The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hour 1 - The Thunder win the title

Episode Date: June 23, 2025

Colin discusses the Thunder winning the NBA championship with their game 7 win over the Pacers and why despite their historic run, they shouldn’t be considered one of the all-time great teams The NBA playoffs are too long and the injuries seem to show us thatSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it. But, you know, tired and sick. Tired and sick.

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What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast, Point Game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was crying. You just understood.

That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis' keep coming to you. He's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the,

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It's the herd wherever you may be and however you may be listening. Thanks for making us part of your day. John Middlkoff is going to be filling in for the next three days. My buddy John Middletoff got a very popular podcast at the volume, Three and Out, former NFL scout. You know, you're a self-admitted football guy, and I like football more than basketball, but I did grow up in the 70s and the Pacific Northwest

with Bill Walton and the Blazers and the Sonics, and people always lament the 7th. 70s NBA, John. There was no great dynasties, and I defend it because I collect basketball cards when every other kid had baseball cards. But I got to admit last night, that kind of

felt like a nothing burger. Did it not? It was a big win for the small markets, I guess. I guess it was. It was. It's a small story. Listen, we have entered in the last seven years a new NBA. The champions they're good teams.

Yokicch, The only All-Star on Denver. Yeah, you can see them, Thunders, Celtics, Nuggets, Warriors, Bucks, Lakers, Raptors. Folks, OKC has one elite score. He had three bad games, shot 24% from three. Chet Holmgren disappeared for five games. J. Dub disappeared for several, and they won. That's the champion.

I'm not sure they do. if Halliburton remains in the game. Baseball's best teams right now are stacked and feel like it. Attendance ratings up. The NFL's best teams, Ravens, Kansas City, Philadelphia, stacked. Ratings up. The new NBA, it's like you're battling the CBA as much as opponents. In fact, OKC is so young, they could potentially be significantly better over the next three years

than this season. They've got two first-round picks. They're young players like Holmbrin, who's talented, but wildly uneven. You have no idea what you're getting quarter to quarter. J-dub, what a ceiling, but what a disappearing act. Alex Caruso literally had to show OKC's young players how to open champagne bottles. America's event-driven now. It's a Tom Cruise movie, a Taylor Swift tour, the World Cup. The college football playoff, the Super Bowl. And these NBA playoffs, I know I tried to defend them, but last night after that Halliburton injury, it felt small.

I don't want every NBA champion to feel like the 2004 Chauncey Billups Pistons. I don't. Last night, I'm watching that game because I'm a sportscaster. I missed MJ's Bulls, Tady, Steph, Clay, Draymond Warriors, the Heedles. Hell, I miss the Duncan, Manu, Tony Parker, Spurs. This is not a knock on Oklahoma City. They won due to roster construction and depth, which is not exactly a great movie poster.

The new NBA is the era of accounting where you have to draft really well and develop really well, and then cross your fingers where players stay healthy. And the last team standing was the healthiest, and maybe has the best GM and has tremendous roster construction. But again, that doesn't get me to goosebumps. This felt like a great day for Oklahoma. Maybe a neat day for Oklahoma and surrounding areas.

And I know I sound like a buzzkill. I'm not telling you how to feel. I'm just telling you how I feel. I think Indiana, 10 years from now, will be the team you remember. Now, maybe I'm wrong. maybe O KC goes on to win six titles. Seven. And they're one of the greatest dynasties ever.

Because the new CBA doesn't allow for star stacking, and really the GMs will be as big as the players. But when I watched the Dodgers Padres last week, it jumped off the television, the animosity, the intensity, the stars. It was everywhere. And I felt last night there's the old saying, video killed the radio star, and the new CBA has killed basketball stars.

They can't play together. So just think about this in terms of all-time great teams. OKC has one elite score. Three bad games couldn't hit three pointers. The number two and three scores really struggled. I mean, Chet Holmgren was the invisible man for like four games in the series, maybe five. And they won. That's why Indiana was so captivated.

rating. Rick Carlisle, the oldest coach in the league, the most overrated player in Halliburton. If not for the injuries, maybe I feel different. And I'm happy for Oklahoma City. They have probably the best young executive in the league in Sam Presti, but it felt small. And when the Celtics lost Tatum and the injuries throughout the playoffs, it just didn't feel big, and it hasn't for seven years unless your team won. And here's SGA after. No matter what, like you go into every night wanting to win and sometimes it just doesn't go your way.

