a bad knee. He's got bad ribs. He's got a torn laborer. His shoulders still not recovered.

That wasn't Baker Mayfield. That was 50% of Baker. So Cleveland fans were outrageously delusional to start. And now you're unbelievably critical and unfair now. So once again, America's honesty broker, me delivers the truth. Here's the solution. And since I've been right.

the entire time, why don't you just sit there, stop talking, and listen, because all paved the way to your success. I should frankly own the franchise at this point. Instead, I just own their fan base. I would sit Baker against Baltimore. Yes, and you're going to lose with Case Keenham, because Baker, as I've told you, is a better version of Case with a much quicker release and a much better arm, and this is not arrogance, it's accuracy. I would sit him against Baltimore because the Browns have a buy after Baltimore. and then I would get two weeks of Baker Mayfield finally being healthy, and they'll lose to Baltimore. But then I get him back for the final five games.

It'll be the healthiest Baker can be, and I can make a true evaluation on him. And he's going to beat Baltimore at home, and he's going to beat the Raiders at home, and he's going to lose to Green Bay, but beat the Steelers on the road, and beat the Bengals again, and go 10 and 7, and you'll be a playoff team. And as a front office, I'll get a reasonable evaluation of him because he'll be 90% healthy, which is frankly where most quarterbacks are during the season. They're sore, they're beat up, but they're about 90% healthy. But you were delusional initially, and now you're outrageously critical now.

And you've been wildly inaccurate with both. If you want a true evaluation, sit the kid down for two weeks, get him as healthy as he can be, because what you saw Sunday is a kid with a bad knee and a bad heel and a bad shoulder and a torn laborer and you're like he's no good. Who's good playing at 40 to 50%? Mahomes isn't. I've seen Mahomes on a bad toe. He's not the same quarterback.

So there he go. By the way, to just to prove my point, Baker's passing numbers this year are better than last year at this point. His completion percentage is higher. His passer rating is higher. His total passing yards are higher. This is the best Baker until he fell apart. Now he's Frankenstein out there.

He's only missing a bolt in his. neck. But the delusion initially and the criticism now is absurdly off. And you're welcome. You can take this for free, use it to get into playoffs, come back in about six weeks. Maybe I'll take your calls. Joy with the news. Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. I quite enjoyed that, Colin. That was definitive. Well, listen, we're all about accuracy on this show.

So after last night's Bulls game, chance could be heard saying fire Nagy. And fans might be getting their wish. According to a report on pro football talk, Mark Conkel, who previously worked for the Chicago Sun Times and now reports at patch.com, said that the bears have informed Matt Nagy that he'll be fired after Thursday's game at Detroit. A top source with knowledge of the decision told Conkel that Nagy was informed of his fate yesterday. also the Bears have never fired a coach mid-season in their history. Yeah, their ownership doesn't do that. The Bears have not responded to or comment from pro football talk

and Nagy is expected to speak this after schedule to speak this afternoon. Look, I would not be surprised if Matt Nagy and Ryan Pace for that matter are not with the Bears after this season. I would put more of the burden of responsibility on the front office in this situation, as I tend to do. I tend to look at front offices first when firings like this happen, especially mid-season. There's two advantages to Chicago, though. Denver's going to be the best job opening if they fire Vic Fangio. But Chicago will arguably be the second best opening.

And Joy, it's an interesting year for candidates. There's some interesting offensive coordinators out there. Right. And listen, if he's lost the locker room and lost the fan base to that degree, maybe you don't have a choice. I'm kind of a defender of coaches you tend to be as well. I think it's a sign of dysfunction if you're firing a coach in the middle of the season, no matter what sport it is, especially depending on where in the season you fire them.

If you fire a coach was in the first couple weeks of the season, it's on the front office. You needed the whole off season to see two more weeks to decide this wasn't the guy. Obviously, this isn't the situation. They're third in the NFC North. It's obviously been a disappointing season overall, but he's never had a losing season. It's been to the playoffs.

Yeah. So I don't know what exactly you're looking for. Well, how about this? He'll get another job, but it's time for a new voice. You can make that argument. I think you can make that argument, yes. And if you're going to make a change, you should make it early in Justin Fields' career. Yeah.

And another thing is, if you make it early, you're going to get the best candidates. Like, because BNaby will have suitors. And Byron Leftwick will have suitors. And Brian Dable will have suitors. So if you're the first one to say, we're getting a new coach. You could beat Denver to the best candidate. because Denver's the best opening potentially. That roster's ready to win.

