The Herd with Colin Cowherd - Hour 2 - Chapel Bill

Episode Date: May 21, 2025

What to expect in the NBA Western Conference Finals More on the Tush Push not being banned  Colin addressed if UNC has set up Bill Belichick to succeed in Chapel Hill   Guest: Rachel Nichols   See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Here we go. It's our two. Two. It is a Wednesday. We're live. We're in Chicago. It's the herd. Wherever you may be in, however you may be listening, thanks for making us part of your day. Rachel Nichols in about five minutes. You know, Jay Mack, the Nick's Paccers tonight, two things can be true. The NBA got $76 billion and they're fine, and I don't think Minnesota and Oklahoma City are going to get great ratings. So I think all those slight ratings increases.

There's a lot of NBA ratings talk. We never talk hockey talk. Hockey ratings are in the tank. We don't talk baseball ratings. We talk NBA ratings. I'm not sure why it is such a thing. It's been around for a long time. It's been flourishing since the 80s.

Yeah, let's be above that. Let's be above the fray, not talk about that. Let's go and talk about why. Brock Purdy was slighted in the PFF quarterback tier ratings, Colin. Huh? Well, it came out today. I actually think they did a really good job. Usually on these rankings, I've got big pushback.

PFF. and they watch every play. They ranked all 32 starters ahead of this year. I thought C.J. Stroud was five or six spots too low. Other than that, wait, hold on. How on earth is Gino Smith in the same tier as Brock Purdy?

I mean, I would love to see the metrics from PFF. I'm going to go read them during the next commercial break, but there is zero data that can tell me that Gino Smith has had the last three years as good as Brock Purdy. No way. No shot. Well, Brock Pretty last year lost eight of his last nine starts.

Yeah. Last year, forget the years before that, the two years before that? Well, he's cooking everybody? You usually don't get big contracts. Last year was the first year that Brock Pretty had to play without a stacked roster, and he lost eight of his last nine starts. That's the difference between the haves and have-nots.

Oh, C.J. Stroud, O-line was awful. Receivers all hurt made the playoffs want a playoff game. Niners probably win that division last year without CMAQ if they're playing in the AFC South with those jokers. I thought what was interesting about it, I think they'd PFF did a really good job. They have Dak Prescott, the highest paid quarterback in the league, at 17th, one spot ahead of Tua. And I think that's perfect.

I would take Dak by a whisker over Tua if I was a general manager. Both Dak and Tua are pocket guys. Both have had multiple injuries. Both are kind of reliant on their supporting cast. And both sign their contract with the Dolphins and Cowboys respectively. And our first thought was, ugh, the team got worked. Good for Tua and Dak. They made out.

And that's always been my concern with Brock Purdy that I think he's very much. I think he's a little better than Tua, not much. And this was interesting. Adam Schaefter had this story. Brock Purti asked the Niners for $65 million annually and settled for significantly less than that. But more important, no team showed trade interest at all. And we know seven teams needed a quarterback. So that is also very similar to Tua and DAC, that there's,

teams view them higher than the league does. There's no interest outside of Dallas for DAC. There's no interest for Tua outside of Miami. And Brock Purdy, according to Adam Schepter, who I trust, there was no big, great league-wide interest.

I got news for you. If C.J. Stroud was on the market, you've got 12 teams calling. So I've always said, you're as good as the market dictates. Your home company can love you, but if you're on the street, what's the market say? If Justin Herbert and

C.J. Stroud are on the street, there's a lot of interest. I mean, Herbert's 65, 230, huge arm, and moves. 18 teams are interested in him. 32 teams are interested in Josh Allen and Mahomes, and probably 28 are interested in Lamar and Joe Burrow. So what is your value? You're on the market. What's the market say? I don't care if you're a talk show host. I don't care if you're a quarterback. You're on the market. Who comes knocking? The more come knocking? To me, that's an amplification of your talent. And according to Schefter, nobody came knocking for Purdy. But that's okay. The Niners love him. The Cowboys love Dak. The Dolphins love to it. Nothing wrong with that. Their employers feel better about them than the market does. And they've been paid a lot of money.