And tonight could have been one of those nights where we found a way. I'm so proud of this group. I wouldn't have done it with any other group in the world. It feels good to be a champion. So I thought it was interesting earlier in the day, the KD trade came down. And people were so excited. Here's what's funny. He didn't have much of a market, but we were so excited for basketball

that, you know, 36, 37-year-old Katie going to Houston felt bigger than game seven, especially after the Halliburton injury. So Kevin Durant to the Rockets, I said this for the last two weeks. Why isn't there a bigger market? I do think this could help or hinder his legacy because KD is starting to feel a little like old shack and current Aaron Rogers. Kind of sad. Katie to Brooklyn was an absolute mess. Katie to Phoenix was underwhelming, although it should be noted. Phoenix was about a 500 team when he played, 3 and 17 when he didn't. So he wasn't the problem in Phoenix.

I think it's going to work. This to me is the perfect place to go. So they have things Phoenix didn't. They have an infrastructure that the Sons didn't. Houston has a great coach. They just gave an extension. They have size. Phoenix doesn't.

they've got depth. He doesn't have to play 68 games a year. They've got multiple players. Cam Whitmore, Javari Smith, Reed Shepard. He doesn't have to be on the floor a lot until big games and the playoffs. So I think this is exactly what Houston needs. And strangely, it's exactly what Kevin Durant needs. A relevant team, excellent owner, one of the top five richest owners in the sport,

excellent coach lots of depth shengoon will be the centerpiece of the offense amend thompson will be the defensive stopper and then the team has all sorts of length around him so kevin doesn't have to be as great defensively as he was probably six seven years ago i mean houston was held under 90 points twice by the warriors they can't shoot so he's absolutely necessary i think he's a perfect fit they've got all the structure. And by the way, certain people, Shaq was often distracted. Aaron Rogers clearly needs structure. That's why I've said Aaron and Katie are similar. They're very good when structures already present. Because what Katie doesn't want to do is end up being if this

goes sideways, a yeah, but guy. Yeah, it was great, but he didn't win big without Steph. Yeah, he had to bounce around. He had eight different head coaches. I mean, yeah, Yeah, he was great, but when you really compare him to like LeBron and staff, you know, what is he kind of a wander? I think Kevin Durant's game, his talent, he was the number one mid-range shooter in the league last year. Only two people in the NBA also average 25 a game and then hit 40% on threes. Yo Kitch and Kevin Durant. He's still an elite player.

If he remains healthy for the next two years, it will feel like the Houston Rock. Stole KD from Phoenix. If he crumples to the ground, cross your fingers he doesn't, then maybe Phoenix likes the assets they got. Here's Kevin Durant yesterday. Being part of the Houston Rockets, I'm looking forward to it. Crazy, crazy. The last couple weeks when I'm glad it's over with. You know, when people can just hang your career in the balance like that and just choose what they want to do with your career as a nerve-wreck and feeling. But being able to kind of dictate what you want to do and then being with a team that values you.

and I'm looking forward to it. Kevin, people are going to hold on to that dictate what you want to do. Did you have a hand in this? Most definitely. I mean, they asked me where I wanted to go. Some of my destinations I gave them to him, and here we are. Yeah, again, everybody wants to pick a side on trades, winner and loser. If KD remains healthy, Houston's going to feel like they won this trade

because they only had to give up one first round pick. If he has injury issues and the number 10 pick the son's gotten the draft hits, Jalen Green's expensive, but it'll be productive. Dylan Brooks will start for them, a bunch of second round picks they can play around with. Then maybe it feels like Phoenix won the deal. But I do think Kevin Durant's game is too good to be sort of lumped into a yeah-but guy. One of the best NBA offensive players of my lifetime, and I started watching this sport in 1971, 72, so I'm happy for him. Well, you live in the Arizona area.

He said something, John. I thought it was interesting. He's just got such an interesting personality. He'll go on Twitter and talk to people. You see him on the street. You go to games. He'll talk to people. He said yesterday, he goes, you know, they didn't want me, so I'm glad to go.