They need a quarterback and the right offensive coach. Chicago and the Raiders, you can argue what's better. The O line for the Bears, they're on like year four. It's a mess. The offensive line is a pretty good reflection of what they've been able to put together. But I also think that you have to, if you're going to move on, move on completely. Don't move on halfway because the front office has had a say in these players and what's gone on here as well.

If you're going to do it, do a clean slate. and give Justin Fields a platform to grow. Obviously, he's the guy. So I don't think you're going to run into a situation where you're bringing in a new coach, and he's like, oh, you know, I didn't draft Justin Fields. So, I mean, look, it's an unfortunate situation at this point in Chicago, but if the fans are that far gone,

and then you've got to move on. Now they play the Lions on Thursday and are three and a half point favorites over that. So speaking of moving on, Packers kicker, Mason Crosby, is two for six on field goal. over the last three weeks. But Coach Matliflor said his job is not in jeopardy.

That never falls squarely on one individual. Our operation has got to improve. And that's from the snap to the hold to the kick. So we'll continue to work on that. And then, you know, but certainly have a lot of confidence in Mason. Never would have sent him out there if we didn't on a 54-yarder. And he came through. So I just think that shows the level of confidence that we have in.

not only in him, but that entire group to go out there and execute, and they did a great job on that one. And then certainly you got to make the chip shots. It's been a rough year for kickers overall. Yeah, I'm going to blame the long snapper for that. Okay. And by the way, you know, that's why we sent him out there. Now you send him out there because he's your kicker on the roster.

Right. I mean, come on. I think Skip dubbed him Mason Crossbar. I think I want to give Skip credit for that one. Listen, they're supporting him. He's made 65% of his field goals this season. It's the second lowest mark of his 15-year career. He looks washed, yeah.

I never know what it is with kickers, because they can surprise you, obviously, but that's not what you want in your kicker. You want clutch. You want reliability, not surprises. They host the Rams on Sunday and a half-point underdog, according to Fox bet. Listen, especially at this point in the season, you don't want your kicker dealing with confidence issues.

A lot of these games come down to kickers, and Mason's been struggling, and I'm with you. I don't know if I'm blaming it on the guy holding the ball, but he's not going anywhere for now. So LeBron James and Isaiah Stewart got into his scuffle on Sunday following LeBron making contact with Stewart in the face. Everyone keeps saying it's an elbow, but I feel like it was like an elbow fist follow-through kind of situation.

That's what it looked like, yeah. Well, Stewart's eye began bleeding. I don't know if you didn't see this, so you haven't been on the internet for the past couple, couple days, but it was a messy scene there in Detroit. Both players were ejected. And according to Sham Sharania of the athletic, LeBron did try to get in touch with Stewart following the game. He said, I'm told LeBron James has made clear whether it was on the court or post game that it was inadvertent to hit Isaiah Stewart. They didn't mean to do it and it was not intentional. I'm told

LeBron did try to track Isaiah Stewart's number down post game to apologize to Stewart again and let him know it was inadvertent to hit his face. Well, yesterday. Yeah, I thought it was an inadvertent. I didn't think it was a, I don't know. Yeah, and I think your reputation matters in these spots. LeBron's not a dirty player. He's not a... Watch, this. I mean, they're pushing on it. Well, maybe I don't know. It's, it's, it's, you know, it is what it is. I'm not going to lose too much. I think you can make a dirty play. You can not be a dirty player and make a dirty play. I mean, he, I think, that's a good way to put it. He did definitely mean to move Isaiah Stewart off of him. And so I'm not making excuses for LeBron.

Like, he obviously hit him. Otherwise, it wouldn't be blood on his. face. Well, here's my concern. You've got a 20-year-old who lacks self-awareness. I'd probably keep him away from the game for a couple weeks, not two games. Well, he's only suspended for two games. So the league handed suspensions down for both players. LeBron received one game for recklessly hitting Stewart, which I have no problem with it. Obviously, the timing of it, they're playing the Knicks tonight. You would have loved to see LeBron out there, but that doesn't matter. like this happened. And I do think you have to set some precedent for that kind of contact. I guess it wasn't quite as inadvertent as I'd like to state. It's not, inadvertent is not quite the

word I would describe or accidental. I don't know that he meant to do that to Isaiah Stewart. I don't believe that. But LeBron is a big man. So if you make contact with your elbow slash fist with someone's face and your LeBron's size, that could be the outcome. And it was. Now, obviously, Stewart took to a whole other level running away from guards and coaches

and people. I mean, it was a scene. And he has been suspended for two games. So they will face off again on November 28th here in L.A. and that they'll both be there, which I don't love that. I do wish there was more time between them seeing each other again, but that's what the NBA said. Joy with the News.

Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Hurd-Lie News. What a pleasure it is. Nick Wright usually joins us on Wednesday, but this is a short week and his schedule has changed. Nick and I got to watch the Cowboys Chiefs game in-person Sunday, which was a big win for him.

I had a little money on Dallas, and he had all his feels on the Chiefs, and they won, and they look pretty good. Now he's joining us here on the set. I think this is the first time in several years, brought to you by Mercedes-Benz, the best or nothing. The new Nick Wright with the new hipper haircut. I like the look on you now.

Oh, thanks, buddy. This is the first time I've been on here with hair. It's Jared Lato. Oh, Jared Lotto. I mean, quiet, your laughter over there. That's what you're doing, Gerald Lowe. Can I tell you something, though? Okay.

As I watch the show every day as every true American sports fan does, I think your Baker Mayfield rant to open this segment was your single best, most definitive rant of 2021. And I don't think it's a coincidence that it's the first rant I was in studio for. As your mentor, I was performing for you. I really felt that way. I really felt like, oh, Colin's trying to impress me. Colin, I mean, he's working straight down barrel.

I was like, is this scripted? My God, it was great. It was stirring. By the way, I want to go, let's start with the Daniel Jones. And my takeaway was it can't be this hard. Like, if you're in a marriage, 10 years in, and you need therapy every week, it's not working. It can't be that hard. Every five, six years, let's go see a couple's therapists.

We're arguing about money. I look at Daniel Jones, and I'm like, we're three years in. Screen passes are a challenge. And it has to, I know Judge is getting killed today, Daniel Jones is getting killed today. the common denominator between them is the person that picked both of them, and that's Gettleman. And Gettelman, after he drafted Daniel Jones, said, talk to me in three years. Okay, it's been three years. He looks awful.

His first year in the league, he had the highest fumble rate in modern NFL history. He then seemed to clean that up a bit, but the tradeoff has been, he doesn't score touchdowns anymore. They have 20 touchdown, 17 picks. His last two years, he started basically every game. No, he's, he is going to have a long career as a backup quarterback. Yeah. But he's not a starter in this league. I don't know if Joe Judge is a coach.

I do know, or a head coach, I do know that whoever, somebody else is going to have to make those decisions now. Because the Giants, keep in mind, they have the number two pick. They took Sequin. Then the number 34 pick that year, they took the Will Hernandez guy who kept getting holding calls yesterday. Yeah. And then they had three first round picks of the next year. Daniel Jones, Dexter Lawrence, who's been okay. They traded up for first round.

DeAndre Baker. He now plays for the Chiefs. He spent one year with them. It hasn't been good. No, it hasn't. And by the way, I say this, as much as we mock the Cowboys at times, they've had four home run picks in the last two years. And now that Jalen Smith has gone, nobody is dramatically overpaid. It's like DeMarcus Lawrence should be healthier.

But they, you know, so in the end, and we don't consider, you know, the Cowboys as buttoned up as we'd like. But you look around and you see talent in a lot of these picks, they've had home runs. So I want to go, I said this about Brady and the Bucks. If you go look at all the data, they're the exact same team as last year. There is no upside. They are a very good team and you cross your fingers on Brady to be magical in the postseason. But whereas Arizona's offense when Kyler gets healthy, and Dallas, if Tyron and Amari play with CD Lemp, chiefs, we've seen the next level. But not that they were lucky last year.

they were fortunate that they play lousy teams all at the end and got Taylor Heineke and Matt Lafleur's weird coaching and the chiefs got hurt. But I don't think there's another level. This is what they are, which is good but not special on most Sundays. So I think I happen to totally agree with you on that. I wish I didn't, but I do. Last year they were 7 and 5. Then they hit the buy and they're like, oh, everything got fixed after the buy. No, they played four awful teams to end the year.

And then if we remember the playoffs, first round, they're playing Taylor Heineke. That is a one-score game into the fourth quarter. Yep. Second round, they're down two scores to New Orleans in the second half. New Orleans is driving. And Jared Cook fumbles, and they go score. Then Breeze interception, they score. Breeze interception, they score, and it's over.

