The Herd with Colin Cowherd - HOUR 1 - Tatum, Watson, Cardinals

Episode Date: June 15, 2022

Joy Taylor filling in for Colin Jayson Tatum is due for a huge game in the NBA Finals Deshaun Watson's comments at training camp The Cardinals still haven't worked out a contract extension for Kyler Murray   Guest: Nick WrightSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Joy Taylor in for Colin Cowherd today. He will be back with us tomorrow, but very excited to be here with you today, alongside Alex Curry, who was kind enough to make some time for us, because she is off across the ponds, just hours after the show today. Today's the day that I finally leave for Italy. I'm very excited for you. I'm so excited. It's going to be a, it was a packing mayor.

miracle because I had to be here this morning, I did everything last night. 10 days, carry on. First time in my life I've ever done that. We're going to talk about this because I'm not really an overpacker, usually. Oh, I am. I try to be kind of efficient, but I'm going on a long trip later in the summer. I'm going to try and do the same thing.

Colin just got back from Italy. Ryan was in Italy. Everyone. Everyone's going to Italy. It's the Italy summer. I went last year, so I guess I got it started. It's okay. Yeah, Trent Seder.

I'll take credit for that. Thanks for hanging out with us today. We have a big show today. Game 6 is tomorrow night. So we have a lot to talk about there. We'll talk to Nick Wrights. First things first. Ryan Hollins will be in studio with us today.

Former NBA Center, Rockets TV analysts, UCLA alum. And T.J. Husman Zada will also be in studio with us. Fox Sports NFL analysts and Fox Sports Radio's up on game, which airs right before my show, the Joy Taylor Show on Fox Sports Radio on Saturdays. And speaking of Fox Sports Radio, we're very excited to announce that the herd is debuting today on our new Fox Sports Radio affiliate, Fox Sports 920 in Columbus, Ohio. So welcome Columbus, Ohio. Thanks to GM Brian Ditko and PD John Crenshaw.

And then coming up next week, the herd will debut in Nashville. Hey. You've been to Nashville. Oh, yeah. Okay, yeah. Well, you're like a huge live music individual. Yeah, it's my other life. Sports and then live music is my other life.

Yes, I too love live music. was under the impression that LA was more of a live music town than it, uh, than actually has turned out to be. Yeah. Um, but yeah, so we have a fun show. Welcome Columbus, Ohio. Next week we'll be in Nashville. Uh, Colin will be back tomorrow. But let's get started with game six tomorrow night. Very excited for this matchup. I think this will be one of the more intense game sixes that we've seen in a very long time for, for many reasons. and I do think that this will be Jason Tatum's night. But before we get to that,

we'll talk about what Steve Kerr said in his locker room after game five, which I want to set the table for this because when you initially see this quote, it's like, whoa, bulletin board material, we're going to win. It's a guarantee that's the one thing you don't want to do in sports is guarantee a win. Of course, also on the road, a team's back is against the wall, elimination game. But that's not actually what happened. So Steve Kerr was in the locker room. after the Warriors game 5 victory.

He said we're going to go get this in Boston. We're going to finish this in Boston. Now, again, the sound got out of this. If he had said this in a press conference, I'd be a little bit more concerned. But what are you supposed to say to your team after a huge win and you're going on the road to possibly close it out?

Of course you're going to tell them that they're going to win. But Jemond Green also talked about the possibility of closing it out in Boston tomorrow night. Here is Jemond Green on his podcast on the volume. Going on the road and closing the team out and the silence that you hear in an opposing crowd, it's an insane feeling because you feel like you just conquered them.

And so that's great. Having an opportunity to close a team out when you're at home and sharing that moment with your fan base, I mean, that's like, it's glorious. To say one is better than the other one is like, yeah, you can have your preference, but they're both absolutely incredible, but they give you different feelings. I totally understand what Jemann's saying. Winning a huge game and closing out the series at home,

celebrating with your family, going out in the city where you play and live and celebrating with the fans, everything being right there for you. That's an amazing experience. But I also understand what he's saying about ripping the hearts out of your opponent on the road and ending the series early.

So I see both sides of that. Now, that being said, going against what Steve Kerr told his team in the locker room and what Draymond just said, I don't think they're closing it out tomorrow night. I think Boston wins game six because I've had this going seven the entire time, which is why I never panicked throughout this series. I want the series to be long. Don't you want this to be a long series? Don't you want to see a game seven? What's better than a game seven? Nothing.

