The Herd with Colin Cowherd - HOUR 1 - Luka, Harden, Heat, Wilson

Episode Date: May 5, 2022

Is Luka Doncic the new James Harden? The Sixers should consider moving on from Harden It's impressive what the Miami Heat have put together Russell Wilson is already making an impact with the Broncos   Guest: Stephen JacksonSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Find your local station for the herd at Fox Sports Radio.com or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Hurd. You're listening to Foxxport's. Sports Radio. This is the herd. Wherever you may be and however you may be listening, IHeart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, and FS1, live in Los Angeles. It is great to have you here today. Alex Curry is joining me.

Joy Taylor is on her way to give a commencement speech and get an honorary humanities doctorate from Barry University in Miami. So it is great to have Alex in today. Although these NBA playoffs now, it's pretty clear we can kind of see the conference finals getting into shape right now. There's a lot. First of all, happy Cinco de Mayo. Same to you. We were talking during the break about that. And yeah, Joy will come back, Dr. Joy.

Dr. Joy. So let's start with this. There's obviously recency bias is a real thing. Like we all fall in love with what's happening now. This is the greatest day. It's the greatest basketball player. So recency bias, I fall prey to it all the time. I try not to, but you get emotionally connected, viscerally connected to all these like athletes and teams and games and March Madness and the playoffs.

But it was about five years ago in his prime that we were saying James Hardin was better than Kobe. Analytically, he was the greatest, most efficient scoring guard of all time. But there was a truth serum about James Harden that he had the ball in his hand so often and he initiated so much contact. He was exhausted by the end of games. he was a defensive liability. Is Luca Donchich just becoming the Dallas version, the bigger version of James Harden? Always has the ball. Initiates a ton of contact.

That takes its toll on you over a game. Plays a lot of minutes. Everything goes through him. And he scores 35 to 38 points effortlessly. And then by the end of the game, he's gassed and they're picking on him. Chris Paul was seeking him out at the end of the game. We looked it up this morning. Chris Paul went after Luca 50 times as the screen defender.

They were seeking him out. That's what teams did the James Harden. Ryan Rosillo, podcaster came on, my buddy yesterday, talked about Luca's style and how he has the ball so often. There's so many minutes. He's in every moment of the game it wears guys out. They are too Luca-reliant. We've had an incredible run of statistical performances over regular season, like historic stuff, right?

The Westbrook season in 17, some of these hardened seasons. But I kept coming back to the point, and Blake, these guys have the basketball more than anyone's ever had it regularly in history. So I went through usage rates, the top 20 usage rates in NBA history. And the playoff track record is terrible for these single-season players with the highest usage rates in the history of the game. And a lot of them are very recent years. The only player to ever get through a finals is Alan Iverson.

Maverg's only had two other players that even got the double figures, and one just had 11. So it says a lot when you score as much as Luca. When you're this centrifugal force, you know what his plus minus was, not to go all staty and stuff? Minus 28. It's James Harden. It's so much contact, so much ball usage, so much. initiating everything. By the end of the game, you're just a liability.

And by the way, as great as he's been, like Hardin, he didn't come into the season in shape, did Luca. You also need some self-awareness as a star. He's got to figure out how to work with others. He and Porzingis hated each other. Make it work. You also need Luca to do something that it's quite possible international stars don't feel comfortable doing.

getting on the phone and recruiting a player. LeBron does it. Katie does it. Steph does it. That's the NBA model. Now, international players, Dirk didn't want to do it. Luca didn't want to do it. Sometimes international players don't feel as comfortable doing that.

But that's what Kauai did with Paul George. And Kauai doesn't even talk. He got out of his comfort zone and like, okay, put his recruiting hat on. and he got Paul George to L.A. You've read those stories. You were as surprised as I was. So that's a responsibility too in the NBA. Self-awareness.

Getting along with others. Getting on the phone and recruiting players. And I'll say this. You start looking at the West now. This all-Luca all-the-time thing, it's got a pretty low ceiling in the playoffs. Phoenix is pretty young and going nowhere. Denver gets Jamal Murray back.