How did people in your hometown Phoenix, how did they view KD and the whole KD. Beale experiment? Yeah, I think the sons have just been a disaster. People are tuned out. I think the expectations when they traded for them were pretty high. I mean, you get it Kevin Durant. The same thing with Brooklyn. you're expecting we're going to compete for the championship.

Last year wasn't even close. Now, not all his fault. The owner's a little crazy. I mean, you know, trading for Bradley Beal absolutely backfired. I actually think this situation, Houston feels three or four years a little too late. I mean, he's 37, Colin. He got out in the NBA when he was 19 years old. So a lot of wear and tear on this body.

If he would have got there, like, when he moved to Brooklyn, a situation like this, who knows, I don't know. It's about a lot of injuries lately, Colin. Yeah, no, he's playing about 60, 65 games. Now, the good news is they have a lot of length in Houston and a lot of young guys, so he does not have to be, you know, it's pretty clear they're going to keep him around for the playoffs. They got him. I mean, they got to the playoffs without him.

And Jaylon Green is not a defined player. He's too expensive. I think it will pay off for sure late, but you cross your fingers on health because with KD, you know it with the Warriors. That is now a thing in his career. Are you confident that he's going to be there for more than a year and a half at this point? It's kind of a traveling circus a little bit. I do think I've heard for years NBA players like Houston. They like living there, no state tax, middle of the country.

My take is this is where he ends it. And I think it's a pretty good spot because I do think they have a defensive culture. He's not the defender he used to be, but they have a defensive culture, and they have the length and quickness, amend Thompson. So they really need him to grab it and shoot it. They shot fewer three-pointers than anybody in the playoffs. They had two games with the Warriors under 90 points. It's like, he is exactly what they need, and they don't need him to be multiple in roles.

Bro, catch it, shoot it, score, hit threes. That's all we need. And I think that's what he provides. Totally. Be sure to catch live editions of the herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the IHeard Radio app. Hi, this is Jay. I'm the producer of the Paul and Tony Fusco show.

Usually in these promos, they ask you to listen to the show. I'm here to ask you, please don't listen to the show. host are two absolute morons who have the dumbest takes on sports imaginable. Don't listen to this show so it can get canceled. Whoa, whoa, what the hell are you doing in our studio? Get him, Paulie. Ignore that fool. Listen to the Paul and Tony Fusco show on the IHart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast.

He's still moving. Hey, it's us to Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, huge news? We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to...

We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers.

This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing. a bit for the podcast where people could call in and say, Hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman helped make you funny. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes.

Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis, and I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris. Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on Clay.

Jen she went. I mean, she went down at three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lena Rubakina is arguably the best player in the world right now. And I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your courtside seat to the French Open.

Listen to the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds.

I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's great to be back. John Middletoff joining me today. Don't forget in 40 minutes from now where Colin was right, where Colin was wrong. Rick Buecker, Alexi Lala, stops by. He's all fired up. So, listen, I'm like you.

I sat around all day. I thought, okay, you don't get many game sevens. I thought the Indiana Pacers were an amazing story. It's one of the craziest playoff runs. They were underdogs to Milwaukee. They were supposed to get rolled by Cleveland. They weren't going to beat the Knicks. They even sold game one of the finals in OKC.

It's just you don't get stuff like this. And then Tyrese Halliburton, this incredibly likable guy, and his kind of crazy dad sometimes, he was along for the ride. And then he gets hurt, and you're like, oh, you can't beat OKC with one. ball handler and just T.J. McConnell. But last night was a real gut punch. It was hard to stomach.

And this was the eighth Achilles tear this year in the NBA, most ever, and the third in the playoffs, most ever. The NBA is on notice. Shorten the playoffs. They started two weeks before the draft, the NFL

draft. The NBA is faster. There's more spacing. There's way more movement. Players are just moving more. It's twitchier when you can see his Achilles flop. Ah, it's gutting. An Achilles tear used to be what old guys did at 58 playing handball. It was an old guy injury. It wasn't for 20-year-olds. That tells you everything. And baseball, for the record, has made multiple tweaks in the last three years. The sport has greatly benefited. The NFL tweaks in season. We love the NFL. The NBA has never been a stubborn league. Move off seven game playoff series until you get to the

finals. MJ, the most popular to the league ever was, five games in the first round. Maybe you can do conference finals at seven. But the NBA just got a $76 billion TV deal. The billionaires are going to be okay without another home game. Everybody's going to eat. Adam's going to eat. The owners are going to eat, the players, the coaches, seven and eight figures everywhere. These early round seven games, when you look at these injuries, the Achilles injuries, it's a wear and tear injury. You're just fatigued, you're tired, you're pushing it. Like they always say, you know, you tear the Achilles on the last ski run of the day, or as you get older, you're an old guy and you're pushing it, that's where this usually happens. So next year, think about this, two of the most captivating players that we argue about, Jason Tatum of the Celtics won't play next year.