So I'm never going to root against the guy making money. Brock Purdy's family and him are set for years for decades. With that, Rachel Nichols joins us. Game one of the Western Conference Finals in the books. Before I get to that, this has been a topic on our show. So David Stern inherited a league where there was a different champion every year. And though there were some good players like Rick Berry or Dr. J, the league didn't have a lot of dynamic television present. you know, people. And so David Stern was very okay with big markets and the collaboration of

stars because he saw the opposite of that. Now, Adam Silver's different, Rachel. He saw David Stern's version of the NBA, which was stacked rosters, ticked off 90% of the owners, and these big cities often flourishing. So my take has been what you're seeing now in the NBA is what this is finally Adam Silver's league. This is what he wants it to be. do you think it'll work? Well, look, owners want parity, right? Because more guys want a piece of the pie. If one team is winning, you know, four or five years in a row,

that means everyone else is shut out of that playoff money. So owners love parody. This is making a lot of guys who are Adam Silver's boss happy. The little bit of the twist on it is that the general public actually follows the NBA more during dynasty seasons. Because you get to know the Warriors over time. Your grandma knows who Steph Curry is. wherefore when you have different champion after different champion after different champion,

we all know who Aunt Edwards is. We think he's a star. He's got great charisma. But the question is, is he breaking through to sort of the regular fan? The NBA needs some dynasties mixed in with the new faces coming in. You need a mix to be popular. So I think it's interesting. The Pacers have the fastest-paced team in the league for three straight years.

The Knicks are the slowest-paced team in the NBA for two straight years. It is a clash. It's a boxing match. styles make fight it is a clash of pace uh and indiana's done an unbelievable job to dominate pace against milwaukee and cleveland they set the pace and they won the series i'm interested when you talk to people around the league and they look at this really i mean these are a clash of this is like a passing team and a running team in the NFL who do people in the league like in the next pacer series which starts the night it's very split it's interesting first of all i'm here in

New York and the energy around the city is exactly what you would expect, Colin. If you talk to people on the streets and the taxis, not only are the Knicks going to sweep the Pacers in this series, they're also going to sweep the finals and somehow win two titles in the process. So that's the energy going on here right now. And certainly the Knicks match up so well against the Pacers, but they're going to find a defense that they haven't seen so far. You think Detroit pressed them a lot, the Pacers, because of their depth, they can go full court press. So when you talk about the pace of the Knicks or what they want to do offensively, who's going to going to have their way. The Knicks have to get there. Jalen Brunson has to be able to get to what he

wants to do, and he's going to see pressure like he hasn't quite seen before. You know how good the paces are in transition. You know how the good they are at getting points off of steals, turnovers. I think that's really part of the matchup to watch tonight to see whose style makes this fight. You know, it's funny, six months ago to a year ago, Tibbs was in trouble. People were saying the practices are too hard. He doesn't play his bench. This is not working. And today, and I don't know what his contract situation is, but he could probably get an extension. I feel like Rachel, and this happened sometimes in different industries, the league moved into Tibbs. They were tired of three-point shooting. They thought it was too homogenous and too repetitive, and they wanted

half-court basketball, they wanted physicality because fans love the physical. We even see it with Caitlin Clark and Angel Reese. If you're physical, it gets talked about. It's controversial. I feel like Tibbs is now the most secure a New York Knicks coach. has been since Pat Riley. What do you hear? I mean, look, yes, certainly in a postseason where they're not calling as much, that favors different styles of teams and different styles of coaches and Tibbs has always been in that hard-nosed basketball category. But I would say Tibbs even was, quote, in trouble. And trouble's probably the wrong way to say it because Leon Rosen here is so close. So who knows how close he would actually come to not getting future contracts.

But there are a lot of whispers about Tibbs going into the Detroit series. and even during the Detroit series. Colin, there was talk of they lost the Detroit series. What was going to happen to Tibbs? They had to take a really hard look at his future. Now all of a sudden, they went two series later, and he's the toast of the NBA. So sometimes we talk about matchups

and sort of how the bracket fills out and how that affects players and their legacy. He never got out of the second round. Well, that's because he always had these tough first and second round matchups out in the West, that kind of thing. Well, they got a great bracket here. They had, you know, based a Boston Celtics team that didn't play like itself the first few games,

then Jason Tatum gets hurt, and here they are, and Tibbs is the toast of the NBA, and I certainly wouldn't expect anyone to talk about his job security going forward. You know, so SGA, when James Hardin was doing the stepback move, it felt like he was working the league. He was working the system. Some have said the tush push is working the system, although the NFL owners today voted to extend it. I don't feel that with SGA.

I think SGA is just a contract initiator. He's good from the line. He's a great pure shooter. I'm not bothered by the S.J. Whistle. I thought he got one whistle last night that was ridiculous. But overall, I'm like he's a really good player that initiates contract. It hardened bothered me. This doesn't.

Brunson's flopping can be irritating. This doesn't. How is he viewed in the league? Yeah, I mean, people just think he's such a pure player. You know, I talked to several players throughout the league this season. And every single one of them, many of them on camera, including James Hardin, by the way, told me he is the MVP of the league this season. And the MVP is going to be announced tonight. And I would certainly expect SGA to be the one to walk home with that hardware.