The Clippers and Warriors are going nowhere. Memphis and Minnesota are young, made the playoffs and feisty. And the Pelicans with Zion back. Watch out. So these teams have a second star. I know Luke is great. Got to get along with people. Not saying poor Zingis is ending at the beach.

Got to get along with people. Got to get on the phone and recruit people. All Luca all the time, I'm watching it. It's James Harden. Now, their games may not be identical, but they initiate a ton of contact. they play a ton of minutes and you know both little weight you know don't always feel like they're in the best shape Jason kid after the game he had a great game but no one else showed so you know we got to get other guys

you know shooting the ball better we can't win with just him out there scoring 30 a night not at this time of the year and we're playing the best team in in the league He can't win with him not getting on the phone either. It's the new NBA model. It's got to get along with people. Speaking of James Harden. So, listen, you're all watching what I'm watching. I watched every minute of both games last night.

Like James Hardin is now a three. And I like James Hardin. And I thought Philadelphia won the trade. I mean, they had to get Ben Simmons out of town. Draft picks? Who gives a rip? They're late first rounders. Who cares?

Philadelphia is going to be very good. Those picks are irrelevant. two first rounders, one next year and one five years from now. Seth Curry is a nice rotational player. And Andre Drummond, no championships or won or lost by him. So I still love what Philadelphia did. But here's the issue with Hardin. He's eligible for a four-year contract, an extension,

for about $230 million, potentially $270. Okay, say this out loud for a second. You know my theory on this. Whenever you're not sure what to do, just say it out loud and let it sit. declining enigmatic player. Let's pay him a fortune. Does it sound like a great idea? No, I think Darry loves Hardin, and Darryl Morey brought him over, and he gave up a lot.

So my guess is they'll pay him. I don't think it's the answer. I'd move off Hardin. And I loved the deal to get him. But here's the three reasons why I'd move off him. Number one, what did you really lose in the tree? trade. Ben Simmons, a backup center, irrelevant draft picks, and a rotational player. You don't want to give up anything. By getting Simmons out of the room, you won the trade. At least Hardin

plays. What do you have last night? 20 points. He plays. Okay. Number two is, look at the construct of your team. Without Hardin. It's fantastic. You have a superstar. How many of those in the league? Six. You have an emerging star in Maxie. That kid is a rocket. You have an excellent three in athletic Tobias Harris can get you 20 points in any night, and you have an elite defender in thigh bowl. So you've got size, defense, superstar, complimentary pieces without James Harden. Number three is, you are watching these NBA playoffs like I am. What to Miami, Milwaukee, Golden State, and Phoenix.

The four best teams are a Yubilee. have. It's not a center. Golden State didn't have a great center. What do they all have? Great chemistry. Amazing chemistry. Tell me a James Hardin team that's ever had great chemistry. He's his own guy and I like him. He's his own dude and I like him. It's hard to build great chemistry when James Harden is your like second guy. All right. So we're witnessing what's winning in these playoffs. Chemistry. Miami doesn't even have a go-to star. I mean, Jimmy Butler's not a closer. Great chemistry. Milwaukee's number two score is out. Still have great chemistry.

I guess my point is I love the Sixers core. Without Hardin. Superstar, emerging number two star. I mean, Maxie right now is their second best player. Tobias Harris, better than average three. Thibble is one of the top five defenders in the league. What the Sixers need is a bench, which you're not going to get if you sign Harden, and flexibility. That's what's always been great about the Warriors. They've always got flexibility to go get an Andrew Wiggins or go get a KD or go get an

Andre Iguidol. They have flexibility. Smart people. The Warriors are full of smart people. Smart people like flexibility. smart people don't want to get trapped you sign james hardin you're trapped you're going to have no bench average flexibility i think and maybe you can move tobias harris maybe that's the answer uh and i think they will sign him but listen athletes that don't take meticulous care of their bodies i e harden

you want to lock yourself into four or five more years of that like you're injured players and closing nightclub players. I'm not locking myself in for five years. I'd love to lock myself into a good bench for five years, flexibility for five years. But as I'm watching Philadelphia lose to Miami, what they needed last night was James to be James. He can't beat guys off the dribble.