And now Tyrese Halliburton, because the lateness of this injury probably will not play next year. Are you going to tell me the Eastern Conference, I don't get Tatum and I don't get Halliburton? You think that's good for the league? I was thinking watching this injury, I'm thinking, you know who really benefited in the East this year? Orlando and the Knicks by getting knocked out earlier. They'll have a healthy roster. So I just look at this. College basketball in March gets bigger ratings than the NBA often gets in the playoffs.

Why? Urgency. Make the games matter. I'm not asking for one and done. But when you're seeing eight injuries and three tears over a course of a season, these are the world's, arguably the world's best athletes. They're in incredible shape. Very few of these guys play themselves into shape.

They come in finely tuned. and the NBA should not be a war of attrition. Once again, think about this. The NBA playoffs, the playing tournament, started April 15th. Fourth of July is around the corner. These things are too long. It doesn't take 10 weeks to realize, yeah, that team that dominated the regular season also ended up winning the NBA championship.

If a team can win in five, they're good enough. if you're losing in five, you're not good enough. And so I think Rick Carlyle, highly emotional after, I think on a more personal level, but on a level for all of us, you kind of felt like, oh, you felt a little cheated yesterday. The oligarchs and the billionaires have a $76 billion contract coming.

They can give a couple of games back. Here's Rick Carlisle after. What happened with Tyrese is just, all of our hearts dropped. But he will be back. He authored one of the great individual playoff runs in the history of the NBA. With dramatic play after dramatic play,

it was just something that no one's ever seen. And nobody wants to see, again, how it ended. Again, the NBA in most of these leagues, you know, we always thought baseball was the stuff sport unwilling to change. And Rob Manfred has stepped up and made change after change. And they've all worked. Baseball is much easier to watch. Two-hour, 35-minute games. The game flies by. It's really made baseball. It's given it a bit of a renaissance. And I say that as a guy that for about 15 years stopped talking baseball. It was too slow. None of the kids in my house wanted to watch

baseball. It was soccer. That's not the case anymore. The games are faster. The NBA needs to act quickly, succinctly, shave playoff games. We don't need 10 weeks. Here's John Middlkoff with the news. No, no, no, no, turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Well, Colin, Caleb Williams and Bed Johnson

head into their first season together, with obviously Ben coming over from the Lions this offseason. Speaking at the Fanatics Fest yesterday, Caleb was up there with Peyton and Eli. He discussed how his relationship with his new hands. coach has grown this offseason. It's been awesome. Ben Johnson, he uses some choice words every day towards me.

He's tough. I love him. He's awesome. It's been great being around and we hang out in his office and we just, you know, we have lunch and times, things like that. We just, you know, build this bond in relationship to be able to, you know, last a while. I think it's interesting because I, and I, you and I, you and I have talked about this privately, and on our podcast, is that offensive coaches in this league are better with O lines.

If you look at the highest-ridden O-lines the last 10, 7, 8 years, most are offensive coaches. If you look at some of the worst O lines, it's often, New York Giants excluded, defensive coaches. McVeigh, Andy Reed, they can fix offensive lines quickly. The Steelers have been trying to rework theirs for years. The first thing Ben Johnson did is fix the Interior O-line. And I thought, regardless of what happens this year, and regardless of Caleb Williams is good enough, Ben came from Detroit and went, Joe Tuny, Drew Dahlman, the Rams Guard. He's like, I got to protect this guy's feet. And so, you know, as somebody you were a scout in this league, I don't know if Caleb Williams will be a star.

But that initial move in free agency by Ben Johnson told me he, he's a guy. He's got, because that's what McVeigh did in L.A. with golf. Left tackle, fix the interior O-line. So I actually have a lot of confidence in a team that I shouldn't. Yeah, I mean, this was a head coach. How often do we see now guys get at these opportunities not jump immediately? We just saw it Liam Cohen. Ben Johnson was kind of the opposite of that.