His game is so complete that I think no one feels like it's maybe the way they felt about Hardin because they don't feel like he's depending on that and only that. So you have a lot of guys around the league players who really respect the way this guy's played. And you don't really hear about that foul merchant stuff that Doris Burke mentioned last night is all over NBA Twitter. I want to wrap up with this. There are three levels of players that are going to potentially move. There's the Janus level. A dominant player still in his prime. There's the KD level.

Out of his prime, but an excellent player, 26 a game, can catch and shoot on any team in the league. Then there's the Kaminga level, not a refined player, but you're going to get 20 points. He's moving into his prime. He still has some refinement. I feel like there are three levels. of this. But let's go to the Janus level because his numbers have been dominating over the last couple years.

Usually when we predict a huge market, you find out like with the Luca trade, there was like one team involved. Do you think there's six, seven, eight teams for Luca? For instance, the Knicks, I thought needed a big swing. Now I don't think they

do need a big swing. I would not make, I would not give up picks and players for Janus. I think with this new style they could win a title. What do you think the market is for Janus? I think the market for Janus is going to be enormous. I think that there are so many teams who feel they are one Janice Antigua away from a title. And in this day and age, where there is, as you started the segment, talking about so much parody,

and just one guy who can push you over the edge is rare in today's NBA, and Janus is that guy. So I think there will be a huge market for him. I think there will be teams that we're not even thinking about who are willing to make deals. We're not even believing they're able to make. We've been talking, you and I, Colin, about sort of the top three that people keep talking about. Are the Spurs now going to make a bigger push for Janus, not that they have that number two pick that's dangling there, that they won in the lottery?

The Houston Rockets still going to be the favorite to try to get a player like Janus. You know, Janus came out and didn't ask me anything Q&A, which is so Janus, right, when there's trade rumors about him and everything. And gee, who did he name as his number one player out there? Who did he say? He said Steph Curry, which is not exactly. a veiled sort of reference to the fact that there's been a Janice-Steff sort of romance over the years. So the Warriors have long wanted to get Janus.

I think there will be a lot of teams in the derby, and it's just a matter of does Janus want to leave, do the bucks deal him, and who too? They haven't done that great with keeping guys in their own conference. So-and-so Drew Holiday, so I would expect him to go to the West one way or the other. Great stuff. Rachel Nichols, as always. Thanks, Rach.

Appreciate it. Thank you. Hey, Jay Mack, let me throw this at you. This is completely hypothetical. Mike Dunlevee says, I'm just going to throw this out there. You've got to make salaries match. So you guys, Jason and Martin, you guys can figure this out here because I don't have it in front of me.

Butler, Cominga, Butler Caminga, four first round picks. You're the GM of the Milwaukee Bucks. No, thanks. Okay, that's what I would say no. But I will tell you, now here's what I would say. knowing that college basketball is becoming more domestic, this draft this year.

All the top players look like it's not a European draft. The story we reported on, where the NIL is now buying Europeans, the Spanish leagues are chock full of, they have more young talent than any of the leagues, the Spanish leagues. They're thinking of shuddering it because the NIL here in the States is buying their best players. So a draft pick for the previous 15 years, you were like, can they play? Well, draft picks now, especially at the top of the draft, are going to be better NBA prospects.

But you're not going to be picking at the top of the draft with the picks you get from the Warriors. They've got Curry and Janus. It's going to be like in the late 20s. You know, so I don't know. I still think Houston is the team to watch. I think San Antonio is lurking in the shadow. Like, would you part with Stefan Castle if you're going to get Janus back? And then you pair Janus and Webby together?

No. No. No. How many MVP's is Stefan Castle going to win? I don't think he's going to win him because Wemby will, and he will because of the eight assists he gets from Castle, and Castle's ability to force you out of doubles to guard Castle. I'm not giving that. By the way, what is also happening in the NBA, guard-driven sport?

What's Castle? Long, I mean, great lengths can hit jumpers, drive, forceful. If you start looking at the NBA right now, it is becoming a. a point guard league because of the multiple aprons you can't stack stars. So it is pace of play. I'm not giving Castle up. Okay, fine. Would you give up Amen Thompson if you're Houston?

Well, Houston only has one or two. I want Shengun and Thompson. I'm not interested in anything else they have. And Houston has said, Amman Thompson is off the market. So I don't think Houston, I mean, I don't want a bunch of picks in Jalen Green. I'm not interested in that. You want craziness. OKC has a kid, Kaysan Wallace on the bench who, I mean, listen, there's a lot of hype around him.

He's only 21. Very good player. How about this? What if you included him in a package, you know, you give up the salaries to match and Wallace and two or three firsts for Janus. No, no, no, no. I would want Chet Holmgren, Kaysen Wallace, and four firsts. I would do that for Janus in a heartbeat. Okay, that's interesting.