He can't get around guys. And I said this, Cam Newton Harden Westbrook, 32, 33 years old. That's the number for a pro athlete. any neglect you go off a cliff I mean like half a season you're not the same player I mean we woke up and cams like MVP declining

oh he can't play I mean Westbrook's like oh he's a star triple double oh he's difficult oh can't play Hardin can play but they need him and this is he doesn't have another gear so I think it's not only interesting now what's happening to Hardin but what do you do if you're Philadelphia? like so much about this team, and I still think they can win this series, but they'd need to imbid. But I don't know if I want to lock myself into this stuff. I'm looking around these

playoffs. The four best teams have the four best chemistry. It's amazing, isn't it, when you don't take all these days off in the regular season? It's like you work really well together. It's amazing, right? That's where we're at. Here was Hardin on the heat's frustrating defense. They're doing a good job of just putting two on the ball, trying to deny me basically the entire court. So it's given our guys more space to be aggressive. You know, I mean, if they're going to deny me wherever I am on the floor, you know, give them credit. But I feel like if we make a little, you know, shots, then I keep saying that.

But it opens the floor up a little bit more than what you got to respect our shooters now. By the way, that's how people played Hardin in his prime. He could just get around him. Different player now. Less of a player now. Be sure to catch live editions of the Hurdoll. weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeart Radio app. You are now entering the No Bull Zone, sponsored by credible.

Great rates, none of the Bull. So, you know, there's always been an understanding. The NFL teams have talked about this for years. Port cities. L.A. has got a port. Miami's got a port. New Orleans has a port. New York's a port city. There's others. Coastal cities can often be harder to manage your players.

Players are young. They've got a lot of money. They're in great shape. Port cities tend to be very active nightlife. There's a lot going on in port cities. And so it is, I think it's really interesting why I have so much respect for the Miami Heat organization. It's hard to be focused in Miami. I mean, the water's aqua blue.

The people are beautiful. There's no state tax. You keep more of your money. And there's a lot to do in Miami. Miami. I mean, Miami is one of the great three-day cities in America. It's probably my favorite. And I'm older. Like, I'm not staying out all night. But when I go to Miami, even I go sideways. And so it is harder to build a great culture in these cities. You know, the Marlins have been a mess forever. The dolphins can't get their act together. Miami Hurricane

football has been uneven. And here are the heat year after year after year after year. the rebuilds are quick i mean all these big heavily discussed cities new york philadelphia dc boston the only eastern seaboard franchise in the league that is well run as miami and i'd argue it's the hardest city to be well run in there's a lot of distractions now can you win a title in the nbaugh bama oboe jimmy butler victor oladipos back tyler hero excellent players But what Miami proves is that a great culture, a commitment to chemistry, the right coach, defense, and a bench can go a long way. They're a number one seed. That you don't have to sell your soul or sell your identity to be formidable.

Brooklyn sold their soul. They had chemistry, a good coach. Players liked each other. They sold their soul for two stars, swept out in the first round two of the last three years. Lakers had a lot of young players, Brandon Ingram, Lanzo Ball, Kyle Kuzma, they sold it all out. Couldn't make the playoffs.

There's something to be said about commitment on both ends. Miami's athletic, deep, they got a bench, and they demand a lot from their players. In a league where the players run it, and that's okay since I was a little kid in the Pacific Northwest. You know, Spencer Haywood, the stars had the power over the front office. That's okay. And I don't know if they'll win titles, but a great example of what the Miami Heat are is Tyler Hero. It's classic Pat Riley. So they draft him. They get him a bit of a

steel 13th. And he stars first year in the bubble. Like 13th pick. I mean, come on. You get these kids out of college now. Even the really good ones. They don't really connect unless they're a John Morant by like year two or three or four. So Tyler Hero comes in and just explodes in the bubble. Year two, A lot of Miami nightlife. Reportedly, got a little sideways. Struggled year two. But at the end of year two, Pat Riley calls him out,

holds him accountable, rips him publicly. Who are you? A lot better players around here than Tyler Hero. And now in year three, six man of the year award. That's the Miami Heat. And they deserve a lot of credit.