He waited. I mean, remember he kind of hung up the phone as Washington was flying to him? Turns out that was a pretty good job. I think the key for a lot of these young offensive coaches, just remember when McVeigh got to the Rams, Kyle got to the Niners, run the ball. Even LaFleur when he got to the Packers, they started Aaron, you're not just going to carry us on your back. Caleb's been used to that.

That's how he played with USC. It's not going to work in the NFL that way. So I think they've got to get him under control. The roster's pretty good. The problem, though, Colin, division, the schedule, it's not easy. So good luck to these two. Yeah, I mean, we, I said this last year, Minnesota ended up having a great year, but I said if Minnesota finished in fourth place,

it would be the most dynamic fourth place team you'll ever see. I kind of feel like Chicago doesn't have Detroit's roster. They don't. They don't have the continuity and the momentum of Green Bay. And do they have the coach of Minnesota? So I don't know, I feel like if I said to you today, 10 and 7, would you take that in-jerk? You would take it.

If you were a Bears fan or Ben Johnson or Caleb, one-th-thous-old. And this is the hard part about this job. You know, Dallas, we understand why it's a tough job, but they have won a lot since winning the Super Bowl. They just haven't won that often in the playoffs, but they've been in the playoffs lot. This Bears team, beside the Erlacker run now for about 15, has been not very good.

And obviously, you know, Aaron Rogers, Minnesota has had a lot of good teams over that time. Now Detroit, I would say Detroit healthy, second best roster in the NFC behind Philadelphia. So it's just, it's difficult. And the pressure, I mean, you're there a lot now, that market, it's a flip. ball town, the expectations and the results don't exactly match up.

So it's a tough job for these two. No, listen, since May, there's two topics in Chicago now, the Cubs and the Bears. Yeah. Like, that is the topic. Everybody's interested. So, but you know, Caleb said this when he went there. Chicago cares about sports. It's fun to be in those markets.

For sure. This is a cool story. Sean McVeigh and the Rams. They made an unusual decision this offseason holding their mandatory mini-camp in Maui. Players were encouraged to bring their families with them, and McVeigh talked about what it meant for the team's bond. It's about connection, and being able to get some time. It's cool to be able to, you know, really for me,

meet a lot of these guys' families that maybe I haven't met quite yet or see their wives or girlfriends or their kids. And so that's been a really cool thing so far. This is about being able to get some good quality time with each other and then being able to use the platform that we're blessed with to be able to get back to a community that went through some similar things that we can all understand and kind of empathize with. It's really remarkable.

This feels a little different than a previous coach we dealt with. Do you think that Lombardi Parcells or Belichick would have taken this team to Honolulu and played a little golf? I don't know. This to me screams, though, 2025. It's got it all. NFL. A business feel with Maui tourism. You know, very player family century.

McVeigh, Young, kind of has a collegiate feel to him. I mean, I saw pictures of, you know, Whitworths along for the trip. Devante Adams, they're playing golf. Everyone's wife went. You know, the NFL is a little different than, you know, definitely the one I grew up in the 90s and even the 2000s. It's very player-centric. It's not the NBA, but it's a different version of, you know, management.

They control everything. You've got to give it. And they have a young team, Colin. And the expectations are pretty high. So a lot of good vibes right now around McVeigh. Well, and I also think you've asked the players to play another game. you're probably going to ask them to play an 18th game, and you're now asking teams to regularly play overseas,

and the league's never had more revenue. So to me, you know, we've all had bosses. When the bosses are making a lot of money, I'm always okay with it. Spread the wealth a little bit. And so I think, you know, John, the other thing with all the new CBAs, there's just less hitting at practice.

And I think there were certain cliches we've always grown up with. But the more and more you read about studies, they're like if kids don't start hitting until they're 13 or 14 for blah, they're going to be just fine, and you don't need a ton of hitting in these OTA and mini-camp.