So I love Hongren. I think Hongren's really good. Injuries worry me a little because of his size. but Holmgren, Kaysen Wallace, four firsts is... I mean, you need more to get the salaries to match, but I think that's an interesting one. The Lute Dort, get it. I mean, Lute Dort somehow starts over Kaysan Wallace.

I don't get it. By the way, can we stop breathing on SGA and calling a foul? Did you see that garbage last night? I mean, 14 free-door trips? One. Are you great? Oh, my gosh. There was the one where he drove to his left,

and I'm not sure what happened. I don't know what. Maybe it was the Jersey number. By the way, he had... Came off its fabric. brick and bumping. By the way, he was 10 of 27 shooting. I've never seen more hype for a 10 for 27 performance than last night. 31 points on 27 shots. That's like Russell Westbrook action. The hype trade must stop. You go look at Michael Jordan in those Utah finals. Michael ended up

with 28 points on horrible shooting on multiple games. Part of this league is getting to the free throw line. I mean, that's part of the sport is getting to the line. Michael Jordan fans want to tune in for the final hour for sure today. Somebody's getting lit up. We'll talk about that in the final hour. All right. One more herd? The herd streams 24 hours a day, seven days a week, within the IHeart radio app.

Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, huge news? We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it.

First people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band. Before Jonas Brothers was...

This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast. we could call in and say, hey Jonas, and then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys.

Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, and L. Michael's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis, and I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs Tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening. at Roland Garris, every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on Clay.

Jen she went. I mean, she went down at three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lena Rubakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface, because if she's serving, well, good luck. Consider this your court-side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app.

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before.

And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the game. challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on a night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too.

Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court licking his fingers while he got the ball. Like, you go through a training camp with that I said? you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All right, the push lives for another day.

NFL owners did not take the recommendation of two different committees in the NFL. and by a very narrow margin, the NFL owner said, we're going to keep the tush push. So that makes Philadelphia Eagle fans and players very happy. Jason Kelsey, the former Eagle, apparently talked, stood up and said, listen, I don't think it's as dangerous as you're saying. So that's good for the Philadelphia Eagles. Anybody can use it.

I was a bit surprised. We're seeing horse collar tackling eliminated. Cam Chancellor jumping over trying to block. kicks eliminated. There wasn't a lot of data of injuries there. The kickoff has basically been completely altered. So I'm surprised. I thought it looked dangerous

enough for the NFL to move off it. They didn't. So the Eagles, once again, the play they created remains a viable part of their third and one and fourth and one offensive situations. J-Mack with the news. No, no, no, no.

Turn on the news. This is the herd line news. Con let's start with the Vegas Raiders. They've had quite an offseason, right? Pete Carroll's a new head coach. I got the Chip Kelly's the new OC, drafted Ashton Gentie. But the big one is trading for quarterback Gino Smith. He's now reunited with Pete Carroll.

They had some success in Seattle. But it's his first time working with Chip Kelly. Gino says Kelly has made the transition smooth, adding the chip nose that I can see the game. Whatever that means. I don't know. I'm kind of torn on this team. We talked about them a lot. Colin, but there are some Raiders fans on staff, hint, hint.

What do you really think of Gino Smith? Because I'm shocked that he was in that same tier as Brock Purdy. I can't get over that. Well, I think Pete Carroll clearly likes him. He defended him in Seattle. He brought him into the Raiders. So, you know, they always say, just like when people look for jobs, it takes one. And I think Pete Carroll likes him.

Pete Carroll likes him. He's a big guy with a big arm that can throw the ball down the field. The Raiders are going to be a run-first team with Chip Kelly and Ashton Genty. Brock Bowers' tied-end, not a whiteout. So I think they'll play. You know, Pete is old school a little bit. He wants more conservative game, low-on turnovers, run game and defense and special teams. So my take is Gino Fitzpeat.

It only takes one. I mean, like Adam Schepter reporting, nobody was calling about Brock Purdy. Kyle Shanahan loves him. That's all it takes. Mike McDaniel loves Tua. Brian Flores did not. It takes one. He got paid.

You know, we try to be thought leaders, and I'm just going to float this out there. You tell me your thoughts. So Pete Carroll gets the job, and first thing he says is, we got to get a quarterback. This quarterback room was garbage last year. So he looks at the landscape. He's like, okay, we could make a play for Sam Darnold, but he kind of had an outlier year with Kevin O'Connor. We could draft. We could look at the quarterbacks in the draft.

You know, we have a top ten pick. Maybe we like Shador, so they kick the tires on the quarterbacks. that hey, Kirk Cousins, we could go out and trade for him, but he's, you look kind of washed. Maybe Gino was simply the best option among a pretty weak slate in the offseason of quarterback options. Is that possibly what happened? I think Darnold and Gino are similar in that if you hurry them, their mistakes increase. But I can see Pete Carroll, based on his history, thinking Darnold was a little reckless for his taste. Gino's not necessarily reckless.