So I've been rooting for this all along. I've thought the Warriors were going to win in seven, which is why I think Boston wins tomorrow night. But the other reason why I think Boston wins tomorrow night is Jason Tatum. So he hasn't been particularly impressive throughout the finals. There's been a lot of questions about, is he going to have this big game? Is he really even the finals MVP if the Celtics end up winning? I think it's Jaylon Brown at this point. He talked about not being a superstar.

Did he give himself that label? And I do think there are some genuine questions about whether he's a true number one or not. And these are terms that we use in the media and fans. Are you a number one? Are you the leader? All these intangibles that are really kind of impossible to quantify. But we discuss them because we know what we can see. We know what we can follow. We know what we, we know what the results are and the energy that a Kobe or a Michael or a LeBron bring to the table when you're talking about true number one. I think Steph Curry is also that. But I also don't think you need to be a number one in order to win a championship. I don't think that a lot of people feel that Kauai Leonard is that type of leader, that he's that type of number one.

but he obviously was the catalyst for the championship in Toronto. Tim Duncan, obviously the leader of that team, not a very vocal guy, an outspoken guy, a real killer, but all-time legends. And he was truly the heart and soul of those teams. So I do think that you can be on the quieter side, the less flashy side, the less killer side, and still be the leader number one of a team.

But I don't know that Jason Tatum is the leader of this team. What I do think about Jason Tatum is he's due for his big game. If you look at his numbers throughout the finals, game one, 12 points, obviously not particularly impressive, 28, 26, 23, and 27 in game five. But if you look at what Jason Tatum has done facing elimination in the 2022 playoffs, it's a little bit of a different story. So they've had three elimination games that they have played in the 2022 playoff run so far, which is incredible.

It should really tell you the story of what this is something. Celtics team has done in the postseason. Just look at the numbers. Obviously for our radio audience, it's going to be more more difficult, but points per game, 31.7 to 25.4 in all other games. This is elimination to all other games. Higher rebounds, assists basically the same, and field goal percentage goes up significantly. Three point percentage goes up from 51.6, from 37.3 in all other games to 51.6 facing elimination. Basically, he's awesome in the clutch. And that's why tonight, I think, is it going to be Jason Tatum's night? And quite frankly, I think Boston's going to need it.

There's going to be a lot of animosity in that building tonight. Tomorrow night is going to be wildly intense. Forget that it's an elimination game. Everything that's gone on throughout the series with Dramon Green, Steph Curry's talked about it, Clay Thompson's talked about how excited he is to go back to Boston. And Steve Kerr, while not bulletin board material, it did get out that he said that they're going to close it out.

So I think tomorrow night is going to be incredibly intense. I think we're going to see an all-time performance from the stars tomorrow night. And I'm looking forward to seeing Jason Tatum write another chapter in his history because we've had a lot of questions about, you know, is he a superstar? Is he a superstar? Really doesn't matter if he's going to step up in the biggest moments and there's plenty of time left in the series for him to do that. He can completely remove that narrative. So I can't wait for tomorrow night. And it is going to be intense in TD Garland.

So let's transition to Deshawn Watson. He spoke to the media at camp, mandatory camp, yesterday. This is the first time that we've heard from him in a very long time. After everything that's happened with this story, particularly over the past couple weeks, I was very surprised that anyone would let him go near a microphone, that this would be a good idea. But he actually had to speak to the media per the NFL rules being a NFL veteran at a mandatory camp. So that That's why he spoke. And here's a little clip of Deshawn Watson at camp yesterday. And what I was saying is, yes, I never assaulted, disrespected, or harassed anyone.

But at the same time, I do understand that I do have aggressed as far as the impact that has on the community and people outside of just myself. You know, and that includes my family. That includes this organization. That includes my teammates in this locker room that have to answer to these questions. That includes, you know, the fan base of the Cleveland Browns. includes males, females, everyone across the world. You know, so that's one thing I do regret is the impact that has triggered on so many people.

And, yeah, it's tough to have to, you know, deal with. So nothing he said yesterday moved me either way. I don't think he made things worse for himself. I don't think he made it any better. My opinion about the situation has been the exact same since day one. Since this whole thing began, nothing. about my opinion has changed because I knew what it was from the moment that the story came out. I knew there would be more cases. I knew there would be more developments in the situation.

Two more cases are possibly going to be filed very soon, which would bring the case number up, if I'm correct, to 26. Started at 22. Two more were filed in the last couple weeks. Tony Busby has said that they are going to file two more. So if those get filed, we'll be at 26. I don't know why 26 would change your opinion from 22, which was the original number. And that's why my opinion about this has never changed. My opinion of the Browns bringing him in is the same from the moment that they did it until now. Whatever happens in this situation is exactly what the Browns deserve. They knew what the cases were when they chose to sign him and give him $230 million guaranteed.