Do you remember when the CBA changed, I think, in 2011? Harbaugh and Pete Carroll gotten a little trouble in the off-season because they were being a little too aggressive on defense. Those days are done. The off-season is really about hanging out, being with your crew, going to hockey and basketball games,

And, you know, getting to know your new team because we have so much turnover now in the NFL. Yep, agree. Okay, this one's interesting because your guy, Sam Darnold, is now in Seattle. After an incredible season with the Minnesota Vikings, it did not end very well. Remember, the Vikings went 14 and 2 and looking to win the division, but ended up losing their final game, and they got completely outplayed by the Rams in that wildcard game in Arizona. Donald has been open about how he played too close, how he played to close out the season, saying, we laid an egg as an offense.

You know, here's the thing that, let me defend them. So they lost in Detroit, right? That was one of the games. Biggest game in Detroit, probably 30 years. That was my argument, John. I said, guys, this is the biggest game in Detroit. You were not winning that game. Now, it was uglier than you want.

You were not winning that game. It's also a division rival. Those are hard games. And the Rams game, again, because it's back to back, is easy to pick on. But by the end of last year, Jared Verse was becoming a top five defensive player in the league. That ram defense, because of its youth, from week three to week 15, was a different defense. This team had Philadelphia beat in Philadelphia. So Darnold goes to Detroit, and he didn't play well.

And then that Rams team, In the snow is the only team in the playoffs where you felt, oh, Philadelphia is in trouble. We have to give some credit to the lions and the Rams. Those were tough spots for that offensive line in Minnesota. And I think if Kevin O'Connell could get a redo, you know, I think there are two different versions. You and I talk a lot about this, about the young crew.

The LaFloors, obviously, Kyle, they like to run the ball. Arthur Smith up in Pittsburgh. Kevin, and rightfully so because it worked most of the year. Throw that ball, baby. Well, when it's not where. working. Well, who's the offensive coordinator in Seattle? Kubiak. Where does Kubiak come from? Shanahan. He's basically a Shanahan family member. They're going to try to run the ball, slow down the game. Because when you get in positions, when you're down a couple scores, how many quarterbacks,

Josh Allen, Patrick Mahomes, Matt Stafford still, there's only a couple guys who can really carry you in that environment. Yeah, I agree. I think Donald's going to play well. I think their team's pretty good on paper. You know what I mean? They got a lot of good young talent. People act like Seattle because they haven't been in the playoffs last couple of years. They're not winning four or five games. They won ten games last year, Colin. We just said the Bears would sign up for ten and seven. Seattle went ten and seven. So it shows you, the NFC was a little top-heavy, but it was actually pretty deep last year. They don't have the quarterbacks, but they have a lot of good teams, a lot of good coaches. I'm pretty high out Seattle coming into this season.

Well, if J.J. McCarthy hits, so you have a Caleb, you have a Jaden, you have a J.J. McCarthy, the reason the AFC separated from the NFC, they hit on quarterbacks. Like three years in a row, they hit on all their quarterbacks. If this quarterback class is as good as that like Herbert Joe Burrow 201, we're going to look up at the end of this year and go the gap between the AFC and the NFC, especially with the rebirth of Darnold and Baker, it's pretty close. A lot of good coaches in the NFC, a lot of young offensive hot shots. I think Mike McDonald, if he was an offensive guy, we would talk about him like McVeigh or Kyle.

So Dan Campbell's turned into, you know, the version of the hardball brother. Can't deny it. He's like the third horrible brother. So really, really good coaching, I think, in the NFC. They might not have the quarterback star power, but the high-end coaching is pretty impressive. John Middlecough with the news. Well, that's the news.

And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lie News. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Hey, it's us, the Jonas brothers. And guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, huge news? We created our own podcast called,

Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's extra special.

So how did we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band. Before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down?

Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast, where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends, me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

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everything happening at Roland Garris, every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on Clay. Genschen win. I mean, she went down to three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lina Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court-side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal but encouraged. It's the enhanced games. Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I'd put on 10 pounds.

I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Bryson, Kepka, Rom, Phil, and DJ. Some of the biggest names in golf are headed for the Texas shootout at Live Golf Dallas. Catch coverage of around one Friday at 2 p.m. Eastern and round two Saturday at 3.30 all on Fox.