He's actually not reckless if he has a run game. He's a very good play action past quarterback over 100 rating. But I can see in Pete's world watching Sam and thinking he can do a little hero ball. He's a little reckless. He was at college. He was with the Jets. He was with Carolina. So I think that's been coached out of him.

But like I get Pina. I get Pete picking Gino over Sam Darnold. That I get. It's like, I mean, it's not quite like when you're playing pickup recess, you know, when you're dividing up the teams and there's a draft and there's like three guys left and it's like, well, I've got to take that guy because he's there. I don't know that like Gino Smith is the long-term answer. This is a bridge quarterback, clearly, right?

One or two years. He's not like five years with the race. I don't know if that's true. Again, I think Pete Carroll looks at that division and sees Mahomes Herbert specifically. and thinks, okay, that that's not available on the market. What I'm not going to do is somebody that's impersonating Herbert or Mahomes. I'm going to get somebody that understands himself. He's a smart player.

I mean, Gino's a total pro. He's a total adult. He takes it very seriously. And Pete's like, this is my kind of guy. If I can't get him a Mahomes, then I'm not going to cost myself wins by somebody that's reckless. That's why Darnold's a little, he's a little skittish on Darnold. I would love, I mean, if you corner people, beat Carol at a party in one of your swanky affairs that you go to.

Maybe you could ask him, hey, why not Justin Fields? Why not? Justin Fields never made a Pro Bowl. We don't know if Justin Fields can play. Pro Bowl is not the barometer for good quarterbacks. Gino Smith has a better NFL resume than Justin Fields. We don't know if Justin Fields is a starter in this league. We know Gino is.

He's probably the 17th best starter, but we know Gino's a starter. Next up, Colin, I've temporarily lifted the ban on the Steelers. We're going to talk about him briefly. So they enter OTAs, still not knowing the Aaron Rogers situation. But Will Howard, who you see in this video here, I mean, kind of looks like a linebacker. He's a big boy there. He was a six-round pick, and he said Ben Rathusberger has taken him under his wing. We actually have the same agent, so we got connected through that. He's been really good. He's been super supportive of me through this whole process. You talked him before you became a Steeler? No, I didn't. I didn't before I became a

Steeler. But throughout now being a Steeler, like getting to know him, he's been really helpful for me. Texting me checking in last week, you know, just been a really good mentor. You know, I can see him being a really good mentor for me going forward, and he's been super nice.

Will's going to be a nice backup. He is a huge individual. Did you, I mean, maybe the interviewer, whoever that was, was tiny, but Will Howard looks enormous. Now, he needs to work on the Farmers, Dan, obviously. That was, you know, pretty bad. But, I don't know, is there any chance if Rogers doesn't go to Pittsburgh.

Is Will Howard unseating Mason Rudolph? I don't know. It's a good question because we're hearing nothing from Aaron. I would say, no, I think Will Howard's the backup in Pittsburgh. He had a charmed run with the Buckeyes. Let's be real. Final story, Colin, we're going to talk about the free throw merchant, SGA, your guy. He had 31 points. I need to add. It was on 27 shots, which is highly inefficient. Anyways, he had nine assists, OKC rolls in the second. half. Now here's what's interesting. This was picked up by some angry Nuggets fans. Earlier this

season, Denver coach Michael Malone before he was fired went on this rant about how, hey man, you can't vote him the MVP. The MVP's our guy, Yolkis. So last night, Michael Malone takes up a job for the other network, and here's what he had to say after game one. Shea Gilgis Alexander. He showed why he's the MVP. He took over in the second half, did so in a very efficient manner and put the team on his back when they needed it needed him to do so. So you know what's going on here, right? And I'm not wearing a tinfoil hat. Denver Nuggets fans say, oh, Michael Malone is saying that because he's ticked off.

Yokic didn't save his job for him. And he's now flipped and said, oh, Yokic was the MVP earlier. Now he's saying SGA's the MVP. Is that two conspiracy theorists for you? Yeah, the NBA can be a petty league. I would have voted SGA, the MVP, and I think the best player is easily Yokage, but it's a regular season award, and OKC was historically dominant in the regular season. So how your team fares matters. It's not just a, it's not called most statistically superior player.

It's the most valuable. How can you be valuable if your team's like a four or five seed? You're not as valuable. Wait a minute. All right. Now you stepped in it, my friend. So you love to say Brock Purdy's got a stack deck. If you take SGA off OKC, they have so much talent, they're still a play-in team.