So however this plays out is exactly how it should play out for them. my question with this situation, with all of the new information that has come out, with the additional cases, the quote from Deshaun Watson's lawyer, which I still to this day cannot imagine why anyone defending anyone in this particular situation would say anything, even remotely close to what he did, him saying that all of this, everything that's happened, the public reaction thus far and the precedent that existed before all this began, as far as the punishments that the NFL has doled out for player misconduct. I don't know how the NFL doesn't start at a year for Deshawn Watson. Because keep in mind with all these cases, none of them have been settled,

none of them have gone to court yet. So there is a very real potential that at worst, he loses all of these civil cases. Then where does that lead you? Now, he very well may win some. He may lose some. We don't know, but they haven't started. And it's not a class action suit. So each of these individual cases has to go to court. This is far from over.

So my question isn't about what the public opinion of the public opinion of Deshawn Watson is, what's actually happening with Deshawn Watson civilly or potentially criminally now that there are new cases out there or any of the new developments. My question is what is the NFL going to do and my fear and anxiety with this situation regarding the NFL from the very beginning began with the Ray Rice situation.

We all know how badly that went, how quickly it went terrible. And the public reaction, how long that story lasted, and the effects that it's really had on the NFL and dealing with player misconduct to this day. So I don't think at this point, with the amount of cases, the new developments that continue to come out day after day with the situation, that the NFL doesn't start at a year. I fear that anything less than that, with the potential for the explosive nature of this situation,

it is going to be one of the worst PR disasters in the history of sports. And I'm not suggesting that you do this just for PR reasons, obviously, but the backlash will be warranted. So I don't see how he plays a single game this year, but we'll see how it develops over the rest of the offseason leading into the start of the NFL.

year. Coming up next, we will discuss Cliff Kingsbury's prayers and why I completely agree with them. Joy Taylor, in for Colin Coward on the herd. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth.

Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way,

this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes

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on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking What the hell does George Bush

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We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Dollar Shave Club, six blade razor brings noticeably smooth shaves with six stain-the-seal blades for swift hair.

and a lubricating strip that keeps things smooth. Dollar Shave Club raisers are sold at Dollar ShaveClub.com or in stores. Welcome back to the herd, Joy Taylor in for Colin Cowherd. He will be back with us tomorrow alongside Alex Curry, who is getting ready for a cross-the-world adventure. It's a perfect little pregame with you. It is. Pregame with a little bit of sports and work before I just go traveling all over Italy. You know, I do like the work the day that I go out.

because I feel like I, you know, like accomplished. Like I'm ready to go. And I've been off for like a week and a half. So I'm like, sure. Yeah. Let me come in. Well, someone who is at work right now is the NFL in minicamp. And the big conversation around the Arizona Cardinals this offseason has been

Kyler Murray. And there's been a little bit of a drama here. It does feel like it's settled down a little bit. But there is still the conversation of his contract and what they're going to do with it. And Cliff Kingsbury gave his thoughts. on Kyler Murray's contract yesterday camp. I'm praying before training camp. I just want him there.

They want a training camp. There's no doubt. He's the leader of this franchise. You know, we're about to make him. I'm sure the highest paid player is franchise history. And so he understands what comes with that. And the guys know what he can be at his best. And any time we can get the whole band out there, things pick up.

I agree with you, Cliff. I don't like to waste prayers, but I also am praying that this contract gets done before training camp. Because what I don't want to deal with is another Dak Prescott saga. It's the same with Amar Jackson. I don't like talking about people's contracts. I don't like talking about what people make. It doesn't matter to me. I'm not running them a check, so it really doesn't matter to me what someone is paid.

And in this situation, this is a good thing to have to pay for. I never understand why organizations get to the point where they have to pay their quarterback. and then it's this panic reaction of having to pay the quarterback. This is a good thing to have to pay for. It's actually the number one thing you should want to pay for is a franchise quarterback. So this discussion about how much or how long or when are we going to pay him or if you should pay him, you have the guy. What else is there to discuss?

Figure the numbers out and get it done. And you're better off getting it done early than dragging it out and losing even more leverage as an organization and having to pay more. I do agree that there is a number that you want to get within. We've used the stats and showed the graphic many times. If your quarterback takes up more than, I think, 12.4% of your salary cap, you're not winning a Super Bowl in the last 11 years. That's a significant amount of time. So there is a number that you want to be within with your franchise quarterback,

but paying your franchise quarterback is something you should budget for. Like when you start a family and you're having children and you're planning on, you know, establishing a life, you probably want to be. saving for, I don't know, a home. And then when it's time to buy it, you buy the house. Like, that's a good thing to have to buy because you have the family and you've saved for it. You've planned for it.