It's like New Orleans had them right where they wanted them. And then for the third time that year. The Packer game, the Packers play as poorly as a team can play in the first half, totally botched the end of the first half. And then Brady throws three second half picks. Green Bay can't take full advantage. But we remember it differently because the Chiefs were the dominant team in the league last year. They were 14 and 1 in the regular season.

They rolled through the postseason. They won a playoff game. Mahomes got hurt in. And then the Chiefs for the first time ever under Mahomes up to that point looked awful. And it was against Tampa. So we looked at Tampa's, oh, my God. They were a juggernaut. They were not a juggerna.

I know they won the Super Bowl, but they weren't a juggernaut. And I think it's risky in the NFL. It's not the NBA where if you win the title, bring everyone back. It's risky to say, while everyone else is trying to get better, our plan is to just stay the exact same. Bring everyone back from the previous year. And now they're dealing with some injuries. It was good to see Gronk back.

I don't know if and when they're going to play A-B. So I agree with you. I don't think they're a bad team by any stretch. They're a good team. But I do think it warrants mentioning in the NFC, and I say this a lot because I don't think people totally understand it. Packers, Cardinals, Rams, Cowboys, Bucks, that's five teams. By definition, at least one of them won't win a playoff game.

Only four teams move on to the second round. So one of those five is gone in the wild card round. I don't know who it's going to be, but right now, I think you have a strong of a case to make that it'll be the Bucks as any of the other five. So I want to talk about the story. Do you say pro football talk, Joy had it, that Matt Nagy is going to get whacked after Thanksgiving. Now, I could defend him and say he got Tribiskey to the playoffs twice. He's never in a full season had a losing record.

My coaching contacts have always been lukewarm on him, a little frenetic on the sidelines. He didn't really call plays in Kansas City as much as you'd like BN him. He's been more, has more experience doing that. So they've always been, he's okay. He's a nice guy. People like him. but my guy's role was a little more critical of them than I was. I like the guy, Trubesky, I thought was mostly awful.

And he got him to the playoffs twice in a division with Aaron Rogers. But it's interesting. You can make the argument today that it's a really good year for offensive coaches. Be enemies on the market, left which is on the market. Brian Daible is on the market. If you want to go defense, there's Iber Flues from Indianapolis. that it's the rare year where you've got some guys with three and four and five years coordinating and they're really good.

Or he doesn't have three or four years, but Kellyn Moore. I think Kellyn Moore is probably going to go get a job. Dallas doesn't elevate him. College, there's almost never a good year where you have multiple good, you have to roll the dice. But I do think to, are you okay if Nagy gets whacked? I think they should have fired him Sunday. I think the whole logic of we can't fire him Sunday because we play Thursday is illogical. because I understand that you don't want to have the flux of a coaching change on a short week.

But I believe, and it seems like it's kind of being confirmed via reporting, they decided after Friday's loss, you can't lose the way they did to the Ravens without Lamar. It's your fifth loss in a row. It's your fifth loss in a row. So they got to fire him. And now the logic is, but we don't want to do it on a short week. But then the problem is, well, you're probably going to beat the Lions. You're going to fire him after a win?

Maybe, maybe not. then you extend it further. So if they basically decided you lost your job Sunday, but we're not going to announce it until the day after Thanksgiving, I mean, that's fine, I guess. But yeah, it shouldn't take this long to be competent on offense. And that's the problem is I know they had Trubisky. But Colin, we are seeing so many teams that if you have the right guy,

you look functional on offense. The Bears don't look functional in offense. The Giants don't look functional on offense. It's not tenable in the modern NFL to consistently look dysfunctional on offense. And he's been so weird with the quarterback thing. After the game, Sunday, this guy was reported, but it wasn't discussed much. He was asked point blank, if both are healthy, who's your starter, Dolton or Fields? And he wouldn't answer.

We're back on this damn treadmill about wanting to play Andy Dalton. I don't understand it. So, yeah, I think you move on from him the sooner the better. One more question before we go to the break, because I have some stuff on the other end. Baker Mayfield, my suggestion, sit him, then the buy. I get a fair evaluation last five weeks. For those five, they may be favored. But the criticism now is unjust, like the delusion initially was unjust.

Am I close? Well, you've been kinder to Baker today than I would have thought. Because I said on first things first Monday, when we were asked the Baker-Mayfield topic, I said, unfortunately, Colin Cowherd appears to have been right about all of it. It pains me. But Baker's storming, not doing the press conference. Not good. Not good. His wife with the – and by the way, quick sidebar.