It is easy to get into trouble in Miami. It is nothing against Milwaukee. But that town just screams afternoon nap and bed by 845. Nothing against Cleveland. Cleveland flats, rock. No, they don't. Not really. They don't.

Miami Rocks. They don't have to have a term or a saying Miami Rocks to feel good about themselves. Cleveland needs that. But Pat Riley and Spolstra, hand in hand, smart guys, formidable, hold players accountable. And I'll tell you, they did for... The last couple of years with LeBron, I felt like they were kind of selling their identity and soul for LeBron. But they'd won back-to-back titles. The Healds were the talk of the league.

And LeBron was in his prime. And D-Waids, like, the mayor of the city, right? So, like, I got it. But I did feel a little bit like they were kind of losing themselves a little to LeBron. And in the fourth year, disappointing playoffs, he leaves. And they had to rebuild. but you know you can tell when a company's well-run. Because the idea, I mean, I don't care if you're Alabama football,

they've had a lot of downturns. They've had a lot of downturns with Alabama football. Kentucky basketball. They've had downturns. But you know when you're well-run in the athletic department. You know when you're well-run, when the downturns are brief. Because in the NBA, the Knicks have been in a 20-year downturn. The Lakers have been in a nine-year downturn.

Like Miami had to go, rebuild, draft, build. back up. They stayed with Spolstra. They didn't listen to the critics. And here they are. Number one seat in the east. I don't know if they can win a title. I said all year, I don't know if I buy this team. But now Oladipo is back and they look more formidable. But they just hold players accountable, hard practices. You have to play defense. You have to be committed to the culture. And I find them in a very distracted city where it's easy to get in trouble. Tyler Hero is a great example. Kid went sideways, lost himself. They brought him right back in, demanding, held him accountable, and he's off to the races to a great NBA career. Alex with the news.

No, no, no, no, turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Colin, you're selling me on Miami. I've never been to Miami. Oh, well, you grow up on the beach in California. I grew up here. So I will say this. The beaches are better there because the water's warmer. And on the east coast of Florida, you get like real waves. Yeah. And so I love California. But Miami, there's a reason, a thousand people a day move to Miami.

It's very business friendly. It's now becoming a tech hub, believe it or not. And the beaches are fantastic. The water is warmer, bluer. And also, you know, Miami may be brutal in August, but they're winters. It's the last place in America. It's still warm in December.

You're becoming a spokesperson for Miami You're selling me. It's a top my bucket list. It's up there. All right, but let's go to New York because Annette's announced yesterday that Ben Simmons will undergo back surgery to address the pain in the herniated disc in his back. He reportedly will need three to four months of rehab, but he is expected to be fully recovered and able to return to the court ahead of preseason in camp in September. Now, we're finally getting some answers, but it's also raising some questions. If they knew this was a possibility, why wouldn't you get the back surgery right away? It's 25 years old getting back surgery and he hasn't played the entire season.

Yeah, we were saying this this morning as we were preparing for the show. Like, I've just, I'm sort of out of guessing what Ben Simmons. I honestly think Philadelphia just wanted to get him out of the room. Like, like, and that's why as much, as many reservations I have about Hardin's future, James plays. I think he plays to the best of his ability. He can give you 20. Like, I'm, I'm just over trying to figure out this,