Plan to have to pay for a franchise quarterback. It is a good thing. And when it comes to Kyler Murray, I don't know what the argument and discussion is. You look at the Cardinals record since Kyler has arrived there. And again, before Kyler, it was Josh Rosen. We don't need to revisit how that went for Arizona. In 2019, they were 5, 10, and 1 his first year. Then in 2020, they were 8 and 8.

Then in 2021, they were 9 and 5. and he missed three games. That was his record. They have gotten better every single year with Kyler Murray. Coincidentally, same with Cliff Kingsbury, which is why they gave him an extension. You have your future here. There's not a whole lot to discuss. He's also a dual threat quarterback.

He is the immediate future of the Cardinals. Now, when you get into the conversation of how long, what type of contracts you want to give him, those are other conversations. And I understand. I wouldn't give him a Patrick Mahomes 10-year deal. I wouldn't even give him a Josh Allen's six-year deal. I think he's somewhere in between Derek Carr and Dak Prescott. That's around the deal that you want to do with Kyler Murray.

This anxiety about, oh, is he going to be here for the next 10 or 15 years? Are you going to be there in the next 10 or 15 years? Like the Cardinals are in a position to win within the next three to five years. That's what you have with Kyler Murray. Figure it out. Get it done. Don't drag this out. And the question when it comes to franchise quarterbacks in the space of Kyler Murray is, you know,

does he have the leadership? Is he completely dedicated? Is he going to have injuries? Okay, these are fair questions, but you have the talent level. So what is the floor or the ceiling, right? That's the conversation. Someone who I always point to with this is Kirk Cousins. Kirk Cousins is considered to be completely, completely average, right? He's made a lot of money, but he's not somebody that everyone thinks is really elite and he's not terrible. What's happened with Washington since they franchise tagged him twice and gave him $44 million guaranteed in those years. He's gone 33, 29, and 1. Totally average. What's Washington done since Kirk Cousins left the building? Let's take a look. They've gone through

10 quarterbacks in four years, not including Carson Wentz. The record is 24 and 41. That's the seventh worst in the league during that time. So you can be completely average and pay a guy a lot, or you can be above average to great, which Kyler Murray is in that conversation, and pay him a lot. pay your quarterback. Get it done with Kyle and Murray so we don't have to talk about this throughout the entire season. Here's Alex Curry with the news. No, no, no, no, turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Well, Joy, there's been some talk and even some doubt whether or not Trey Lance is ready to take over for the 49ers as their franchise quarterback. Now, Lance was dealing with a finger injury

last season that he suffered in the preseason game against the Raiders, but according to sources close to Lance, his finger is fully recovered. Now, they said his passes are a noticeable more crisp and tighter. But this is what stood out to me. Lance noted that he had to throw the ball differently last season due to the injury, which could be a cause for poor throws. And he was unable to fully use his index finger to finish off throws during the 20-21 season. So now I'm wondering, because we've been talking about this for a long time. Is Trey Lance the guy? Why haven't they said he's the guy? So is this finger injury a bigger deal in a bigger situation than we were led on to be? or are they placing the blame on this finger situation right now because he is not ready yet

and they're kind of buying him a little more time as to why he wasn't at the place. They wanted him to be in that moment last year. This raises more questions for me with this finger injury. Yeah, the question that I have with the Niners and Kyle Shanahan, and Kyle Shanahan likes to kind of do this. He likes to sort of play these shell games and not be super transparent with the media, which is his prerogative to do. But I do think when it comes to your franchise quarterback,

you get into a little bit of muddy waters there where there are some questions. Is he ready? Is it his finger? Is he just not where he needs to be to be the starting quarterback? You still have Jimmy Garoppolo on the roster. Why would you still have him if he takes up cap space? You're trying to get trade value for him. You got him for a second round pick.

There's just a lot of questions. And when there's this many questions, I do start to wonder why. Because the talent should speak for itself. There shouldn't be this many questions. I think Tray Lance is perfectly capable. I liked the pick when they made it. And I understood, whereas I normally want young quarterbacks to start right away, I understood why Tray Lance didn't because he hadn't played football in quite a while because of COVID.

So he was a little bit more raw than most prospects that would be taken in the position that he was taken for the amount that they gave up. But there's just a lot of smoke here. And I feel like some pretty strong statements could really smooth this out. Yeah. And the fact that they're not gives me a little bit of pause. Also, last season, did we feel like this finger injury was that big of a deal? Well, no. We talked about it, but I didn't think it felt like it was that big of a deal that he completely changed the way he threw, that it impacted everything he did as a quarterback.