By the way, Chicago's getting a tournament. People are already talking about it up there, so they got big stars. So, you know, as I started the show today, I was thinking, I don't want to be Mr. Negative OKC because I'm really impressed with Sam Presti. The fans there, it's their first title since they've moved. They thought they were going to get one with KD and Hardin and Russell Westbrook, and they didn't, and it's heartbreaking. So I was happy for him last night, but I just thought once Halliburton got hurt,

I'm like, okay, this is a really forgettable final. This is the worst. And it's not their fault. They deserve it. But I was saying is we have entered a new NBA. This is the seventh different champion in seven years. And a lot of it's because it's Adam Silver's NBA. So David Stern took the league over from Larry O'Brien, and they needed big markets to flourish.

The league wasn't doing well financially. The finals were on tape delay. I mean, seriously. Playoff series were on a tape delay. The league was a mess. And so David Stern leaned into stars and big markets and had no problem with dynasties. But Adam Silver inherited the league where the ratings were downpost, Jordan, but the league was making a lot of money. It was culturally relevant.

And there were a bunch of dynasty after dynasty after dynasty. And a lot of the market owners were complaining that it's very pro-Laker, pro-Seltic, pro-Miamy, pro-Big Market. So Adam Silver, it takes a commissioner five or six years to create their own. league. And I think this is the league he wants. I'm not sure it's going to be popular, but it's a league that's collaborative. You can't stack stars. And we're seeing it in real time the last seven years. Oklahoma City, excellent defensively, but basically one elite score, and he didn't even shoot particularly well, especially from three, and they still won. So I said, I took the last seven champions. Let's rank him in order of how, where they rank,

in this seven-year stretch. I think of the seven champions, I would put the Raptors as number seven. It was very Kauai Leonard dependent. It was Fred Van Bleet and Kyle Lowry and Danny Green and Sergei Bocca. It wasn't a great team. I mean, they went six plus games in each of the three rounds. They got very fortunate on a bounce against Philadelphia. Again, happy for them, a one-and-done. That is the weakest champion in the last seven years. I don't mean to beat upon the Thunder, but I think they're the sixth rated team. Listen, they have one offensive player. It's mostly depth and roster construction.

Their second and third best scores, like Chet Holmgren and J. Dub, disappeared in games, and they still won. And also, are we sure they would have won of Halliburton play? Great team defense, but I thought they had the second best coach in the finals. Their best shooter shot 24% from three. They're going to be noticeably dead. the next three years than this year. Number five, I'd put the Milwaukee Bucks.

Again, a team that had to come back from multiple O2 deficits to win. Now, it was Chris Middleton in his prime, Drew Holliday in his prime, Janus emerging as a superstar a previous year or two. So, again, they felt like defensively the best team in the league, but they fell behind in multiple playoff series and were in trouble, and had to go multiple games, I would put them at number five. Number four, the Warriors. It was the end of the run, end of the dynasty.

Now, they got a really good final from Andrew Wiggins. Jordan Poole was a good role player, but Steph Clay and Draymond passed their prime. It was the last legs of a dynasty. I thought they were done. Remember when they flew cross-country back to Boston? I think they trailed in the series like two to one. I thought they were done. I thought they were toast.

And then they went to Boston and Tatum and Brown. they just weren't quite ready yet to seize it. I would put the Warriors of the last seven champions at number four. I would put the Nuggets at number three. They're a little like O KC. You got one great star. The difference is Yokic is the best player in the world. They also were dominant in the conference finals and the finals.

They lost only one game. I got fooled by this team. I thought they had a long run, but then they started losing really valuable pieces like Brown and KCP. I put Denver at number three. The best overall roster of the last seven is Boston. The question is, what was Tatum? Brown won the conference MVP and the finals MVP.

Dominant season, 64 and 18, did not lose more than one game in any series. And I think one through 10 in the last seven years, this is actually the best roster. You could say all you want about OKC, but Jalen Brown is better than any number two. player for Oklahoma City. And Derek White, I mean, everybody, he was our number four or five starter. You knew you were getting great defense in threes from Derek White in every game. So this is the best collection of talent in the last seven years. But I think the best team was the Lakers.

AD in his prime, LeBron playing like he was in his prime, Alex Caruso. You just didn't know who Alex Caruso was yet. He was a great defensive player. KCP, who's always been a big shot maker in the playoffs. They had the best record in the West before. or the league shut down with COVID, so they don't get a lot of credit. But as the other old veteran teams crumpled, they had LeBron, AD, and really, really, really good role players.