Because I'm not athlete-level prominent, obviously. You kind of are. But we are public people that get criticized on the Internet. Yeah. What is up with the family members going online arguing for people? Like, do you know how mortified I would be? Do you know how many people say terrible things to me? People don't all call me Jared Leto.

Let me tell you that much, Colin Cowder. People say terrible things to me. People say terrible things to joy. They're terrible things to you. You can't have your spouse, your mom, this applies to my homes with their mom, fighting your battles for you on the internet. You got to see, it's a bad look for everyone. With all that said, on the Baker thing specifically.

I think he has really hurt himself this year, and I think it is a good lesson for young athletes to learn. You get no credit for playing hurt. Lamar had a cold. Didn't play. Not criticized today. Last time we saw Lamar lost to the Dolphins, this week he's sick again.

He's sick a lot, by the way. It's an odd thing. But nobody, he's like, hey, he didn't play. Not on him. Baker's got a broken shoulder, a torn legroom, a bad knee, and a bad foot. He's getting booed at home. You know why? because his Pippin was right.

You don't get credit for the bad bat game when you score eight points. The flu game, you score 40, good for you. But if you're going to play hurt, you better play well, or else people will just use it against you. Baker should have shut it down three weeks ago. Kyler Murray could have played. He's like, you know what? We won in San Francisco with cold.

It's kind of the same offense. I just want to get healthy. Correct. Absolutely. And by the way, that helps him. And for a guy that's like Baker and Lamar, same draft class, both fighting for a contract. Lamar's getting his. The question is how much? Baker at this point looks like he's not going to get his.

I wonder if he shut it down five weeks ago, got healthy and then looked better if he would have. I think it was a bad, bad decision by him. More with Nick in the herd next. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, this is Jason McIntyre. Join me every weekday morning on my podcast, straight fire with Jason McIntyre. This isn't your typical sports pod pushing the same tired narratives down your throat every day. Straight fire gives you honest opinions on all the biggest sports headlines, accurate stats to help you win big at the sports book, and all the best guests. Do yourself a favor and listen to Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clever Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football or my career in sports media.

Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show, isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart

radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do a little camp? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know.

I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed correct. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah.

For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to my new podcast, Learn the Hardway with me, your host, and your favorite therapist, Kear Games. And in recognition of mental health awareness month, I'm bringing over a decade of my own experience in the mental health field and conversations with so many incredible guests.

I'm talking. Tripp Fontaine, Ryan Clark. Sometimes when we're in the pursuit of the thing, we get so wrapped up in the chase that we don't realize that we are in possession of the thing. And we're still chasing it, and we don't know when we've done enough. Because people scoreboard watch.

Life becomes about wins and losses. Steve Burns Dustin Ross, because you find it important to be a good person while you hear on earth, or are you a good person because you're afraid? Because that's two different intentions, bro. Absolutely. And that's two different levels of trust. I want you to just really be a good person.

Join me, Kear Gaines, is we have real conversations about healing, growth, fatherhood, pressure, and purpose on my new podcast, Learn the Hardway. Open your free, our Heart Radio app. Search Learn the Hardway and listen now. What young people don't sometimes understand, some do that the power of the wife is influential and most crucial decisions. Russell Wilson's wife is Sierra. Yeah. Buried in the Pacific Northwest, her husband's not happy, comes home every day from work and probably grumbles to her.

Russell Wilson, one year from now, is he a Seahawk? No, I think he's a giant, right? I mean, a giant or dolphin? one of the two. Miami or New York. Miami or New York. Here's the, like, he's not going, I think Sierra deserves and is going to have a saying in this.

They're partners. They're both, you know, they both have major careers going on their own. She's an entertainer in Seattle is buried in the Pacific Northwest. Exactly right, which is why the idea that, oh, well, what if Cleveland wants to move on from Baker? Russell Wilson can't tell his wife, honey, I got us out of here. Where are we going? Cleveland.

Listen, I'm from Canton, Missouri. I am not Midwest or Russ Belt shaming, but he also couldn't tell her we're going to Kansas City. If you're going to leave there, it's going to be for a big time coastal city. And the Giants, by the way, the one thing I'll give Gettelman credit for, he won't get to use it, but they have that Bears' draft pick. So they have their pick and the Bears pick. We know Miami traded their own pick, but they still have a surplus of picks. I think one of those two teams makes a play for Russell Wilson.