You take Yokic off the Nuggets, they're 22 wins and top five pick in the draft. That you can agree with, right? OKC has a pretty sad roster. Yes, but I'm not blaming SGA for that. The truth is their roster is the deepest by far in the league. And if you take SGA off it, they are not the same team, but they can win games. If you take Tatum off the second team. deepest roster, Boston

can win games. Denver's roster is not the same. If you put Yokic on OKC and SGA on Denver, if Yokic didn't play for OKC, they'd still win games. Boston and OKC have great players.

The roster construction's insane. They're like next level. Denver doesn't have a bench. So is it safe to say? So Yokkich leaves, their whole team unravels. They have nothing. So is it safe to say there is parallel between Brock Purdy and SGA. No.

One is the NFL's, one is a 8, 10th, 12th best quarterback. The other is the NBA leading score. Like one guy is a Hall of Fame talent. Brock Hardy? No. He is, if you gave me choices, he'd be my fourth best quarterback in the NFC West.

Oh, stop. Well, I'll tell you right now, if you gave me choices, I'm not taking SGA top seven in the league. I'm taking six guys ahead of them. Maybe seven. Name them. Oh, easily. Okay, let's go. We'll start with the Honest. We'll go Yokic. We'll go Luca. We'll go Jason Tatum. We will go, I mean, I can still, if it's just for a year, Steph Curry.

I'm taking Steph Curry over him, obviously. I would take Jalen Brunson over SGA. I don't know that there's any debate there. I would have to think long and hard about Halliburton. Yeah, I think SGA is very good, but again, Colin, this guy can't shoot three-pointers. He's a free-throw merchant on a stacked deck. Yes. That's like criticizing Brady because, you know, Brady didn't throw the ball down the field except when he had Randy Moss. Brady was the best pre-snap quarterback ever.

Yeah, yeah. Arguably the best cold weather quarterback ever. The best leader ever. Never missed starts. Was one of the most, was one of the great big game clutch quarterbacks. Yeah, Tom didn't throw the ball down the field because. it's an inefficient play, and when he didn't have Randy Moss, he didn't have guys that beat people down the field. Tom Brady's not in this discussion, okay?

SGA, he was not like the number one overall pick. Remember, the Clippers had him, and they were like, eh, you got to trick. He led the NBA in scoring. It's pretty talented league. I mean, James Hardin's in like four times. James Hardin is not SGA. SGA is a very good defender. I'll give him that.

He's an excellent defense player. Yeah, you're talking Hardin's an all-time bad defender, and SGA is a good defender. That's a huge swing. That's a 30% swing. And I also think that James Hardin sort of found a loophole in the league rules, which they eliminated. There is no loophole. SGA just gets fouled and hits free throws. There's no loophole.

Hardin was doing that drag move that they had outlaw. And the NBA eliminated it. Yeah, they did. Maybe they've got to. NBA can't do anything to SGA. They can't do anything. He just gets foul. He gets breathed on, as Chris Fitzger boy said earlier this season.

J. Mack with the news. Well, that's the news. And thanks for stopping by. The Herd Lye News. Sounds like a good problem. It's actually a bad problem. And an NFL team, a great one is facing it next. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific.

On Fox Sports Radio, FS1, and the I-Hard Radio app. Hey, it's Steve Kavino. And I'm Rich Davis. And together we're Kavino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio. You can catch us weekdays from 5 to 7 p.m. Eastern, 2 to 4. Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and of course the I Heart Radio app. Why should you listen to Covino and Rich? We talk about everything, life, sports, relationships, what's going on in the world?

We have a lot of fun talking about the stories behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture. Stories that, well, other shows don't seem to have the time to discuss. And the fact that we've been friends for the last 20 years and still work together, I mean, that says something, right? So check us out. We like to get you involved too. Take your phone calls, chop it up as they say. I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive show on planet Earth. Be sure to check out Covino & Rich live on Fox Sports Radio and the IHeart Radio app from 5 to 7 p.m. Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific.

And if you miss any of the live show, just search Covino and Rich wherever you get your podcast and of course on social media. That's Cabino and Rich. Hey, it's us to Jonas Brothers and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it.

We just contributed to... We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special. So how did we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. And we were thinking, I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band.

Before Jonas Brothers was... This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing. a bit for the podcast for people could call in and say, Hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys.

Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman helped make you funny. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform?

We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The French Open is one of the toughest tests in tennis, and I know firsthand because I competed there myself. I'm Renee Stubbs, and on the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast, I'm breaking down everything happening at Roland Garris.

Every match, every upset, and what it really takes to win on Clay. Jenshin win. I mean, she went down in three to Rabakina, but I'm delighted. She's an outsider to win the French for me. And she likes Clay. Listen, Lina Rabakina is arguably the best player in the world right now, and I actually can win on any surface. Because if she's serving, well, good luck.