jigsaw puzzle. I feel I'm being manipulated. I feel I'm being lied to, not by anybody specifically, but this thing now is just a PR game. I mean, I wish him the best, super talented guy, but I think there are certain times with certain athletes. I always felt this with Antonio Brown. I know Tom Brady loved him. I just think there's, sometimes locker rooms are better addition by subtraction. I really do. Well, they're also going to be watching what happens with Kyrie this off season because he's eligible for a five-year extension with Brooklyn and he doubled down on his allegiance with the team telling the New York Daily News that he wants to put together four straight years of team dominance. So they have a lot of things to kind of figure out this off season. He has a 36.9 million player option for next

season. So it's a lot. A lot of moving parts with the Nets. All right. But let's move on because the Titans selected Malik Willis in the third round of the draft this year. But before the draft, the team looked into other options to improve the quarterback position. Tennessee reportedly explored trades for Deshaun Watson, but Texans wouldn't trade within the division. And then they also dip their toes into a trade market with Aaron Rogers. So this has not been a great week for Ryan Tannehill. He's got a lot going on mentally right now. They just drafted his possible future replacement. He made it clear that it's not his job to mentor him. And now he's hearing that the team was interested in Rogers and Watson.

Yeah, these were reported, by the way. The Aaron Rogers stuff was out there. Aaron built a home in Nashville. Yeah. So, no, I think, you know, again, not to say they're the Miami Heat, but they're really well run. They've got a good roster. They're committed to running the ball in defense. I don't know if they have the guy at quarterback. I don't think they do to win. And I don't know if Miami has the guy. They don't have a Janus. They don't have a Chris Paul or Steph. But, you know, I, you know, I get.

I think there's value in being well run, and I think Tennessee's well run. You can win the division with Ryan Tannahill, and I just think you have to, going forward, look to upgrade. But, you know, there's limitations. There was in Miami. They've gotten the most out of him. I mean, you'll say this for Tannahill. He's a pro.

Shows up, plays hurt, wins a lot of games. But the AFC now is so good at the top. It is so unbelievable. I mean, just think about a division right now. AFC North has Joe Burrow, Deshawn Watson, and who am I missing? And Lamar Jackson. That's one division. The AFC West has Patrick Mahomes, Russell Wilson, Justin Herbert and Derek Carr.

And so I think you kind of look at Tennessee and you're like, listen, I don't think we're good enough to win a championship. We're not going to sell our sole 12 draft picks unless we could get an Aaron Rogers. Then we would think about it. But I don't think they're in a terrible spot. I think there's a reality right now. Tennessee, you just keep building this roster up. So when you get the A++ quarterback like Denver just did,

one draft, you're on your way to be in a very small Super Bowl bubble. And when you have that opportunity to get that one in a million quarterback, you do whatever it takes. That's what you got to do. All right, moving to the 49ers, they have been vocal about their desire to keep Debo Samuel in San Francisco, despite the reports that he wants a trade. But now it seems like they could be working things out.

Devo is following the 49ers on Instagram again just one month after removing the team from his social media. Now, players have been very dramatic with their social media, following, unfollowing, deleting posts. It's become a thing, but we're talking about it. It's a very kind of petty, passive, aggressive way to get your point across. But it seems to be working, and the positive thing is following him again. And it seems like they're working things out. Yeah, I mean, I think if they were in the AFC, I would have my doubts about their ceiling. But I think in the NFC right now, outside of the Rams, a team, by the way, Kyle Shanahan has performed very well against, had McBay's number.

Those games are always tough. They often win, and if they lose, it's close. This team's got some holes, but I don't think in the NFC, it precludes them from being in the NFC championship game. I mean, I would have considered moving off Debo, but in the end, they have him work it out. If two or three of their draft picks hit, you're good. You still have the Garoppolo move to get a player. As we talked about earlier, you stole Garoppolo from New England for a second round pick, got you to the Super Bowl. He's won't like 70% of his games. You don't need draft picks for Garoppel.

If I could trade Garoppolo, honestly, at this point, and get a starting reasonably high-end interior offensive linemen, I'd do it. The roster's good enough to compete. for the Super Bowl. Not sure it's good enough to win it, but it's good enough to compete. Alex for the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The herd lie news. So like a lot of times, there's a narrative on somebody, and it's just not true.