By the way, remember when Brady, the story was broken? broke the story on Brady to Tampa. Oh, I think it was you. Anyway, Giselle, and I was told this, it came down to Chargers Tampa. She wanted warm weather. She was done with Boston winters. Like, Wives Matter. And when it comes down to big decisions, Giselle said, Tom,

Miami, Tampa, L.A. And they didn't want to travel with all their kids all the way west. So they chose Tampa's Chargers were second. Now, LeBron, it wasn't inadvertent, but Joy brought up that you cannot be a dirty player, but have a dirty moment. So I don't know if it was a dirty

moment. I think it was a reckless moment. I think he definitely was trying to do what he did, but not hit the guy in the face. I think he was trying to hit Isaiah Stewart, like get off me type of thing, but I don't think he was trying to hit him in the face. And you could see, by the way, his immediate reaction, those are hard to fake. And with respect to space jam a new legacy, I've seen LeBron act. I mean, he's good. He's not, I don't know, he's winning any awards. So that, like, he, that was an authentic reaction of, oh, darn. I didn't mean to hit you in the face. Yeah.

So let me ask you this, though, Colin, because I think the whole sports world disagrees with me on this, I think you will agree. So if you're going to suspend LeBron again, now if Yokic got one game for the incredibly dirty play on Mark Keith Morris, if that's the threshold for one, then LeBron should have gotten zero. But regardless, if you're going to suspend him again, I think Adam Silver should have the discretion.

Stars serve short-term suspensions at home on non-nationally televised. games. So LeBron, what is your next game at Staples that isn't on national TV? That's when the suspension kicks in. Who benefits from LeBron James not playing on T&T tonight in his one trip a year in Madison Square Garden? Well, here's why I agree with you. All these leagues are TV shows. Yes. That's where all the money comes from. Secondly, it's subjective anyway. So we all know there is no, you know, this is two games, that six. I mean, Joy and I both thought LeBron would get one or two, the kid would get eight. So if it's already subjective, then let's not pretend that there's a definitive line in the sand and a menu for this stuff.

I'm just going to pick when it hurts the league least. Absolutely. And not just the league. It's the television ratings for national TV, but also we don't think of it because it's New York City. But let's say their game tonight, instead of being at MSG, was there one trick? a year to Indiana. Do you know how much that sucks for the fans of Indiana who bought tickets? I don't want to sound like the guy that says, what about the kids?

But the kids were like, this is my time to see LeBron. And because of this, he misses that game, fans in L.A. have 41 chances a year to see him. And so I just think it's not just LeBron, but if a star, you know, if a one-name guy, a Cady, a Janus, a LeBron, something like that, similar to how they say, try not to load, manage our nationally televised games. The NBA said, okay, you're suspended for your next home game. That way, the fans who have one chance a year to see you,

and how many more times do we think, by the way, LeBron's going to play in MSG? We're not getting Knicks-Lakers in the finals ever. How many years he got left? Three? Call it three. That means he has three appearances. You only played MSG once a year now that you're in the Western Conference.

We all lost out on it. That sucks. No, the other thing is you could say, well, that'll give stars the initiative. to stars don't want to get in fights. Nobody's trying to get suspended. By the way, the opposite is true. In hockey, send a bench guy against the star, get Patrick Kane into a fight, and they both get the penalty box.

So, you know, Morris going after Yolkich is actually a strategy. Absolutely. And I will say, though, because whenever we talk LeBron, people do the LeBron, Jordan stuff, LeBron is now closer in career suspensions to Michael. Now, Michael's was for gambling. It was 140. I'm kidding. I'm sorry.

Michael. My bad. Michael quit the sport in the middle of his prime to go play another one. That's the story, right? He just loved baseball. My bad, he wasn't kicked out of the league for gambling. That wasn't it at all. So LeBron's suspended.

Michael, not very often suspended, I guess. Okay, it's great to see you. Jared Lato. You've got a little bit. This is unbelievable. I don't know how long we have. Is it Letto? We got 10 seconds.

What? You never let me gloat about Chiefs over Cowboys. Your worst sports prediction of the year. I did two segments with you didn't let me gloat. That's unfair. I'll see you in five years. Is it Leto or Leto? I think it's Leto.

Jared Leto. I don't know. I see the similarity. Thanks, buddy. All right, buddy. Hour 2 next. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and Friends.

Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their Between Songs Band. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. On The Look Back at it podcast. From 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 is big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down, and try to be. to make sense of how we survived it with our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors.

Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds.

I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.