Guys also, you know, disguised and don't really discuss injuries. And we've heard all the time, like, oh, I played with, you know, this injury the entire season. I can see that. I just feel like there's so much going on with this situation. In the one position that there should be not this many questions. Correct. And smoke going up. But speaking of quarterbacks, Lamar Jackson has skipped voluntary OTAs but was present for mandatory mini-camp that started this week. And John Harbaugh noted how great it was to see his quarterback back on the field. He's physically in very good shape.

I thought his arm looked really good. You can see he's been throwing a lot. And you see he's in great condition, physical conditions. So it's great to have him out there. I kind of boosted everybody's spirits a little bit too. But it was good to see and he threw some great balls. So it's fun. Now just remember, Lamar is currently trying to get a new contract with the Ravens. He is entering his fifth year option, which will pay him $23 million this season. If the sides are unable to reach an extension by March 7th, Baltimore is expected to place the franchise tag on him. But one big thing to remember here, Lamar does not have an agent.

He has his mom helping him out. And this is the moment right here, right now, where you want an agent and you need an agent to go to the table who is a professional negotiator to get you. max deal exactly what you need so you can do what you do best, which is focus on playing football and performing to your best of the ability during training camp, during the season, and getting your team to a Super Bowl. This is where agents are worth every single penny. We have agents. Everybody in this industry has an agent to get you that next big deal. And this is the moment, this is the moment where you need one. Yeah, I agree. I'm not anti-agent at all. And listen,

Nobody loves to have to shell out money, but there's just certain things that are worth paying for. And there's also certain times in your career where agents are extremely valuable. And you can get to certain points in your career where you really don't need an agent. Maybe you just need a lawyer to look over the paperwork. Or you just need an accountant.

You don't need somebody to go over the details of the contract because you're happy with your contract and you just want to get an extension or whatever else. There have been guys who have negotiated contracts on their own. But in this situation, It's your first big deal. When you're going into and essentially betting on yourself at this point, I don't love it from that perspective because you can't focus on football and negotiating your first major deal.

No. So I'm with you. This is a point where I would absolutely advise someone to have an agent. Now, obviously, if you don't want to pay any money out, then you also have to be happy with whatever deal you negotiate and how things work in that situation. or if you don't do it because you're focused on football. Like there's just a lot of risks here that could be avoided. I do think that obviously Lamar is the future of that organization and they're going to get it done.

I just don't know that it's going to be this year. That's a lot to focus on. It's a lot to focus on. And think about it. You're going to get more with someone who knows how to negotiate. So think about that what you would have gotten if you're doing it yourself. But there's also intricacies of contracts. Like there's wording in contracts that matter that changes when you get your money,

how you get your money. Oh, yeah. Is it guaranteed? There's all kinds of little nuances and contracts. It's not just, oh, it's this many years, this much guaranteed. There's a lot that goes into it. Oh, I have to read over my contracts with someone. I mean, I don't know what it means.

I'm like, just tell me what it means. I don't know what this means. Tell me when I'm getting paid. Yeah. All right, moving on. LeBron got everyone riled up when a clip from his show, The Shop on Uninterrupted's YouTube channel said that showed him saying he would love to play for the Warriors.

But what the promo clip did not show is there was another. team from the playoffs, he would also like to join. The team I would love to play for is not in the playoffs, which is the Lakers. Yeah. But if it was one team that I know I could make an immediate impact in the postseason, and we could be very special. It'd either be Miami or go and say, for sure. What?

LeBron knows what he's doing right here. What do you mean? I'm just telling you. How do you just slip Miami in there? How do you not put Miami in the promo? Uh-huh. Did I hear that right? Yes, yes, it was Miami.

He was his second option, but he knows what he's doing here. Come back to Miami, LeBron. Give your plea, give your plea. I mean, listen, you know how great it is down there. Yeah. What are we talking about here? How does it bury the lead? Yeah, I know, exactly.

But he knows what he's doing here. He's not in the playoffs right now, which is probably killing him inside. He's keeping his name in the headlines right now. We're talking about him. And to be honest, LeBron's going to do what LeBron wants to do. LeBron's not leaving L.A., but that clip is a bury the lead situation. I was just going to slip Miami, Cadillian. Forget Golden State.

Go back to Miami. That's Alex Curry with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Heard Lye News. All right, let's go out to my friend Nick Wright, co-hosts of First things first. And What's Right with Nick Wright's podcast, new episode Sunday, Tuesday, and Thursday. Hello, Nick Wright.