Consider this your court-side seat to the French Open. Listen to the Renee Stubbs tennis podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game.

His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin. Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall.

And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He run up the court, licking his fingers, got the ball like, after you go through a training camp with that Isaiah, you figure it out real quick.

Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In just four days, it's the biggest day in motorsports. As the greatest spectacle in racing, the 109th Indy 500 comes to Fox for the first time ever with Joseph New Garden going for a historic repeat. Coverage begins at 10 a.m. Eastern Sunday on Fox, we are so pumped for the race. We got an authentic Indy 500 driver helmet and an Indy 500 milk jug. Of course, the winner on Sunday will continue the tradition of drinking milk in Victory Lane. So Mac Brown coached at North Carolina, then went on to fame, riches, and a national title of Texas.

And then he went broadcasting. And then they went back to North Carolina. He did a good job. He did a good job. He raised a lot of money. North Carolina got into bowl games. They put a lot of guys in the NFL, but it is a basketball school. So he retires his last year.

I think he's six and six. And Bill Belichick takes over. So they asked him about Belichick. And I'm not saying what he's saying is untrue, but I could see where the Belichick people, the Belichick camp, wouldn't love what Mack Brown said when he was asked about Belichick with a time. Har Hills. As far as North Carolina and Bill Belichick, now he's arguably the best coach ever.

They've committed money to it. They've helped them with academics. They've lowered those standards some, so there's absolutely no reason that they shouldn't be successful. And anymore, they've changed the roster. I think they've signed maybe 60-something new transfers. So you've got a chance to succeed at the highest level, and I expect them to do that, and I'm proud for them. He may be right, but if you take out Notre Dame, there is no top 12 college football program, top 15 college football program that can't get the best high schoolers in. When you talk about academics, you know, they've lowered the standards. Notre Dame is different.

They're a top 15 program, and it's a tough school to get in, and it's a tough school to get through. Stanford, but they're not a top 15 program. They've had stretches. Stanford's another program where it's hard to get in. I've had coaches tell me at Stanford, you can't keep 85 guys on scholarship. They can't find enough players

that academically qualify for Stanford. Did they lower academic standards at Carolina? My take has always been, Carolina is one of those schools that if they want to get a player in, they'll get a player in. So I could see Belichick people blanching at that a little bit.

But I do think, this is where I give Carolina a lot of credit, is they realized, listen, in our conference, there is one big dog, and that big dog is Clemson. And how are we going to catch Clemson? Well, Clemson will not play the NIL game. They're the only national power that's not interested in it. And I think Carolina smartly said, okay, they're not going to do it. This is a moment in time to catch the big dog Clemson in our conference.

we're going to go completely pro-model and go all in on NIL. And this is a little bit what Oregon did with Chip Kelly. Mike Pilate did a good job, but it was always Washington and USC were the big names in the conference. They had national championships. And Oregon said, how do we catch them? Well, Phil Knight, 100 uniforms to get L.A. kids, be cool. We're going to be the cool program. We're not going to, like USC and Washington, grab on the tradition.

We have no tradition. We're going to go 100 uniforms, and we're going to go hire a guy in Chip Kelly. They don't huddle. Oregon stopped huddling for a long time. We're not going to huddle it. I'll play every 13 seconds. And it worked, and Oregon is still on top of Washington and USC. So to catch the big dog in a conference, you've got to take big swings.

And I look at Carolina saying, hey, we've got a moment in time here. Clemson's not playing the NIL game. So let's go all in on NIL, all in on NFL model, all in. on Belichick and Jordan Hudson too. So I respect what Carolina is doing. I think it's the only way to be a disruptor is to look at the leading models and do the opposite.

This is interesting. The Buffalo Bills, I was just told in my earpiece, are going to do hard knocks. They've been selected. Now, usually you get boring teams or dysfunctional teams or chaotic teams or teams. That's why hard knocks eliminates all a good team. So Buffalo is

actually fascinating. So this is a team that they're the only team. I saw this yesterday. The Buffalo Bills, not Philadelphia, are the only team to be favored in every game next year. So the Eagles face Buffalo at the end of the season. And right now, Buffalo is a one and a half point favorite in that game. You can bet it. So my takeaway on this is Buffalo, this sounds like a good problem. Buffalo is a really tough spot. Josh Allen just turned 29. He's audaciously talented.

6-6-255 or more and a great runner. He's in the middle of his prime. And last season, off his best season, the Kansas City Chiefs were the single most vulnerable Chiefs team since Mahomes arrived. O-line issues,

receiver maturity issues, health issues, and Kansas City still beat him in the AFC championship. And when Sean McDermott got into those short-yardage situations with Josh Allen leaping over. I've got to be honest. It looked like a defensive coach that was a bit unprepared on third and fourth and one calls.