Again, you just didn't know, I didn't know much about Alex Caruso. We find out now he's a pretty solid player. So that's where I would rank the teams. Again, if Jason Tatum was a more decisive, big game star, I'd have no problem putting the Celtics above the Lakers because I thought one through nine the roster is better. I mean, when you can go, you know, the 2024 Celtics, just look at how good Derek White is at an NBA player. He was off an option number four. But I don't think even that the Lakers are an all-time great Laker team.

I would say the Showtime Lakers are much better. The Shack and Kobe Lakers are better. The Kobe Gassall Lakers to me are better than this Laker championship team. the bubble. I would agree. And the Warriors team, remember Jordan Poole played a pretty big role. Steph missed some time. Remember, Steph missed some games. I think Jordan Poole was starting. So, yeah, I mean, we have some great individual players over the last seven years, but the teams, but this is kind of the nature of Adam Silver, right? All these players move, not stop. This is in the 90s where guys are on the same team. Reggie Miller played for the Pacers for what? 18 years? Those days are

done. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so I started reading on the flight to L.A. yesterday afternoon. I started reading Caitlin Clark book by Christine Brennan. And I just wanted to know, like the rest of you, 90% of us, me and you, we started watching her her junior year, her last couple years at Iowa. Right? Oh, man, she shoots three. She looks like Steph Curry. But when you read this book, Christine Brennan really holds the W.A. accountable. And she says the league was simply not prepared for and didn't do their homework. So the NBA has, I think, through the years in the NFL, they kind of know when a star is coming, and they often soften up the schedule. The WNBA did not do that for Connecticut, having them play New York and Connecticut early.

But this book talks about a specific moment. Caitlin's sophomore year, sophomore, she goes on the road to face Michigan, a 20-and-2 team. She dropped 46 points, 10 assists played every minute. It was her third 40-point game of her season. sophomore year. And in the book, it details how people that were at the game realized, oh, she's doing things. We have never seen a woman's basketball player do. Forty-six points. Ten assists played every minute. There's also stories, and I don't expect the NWNBA to have information when she was in seventh and eighth grade. But one of the fascinating stories is she

was down when she was like in the seventh or eighth grade, she was down 11 points with a minute seven left. Caitlin Clark won in a 13-0-0-0 run to win in like the seventh or eighth grade. But one of the criticisms I've had with the WNBA is it is your job to know and identify stars before they're at your doorstep. You've got to see them coming up the driveway. And when you read this book, I think Christine really holds them accountable and the WNBA has pushed back.

But her shooting distance, multiple 40-point games. You don't get a lot of 40-point games. 45-point games from college men's basketball players. Like you just don't see that. So she's dropping 46 as a sophomore. People that are at the game are talking about her passing's actually better than her shooting. She's a revolutionary player. So I think the book really dissects some of the lack of preparation or awareness.

And, you know, you can just like also Christine Brennan holds women's basketball accountable for not putting her on the Olympic team where they didn't have a lot of great perimeter shooters and she was emerging as a noteworthy player when they were making those tryouts. So Christine Brennan last week on the herd on Caitlin's impact to the WNBA. This athlete, Caitlin Clark,

is so important to the financial future of the WNBA. At the time, by the way, as you know, that the CBA, the collective bargaining agreement is open and will be being negotiated. all of these things that we would see arenas having to be games being moved to bigger arenas and that we would be talking about a female athlete never in my lifetime did i think i would see that and i think that's what makes this so remarkable and so different from another you know phenom coming into a sport uh the book is called on her game it really breaks down

how all the signs were there not as a junior not as a senior not as a senior they were in In the Big Ten, on display, late sophomore season, she was doing things, making passes, and taking shots from areas. Women did not shoot from. And the people that were in attendance at these games, especially the one in Ann Arbor, were awestruck by what they saw. And Word was traveling really fast. John, we're going to hour number two. Colin right, calling wrong. Rick Buecker stops by to hurt.

Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own. podcast called Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know, tired and sick. Tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and Friends. me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform?

We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam, it's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast, point game. the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season, and I'm looking back on

some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was crying. You just understood. That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis come until he's like, you know I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Real talent is defined by what people can do, not where they learn to do it. So by stopping at the education section of a resume that you might throw away the perfect hire. Skills first hiring helps you see talent others miss, like more than 70 million stars, skilled through alternative routes.

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