I heard that, did I hear correctly? Did you switch your pick in the finals? Yeah, I did. What does Colin tell us with new information? You can develop a new opinion. Here's what happened, Joy Taylor. As committed as I am to take integrity and pick integrity, I'm more committed to actual integrity.

And I found myself doing something. So after game one, I was like, oh, my God, the Warriors are in trouble. but it had been one game and I was like, and I'll look like a coward if I switch my pick after the one game because of the team I picked lost. But then after game two, which the Warriors won by, what, 20 points,

that's when I switched the pick, first of all. So I actually think there is added credibility bonus for switching off a team that just won and blow out fashion. But the reason I did it was literally during the show, I think it was on a Wednesday, after the Warriors won, during a commercial break, I went on the old Fox bet app

and made a sizable wager on the Celtics to win the title. And I'm like, man, I just bet the Celtics to win the title. I can't go on TV and pretend I think the Warriors are going to do it, so I told America. That's what I did, Joy,

and I have no shame in it. You're allowed. Once every two years, you're allowed to switch a pick. I've decided, and I've used up... I've done it now. I am very... Mid-series.

I stuck with the Mavs when they were down 3-0. I'm very... I'm very... to changing my opinion based off of new information. I do appreciate that. I wish more people did that in life. I find it intolerable that people believe that that is something that's cute. I don't know who told them it's cute.

It's not cute. But how do you feel about that pick today? Well, you know, I have opened myself up, as your buddy and former, I think, mentor Dan Lovitar would say to be able to be wrong twice about the same series. And one never wants to do that. However, I do believe Boston's going to win game six, and I also believe this. As great as Steph Curry is, in the highest leverage finals moments, he has not played his best. He called game seven in 2016 the worst game of his career.

That might be a bit harsh, but it was close. and game six in 2019 against the Raptors, he was not much better. I think he was six for 17. He had 21 points and missed the shot that could have won the game with eight seconds left. So if it gets to seven, I do think the pressure mounts quite a bit on the warrior's side of things. And I think what the Celtics are doing wrong, a lot of it is fixable. The turnovers and Tatum's hesitancy when going to the basket, I think that's fixable. so I feel okay.

If the question is, am I right now betting more on the Celtics? I am not. I'm fine with my one wager, and we'll just see how that one plays out. Well, I picked the Warriors in Seven, so I agree with you that Boston is going to win tonight. And I also think that where there's been some questions about Jason Tatum, and I started the show with this about, you know, is he a superstar?

Is he the one? Is he the leader? he's been awesome in elimination games, and I do think tomorrow night is going to be his nights. You have him in club superstar. Do you still feel strongly about that? Because I do think there's an argument to be made that your superstar club might be a little too inclusive.

There's 12 guys in it. What do you mean? It's 12 guys. That's how many active players you have on an NBA roster. That's why we're doing 12 guys in Club Superstar. There's a theme here. And if we're kicking anybody out, who are you kicking out?

If we're kicking anybody out, we're kicking out Chris Paul. If we're going to kick out guys, we're going to kick out Chris Paul. But LeBron, who has a merited status at Club Superstar, needs another old guy to hang out with. So he wants Chris Paul in. Now, some people are arguing Jimmy Butler should get in. Okay, I understand that argument. But it is hard for me to square the circle of Tatum is in having beaten Jimmy Butler,

but now we are kicking him out for struggling in a series that Jimmy Butler didn't get to because Tatum's team beat him. Tatum played better than Durant in round one, didn't play better than Janus in round two, but the game six, the game you're talking about facing elimination, Tatum had the game of his life. And while Jimmy's, I thought Jimmy was the best player in the conference finals, Tatum was excellent and his team ended up winning. Like, we're not putting Devin Booker in right now. Trey Young, no chance.

Like the, no, Jason Tatum, he's 24 years old. He's first team all NBA, and he's the best player on a finalist. This is like a first cousin of the stuff people would do to LeBron, which is LeBron drags a team to the finals. They then lose the finals, and he's like, oh, that's another finals loss. Now, Tatum didn't drag this Celtics team. This is a good Celtics team. But if Jimmy Butler had made that three,

and the heat were in this round of the playoffs, Would anyone be arguing Jason Tatum is not a superstar? Of course not. So a lot of guys struggle in their first finals. LeBron struggled in his first finals. Kobe struggled in his first finals. Durant didn't, to his credit, Durant didn't struggle in his first finals, but a lot of guys do.

I'm not going to kill Tatum for being 24 years old. And by the way, it should be noted. Tatum has rebounded the ball well. He leads to team in rebounds. He's passed the ball, excellent, leads to the team in assists. He's shot the ball from three, brilliant. He's leading the team in points and everything, essentially, where he has struggled is on two-point attempts and on turnovers. So I'm not acting like he's been amazing, but he's also, he hasn't been horrific.