But first impressions are very strong, right? And then also times, we watch the NFL so much. We fall into recency bias. So I've kind of laughed at these people, and there's a lot of them in the media, and a lot fans, Russell Wilson's washed. And it's like, no, he's not. So Jerry Judy is a very, very talented receiver for the Denver Broncos. And Jerry Judy, I mean, Russell Wilson, they just started camp. And Jerry Judy was asked this week the difference between having Russell Wilson out there and the previous quarterbacks. He's a great quarterback, you know, Hall of Fame quarterback. that came into the office as a leader and it gave me better as well.

Just his energy, you know, I was uplifting guys, I was motivating guys to go out there and just keep working hard, you know, even one of them off days, you know, you don't feel like working or doing anything. He's the guy that come up there and get your mind right for it. So that's a great guy to be around. By the way, you know what that sounds like? The Buccaneers when Tom Brady arrived and the Rams, Stafford arrived. They said the same stuff. You could take the quote, the juice, the energy,

there's no bad days. Like people have no idea how quickly Denver is going to be great. And so let's go back to the opening of this, which is, oh, Russell Wilson, he's a little washed. Okay. So Brady and Stafford had defensive coaches and were getting frustrated. And then they moved to offensive coaches, Bruce Ariens and Sean McVeigh and won Super Bowls. But before we get to that coach, let's just take Brady's last year in New England, you thought he was washed, and Stafford's last year in Detroit, low ceiling, and compare it with Russell's last year in Seattle. Completion percentage, Russell's got the best.

Passer rating, not close. Russell has the best. TD to interception ratio, once again, Russell has the best. And you thought Brady was washed and Stafford's best years were behind him. Oh, kids. It's amazing. It's called Google. It's a search engine.

It's not difficult. And those numbers for Russell Wilson are depressed. Why? Because he was hurt last year. So he was out several games, could not practice several games, and then came back. probably two and a half, three weeks early. Russell Wilson, over the next five years, is in his prime. And like Stafford and like Brady, optimistic, high EQ, works well with others.

Do you understand Denver over the last 25, 30 years? With average quarterbacks, really hard to beat at home. So you know they're going to start quick with, Russell Wilson. But when you hear those quotes from Jerry Judy, they're literally Chris Godwin, Mike Evans, you know, Cooper Cop, Robert Woods. That's different. Now the juice. Oh, just the way he runs the practice. Oh, the energy. It's exact same quotes. We've seen back to back years how this works, star joining a team that's just missing the catalyst. That's why I put him yesterday and my herd hierarchy,

Buffalo is the best team in the league. To me, Denver right now this morning is number two. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, I'm Doug Gottlie. The podcast is called All Ball. We usually talk all basketball all the time, but it's more about the stories

about what made these people love their sport and all the interesting interactions along the way. We talk to coaches, we talk to players, we tell you stories. You download it, you listen to it, I think you like it. Listen to All Ball with Doug Ghalib on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Playoffs have been really fun and really intense. Boy, after that Grizzlies Warriors game, like nothing against Dallas Phoenix, but that was like shifting down.

It's a different level. It's a completely different game, intensity, everything. You're like glued to the TV for that series. Yeah. So Stephen Jackson, all the smoke with Stephen Jackson and Matt Barnes, great podcast, Fox Sports NBA guy. So you had success in your career against Chris Paul, who just completely took over the game last night, completely took it over. You guarded them a lot. Now, you're a bigger physical player, so you could probably impose your will a little bit on Chris because of your size and your athletic ability.