It was really bad. It was the opposite of the tush-push. It looked unpracticed. And so here's the problem. Sean McDermott is a good coach. In fact, I'd say he's a really good coach. Is he Mark Jackson to the Warriors where he's a good. coach, a playoff coach, a smart coach, but not the championship coach. And if you look at the

AFC now, you've got Annie Reid, both Harbaugh's, Sean Payton's in it, oh, oops, Mike Vrable just reappeared. So it's very easy when you watch one of those music shows to spot great and lousy. You know, it's just not that hard to see mediocre or bad. or great. What do you do with good to pretty good? And it would be one thing if Buffalo had seven trophies. They're the one team in the National Football League, who is now on its second run that's going to last over a decade

that's good enough to get there, often gets there, and has no trophies. They're like the last. I mean, it was one thing when the Cubs won a World Series. They were just bad forever, the lovable losers. Now, Buffalo's had the Jim Kelly era. The Josh Allen era where we're like, I think half those years, they were the best team in the NFL. And they got no trophies.

So that adds to the tension in the city. If you got trophies like the Packers or the Eagles in the back room, it's a different vibe entirely. So how long is Dionne Dawkins going to remain healthy at left tackle? I looked this morning, Josh Allen's cap hit is going up. It's kind of the Sean McDermott dilemma where he's not bad. but I don't think he's great, but I think he's good to pretty good. And the Warriors moved off Mark Jackson, and it was a risk because Mark Jackson was a good coach. So you do get to a point with Buffalo.

It's interesting that they're going to be the HBO Mac show or the HBO show, Hard Knocks. usually it is a team with an outrageous personality at coach or at quarterback. McDermott's pretty muted, pretty intense. I do think Buffalo's interesting. But they're the only team favored to win every game next year. And yet, here we are. Do you really think Kansas City had its worst, most vulnerable team? Now, they got blown out in the Super Bowl.

This was their most vulnerable year. And now it's Peyton. Now it's both Harbaugh's. Here comes Vrable. And all of them have their quarterbacks. John Harbaugh's got his quarterback. Jim Harbaugh's got his quarterback. Sean Paton's got his quarterback. Mike Frable, Drake May, I think,'s got his quarterback. Sean does too, but the pressure is really on him. By the way, good news here, J. Mack. I know we're not supposed to talk about this. But I'm just reading this. What? Per Nielsen. Live same plus same day data. First two rounds of the NBA playoffs. Average 4.2 million viewers, 3.3% improvement versus a year ago. Great.

Wonderful. So ratings, we're talking about ratings for the NBA again or no? Because remember yesterday you shut me down, you're like, oh, they got their deal. They're fine. Who cares? Well, can two things be true? Yes, of course. They got $76 billion.

And baseball, hockey, and the NBA and the MLS. regular season ratings going forward are never going to be great because we are an event society we're more distracted there's more content there's more platforms hockey ratings regular season are awful baseball MLS where is MLS Apple where is I can't watch me as a soccer owner let's not disparage the sport but let's be it two things are true they got 76 billion and the league is fine well listen how about this it's some anic data was what they like to call there's a guy who works here. You know, he's a big Lakers fan. I asked him, hey, what did you think of the game last night? The free throw merchant.

He said, I didn't see the game. Johnny, obviously I'm talking about. And he's like, I had my nephew's birthday party to go to. And I just wonder, Colin, nationwide, if you've got an invite on a Tuesday night versus checkout thunder against wolves. Like, that's a legitimate question. You're not skipping LeBron. I don't. I think the increases in ratings

will go now backwards for Minnesota OKC. I think it'll go backwards. Well, last year it was Dallas and, who was it? Dallas, Minnesota, which I don't think were great ratings. Well, that was Luca. Luca. That helped. Our three, around the corner and the herd.

Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast?

Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We get to ask people to do podcasts. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know, tired and sick, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guy, not quite.

Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano. It's our favorite time of the year on our podcast point game, the playoffs. We're digging into the biggest surprises of the season. And I'm looking back on some of my greatest playoff moments. If we didn't talk ever again, I was hiring. You just understood.

That's how personal it got. Wow. Then after that game seven, Marquis come in to you, he's like, you know, I love you, dog. You know, it's all love. This was just playoffs. This was just basketball. So listen to Point Game on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Most people out here think that taking care of one another is important.

And most people would step up for a neighbor going through a tough time. Most people around here help out friends and family when they need it. But the funny thing is, most of us won't look for friends. help when we need it. Talk to someone if you're struggling with mental health because most people out here really care. Find more information at loveyourmindtay.org. That's loveyourmindtay.org. Brought to you by the Huntsman Mental Health Institute and the Ad Council. This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human.