If he were putting up the Draymond stat line, then maybe he would be evicted from club superstar, but he's not doing that. No, I don't think that he's been terrible or anything. I think the expectations that come with being the best player on a team in the finals are warranted as well, though. You have expectations from the best player on any team in the finals. And I think that's where it's coming from. That said, I think he's going to be amazing tomorrow night. And I think the Celtics go to a game seven and then lose to the Warriors. So I wanted to talk to you about this because I feel like Colin and I, I don't know your opinion about this at all.

We're talking to Nick Wright, host the First Things First, Joy Taylor in for Colin Cowher today. Colin and I feel like are the only two people in the media who, at least that I've heard, that feel a strong. as we do, that people should be allowed to make money. And I don't have a problem with these golfers leaving to play in the Live Golf Series. I just don't. I can't fake the outrage about it. What is your opinion about what's happening with the PGA tour in the Live Golf Series? So I thought John Rom, I thought his quotes were really interesting where he talked about the history mattering to him. and I thought he maybe had the best quote of anybody on this.

But I also think sometimes there is low-hanging fruit and people can't help themselves but to pluck it. And that low-hanging fruit is these guys essentially aiding the Saudi government laundering its reputation. But I believe in following things to their furthest logical conclusions. And if we are going to go down the round, road of anyone who associates themselves with

either a multinational corporation that might have done some evil at the top or a regime that might be doing some evil a lot of us are going to be looking for work in short order. It's very hard Balmani made this point and he is correct. It is very hard to be a totally morally pure capitalist.

And there is some moral relativism going on and I understand some of the things that the Saudi regime is alleged to have done is just objectively abhorrent up to an including allegedly, you know, dismembering and murdering a journalist. Like that is a clear line that you're going to say, yeah, that shouldn't be crossed, obviously. But I don't if, I was saying this on the podcast actually to my son, to Damase. Because there was a period of time where I thought he might,

and he thought he might be able to play professional basketball overseas. if the only league where he could play or he got an offer to play in China, would I say, well, you shouldn't do that because of the oppressive regime, the way they treat the minority Muslim population there? No, I wouldn't have. I mean, how about everyone rightfully is arguing right now free Britney Greiner as they should be, but prior to the war, Putin and Russia had done some pretty awful things, and yet nobody was saying she shouldn't be playing basketball over there, which is helping them launder their reputation. And she was not, you know, there are many women over there playing basketball. And so I just think it's very difficult for

where we're going to draw these lines. And so I understand why people would draw them at Live Golf in Saudi Arabia. I just think if we're going to be intellectually consistent on it, there's a lot of us are going to have to, you know, buy different types of shoes, use different types of phones and maybe work for different companies. Yeah, no, I agree. That's sort of where I stand on it is that I'm very much a keep that same energy person. So where do you draw the line

on this moral grandstanding for where your money is coming from? Do you actually do the research to find out where your money is coming from or the items that you buy or the places that you shop, the music you listen to? Like, where does it ends? And I understand it's very easy to say, well, I just wouldn't take that money. But no one's ever

offered you $125 million. And no one will ever offer you $125 million. $125 million. So it's very easy to say that you wouldn't do that, but I quite frankly, I don't believe you. I don't believe you. All right, I said it. I don't believe you. Well, hold on. Well, just Joy, wait, let me just push back a tiny bit. I do,

I, I, I do believe there are, that we all have lines. I just think sometimes those lines are arbitrary. I, you know, we don't have to get into it here, but I have you know my politics. Um, I have seen

the level of broadcasting talent and argumentative lawyerly talent it takes to make $10 plus million if you will advocate the opposite side of my politics. I think I could be one of the greatest ever and I could do it immediately. It's not hard. I wouldn't do that. So I have a line. I don't think you would do that. So I think you have a line. But where I do have a problem is, is where we, I think it's just easy and people aren't going further than surface level on. Phil Nicholson is an easy target. A lot of that he did himself. Some of these guys, let's just go after them as opposed to are we going to make the argument like you said, you know, that hey, LeBron James shouldn't take that Nike check

unless they are going to upgrade the way they treat their workers who are making the shoes. I mean, some people do argue that and you could argue that. I'm not arguing that. So it's all kind of fruit of the same poisonous tree. We just all have to determine personally where our own line is that we won't cross. Make sure you check out first things first with Nick Wright. And What's Right with Nick Wright is podcast, new episodes every Sunday, Tuesday, and Thursday. Thank you for coming on with us, Nick. Enjoy game six tomorrow.