What did you do that others didn't? because you had some success against a younger Chris Paul. Yeah, Chris Paul is definitely the point God. He's one of those guys you definitely can't stop. But every player has something that makes them uncomfortable in their game. And I played for Greg Popovich. I played for Mike Brown or Rick Carlop. And they were big on Scott & Reports

and saying what players don't like to do during that game. And Chris Paul is a 98% right-hand driver. You let him get to that right hand. He can pass. He can score. He can do a large. amount of things with the ball on his right hand. And the left hand is limited. He can't really pass with his left. He can't really throw back over his right shoulder with the left. And he's

not comfortable of really shooting going left. Everything is really dominant in his right hand. I had a chance to speak with PJ Tucker last year around the playoff times and kind of gave him some clues to guard Chris Paul. And it definitely helped the rest of that series. But if you let him go right, he's going to be the best, he's going to be the best point guard in the world that everybody says he is. Yeah. You know, Lucas is interesting. I said earlier, Stephen, he's a bigger James Harden. That's what I'm seeing. So he always has the ball.

He initiates a ton of contact. He gets 35 in his sleep and he looks exhausted by the end of the game because he's got the ball usage rate is through the roof. And I mean, everybody goes, no, Luca's better. But five years ago, we were talking about James Hardin being one of the great guards analytically in the history of the sport. And I just, you know, I just think it's too much Luca all the time. You know, jump ball, he's taking the shots, he's got the ball.

I don't know if you can win titles that way. To me, I just see a ceiling with winning championships if Luca has the ball in his hands that much. Your thoughts? James was a perfect example. James had his best years in Houston, and I guess he thought, and Dan Toney, excuse me, Dan Foney, thought that that type of offense was going to win championships, and Kobe didn't agree, and nobody agreed because that's not winning basketball, especially with one star.

Luke's great. Don't get me wrong. Lucas is a great score. He's a great offensive talent. He doesn't give you much on defense, and he's just not that leader, that vocal leader that'll get everybody going. But Dallas also made a big mistake, Colin. Game three, they bought Luca back. Jalen Brunson was bawling. He was rolling,

and they were up too old. They bought Luca back too early and ended up losing that game. Still won the series, but you was giving Jalen Brunson a lot of confidence and the confidence that you needed and for him to be the Batman, I mean, the Robinson Batman, which is Luca. And in order for that team to be successful, where they need another star.

They took the confidence from Jaylen Brunson early, and I think that was the bad move on Jay Kid. So Warriors Grizzlies is a feisty series, and I love it. And now, the other day I said this about Dylan Brooks. He's their tough guy, whatever that means, but he's a little bit like their Draymond. And I felt that Memphis was saying, listen, your guy Draymond went after one of our guys.

Okay, fine. And we may be the kids and the little brother in this series, but you're not going to intimidate us. And so Dylan Brooks came out, and the first opportunity for a hard foul in that game, he went right after Peyton. Now, I don't like what happened to Peyton. I don't like the result. But I said sometimes in sports, intimidation's really valuable. And that's what it felt like he was doing.

Were you totally bothered by it? Is it totally cheap? How did it land for you? Yeah, I'm a fan of Dylan Brooks, but I have to be honest. what you're calling, I'm going to knock all his teeth out, every last one of them. That was dirty. It was completely dirty. Jemann was a hard file.

Jemont tried to actually catch the guy in the air. It was a hard file. Yeah, he came across his face. And that would be a flagrant one. You know, a flagrant one coming across his face. But Dylan Brooks, this was a chief shot. He had no, he had no effect on the play whatsoever. He came in and hit the guy straight across his head.

No attempt at the ball. This was a straight, dirty play. I don't like it. Like I said, if I was in the league right now, I wouldn't play the rest of the series because I'm going to knock somebody out. Let me ask you this. When you knew you had to make a statement, Stephen, like you went into a game knowing I'm going to make a statement.

What was okay and what was not okay? What was hard and what was dirty? Well, I can give you a perfect example. I had one of the biggest tasks ever and gone Durkner Whiskey in the first round when he was the MVP of the league. I didn't undercut him. I didn't elbow him. I stayed in his face.

I let him know it was going to be difficult night all night. If he didn't like the way I was playing defense, then it could escalate and it can go to a fight. But for the most part, I kept in basketball. I sent him right. I made it difficult on him. I stayed in this face. And I didn't do nothing dirty.

And this way is to stop guys and beat him. He was going to make a statement without physically hurting someone. And that's something I was good at. Stephen, what we're seeing, and you would know this because you were part of a great culture, that the four teams I think are the best in the league are Milwaukee. right now playing the best, Miami, Golden State, and Phoenix. They all have one thing in common. Excellent chemistry.

Excellent. Milwaukee's missing a player. Miami doesn't really have the A-plus-plus star, but chemistry. So I look at Philadelphia, and they have an option at the end of the year to, you know, pick up the hardened contract for four or five years in like 250 million or not. or not, and this is my argument. James Hardin has never been in a team with great chemistry. He's his own dude.

He's his own culture, right? And I like him, and I like the deal to get him, but they've got Thibyl and Embed, great size. They got a superstar. Maxie Stevens becoming a star in front of our eyes. Tobias Harris, a solid three. Get 20 all the time. I don't think you can have a great culture with James Harden.

I wouldn't sign him. And I don't care if I gave up a bunch of late first-round picks. I don't care if I gave up Andre Drummond. I can't commit to him for five years. Am I out of my mind? No, you're not because, like I said earlier, we've seen the best of James Harden in my mind in Houston. And I think he still has talent.

I think he has the love of the game. I just don't think he wants to be that star. He don't want to be that go-to guy no more. He want to make his money, float under the radar, and, you know, have a big game every now and then. What's going on right now, what you're seeing is Maxie is the robin to Embed. Embed is Batman and Maxie is the second best player. And if he continues to be the second best player in these playoffs and averages what he's averaging,

then it's going to be an easy decision to make. It's going to be an easy decision to make Maxie and Embed. We can have them for a long time, longer than we could have James and Embed. And Maxie gives you way more on both ends of the ball. Finally, Bucks, Celtics. We've seen two different games. I still like Milwaukee without Middleton. Who do you like and why in the series going forward?

Well, I've always said this. You know, Greek freak is like Shaq. He's the most dominant player in the game. But his skills are limited. He can't really shoot. You know, when you find guys like Al Hartford, who's just as big as him, who can move his feet, he has trouble. You can give him jump shots.

He's not going to really knock him down. And he's going to struggle against Boston. Because one thing about Boston, three teams in the playoffs all have Spurs DNA, and they all prepare for players, and they know what their players do best, and they try to take those things away. Boston is doing a great job of being physical with Greek Freak.

Without Middleton, they don't have a closer. Without Middleton, they don't have a guy to make those big shots, those long jumpers when Greek Freak can't get to the basket. And that's what Boston is doing. They're keeping them away from the basket and forcing them to hit jump shots. Without Militon, it can't get done. All the smoke with Stephen Jackson and Matt Barnes,

two smart guys who know their stuff, Great seeing you, my man. Love having you on. Always, my God. Take care. All right, Stephen Jackson. So he likes Boston in that series. I'll say this. They gave Katie Fitz. They gave Kyrie Fitz. And Janice has had not bad games, but inefficient games for Janus. So, you know, I had watched Boston during the regular season, and they had the second most blowouts in the league of Phoenix. So because when you play great defense in any sport, when you lose, you lose close.

So when you go back to the Seahawks, when they, they had that great defense, the Legion of Boom, they lose. They didn't lose big for like three years ever. So that's Boston. Boston's going to be in every game because they limit you offensively. And then when they're hitting shots, like in game two, they blow you out. So to Stephen's point is Boston's going to be in all these games. I still think Milwaukee with Janus, down the stretch, I get the best closer. But this is a profoundly different Celtics defense. There's a lot of good defense in the NBA. There's a lot of teams that play better defense in the playoffs. Boston's like next level. They took KD for four games completely out of his game. None of us

have ever seen that. And Yonis has really, from an efficiency standpoint, he's started both games in this series really slowly. All have different ideas about success, retirement. What do we do with our money? Can't do it alone? Go to somebody with 130 years of quality service. Steffle, Financial Advisors, STI-FEL, Steeful. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and Friends, me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an

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A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but, celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the I Heart Radio

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