Of course, Joy, just real quick. Yeah, before I go, are you about to get it? I don't want to put your business out there. Are you about to get another passport stamp? Are you globetrotting again here pretty soon? Oh, I am. I haven't seen you on IG. I am, but not as soon as Alex Curry, who's leaving for Italy tonight.

Oh, wow. Look at you guys. Wow. Good for you, Joy. That non-kid life, I'm envious. I'll be at a recital this weekend. You'll be in Rome. Okay, enjoy.

See you. I'm sure that I'll be wonderful, Nick. Yeah, that is the life that Alex Curry and I live, the no-kid life. We'll be back on the herd. Baker Mayfield doesn't have a lot of suitors, but I do think that the one team that is looking at him might need to be a little urgent. That's next.

Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern 9 a.m. Pacific. I'm George Reister, host of the Reister or Wrong podcast. This is the intersection where sports, business, society, and pop culture meet the truth. Absolute fire on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays. Facts only. Make sure you check your feelings at the door because no BS is allowed. We keep it 100. This is where real conversation.

happen, listen to the Rights or Wrong podcast on the IHeart Radio Apple, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth.

Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement

to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life,

mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok.

Hey, this is Robert from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast. Joe and I are both lifelong Star Wars fan, so we're celebrating May the 4th with a brand new week of fun, thought-provoking Star Wars-related episodes. Join us as we tackle science and culture topics from a galaxy far, far away, such as the biology of taun tons and wampas on the ice planet hot, or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to Stuff to Boar Your Mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs?

Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got? to do a little count. Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it.

Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so you all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people.

Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to the herd, Joy Taylor, in for Colin Cowherd, alongside Alex Curry. Fun show today. Thank you to Nick Wright for stopping by. Ryan Hollins will be in studio with us in just a few minutes.

But the situation in Cleveland is quite fluid when it comes to their quarterbacks, both Deshawn Watson and Baker Mayfields. And there's been some reports about where Baker may end up. He is not at mandatory minicamp. He has an excused absence from the team. Obviously, he's still rehabbing, and it doesn't make sense for him to be there if Deshaun Watson is there, which he is. But the Carolina Panthers have been the most consistent rumored suitor for Baker

Mayfield. And the kind of consensus on how this thing is going to play out is that everyone should just be patient and waiting to find out what Cleveland's going to do and not spend any money or spend any picks on Baker Mayfield because they may end up having to cut him after all. And why would you give something or do you pay for something that you could eventually just get for free? However, the new report about the situation makes a lot of sense to me. So Jonathan Jones of CBS Sports reported that, you know, obviously the main sticking point with the Panthers is that they want the Browns to absorb as much of Baker's salary as possible because they're, are paying Sam Darnold $19 million. But there is a sense of urgency with Carolina to get the deal done soon to have Baker Mayfield in camp.

Now, Baker Mayfield is still rehabbing from his injury, but it would make sense that you'd want Baker in the building. If you're going to bring Baker Mayfield in, he is essentially going to be your franchise quarterback. We've all seen enough of Sam Darnold to know that he's not the future, but they might just have to run it with him this year because he's there. If you do make the move for Baker, you'd want him to have some familiarity with the building, start, you know, building relationships, which has been kind of an issue for Baker Mayfield with some people. I wouldn't be desperate if you're the Panthers, but it does make sense that they would have a little bit of urgency

about getting Baker in the building, getting him around everyone, start going over, you know, the system, you know, do things that you can do while you're rehabbing to get familiar with the organization if they're going to make that move. Again, I wouldn't be desperate if I'm any team in this situation when it comes to Baker Mayfield or Jimmy Garoppolo, because I think they're both going to be on the market for free very soon. but it does make sense that they would want to get that deal done sooner than later. Joy Taylor in for Colin Coward today. Collin will be back tomorrow and we will get ready for game six, which is very exciting.

Ryan Holland's in studio with us in just a few minutes and I will give some more thoughts on this live golf PGA tour drama. It continues on. It's the herd. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite, unhumored me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing huge. human potential. Either way, the podcast, Superhuman, documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

you get your podcasts. On the Look Back at it podcast. From 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84 was big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a hear. unpack what went down and try to make sense of how we survived it with our friends fellow comedians and favorite authors like mark lamont hill on the 80s it was a wild year I don't think there's a more important year for black people listen to look back at it on the iHeart radio app Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts a win is a win a win a win a win I don't care what you're saying yep that's me cliver taylor the fourth you might have seen the skits my basketball

in college football journey or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human. Thank you.